# Help, please -- Windows update caused a problem



## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

I was using my laptop all evening yesterday and it worked fine.    It notified me that there was a Windows update, and when I finished working I downloaded that, restarted the computer as prompted (everything looked normal), and went to bed shortly thereafter.

This evening I tried to use that computer, and can't get online.  (Right now I'm using an alternate one, as I did during the day.)  Everything else (Word, games, photo editing) works fine, just nothing that involves being online. 

The computer itself finds my wireless connection, and tells me that the connection is good, which I know to be true because the alternate computer is using the same one.  So the problem is not the wireless.

But Firefox doesn't find it.  Neither does Yahoo Messenger and neither does Windows Live Messenger, and neither of those goes through Firefox, so the problem is not with Firefox either.

But that's where my troubleshooting skills end  --  I have no idea where to look next!    Can I fix this somehow?  Do I need to uninstall the update (and if so, how)?  Can anyone help?


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## NogDog (May 1, 2009)

Find the network connection icon in the system tray at the bottom right:








Right-click it and select the "Troubleshoot problems" option. Let it do it's analysis, then if you're lucky it will suggest something to click to try and resolve any detected problem.

Also, sometimes simply rebooting may address the problem (if you've not tried that already).


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

NogDog said:


> Find the network connection icon in the system tray at the bottom right:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Alas, I had tried both of those... the troubleshooting option claims that there are "currently no issues", and I've rebooted several times with no changes.


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## NogDog (May 1, 2009)

Susan in VA said:


> Alas, I had tried both of those... the troubleshooting option claims that there are "currently no issues", and I've rebooted several times with no changes.


Rats...I'm afraid I'm not enough of a Windows admin guru to have any other clever ideas off the top of my head. The only other thing I can think of is to try restarting the 'puter in safe mode with networking enabled (hold down F8 key when the computer first starts up and before Windows loads), then see if you can connect. If so, odds are that some driver or other program is conflicting with one of the network-related drivers. I'm not exactly sure where to go from there, but if you can connect that way then it would rule out a hardware problem and might give us (or someone smarter in this area than I) more info on what to look at.


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

Wild thought, based on speculation rather than any knowledge....Do you have any sort of firewall installed (ZoneAlarm?)  You might see if the inherent firewall in Windows has turned itself on, even if you didn't have it on before.


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## CegAbq (Mar 17, 2009)

Another wild thought - check to see if somehow FF got set to 'work offline' and if so, uncheck that.
You find it under 'File' towards the bottom of the list.


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

No luck yet.  But thanks everyone for the wild-but-good ideas.  A friend walked me through a couple of other options over the phone, and eventually came to the tentative conclusion that the Windows update made enough changes that maybe the router isn't recognizing my computer anymore.  Among other things, I pinged the router and it found it, so I'm told that the next step is to reset the router itself.  Can't easily do that until daylight though; it's in a dark corner of the garage.  So for now I'm letting it sit....  I'll post tomorrow and let you all know what happened, in case anyone else runs into the same update problem.

(And if that's NOT it, then we're back to square one, and I'll be venting my frustrations here.  )

Thanks for helping!!


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## Jasonmh (May 7, 2009)

If you really think that it was an update that caused the problem, here are a few things you can do:

1- Manually run Windows update again, depending on which version of IE you have, you will see a Windows Update option in Internet Explorer under Tools or Safety.  The reason I say to run it again is that sometimes they may issue a new update to replace a previous update that had a problem, or something may have happened during the update that caused it to not finish installing correctly.
2- If you want to remove the update, you can go to Control Panel > Add/Remove Programs, and you will see a check box at the top that says something like "Show Windows Updates", make sure it is checked.  You should now be able to see all the Windows updates that have been installed on your machine and when there were installed.  Most can also be uninstalled from there.
3- If that doesn't work, run the system restore.  Go to Start > Programs > Accessories > System Tools > System Restore.
This will give you a chance to pick a restore point, and you can pick one from shortly before the problems occured.  The system restore will reboot the machine and run automatically.  Once it is done you can log in again and give it another try.

A few more thoughts:

- You said you can ping the router.  Can you also ping something by IP on the internet?  Try 4.2.2.3  (one of GTE's name servers that is always on), and then try pinging something by name - www.goole.com, to see what you get.

- Have you tried pluggin into the router directly instead of using the wireless?  This might tell you if it is your Wireless connection that is the probem. 

- As others have said, it is always a good idea to disable all firewall software while troubleshooting these kinds of issues


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## Jasonmh (May 7, 2009)

I should also note that some of my instructions above assume you are using windows XP, if you are using Vista, 7, or 2000 let me know.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Every now and again my laptop forgets that it can talk to the wireless router.  Bars are there. . .but it says "can't find".  I turn the wireless off manually (right click, wireless off), wait 10 sec or so, and then turn back on (right click, wireless on).  99% of the time that fixes things.  But depending on your wireless controller, which is likely where the problem is, there might also be an option to "repair connection".  If so, try that.  

The problem is likely NOT in the router if it was working fine before, and especially if it "finds" it but just can't use it.  Still, turning EVERYTHING off and than starting from the beginning is sometimes the answer.  All computers off, unplug router and cable modem (depending on your ISP they might be the same thing).  Let all sit for 20 sec or so.  Plug in cable modem.  When all lights are green and happy, plug in router.  When it's up and running, restart the computer.  You may have to re-find your network, so before you do this you should write down your log in info if you've secured it.  For instance, ours has a name but is set to not broadcast the name, so when searching for it it just shows "SSID not broadcast".  If you don't know what we called ourselves you can't use our name.  OR you may have a name broadcast but it has a password that you have to use to log on.

Actually, have you tried searching for networks and manually connecting?  It's usually one of the options when you right click the wireless controller. . .that may be your problem right there:  the password, or knowledge of your network name got lost in the update.

My knowledge on the subject is now exhausted.


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

I don't know if you remember, but I had a huge problem with an automatic Windows update back in late August (when I was in Switzerland). Not the same problem you are having, but a problem nonetheless. Google "windows update." If the update is buggy, people will start posting about it and post what you need to do to fix the problem. For me, I had to uninstall one particular update -- it had a number and date and the instructions I found online told me exactly how to remove that one update and nothing else. Once I did that, the problem was fixed.

Good luck.

L


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Jasonmh said:


> If you really think that it was an update that caused the problem, here are a few things you can do:


I can't be 100% certain of that, but it was the last thing done on the computer before the problem appeared, so I'll go with that theory until something doesn't fit it... Those are some great suggestions, and I especially appreciate the info for how to uninstall the update if nothing else works. Thank you.


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Every now and again my laptop forgets that it can talk to the wireless router. Bars are there. . .but it says "can't find". I turn the wireless off manually (right click, wireless off), wait 10 sec or so, and then turn back on (right click, wireless on). 99% of the time that fixes things. But depending on your wireless controller, which is likely where the problem is, there might also be an option to "repair connection". If so, try that.


First things I tried... generally I have to use the "repair" function every couple of weeks too.



Ann in Arlington said:


> The problem is likely NOT in the router if it was working fine before, and especially if it "finds" it but just can't use it. Still, turning EVERYTHING off and than starting from the beginning is sometimes the answer. All computers off, unplug router and cable modem (depending on your ISP they might be the same thing).


Yep, did all that too this morning... reset everything... and it's Verizon FiOS.



Ann in Arlington said:


> Actually, have you tried searching for networks and manually connecting? It's usually one of the options when you right click the wireless controller. . .that may be your problem right there: the password, or knowledge of your network name got lost in the update.


Yes, in fact I should have mentioned that because it may help with troubleshooting. It_ finds_ all the networks in the neighborhood.... unfortunately they're all secure, so I can't test whether it'll connect..... but I can take it to the office building later today and test it at the public access point there. Thanks for reminding me.



Ann in Arlington said:


> My knowledge on the subject is now exhausted.


  Seems to me that the more suggestions are made that are NOT the fix, the more it will help pinpoint what IS.... so I'll happily try out all the suggestions made here and sent to me by email..... if nothing works, it's nice to know there's an easy way to uninstall the update (and then I'd really keep my fingers crossed that that was the cause of the problem!)


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Leslie said:


> I don't know if you remember, but I had a huge problem with an automatic Windows update back in late August (when I was in Switzerland). Not the same problem you are having, but a problem nonetheless. Google "windows update." If the update is buggy, people will start posting about it and post what you need to do to fix the problem. For me, I had to uninstall one particular update -- it had a number and date and the instructions I found online told me exactly how to remove that one update and nothing it. Once I did that, the problem was fixed.
> 
> Good luck.
> 
> L


Thank you! Didn't see anything on the first few sites I checked, but there's always a possibility that the problem only shows up for Firefox users... or maybe for Sony Vaio users, since there are occasionally quirky things that Sony does that cause incompatibilities with software that everyone else can run just fine. So I'll check those support sites as well. Good idea, thanks.


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

OK, an update.

It finds all the public wireless connection points near the office as well, but can't connect to any of them.  So the problem is not with the router at home.  

I searched for any online postings about comparable problems and am not finding any.  It's only been a day and a half, but by now there should be quite a few people...  so I'd say that if it's something caused by the update, it's not a very common incompatibility.

This update (turns out it's actually several dozen security updates) cannot be removed, according to Windows.  (And it did confirm at the time that it had installed correctly.)

I tried to run the wireless setup wizard but ran into an endless-loop error message that made that impossible, and since I don't know whether that's part of the same problem or not, I'm leaving that alone for now.

Currently trying the system restore option.  I've never had to do that before, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed.....


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## carlobee (Jul 21, 2009)

System restore would be a good option. I think probably there's something you have to change with the router settings for it to go with the recent update you just made with Windows.. or just make a reconfiguration of the router. 

not really an expert on this field though. hope everything will eventually be fine.


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

Susan in VA said:


> Currently trying the system restore option. I've never had to do that before, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed.....


I did it on my stepfather's computer about a year ago, and it worked superbly and solved the problem. I hope you have similar luck!


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## NogDog (May 1, 2009)

You might want to check if there's an updated driver for your wireless adaptor. Also, if you have a network cable you can use to connect the laptop to the router, it might be interesting to see if that lets you connect to the internet. (It will use a different piece of hardware in the laptop.)


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

*Hurrah!! The system restore worked *-- I was a little reluctant to do that but after Windows assured me that any new files I'd created wouldn't be affected, only system ones, I reset it to last Wednesday (the questionable update was Friday night) and it works perfectly again now! *Thank you jasonmh for suggesting this!!*

Nogdog, you may very well be right that I could have changed something at the router to go with the update -- but what about all the public access points? And if I had changed the router settings, what about the other two computers using the same router but which didn't get the same update? It could have been an ever-widening circle of needed fixes... The idea of using a cable had also been suggested again elsewhere this afternoon, by someone who assumed that a piece of hardware in the laptop was responsible and wanted to pinpoint that, and if the system restore hadn't worked I would certainly have done that tomorrow (I don't have such a cable here).

Phew. Crisis resolved.  Thank you all for being so helpful!


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

Great, Susan, glad to hear you are back up and running!

L


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## NogDog (May 1, 2009)

What's the plan when Windows next wants to install that update?


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Uh, "Thanks but no thanks"?

Seriously, that's a good question. I suppose I could try it again, just in case they improved it, since I now know how to undo the damage... or I could henceforward refuse all updates, which doesn't sound like a good idea either. (OTOH on another computer I have been running, dare I say,


Spoiler



Windows 95


 since it came out, with NO updates, and it works perfectly well, never a single problem, no crashes, no lock-ups, nothing.)

Got any suggestions, since you brought it up?


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## NogDog (May 1, 2009)

Since you now know you can go back to a working back-up, I'd be inclined to try the update again. I'd probably first check to see if there is any updated Win7 driver for your wireless network card just in case that was part of the issue.


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## Jasonmh (May 7, 2009)

Hi Susan,

I would be inclined to try the update again as well the next time you are prompted.  I have not had a windows update problem yet that one if the 3 options I described has not fixed.  The problem you described, Windows Update having an affect on a piece of hardware, is extremely rare.

If you know which update or set of updates caused the problem you can tell your machine to permanently ignore that update, so that it won't be downloaded or installed again.  The process varies greatly, depending on your OS, etc., but basically if you can see where your updates are prompting you to install, you wil usually see an Express or Custom option.  If you choose Custom, you should get a chance to tell Windows Update to "ignore" or "hide" a specific update.  That will cause the update to be skipped now and in the future.  If that is too vague let me know and I will try to steer you in the right direction.  

It is also possible that you are getting a software or driver update for your network card that caused the problem, which is not the default, and usually something that you do not want to do.  Along the same lines as above, take a look at the "Custom" option and under Optional Updates you may see driver or software updates.. uncheck those.  Not much good can come from having Windows take a "best guess" at what hardware you have and try to install a driver update.

Hope that helps,
Jason


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

That does help, thank you. I didn't know that it was possible to pick-and-choose among updates or to decline certain components such as driver updates.

Guess I'll wait until it next waves at me to say _hi we have an update for you_, and approach it v e r y cautiously at that point.


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## Jeff (Oct 28, 2008)

Susan in VA said:


> That does help, thank you. I didn't know that it was possible to pick-and-choose among updates or to decline certain components such as driver updates.
> 
> Guess I'll wait until it next waves at me to say _hi we have an update for you_, and approach it v e r y cautiously at that point.


You can go to the Windows Update site and view your recent updates. One of them is likely to be a driver update for your wireless NIC, and the culprit.

If you do a custom update you can opt out of that particular update until the vendor fixes it.

If you accidently install it again you can probably roll back the driver rather than restoring.


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Thanks, I'll look at the custom update options when next it tells that there is one.

That shouldn't be very long from now, actually.... When I did the system restore, it offered me _many _possible dates I could restore to, all of them apparently ones on which something had been updated or otherwise changed. It boggles the mind to think that there is some form of unsolicited Windows-tweaking going on every two or three days.


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## Jeff (Oct 28, 2008)

Susan in VA said:


> Thanks, I'll look at the custom update options when next it tells that there is one.
> 
> That shouldn't be very long from now, actually.... When I did the system restore, it offered me _many _possible dates I could restore to, all of them apparently ones on which something had been updated or otherwise changed. It boggles the mind to think that there is some form of unsolicited Windows-tweaking going on every two or three days.


You can visit the Windows Update site without waiting for the automatic update.

http://www.update.microsoft.com/microsoftupdate/v6/default.aspx?ln=en-us

I think Windows is set by default to create a new restore point every day. Additional restore points are also often created by installed software so you may have many for a particularly busy day.

The truly mind boggling part is that it works so well. Millions of people have written billions of lines of code that are almost miraculously married to millions of hardware devices and combinations. You'd be astonished to see how many zeros and ones are exchanged when you click your mouse.


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Ah yes.... that last part reminds me of a little exchange that DD's dad sneakily posted on his website:

_Al: "I can't find the bug in this program!"
Sue: "Maybe a two got in there."
Al: "What?"
Sue: "Well it's all zeroes and ones, right? 
Maybe a two got in there somehow."

... Years later, Al is still speechless ..._

He posted it as a dumb-blonde type of comment, but it was meant as a JOKE, I swear! 

(And now, whenever anything doesn't work -- printer, fridge, vacuum cleaner -- it's "can you come take a look at this, I think it has a two in it!")


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

LOL!  Susan. . .that's great!  I think I might use it next time someone is whining about their computer not working right!


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## Susan in VA (Apr 3, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> I think I might use it next time someone is whining about their computer not working right!


Or you could just direct them to Kindleboards for advice!


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## CegAbq (Mar 17, 2009)

Susan in VA said:


> Ah yes.... that last part reminds me of a little exchange that DD's dad sneakily posted on his website:
> _Al: "I can't find the bug in this program!"
> Sue: "Maybe a two got in there."
> Al: "What?"
> ...


I LOVE this!


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