# Amazon Announced: real page numbers to be in software update....YAY!!



## sjc (Oct 29, 2008)

I knew it was possible. Even though there are different text sizes there had to be a ratio to determine page numbers to size of font. So much better than locations. I got used to locations; but always wished for page numbers. I'm one of those who decides which book I am going to read by page numbers. If I am very busy, I'll pick a short book...but if I have a good stretch of time to myself; I go for a nice long read.

http://www.amazon.com/tag/kindle/forum/ref=cm_cd_tfp_ef_tft_tp?_encoding=UTF8&cdForum=Fx1D7SY3BVSESG&cdThread=Tx1LTITBVYJBJPM&displayType=tagsDetail


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

FYI, this is a blog post from February, and this software update (3.1) has been available officially for several weeks.


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## SusanCassidy (Nov 9, 2008)

And, FYI, it isn't based on a ratio.  They are the actual page numbers from a specific print version of the book.


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## Seamonkey (Dec 2, 2008)

And they are only available on some books.


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

SusanCassidy said:


> And, FYI, it isn't based on a ratio. They are the actual page numbers from a specific print version of the book.


Has anybody actually verified this? I'm still the teeniest bit skeptical. 

I'd like to see a few dozen examples compared before I'll accept it.

Mike


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

jmiked said:


> Has anybody actually verified this? I'm still the teeniest bit skeptical.
> 
> I'd like to see a few dozen examples compared before I'll accept it.
> 
> Mike


The Kindle book product page does give the ISBN for the specific paper edition being used for the page numbers, so it should be easy to check - but who's going to buy both?


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Did a quick check on the book I'm currently reading. . . .using the 'see inside this book' feature. . . .the ISBN number seemed to actually be the ASIN for the original hardback.  Page numbers seem to correspond.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

jmiked said:


> I'd like to see a few dozen examples compared before I'll accept it.


Let us know when you are done cross-checking.


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

Linjeakel said:


> The Kindle book product page does give the ISBN for the specific paper edition being used for the page numbers, so it should be easy to check - but who's going to buy both?


I recently bought both Kindle book and DTB (trade) of "Girls Like Us: Carole King, Joni Mitchell, Carly Simon". (I wanted the photos. I was quite certain I'd like the book, so I wanted both. I like it even more than I expected.) Kindle book has page numbers. A few days ago I left my K3 wireless / 3G turned on for quite a while. I still don't have 3.1 update? Do I want it? Negatives? How do I get it?


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Elk said:


> Let us know when you are done cross-checking.


Me? A) I'm not interested enough to do that, and B) I don't buy both the printed and ebook versions of book. At least none new enough for the ISBN to be listed.

Mike


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## PraiseGod13 (Oct 27, 2008)

I finally came across one of my books the other day that actually has page numbers available.  I was beginning to wonder if any of my books would have the feature.... evidently VERY few of my books have it available.


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Sandpiper said:


> I still don't have 3.1 update? Do I want it? Negatives? How do I get it?


No negatives that I know of. The update gets pushed from Amazon, so just leaving the wireless on doesn't insure you will get it anytime soon. It may be weeks or months. You can download the .bin file from Amazon and copy into the root directory of your Kindle and do a restart and that will install it.

Mike


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

jmiked said:


> No negatives that I know of. The update gets pushed from Amazon, so just leaving the wireless on doesn't insure you will get it anytime soon. It may be weeks or months. You can download the .bin file from Amazon and *copy into the root directory of your Kindle and do a restart and that will install it.*
> 
> Mike


Actually, no it won't. You have to go to Menu --> Settings --> Menu --> Update your Kindle. Just restarting it yourself doesn't install it, though the update will restart the Kindle - sometimes more than once - as part of the update procedure.


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

Linjeakel said:


> Actually, no it won't. You have to go to Menu --> Settings --> Menu --> Update your Kindle. Just restarting it yourself doesn't install it, though the update will restart the Kindle - sometimes more than once - as part of the update procedure.


So I went there -- with wireless / 3G on. When I do, "Update Your Kindle" is grayed out. Now what?


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

jmiked said:


> Me? A) I'm not interested enough to do that,


If you don't care, why post "I'd like to see a few dozen examples compared before I'll accept it."?


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Elk said:


> If you don't care, why post "I'd like to see a few dozen examples compared before I'll accept it."?


"Not interested enough" does not equal "don't care".

Mike


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

Sandpiper said:


> So I went there -- with wireless / 3G on. When I do, "Update Your Kindle" is grayed out. Now what?


Did you download the update and put the file on your Kindle first?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_200127470_ksupport_softwareupdatek3?nodeId=200529700


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

jmiked said:


> "Not interested enough" does not equal "don't care".


A fine semantic distinction, despite leaving the question unanswered.

I'll simply file your original post in the "I don't mean what I write" pile.


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

history_lover said:


> Did you download the update and put the file on your Kindle first?
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_200127470_ksupport_softwareupdatek3?nodeId=200529700


No, I've never hooked my K3 (or K1) up to my computer (MacBook Pro). I've never seen software workings in there. Never wanted to.  Didn't understand Linjeakel's instructions meant to hook 'em together, etc. first.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

jmiked's post said to download it and restart.



jmiked said:


> No negatives that I know of. The update gets pushed from Amazon, so just leaving the wireless on doesn't insure you will get it anytime soon. It may be weeks or months. You can download the .bin file from Amazon and copy into the root directory of your Kindle and do a restart and that will install it.
> 
> Mike


 linjeakal was correcting the 'restart' to 'update'.



Linjeakel said:


> Actually, no it won't. You have to go to Menu --> Settings --> Menu --> Update your Kindle. Just restarting it yourself doesn't install it, though the update will restart the Kindle - sometimes more than once - as part of the update procedure.


If you go back up to it you'll see she even put the part she was referencing in bold.


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Ann in Arlington said:


> jmiked's post said to download it and restart.
> 
> linjeakal was correcting the 'restart' to 'update'.
> 
> If you go back up to it you'll see she even put the part she was referencing in bold.


I thought I remembered that a Restart would do the trick as long as the .bin was present in the root directory. I guess I would have found out differently next time an update was issued. 

Mike


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Honestly, I don't know that a restart _wouldn't_ work. But the directions do say use "update." I've never tried anything else because I'm chicken.  And I know from reading discussions about the "hacks" that restart definitely does NOT work with them.

And, of course, this is AFTER you download it and transfer it with the USB cord.


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## padowd (Jan 14, 2010)

Maybe I am alone in this but I am upset that my K2 will not update. I have wanted page numbers for a long time and now they have the update and I can't get it because I do not have the newest Kindle. This does not seem fair but I do see why Amazon has done this to sell more products. I love my K2 and I really don't like the style of the new one so I decided not to get the new one. Why buy something when the old one isn't broken and I really don't need another one. With prices going up on everything these days I can't see buying a new Kindle just to get the updates but that seems like what Amazon wants us to do. I have spent alot of money on books and other items on Amazon and I feel like this is just not fair. Am I the only one who feels this way? I know there is nothing we can do but I just had to vent..


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

It's always frustrating when older products are eventually left behind.  I don't think of it as "unfair" as they simply cannot justify supporting all products indefinitely.  To Amazon's credit, it often provides credits, etc. for owners of legacy products when they have a problem.

The K2 remains a great device and you are smart not to buy a K3 merely because it is newer.


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

Elk said:


> It's always frustrating when older products are eventually left behind. I don't think of it as "unfair" as they simply cannot justify supporting all products indefinitely.


Agreed - it may seem unfair to the consumer but actually, it would be unfair to expect companies to maintain updates for discontinued products.


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## padowd (Jan 14, 2010)

I would not be upset if I had to pay something to get a update if it was something I really wanted but that is not offered. Why would anyone want to buy the newest Kindle because in the future if there are new updates it want be covered if a new Kindle comes out on the market. Maybe it was crazy on my end but I never thought when I purchased these 2 Kindles that updates would not be available for them. They don't have to offer them for free but at least let us pay if we want them. I think that would be fair. I am very upset with Amazon and I will look somewhere else to spend my money in the future.


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

padowd said:


> I think that would be fair. I am very upset with Amazon and I will look somewhere else to spend my money in the future.


Good luck finding a company that is going to continue updating older hardware. Sony doesn't update their older e-readers. Once B&N introduces a new e-ink reader, I don't expect any enhancements to the original either.


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## nmg222 (Sep 14, 2010)

I am currently reading a book that does not have page numbers or locations, just a % read.  

Anyone else come across this?


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

nmg222 said:


> I am currently reading a book that does not have page numbers or locations, just a % read.
> 
> Anyone else come across this?


You will not see the locations displayed in the new 3.1 update. If you want to see the number of locations, click the Menu key.


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

padowd said:


> I would not be upset if I had to pay something to get a update if it was something I really wanted but that is not offered. Why would anyone want to buy the newest Kindle because in the future if there are new updates it want be covered if a new Kindle comes out on the market. Maybe it was crazy on my end but I never thought when I purchased these 2 Kindles that updates would not be available for them. They don't have to offer them for free but at least let us pay if we want them. I think that would be fair. I am very upset with Amazon and I will look somewhere else to spend my money in the future.


You're obviously not very familiar with the technology industry because I'm not sure why else you'd be under the impression that Amazon would forever provide updates for discontinued products. Any time you buy any type of technology, it (and it's updates) will get discontinued at some point. It's just not realistic for companies to maintain them forever. You can look elsewhere but you'll likely find all other companies work the same way, not just with ereaders but all kinds of technology.


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

pidgeon92 said:


> You will not see the locations displayed in the new 3.1 update. If you want to see the number of locations, click the Menu key.


Phooey. Though it may not make much difference. Now that I am used to location numbers (along with percentage read), I like having the numbers immediately available. I usually prefer to sync my K3 and DXG manually by location numbers. So better to have locations "right there".


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## padowd (Jan 14, 2010)

I am familiar with how the tech industry does things but I am getting real tired of it. I really don't see the Kindle 2 as being that old and out of date. I don't expect free all the time but they could charge for the updates on the older items. I know that is how these companies make money. They bring out something better and everyone wants it. It is not just Amazon it is everyone. I guess I just feel ripped off and need to vent. At least when you buy a computer you can take it and pay to have it upgraded to run faster,etc. but here you have no choice and with the economy being the way it is I cannot afford to buy a new ereader everytime a new feature comes out. I have spent alot of money with Amazon on books. I am not one of these people who only gets the free books and never buys. In fact I have bought more books then I could read in my lifetime so I am upset not to get the new update. Just needed to vent. Thanks for listening.


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## nmg222 (Sep 14, 2010)

pidgeon92 said:


> You will not see the locations displayed in the new 3.1 update. If you want to see the number of locations, click the Menu key.


Thank you.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

padowd said:


> They bring out something better and everyone wants it.


The trick is not to fall for it.

Your K2 is in no way less than it was a month ago, or six months ago. It's still the nice machine you originally bought. So what if it doesn't get an upgrade? You were perfectly content until you heard about the new toy.


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## Josh_Stallings (Mar 18, 2011)

Elk said:


> The trick is not to fall for it.
> 
> Your K2 is in no way less than it was a month ago, or six months ago. It's still the nice machine you originally bought. So what if it doesn't get an upgrade? You were perfectly content until you heard about the new toy.


Logic my old nemesis rears its ugly head once again! Actually you are correct in my case, I had sudden "page number" envy, but I haven't been bothered by % until I saw I couldn't get pg #'s. Human nature I guess.


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## Amy Corwin (Jan 3, 2011)

I do wish they'd upgrade the K2, as well, as I have had some difficulties trying to "get around" in my books using the locations. But I guess I'll just have to keep working at it.  

Unless Amazon has a change-o-heart and upgrades the K2s, too.
Hint. Hint.
Please?


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## CaraMarsi27 (Aug 7, 2010)

I haven't gotten my updates. It didn't happen automatically as they said. When I contacted them about it, they sent instructions on how to update manually. Didn't work. I contacted them again to say the manual updates didn't work, and I never heard back from them. I'm a little disgusted with Amazon about this.


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## sjc (Oct 29, 2008)

Sorry; it is K3 only.  Hey, just think my K1 is way out of the loop.  I have the K3 but won't part with my K1.  All the classics are in it.  When I feel like a classic I just read off of the K1.  It is sad, but that is technology for us.  Today's hot is tomorrow's dinosaur.  All the best...sjc.


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## Tatiana (Aug 20, 2010)

Soon after page # feature was announced I downloaded a sample which indicated it was page # enabled AND showed page #'s in the sample.  I just, today, purchased the book.  The book is not page # enabled nor does the sample show page #'s any more.

I'm not happy.  It is for a book club and I was told by the moderator of the club that I couldn't use my Kindle with the book downloaded unless I could have page # because without page # it would be too difficult to find the various page under discussion and I would "bog down the group discussion".  Now, I'm not welcome at the book club because there are no longer any page #.    BTW, I didn't want to buy the DTB because it is almost 600 pages and over twice the cost of the eBook and I like reading on my Kindle.  

What happened with the page # between the time I downloaded the sample (about 4 - 6 weeks ago) and today?  I think I'm going to return the book and forget about the book club and even reading the book at all.  I wouldn't have bought the book except for the book club discussion in June.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

Tatiana said:


> Now, I'm not welcome at the book club because there are no longer any page #.


Seriously?

Time for a new book club.


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## amafan (Aug 11, 2010)

padowd said:


> I am familiar with how the tech industry does things but I am getting real tired of it. I really don't see the Kindle 2 as being that old and out of date. I don't expect free all the time but they could charge for the updates on the older items. I know that is how these companies make money. They bring out something better and everyone wants it. It is not just Amazon it is everyone. I guess I just feel ripped off and need to vent. At least when you buy a computer you can take it and pay to have it upgraded to run faster,etc. but here you have no choice and with the economy being the way it is I cannot afford to buy a new ereader everytime a new feature comes out. I have spent alot of money with Amazon on books. I am not one of these people who only gets the free books and never buys. In fact I have bought more books then I could read in my lifetime so I am upset not to get the new update. Just needed to vent. Thanks for listening.


I admit it is frustrating. It is for the manufacturere too. They really do want you to be happy, but from their side older systems just flat aren't able in many cases to support some new features. Hardware obsoletes fast, what was cutting edge soon becomes middle-aged and simply cannot support features that the latest technology can. Don't get me wrong they do want you to buy the new stuff, but most of them support a generation or two back with new updates. After that it just consumes too much resource that is needed to produce the next product to stay ahead of the competition. Survival is at stake. And like someone said, your older Kindle doesn't go backwards, it still does all the good stuff you bought it to do.


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## Tatiana (Aug 20, 2010)

Quote from: Tatiana on Today at 04:24:52 PM
Now, I'm not welcome at the book club because there are no longer any page #. 


Elk said:


> Seriously?
> Time for a new book club.


Seriously! This would have been the first time I joined this group but after the moderator made that remark...nope. I called Amazon and they deleted the book and refunded my money tonight. Now that I really think about it, I'm glad I'm not joining the book club.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

I think you are better off without them.  

Find a wonderful book club!


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## sjc (Oct 29, 2008)

I'm sensitive like that: I would feel hurt.  It would only take a minute or so for someone to explain what the first couple of lines were and have you sync to those words via search.  I'm glad you got a refund.  Sorry your club didn't work out.


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## QuantumIguana (Dec 29, 2010)

I too had gotten used to the locations. Percentage tells me something, but not everything. 10% in a book with 1500 locations isn't the same as 10% in a book with 7500 locations.

As far as the book club goes, what if some people had the book in hardcover and some had it in paperback - the page numbers wouldn't match up.


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## Tatiana (Aug 20, 2010)

QuantumIguana said:


> As far as the book club goes, what if some people had the book in hardcover and some had it in paperback - the page numbers wouldn't match up.


Well, the only print edition of this book is hardback. It's not yet been published in paperback. The moderator usually announces the book title then ladies who want to participate let her know and she orders the books for them so everyone has the same book. I'm the first person who wanted to use an eBook edition. She wasn't happy about my choice.


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## ApK (Feb 4, 2011)

Tatiana said:


> Well, the only print edition of this book is hardback. It's not yet been published in paperback. The moderator usually announces the book title then ladies who want to participate let her know and she orders the books for them so everyone has the same book. I'm the first person who wanted to use an eBook edition. She wasn't happy about my choice.


Aha! She gets a cut of the sales, and you are taking away some profit.

Run and find a better book club. Or better yet, start your own and run it right!

ApK


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

So what *was* the real point of 'locations,' anyway?


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

RM Prioleau said:


> So what *was* the real point of 'locations,' anyway?


They are more precise than page numbers, and do not change like page numbers can when you change the font size on an ebook.


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

pidgeon92 said:


> They are more precise than page numbers, and do not change like page numbers can when you change the font size on an ebook.


The nook had just the page number and %. I guess the Kindle will do this, as well with the update?


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Kindle still uses locations.  What shows with the 3.1 version of firmware on a K3 is only the percentage -- and marks showing chapters if the book is formatted for it.  With a click of the menu key you get a notation of what page of how many you are on and what location of how many.  You'd have to look on the product page at Amazon to see what paper edition the page numbers correspond to.

I personally don't see a lot of need for page numbers as I rarely need to cite the books I read on Kindle.   But I do see where they'd be really helpful for some folks.  And clearly it's one of the things they had a lot of requests for which is why they implemented it.  I'm glad they didn't do away with locations when they did so.


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

RM Prioleau said:


> The nook had just the page number and %. I guess the Kindle will do this, as well with the update?


I guess, too. My Kindle has yet to update.


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## Steve Emmett (Mar 31, 2011)

I don't have pages yet. Maybe the UK is updating later? That would be par for the course. Odd thing is though, at first I thought how weird it was not having page numbers but I got used to it so quickly that I really don't care.


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## HappyGuy (Nov 3, 2008)

I have a hard time understanding why people are so attached to page numbers other than that's what they're used to. If you cite a page number the reader has to have (or have access to) the same edition/version of the source as the citee?. With locations it doesn't matter which version, font size or anything else ...  location 137 is location 137 in all versions. Makes more sense to me and sure would make citing much easier.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

RM Prioleau said:


> The nook had just the page number and %. I guess the Kindle will do this, as well with the update?


Yes. The Kindle also keeps locations after the update as well.


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## sjc (Oct 29, 2008)

I'm so immune to it now. Locations, percent, page #'s...it doesn't really matter any more. I only use it to gauge whether I should select a long or a short book for that day; depending on how busy I am. But to check *as* I'm reading; I don't. When I'm done, I'm done...and on to the next.


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