# Non-wireless Kindle 2



## KindleRx (Dec 10, 2009)

Hi everyone,

New to to e-readers and this forum. So I was browsing ebay yesterday for a K2 when I stumbled upon this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300376357638. Can anyone tell me anything about this version. I don't travel much so saving some money would be a plus. In the description they mention basic web browser, which I know the wireless version has. So that's why I'm confused, is it truly non-wireless or?? Also, would this work with a mac and will I be able to update through it?

Thanks!


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## Britt (Feb 8, 2009)

Welcome to KB!

As far as I know, Amazon doesn't make a non-wireless version of the Kindle. It sounds like the seller is trying to ship internationally, and since it's a regular Kindle 2, not the new international Kindle 2, the wireless won't work outside of the U.S. If you live in the U.S., though, it generally shouldn't be a problem to use wireless (which you definitely need to access the basic web browser), but you might want to check a coverage map to be sure.

I live in Japan and I have the regular Kindle 2, so I can't use the wireless feature. Downloading books and software updates to my Mac and then transferring them to my Kindle via USB is no big deal


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## xianfox (Dec 7, 2009)

There was a recent theft of a quantity of Kindles from a delivery vehicle. It's probable that Amazon knows which units were stolen and deactivated the wireless on them. This could be one of those.

Amazon could also prevent one of the stolen units from being activated on an Amazon account thus preventingg the purchase of books thru Amazon.

Personally, I'd avoid this auction.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

I have to agree.  You can't buy a Kindle from Amazon for less than $219. . . that's for a refurbished unit.  $179?  Too good to be true.  I'd steer clear.


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## marianneg (Nov 4, 2008)

xianfox said:


> There was a recent theft of a quantity of Kindles from a delivery vehicle. It's probable that Amazon knows which units were stolen and deactivated the wireless on them. This could be one of those.


Where'd you hear about that?


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

That was my first thought too...that it was possibly stolen and therefore can't be registered to connect with Amazon.  Sounds fishy to me.


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## dnagirl (Oct 21, 2009)

Wow, that's a lot of Kindles!  He's sold 459 of them so far in one week.


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

In addition to the wireless confusion, a couple of other things caught my eye. It says shrinkwrapped, but the kindle doesn't come shrinkwrapped. At the top of the listing, it says no returns, yet at the bottom it has conditions for returns. The item location, to the right, near the top, says "Cell Phone, FL". The person has good feedback, including people who have bought K2s from him. But for me, the $40 extra to get a refub from Amazon with a warranty, is worth it. 

For entertainment, or if you are still considering buying this, try sending the seller a question (link to the right, near top) and see if he answers, and if so, also see how good his English is. That's generally a big tip off of a Nigerian scam.


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## jscottcole (Dec 10, 2009)

I did email the seller. He is seems to be an american. Or at least a very good english speaker and his gmail address is very normal sounding. He was very upfront with me about the wireless being "suspended". I questioned the validity of these being new, being afraid that the wirless was either broken or they were stolen. He told me that if I bought one and it was not new, he would refund my money.

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64355&highlight=kindle+suspended

The above link is a guy who's wife bought him one.

It all seems very weird. If the guy was selling stolen Kindles, why would he be so communicative. Especially since ebay or paypal could find this guy if Amazon went looking.

I think I will avoid....

Also, on an odd note the guy in question added me to his Google Chat friends list. Now I see him in google chat when he is online. Along with his name. Very strange actions for a person potentially selling stolen goods.


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

It really seems like there's no legitimate reason the wireless would be disabled other than the kindle being stolen.

It can actually be quite hard to catch these people. Yes, eBay has the person's eBay log in info, his gmail address, and his paypal username, but that's about it. It may be possible for them to find out personal info and catch him, but it won't be easy. They'd have to look at how he is using/getting access to his paypal funds. If he were to request a transfer to his bank account (as I do), then they could catch him. But he's probably using the money from paypal to buy other things. Then they'd have to see what he's buying, from whom, and try to get a ship to address (which might just be a PO box). 

So, you see, it's complicated.


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## Joan Flett (Mar 10, 2009)

Something else to consider....the sellers feedback.  98.8 is not very good as eBay feedbacks go, 99 or better is what you want to aim for.  Check him out on www.toolhaus.org and click on negative feedback rec'd; not a good track record.   I'd be very wary of this seller no matter what he was selling.  You're right, it's a good idea to avoid him.


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## Wheezie (Oct 28, 2008)

I would totally stay clear of that one personally. I would be to guess they are "hot" because of the suspension.


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

why dont you call Amazon Kindle CS and ask them why the wireless is out on those units?


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

BTackitt said:


> why dont you call Amazon Kindle CS and ask them why the wireless is out on those units?


Hi everyone. New to these boards. I'm of the customers of this guy, except I bought the Kindle 2 when it was described as "international version," and no mention of the wireless not working.

I got the Kindle 2 this Saturday (he shipped it next-day for $244.99 before the listing changed to $179.99 with NO wireless). My wireless was immediately not working. My wife has a Kindle 2 that I bought from Amazon the day of release, and the wireless works fine in hers. I've been in contact with Amazon since Saturday (December 5), and they have not been able to resolve the issue nor explain WHY the wireless is suspended. They HAVE told me, though, that they will get my Kindle reconnected somehow, but I have my doubts.

I feel very sorry for the hundreds of people who bought one from him as gifts for Christmas, and that won't be able to connect theirs to the Whispernet. I had messaged some of the buyers to ask if they have trouble as I did - and people who replied who HAD used their Kindles said they had the same issue as me. However, quite a few people replied and said they weren't even opening them till Christmas. *sigh*

In any case, something is amiss. The seller did refund me a bit of money for "my trouble," but really the whole thing makes no sense...

FYI, I'm in the USA.


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## kevindorsey (Mar 4, 2009)

Non-wireless?  LOL.


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

kevindorsey said:


> Non-wireless? LOL.


That really is exactly what it is!


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

WilliamG, not to rub salt in your wounds, but why on earth would you buy from eBay when it was only $15 less than buying new on Amazon? Maybe, as the OP said, you had some discount for buying with PayPal?


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

vermontcathy said:


> WilliamG, not to rub salt in your wounds, but why on earth would you buy from eBay when it was only $15 less than buying new on Amazon? Maybe, as the OP said, you had some discount for buying with PayPal?


Because I live in Washington state, so I have to pay 9.5% tax on products from Amazon. I got 10% off for using Bing cashback for the $244.99 which made is $220 shipped, instead of what, $285-ish from Amazon? The $244.99 (before Bing cashback) price wasn't so different from Amazon that it screamed SCAM to me in any way, shape or form. But you can't blame me for wanting to save $65, can you?


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## Sofie (Dec 30, 2008)

> But you can't blame me for wanting to save $65, can you?


Not one little bit. Everyone tries to save money any way they can.


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

The people who got scammed by this person need to contact eBay. If he is selling stolen goods, they will suspend his account.


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

WilliamG said:


> Because I live in Washington state, so I have to pay 9.5% tax on products from Amazon. I got 10% off for using Bing cashback for the $244.99 which made is $220 shipped, instead of what, $285-ish from Amazon? The $244.99 (before Bing cashback) price wasn't so different from Amazon that it screamed SCAM to me in any way, shape or form. But you can't blame me for wanting to save $65, can you?


$65 does seem more worth it than the $15 I was thinking of. Still, if it really was brand new in an unopened box for $244.99... Where would the seller get a kindle (actually, get more than 10, as his posting says) for less than retail - when Amazon doesn't sell wholesale to any stores or anything? If it was a person selling just one, and he said something like he got it for a gift and doesn't want it, that makes sense. But more than 10 at less than retail?

I'm just saying, be careful on eBay, people. If a posting says brand new and perfect, for less than it costs to buy one new, anywhere, it's too good to be true. Hopefully Amazon's great customer service comes through for you, WilliamG, and reactivates the wireless. Keep us posted. Are they at least letting you register it to your Amazon account and download books to it via the cord?

One last eBay thing - even if someone has 100% positive feedback, you can't trust that. People hijack other people's good eBay accounts (somehow steal the person's password) so it looks like they are an honest, trusted seller.


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## dnagirl (Oct 21, 2009)

More than 10 units for sale currently. He's already sold *459* since December 3rd.


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## marianneg (Nov 4, 2008)

Sofie said:


> Not one little bit. Everyone tries to save money any way they can.


But knowingly buying stolen property (not saying this is what either the OP or WilliamG did at the time) is still a criminal activity.



vermontcathy said:


> One last eBay thing - even if someone has 100% positive feedback, you can't trust that. People hijack other people's good eBay accounts (somehow steal the person's password) so it looks like they are an honest, trusted seller.


...or that people are happy with their cheap merchandise and don't care where it came from. Lots of the book pirates have _great_ feedback.


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## dmcounts (Nov 26, 2009)

The seller is no longer offering the Kindle on eBay.

He is still offering Sprint Centro cell phones with bad ESNs though.


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

I reported the item as potentially stolen a few hours ago.


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## dnagirl (Oct 21, 2009)

Yes, I saw that he had ended the auction early.  There were originally 4 more days left.


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## geko29 (Dec 23, 2008)

vermontcathy said:


> It can actually be quite hard to catch these people. Yes, eBay has the person's eBay log in info, his gmail address, and his paypal username, but that's about it. It may be possible for them to find out personal info and catch him, but it won't be easy. They'd have to look at how he is using/getting access to his paypal funds. If he were to request a transfer to his bank account (as I do), then they could catch him. But he's probably using the money from paypal to buy other things. Then they'd have to see what he's buying, from whom, and try to get a ship to address (which might just be a PO box).


In order to be a merchant, you have to have a verified Paypal account, which means one tied to a legitimate bank account and have various other pieces of confirmed personal information on file. Since eBay owns Paypal, it would be trivial for them to find such a person.


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## dmcounts (Nov 26, 2009)

Register with a prepaid debit card.


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## KindleRx (Dec 10, 2009)

Thanks for the replies everyone. I knew it was too good to be true. I guess I'll wait until after Christmas to see if they lower the price of the refurbished. I would really like to get one for under $200



kevindorsey said:


> Non-wireless? LOL.


"LOL" at what exactly?


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## higdona (Dec 1, 2009)

vermontcathy said:


> One last eBay thing - even if someone has 100% positive feedback, you can't trust that. People hijack other people's good eBay accounts (somehow steal the person's password) so it looks like they are an honest, trusted seller.


That rule is not true. I have 100% positive feedback on my ebay account. I never hijack other peoples accounts to get that score. I dont sell much but I do get positive feedback because I ship fast and communicate well with people.


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## anivyl (Nov 12, 2009)

was just reading this post and checking out the link. there's another kindle up at this moment, for 244.99. very interesting, but first we need to find out when and where the kindles were stolen... i haven't heard of it yet o.o and it intrigues me


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## Tigerlaady (Dec 11, 2009)

Well, my husband purchased 2 of these from this guy this morning - one was for me for xmas. I just stumbled on this sight and now we're both really concerned. I emailed the seller to ask how he knew they were not wireless if they're still shrink wrapped. I'll keep this post updated with his answers to my questions. We're trying to figure out how to just cancel the sale. No one mentions in his feedback if the other, wireless ones work - they just say that he "ships fast"! Big deal! Do the units work Buyers don't even know how to leave proper feedback! As of 11:30pm mst, he's running yet another non-woreless auction with "more than 10 available" for the quantity. He sure has a lot of them!


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## Britt (Feb 8, 2009)

vermontcathy said:


> For entertainment, or if you are still considering buying this, try sending the seller a question (link to the right, near top) and see if he answers, and if so, also see how good his English is. That's generally a big tip off of a Nigerian scam.


English is the official language of Nigeria.


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## TheSeagull (Oct 25, 2009)

I personally wouldn't buy a Kindle ANYWHERE but Amazon. Amazon is the only place that sells them new, why would someone sell them new on eBay for a loss (as they must be obtained from Amazon) unless there was something suspicious about it?


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

higdona said:


> That rule is not true. I have 100% positive feedback on my ebay account. I never hijack other peoples accounts to get that score. I dont sell much but I do get positive feedback because I ship fast and communicate well with people.


You misunderstood me. I'm not saying that everyone with 100% feedback cheated or hacked an account to get that. I'm just saying that just because someone has good feedback doesn't mean you can trust it. For instance, someone could steal YOUR password, and use your account with a good feedback rating to sell their stuff. Someone would say, "Hey, this person has 100% feedback - I can trust them!" But that's not the case if they're not dealing with who they think they're dealing with.


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## Anju  (Nov 8, 2008)

English may be the official language of Nigeria, but maybe not necessarily American English and some incorrect grammar might just give it away - but I am not sure I would buy a wireLESS, how would you get updates? without d/l yourself? and then they might not even work.


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

Anju No. 469 said:


> English may be the official language of Nigeria, but maybe not necessarily American English and some incorrect grammar might just give it away - but I am not sure I would buy a wireLESS, how would you get updates? without d/l yourself? and then they might not even work.


You can transfer the updates to the Kindle very easily via a USB cable. I have done so on my wireLESS Kindle 2. Amazon still have not "fixed" it for me, and said they couldn't even find the original order number associated with the serial number. Oh the joy of eBay.


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## TheSeagull (Oct 25, 2009)

The fact is why would anybody sell a genuine new Kindle at a loss?


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

TheSeagull said:


> The fact is why would anybody sell a genuine new Kindle at a loss?


It's possible someone might sell something on eBay at a loss to move product quickly to build up feedback, though I doubt this is the issue in this case.


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

WilliamG said:


> It's possible someone might sell something on eBay at a loss to move product quickly to build up feedback, though I doubt this is the issue in this case.


Or if someone got something new as a gift, doesn't want it, and doesn't care if they 100% of the retail price, since they didn't pay for it. Of course, not the situation here (since he's selling a LOT).


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## kevindorsey (Mar 4, 2009)

vermontcathy said:


> Or if someone got something new as a gift, doesn't want it, and doesn't care if they 100% of the retail price, since they didn't pay for it. Of course, not the situation here (since he's selling a LOT).


Yea, that's not at all what's happening here.


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## vermontcathy (Feb 18, 2009)

kevindorsey said:


> Yea, that's not at all what's happening here.


I KNOW. That's why I said, "Of course, not the situation here"


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## Anju  (Nov 8, 2008)

I didn't have whispernet for 1-1/2 years, but still not sure I would buy one from somewhere other than an authorized seller, which I doubt seriously if anyone on e-bay is.  I would want it to work when I was in the US.


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## dnagirl (Oct 21, 2009)

WilliamG said:


> You can transfer the updates to the Kindle very easily via a USB cable. I have done so on my wireLESS Kindle 2. Amazon still have not "fixed" it for me, and said they couldn't even find the original order number associated with the serial number. Oh the joy of eBay.


If these were stolen from a truck, as was insinuated somewhere upthread, I'm assuming there would be no order number associated with that serial number. WilliamG, have you suggested to them that the unit was possibly stolen?


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

dnagirl said:


> If these were stolen from a truck, as was insinuated somewhere upthread, I'm assuming there would be no order number associated with that serial number. WilliamG, have you suggested to them that the unit was possibly stolen?


Absolutely, but Amazon wouldn't confirm either way that this was the case...


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## WilliamG (Dec 10, 2009)

Thought I'd update that I got an email from Amazon saying my Kindle was connected, and sure enough, after a restart, my Kindle 2 connects to the Whispernet!  Yay success!


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

That's excellent news! I'm so happy they got it working for you.


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## happyblob (Feb 21, 2009)

Good news. I missed all of the drama, but I'm glad to hear that you've got it sorted out.


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

His feedback has dropped quite a bit from a lot of unhappy buyers who did not receive their orders at all.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Anju No. 469 said:


> I didn't have whispernet for 1-1/2 years, but still not sure I would buy one from somewhere other than an authorized seller, which I doubt seriously if anyone on eBay is. I would want it to work when I was in the US.


I don't really understand this philosophy, I mean I understand the being leery of eBay, but (the universal) _we_ sell kindles on this forum all the time, and I doubt any are "authorized dealers". Is the the new status maybe


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

Red said:


> I don't really understand this philosophy, I mean I understand the being leery of eBay, but (the universal) _we_ sell kindles on this forum all the time, and I doubt any are "authorized dealers". Is the the new status maybe


Reselling a Kindle you own and no longer need is different than having 400 Kindles that just dropped into your lap.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

I understand the difference between selling my used kindle "and 400 dropped in my lap." My confusion was on the point _ "but still not sure I would buy one from somewhere other than an authorized seller." _ I wasn't attempting to start a disagreement. Just trying to understand the point  .


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

People have different levels of comfort.  I don't think I'd be comfortable buying from anyone other than Amazon either. Not to say I don't trust people here, just that I'd be more comfortable buying from Amazon.

Many others would -- and have been -- perfectly happy buying used Kindles from members here.  That's fine too.

It's a personal choice.


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

Well, if you use a credit card through paypal you really have little risk. *Both* will protect the buyer in cases of fraud. I have bought tons of things on eBay including expensive lenses and other photo gear. One of my main rules of thumb is: I want to see actual photos of the item. Anyone can pull stock photos and set up an auction. I feel better if the seller is just a regular person selling something they no longer want or need. I also do check feedback and take it seriously. I'd be especially wary of someone with very little selling big ticket items. Also check to see if they sell at all, someone might have a lot of feedback from buying but not selling. I agree, everyone has different comfort levels. As someone said earlier, if sounds to good to be true it probably isn't!


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## Anju  (Nov 8, 2008)

Maybe I had a bad choice of words.  I did buy a K1 waaay back when from a member of kindleboards, but like Verena said, someone who had 400 kindles dropped into their lap, or even 50, would indicate someone who is not quite on the up and up unless they explained how they got them  .  Craig's list would also make me wonder, although some on kindleboards have bought through there.  

Sometimes my fingers go faster than my brain, and Red you have to remember I am almost a geezerette and we don't always make a whole lot of sense


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

I wasn't attempting to start a problem. Sorry.


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## Anju  (Nov 8, 2008)

no worries Red - I didn't think you were trying to cause problems with me.  After all almost gezerettes have thick skins


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Thanks for understanding 


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## kevindorsey (Mar 4, 2009)

Red said:


> I wasn't attempting to start a problem. Sorry.


Problem starter, problem child


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

I am a middle child


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## mominsky (Feb 23, 2009)

Octochick said:


> Well, if you use a credit card through paypal you really have little risk. *Both* will protect the buyer in cases of fraud. I have bought tons of things on eBay including expensive lenses and other photo gear. One of my main rules of thumb is: I want to see actual photos of the item. Anyone can pull stock photos and set up an auction. I feel better if the seller is just a regular person selling something they no longer want or need. I also do check feedback and take it seriously. I'd be especially wary of someone with very little selling big ticket items. Also check to see if they sell at all, someone might have a lot of feedback from buying but not selling. I agree, everyone has different comfort levels. As someone said earlier, if sounds to good to be true it probably isn't!


octo, be careful with "if you use a credit card through paypal you really have little risk" - i frequent The Consumerist (consumerist.com), and have heard stories of people using credit cards for paypal purchases and when they try to do a chargeback, the credit card company wont because it is through paypal. I personally have never had this happen, but have definitely read where it has...I use my American Express for EVERYTHING, because of how good they are with chargebacks, but on paypal, I try to think paypal is my only line of defense.

And actually, on the subject of American Express, just this week they settled a chargeback and refunded me the purchase amount - bought a cell phone from a shady place online, who calls me a week later to say it isnt in stock and i will get a refund. After 3 weeks of calling them and hearing "refund in 3 more days", i finally told them if i dont get it, i am doing to do a chargeback. Did the chargeback, and got my money back. Will never shop at Thrifty Computer again!


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## dnagirl (Oct 21, 2009)

Also, Paypal will not always protect a buyer in cases of fraud.  You must be able to prove to Paypal, usually with a letter from the original manufacturer, that the item is a fraudulent item.  Often, they won't accept anything less than this for proof.  They will not automatically side with the buyer in a fraud case and sometimes will side with the seller if they can produce proof of delivery.  I've heard way too many horror stories (just read the buyer's forum on eBay) and I don't trust Paypal to protect me against fraud, so I personally refrain from buying electronics through eBay.


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## kevindorsey (Mar 4, 2009)

dnagirl said:


> Also, Paypal will not always protect a buyer in cases of fraud. You must be able to prove to Paypal, usually with a letter from the original manufacturer, that the item is a fraudulent item. Often, they won't accept anything less than this for proof. They will not automatically side with the buyer in a fraud case and sometimes will side with the seller if they can produce proof of delivery. I've heard way too many horror stories (just read the buyer's forum on eBay) and I don't trust Paypal to protect me against fraud, so I personally refrain from buying electronics through eBay.


they are usually strongly on the side of the buyer with any kind of a good explanation. I've sold items before, so I know a bit about this.


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