# DALYA RUINED MY LIFE!!!



## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

She just wrote she doesn't want to update her scorecard:










And here I was, scrutinizing it all day to see if it moved!!!!!!one!!eleven!!!1!

D*MN YOU DALYA!!!


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Nathalie Hamidi said:


> She just wrote she doesn't want to update her scorecard:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dalya ruined my whole year by writing that many words and making me look like a slacker.


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## Amanda Brice (Feb 16, 2011)

I know...658,000 words? 

Here I'm aiming for 140,000 words in 2013, and feeling rather ambitious! Makes me look like a ginormous slacker!!!


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## EC Sheedy (Feb 24, 2011)

Dalya's on meds--I'm sure of it!    

Those numbers are pure awesomeness.


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

She also had 9 meltdowns. I'm pretty sure I only had two. Last year I put down 200k words. 2 meltdowns. Do we see a correlation here?


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## Victorine (Apr 23, 2010)

I had a meltdown just reading what Dalya did this year. Wow.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

Word count, hell. That's just dedication, or obsessiveness, or lots of caffeine and a speech-to-text program.

I'm very much in awe of her sales. Like, damn.

Also, her cat is _way_ cuter than mine.


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## John Blackport (Jul 18, 2011)

Stop whining and get in line. Dalya's ruined everyone's life.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Actually, scratch that! I WILL update my scorecard, because I've sold a few more units and written a few more words. I just won't rack up another pen name just yet.

My secrets are:
1. I don't do anything else. (We have a housekeeper now, and the waitresses at diners nearby greet my poor husband by name.)
2. I first-draft 1400 words per hour (thanks to a loose outline) and I don't rewrite. I revise with a light hand.
3. The cat on my shoulder gives me ideas.

I'm so glad I ruined your life inspired you!


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## Alain Gomez (Nov 12, 2010)

John Blackport said:


> Stop whining and get in line. Dalya's ruined everyone's life.


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## bmcox (Nov 21, 2012)

I am more amazed that Dalya is a unicorn who poops rainbows.    How do I get to that level of word mastery?


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

I think there should be a column for an avvy count. How many avvy's this year?


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## Al Dente (Sep 3, 2012)

I'm still waiting for Dalya to write the erotica story that no one wants to read. What, did you think I would forget? I never forget! Muhaha.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

David Scroggins said:


> I'm still waiting for Dalya to write the erotica story that no one wants to read. What, did you think I would forget? I never forget! Muhaha.


There is no such thing as erotica nobody will read!!!

Oh. Unless it's written by E. Annie Proulx.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

EC Sheedy said:


> Dalya's on meds--I'm sure of it!
> 
> Those numbers are pure awesomeness.


Well, I want some of those meds! I'm doing really well to manage 200,000 words in a year so she needs to share.


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## Nicole Ciacchella (May 21, 2012)

Whenever I'm feeling smug about my word count, Dalya comes along and makes me feel like a slacker. 

Those are some pretty awesome numbers for 2012. It inspires me to see how much they've grown. Good on ya, Dalya. I hope 2013 is an even bigger year yet for you!


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

Dalya said:


> There is no such thing as erotica nobody will read!!!


You've forgotten some of the "worst opening for an erotic novel" entries, haven't you?

Just write erotica for every special interest group you can think of, all at the same time: Zombie fans. Furry fans. Stepparent faux-incest fans. Billionaire erotica fans. BDSM fans. M/M romance fans. Everyone will hate it. 

_It was a quiet evening in the stable when my stepfather, Mr. Flowermaigne - pronounced 'Flower-mon-yay', and *always* 'Mr. Flowermaigne', never 'dad', or, God forbid, 'Cedric' - stepped into my stall. "Rocky," he said, staring at me with those dark, soulful eyes that spoke of untold centuries of pain and suffering, "you're like a son to me, you know that, right?" I nodded, not trusting my voice around him. "And you know I love your mother more than anyone who has ever lived, right?" I nodded again, unsure where he was headed with this, and not daring hope that he'd finally caught on to my interest. "Rocky," he said, turning, unable to face me, eying instead the bit and bridle hanging on the wall, "none of that changes the fact that I'm a horse of considerable means and considerable needs..."_


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## D/W (Dec 29, 2010)

vrabinec said:


> I think there should be a column for an avvy count. How many avvy's this year?


Yes...and has anyone else noticed that Dalya looks like a _different_ person in each avatar photo?


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Did you guys miss our betting pool on number of meltdowns for 2013? Ed Robertson put the under/over at 5.5, and we're taking bets now!


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

DreamWeaver said:


> Yes...and has anyone else noticed that Dalya looks like a _different_ person in each avatar photo?


Well, I don't have on my glasses in this current pic. Also, it was taken before my epic 2012 weight gain. I now have an extra chin! We've ordered a treadmill, though, and I plan to have a walking desk soon! Or at least something to throw my coat on when I get home from my one daily outing for coffee.

p.s. I'm seriously hoping for 0 meltdowns this year. I'm sure I'll have bad days, but I'll be honest and update the chart whenever I cry over my author career and threaten to quit.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Dalya said:


> Well, I don't have on my glasses in this current pic. Also, it was taken before my epic 2012 weight gain. I now have an extra chin! We've ordered a treadmill, though, and I plan to have a walking desk soon! Or at least something to throw my coat on when I get home from my one daily outing for coffee.


This is a serious hazard of being a full-time writer. If someone made a "let's exercise our lazy fat asses between word sprints" motivational thread, my mummy tummy and I would be the #1 participant.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

smreine said:


> This is a serious hazard of being a full-time writer. If someone made a "let's exercise our lazy fat *sses between word sprints" motivational thread, my mummy tummy and I would be the #1 participant.


My ONE New Year's Resolution this year is to exercise while my clothes still fit (barely).


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

I buy the baby carrots, lettuce, berries, and other healthy food every week. It's a shame it goes bad and I have to throw it out every week, too. I think David Adams is on to something with his no clothes philosophy.


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## folly (Apr 1, 2012)

i'm with you on needing the fat *ss motivational thread. and i'm so glad Dalya didn't quit b/c what would we do without her?!


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## Al Dente (Sep 3, 2012)

I think I'm with you folks on the exercise thing. I don't even want to think about the weight I've put on since I began working at home. It's got to go!


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## Honeybun (Nov 25, 2012)

Where does the score card information come from?


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## Dawnchapel (Sep 16, 2012)

I've been coveting the scorecard since I saw it in her sig. So jelly. I might have to make one of my own.


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## EC Sheedy (Feb 24, 2011)

David Scroggins said:


> I think I'm with you folks on the exercise thing. I don't even want to think about the weight I've put on since I began working at home. It's got to go!


Be careful what you wish for.

I've spent 18 months getting rid of thirty-three pounds, and have now reached the stage where a lone stalk of celery makes my knees sweat. But with the weight loss came a concurrent loss of words put to the page, so I'm thinking there might be a dangerous and hitherto unknown correlation between a big butt and big output.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Deanna Chase said:


> I think David Adams is on to something with his no clothes philosophy.


We are a truly civilized and noble people.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

You know we can see you, rightt?  *Averts eyes from David*

Betsy


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> You know we can see you, rightt? *Averts eyes from David*
> 
> Betsy


I know, and yet, I do not care.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

Dawnchapel said:


> I've been coveting the scorecard since I saw it in her sig. So jelly. I might have to make one of my own.


I want one, too. I am nowhere near skilled enough, graphically, to produce something that awesomesauce that is personalized, though.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I'll note that the typo in my last post is because when David's in the room I have to type with my eyes closed.
 *peaks through squinted eyes at this post*

Betsy


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

I would like to propose that such a scorecard would be much easier to produce textually, in the BBCode of one's sigline, than changing and re-uploading a graphic every time.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

smreine said:


> I would like to propose that such a scorecard would be much easier to produce textually, in the BBCode of one's sigline, than changing and re-uploading a graphic every time.


Yeah, I dunno that I've got the tech-savvy to figure that out, either. If someone makes a template, though, I can copy/paste like a pro!


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

I just like writing the words "unicorn pooping a rainbow." I also like the word "crap." 
Sigh. I rewrote a lot this year, does that count

No. Guess not. Well, since I'm somewhat of a slacker I'm aiming for six first drafts and then polishing them into books. That's about 420k worth of first draft words. I'd like to point out, lol, I do have a life off my keyboard, which I use as an excuse to slack off in the writing arena.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Here, I blanked it out. Feel free to use the template! Add your own smiling face or icon to the side, or chop it down.










Or just use it as the basic idea for whatever you like. I have meltdowns, but you could have pounds gained or lost, etc.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

Dalya said:


> Here, I blanked it out. Feel free to use the template! Add your own smiling face or icon to the side, or chop it down.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is how much of a n00b I am...what program do you use to edit it?


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

RobertJCrane said:


> This is how much of a n00b I am...what program do you use to edit it?


Oh, you'd have to bring it into a graphics editing program. It's not "editable" so much as it could be used as the base layer. Then you'd need somewhere to host it, such as uploading it to your blog. And then, every time you change and upload, it'll likely have a different file name, so you'd have to update it here.

I think there are other places that might host editable graphics. I remember NaNo people had nifty badges and such ...

I'm glad I can't program, because there would go my day.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Here's a bbcode table, if anyone wants to use it in his/her signature. "TR" means "table row," so if you want to add rows for pseudonyms and genres, just copy the bits between the TRs and /TRs. Otherwise, just swap out my data for yours. 


```
[table]
[tr]
	[td][/td]
	[td][b]2011[/b][/td]
	[td][b]2012[/b][/td]
	[td][b]2013[/b][/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Words published:[/b][/td]
	[td]250,000[/td]
	[td]420,000[/td]
	[td]??[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Units sold:[/b][/td]
	[td]2,500[/td]
	[td]40,000[/td]
	[td]??[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Meltdowns:[/b][/td]
	[td]2[/td]
	[td]4[/td]
	[td]??[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
```
And this is what it looks like:


*2011**2012**2013**Words published:*250,000420,000??*Units sold:*2,50040,000??*Meltdowns:*24??


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## John Daulton (Feb 28, 2012)

David Scroggins said:


> I think I'm with you folks on the exercise thing. I don't even want to think about the weight I've put on since I began working at home. It's got to go!


I was bad-tripping on that in July and August when sitting at a bar for three hours nearly forced the brutally metallic button of my jeans through my skin and might have embedded itself in my small intestine or colon or whatever pipe runs through that region. To compensate, I promised I'd do something, but went to wearing elastic banded shorts in September and October instead. But then it started to get cold here in November, and by the first of this month I had to decide to either motivate or accept that I would never wear jeans again and ultimately end up freezing to death.

Turns out, Target sells jeans in incredibly large sizes for only 19 bucks. For the price of three months membership at a gym, I am now good to go for at least another 40 pounds of weight gain. I win.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

John Daulton said:


> Turns out, Target sells jeans in incredibly large sizes for only 19 bucks. For the price of three months membership at a gym, I am now good to go for at least another 40 pounds of weight gain. I win.


I like the way you think.


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## maritafowler (Nov 27, 2011)

DreamWeaver said:


> Yes...and has anyone else noticed that Dalya looks like a _different_ person in each avatar photo?


Maybe it is a different person in each picture....


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## Honeybun (Nov 25, 2012)

Just so I know what to look forward to... define "meltdown."


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

smreine said:


> Here's a bbcode table, if anyone wants to use it in his/her signature. "TR" means "table row," so if you want to add rows for pseudonyms and genres, just copy the bits between the TRs and /TRs. Otherwise, just swap out my data for yours.


You're my hero. If I start singing "Wind Beneath My Wings," I want you to know...that its probably just the massive amount of NyQuil I just downed to counter this stupid flu bug doing the talking. But seriously, you are awesome. Beeeecause yoooouuuu are the wiiiiind....


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## Al Dente (Sep 3, 2012)

Ada O'Flaherty said:


> Just so I know what to look forward to... define "meltdown."


*clears throat*

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yet another half-completed manuscript lying around. I need to make time to finish my WI...

OHHH STAR TREK! SHINY!

I'll get some work done after I have a sandwich.

Maybe I shouldn't have eaten that. I need a nap now.

That was a nice nap. Time to wor...

*parrot squawking* *dog barking* *wife wants to go out*

OMFG I DIDN'T WRITE ANYTHING!!!! NO ONE LOVES ME! IS THIS WHAT MY LIFE IS? WHY ARE THERE NO SALES TODAY? IS IT SOMETHING I SAID? AM I FAT? OH GOD, I AM FAT! I DON'T KNOW HOW TO WRITE A BOOK? I MEAN, I'VE ONLY WRITTEN 20 SHORTS, TWO BOOKS AND TWO NOVELLAS THIS YEAR. WHAT MAKES ME THINK I KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT ANYTHING? WHY ARE YOU STARING AT ME? WHY CAN'T I CONCENTRATE??

*takes a deep breath*

Okay. I can do this.

*writes 500 words*

*deletes 500 words*

*writes a short story*

*edits a short story*

*publishes*

(two hours later)

WHY HASN'T SOMEONE BOUGHT MY STORY??

(someone buys story)

OMG!!! TWO BUCKS! YES! I _CAN_ DO THIS!

------------------------------------------------------------

At least, that's how it works for me. My poor, poor wife.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

Ada O'Flaherty said:


> Just so I know what to look forward to... define "meltdown."


Something like this, I guess...


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## Honeybun (Nov 25, 2012)

David Scroggins said:


> *clears throat*
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> ...


Ahhhh.... Thank you, David. 

It turns out that I live in a state of "meltdown" and that it has only become my norm so that on the outside I _look_ like I'm functioning like everyone else. Yet... inside... you described me to a "t". I'm considering taking up drinking. Literally.


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## Honeybun (Nov 25, 2012)

George Berger said:


> Something like this, I guess...


I took a look at the links. So.... how many times has Dayla threatened to quit?


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## Hudson Owen (May 18, 2012)

Dalya said:


> There is no such thing as erotica nobody will read!!!
> 
> Oh. Unless it's written by E. Annie Proulx.


Thought you might enjoy this essay; a bit dated but still relevant.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2001/07/a-readers-manifesto/302270/#


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

George Berger said:


> Something like this, I guess...


Yes, yes, a lot like that!! All archived ... foreverrrrrrr!

Actually, one of those meltdowns was after some of my new pen names started selling. I freaked out and "mourned" the death of the first career as she who writes pleasant YA and middle-grade fiction.

I think about quitting about once a day. If there were a button within arm's reach that blew up all my books, I'd have hit it.

But now that you all know I'm getting a few sales (I assure you that a lot of those are at 99cents ... and I still take my laundry to a laundromat), I'll have to not feel sorry for myself in public.


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## Honeybun (Nov 25, 2012)

Dalya said:


> Yes, yes, a lot like that!! All archived ... foreverrrrrrr!
> 
> Actually, one of those meltdowns was after some of my new pen names started selling. I freaked out and "mourned" the death of the first career as she who writes pleasant YA and middle-grade fiction.
> 
> ...


We all have to vent ... and if it helps you get to the next moment that feels a little bit better, well then, coming here to vent is a safe place among people who "get it." And besides that, the rest of us get to vent/have a melt down vicariously through you. Cathartic.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Ada O'Flaherty said:


> We all have to vent ... and if it helps you get to the next moment that feels a little bit better, well then, coming here to vent is a safe place among people who "get it." And besides that, the rest of us get to vent/have a melt down vicariously through you. Cathartic.


Sometimes, just seeing my whining words on the page slaps me out of it. I mean, GAH! Some people have REAL problems, eh?!

ETA: I don't know what monkey made that scorecard, but the numbers aren't right. My unit sales for 2012 are about 2k fewer than it says. I'll update it after midnight. (We have friends coming over for a stay-in party.)


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya, I'd like you to update with the books total also, or else you'll ruin my life (for the second time)!


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Nathalie Hamidi said:


> Dalya, I'd like you to update with the books total also, or else you'll ruin my life (for the second time)!


Agreed.

*taps foot*


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

My friends are yelling about Joss Whedon in the other room.










My earlier chart had the 2011 sales numbers in it, I think. So the sold units has gone down compared to the first graphic, but now it's accurate. These are just US Amazon.com sales because I'm not anal enough to add all numbers from all countries and venues, but I've mostly been in Select, so there isn't much.

FWIW, I had 2 books and nothing but Brown Bar until December 2011 and Select.


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya said:


> My friends are yelling about Joss Whedon in the other room.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There's still not the number of books you've published, we are waiting!   
(love you)


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Nathalie Hamidi said:


> There's still not the number of books you've published, we are waiting!
> (love you)


Ohhhhhhh, I don't know if I'll put that on that graph. That number's misleading, as the things can be any length, and I like to look at the word count ... but at the moment I have 35 titles. 

The highest one's around 6,000 and the lowest is in the million area. I think I had one in the Top 1,000 briefly. I'd like to have a hit book, but I don't think I necessarily have the right elements. I try to write broad, but it still comes out weird. I have to do it the hard way, with a ton of words.

Also, I don't have a "story" as an author/character. I'm not part of some specific community or movement that people can relate to. I'm just a regular person with no schtick, and I'm not exactly a social media machine.


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya said:


> Ohhhhhhh, I don't know if I'll put that on that graph. That number's misleading, as the things can be any length, and I like to look at the word count ... but at the moment I have 35 titles.
> 
> The highest one's around 6,000 and the lowest is in the million area. I think I had one in the Top 1,000 briefly. I'd like to have a hit book, but I don't think I necessarily have the right elements. I try to write broad, but it still comes out weird. I have to do it the hard way, with a ton of words.
> 
> Also, I don't have a "story" as an author/character. I'm not part of some specific community or movement that people can relate to. I'm just a regular person with no schtick, and I'm not exactly a social media machine.


Evil Dalya,
You don't have the links to your books in your sig anymore
And so I can't check out your middle grade books
Evil, evil Dalya!


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Nathalie Hamidi said:


> Evil Dalya,
> You don't have the links to your books in your sig anymore
> And so I can't check out your middle grade books
> Evil, evil Dalya!


OHHHH yeah I had that banner linked before to my Author page. Okay I'll add something.


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya said:


> OHHHH yeah I had that banner linked before to my Author page. Okay I'll add something.


Yeah, and SCHNELL! Because I'm high maintenance and deranged that way!


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Nathalie Hamidi said:


> Yeah, and SCHNELL! Because I'm high maintenance and deranged that way!


Woohoo, happy new year!

http://www.fivebyfivepublishing.com/2012/11/author-dalya-moon.html


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya said:


> Woohoo, happy new year!
> 
> http://www.fivebyfivepublishing.com/2012/11/author-dalya-moon.html


d*mn, didn't I see middle grade fiction once? Where did it go?

ETA: was too quick, found it! Thanks Dalya!


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Nathalie Hamidi said:


> d*mn, didn't I see middle grade fiction once? Where did it go?


I call it "Family" on that website. Cuz I'm a jerk like that. My Snowy Cove titles are about Grade 9 students. It's borderline MG/YA.

I would advise against writing MG fiction on Kindle as a business. Maybe in a few years. I think it'll happen ... that there'll be the clean, sex-free "Harry Potter" of self-pub. We may be three years from that, though.


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## Lefty (Apr 7, 2011)

I tried to find it, about your kitty has no hair, but this was the best I could do.


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya said:


> I call it "Family" on that website. Cuz I'm a jerk like that. My Snowy Cove titles are about Grade 9 students. It's borderline MG/YA.
> 
> I would advise against writing MG fiction on Kindle as a business. Maybe in a few years. I think it'll happen ... that there'll be the clean, sex-free "Harry Potter" of self-pub. We may be three years from that, though.


Yeah, I'm writing it for my niece and nephew, actually... Don't care if it doesn't sell! 
I think there is a problem with your links, Charlie does not link to the right page on Amazon.


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## Jan Hurst-Nicholson (Aug 25, 2010)

JRTomlin said:


> Dalya ruined my whole year by writing that many words and making me look like a slacker.


Does this include the words written in these threads?


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

OK, now that I bought Dalya's books, I *HAVE* to write that middle grade story for my nephew.
DALYA, YOU RUINED MY LIFE!   

ETA: as a thank you, this is my favourite unicorn comics (BEWARE, NOT SUITABLE FOR WORK): http://global3.memecdn.com/Worst-Unicorn_o_36314.jpg


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Dalya means "life ruiner" in Zimbabwean... or some other obscure language like Gallifreyan. I'm sure of it.

We all still enjoy her, though...


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## Nicole Ciacchella (May 21, 2012)

I keep having thoughts of a standing desk because I could use a whole lot more exercise. I have an elliptical, but that piece of equipment doesn't exactly lend itself to writing while exercising, though I can read on my Kindle while I'm on it--which is how I've managed to read some of the books by KB authors.

I seriously envy Dalya's productivity, but since I have a small person running around my house most of the time, it's hard to pull down anything like those numbers. Once both kids are in school all day, though, I intend to do little other than exercise or write. It's going to make me a very exciting person, I'm sure.


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## Hudson Owen (May 18, 2012)

At 660,082 words in a year, and this was an Olympic sport, Dalya would win the gold.  Looked at in terns of sales, you see a different picture.  Let's say the word count is in ten novels, some literary novels, at 66,000 words per novel.  On average, that is 2,500 sales per novel.  I don't know if that is typical of a successful e-book publisher or not.  Let's say that that is.

For an author with an agent and one or more publishers (on the trad scheme), those sales figures are way below mid-list, which would be in the 12 - 25k range.  So, in trad terms, sales for the year should be at least 120,000 to be considered successful, by those standards.

Actually, it would be impossible to market 10 books by one author in a year.  Everyone at the top would die or go crazy from exhaustion.  Lets say, it was only five titles at 120,000 words per title.  For a hardcover of that length you wold want more than 5,000 sales per book.  The sales for that small number would hardly pay for the marketing campaign.


My sense of the life of a successful career novelist is that he or she will pen a new book once a year or less, on an advance of 100 grand or more per title.  This model is in flux as we speak; maybe fewer and fewer novelists will be living on, shall we say, the 'gentleman's model,' and more like the lean, mean self-published e-book writer.  If the trad model goes the way of the dodo bird, then we are all wage slaves paid by the number of words we write.  One trad word is--or was--worth four or five e-book words.

I keep hearing on this board that we're all on a word/title production schedule in which only quantity is a sure bet to the good life as a writer.  Maybe e-words are indeed debased like our currency; we need to churn out more and more words to keep running in place or make modest gains in our lifestyle--just as the government must continue printing more and more billions of dollars to keep going even as the value of the dollar slides.

That's a frightening thought to me.  In this scenario, the race goes to the swift, to the young.  I cannot keep up at that pace.  I need to hit the bulls eye with one or two titles, say, carefully craft a Tender Is The Night (at 58,000 words), currently ranked at 64,352 on Amazon.  You have to admit, though, it had quite a run.  Actually, F. Scott Fitzgerald lived on his short story sales to The Saturday Evening Post.  During the 1920s, he got $4,000 per story, a fabulous sum then and today.  He despised that kind of writing, but it kept him going until he entered into his own untender night.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Hudson Owen said:


> ... Maybe e-words are indeed debased like our currency; we need to churn out more and more words to keep running in place or make modest gains in our lifestyle--just as the government must continue printing more and more billions of dollars to keep going even as the value of the dollar slides....


Individual mileage varies, of course, but I've found that the more I write, the better I like what I'm producing. I will re-read my short stories a week after completion to give them a final proofread, and I enjoy them immensely.

I have a few new rules:

- Don't bloat in revisions; resist urge to explain.

- If an awkward sentence gives me pause, and rewording doesn't make it better, I delete the sentence. It probably has no purpose, hence the awkwardness.

- Time at computer does not equal time writing.

Of course, it really depends on your genre. I'm writing sci-fi, fantasy, and hot romance. My sentence styling is as far from purple as writing can be.

I don't mention my word count or sales to drive anyone harder (you're my competition, dudes, ha ha ha j/k ... or am I?), but to show where I'm coming from with my many opinions.

As for my posts on WC -- I think they help my writing. They certainly help my mental health, as posting on here is a fun thing for me, and it has no calories. THANK YOU KB MODS AND the SITE OWNERS and my fellow posters.


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## Ian Marks (Jan 22, 2012)

Is that what I think it is? A unicorn pooping rainbows?


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Dalya said:


> - Time at computer does not equal time writing.


I feel like this should be tattooed upon the forehead of anyone who decides to embark upon the wacky journey that is writerhood.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Ian Marks said:


> Is that what I think it is? A unicorn pooping rainbows?


Yes. I put one on my website once, and my traffic increased mightily, though not my book sales.

I think it's amusing, and you may view it as a metaphor for my prolific production ... or as a metaphor for taste in books ... or as an explanation of where rainbows come from.


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## Hudson Owen (May 18, 2012)

Dalya said:


> Of course, it really depends on your genre. I'm writing sci-fi, fantasy, and hot romance. My sentence styling is as far from purple as writing can be.
> 
> I don't mention my word count or sales to drive anyone harder (you're my competition, dudes, ha ha ha j/k ... or am I?), but to show where I'm coming from with my many opinions.


Yes, genre and also sensibility (a Jane Austen word). Your sensibility is formed by the way you see and say things. Not quite the same thing as style, but close. My sensibility was formed before many of you were born, before the pc era. Before p-correctness, writers were mainly concerned about freedom. At the margins of society, the Beatniks and Lenny Bruce were concerned about swearing in public, for one thing. Post-pc, writers are more concerned about saying something authentic without offending the word police. Pre-pc, authors quarreled in public--Norman Mailer swapped punches with Gore Vidal--post-pc, it's all about safety; putting a bike helmet on your tyke when she rides on her trike.

And yes, we all compete, in a way. But I must say, since joining the WC, that my views of my fellow authors have improved. I do appreciate the warmth and generosity and sharing of knowledge, especially technical knowledge, here, which comes more easily to you young-'ns.

Speaking of which, the next wave of authors is coming...seven-year-olds writing and publishing on their iPads. 12-year-olds e-pubbing YA. Daughter against mother, son against father. Don't trust anyone over 18. HaHa HeeHee. Been there, done that.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

Hudson Owen said:


> My sense of the life of a successful career novelist is that he or she will pen a new book once a year or less, on an advance of 100 grand or more per title. This model is in flux as we speak; maybe fewer and fewer novelists will be living on, shall we say, the 'gentleman's model,' and more like the lean, mean self-published e-book writer. If the trad model goes the way of the dodo bird, then we are all wage slaves paid by the number of words we write. One trad word is--or was--worth four or five e-book words.


Who out there is getting $100,000 advances?



Hudson Owen said:


> That's a frightening thought to me. In this scenario, the race goes to the swift, to the young. I cannot keep up at that pace. I need to hit the bulls eye with one or two titles, say, carefully craft a Tender Is The Night (at 58,000 words), currently ranked at 64,352 on Amazon. You have to admit, though, it had quite a run.


I don't think it's possible in this day and age to purposefully "hit the bullseye". It's just not a business model that works.



Hudson Owen said:


> Actually, F. Scott Fitzgerald lived on his short story sales to The Saturday Evening Post. During the 1920s, he got $4,000 per story, a fabulous sum then and today. He despised that kind of writing, but it kept him going until he entered into his own untender night.


So F. Scott made a living by writing a lot of short stories. Sounds familiar. You should read Dean Wesley Smith's blog from the beginning.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Rant deleted. Fugeddaboudit.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

smreine said:


> Rant deleted. Fugeddaboudit.


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## maritafowler (Nov 27, 2011)

@smreine Love the new signature block


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Why, thank you. You can get one of your own here: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,137914.msg2019680.html#msg2019680


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

smreine said:


> Why, thank you. You can get one of your own here: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,137914.msg2019680.html#msg2019680


You LEFT THE HOUSE? Now that is a scary idea.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

JRTomlin said:


> You LEFT THE HOUSE? Now that is a scary idea.


I had no choice. Family was going to a steakhouse. Husband wouldn't bring some back for me. I waited until night fell so that the sun wouldn't burn my tender Irish flesh, and I seem to have survived, so...


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## Veronica Drema (Sep 25, 2012)

I got these coupons for free coffee kcups from my grocery, buy I can only use one a week. (it's coffee for a year from starbucks.)
Which means, I will HAVE to leave the house at least once more a week than usual. Which will bring me up to 2 trips from my house a week. I'm gonna need that freaking coffee just to recover.


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## Romana Grimm (Mar 19, 2012)

Uhm, alright ... I don't think I'll ever manage to write half a million words a year, nevermind more than that! But it won't hurt to try, chackaaah! 

And wow, I'm a bit surprised that so many writers seem to have a little problem with their weight. But it might just be me, because I went vegan last May and haven't looked back after loosing those pesky pounds of extra padding. (Since I hate exercise, eating plant-based whole foods was the next best solution. And freshly made veggie juice, can't forget that. Because honestly, nobody can eat so much of the green stuff!)   Now I actually can wear my trousers from a few years back, which is kind of awesome, even in the house where nobody can see *g* 

That being said, I wish all of you a Happy (and productive, successful, not to mention great) New Year!


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Romana Grimm said:


> Uhm, alright ... I don't think I'll ever manage to write half a million words a year, nevermind more than that! But it won't hurt to try, chackaaah!
> 
> And wow, I'm a bit surprised that so many writers seem to have a little problem with their weight. But it might just be me, because I went vegan last May and haven't looked back after loosing those pesky pounds of extra padding. (Since I hate exercise, eating plant-based whole foods was the next best solution. And freshly made veggie juice, can't forget that. Because honestly, nobody can eat so much of the green stuff!)  Now I actually can wear my trousers from a few years back, which is kind of awesome, even in the house where nobody can see *g*
> 
> That being said, I wish all of you a Happy (and productive, successful, not to mention great) New Year!


Ha, I keep my weight off in the exact opposite way. I'm somewhere between keto and paleo. Like veganism, though, these are all extreme diets that require immense and often unrealistic levels of dedication, forethought, and self-denial. I think it's a little a little more surprising that an individual would be "surprised" people are unable to cut food that 99% of folks eat from their diets -- animal products in your case, and all grains/sugars in mine.

If weight loss was easy, nobody would be fat. And yet, the industrialized world struggles on. Fancy that.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

smreine said:


> I had no choice. Family was going to a steakhouse. Husband wouldn't bring some back for me. I waited until night fell so that the sun wouldn't burn my tender Irish flesh, and I seem to have survived, so...


Whew! Glad you survived!

So far I've avoided that this year.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

I'm going to hit that Publish button today. It's just a little romantic short, but I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna totally finish editing that story ... as soon as I get some coffee!


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## Romana Grimm (Mar 19, 2012)

SM Reine, I sincerely hope that you won't develop leaky gut syndrome, arthritis or other illnesses with that way of eating. I saw videos on youtube about people who tried the Paleo diet and ate an awful lot of animal protein and got very sick because the body couldn't handle it. Just sayin'.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Romana Grimm said:


> SM Reine, I sincerely hope that you won't develop leaky gut syndrome, arthritis or other illnesses with that way of eating. I saw videos on youtube about people who tried the Paleo diet and ate an awful lot of animal protein and got very sick because the body couldn't handle it. Just sayin'.


Romana Grimm, I sincerely hope you educate yourself. You've been bandying around a lot of of meaningless buzzwords like "detox" and "starvation mode," and the fact that you consider YouTube a reliable source of information is deeply disturbing. Veganism has problems with nutritional balance (most significantly B6 deficiencies, as that vitamin's not bioavailable from vegan sources), but I think it's nice that you eat the way you eat, and I'd prefer that you keep condescension away from my life choices when I have no problem with yours.

Just saying.

*goes back to bacon/avocado/mushroom omelette*


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

I'm chubby, but I've held the same weight, and the same clothes sizes, for the better part of a decade. Even after I stopped being a pedestrian and started bicycling 1500-2500 miles/year, and stopped renting and bought a house, and and and... My body just wants to be this shape, I guess.

I cook whatever takes my fancy, that I can convince my kind of weirdly picky partner to eat. They're fine with baked stuff calf's heart, but rabbit stew or any kind of rice casserole is a no-go...


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## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

smreine said:


> Here's a bbcode table, if anyone wants to use it in his/her signature. "TR" means "table row," so if you want to add rows for pseudonyms and genres, just copy the bits between the TRs and /TRs. Otherwise, just swap out my data for yours.
> 
> 
> ```
> ...


This. Is. Awesome! Thanks! Now, how do I get it to post to the right of my book covers, instead of underneath them?


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Cherise Kelley said:


> Now, how do I get it to post to the right of my book covers, instead of underneath them?


More tables! I'm trying to work this morning (and utterly failing), but here's the code for my sig so you can break it out and figure out how I did it. Basically, I have one big table, and the first two columns are a book cover and text, and then there are the stat columns on the right.


```
[table][tr][td][url=http://smarturl.it/descentspecial][IMG]http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51YqcR5gBCL._SL160_.jpg[/IMG][/url][/td][td][center][b]The Descent Series[/b]
You know who wants five urban fantasy books for less than $5? YOU DO. 
I know, I'm like a mind-reader, right?[/center][/td][td][table][tr]
	[td][/td]
	[td][b]2011[/b][/td]
	[td][b]2012[/b][/td]
	[td][b]2013[/b][/td][/tr][tr]
	[td][b]Words published:[/b][/td]
	[td]250,000[/td]
	[td]420,000[/td]
	[td]0[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Meltdowns:[/b][/td]
	[td]2[/td]
	[td]4[/td]
	[td]0.5[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Minutes on treadmill:[/b][/td]
	[td]n/a[/td]
	[td]??[/td]
	[td]0[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Cappuccinos:[/b][/td]
	[td]??[/td]
	[td]??[/td]
	[td]3[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td][b]Times I've left house:[/b][/td]
	[td]??[/td]
	[td]??[/td]
	[td]1[/td]
[/tr]
[/table][/td][/tr][/table][center][url=http://facebook.com/authorsmreine]Join me on FB![/url][/center]
```


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Or you can be sneaky like me and have a random picture for your sig. 
MOUHOUHOUHAHAHAHAHA! *evil laugh*


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## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

smreine said:


> More tables! I'm trying to work this morning (and utterly failing), but here's the code for my sig so you can break it out and figure out how I did it. Basically, I have one big table, and the first two columns are a book cover and text, and then there are the stat columns on the right.
> 
> 
> ```
> ...


You're the bestest!


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## Selina Fenech (Jul 20, 2011)

Is no one else curious what Dalya's 6(!) pen names are? Does everyone except me already know? Is it some kind of writers taboo to ask these questions?


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## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

Dalya said:


> Actually, scratch that! I WILL update my scorecard, because I've sold a few more units and written a few more words. I just won't rack up another pen name just yet.
> 
> My secrets are:
> 1. I don't do anything else. (We have a housekeeper now, and the waitresses at diners nearby greet my poor husband by name.)
> ...


You don't rewrite? I would like to see how many people refund your books then add that to the scorecard.

A writer, is a rewriter

I think more focus should be put on quality not quantity.

Anyone can knock out words.

Few can knock out words and write well

But then again you may be a genius, a natural and the above doesn't apply and you hit quality and quantity in one go.... who knows.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

Selina Fenech said:


> Is no one else curious what Dalya's 6(!) pen names are? Does everyone except me already know? Is it some kind of writers taboo to ask these questions?


edited:
The other ones are all dirty or weird and experimental. Knowing that it's anonymous is actually more freeing to my creative spirit.

If I ever manage to get something on the Top 100, I'll do a big reveal here.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

kalel said:


> You don't rewrite? I would like to see how many people refund your books then added to the scorecard.
> 
> A writer, is a rewriter
> 
> ...


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH

YOU'RE AWESOME!

GOOD LUCK TO YOU, SIR! I'm sure putting down other people on a message board will serve you well in life.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

kalel said:


> You don't rewrite? I would like to see how many people refund your books then added to the scorecard.
> 
> A writer, is a rewriter
> 
> ...


She's a lot more likely to have hit quality and quantity with any given day's labor than you were to try and make it through that critique without looking like a huge d-bag. My money's on her, not so much on you.


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## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

Dalya said:


> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH
> 
> YOU'RE AWESOME!
> 
> GOOD LUCK TO YOU, SIR! I'm sure putting down other people on a message board will serve you well in life.


You misunderstood me.

You had said that you don't rewrite.

All writers, rewrite. If you disagree, billions of writers must be wrong.

Plus stats on refunds is as important as stats on sales if you feel the need to show people what you have sold


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## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

RobertJCrane said:


> She's a lot more likely to have hit quality and quantity with any given day's labor than you were to try and make it through that critique without looking like a huge d-bag. My money's on her, not so much on you.


Calling someone a huge d-bag because they say that a writer is a rewriter, says more about you than it does about me.

Seriously, grow up.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

kalel said:


> You misunderstood me.
> 
> You had said that you don't rewrite.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I thought you were being a d-bag. Mainly because of your chosen words and their order, I guess.

I consider "rewriting" to be changing every single sentence, and/or deleting entire scenes and rewriting them. I did that with early books, but now I simply edit. And I do edit. A few sentences get rewritten or deleted, but I don't do extensive rewriting, and I think it's because I always outline and/or have too much faith in my gut instincts.

Refunds vary by genre. My sales are net and there are refunds. Customer reviews vary. Some people think my work is awesome and beg for more. Others think it's awful. All art is both great and terrible at once.

Honestly, when I was a newbie writer and I read a blog post by an author, saying he doesn't do anything to his first drafts except fix the odd error, I was extremely annoyed. It bugged me, because I had to write everything three times. Practice changes everything, imho.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

kalel said:


> You don't rewrite? I would like to see how many people refund your books then add that to the scorecard.
> 
> A writer, is a rewriter
> 
> ...


When one enters a conversation with such a confrontational tone of voice, one should not be super duper surprised to be called a d-bag.

On a tangential note, KB is not good for my productivity today. My mischief gland is having just too much fun.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

smreine said:


> When one enters a conversation with such a confrontational tone of voice, one should not be super duper surprised to be called a d-bag.
> 
> On a tangential note, KB is not good for my productivity today. My mischief gland is having just too much fun.


Days accident-free: 0


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## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

smreine said:


> When one enters a conversation with such a confrontational tone of voice, one should not be super duper surprised to be called a d-bag.
> 
> On a tangential note, KB is not good for my productivity today. My mischief gland is having just too much fun.


OR...

Maybe I hit a sore spot with folks who are more interested in banging out books regardless of quality ( the MOST common trait with self-published authors ) than banging out books that are quality. I stick with what I said. Anyone can write words, not everyone can write well.

Writers, rewrite. They don't just write and then edit.

The first draft is always the vomit pass, no matter if you worked on an outline

If you feel the need to call people D-bags because they call in to question what professional writers have been doing for years. You really are immature.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

kalel said:


> Calling someone a huge d-bag because they say that a writer is a rewriter, says more about you than it does about me.
> 
> Seriously, grow up.


To be clear, I didn't call you a huge d-bag because you said a writer is a rewriter. In fact, if you reread what i wrote carefully, I think you'll find I didn't actually call you a huge d-bag at all; I merely inferred you might look like one after your post. Much like the entire tone of your post was sneering condescension inferring that because someone writes fast, their quality must be suspect.

And I don't want to grow up; I'm a Toys 'R Us kid.



Dalya said:


> Days accident-free: 0


Teehee.


----------



## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

RobertJCrane said:


> To be clear, I didn't call you a huge d-bag because you said a writer is a rewriter. In fact, if you reread what i wrote carefully, I think you'll find I didn't actually call you a huge d-bag at all; I merely inferred you might look like one after your post. Much like the entire tone of your post was sneering condescension inferring that because someone writes fast, their quality must be suspect.
> 
> And I don't want to grow up; I'm a Toys 'R Us kid.
> 
> Teehee.


It's not the speed of writing that concerns me. It's the speed of publishing that concerns me in the self-publishing world

Because a person can hit PUBLISH doesn't mean they should do it.

Unfortunately self-publishing is getting a bad name because of impatient writers. People chasing the coin, instead of realizing that the 1st draft is just that. A first draft. Usually not fit for anyone to see, no matter how much of an outline you have worked from. ( Even if you are a household name. Few pros release their first draft with a few minor edits. )

Maybe once self-publishers who feel the need to show their stats, start showing their refund stats. Maybe then I might take their stats seriously. Otherwise they mean nothing.

I would rather see a person with 1 book out that is quality than 9 that are crap, riddled with errors, weak plots, 1 dimensional characters and poor writing.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

kalel said:


> It's not the speed of writing that concerns me. It's the speed of publishing that concerns me in the self-publishing world
> 
> Because a person can hit PUBLISH doesn't mean they should do it.
> 
> Unfortunately self-publishing is getting a bad name because of impatient writers. People chasing the coin, instead of realizing that the 1st draft is just that. A first draft. Usually not fit for anyone to see, no matter how much of an outline you have worked from. ( Even if you are a household name. Few pros release their first draft with a few minor edits. )












FYI, in case you hadn't figure it out, this being in my signature is tongue-in-cheek.

And how do you know pros don't release their first drafts with a nice, light edit? Wait, is this Stephen King? Stephen! Are you in the forum posing as someone anonymous with no books in his signature? Oh, Mr. King you devil, you! Naughty boy. Trying to get in with the cool self-pubbers, the pulp fiction writers of today.


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## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

Dalya said:


> FYI, in case you hadn't figure it out, this being in my signature is tongue-in-cheek.
> 
> And how do you know pros don't release their first drafts with a nice, light edit? Wait, is this Stephen King? Stephen! Are you in the forum posing as someone anonymous with no books in his signature? Oh, Mr. King you devil, you! Naughty boy. Trying to get in with the cool self-pubbers, the pulp fiction writers of today.


No Dayla. I stand 100% behind self-publishing

But the standard of work being shoveled out the door needs to be better.

Right now most of it is below par.

Because people are chasing numbers, thinking they are the next J.A. Konrath or Amanda Hocking instead of focusing on quality.

That might lead to getting numbers ( some real, some fake to drive people to buy their books to see why they are hitting those numbers ) but eventually it will circle around and bite a person in the *ss.

Readers want quality in all areas of writing ( characters, plot, grammar etc etc )

It's like the story of the tortoise and the hare.

The hare takes a nap ( stops paying attention to quality ) confident that chasing the numbers will lead to winning.

The tortoise ultimately wins.


----------



## maritafowler (Nov 27, 2011)

The amazing Maeve Binchy went with first drafts. "Her natural talent for storytelling was such that she wrote just the way she spoke. As her colleague in London in the mid-1970s I would find her typing at speed and handing the first draft to the telex operator before heading off for one of her long lunches. She dared not reread the copy, she said, or she would spend the day rewriting it. It was this natural fluency that enabled her to produce 16 novels, several collections of short stories and a play in the last 30 years of her life." http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/jul/31/maeve-binchy

I'm certainly not one of those natural talents (I have to edit my stuff repeatedly), so I admire those who can.

FWIW - I've read Practice Cake by Dayla and quite enjoyed it...so no returns from me.



Dalya said:


> And how do you know pros don't release their first drafts with a nice, light edit? Wait, is this Stephen King? Stephen! Are you in the forum posing as someone anonymous with no books in his signature? Oh, Mr. King you devil, you! Naughty boy. Trying to get in with the cool self-pubbers, the pulp fiction writers of today.


----------



## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

kalel said:


> It's not the speed of writing that concerns me. It's the speed of publishing that concerns me in the self-publishing world
> 
> Because a person can hit PUBLISH doesn't mean they should do it.
> 
> ...


Before I accept your advice as correct, I'm going to need you to post your pen names and sales numbers, you know, so I can make sure I'm taking advice from a real writer and not someone who wandered in from a Freshman High School comp class or someone who just wrote their first book and can't even sell it to their mom. You understand.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

kalel said:


> No Dayla. I stand 100% behind self-publishing
> 
> But the standard of work being shoveled out the door needs to be better.
> 
> ...


So what's your point?


----------



## anotherpage (Apr 4, 2012)

RobertJCrane said:


> Before I accept your advice as correct, I'm going to need you to post your pen names and sales numbers, you know, so I can make sure I'm taking advice from a real writer and not someone who wandered in from a Freshman High School comp class or someone who just wrote their first book and can't even sell it to their mom. You understand.


Hard to hear the truth isn't Robert? No matter who it comes from.

Stats mean nothing to others if they don't show the whole picture -- the truthful one.

I could tell you I sold 50,000 last year would you believe me? No because you are too focused on calling people D-Bags because they said that a writer is a rewriter. Something in that statement has you up in arms. Maybe because you don't rewrite? who knows? It's not my place to decide why you find beef with it. I suggest some meditation to locate the route of your angst with that statement.


----------



## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

(Moves on to Kalel-free threads.)


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

kalel said:


> Hard to hear the truth isn't Robert? No matter who it comes from.
> 
> Stats mean nothing to others if they don't show the whole picture -- the truthful one.
> 
> I could tell you I sold 50,000 last year would you believe me? No because you are too focused on calling people D-Bags because they said that a writer is a rewriter. Something in that statement has you up in arms. Maybe because you don't rewrite? who knows?


LOL, the truth? I've taken exception to the insulting way your opinions are expressed. So have others. You don't accept that you've given insult - to Dalya, specifically - and that's fine, but it is THE issue I have with you. I have no other, I don't really care what you sell or don't sell, what you write or don't write. I don't care who you are, dude (or dudette) and it matters little to none to me whether you want to rewrite the same thing over and over or nail it on the first draft. I have no issue with the way any writer chooses to rewrite or not, because it's their business, not mine. I respect that, and I don't get all sanctimonious about how someone is DESTROYING ALL OF SELF-PUBLISHING ZOMG if they don't do it the way I do, I just worry about writing the best book I can.

I do, however, enjoy arguing with an Internet troll every now and again.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I actually do have a book rewrite to get back to.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Nobody asked for my two cents, but I'll throw it in anyway! Woo!

I don't rewrite. I do revise, though. I attack my books like the starving, furious, English-loving hyena that I am, but mostly to clean up flagrant emdash abuse and to move sentences around into logical order. If a book has major structural flaws that would require rewriting, I generally can't finish the first draft until that's corrected. So! By the time I type "the end," my books are indeed 80% complete.

My author rank says that I'm currently #192 in all books (wtf when did that happen are the servers borked again), so I must be doing _something_ right by not rewriting.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

smreine said:


> Nobody asked for my two cents, but I'll throw it in anyway! Woo!
> 
> I don't rewrite. I do revise, though. I attack my books like the starving, furious, English-loving hyena that I am, but mostly to clean up flagrant emdash abuse and to move sentences around into logical order. If a book has major structural flaws that would require rewriting, I generally can't finish the first draft until that's corrected. So! By the time I type "the end," my books are indeed 80% complete.
> 
> My author rank says that I'm currently #192 in all books (wtf when did that happen are the servers borked again), so I must be doing _something_ right by not rewriting.


That's pretty much how I do it. I can't keep going if I know there is a serious structural flaw. Different strokes and all that... My way wouldn't work for everyone.


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## ruecole (Jun 13, 2012)

Dalya said:


> Practice changes everything, imho.


SO TRUE!

Experienced authors need to rewrite a lot less than the newbies.

I don't rewrite either. Edit yes. Rewrite. No.

Rue


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

smreine said:


> Nobody asked for my two cents, but I'll throw it in anyway! Woo!
> 
> My author rank says that I'm currently #192 in all books (wtf when did that happen are the servers borked again), so I must be doing _something_ right by not rewriting.


I was hoping you were going to weigh in about an hour and a half ago, and with more mischief gland, less sense-and-sensibleness.

Congrats on your awesomeness, though. Fairly unsurprising imo.



JRTomlin said:


> That's pretty much how I do it. I can't keep going if I know there is a serious structural flaw. Different strokes and all that... My way wouldn't work for everyone.


Your talent for mischief would not have been out of place, either.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Sorry to disappoint. I've been working. (_What is that? Work??_)


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

kalel said:


> You misunderstood me.
> 
> You had said that you don't rewrite.
> 
> ...





> .HEINLEIN'S RULES FOR WRITING
> ----------------------------
> 
> 1. You must write.
> ...


Guess Heinlein wasn't a writer. Thanks for telling me because I would have sworn that he was. (At Robert's request  )

ETA: I have also been working... Sorry about that.

ETA: Our friend here wants "return statistics". Well, I had 2245 sales last month and 40 returns which is something like 1.7%. *shrug* For whatever that's worth.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

JRTomlin said:


> Guess Heinlein wasn't a writer. Thanks for telling me because I would have sworn that he was. *(At Robert's request  )*


I'm pretty sure Betsy would have considered me a good citizen on this board (or at least a non-offender) until today. Does the cattle prod hurt much?


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

RobertJCrane said:


> I'm pretty sure Betsy would have considered me a good citizen on this board (or at least a non-offender) until today. Does the cattle prod hurt much?


It smarts a bit, but you'll live.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

RobertJCrane said:


> Does the cattle prod hurt much?


The cattle prod doesn't hurt.

But you'll feel absolutely _amazing_ when it's taken away. 

To the list of talentless hacks who aren't writers because they don't rewrite can be added Harlan Ellison(TM), I believe.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

smreine said:


> Nobody asked for my two cents, but I'll throw it in anyway! Woo!
> 
> I don't rewrite. I do revise, though. I attack my books like the starving, furious, English-loving hyena that I am, but mostly to clean up flagrant emdash abuse and to move sentences around into logical order. If a book has major structural flaws that would require rewriting, I generally can't finish the first draft until that's corrected. So! By the time I type "the end," my books are indeed 80% complete.
> 
> My author rank says that I'm currently #192 in all books (wtf when did that happen are the servers borked again), so I must be doing _something_ right by not rewriting.


By the way, one of my profs once told me that em-dash abuse causes hairy palms.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

RobertJCrane said:


> I'm pretty sure Betsy would have considered me a good citizen on this board (or at least a non-offender) until today. Does the cattle prod hurt much?


We're bad influences on you. It's like we're turning into a KB street gang of people with hyperactive mischief glands.



George Berger said:


> To the list of talentless hacks who aren't writers because they don't rewrite can be added Harlan Ellison(TM), I believe.


Name rings a bell. Remind me who that is? A famous camel?



JRTomlin said:


> By the way, one of my profs once told me that em-dash abuse causes hairy palms.


I wouldn't be able to tell the difference at this point.


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## 60911 (Jun 13, 2012)

smreine said:


> Name rings a bell. Remind me who that is? A famous camel?


ZOMG THE CITY ON THE EDGE OF FOREVER (sort of) ZOMG



smreine said:


> We're bad influences on you. It's like we're turning into a KB street gang of people with hyperactive mischief glands.


I'll just tell her, if she asks, that all the cool kids are doing it. Oh, and you guys, too.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

ITT:


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

Now we need to assign Jet characters to KB members. I vote Dalya as Ice cause he's the _dreamiest_.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

smreine said:


> Name rings a bell. Remind me who that is? A famous camel?


Nah, he's just some guy who wrote a couple of short stories, a while back. Worked on a TV show or two, I think, maybe a movie nobody's ever heard of. Didn't have what it took to be a real "writer", obviously, so he went into journalism.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Can I be Anybodys?


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

smreine said:


> Can I be Anybodys?


Hmph. You're also dreamy, too dreamy for Anybodys. How 'bout Riff?


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

But Anybodys is awesome! I think she's dreamy.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

Dalya sux. teh boosks get pwnd bye totes bad returns. lol. adn ratigs. down wit KB BAORD BULLEES


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## Nicole Ciacchella (May 21, 2012)

Judging someone based on their works when you've never read one of their works? Now that's what I call gall.

I've read some of Dalya's works, and she is a very good writer. Practice Cake is an excellent book. 

Why on Earth would you insult someone just for the sake of insulting them? I fail to get people like this.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)




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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

Nicole Ciacchella said:


> Judging someone based on their works when you've never read one of their works? Now that's what I call gall.
> 
> I've read some of Dalya's works, and she is a very good writer. Practice Cake is an excellent book.
> 
> Why on Earth would you insult someone just for the sake of insulting them? I fail to get people like this.


How could he POSSIBLY get evidence though? There's NO WAY to determine if Dalya's writing is good or bad or effective or professional or amateurish. Is there?


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

NathanWrann said:


> How could he POSSIBLY get evidence though? There's NO WAY to determine if Dalya's writing is good or bad or effective or professional or amateurish. Is there?


Her writing is better than mine.

But I tend to think _everyone's_ writing is better than mine.

Except for that "erotica" David Adams tried writing with a co-ed from California in it, while having never been to California nor read any erotica, previously. <shudder>

And except for most of the stuff by the latest round of new writers here with lots of typos and gobs of extremely suspicious-looking reviews.

_And_ that one infamous erotica story about "fastidious humping" that Betsy will kill me if I link to again.

But, still, I think Dalya's writing is, y'know... really good.


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

George Berger said:


> Her writing is better than mine.
> 
> But I tend to think _everyone's_ writing is better than mine.
> 
> Except for that "erotica" David Adams tried writing with a co-ed from California in it, while having never been to California nor read any erotica, previously. <shudder>


Poor David. And here he was behaving himself (yeah sure), blissfully unaware of what is going down in the thread and got thrown in the middle of things. 

I read Practice Cake, too. It was very good.


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## Nicole Ciacchella (May 21, 2012)

NathanWrann said:


> How could he POSSIBLY get evidence though? There's NO WAY to determine if Dalya's writing is good or bad or effective or professional or amateurish. Is there?


What I meant is that you can't judge something you've never read. From what I can tell, he's never read anything she's ever written so where does he get off thinking he can judge her writing?


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

smreine said:


> But Anybodys is awesome! I think she's dreamy.


You can be Anybodys you want to be.

Get it? yuk yuk yuk!

(I'm srsly cracking myself up over here)



NathanWrann said:


>


Love.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

I haven't read Practice Cake, but I have read Dalya's Pretty Girls Don't Cry, and it was one of the very few books that managed to keep my attention while I was moody and PMSing a couple months ago. So it must be pretty good to get through that brain fog.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

I'm not reading this thread. Stop, you guys are making my ears burn.


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## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

The real question here is: WHY HASN'T DALYA PUBLISHED ANY WORDS IN 2013? Come on. It's the 2nd!

(Are you rewriting? Are you?)

WELL STOP IT! HIT THE RED BUTTON, I SAY, HIT IT!


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## ruecole (Jun 13, 2012)

I was wondering the same thing. I bet she is. I bet she's rewriting right now! 

I, too, have read Practice Cake and loved it. Just wish I had more hours in the day to read the rest of her books (which are sitting on my Kindle along with a bunch of other KBers books waiting for me to read them...  )--at least the ones I *know* about.  

Rue


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> The real question here is: WHY HASN'T DALYA PUBLISHED ANY WORDS IN 2013? Come on. It's the 2nd!
> 
> (Are you rewriting? Are you?)
> 
> WELL STOP IT! HIT THE RED BUTTON, I SAY, HIT IT!


I wrote 5k today in between the other nonsense I do. I keep planning to write more, but ... internet. I'm doing a short that's trying to be a novella. I think I'm going to give it a firm hand, though, and stop it now before it gets crazy. It's written with a hint of narrative distance and no time-frame specified, so I'm going to pan way back and skim forward five years in a more mature voice. Like a boss.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Dalya said:


> I wrote 5k today in between the other nonsense I do. I keep planning to write more, but ... internet. I'm doing a short that's trying to be a novella. I think I'm going to give it a firm hand, though, and stop it now before it gets crazy. It's written with a hint of narrative distance and no time-frame specified, so I'm going to pan way back and skim forward five years in a more mature voice. Like a boss.


Dalya, your sigs just crack me up.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

For giggles:


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

Dalya is not human, she is a mutant with half a cat protuding from her shoulder. SHE IS NOT QUALIFIED TO WRITE ABOUT HUMAN BEINGS!    
Even with two editors and 455878 rewrites, she will never get it right, NEVER!

Worse even, she uses her sig to exploit our lack of attention-span, forcing us to write insanities on message boards, that produce a magnetic force with a devilish evil-genius machine, that will ultimately thrust the Earth into space and cause the annihilation of the human race.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

BAHAHAH!

You guys get to work. I already wrote 9,987,489.2 words today and published 18 anthologies before dinner.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

Nicole Ciacchella said:


> What I meant is that you can't judge something you've never read. From what I can tell, he's never read anything she's ever written so where does he get off thinking he can judge her writing?


I know. I was being sarcastic.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> For giggles:


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## maritafowler (Nov 27, 2011)

LOVE IT!



George Berger said:


>


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## Iwritelotsofbooks (Nov 17, 2010)

Dalya said:


> BAHAHAH!
> 
> You guys get to work. I already wrote 9,987,489.2 words today and published 18 anthologies before dinner.


You've sold 168 books in two days? Holy smokes. I need to have more breakdowns.


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