# The defective PaperWhite thread



## NogDog

Got my Kindle PaperWhite at 7:40pm EDT. By 7:45 I had it plugged in to the power cord and one of my several Kindle AC adapters and started playing around with it. I immediately noticed it seemed unresponsive and quite flaky about how/where I touched the screen -- it turned out to be impossible for me to enter my wifi password. (If I'd kept trying, I risked further damaging it by bouncing it off a wall.) I tried a restart by holding the power button in for 15 seconds, but that didn't seem to help.

Then it occurred to me that with earlier Kindles, you didn't get a real restart unless it was not plugged in, so I unplugged it, did another restart by holding in the power button, and then everything seemed to work fine. I connected to wifi, downloaded some of my books, played around with font settings. Then I plugged in the cord again, and guess what: back to the flaky touch screen rendering it essentially useless. A little testing (including with a different cord) ended up proving that it only had problems while plugged in.

I guess I'll be contacting Kindle Support tomorrow and requesting a replacement.


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## Leslie

And hopefully you'll have it asap. That's what's happened to me when I received  a defective Kindle on delivery.

L


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## Me and My Kindle

> Got my Kindle PaperWhite at 7:40pm EDT.


I'm sorry that you're having trouble with your new Kindle Paperwhite. But I have to admit... I'm also jealous that yours has already arrived so soon! Amazon only started shipping them out on Monday!


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## mom133d (aka Liz)

Mine randomly restarted on me as I was downloading books from my archive. Until I have it happen again I won't worry.


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## BenReem

My fiance and I each got a paperwhite yesterday. After playing around with ours for a few hours, we've noticed that on his screen there are pinhole broken pixels (about 4) towards the bottom of the screen. While it doesn't impact the functionality of the device it is very noticeable. Do you guys think it's something worth contacting CS about or should we just suck it up?


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## HappyGuy

^^ Contact CS. It shouldn't be like that from the start and it may drive y'all crazy (well ... some people it would).


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## BenReem

I'm planning on contacting them now. I just noticed they charged my account for $119 even though we paid for both kindles with gift cards. When I checked our GC balance, there was $119 there. So they gave me back the gift card amount and instead charged my credit card. I'm not a happy camper.


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## Moony

I've found that devices that are plugged in while youvare using them tend to be a bit glitchy. Both my phone (Droid Razr Maxx) and my tablet (Samsung Galaxy 10.1) are much less responsive and often force close apps, have problems with the touchscreen response and also have problems when using the on screen keyboard. I wouldn't worry too much about problems while it is plugged in. I would be more concerned if those issues continued while unplugged.


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## Atunah

BenReem said:


> My fiance and I each got a paperwhite yesterday. After playing around with ours for a few hours, we've noticed that on his screen there are pinhole broken pixels (about 4) towards the bottom of the screen. While it doesn't impact the functionality of the device it is very noticeable. Do you guys think it's something worth contacting CS about or should we just suck it up?


I have one of these "holes" on the bottom left, right above the location number. I am still waffling over what to do. I am giving it a few days. I have a perfect screen otherwise, everything works. I think that bright tiny speck is some metal dust stuck under the layer and the light shines downward and lights it up. The higher I turn the light on, the brighter it gets. It is very small. If the light is off, its not there.

Unless it really is a hole going up.


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## Kathy

BenReem said:


> I'm planning on contacting them now. I just noticed they charged my account for $119 even though we paid for both kindles with gift cards. When I checked our GC balance, there was $119 there. So they gave me back the gift card amount and instead charged my credit card. I'm not a happy camper.


Same thing happened to me. I found out later that if you add the gift card after you purchase you have to modify your order and apply the the card.


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## Nickinev

BenReem said:


> My fiance and I each got a paperwhite yesterday. After playing around with ours for a few hours, we've noticed that on his screen there are pinhole broken pixels (about 4) towards the bottom of the screen. While it doesn't impact the functionality of the device it is very noticeable. Do you guys think it's something worth contacting CS about or should we just suck it up?


I would definitely contact them. I had one dead pixel and it was driving me nuts, I couldn't imagine just dealing with four!

NIcole


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## Miss Moneypenny

Earlier this year I bought a Nook Glow and experienced the same type of issue, though the pixels did not appear bright like that until after I had been using it for a few days. I returned it and they did tell me it was a defect. Not sure what the differences are between the Nook screen and the Kinlde Paperwhite.



Atunah said:


> I have one of these "holes" on the bottom left, right above the location number. I am still waffling over what to do. I am giving it a few days. I have a perfect screen otherwise, everything works. I think that bright tiny speck is some metal dust stuck under the layer and the light shines downward and lights it up. The higher I turn the light on, the brighter it gets. It is very small. If the light is off, its not there.
> 
> Unless it really is a hole going up.


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## BenReem

well i contacted CS about both issues. they issued a replacement kindle for my fiance (will arrive between Oct 17-24th with prime 1 day shipping). We have 30 days to return this one so he won't be without a kindle for 2 weeks. 


For the 3rd charge issue, they took back the GC amount and issued a refund to our credit card, however somewhere along that line the rep messed up my gift card balance. It now says $69 even though the balance is zero, and according to the rep, it will never change. So if i add a $100 GC it will read $69. Not a huge deal but we use gift cards a lot (we get fuel perks from buying them here at giant eagle) and it will be a hassle subtracting $69 from the balance every time we want to know how much we have.


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## Not Here

BenReem said:


> well i contacted CS about both issues. they issued a replacement kindle for my fiance (will arrive between Oct 17-24th with prime 1 day shipping). We have 30 days to return this one so he won't be without a kindle for 2 weeks.
> 
> For the 3rd charge issue, they took back the GC amount and issued a refund to our credit card, however somewhere along that line the rep messed up my gift card balance. It now says $69 even though the balance is zero, and according to the rep, it will never change. So if i add a $100 GC it will read $69. Not a huge deal but we use gift cards a lot (we get fuel perks from buying them here at giant eagle) and it will be a hassle subtracting $69 from the balance every time we want to know how much we have.


So glad you were able to get it worked out. The great customer service is one of the main reasons Amazon keeps me as a customer. I seriously wonder if she is wrong about the $69 though. Sounds to me like they made a mistake and you've got a credit of 69. Wouldn't be the first time I saw this. With my first Kindle I had to return it about 4 times. During this time I bought a Kindle for my brother. Anyways, they were exchanging one for me and processing another. I ended up with a credit of $100. I called because it was weird. They didn't really know what to do and just said enjoy.  I hope it end in your favor as well.


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## Kathy

Bethany B. said:


> So glad you were able to get it worked out. The great customer service is one of the main reasons Amazon keeps me as a customer. I seriously wonder if she is wrong about the $69 though. Sounds to me like they made a mistake and you've got a credit of 69. Wouldn't be the first time I saw this. With my first Kindle I had to return it about 4 times. During this time I bought a Kindle for my brother. Anyways, they were exchanging one for me and processing another. I ended up with a credit of $100. I called because it was weird. They didn't really know what to do and just said enjoy.  I hope it end in your favor as well.


Same thing happened to me with the K2. I wound up getting back all of my money with all the credits they kept giving me after 4 defective screens. I was afraid to use but they kept telling me it was mine. After about 3 months I started using it.


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## BenReem

I just paid for 2 amazon covers for us and I think you're right....It just discounted the amount. That's amazing! I'm so pleasantly surprised! 


I do love amazon's CS. I've been a prime member for years and I've never found better service than theirs.


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## BenReem

Atunah said:


> I have one of these "holes" on the bottom left, right above the location number. I am still waffling over what to do. I am giving it a few days. I have a perfect screen otherwise, everything works. I think that bright tiny speck is some metal dust stuck under the layer and the light shines downward and lights it up. The higher I turn the light on, the brighter it gets. It is very small. If the light is off, its not there.
> 
> Unless it really is a hole going up.


I can tell you CS was great about replacing it. They asked me to restart the KP and see if it went away, I told them it did not (it's obviously a hardware issue) and they immediately issued a replacement. Granted, it won't arrive until the end of the month, but that's okay!


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## carrie

I, too, love Amazon's customer service!  My PW arrived and the light was very uneven from the bottom to about a third of the way up the screen.  I called CS Wednesday to ask them about it and was told they would send a replacement, but that it would take 3-4 weeks to get it.  This was fine with me as I still have my old Kindle to use.  To my surprise, the next day I received an email from Amazon saying they they were upgrading my wi-fi only, special offers PW to a 3G, no special offers PW at no cost because of the backorder delay!  It's out for delivery today!  I can't believe it, but I sure appreciate what they've done.


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## AnelaBelladonna

I ordered a wifi only for my husband and a 3g for me. They both arrived yesterday.  My husband's was perfect but my screen was a dingy gray color no matter how high I set the light.  I called customer service and my new Kindle PW 3G will arrive tomorrow.  The customer service guy, Derrick, was amazing and I told him so!  I wish all companies could be like amazon.com and all customer service reps could be like Derrick.


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## LuvHorses

AnelaBelladonna said:


> I ordered a wifi only for my husband and a 3g for me. They both arrived yesterday. My husband's was perfect but my screen was a dingy gray color no matter how high I set the light. I called customer service and my new Kindle PW 3G will arrive tomorrow. The customer service guy, Derrick, was amazing and I told him so! I wish all companies could be like amazon.com and all customer service reps could be like Derrick.


Not fair to those of us who preordered and have delivery dates of Oct 24!

Replacements should be shipped after fulfillment of pre orders.


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## AnelaBelladonna

LuvHorses said:


> Not fair to those of us who preordered and have delivery dates of Oct 24!
> 
> Replacements should be shipped after fulfillment of pre orders.


There are going to be back orders for quite a while now so you are saying that even though I ordered the first day pre-orders were available that I should wait a couple of months until all of the orders are delivered before I get one that is working like it's supposed to? THAT is not fair.

Edit: Perhaps it has something to do with the availability of the type of Kindle. Mine is a 3G with no ads. Maybe if I had one of the other types, it would take longer. Anyway, even though you weren't very nice, I hope you get your Kindle very soon. Mine was supposed to arrive on the 10th but it came yesterday so maybe yours will arrive sooner than expected too.


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## LuvHorses

I am talking about preorders before Oct 1st.

I'd be happy with any PW, at least I would know a replacement would come eventually. Could still read etc.


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## w5jck

LuvHorses said:


> I am talking about preorders before Oct 1st.
> 
> I'd be happy with any PW, at least I would know a replacement would come eventually. Could still read etc.


Sorry, but I respectfully disagree. My defective PW is virtually unreadable because the screen is so bad. I can read on it for no more than 15 minutes before the eyestrain becomes so bad I start getting a headache.

At any rate, my replacement is out for delivery, so . 

CS also upgraded my PW WiFi SO to a PW 3G (no SO) because they had some of these still in stock. The email I received from CS mentioned a *"Kindle Replacement Team"* so if they had to put together such a team then they must have a lot of bad units. I think quality control was really bad on this production run. I hope they get it fixed soon.

I have nothing but praise for Amazon's CS as they are treating us very well. On the other hand, I have no good feelings about Amazon's manufacturing process. They need to move it to a country in which they can have top notch quality control. I'm sure there must be a lot of other countries with cheap labor that would be much better hosts to American companies than China!


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## mooshie78

Yeah, it's only fair for companies to hold back some stock to replace the inevitable lemons that go out defective.  A customer that gets a defective item has paid for something that doesn't work properly.

People waiting on preorders haven't been charged yet since they charge when shipping.  More important to take care of the already paid customers first IMO.

I've had to wait past launch for things like iPhones and iPads despite pre-ordering day 1.  It sucks, but they're gadgets and not necessities, and I had no issues with Apple keeping some stock to replace lemons.


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## w5jck

Seleya said:


> Maybe Amazon could move out of Foxconn and use a factory where workers are treated as human beings.


Yes, that to! I was holding back on my comments since I went "unglued" in another thread where I said more less that Amazon was getting what they paid for by using nearly slave labor. I cannot understand how the same people who up to a few years ago constantly blasted China for its communistic views and human rights violations now flock to China in huge numbers to build factories they know will be filled with nearly slave laborers! Amazon is just one of many such companies. Obviously the almighty American dollar is more important to them than moral values.


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## tiktokman

Just got off a very frustrating call with Amazon Kindle support. Took 35 minutes, 4 holds and lots of stress to initiate an exchange for my PW. I get random bolded words no matter what font and eyestrain anytime I read for more than 10 minutes. The rep kept telling me I could return it and get a refund even though I repeatedly asked for an exchange. Then she told me it'd be 4-6 weeks before my new one arrived and that I had to send my current one back within 30 days. I disagreed with that logic and after another hold she said she could extend my return window. After getting that sorted I told her that I'd heard nothing but good things about Amazon Kindle Support and that this call did not live up to my expectations. After another hold she came back on and magically they had a new Kindle they could send me by next week. It should be here by the 9th she said. I asked her for a confirmation # on this call/ticket and she told me they don't use them but that I'd be getting an email shortly with all the details. That was 2 hours ago and still no email. 

Fingers are crossed.


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## BenReem

I got an email from amazon-my fiance's replacement kindle will be here monday (shipped today). I'm anxious to unbox it and check the screen. 



I do have to say, I like amazon CS over chat. I don't know if i'd like their CS over the phone.


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## Arclight

Here is pic of a KPW looking down from the top to the bottom screen-frame. See the four LED lights. The spaces in between the led lights are the shadows you see at the bottom of your KPW.










Read the thread and see some interesting problems with the KPW.

http://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=83739

It would appear this was a rushed lighting engineering solution to use the 4 leds.
Further thought, is will they rectify this and other obvious problems. Mine comes next week and if exhibits shadows and dead pixels I want a refund. $140 is too much for this result.










Will stick with my K3 and Nook Glo-Light. If Kindle fixes the KPW then I'll reconsider buying another.


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## Skydog

BenReem said:


> My fiance and I each got a paperwhite yesterday. After playing around with ours for a few hours, we've noticed that on his screen there are pinhole broken pixels (about 4) towards the bottom of the screen. While it doesn't impact the functionality of the device it is very noticeable. Do you guys think it's something worth contacting CS about or should we just suck it up?


You do realize that those "four pinhole broken pixels" at the bottom are most likely he four LED's that provide the lighting?


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## carrie

CAR - I agree that amazon should ship out the Paperwhites in the order they were received - I ordered mine within the first 10 minutes of the site going up.  I neither expected nor asked for my replacement to be moved in front of anyone else or for an upgrade, and indeed was prepared to wait until the units were back in stock, even though I do think Amazon should hold back some units to replace any "duds".  What Amazon did for me was a pleasant surprise.  I have owned multiple kindles since the K1 came out and, with the exception of one incident, have been amazed at the quality of their customer service, which is half the reason I am a very loyal Amazon customer.  I understand that not everyone has had the same experience and that some interactions can be extremely frustrating, particularly when you get multiple answers from different cs reps.  I hope everything works out and you get your Paperwhite soon!


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## Pushka

LuvHorses said:


> Not fair to those of us who preordered and have delivery dates of Oct 24!
> 
> Replacements should be shipped after fulfillment of pre orders.


Why? They received a defective kindle and had ordered in the first wave. I think it makes perfect sense to me.


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## LuvHorses

Arclight said:


> Here is pic of a KPW looking down from the top to the bottom screen-frame. See the four LED lights. The spaces in between the led lights are the shadows you see at the bottom of your KPW.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Read the thread and see some interesting problems with the KPW.
> 
> http://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=83739
> 
> It would appear this was a rushed lighting engineering solution to use the 4 leds.
> Further thought, is will they rectify this and other obvious problems. Mine comes next week and if exhibits shadows and dead pixels I want a refund. $140 is too much for this result.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will stick with my K3 and Nook Glo-Light. If Kindle fixes the KPW then I'll reconsider buying another.


I believe that's what the lighting is supposed to be, 4 lights at bottom. That's what I have been reading in other forums too.


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## Broadus

I think the perfect pictures on the Amazon site raise expectations to what has proven to be an unrealistic level. When something is over-hyped, there is an inevitable letdown. Then again, all the "professional" reviews I've read have been very positive. I guess I'll find out about mine tomorrow since it's spending the night at our local post office.


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## Wildgift

carrie said:


> I, too, love Amazon's customer service! My PW arrived and the light was very uneven from the bottom to about a third of the way up the screen. I called CS Wednesday to ask them about it and was told they would send a replacement, but that it would take 3-4 weeks to get it. This was fine with me as I still have my old Kindle to use. To my surprise, the next day I received an email from Amazon saying they they were upgrading my wi-fi only, special offers PW to a 3G, no special offers PW at no cost because of the backorder delay! It's out for delivery today! I can't believe it, but I sure appreciate what they've done.


They did the same for me, and the new one was gorgeous. Big, big difference. Amazon rules!


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## Broadus

Even before I read about the screen problems, I found myself reading "paper_weight_" when I saw "PW."


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## DD

Wildgift said:


> They did the same for me, and the new one was gorgeous. Big, big difference. Amazon rules!


This gives me hope that later versions or later batches of the Paperwhite will correct the problems. Then I might try one again.


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## Atunah

I also received a replacement for the pinhole dot thingy mine had. It was otherwise totally even and I waffled if I could live it it. It does also have slighted lilted print. That is I can see the black cut line of the e-ink and its not even on the edge, so it tilts a tiny bit. 

My replacement came yesterday and now I don't know what to do. It has a blotch of bright light in the bottom right, size of a thumb print. It is very noticable to me and looks bluish. Otherwise the screen is even. It just has a bit more shadowing then the original unit. And that light blob.  

They send me a 3G for my wifi and for those upset at us getting replacements, the box has a R printed on it. These are specific units meant for replacements. I don't think they send these out as new units. 

So now I am upset again as I don't know what to do. Just the thought that I have to call again is making me literally ill. Short version is I have a phone phobia, so it is extremely difficult for me. I can't enjoy reading now as I don't know what to do. I am tempted to just keep the original with the pin hole. But then I still have to call or the shipping label they send me is not correct.


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## Arclight

LuvHorses said:


> I believe that's what the lighting is supposed to be, 4 lights at bottom. That's what I have been reading in other forums too.


Of course, that's where the four leds are located. That is what is causing the shadows everyone is complaining about. Most people call them smudges but that would be an incorrect term. It is the placement and even use of these lights that cause the shadows.


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## w5jck

Atunah said:


> I also received a replacement for the pinhole dot thingy mine had. It was otherwise totally even and I waffled if I could live it it. It does also have slighted lilted print. That is I can see the black cut line of the e-ink and its not even on the edge, so it tilts a tiny bit.
> 
> My replacement came yesterday and now I don't know what to do. *It has a blotch of bright light in the bottom right, size of a thumb print. *It is very noticable to me and looks bluish. Otherwise the screen is even. It just has a bit more shadowing then the original unit. And that light blob.
> 
> They send me a 3G for my wifi and for those upset at us getting replacements, *the box has a R printed on it*. These are specific units meant for replacements. I don't think they send these out as new units.
> 
> So now I am upset again as I don't know what to do. Just the thought that I have to call again is making me literally ill. Short version is *I have a phone phobia*, so it is extremely difficult for me. I can't enjoy reading now as I don't know what to do. I am tempted to just keep the original with the pin hole. But then I still have to call or the shipping label they send me is not correct.


I think there is a huge manufacturing issue as a lot of PWs have some sort of screen defect. Almost sounds to me as though the 1st one you received is better than the replacement.

I had not noticed the "R" on my box before you mentioned it. I guess if we are getting 3G upgrades or our WiFi models that means they long since ran out of their allotment of WiFi replacements. In other words, they must be getting a heck of a lot more replacement requests than they normally do.

You can use the Amazon CS Chat instead. I used it to get my replacement. It takes a little longer but it works well.


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## w5jck

Broadus said:


> I think the perfect pictures on the Amazon site raise expectations to what has proven to be an unrealistic level. When something is over-hyped, there is an inevitable letdown. Then again, *all the "professional" reviews I've read have been very positive*. I guess I'll find out about mine tomorrow since it's spending the night at our local post office.


I find that 95% of the so-called "professional" reviews are anything but professional. The reviewers on those gadget sites are done by people I characterize as jacks of all trades but masters of none. Most of them are not hardcore eBook reader users like the people in this and other forums. They might own a Kindle, but they don't know much about them. If you want good reviews seek out a few good Kindle reviewers. Most of the bloggers are totally worthless, but a few are really knowledgeable. But by and large the best reviews come from us, the people who actually buy the Kindles and know what is important to report about them.


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## Neo

Atunah said:


> I also received a replacement for the pinhole dot thingy mine had. It was otherwise totally even and I waffled if I could live it it. It does also have slighted lilted print. That is I can see the black cut line of the e-ink and its not even on the edge, so it tilts a tiny bit.
> 
> My replacement came yesterday and now I don't know what to do. It has a blotch of bright light in the bottom right, size of a thumb print. It is very noticable to me and looks bluish. Otherwise the screen is even. It just has a bit more shadowing then the original unit. And that light blob.
> 
> They send me a 3G for my wifi and for those upset at us getting replacements, the box has a R printed on it. These are specific units meant for replacements. I don't think they send these out as new units.
> 
> So now I am upset again as I don't know what to do. Just the thought that I have to call again is making me literally ill. Short version is I have a phone phobia, so it is extremely difficult for me. I can't enjoy reading now as I don't know what to do. I am tempted to just keep the original with the pin hole. But then I still have to call or the shipping label they send me is not correct.


Atunah, I really think you shouldn't have to compromise, and should get a perfect unit, and keep at it until you do. I understand your phone phobia, but why don't you try the chat feature? This could work out well, no? You still have an exchange with a real person (and no canned responses like to emails), but you don't have to be on the phone. I'd think it may be worth a try - if it doesn't work out, you'd still have the option to call in, but you may not have to


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## CAR

Atunah said:


> I also received a replacement for the pinhole dot thingy mine had. It was otherwise totally even and I waffled if I could live it it. It does also have slighted lilted print. That is I can see the black cut line of the e-ink and its not even on the edge, so it tilts a tiny bit.
> 
> My replacement came yesterday and now I don't know what to do. It has a blotch of bright light in the bottom right, size of a thumb print. It is very noticable to me and looks bluish. Otherwise the screen is even. It just has a bit more shadowing then the original unit. And that light blob.
> 
> They send me a 3G for my wifi and for those upset at us getting replacements, the box has a R printed on it. These are specific units meant for replacements. I don't think they send these out as new units.
> 
> So now I am upset again as I don't know what to do. Just the thought that I have to call again is making me literally ill. Short version is I have a phone phobia, so it is extremely difficult for me. I can't enjoy reading now as I don't know what to do. I am tempted to just keep the original with the pin hole. But then I still have to call or the shipping label they send me is not correct.


I hope you get a perfect one soon Atunah! As someone mentioned you can use Amazon's CS chat instead of calling, that might work well for you.

So tempted to cancel my PW order before the Oct 17 ship date. But Amazon CS already told me I will have to pay shipping to return the PW cover, unless I make it past the EDD and they don't ship.


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## Tatiana

Last night I read in total darkness for the first time with my new PW.  The light was set on 15 and I noticed there was a blueish swirl down the middle of the page.  It was not distracting or bothersome but it is not noticeable unless I'm reading in a totally darkened room.  I have no intention of asking for a replacement as I might get one with "other" problems. Even tho' I noticed the blueish blob when I first turned it on, it in no way distracted from the reading experience.  It's odd it didn't appear until the room was dark.  I leave the light on level 15 constantly so it didn't change with a different light level.

Other than the lack of collections importing, I have found no other problems with the device and I'm happy with mine.


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## CAR

Tatiana said:


> Last night I read in total darkness for the first time with my new PW. The light was set on 15 and I noticed there was a blueish swirl down the middle of the page. It was not distracting or bothersome but it is not noticeable unless I'm reading in a totally darkened room. I have no intention of asking for a replacement as I might get one with "other" problems. Even tho' I noticed the blueish blob when I first turned it on, it in no way distracted from the reading experience. It's odd it didn't appear until the room was dark. I leave the light on level 15 constantly so it didn't change with a different light level.
> 
> Other than the lack of collections importing, I have found no other problems with the device and I'm happy with mine.


I am a perfectionist when it comes to my gadgets. And my reading devices even more so. Cannot tell you how many screen protectors I went thru on my iPad, before I found one I was happy with. I have to say I am a little shocked on how many screen issues folks are having.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## telracs

Tatiana said:


> Last night I read in total darkness for the first time with my new PW. The light was set on 15 and I noticed there was a blueish swirl down the middle of the page. It was not distracting or bothersome but it is not noticeable unless I'm reading in a totally darkened room. I have no intention of asking for a replacement as I might get one with "other" problems. Even tho' I noticed the blueish blob when I first turned it on, it in no way distracted from the reading experience. It's odd it didn't appear until the room was dark. I leave the light on level 15 constantly so it didn't change with a different light level.
> 
> Other than the lack of collections importing, I have found no other problems with the device and I'm happy with mine.


Weird question..... did you change the angle at which you were holding the PW?


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## DD

Tatiana said:


> Last night I read in total darkness for the first time with my new PW. The light was set on 15 and I noticed there was a blueish swirl down the middle of the page. It was not distracting or bothersome but it is not noticeable unless I'm reading in a totally darkened room. I have no intention of asking for a replacement as I might get one with "other" problems. Even tho' I noticed the blueish blob when I first turned it on, it in no way distracted from the reading experience. It's odd it didn't appear until the room was dark. I leave the light on level 15 constantly so it didn't change with a different light level.
> 
> Other than the lack of collections importing, I have found no other problems with the device and I'm happy with mine.


Tatiana, what do you mean by the lack of Collections importing? I imported my collections from my Touch.


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## Geemont

The 3G on mine wouldn't connect.  After talking to CS and going through the restart and reset, they're sending me a replacement due on Tuesday.  The lights at the bottom were noticeable, just a little, but no deal breaker.


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## LuvHorses

Atunah said:


> I also received a replacement for the pinhole dot thingy mine had. It was otherwise totally even and I waffled if I could live it it. It does also have slighted lilted print. That is I can see the black cut line of the e-ink and its not even on the edge, so it tilts a tiny bit.
> 
> My replacement came yesterday and now I don't know what to do. It has a blotch of bright light in the bottom right, size of a thumb print. It is very noticable to me and looks bluish. Otherwise the screen is even. It just has a bit more shadowing then the original unit. And that light blob.
> 
> They send me a 3G for my wifi and for those upset at us getting replacements, the box has a R printed on it. These are specific units meant for replacements. I don't think they send these out as new units.
> 
> So now I am upset again as I don't know what to do. Just the thought that I have to call again is making me literally ill. Short version is I have a phone phobia, so it is extremely difficult for me. I can't enjoy reading now as I don't know what to do. I am tempted to just keep the original with the pin hole. But then I still have to call or the shipping label they send me is not correct.


You can email support or chat online live with them instead of phone.


----------



## PinkKindle

Well, I've tried to live with mine, but I found the screen issues to be too much of a problem -- I really love my Kindles and want it to be perfect!  Mine had areas of the screen that were distinctly pinkish colored compared to the rest of the screen and uneven shadows (the picture above that says "Hide and Seek" -- it is similar to that with the coloring and shadow but not in the same pattern -- most of my pink area is on the left side) and a diagonal line visible in the top left corner where the corner was definitely brighter than the rest of the screen.  The screen also just didn't seem nearly as bright as other people were describing.  Also, mine has a lot of ghosting (setting the refresh at every page helps a little but not much).

So I called just now, the Kindle Support number, and my rep was named Ivy.  Her accent was a bit hard to understand, but other than that the call was excellent and she was really helpful.  She asked about resetting it and I said I had already done that and then she said basically "okay, let's exchange it."  That was it -- no problem at all!  She said I should have my replacement Kindle Tuesday.  She didn't mention if the new one would be 3G or what and I didn't ask -- I'm sending back a wifi SO PW, and I'd be fine with them sending me the same thing again -- but if they send a 3G one instead, then that would just be a bonus!  All I want is for the new one to have a good screen, and I'll be happy!  

I do have a little bit of a concern about the "R" on the box that was mentioned -- I hope that does stand for "replacement" and not maybe "returned" or "refurbished" . . . although a refurbished one would probably need to be packed in a new box (without old shipping labels or the pull strip torn off), so hopefully that's not likely and it does stand for "replacement"!  But again, as long as my new screen is how it should be, I'll just be happy with that! 

I didn't ask her and I've forgotten -- do I need to do a factory reset on it before sending it back?  I don't have anything on it that I'm worried about them seeing or anything!


----------



## Leslie

I've had 2 replacement Kindles over the years (a K2 where the corner popped open and K3 that arrived with a broken screen) and both had R on the box. I am assuming that meant "replacement." As I recall, they both arrived without USB cables or power chargers/plugs. That was back in the day when we received chargers with our Kindles so I figured that the "R" replacement units (boxes marked as such) meant that they didn't include the power supply.

I actually have a picture in my Photobucket of the replacement box for my K3. I'll see if I can dig it up to post.

L


----------



## BeastMD

Leslie said:


> I've had 2 replacement Kindles over the years (a K2 where the corner popped open and K3 that arrived with a broken screen) and both had R on the box. I am assuming that meant "replacement." As I recall, they both arrived without USB cables or power chargers/plugs. That was back in the day when we received chargers with our Kindles so I figured that the "R" replacement units (boxes marked as such) meant that they didn't include the power supply.
> 
> I actually have a picture in my Photobucket of the replacement box for my K3. I'll see if I can dig it up to post.
> 
> L


R=Refurbished


----------



## w5jck

PinkKindle said:


> Well, I've tried to live with mine, but I found the screen issues to be too much of a problem -- I really love my Kindles and want it to be perfect! Mine had areas of the screen that were distinctly pinkish colored compared to the rest of the screen and uneven shadows (the picture above that says "Hide and Seek" -- it is similar to that with the coloring and shadow but not in the same pattern -- most of my pink area is on the left side) and a diagonal line visible in the top left corner where the corner was definitely brighter than the rest of the screen. The screen also just didn't seem nearly as bright as other people were describing. Also, mine has a lot of ghosting (setting the refresh at every page helps a little but not much).
> 
> So I called just now, the Kindle Support number, and my rep was named Ivy. Her accent was a bit hard to understand, but other than that the call was excellent and she was really helpful. She asked about resetting it and I said I had already done that and then she said basically "okay, let's exchange it." That was it -- no problem at all! She said I should have my replacement Kindle Tuesday. She didn't mention if the new one would be 3G or what and I didn't ask -- I'm sending back a wifi SO PW, and I'd be fine with them sending me the same thing again -- but if they send a 3G one instead, then that would just be a bonus! All I want is for the new one to have a good screen, and I'll be happy!
> 
> I do have a little bit of a concern about the "R" on the box that was mentioned -- I hope that does stand for "replacement" and not maybe "returned" or "refurbished" . . . although a refurbished one would probably need to be packed in a new box (without old shipping labels or the pull strip torn off), so hopefully that's not likely and it does stand for "replacement"! But again, as long as my new screen is how it should be, I'll just be happy with that!
> 
> I didn't ask her and I've forgotten -- do I need to do a factory reset on it before sending it back? I don't have anything on it that I'm worried about them seeing or anything!


Be sure to deregister it. I would do a factory reset just to be safe.


----------



## w5jck

BeastMD said:


> R=Refurbished


Not very likely as there hasn't been enough time for Amazon to receive defective units, refurbish them, then redistribute them. In the months ahead I would expect many of the replacements to be refurbished, but not this early on.


----------



## Leslie

BeastMD said:


> R=Refurbished


No, I don't think so.


----------



## w5jck

Tatiana said:


> Last night I read in total darkness for the first time with my new PW. The light was set on 15 and I noticed there was a blueish swirl down the middle of the page. It was not distracting or bothersome but it is not noticeable unless I'm reading in a totally darkened room. I have no intention of asking for a replacement as I might get one with "other" problems. Even tho' I noticed the blueish blob when I first turned it on, it in no way distracted from the reading experience. It's odd it didn't appear until the room was dark. I leave the light on level 15 constantly so it didn't change with a different light level.
> 
> Other than the lack of collections importing, I have found no other problems with the device and I'm happy with mine.


The darker the room, regardless of PW light level setting, the worse my first PW screen looked. I could almost tolerate the blotchy screen in a well lit room, but at night in a dim lit room the eyestrain was bad enough to cause a headache, literally.


----------



## PinkKindle

Leslie said:


> I've had 2 replacement Kindles over the years (a K2 where the corner popped open and K3 that arrived with a broken screen) and both had R on the box. I am assuming that meant "replacement." As I recall, they both arrived without USB cables or power chargers/plugs. That was back in the day when we received chargers with our Kindles so I figured that the "R" replacement units (boxes marked as such) meant that they didn't include the power supply.
> 
> I actually have a picture in my Photobucket of the replacement box for my K3. I'll see if I can dig it up to post.
> 
> L


I did have a few replacement K2s -- first for sunfade, then after several months something happened to that replacement and it locked up and they replaced it, then that replacement unit had sunfade  -- so I guess I received 3 replacements. Anyway, with the replacement Kindles I seem to remember something like a green dot on the box. I'm pretty sure I was told the later units were refurbs at the time. None of this was right at a release though -- the K2 had been out for a while already when I first got it. They did tell me at the time not to send back my power cords and adapters (which they told me this time as well not to send back the cord); however, the new ones came with cords and adapters too -- I have plenty of Kindle cords! 

I would hope at this point they are not sending out refurbs right at release -- it really seems more likely that these are replacement units -- but the R is a bit concerning.



w5jck said:


> Be sure to deregister it. I would do a factory reset just to be safe.


Thanks -- I'll do that.


----------



## DD

w5jck said:


> Not very likely as there hasn't been enough time for Amazon to receive defective units, refurbish them, then redistribute them. In the months ahead I would expect many of the replacements to be refurbished, but not this early on.


The subject came up when I was talking to CS this week. They said the same thing. They don't have a stock of refurbs yet.


----------



## eidahl

I received my replacement Kindle in the morning (priority overnight, most excellent) - due to the relatively poor contrast/brightness of the screen vs my 3rd gen Kindle with the light at the lowest setting. The black Kindle box it was in was sorta scratched up, whatever that means. Either way, the contrast does seem a little better than the previous one. Possibly. Though while it still seems grayer than the 3rd gen, it does look great when I just keep the light at a low setting to whiten the screen like it's designed to be.


----------



## PinkKindle

eidahl said:


> I received my replacement Kindle in the morning (priority overnight, most excellent) - due to the relatively poor contrast/brightness of the screen vs my 3rd gen Kindle with the light at the lowest setting. The black Kindle box it was in was sorta scratched up, whatever that means. Either way, the contrast does seem a little better than the previous one. Possibly. Though it still seems grayer than the 3rd gen, it does look great when I just keep the light at a low setting to whiten the screen like it's designed to be.


So your replacement does look better and brighter then? That's good to hear!  Did it come with a power cord again?


----------



## DD

If my Paperwhite screen looked like this one from the Amazon page, I wouldnt be returning it!


----------



## eidahl

PinkKindle said:


> So your replacement does look better and brighter then? That's good to hear!  Did it come with a power cord again?


Yup, spare cords can't hurt - I think I have at least 2-3 of them misplaced somewhere in the house from previous gens.


----------



## ayuryogini

PinkKindle said:


> I would hope at this point they are not sending out refurbs right at release -- it really seems more likely that these are replacement units -- but the R is a bit concerning.


It's been my experience that if the Kindle is replaced in the 1st 30 days, it's always with a brand new one.


----------



## Broadus

DD said:


> If my Paperwhite screen looked like this one from the Amazon page, I wouldnt be returning it!


That's what I mean by inaccurate photos. The photos I've seen in professional reviews and the written descriptions more accurately portray reality.

At any rate, as persnickety as I am about displays (I returned an iPad 3 that wasn't $600 perfect ), my PW looks like the photos I had seen in the reviews. I wish the text were a little darker, but I cannot compare it to the K3 I had because my daughter five hours away has it. My PW doesn't seem to have any issues. Not perfect, but pretty good.

That said, I would love to compare it side by side with a Fire HD.


----------



## PinkKindle

I notice in my orders (where the replacement PW shows "shipping soon" with a date of Tues. 10/9) that it shows wifi but does NOT show special offers.  My current PW is with SO, and I'm one who actually likes the SO, so I'm not sure how I feel about that.  Of course I can check them on my Touch and on my Fire, but sometimes the offers are device specific.  I'm not complaining -- I do realize they're sending me the more expensive version for the same price AND doing it right away  -- it's just interesting.  Also, when I click on the product link from the order page I just get an error -- if I click on the product link from any other order (including the first PW) it takes me to the product's page.  So I do think it might be from "special replacement stock" -- though I could be reading too much into it!


----------



## w5jck

PinkKindle said:


> I notice in my orders (where the replacement PW shows "shipping soon" with a date of Tues. 10/9) that it shows wifi but does NOT show special offers. My current PW is with SO, and I'm one who actually likes the SO, so I'm not sure how I feel about that. Of course I can check them on my Touch and on my Fire, but sometimes the offers are device specific. I'm not complaining -- I do realize they're sending me the more expensive version for the same price AND doing it right away  -- it's just interesting. Also, when I click on the product link from the order page I just get an error -- if I click on the product link from any other order (including the first PW) it takes me to the product's page. So I do think it might be from "special replacement stock" -- though I could be reading too much into it!


Doesn't cost you anything to activate SOs if you don't have them. Also, when they sent my replacement it didn't show SO either on the order, but when I got it it was an SO unit. So you might get an SO after all.


----------



## Broadus

w5jck said:


> Doesn't cost you anything to activate SOs if you don't have them. Also, when they sent my replacement it didn't show SO either on the order, but when I got it it was an SO unit. So you might get an SO after all.


I suspect that's a matter of your account, isn't it? My guess is that when it is activated, the PW will have or not have the SO depending upon what you purchased.


----------



## carrie

I received the replacement for my PW yesterday - Amazon did indeed replace my wi-fi only with SO with a 3G no SO unit.  I directly compared the two screens (at the same location in the same book at the same lighting level) and saw that the original unit's screen, in addition to having more 'ripples' at the bottom, had a distinctly yellow cast to the screen that the replacement unit does not have.  I wouldn't have noticed this defect had Amazon not sent the replacement, and it may have degraded further down the line had I not noticed the problems with the lighting at the bottom.

It may sound selfish, but I want perfection when I purchase a new anything - I've paid a bunch of money for something and I expect it to be working correctly out of the box.  I did not expect Amazon to give me what essentially amounts to an $80 upgrade, however, but I will happily take it.  One nice thing about the no SO PW is that the moment I open the case the PW is ready to read - no 'swiping' necessary.  For those of you having issues with cs, please don't give up - contact them again.  Often a new Rep will give you a different answer!


----------



## PinkKindle

carrie said:


> I received the replacement for my PW yesterday - Amazon did indeed replace my wi-fi only with SO with a 3G no SO unit. I directly compared the two screens (at the same location in the same book at the same lighting level) and saw that the original unit's screen, in addition to having more 'ripples' at the bottom, had a distinctly yellow cast to the screen that the replacement unit does not have. I wouldn't have noticed this defect had Amazon not sent the replacement, and it may have degraded further down the line had I not noticed the problems with the lighting at the bottom.
> 
> It may sound selfish, but I want perfection when I purchase a new anything - I've paid a bunch of money for something and I expect it to be working correctly out of the box. I did not expect Amazon to give me what essentially amounts to an $80 upgrade, however, but I will happily take it. One nice thing about the no SO PW is that the moment I open the case the PW is ready to read - no 'swiping' necessary. For those of you having issues with cs, please don't give up - contact them again. Often a new Rep will give you a different answer!


I'm glad to hear that your new one is better -- that's wonderful!  I'm very hopeful my new one will be better as well -- I'm really excited to see it! I wonder if the yellow cast you mention is what's causing the pinkish/tannish light refraction we've been talking about?

That's good to know that I can activate the SOs if they're not on there. I do like them -- I turn on my wifi and check them every night just in case . . . there's usually nothing interesting, but occasionally something turns up! 

My replacement unit has now shipped. It's coming directly from Seattle -- if it says "Jeff's Kindle" I'm going to be super-excited!   It's coming UPS, which I'm very happy about -- none of that FedEx Smartpost (though they did get the original here on time, a day early really). It will be here by Tuesday!


----------



## Broadus

Good for you, Carrie, and I hope you're as successful, Patti.

On a side note, I've been considering an Amazon Fire HD 8.9", though I know there are more "complete" tablets out there, and Google is rumored to be coming out with a 10" Galaxy Nexus. Amazon's customer service, though, makes the Fire HD pretty attractive.


----------



## Leslie

PinkKindle said:


> My replacement unit has now shipped. It's coming directly from Seattle --* if it says "Jeff's Kindle"* I'm going to be super-excited!   It's coming UPS, which I'm very happy about -- none of that FedEx Smartpost (though they did get the original here on time, a day early really). It will be here by Tuesday!


Allegedly, I have that one.


----------



## DD

carrie said:


> I received the replacement for my PW yesterday - Amazon did indeed replace my wi-fi only with SO with a 3G no SO unit. I directly compared the two screens (at the same location in the same book at the same lighting level) and saw that the original unit's screen, in addition to having more 'ripples' at the bottom, had a distinctly yellow cast to the screen that the replacement unit does not have. I wouldn't have noticed this defect had Amazon not sent the replacement, and it may have degraded further down the line had I not noticed the problems with the lighting at the bottom.
> 
> It may sound selfish, but I want perfection when I purchase a new anything - I've paid a bunch of money for something and I expect it to be working correctly out of the box. I did not expect Amazon to give me what essentially amounts to an $80 upgrade, however, but I will happily take it. One nice thing about the no SO PW is that the moment I open the case the PW is ready to read - no 'swiping' necessary. For those of you having issues with cs, please don't give up - contact them again. Often a new Rep will give you a different answer!


I'm so happy to hear this. Then those of us who see something wrong with the ones we got are not crazy. You've proven that there are good ones and bad ones out there. It's too bad this has to mar this release. I thought that stuff was over after the dismal release of the K2 with all the screen issues. I think I will still stick with my Touch for a while longer, maybe until the next Kindle comes out.


----------



## sparklemotion

carrie said:


> I received the replacement for my PW yesterday - Amazon did indeed replace my wi-fi only with SO with a 3G no SO unit. I directly compared the two screens (at the same location in the same book at the same lighting level) and saw that the original unit's screen, in addition to having more 'ripples' at the bottom, had a distinctly yellow cast to the screen that the replacement unit does not have. I wouldn't have noticed this defect had Amazon not sent the replacement, and it may have degraded further down the line had I not noticed the problems with the lighting at the bottom.
> 
> It may sound selfish, but I want perfection when I purchase a new anything - I've paid a bunch of money for something and I expect it to be working correctly out of the box. I did not expect Amazon to give me what essentially amounts to an $80 upgrade, however, but I will happily take it. One nice thing about the no SO PW is that the moment I open the case the PW is ready to read - no 'swiping' necessary. For those of you having issues with cs, please don't give up - contact them again. Often a new Rep will give you a different answer!


Glad you got a good one!  Would it be possible for you to post pics of your old and new one so we could see the difference?


----------



## joanie

w5jck said:


> The email I received from CS mentioned a *"Kindle Replacement Team"* so if they had to put together such a team then they must have a lot of bad units. I think quality control was really bad on this production run. I hope they get it fixed soon.


I don't think the Kindle Replacement Team was created because of faulty PW units; I know they sent me an e-mail when I needed a replacement Touch a few months ago already.

I realized today that my 3g isn't working, although the WiFi does work. I had a similar issue when I got my Touch last year, and they were able to remotely enable it. It had something to do with the radio antenna not being activated. I've read a couple of reports on the Amazon board, plus the person in this thread, who have had the same problem. Some of them were able to get it fixed remotely, but the CS rep I dealt with had no idea what I was talking about and is sending me a replacement.

I also have some uneven lighting on the upper right corner, but I'm not so sure what's within normal ranges or not - I think it's the orangeish tint I've heard people mention. It's completely readable, but I'm worried the next unit is going to have worse issues.


----------



## Cardinal

Do I have a defective Kindle?

I like holding the Kindle in my left hand, and when I reach my thumb over to the page forward section usually nothing happens.  Less than ten percent of the time it pages forward.

Swiping with my left hand only moves the page backward, if I swipe with my left hand in the opposite direction nothing happens.

Swiping with my right only move the page forward, if I swipe with my right hand in the opposite direction nothing happens.

I like to hold my Kindle with my left hand and page forward and back with my left thumb or finger and am having a lot of trouble doing it with my Paperwhite.


ETA:  I have been experimenting with the touch screen and there seem to be dead spots on.  I'll tap the same place over and over and the page doesn't turn.  These dead spots seem to be in places I can easily hit as I'm trying to find a new way to hold the Kindle.

Is anybody else finding the touch screen unresponsive?


----------



## skyblue

So is the "blue splotchiness" caused by shadows?


----------



## mooshie78

DD said:


> I'm so happy to hear this. Then those of us who see something wrong with the ones we got are not crazy. You've proven that there are good ones and bad ones out there. It's too bad this has to mar this release. I thought that stuff was over after the dismal release of the K2 with all the screen issues. I think I will still stick with my Touch for a while longer, maybe until the next Kindle comes out.


It sucks, but pretty much every gadget has a higher defect rate at launch. The sweat shops are really over worked cranking them out for a pre-set released ate.

You'd think companies would wise up and not announce a product until they had plenty of product in stock. Then they could do full quality control, not rush the manufactures, and ship the product very soon after the announcement.

They could also not use sweat shops which would be great. But us consumers would have to be willing to pay higher prices for our gadgets to pay for the added labor costs.


----------



## CAR

mooshie78 said:


> It sucks, but pretty much every gadget has a higher defect rate at launch. The sweat shops are really over worked cranking them out for a pre-set released ate.
> 
> You'd think companies would wise up and not announce a product until they had plenty of product in stock. Then they could do full quality control, not rush the manufactures, and ship the product very soon after the announcement.
> 
> They could also not use sweat shops which would be great. But us consumers would have to be willing to pay higher prices for our gadgets to pay for the added labor costs.


Well a quote from one of the articles I posted before the PW was released "new HD E-ink screen developed by LG Display, and the process for attaching the frontlight might not have all the bugs worked out."


----------



## PinkKindle

Leslie said:


> Allegedly, I have that one.


If mine looks like yours, Leslie, I will be absolutely thrilled! 



skyblue said:


> So is the "blue splotchiness" caused by shadows?


I don't know if "shadows" is exactly the right word, although I think I've used that word to describe them. It's not like a shadow from your hand or something outside the device -- it's coming from inside the device, I guess some level of the screen? I don't know if it's a shadow from something in there blocking light, or damage to the light diffusion grid, or a color problem somewhere in there or what -- I'm clearly not an engineer!  -- I just know something doesn't seem right with my unit. My totally unsubstantiated hypothesis is that it's a problem with the light grid making the light refract toward reddish or bluish instead of white in different areas of damaged screens -- or maybe really not refract at all in the "shadow" areas -- but I really have no idea what I'm talking about. 



Cardinal said:


> Do I have a defective Kindle?
> 
> I like holding the Kindle in my left hand, and when I reach my thumb over to the page forward section usually nothing happens. Less than ten percent of the time it pages forward.
> 
> Swiping with my left hand only moves the page backward, if I swipe with my left hand in the opposite direction nothing happens.
> 
> Swiping with my right only move the page forward, if I swipe with my right hand in the opposite direction nothing happens.
> 
> I like to hold my Kindle with my left hand and page forward and back with my left thumb or finger and am having a lot of trouble doing it with my Paperwhite.
> 
> ETA: I have been experimenting with the touch screen and there seem to be dead spots on. I'll tap the same place over and over and the page doesn't turn. These dead spots seem to be in places I can easily hit as I'm trying to find a new way to hold the Kindle.
> 
> Is anybody else finding the touch screen unresponsive?


Yes, I would say that's probably defective. My touch screen on the PW is very responsive -- much faster and more responsive than my Touch. I haven't found any "dead" areas on mine.


----------



## BookLady

> Do I have a defective Kindle?
> Is anybody else finding the touch screen unresponsive?


My Paperwhite had all the lighting issues in addition to skipping pages periodically. With one light touch, it would go from page 3 to page 64, so mine was a bit too responsive! It's boxed and ready to return tomorrow. Also ordered two Amazon covers for the Paperwhite, and neither worked as designed.....or perhaps this was another issue with the Kindle Paperwhite. I could still see the illumination of the Kindle even when it was supposed to be "off". Very disappointed in this Kindle, but at least I still have my trusty Kindle Keyboard!


----------



## northofdivision

This is great news, Carrie!!! DD and Pink kindle would agree. The fact that you notice a difference between the new replacement PW and the original PW you got in the mail makes me feel less crazy about seeing different color hues in the dark. I had mentioned in a previous post but i've put three new PW's (my mother's my friends and mine) all next to one another (ordered in the same order) and they all looked the same to me. Over the past few nights, these colors and shades in the dark bothered me so much that i used my previous K4 non touch instead. I have to concede during the day, the new PW is excellent. but i'm going to return mine and try to fix this night discoloration issue!!!! It sounds like we all want Leslie's experience. Keep the posts up!


----------



## northofdivision

"I don't know if "shadows" is exactly the right word, although I think I've used that word to describe them.  It's not like a shadow from your hand or something outside the device -- it's coming from inside the device, I guess some level of the screen?  I don't know if it's a shadow from something in there blocking light, or damage to the light diffusion grid, or a color problem somewhere in there or what -- I'm clearly not an engineer!  -- I just know something doesn't seem right with my unit.  My totally unsubstantiated hypothesis is that it's a problem with the light grid making the light refract toward reddish or bluish instead of white in different areas of damaged screens -- or maybe really not refract at all in the "shadow" areas -- but I really have no idea what I'm talking about. "

PINK KINDLE:  Exactly! This is the exact description of the problem that I am experiencing too. "I just know something doesn't seem right with my unit"....the tiny shadows at the bottom because of the LEDS i have no problem with (or the little light coming from the bottom left), my problem is the light grid issue that seems off like PINKKINDLE's. 

UPDATE: My replacement arrives on Wed. Will let everyone know the differences. (unlike many who reported getting 3G replacements for their wifi PW's, mine says wifi which is alright with me).


----------



## larryb52

I returned mine, I have never gotten comfortable with the shadows at the bottom, called for a replacement & they went into 4 week wait, I said forget it , I have other readers. Sad that amazon did do more to make this is a better product, like they say wonderful with full light use the light at night one light throws a shadow over the bottom...


----------



## Pushka

People are reporting the pink tinge disappears after a few days use.


----------



## Leslie

Pushka said:


> People are reporting the pink tinge disappears after a few days use.


Well now that's an interesting tidbit!

L


----------



## northofdivision

BookLady said:


> My Paperwhite had all the lighting issues in addition to skipping pages periodically. With one light touch, it would go from page 3 to page 64, so mine was a bit too responsive! It's boxed and ready to return tomorrow. Also ordered two Amazon covers for the Paperwhite, and neither worked as designed.....or perhaps this was another issue with the Kindle Paperwhite. I could still see the illumination of the Kindle even when it was supposed to be "off". Very disappointed in this Kindle, but at least I still have my trusty Kindle Keyboard!


Haha. Indeed, Booklady. The Kindle Keyboard with 167ppi really took e-reading to a new level. Darn good device two years later still (kept mine and have it on the kitchen table). Sorry to hear about your reader, you seem to have gotten the worst one of all of us. As for the off when the light is at 0, its indeed not completely off. I wonder if they'll allow us to have it completely off in future updates?


----------



## Pushka

I now have it!  It is a keeper.  Yes, there are shadows at the bottom and I can see this colour tint in the page.  But when I found a place of complete darkness (under the stairs with the door locked) I didnt see the tint at all.  I wonder if somehow the colour in the environment is being reflected somehow?  I love the cover - it is a great design and just feels good.


----------



## skyblue

Yeah, *Pushka*! Enjoy!

Any else wondering about *battery life*?  I have charged mine twice since receiving it, and switched it to airplane mode, and I am already down to almost half a charge. My K2 and K3 Keyboard held/hold a charge longer! My light range is 13 - 18.


----------



## CAR

Question: If a Amazon CS rep thinks they will get a bad survey, can they disable the link? I ask that because I got the letter with the survey links, and when I click on "NO" they did not resolve my problem. It comes up with "Opps Can't Find your survey".


----------



## w5jck

I estimate that I got about 12 hours going from a full charge to about 30%. I kept WiFi on and the light level was about 14 most of the time. Since it is not a good idea to allow Lithium Ion and Lithium Polymer batteries drain too low, then I'm looking at recharging every 2 or 3 days.  

Amazon claims: "A single charge lasts up to eight weeks, based on a half hour of reading per day with wireless off and the light setting at 10. Battery life will vary based on light and wireless usage."

That translates into 28 hours with no WiFi and light level at 10, so I guess 12 hours with WiFi and light level at 14 is about what should be expected. Still...


----------



## mlewis78

durphy said:


> I saw somewhere that they figured an eight day charge using full light based upon reading one hour each day. I never read that little.


Amazon claims charge lasts 8 weeks using light based on one hour of reading per day.


----------



## ryan214

I really love the new Paperwhite; however, I think I'm noticing some issues.  When I first received the device, the page turns were basically instantaneous.  However, I'm now noticing that there is a little bit of a lag (nothing major, but still noticeable).  Just to note, this is with regular page turns not with the refresh every 6 pages.  I was watching a review of the Paperwhite on Youtube and their page turns were much faster than mine (almost instantaneous).  Also, I'm noticing that some of the text is lighter than other areas...almost like some letters are bold and others are not.  Does anyone else see this happening?  Is it supposed to be a uniformly crisp, black text?  At least that's how it looks in the marketing photos.


----------



## BenReem

Skydog said:


> You do realize that those "four pinhole broken pixels" at the bottom are most likely he four LED's that provide the lighting?


No. The pinholes are just that...holes. I see the lights. the lights are not on the screen, they are on the bottom. The holes are on the screen.


----------



## Cardinal

ryan214 said:


> Also, I'm noticing that some of the text is lighter than other areas...almost like some letters are bold and others are not. Does anyone else see this happening? Is it supposed to be a uniformly crisp, black text? At least that's how it looks in the marketing photos.


It shouldn't look like that, my Paperwhite has even letters throughout. My first $79 Kindle had eneven text, parts of the screen were very faded and other parts thick. I downloaded the refresh after every page turn update hoping that it would help but it didn't. I exchange it, and the replacement has a wonderful screen.


----------



## Broadus

w5jck said:


> I estimate that I got about 12 hours going from a full charge to about 30%. I kept WiFi on and the light level was about 14 most of the time. Since it is not a good idea to allow Lithium Ion and Lithium Polymer batteries drain too low, then I'm looking at recharging every 2 or 3 days.
> 
> Amazon claims: "A single charge lasts up to eight weeks, based on a half hour of reading per day with wireless off and the light setting at 10. Battery life will vary based on light and wireless usage."
> 
> That translates into 28 hours with no WiFi and light level at 10, so I guess 12 hours with WiFi and light level at 14 is about what should be expected. Still...


The process of turning off the WiFi is more bothersome than it needs to be, IMO. Having it accessible wherever you are with a drop-down "on-off" option would be really nice. I like to be able to sync easily to my other devices, so I typically just leave the WiFi on, but if it were easier to switch it on and off, I would probably leave it turned off more.


----------



## mooshie78

mlewis78 said:


> Amazon claims charge lasts 8 weeks using light based on one hour of reading per day.


Pretty sure it's based on 30 minutes of use a day. They switched from using 1 hour per day when B&N started using 30 minutes per day for their estimate (so they could say they got 2 months on a charge, while Kindle got 1 since it at the time was based on 1 hour per day).


----------



## mooshie78

Broadus said:


> The process of turning off the WiFi is more bothersome than it needs to be, IMO. Having it accessible wherever you are with a drop-down "on-off" option would be really nice. I like to be able to sync easily to my other devices, so I typically just leave the WiFi on, but if it were easier to switch it on and off, I would probably leave it turned off more.


Yeah, it could be easier to get to. Like you I leave it on 99% of the time as I do read on my iPhone and iPad so need the whispersync. It doesn't really make much difference to battery life on the wifi only model anyway in my experience. Made a lot more difference to leave the 3G on when I had the K1 and K2 though.


----------



## Nickinev

BenReem said:


> No. The pinholes are just that...holes. I see the lights. the lights are not on the screen, they are on the bottom. The holes are on the screen.


Those are dead pixels. I had one too and I returned it. It was very distracting!

Nicole


----------



## Sandpiper

Popped pixels?  If I hold my PW at an extreme angle like I'm trying to look at LED lights at the bottom under the bezel, I can see two very bright white pixels and two not as bright.  They always are in the same place.  But when I look at the screen in normal position (to read), screen is good -- NO bright pixels.  Is it OK?  Should I be concerned?  Anyone else see pixels when looking at an angle?


----------



## stevene9

Sandpiper said:


> Popped pixels? If I hold my PW at an extreme angle like I'm trying to look at LED lights at the bottom under the bezel, I can see two very bright white pixels and two not as bright. They always are in the same place. But when I look at the screen in normal position (to read), screen is good -- NO bright pixels. Is it OK? Should I be concerned? Anyone else see pixels when looking at an angle?


My opinion would be that if your screen looks good in normal reading position, don't go looking for trouble. Suppose you return it and get one worse, you could jump on the "return mery-go-round".

Steve


----------



## mooshie78

Agreed.  If it looks fine in normal reading conditions, don't go looking for it.

Reminds me of the light leak issues on the iPad 2.  Sure, I could see them in a dark room with a black screen displayed. But I've never noticed it in normal usage as I don't use a tablet with no lights on (too had on the eyes) and don't display dark screens often.  Most web sites etc. are bright, reading wise I like white background black test etc.

So as Steven said, if you have to go looking for a problem you can't notice in normal usage, then its not a problem most of the time (as long as it's not some sign of a defect that could get worse).


----------



## laurie_lu

Nickinev said:


> Those are dead pixels. I had one too and I returned it. It was very distracting!
> 
> Nicole


I didn't know eInk could have dead pixels. I thought that was only possible with LCD panels.


----------



## mooshie78

Yeah, no pixels so its not dead pixels really.  Just a bad spot in the screen.  i.e.a  problem in the light layer that lets light shine through, or some other problem that blocks a small spot of e-ink from showing through etc.

But same basic idea--small defective dots on a screen that can't change color etc.


----------



## sparklemotion

Count me in on as someone with a defective PW. I noticed a glowing speck on mine yesterday so I'm getting a replacement, due to arrive Wednesday. Fingers crossed there's no issues with it.


----------



## sparklemotion

Sandpiper said:


> Popped pixels? If I hold my PW at an extreme angle like I'm trying to look at LED lights at the bottom under the bezel, I can see two very bright white pixels and two not as bright. They always are in the same place. But when I look at the screen in normal position (to read), screen is good -- NO bright pixels. Is it OK? Should I be concerned? Anyone else see pixels when looking at an angle?


It is a defect, but if it's not noticeable at normal angles and you don't find it distracting you may be better off keeping it. I have the same glowing speck on mine and once you see it it's hard to unsee it. It's quite small on mine, but when I have the light on a higher setting I will notice it every time I turn a page. I asked for a replacement which is due to arrive this Wednesday. Hopefully that one will be ok.


----------



## NightReader

Well, I've printed out the return label and I think I'll just return it and wait to see if later runs look better.  

But, I have a dumb question:  I think I read somewhere that I don't need to put the accessories in the box?  So, I can keep the cord?  I wouldn't mind having an extra cord.

Also, I should unregister it before I send it back, right?


----------



## Leslie

NightReader said:


> Well, I've printed out the return label and I think I'll just return it and wait to see if later runs look better.
> 
> But, I have a dumb question: I think I read somewhere that I don't need to put the accessories in the box? So, I can keep the cord? I wouldn't mind having an extra cord.
> 
> Also, I should unregister it before I send it back, right?


When I've returned defective units, they've asked me to keep the cord. And no, you don't need to unregister it.

L


----------



## w5jck

NightReader said:


> Well, I've printed out the return label and I think I'll just return it and wait to see if later runs look better.
> 
> But, I have a dumb question: I think I read somewhere that I don't need to put the accessories in the box? So, I can keep the cord? I wouldn't mind having an extra cord.
> 
> Also, I should unregister it before I send it back, right?


From the return email Amazon sent me:

"_When you return your Kindle, please keep your USB cable or power adapter, manual, and any accessories or other items that originally shipped with your Kindle. Remember to back up your personal content to your computer.

If possible, please turn off wireless on your Kindle, insert the Kindle into a plastic bag, put it in original packaging if available, and send it back to us within 30 days from the date of this e-mail. If we don't receive the device by then, you'll be charged for the replacement Kindle._"


----------



## Broadus

w5jck said:


> From the return email Amazon sent me:
> 
> "_When you return your Kindle, please keep your USB cable or power adapter, manual, and any accessories or other items that originally shipped with your Kindle. Remember to back up your personal content to your computer.
> 
> If possible, please turn off wireless on your Kindle, insert the Kindle into a plastic bag, put it in original packaging if available, and send it back to us within 30 days from the date of this e-mail. If we don't receive the device by then, you'll be charged for the replacement Kindle._"


This is if you're seeking a replacement, right? I understood NightReader wanting to return for a refund and wait to see if PaperWhites down the road are consistently better.


----------



## Leslie

Broadus said:


> This is if you're seeking a replacement, right? I understood NightReader wanting to return for a refund and wait to see if PaperWhites down the road are consistently better.


Good point. Then of course you'd need to return everything.

L


----------



## BenReem

Well. We received our replacement PW today and I realized something once I had them all in front of me (mine, my fiance's and his replacement). 


My PW is the only one with a truly white background. His and the replacement were significantly yellower in the screen, with the replacement PW being the most yellow-tinged. 


I have attempted photos and a video, but none seem to capture it. I will still attempt to post them tomorrow morning in hopes of someone understanding what I mean. 

After seeing how bad the replacement looks, my fiance is afraid to part with his (even if it is yellower than mine) for a replacement that could be worse, so we're not sure what to do in this scenario. 


I'm thinking of contacting Amazon tomorrow and just telling them I'm sending back the replacement.


----------



## DD

BenReem said:


> Well. We received our replacement PW today and I realized something once I had them all in front of me (mine, my fiance's and his replacement).
> 
> My PW is the only one with a truly white background. His and the replacement were significantly yellower in the screen, with the replacement PW being the most yellow-tinged.
> 
> I have attempted photos and a video, but none seem to capture it. I will still attempt to post them tomorrow morning in hopes of someone understanding what I mean.
> 
> After seeing how bad the replacement looks, my fiance is afraid to part with his (even if it is yellower than mine) for a replacement that could be worse, so we're not sure what to do in this scenario.
> 
> I'm thinking of contacting Amazon tomorrow and just telling them I'm sending back the replacement.


I, and others here, know from experience that Amazon will replace them until you get one that you're happy with. I wouldn't keep one that wasn't perfect. But, that's up to you.


----------



## techiegirl

BenReem said:


> My PW is the only one with a truly white background. His and the replacement were significantly yellower in the screen, with the replacement PW being the most yellow-tinged.
> 
> I have attempted photos and a video, but none seem to capture it. I will still attempt to post them tomorrow morning in hopes of someone understanding what I mean.
> 
> After seeing how bad the replacement looks, my fiance is afraid to part with his (even if it is yellower than mine) for a replacement that could be worse, so we're not sure what to do in this scenario.
> 
> I'm thinking of contacting Amazon tomorrow and just telling them I'm sending back the replacement.


My replacement will be here tomorrow and I'm afraid it will be worse than the original. I wonder if Amazon would have. Problem if we return the replacement instead if it ends up being worse than the original.


----------



## tamborine

BenReem said:


> My PW is the only one with a truly white background. His and the replacement were significantly yellower in the screen, with the replacement PW being the most yellow-tinged.
> 
> I have attempted photos and a video, but none seem to capture it. I will still attempt to post them tomorrow morning in hopes of someone understanding what I mean.


I understand exactly what you mean, because my replacement PW, which arrived this morning, is yellow compared to the original. The original has all kinds of issues that make it not particularly enjoyable for me to read on, but at least it basically looks white.  I don't know if it's because of the yellow light, but the replacement looks much dimmer when on the same light settings as the original.

I had asked the kindle cs guy when I called last week if I could return the replacement if it turned out to be worse than the original. He replied that I shouldn't have to settle, and if I wasn't satisfied with the replacement, they would send me another one. AND he said he's going to call me on the 10th to find out if I'm happy with it (it was scheduled to arrive the 9th, but it got here a day early).

We'll see if he really calls. But this could go on indefinitely. I'm starting to wonder if I would ever get a "good" one. At this point I'm almost ready to throw in the towel, return everything, and just stick with my K3.


----------



## ayuryogini

tamborine said:


> ...... I'm starting to wonder if I would ever get a "good" one. At this point I'm almost ready to throw in the towel, return everything, and just stick with my K3.


Take heart. With the last 3 Kindle intro's, I had them replace my Kindle 2-4 times before it was just right.


----------



## BeastMD

techiegirl said:


> My replacement will be here tomorrow and I'm afraid it will be worse than the original. I wonder if Amazon would have. Problem if we return the replacement instead if it ends up being worse than the original.


You may want to give the yellowing a couple days. I have been readin posts that the yellowing goes away after a couple days. Could it be the same issue with glue that has to dry that the iPad was reporting? The screen layers are probably glued together.


----------



## CAR

BenReem said:


> Well. We received our replacement PW today and I realized something once I had them all in front of me (mine, my fiance's and his replacement).
> 
> My PW is the only one with a truly white background. His and the replacement were significantly yellower in the screen, with the replacement PW being the most yellow-tinged.
> 
> I have attempted photos and a video, but none seem to capture it. I will still attempt to post them tomorrow morning in hopes of someone understanding what I mean.
> 
> After seeing how bad the replacement looks, my fiance is afraid to part with his (even if it is yellower than mine) for a replacement that could be worse, so we're not sure what to do in this scenario.
> 
> I'm thinking of contacting Amazon tomorrow and just telling them I'm sending back the replacement.


I sure hope you get a perfect one soon!!

These problems should not be happening like this. Did they not even turn on some of the PW's? So QC could check for "yellow" or "pink" screens, obvious dark spots, pin holes, etc. These are all easy things to spot, as soon as you turn them on.


----------



## avivs

there is a very very very small white dote in the middle of my screen. very little, but on a dark backround i can see it. why is that?


----------



## chocochibi

I'm still trying to decide what to do. My screen is pretty white, but has the shadows at the bottom like everyone else's. Problem is there are some slightly lighter shadows above them mostly in the middle that extend as far as the bottom four lines of text. I can read with it like that, but I'm finding it really bugs me, so I don't know whether to try and put up with that or ask for a replacement in the hopes of getting a better one. I've tried using different light levels, but I find the shadows up into the text are there whatever level I'm on. Yes they're kind of faint, but I find I can't lose myself in a book because my eye keeps going to them.


----------



## KindleGirl

CAR said:


> These problems should not be happening like this. Did they not even turn on some of the PW's? So QC could check for "yellow" or "pink" screens, obvious dark spots, pin holes, etc. These are all easy things to spot, as soon as you turn them on.


I would really doubt that they have a QC person turning on every kindle to check for things. I think usual procedure is to check a certain number of them in a batch, not every one. I would find it hard to believe that every ipod, iphone or tablet is checked by QC before being shipped out.


----------



## BenReem

CAR said:


> I sure hope you get a perfect one soon!!
> 
> These problems should not be happening like this. Did they not even turn on some of the PW's? So QC could check for "yellow" or "pink" screens, obvious dark spots, pin holes, etc. These are all easy things to spot, as soon as you turn them on.


Thank you everyone. I just contacted them again and they'll be sending another replacement.

I checked my bank account about the refund issue i posted on page 1 of this thread, and they have not yet refunded us. When I asked the CS rep, she told me that the rep I spoke with last set up some sort of personal followup and they'll let me know tomorrow on the issue of my refund. I'm confused, because I was told by the rep that the refund was issued.


----------



## Leslie

KindleGirl said:


> I would really doubt that they have a QC person turning on every kindle to check for things. I think usual procedure is to check a certain number of them in a batch, not every one. I would find it hard to believe that every ipod, iphone or tablet is checked by QC before being shipped out.


Obviously they are not since my husband is on his 3rd iPhone in a week...

L


----------



## BradW

BenReem said:


> Well. We received our replacement PW today and I realized something once I had them all in front of me (mine, my fiance's and his replacement).
> 
> My PW is the only one with a truly white background. His and the replacement were significantly yellower in the screen, with the replacement PW being the most yellow-tinged.


Is that really a bad thing? I don't like the bluish tinge of "white" LEDs and have stayed away from them for room lighting or Christmas tree lighting for that reason, but I see now that there are LED lights that have the warm tones you get with incandescent lights now, so that's a good thing. Any chance this is a "feature" instead of a "bug"?

Besides the differences in light temperature, a lot of books, even high-quality hardbacks, are on ivory or bone-colored paper instead of bright white.

Not having seen any of the Kindle Paperwhites in person, I can't say anything for sure, but just theoretically, a _slight_ yellow tinge doesn't sound bad to me. Certainly better than bluish or pinkish. Of course, if it looks like a 50-year-old cheap paperback or Yellow Pages, that's a different story.


----------



## tiktokman

My replacement was just delivered. Gonna be a long afternoon until I can get home and compare the two. According to my account page on Amazon the replacement is a WiFi PW w/o special offers. 

If there are noticeable differences I'll post some side by side pics.


----------



## MsBea

I too had to get a replacement. The original one had a pink spot in the middle of the screen, but after about 5 days it started to fade and the background is pure white now.  In the meantime I got a replacement, not knowing that the original would eventually "correct" itself.  The replacement was worse than the original when I first got it. The screen was a tan color with red and green over half of it and not as bright or crisp as the original one. Amazon offered to replace it, but I told them I'll just keep the original and send them back the replacement.  One thing that I thought was odd is that the CS rep said was that the PW  kindles were "betas" and offered to QC the replacement before she sent it out.  If the PW is a "beta" why are they selling them to the public, only to have more than half of them returned?


----------



## mooshie78

Does sound like there must be some issue with glue not having dried yet or something along those lines with how people are getting tinted spots that go away after a few days. 

Have seen reports of this happening on a few different sites.  So I guess people with tint issues should give it a few days to see if it clears up before getting a replacement.


----------



## BenReem

BradW said:


> Is that really a bad thing? I don't like the bluish tinge of "white" LEDs and have stayed away from them for room lighting or Christmas tree lighting for that reason, but I see now that there are LED lights that have the warm tones you get with incandescent lights now, so that's a good thing. Any chance this is a "feature" instead of a "bug"?
> 
> Besides the differences in light temperature, a lot of books, even high-quality hardbacks, are on ivory or bone-colored paper instead of bright white.
> 
> Not having seen any of the Kindle Paperwhites in person, I can't say anything for sure, but just theoretically, a _slight_ yellow tinge doesn't sound bad to me. Certainly better than bluish or pinkish. Of course, if it looks like a 50-year-old cheap paperback or Yellow Pages, that's a different story.


I think it's the fact that there is a large inconsistency in the product. We want to have the same quality product, that's all. My PW is perfect. the glow is white, not a stark white, but a soft paper look that is very pleasing to the eye. His lights are dimmer and more yellow-so no, I don't think that is a feature, I think it's a quality issue.


----------



## w5jck

My original PW was terrible--shadows and blotches all over the screen, poor and inconsistent text rendering. I got a replacement and that one was much better though no where near perfect. After a few days my original PW seemed to get a lot better. But then last night I was boxing it up to return it and needed to restore it to factory state before shipping. I turned it on and it had regressed to a state as bad as it was originally.

My replacement had a slight blue hue to the light, but nothing really bad. However, when I turned it on today it had developed the pink and blue shadows as well. See image. My first thought was that I had accidentally boxed the wrong one. I checked and I hadn't done that. The original was WiFi only and the replacement is 3G so it was easy to verify that I had kept the replacement 3G model. I'm thinking about returning this replacement, but if I do I won't be getting any more replacements.

Personally I think all the talk about glue drying is total and utter bunk! Someone in another forum mentioned the glue drying issue with iPads and somehow that got transferred to the Paperwhite issues. Whatever the cause, it is almost certainly a fault of terrible quality control.

*My replacement PW*


----------



## PinkKindle

Well, I received my replacement today, and I'm not sure whether it's better.    Well, I guess it is better in some ways, but I guess I'm not sure that it's "right."  I tried to take a picture of the two screens side by side, but I can't seem to capture the problem in a picture.

The 1st PW had a large darker area with pink tinge around it -- so I could see pink against a sort of greenish area, and that was pretty distracting.  I could also see a diagonal line down the top left corner with the screen being brighter above that line.  Finally, it just didn't seem that bright -- I needed to keep the light at much higher levels than some are reporting using.

Well, this new one definitely still has a pinkish tinge -- actually a large pink area in the middle of the screen with whiter borders -- but I don't see the dark areas that the first PW had.  So I think the pink will bother me less without the pink-green interface line down the middle.  The diagonal corner problem is also gone.  So I guess it is better, but it still doesn't seem like the bright white screen that some people have.  Also, the light level seems about the same -- I need to have the light almost at the brightest level to really see the glowing screen.  I may be able to lower it some at night when my eyes are adjusted to the dark.  The text is definitely dark enough, but it did seem on the replacement unit like some lines were darker than others -- but that could have been an optical illusion.

Interestingly, the replacement PW came with a sleeve over the black box with a picture of the PW with book covers showing and text about the PW.  My first Kindle came with the mailing label stuck directly to the black box -- no sleeve.  The sleeve showed some damage and seems kind of scraped up, but that could be from its travels with UPS.  I wonder if this sleeve is perhaps the retail packaging?

The pink on the first Kindle hasn't faded away at all over the past week.  However, it did have those dark spots to compare the pinkness against.  I think what I'm going to do is return the first PW and give this one a few days to see what happens with the pinkness.  I'm willing to wait before calling again.  It is better, but I guess I just wanted to be able to say "OMG this one has a perfect white screen!," and I can't really say that.


----------



## northofdivision

thanks for the review PinkKindle. My replacement is coming tomorrow so we'll see. I have read a lot of threads that say that it gets better but i've read with it for over an hour or two each night for the past few nights and it looks the same to me. 

A small trick (if you want to call it that) to really explore how the LEDS and shadows (pinkish, bluish, yellowish) are affecting your specific unit, go into your "my clippings" (most of you haven't clipped anything in) and the screen will be empty white so you can really see the lighting without text getting in the way of the perception while the light is still on. mine is more well lit on the bottom left third of the screen.


----------



## tamborine

tiktokman said:


> My replacement was just delivered. Gonna be a long afternoon until I can get home and compare the two. According to my account page on Amazon the replacement is a WiFi PW w/o special offers.
> 
> If there are noticeable differences I'll post some side by side pics.


Does yours specifically say w/o special offers? The description of my replacement on the order just said WiFi Paperwhite, but it did end up having special offers.


----------



## tiktokman

tamborine said:


> Does yours specifically say w/o special offers? The description of my replacement on the order just said WiFi Paperwhite, but it did end up having special offers.


Interesting. I'll know in about 45 minutes.


----------



## sparklemotion

w5jck said:


> Personally I think all the talk about glue drying is total and utter bunk! Someone in another forum mentioned the glue drying issue with iPads and somehow that got transferred to the Paperwhite issues. Whatever the cause, it is almost certainly a fault of terrible quality control.


I agree and considering mine had no pink blotches when I first got it, and now it does, that proves the theory bunk for mine. Unless the glue became wet again and started to dry again. haha.


----------



## tiktokman

New Kindle PW is a SO as suggested above. Screen *seems* better contrast wise. There is still some pink though and an even bigger issue. There's a pinhole of light (dust or dead pixel) halfway up on the left. 

At this point I think I'm done with the PW for now. I'm going to just go with a basic Kindle and wait for the next generation of PW or for the kinks to be completely ironed out of this one.


----------



## Heifzilla

w5jck said:


> My original PW was terrible--shadows and blotches all over the screen, poor and inconsistent text rendering. I got a replacement and that one was much better though no where near perfect. After a few days my original PW seemed to get a lot better. But then last night I was boxing it up to return it and needed to restore it to factory state before shipping. I turned it on and it had regressed to a state as bad as it was originally.
> 
> My replacement had a slight blue hue to the light, but nothing really bad. However, when I turned it on today it had developed the pink and blue shadows as well. See image. My first thought was that I had accidentally boxed the wrong one. I checked and I hadn't done that. The original was WiFi only and the replacement is 3G so it was easy to verify that I had kept the replacement 3G model. I'm thinking about returning this replacement, but if I do I won't be getting any more replacements.
> 
> Personally I think all the talk about glue drying is total and utter bunk! Someone in another forum mentioned the glue drying issue with iPads and somehow that got transferred to the Paperwhite issues. Whatever the cause, it is almost certainly a fault of terrible quality control.
> 
> *My replacement PW*


I cannot see any issues with your PW in that pic at all.


----------



## w5jck

Heifzilla said:


> I cannot see any issues with your PW in that pic at all.


You must be blind then. I'm sorry to sound rude but I'm tired of of people acting like there is nothing wrong with these defective PWs. Open you eyes and you can clearly see the green blue shadows and pink blotches!


----------



## Pushka

I can see a tint there which is around the words swampy swampy and then goes upwards and left. I guess the issue is how much that impacts on your reading experience. 

Another thing to throw out there. I wonder if we all have different perceptions of this tint. Somewhat like colour blindness. My husband and I are always in friendly dispute around the colours of red, pink and orange. He cannot see they are different colours or shades but he is not colour blind as such. He argued my new persimmon was pink for instance. Maybe some can see the tint but others can't?


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

w5jck said:


> You must be blind then. I'm sorry to sound rude but I'm tired of of people acting like there is nothing wrong with these defective PWs. Open you eyes and you can clearly see the green blue shadows and pink blotches!


w5ck--

bear in mind that everyone's computer monitors are different and everyone's eyes are different. There's no need to sound rude. You posted a pic; people will post how they see that pic. If you see a problem with your PW, it doesn't matter what others see; you have the right to return it.

On my iPad I can see a small pink shadow in the corner of the picture you posted but not a lot of other artifacts.

Betsy


----------



## CAR

Betsy the Quilter said:


> w5ck--
> 
> bear in mind that everyone's computer monitors are different and everyone's eyes are different. There's no need to sound rude. You posted a pic; people will post how they see that pic. If you see a problem with your PW, it doesn't matter what others see; you have the right to return it.
> 
> On my iPad I can see a small pink shadow in the corner of the picture you posted but not a lot of other artifacts.
> 
> Betsy


Yes same here, you can clearly see a pink area in the lower corner. Please everyone understand, it is very hard to take a picture to show the screen issues. Or even good screens for that matter.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## chocochibi

I called kindle CS last night about my shadow issues/blotchiness. The rep was great, he went and got his own PW and turned it on and said what I was describing wasn't normal and sent out a replacement which should get here tomorrow.


----------



## Heifzilla

w5jck said:


> You must be blind then. I'm sorry to sound rude but I'm tired of of people acting like there is nothing wrong with these defective PWs. Open you eyes and you can clearly see the green blue shadows and pink blotches!


My eyes ARE open and I clearly CANNOT see these defects you are talking about. Seriously, I CANNOT see the issues you are talking about. And if people are "acting" like there is nothing wrong with these PWs and the pictures you are posting, it obviously isn't just me who isn't seeing the issues and that should be considered. I am not a Kindle FanGirl who worships everything and anything Amazon and Kindle. If I see a defect I say I see a defect. If I don't see a defect, I say I don't see a defect. I clearly DO NOT see any defects. I didn't say YOU don't see any defects, I said *I* do not. Just out of curiosity, I posted pictures of my PW here: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,128453.msg1905446.html#msg1905446 Do you see the same issues you are having in any of my pictures? I ask because to my eye, the picture that you posted here looks pretty much like how my Kindle looks.


----------



## BenReem

Heifzilla said:


> My eyes ARE open and I clearly CANNOT see these defects you are talking about. Seriously, I CANNOT see the issues you are talking about. And if people are "acting" like there is nothing wrong with these PWs and the pictures you are posting, it obviously isn't just me who isn't seeing the issues and that should be considered. I am not a Kindle FanGirl who worships everything and anything Amazon and Kindle. If I see a defect I say I see a defect. If I don't see a defect, I say I don't see a defect. I clearly DO NOT see any defects. I didn't say YOU don't see any defects, I said *I* do not. Just out of curiosity, I posted pictures of my PW here: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,128453.msg1905446.html#msg1905446 Do you see the same issues you are having in any of my pictures? I ask because to my eye, the picture that you posted here looks pretty much like how my Kindle looks.


I think emotions in this thread are getting a little out of hand. It's best to just drop this. People who have defects will get them replaced, people who don't can enjoy their PWs. For what it's worth, I do see the defect in that users photos and I do not see anything wrong in yours.

Sometimes photos are deceiving. No reason to bite each others heads off everyone.


----------



## zwarbles

I got my replacement yesterday and it's worse than my original.  
I'll give it another day or 2 before sending the replacement back. Hopefully the problems will magically rectify. 

I'm really trying not to be unreasonable or too critical, but the 2 I got are nowhere near what all the "professional" reviews said or what Amazon touted when the announced the PW.


----------



## Heifzilla

BenReem said:


> I think emotions in this thread are getting a little out of hand. It's best to just drop this. People who have defects will get them replaced, people who don't can enjoy their PWs. For what it's worth, I do see the defect in that users photos and I do not see anything wrong in yours.
> 
> Sometimes photos are deceiving. No reason to bite each others heads off everyone.


I tried not to bite anyone's head off. I was just stressing my points. I am very curious, though, if he (or others) see the same defects in the photos I posted, since I clearly don't see those issues in mine and the pic he posted looks just like mine to me.

eta: just realized you said you see his defects and none in my pics. I find that really interesting because they look the same to me.


----------



## zwarbles

Heifzilla said:


> I tried not to bite anyone's head off. I was just stressing my points. I am very curious, though, if he (or others) see the same defects in the photos I posted, since I clearly don't see those issues in mine and the pic he posted looks just like mine to me.
> 
> eta: just realized you said you see his defects and none in my pics. I find that really interesting because they look the same to me.


I clearly saw defects in his picture.


----------



## Heifzilla

Guess I'm blind then


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Folks,

we're not going to get in an argument here over whether any one individual's Paperwhite is defective or not.  That's between the individual and Amazon.  Everyone's eyes are different; everyone's tolerance for variation is different; and photographs posted on the web can be misleading due to variances in camera, lighting, quality of the uploaded image and individual computer settings.

This thread is for people who have what they believe to be defective Paperwhites to discuss their problems and experiences.  

Thanks

Betsy
KB Moderator


----------



## Kathy

Heifzilla said:


> I tried not to bite anyone's head off. I was just stressing my points. I am very curious, though, if he (or others) see the same defects in the photos I posted, since I clearly don't see those issues in mine and the pic he posted looks just like mine to me.
> 
> eta: just realized you said you see his defects and none in my pics. I find that really interesting because they look the same to me.


Yours looks good. Mine is the same. In certain light there is some shading but nothing distracting on mine. The shading I have is between the lights and only on the bottom of the screen in some lights there does seem to a little shading in the screen but again that is with the spacing in the lights.

I was one of the people that had to replace my K2 4 times so it does get frustrating, but I'm persistent and finally got one I loved. For those having problems don't give up, you'll finally get one you love.


----------



## mooshie78

Definitely not worth arguing over. As others posted, it's hard to get good pictures and people are looking at them on different monitors with different eyes etc.  Even in person people have different eyes and different standards for how even they expect the screen to be etc. 

All that matters is whether someone is personally happy with their screen or not. If not, they should exchange it or just return it if they can't deal with small shadows on the bottom that even the good units have. Those will bother some and not others, while some units are clearly defective and have blotches and tinting in other places and those shoudl definitely be exchanged. 

I got lucky and notice nothing on mine other than the small shadows above the light that don't bother me.


----------



## techiegirl

I called this morning and requested yet another replacement.  I can't figure out how to upload a picture, but I'm not happy with the replacement (KPW 3G) that I received yesterday.  The Kindle coming tomorrow will be my 3rd KPW.


----------



## BenReem

I posted a photo of the color difference between the 2 kindles on amazon, you can see it in the customer images for the PW and I'll attempt to post it here:










The Kindle on the right is the one that is more yellow. The photo doesn't capture how significant the difference is in real life but I thought I'd try anyway.


----------



## northofdivision

BenReem--I actually like the yellowish tinted one on the right. I'm ok as long as the light is equal. The one on the left looks like the one I returned. Once you bring light in the mix, eye subjectivity gets tricky. Raw E-ink displays pre built in lights seemed to have a lot more unity in opinion. That said, looking forward to my replacement today in the mail. Good luck to everyone on finding one that feels right.


----------



## DD

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Folks,
> 
> we're not going to get in an argument here over whether any one individual's Paperwhite is defective or not. That's between the individual and Amazon. Everyone's eyes are different; everyone's tolerance for variation is different; and photographs posted on the web can be misleading due to variances in camera, lighting, quality of the uploaded image and individual computer settings.
> 
> This thread is for people who have what they believe to be defective Paperwhites to discuss their problems and experiences.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Betsy
> KB Moderator


Well said, Betsy. No one should be judging another's perceptions. As you said, there are so many variables when viewing pictures on a computer monitor.


----------



## WilliamG

w5jck said:


> My original PW was terrible--shadows and blotches all over the screen, poor and inconsistent text rendering. I got a replacement and that one was much better though no where near perfect. After a few days my original PW seemed to get a lot better. But then last night I was boxing it up to return it and needed to restore it to factory state before shipping. I turned it on and it had regressed to a state as bad as it was originally.
> 
> My replacement had a slight blue hue to the light, but nothing really bad. However, when I turned it on today it had developed the pink and blue shadows as well. See image. My first thought was that I had accidentally boxed the wrong one. I checked and I hadn't done that. The original was WiFi only and the replacement is 3G so it was easy to verify that I had kept the replacement 3G model. I'm thinking about returning this replacement, but if I do I won't be getting any more replacements.
> 
> Personally I think all the talk about glue drying is total and utter bunk! Someone in another forum mentioned the glue drying issue with iPads and somehow that got transferred to the Paperwhite issues. Whatever the cause, it is almost certainly a fault of terrible quality control.
> 
> *My replacement PW*


Ugh, that looks terrible. For what it's worth, I've now had 4 Kindles (my wife and I, and replacements for both), and all four have looked utterly ghastly, very similar to that photo. I just could not get over the distraction of the color cast coupled with the uneven light. All 4 are going back to Amazon today, and we'll stick with our Kindle Touch devices.

Can't wait till next year, with the new, improved "perfect" lighting system, lol.


----------



## jaspertyler

My second one is really yellow/brown.  I'm on the phone w cs, who acts like I am nuts, like they never heard of this.


----------



## techiegirl

jaspertyler said:


> My second one is really yellow/brown. I'm on the phone w cs, who acts like I am nuts, like they never heard of this.


Mine looks like that too. I called this morning and had no trouble requesting a replacement (#3).


----------



## WilliamG

techiegirl said:


> Mine looks like that too. I called this morning and had no trouble requesting a replacement (#3).


I don't think there's a point getting a replacement.

Here's what I think happens:

1.) People buy the Paperwhite and don't care about the lightshow at the bottom, or the uneven cast that affects all Paperwhites (from what I can tell. I have 4 that have the issue, and all the user-submitted images on these forums and on Amazon.com do too). For those people who don't see the issue, they will love the Paperwhite. Case closed.

2.) People buy the Paperwhite and immediately notice the light issue, as well as the color cast issue (introduced by the light from what I can tell). For those (myself/my wife included), they will NEVER be happy with the Paperwhite, and replacements don't address the issue, sadly.

I hate to be in category 2, but I am...

It really bugs me that Amazon calls it the Paperwhite. I'd call it the Papershadow, or Papercast, or Papertinge. Paperwhite? Puh-lease.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

jaspertyler said:


> My second one is really yellow/brown. I'm on the phone w cs, who acts like I am nuts, like they never heard of this.


If you are having trouble with the rep, call back and speak to another rep.

Betsy


----------



## mooshie78

WilliamG said:


> I don't think there's a point getting a replacement.
> 
> Here's what I think happens:
> 
> 1.) People buy the Paperwhite and don't care about the lightshow at the bottom, or the uneven cast that affects all Paperwhites (from what I can tell. I have 4 that have the issue, and all the user-submitted images on these forums and on Amazon.com do too). For those people who don't see the issue, they will love the Paperwhite. Case closed.
> 
> 2.) People buy the Paperwhite and immediately notice the light issue, as well as the color cast issue (introduced by the light from what I can tell). For those (myself/my wife included), they will NEVER be happy with the Paperwhite, and replacements don't address the issue, sadly.
> 
> I hate to be in category 2, but I am...
> 
> It really bugs me that Amazon calls it the Paperwhite. I'd call it the Papershadow, or Papercast, or Papertinge. Paperwhite? Puh-lease.


It does seem that some are better than others though. Mine has the shadows at the bottom, but no issues with shadows on other parts of the screen, any tints (its nice and white to my eyes) etc.

If someone can't stand the shadows at the bottom, then yeah, the PW isn't going to be for them as that's just the norm of the current LED lighting technology. But if they can stand that, and just not tints and shadows elsewhere on the screen, then maybe they can get one they'd like.

But I'm sure that some people just have better eyes and/or are more sensitive to uneven lighting who may never be happy with it.

I also wonder if it's a light level issue for some. Mine does look less even if the lights set too low for ambient lighting conditions sometimes. But I like my light up pretty high as I like a nice, white page so that's moot for me. I'm not reading in dim lighting with the light on 5, I have it on 15. In bright lighting I have it on 20-24. With those settings I notice nothing but the shadows at the bottom.


----------



## GBear

mooshie78 said:


> I also wonder if it's a light level issue for some. Mine does look less even if the lights set too low for ambient lighting conditions sometimes. But I like my light up pretty high as I like a nice, white page so that's moot for me. I'm not reading in dim lighting with the light on 5, I have it on 15. In bright lighting I have it on 20-24. With those settings I notice nothing but the shadows at the bottom.


I don't have a PW, but was also just wondering if it was a light issue, although maybe in the opposite direction from you who say you like it better bright. I was thinking that others have said that if they turn the light down to just above where they're aware that the light is on, then the screen seems clear, even, and readable. So I thought that there might be a broader attempt to really brighten the screen so that it looks like what people are more used to, a bright white backlit LCD screen. Perhaps this could be cause for dissatisfaction?

I looked over at the next treadmill yesterday and noticed a woman reading on a bright white screen, no blotches or colors or shadows, and thought that she must have one of those really good new PW screens. But, on a closer look, it was a tablet.

I think that the PW with lighted screen is likely to be much more evenly lit that even my beloved K3 with lighted cover, but perhaps much less even lit than a tablet just by the nature of the technology. So perhaps it's worth asking what are realistic expectations and bases for comparison?


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

For those who don't have a PW, "reasonable expectations and bases for comparison" may be an interesting theoretical discussion; but for those who do have a PW and have one that does not live up to their expectations, or who have multiple PWs that differ in screen appearance, the only thing that really matters is their satisfaction.  

This thread is for those people to share their experiences.  Just sayin'.

I do recommend that people experiment with different lighting levels to see if one works for them.  If not, then they should definitely contact Kindle CS during the 30 day window.

Betsy


----------



## CAR

Betsy the Quilter said:


> For those who don't have a PW, "reasonable expectations and bases for comparison" may be an interesting theoretical discussion; but for those who do have a PW and have one that does not live up to their expectations, or who have multiple PWs that differ in screen appearance, the only thing that really matters is their satisfaction.
> 
> This thread is for those people to share their experiences. Just sayin'.
> 
> I do recommend that people experiment with different lighting levels to see if one works for them. If not, then they should definitely contact Kindle CS during the 30 day window.
> 
> Betsy


Hmm guess the folks that are still waiting for the first delivery, should stop looking in this thread, makes us nervous. 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

CAR said:


> Hmm guess the folks that are still waiting for the first delivery, should stop looking in this thread, makes us nervous.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


Definiitely. As far as I can tell, Amazon has shipped thousands of Kindle PWs. Only a relatively few people have posted in this thread. I wouldn't worry until you get yours and you're not satisfied with it.

I don't doubt that there are issues with some of the screens; however I think there are thousands of satisfied KPW owners like me. So play the odds while you wait. 

Betsy


----------



## stevene9

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Definiitely. As far as I can tell, Amazon has shipped thousands of Kindle PWs. Only a relatively few people have posted in this thread. I wouldn't worry until you get yours and you're not satisfied with it.
> 
> I don't doubt that there are issues with some of the screens; however I think there are thousands of satisfied KPW owners like me. So play the odds while you wait.
> 
> Betsy


But Betsy, it's not the thousands that have been sold, because most non kindleboard people will take what they get (unless it is obviouly very defective), and accept it. The percentage that is important for our discussions is the number of defective units kindleboard members get as compared with the number of all units sent to kindleboard members. That gives you a more accurate default rate.

Steve


----------



## jaspertyler

I am getting my second replacement so it did work out.  I wish pictures would do better justice to this problem. My first one was very pink. If you put it next to my new or one it's really noticeable. The next one that I got is very yellow and brown.  It is still a really awesome device. I just really want it to be normal .


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

stevene9 said:


> The percentage that is important for our discussions is the number of defective units kindleboard members get as compared with the number of all units sent to kindleboard members. That gives you a more accurate default rate.


I agree that would be useful information. But we don't have that in this thread; we have a thread for people who have perceived problems. It's not a survey; for the most part, only people who have had problems with their PWs have posted in this thread. It's a self selected response.

I'm not saying don't read the thread; I'm not saying there isn't useful information. I'm saying wait until you get your PW to fret about it.  My mom used to say "don't borrow trouble." Once you get it, by all means use the information in this thread to determine what you should do about yours.

And I'm asking that people who are perfectly happy with their PWs (like me) or who do not own PWs yet not diminish what people who are not satisfied are experiencing. We can't see their PW through their eyes and know what they are experiencing.

Betsy


----------



## mooshie78

GBear said:


> I don't have a PW, but was also just wondering if it was a light issue, although maybe in the opposite direction from you who say you like it better bright. I was thinking that others have said that if they turn the light down to just above where they're aware that the light is on, then the screen seems clear, even, and readable. So I thought that there might be a broader attempt to really brighten the screen so that it looks like what people are more used to, a bright white backlit LCD screen. Perhaps this could be cause for dissatisfaction?
> 
> I looked over at the next treadmill yesterday and noticed a woman reading on a bright white screen, no blotches or colors or shadows, and thought that she must have one of those really good new PW screens. But, on a closer look, it was a tablet.
> 
> I think that the PW with lighted screen is likely to be much more evenly lit that even my beloved K3 with lighted cover, but perhaps much less even lit than a tablet just by the nature of the technology. So perhaps it's worth asking what are realistic expectations and bases for comparison?


Well it could go both ways. If you have a defective unit where the light isn't even, then yeah you'll notice it less with the light way down. With it all the way down, it's just barely on so the screen just looks like any old e-ink screen as you need an external light source to read.

For the general shadow issue at the bottom--that's normal on all PWs--that I find more noticeable if the lighting is turned up enough for my liking relative to the ambient lighting conditions.

But yeah, a front lit, side lit etc. screen is never going to be as even and uniform as a back lit screen. It's just a tradeoff as back lit screens emit light directly out and give a lot of people eye strain, and that's less of an issue with a glowing front light system on the PW as less light is shined straight out at your eyes.

And I agree 100% with Betsy that all that matters is whether one is happy with the screen/light they have. If not they should exchange until they get one they like, and just return and stick with an older Kindle model if they can't find a PW unit they like as it may just be that even the best units aren't evenly lit enough for them. Everyone has different eyes, different things that annoy them and distract from their reading experience etc.

I'd just suggest anyone to read on their's a couple days, fiddle with the light setting in the various conditions they read in and give the device a fair shake before sending it back--unless it's really bad with terrible shadows, tinting etc. of course. The shadows on the bottom bugged me the first day as they weren't apparent in the Amazon conference. But once I realized those were normal, and that they don't get near my text (and thus are meaningless) I pay no attention to them anymore. And all I have to do is turn my light all the way down and be reminded of how annoying e-ink can be in dim lighting with ambient shadows etc. in the way and I'm then super happy with my PW as it's so much easier to read in the lighting conditions I usually read in. And even in bright lighting, I like cranking the light up to near the max so the screen looks white still.

But everyone's different, and some just won't like the light period, or won't be able to tolerate the shadows, or has sensitive eyes that see tint or shadows that my eyes don't. So everyone just has to try it for themselves and see if they can get a unit they like.


----------



## mooshie78

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I agree that would be useful information. But we don't have that in this thread; we have a thread for people who have perceived problems. It's not a survey; for the most part, only people who have had problems with their PWs have posted in this thread. It's a self selected response.


Good point, and I just made a poll thread to help us get some broader info on KB members satisfaction/dissatisfaction with their PW screens.

http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,129381.0.html


----------



## MsBea

I just read on another board:

"Kindle engineers are now aware of the issue about Kindle PaperWhite devices with screen discoloration/blotches. They are following this very closely, monitoring phone calls to Kindle support regarding this screen issue. The engineers want to see these defective devices and are investigating into the problem. They are sending out a special return label that will return the device to Cupertino (not the usual return warehouse in KY), so that the engineers can see the defective Kindles." They think it a hardware problem.
.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

mooshie78 said:


> Good point, and I just made a poll thread to help us get some broader info on KB members satisfaction/dissatisfaction with their PW screens.
> 
> http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,129381.0.html


Which is fine. . . .but it's still a self selected group so not statistically valid. 

FWIW, I tried to take some pictures of mine, but none of the pictures do it justice to my eyes.  So my advice would be don't necessarily take the pictures as 100% representative to what your _eyes_ will see. If you're interested in the device, give it a try. Play with it for a while as mooshie suggests. . . .after all, you have a full 30 days to evaluate it and still return it. All it will cost you is return shipping.


----------



## Kathy

I understand that some may not like the shadowing at the bottom and it can be distracting. I like to read in bed and have the Kindle Touch with the lighted case. I think the reason I'm enjoying the Paperwhite more is that with the light over the screen you only have a bright spot under where the light shines. You have enough light to see the outer edges, but it gives the screen a shaded look. When I compare the slight shading given the Paperwhite with the light from below it is so much easier to read on it in a dark room. When I'm in a well lighted area I really don't have much shadowing at all. 

Everyone has to make their own choices and should do what is right for them. I am a Kindle lover but I would never just "take what I get" just to have the newest Kindle. I really don't think anyone would really do that with the great services you get from Amazon.


----------



## CAR

MsBea said:


> I just read on another board:
> 
> "Kindle engineers are now aware of the issue about Kindle PaperWhite devices with screen discoloration/blotches. They are following this very closely, monitoring phone calls to Kindle support regarding this screen issue. The engineers want to see these defective devices and are investigating into the problem. They are sending out a special return label that will return the device to Cupertino (not the usual return warehouse in KY), so that the engineers can see the defective Kindles." They think it a hardware problem.
> .


Interesting video of a Kindle Paperwhite being taken apart to be analyzed. 

http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/07/amazons-kindle-paperwhite-gets-torn-down-promptly-put-back-to/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter


----------



## Pushka

I tried taking photos of some of the areas that show in my ppw, which don't bother me enough to send it back (I'm in Australia) but which are most certainly there. But it is hard to capture in a photo. Which in my case, makes me think it is something to do with how my eyes are registering the light?


----------



## mooshie78

Ann in Arlington said:


> Which is fine. . . .but it's still a self selected group so not statistically valid.


Of course. But it at least lets those happy with their PWs say/vote so so people on the fence don't think all/most PW owners are unhapoy with them or that most units are defective etc.


----------



## CAR

Pushka said:


> I tried taking photos of some of the areas that show in my ppw, which don't bother me enough to send it back (I'm in Australia) but which are most certainly there. But it is hard to capture in a photo. Which in my case, makes me think it is something to do with how my eyes are registering the light?


Cameras do not see light the same way as a human eye sometimes. When I took a picture of my K3 a while back, some folks thought the background was not grey enough, and it showed too much contrast


----------



## northofdivision

"It really bugs me that Amazon calls it the Paperwhite. I'd call it the Papershadow, or Papercast, or Papertinge. Paperwhite? Puh-lease."
haha. awesome. 

i got my replacement today and its visibly more yellowed and matte (sepia-ish) and i'm much happier with it than the first pw i recieved last week which has that old school timex indiglo thing going on  (of the camp that loves the drab but very clear eink that feels more paperish than if it were white). Its still got the pinkish spolotches/shading differences but i tell you, the entire left border to about an inch out is PERFECT (no shadows AT all) and what i had hoped originally (which makes me think that some got some great ones). i went in four different light conditions with both and whether light or dark, on 1 or 24 brightness, the new one is great on the left side (and still with some blotching and shadows on the middle and right) and visibly different than the first one. i notice the bottom left light that is coming out from the left border on the first is not there (or minimally) on my replacement. Neither are perfect but i'm too tired to do the trade in game anymore and this one is clearly an improvement. This latest one i got i'm going to read for a week and see if my eyes adjust to it, i'll keep it. 30 days to mess with both helps. The adjustments hardware-wise seem very doable to fix. next gen paperwhites are gonna kill it. can't wait for them.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

And this is why i wait 3-6 months after a new toy is released to buy one.


----------



## TraumaDoll

Eh, I don't know, I dislike the 'that's what you get for being an early adopter' argument. I'm usually an early adopter and this is my first major problem. (That said, this is my first time being an early adopter of a new Kindle generation, so I'll be more careful with *that* next time.)

Speaking of: registered to say I'm another one of those people with pink/blue/green clouds. On my second unit so far (not as bad but still cloudy). On another forum there are many people in my situation who are continuing to get subsequent bad replacements. (And because I can't stress this enough: I mean multicolor screens, NOT shadows from the LEDs.) So I got frustrated and wrote a negative review. Amazon called me within a few hours, mentioned the review and asked me to send one of my bad units to Cupertino. I'm not sure why they picked mine; I know there are lots of similar negative reviews about the color blobs, and most people's returns are being routed to KY for now. I did go into a fair amount of detail in the review including everything I'd tried so far. 

I told them I'd LOVE to help them and that I'll get the unit shipped tomorrow (and I will). I'm mostly posting this to let people know Amazon *is* showing some higher-level interest in, and acknowledgement of, the problem. The rep wouldn't make me any promises that another exchange made *now* would do me any good (which makes sense if they're still investigating the problem), so I'm holding onto unit #2 for the time being. 

I do love the *idea* of the Paperwhite and I'm hoping eventually they sort it out.


----------



## northofdivision

MamaProfCrash said:


> And this is why i wait 3-6 months after a new toy is released to buy one.


For all other hardware, i follow that rule too and never buy 1st gen of any new tech/hardware. but kindles i was going 4 for 4 on "this device is freakin awesome"...PW has the right idea. its interesting that for all the subjectivity once light came into play, there seem to be a lot of reports on this thread of peeps getting a yellowish/browner tinted one as their replacement. that's fascinating. I wonder why that is. The more i stare at the two (PW and PW replacement), the more this yellowish/brown hue is working for me (and if i turn up the light, it gets whiter/less brownyellow). I've put them side by side at 4, 8, 12, 16, 20 and 24 and the new one is less bright and (which i like) because the fonts stand out better for me.

for the moderators on this site, was there anything close to this on other kindle gens? i know that the change from k2's 150ppi to k3's 167ppi was huge for me and i was wholly impressed at the contrast quality of k3's. wondering why the 167ppi to 212ppi isn't having that same effect. what i wouldn't give for a software update to pop up which allows us to turn off the light completely just to see.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Thanks for posting, TraumaDoll, and welcome to KindleBoards!

Betsy


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

northofdivision said:


> for the moderators on this site, was there anything close to this on other kindle gens?


Well, we have a lot of long time members who could answer that question as well as the mods...  But, I think it was the K2 that had the fading text issue? I didn't have the K2 so can't speak from experience...

Betsy


----------



## sjc

Let's hope.
I am holding off on ordering until bugs are fixed; also, maybe my kids will pitch in and get it for Christmas and I won't have to buy it and the bugs will be tweaked by then.  Happy w/ K3 for now; though the lighted book cover is a pain in the @ss.


----------



## TraumaDoll

> for the moderators on this site, was there anything close to this on other kindle gens?


I'm relatively ignorant of Kindle history (I never owned one til 3rd gen was well-established, and had no problems with my KK so never read reviews or forums), but in the course of researching this problem, I've seen some other people talk about going through a lot of ... fourth gens? I want to say Kindle 4 silver model, and the early Kindle Touch...sending multiple units back trying to get a good screen.

I think I speak for at least some of us going on multiple replacements now when I say we don't even care too much about what color it is, or if it looks 'white', we just want a screen that is only _one_ color.


----------



## WilliamG

mooshie78 said:


> Of course. But it at least lets those happy with their PWs say/vote so so people on the fence don't think all/most PW owners are unhapoy with them or that most units are defective etc.


Consider me one of those who believes that all Paperwhites are defective. I've never seen one without a color cast/shadowing/uneven light. I know there are people on here who just can't see it (gawd I wish I were one of those people), but whether they see it or not: it IS defective. Not to say that Amazon should recall the product or anything, but it's without doubt the most falsely-advertised Kindle yet.


----------



## CAR

Take a look at this video, is it me or does the text not look as good on the PW vs K4??


----------



## northofdivision

CAR--indeed, raw pearl E-ink displays (k3,k4) with no layers (light layer and touch layer on PW) can't not have some effect. trade off for the front lit lighting i guess. he addressed the discoloration to him as blue. i read someone describing them as clouds which i thought was a good analogy.


----------



## Kathy

Car. Great video. I liked the comparison with the book light. I don't have a bluish tint but I did notice it a little. Hard to tell from a picture. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## DD

CAR said:


> Take a look at this video, is it me or does the text not look as good on the PW vs K4??


That was exactly my problem with the PW I sent back. I could have lived with seeing the hot spots on the bottom of the screen but the text looked faded...much lighter than my Touch and my K3k. Not what I was expecting at all. I have vision issues and it was difficult for me to read.


----------



## sparklemotion

WilliamG said:


> Consider me one of those who believes that all Paperwhites are defective. I've never seen one without a color cast/shadowing/uneven light. I know there are people on here who just can't see it (gawd I wish I were one of those people), but whether they see it or not: it IS defective. Not to say that Amazon should recall the product or anything, but it's without doubt the most falsely-advertised Kindle yet.


I agree with you, there's some imperfections in all them. I think it's just a matter of how bad yours is, if you can live with it, or if you're lucky enough not to notice it at all. I do think some units are better than others, but some are outright unusable for reading. One look at the user pics on Amazon will prove that. I received a replacement today that I'm happy enough with to keep, but it's been a disappointing process. I do know Amazon is aware of the problems and I have faith that the issue is being addressed. It's just a shame that QC was so poor on this unit and that some people are having to deal with the disappointment of receiving an unusable unit. Multiple times in some cases.


----------



## DD

WilliamG said:


> I don't think there's a point getting a replacement.
> 
> Here's what I think happens:
> 
> 1.) People buy the Paperwhite and don't care about the lightshow at the bottom, or the uneven cast that affects all Paperwhites (from what I can tell. I have 4 that have the issue, and all the user-submitted images on these forums and on Amazon.com do too). For those people who don't see the issue, they will love the Paperwhite. Case closed.
> 
> 2.) People buy the Paperwhite and immediately notice the light issue, as well as the color cast issue (introduced by the light from what I can tell). For those (myself/my wife included), they will NEVER be happy with the Paperwhite, and replacements don't address the issue, sadly.
> 
> I hate to be in category 2, but I am...
> 
> It really bugs me that Amazon calls it the Paperwhite. I'd call it the Papershadow, or Papercast, or Papertinge. Paperwhite? Puh-lease.


And don't forget the light text problem which was my biggest objection to the one I sent back. From the ads, I was expecting sharp crisp black text. Instead I saw gray text against a splotchy background. The text was much lighter than on my Touch and my K3k.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

Every generation of Kindle has had some type of flaw in the first few months that has led to a higher than normal rate of return. It is not just the Kindle that has had problems, kobo always seems to have. Series of software glitches, Nook and Sony have screen issues as well. I don't think that it is right or fair. I do think that the initial high demands leads to quality control issues. There is a clear pattern, which is why I wait. 

I think everyone should get the product that meets their needs and expectations.


----------



## DD

MamaProfCrash said:


> Every generation of Kindle has had some type of flaw in the first few months that has led to a higher than normal rate of return. It is not just the Kindle that has had problems, kobo always seems to have. Series of software glitches, Nook and Sony have screen issues as well. I don't think that it is right or fair. I do think that the initial high demands leads to quality control issues. There is a clear pattern, which is why I wait.
> 
> I think everyone should get the product that meets their needs and expectations.


I wish I could learn a little patience and wait. I swore to myself after the K2 (6 returns until I got a good one!) that I would wait to read the reviews and see how it's going before I order. But No-o-o-o! LOL


----------



## BradW

mooshie78 said:


> If someone can't stand the shadows at the bottom, then yeah, the PW isn't going to be for them as that's just the norm of the current LED lighting technology.


It could be reduced by using more than 4 LEDs across the bottom. That should be a pretty minor engineering change, so if they get enough feedback about the shadows, maybe it'll slip into production at some point.


----------



## berfles

BradW said:


> It could be reduced by using more than 4 LEDs across the bottom. That should be a pretty minor engineering change, so if they get enough feedback about the shadows, maybe it'll slip into production at some point.


I've thought about that as well. Couldn't they also move them down more, have them more recessed or something, so that the light cones touch each other immediately instead of half an inch up the screen? In other words, place them lower in the devices so the light is fanned out immediately, then you wouldn't have the dark portions that the cone of light doesn't illuminate. I'm sure it would affect the brightness a bit, but let's be honest, does anyone actually use full brightness? I doubt it would affect it THAT much.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

DD said:


> I wish I could learn a little patience and wait. I swore to myself after the K2 (6 returns until I got a good one!) that I would wait to read the reviews and see how it's going before I order. But No-o-o-o! LOL


And the rest of us love you for your impatience. (winks)


----------



## BenReem

i don't know....I think that consistency in a product is a big deal. the fact that we've now had 3 kindles in our possession and not one looks like the other is troublesome to me regardless of which one looks better to the eye.


----------



## pomtroll

I'm waiting to get my Kindle Paperwhite. I never had problems with previous kindles (K3 & KT), but I did have trouble with my Sony T1 last year & had to return it 3 times. I finally waited a few months till they got the bugs worked out. Now I'm satisfied with it. So problems can creep up with all readers. It is frustrating though...Especially when some people tell you you are picky or doing something wrong (I'm not saying doing something wrong doesn't happen). I felt that kind of judgment with the T1 & it turned out to be faulty firmware in some of the T1s..not all of course.

So I'll wait but will eventually get a Paperwhite....Have ot have my new gadgets.


----------



## mooshie78

BenReem said:


> i don't know....I think that consistency in a product is a big deal. the fact that we've now had 3 kindles in our possession and not one looks like the other is troublesome to me regardless of which one looks better to the eye.


That I'd agree with.

They clearly need to find a new manufacturer given how inconsistent the one they used is. That and not rush launches as they apparently have given the low quality control and long shipping times for people who didn't preorder. Next time pick a new manufacturer and wait until they have a bunch of good stock (checked for quality) on hand before announcing the product, and then sell it week or two later.

But honestly, this is just a consequence of the drive to get prices down. These things were over $400 a few years ago, and are now down as low as $69 for the basic and $119 for the PW. To get prices down that fast they've no doubt cut corners in reducing manufacturing cost (as well as e-ink tech just getting cheaper over time).


----------



## Skydog

mooshie78 said:


> But honestly, this is just a consequence of the drive to get prices down. These things were over $400 a few years ago, and are now down as low as $69 for the basic and $119 for the PW. To get prices down that fast they've no doubt cut corners in reducing manufacturing cost (as well as e-ink tech just getting cheaper over time).


Bingo.

Sent from my Nexus 7


----------



## GBear

So, perhaps all those folks outside the US should cease complaining about the delays in getting these new Kindles to their markets! Obviously, Amazon:

1) Respects the high quality standards of people outside the US; and

2) Is just taking advantage of the gullibility of (MOST of us) Americans to want the latest and greatest without concern for quality!


----------



## Heifzilla

GBear said:


> So, perhaps all those folks outside the US should cease complaining about the delays in getting these new Kindles to their markets! Obviously, Amazon:
> 
> 1) Respects the high quality standards of people outside the US; and
> 
> 2) Is just taking advantage of the gullibility of (MOST of us) Americans to want the latest and greatest without concern for quality!


Just because a small amount of people (as a percentage of how many units Amazon has shipped) have issues with their PW you cannot make a generalized statement like this. You are also saying that people who are happy with their PW are "gullible"? Kind of offensive, IMO.


----------



## BenReem

Heifzilla said:


> Just because a small amount of people (as a percentage of how many units Amazon has shipped) have issues with their PW you cannot make a generalized statement like this. You are also saying that people who are happy with their PW are "gullible"? Kind of offensive, IMO.


I think the post was intended to be sarcastic and light-hearted. Not offensive. We all need to chill a little.


----------



## Heifzilla

BenReem said:


> I think the post was intended to be sarcastic and light-hearted. Not offensive. We all need to chill a little.


Sarcasm doesn't translate well in text.


----------



## GBear

Heifzilla said:


> Sarcasm doesn't translate well in text.


I'm sorry if I offended. The  was intended to convey that it was a joke.


----------



## mlewis78

Heifzilla said:


> Sarcasm doesn't translate well in text.


They didn't say that people who like their PWs are gullible; they said that Americans are gullible to want the latest thing. I'm sure no offense was intended.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

It is a small percentage of folks who are having trouble. I would say it is a small percentage of people on this site. It is a shame but stuff happens when a new product goes into circulation. 

I believe there is only one manufacturer of eink screens so it is not like Amazon can threaten to move its business.


----------



## mlewis78

Judging from the reviews on the Amazon site, a lot of people have not been satisfied and have the same problems that the people on Kindleboards have with the screen.  Hard to say what the percentage of defective KPWs is, but I've seen many complaints outside of Kindleboards forums.


----------



## techiegirl

My 2nd replacement (3rd PW 3G) has just been delivered at home.  I'll test it tonight.  Meanwhile we received hubby's 1st replacement (2nd PW wifi) last night and while there are still shadows in the bottom, the rest of the screen looked good enough.  He's going to keep it and return the original.


----------



## zwarbles

My 2nd replacement came today and that one is not good either.  
Screen was not as bright as the first replacement (which in turn was brighter than my original) and had colored patches all over the screen.


----------



## TraumaDoll

> It is a small percentage of folks who are having trouble. I would say it is a small percentage of people on this site. It is a shame but stuff happens when a new product goes into circulation.


Whatever percentage it is, it's high enough to keep the average rating of the PW on Amazon at 3 1/2 stars. (By comparison, other Kindles are typically four stars and iPads 4.5.) If the device was really as good as was promised in the marketing, one would expect that rating--all things being equal--to be higher.


----------



## chocochibi

I got my replacement today and so far I am much happier with it.


----------



## TraumaDoll

Amazon is sort of beginning to address it, or at least do damage control (the 3.5 star rating probably stings):

http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html/ref=amb_link_365797822_1?ie=UTF8&docId=1000841011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-6-2&pf_rd_r=17T34864229P91H9JDZQ&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=1404554782&pf_rd_i=B007OZNZG0


----------



## Heifzilla

TraumaDoll said:


> Whatever percentage it is, it's high enough to keep the average rating of the PW on Amazon at 3 1/2 stars. (By comparison, other Kindles are typically four stars and iPads 4.5.) If the device was really as good as was promised in the marketing, one would expect that rating--all things being equal--to be higher.


People are far more likely to complain about something than praise, so I take that with a grain of salt. I am one of the truly happy with my PW and I am sorry that some people are having issues.


----------



## Raheulon

People expect things to run smoothly, so when a product does so, the user tends not to even notice; they see it as the product's default state. They're unlikely to go out of their way to say, "Hey! Your product runs really smoothly!"

If just 1% of your users are complaining on your forums, they can easily give the impression of major problems with your product because their natural reaction is to assume everyone uses your product in exactly the same way they do, despite any evidence to the contrary. And 99% of your customers are most likely having no problems at all.


----------



## northofdivision

Raheulon said:


> People expect things to run smoothly, so when a product does so, the user tends not to even notice; they see it as the product's default state. They're unlikely to go out of their way to say, "Hey! Your product runs really smoothly!"
> 
> If just 1% of your users are complaining on your forums, they can easily give the impression of major problems with your product because their natural reaction is to assume everyone uses your product in exactly the same way they do, despite any evidence to the contrary. And 99% of your customers are most likely having no problems at all.


Though 38.2% of the current 452 customer reviews of the Paperwhites on Amazon.com who have given your product 3 stars or below are hardly 99% of customers being happy. When a product does run "really smoothly", hundreds of us who love Kindles happily "go out of our way" and shout it out and give 5 star reviews (which many of us have through the various iterations of Kindle, self included). And I can only speak for myself but I definitely take notice when a product is incredible with no problems.

For me, Kindleboards is to celebrate our devices (and their users), and yes occasionally, to express our concerns/frustrations on Kindles and find like minds with whom we can connect and work toward righting any ships going the wrong way.


----------



## CAR

Why would folks with PW issues that post in a thread titled " The defective PaperWhite thread"  have to defend themselves to other users?  I just don't get it.


----------



## northofdivision

CAR said:


> Why would folks with PW issues that post in a thread titled " The defective PaperWhite thread" have to defend themselves to other users? I just don't get it.


Great point, CAR


----------



## WilliamG

Heifzilla said:


> Just because a small amount of people (as a percentage of how many units Amazon has shipped) have issues with their PW you cannot make a generalized statement like this. You are also saying that people who are happy with their PW are "gullible"? Kind of offensive, IMO.


Not gullible. That's not the word. More like.... ignorant? 

In all seriousness, the issues are there with all Paperwhites (I had four units, so I'm generalizing from there), and if you can't see the problem/s it doesn't make you gullible. I think the word "lucky" springs to mind.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

You don't have to defend yourself. Your new Kindle is not working properly and that sucks. There are always problems with Kindles, and Nooks, Kobos, Sonys, during the initial launch. While unacceptable, the problems still effect a small minority of folks who are highly disappointed. If you are one of the folks with a problem Kindle it is frustrating and it does not mater you are in the minority.

The only good news is that Amazon is great about sending replacements and it seems like they are upgrading some folks Kindles to apologize for the inconvience.


----------



## FearIndex

WilliamG said:


> Not gullible. That's not the word. More like.... ignorant?
> 
> In all seriousness, the issues are there with all Paperwhites (I had four units, so I'm generalizing from there), and if you can't see the problem/s it doesn't make you gullible. I think the word "lucky" springs to mind.


I don't think either "party" should or should have the defend their point of view. Clearly it is evident there is unevenness on the Kindle PW lighting (even Amazon says so) as well as unfortunate variance between units currently shipping. However, bad units aside, being able to live with the limitations of the technology/implementation does not anyone ignorant or even lucky make. So, there is unnevenness and also more bad units out there, that is currently the nature of the technology and the manufacturing process. I agree, probably no Kindle PW will be completely uniform... ever. Even when they get the variances sorted out. Just like the Nook Glowlight won't be. Or a Kindle 3/4 cover light. Maybe PW 2 will be better?

I think it comes down to expectations and personal disposition. In some cases, it also comes down to immediate history and the natural adjustment period of getting used to something new. Even if you (or I or whomever) is not okay with something, it definitely doesn't mean someone else couldn't or shouldn't be -or that we wouldn't be okay with it after a time. People deal with imperfection all the time in their lives, it is just that for certain people certain things become more important than for others - and in those cases they have a harder time adjusting to imprefection they might otherwise accept or even embrace. Others just don't care about that particular imperfection.

So, if I may, I'd say let's respect our opinions on both sides of the aisle. We can all contribute information, but our opinions and experiences will be our own.  I doubt anyone of us is qualified to decide for others what imperfection they should accept or reject in their lives. Glass houses and all that...

(I am yet in the perioud of adjusting to the screen to form a final opinion, time will tell. I have described my experiences e.g. here: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,128453.msg1911904.html#msg1911904 and my Kindle PW does look like the Amazon pictures here: http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html/ref=amb_link_365797822_1?ie=UTF8&docId=1000841011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-6-2&pf_rd_r=17T34864229P91H9JDZQ&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=1404554782&pf_rd_i=B007OZNZG0 )


----------



## stevene9

FearIndex said:


> I don't think either "party" should or should have the defend their point of view. Clearly it is evident there is unevenness on the Kindle PW lighting (even Amazon says so) as well as unfortunate variance between units currently shipping. However, bad units aside, being able to live with the limitations of the technology/implementation does not anyone ignorant or even lucky make. So, there is unnevenness and also more bad units out there, that is currently the nature of the technology and the manufacturing process. I agree, probably no Kindle PW will be completely uniform... ever. Even when they get the variances sorted out. Just like the Nook Glowlight won't be. Or a Kindle 3/4 cover light. Maybe PW 2 will be better?
> 
> I think it comes down to expectations and personal disposition. In some cases, it also comes down to immediate history and the natural adjustment period of getting used to something new. Even if you (or I or whomever) is not okay with something, it definitely doesn't mean someone else couldn't or shouldn't be -or that we wouldn't be okay with it after a time. People deal with imperfection all the time in their lives, it is just that for certain people certain things become more important than for others - and in those cases they have a harder time adjusting to imprefection they might otherwise accept or even embrace. Others just don't care about that particular imperfection.
> 
> So, if I may, I'd say let's respect our opinions on both sides of the aisle. We can all contribute information, but our opinions and experiences will be our own.  I doubt anyone of us is qualified to decide for others what imperfection they should accept or reject in their lives. Glass houses and all that...
> 
> (I am yet in the perioud of adjusting to the screen to form a final opinion, time will tell. I have described my experiences e.g. here: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,128453.msg1911904.html#msg1911904 and my Kindle PW does look like the Amazon pictures here: http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html/ref=amb_link_365797822_1?ie=UTF8&docId=1000841011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-6-2&pf_rd_r=17T34864229P91H9JDZQ&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=1404554782&pf_rd_i=B007OZNZG0 )


FearIndex, you may have only written 9 posts, but they have been fantastic posts. My compliments to you on your well written, and in depth, analysises. Pull up a chair and stay around a while.

Steve


----------



## FearIndex

Thank you stevene9. I certainly hope to be able to contribute something in the future as well. 

This place has been a valuable reading source for me before, but it took the release of a new, revolutionary product to finally hop on board the writing game...

I love the atmosphere here. Thank you all for the warm welcomes. Serious readers certainly make for great conversationists!


----------



## BenReem

We received our 2nd replacement (3rd kindle for my fiance, 4th in our hands if you count my good PW) and the lighting is uneven with noticeable green patches. I've decided to let it charge all the way before really looking at it again. Hopefully that'll make a difference, but if not, I'm very wary of contacting amazon again. This is a LOT of exchanges and I just can't seem to get a good one


----------



## TraumaDoll

Heifzilla said:


> People are far more likely to complain about something than praise, so I take that with a grain of salt. I am one of the truly happy with my PW and I am sorry that some people are having issues.


Yes, I've heard the 'negative people are more vocal than positive people' argument on this too and I don't buy it. For one, it doesn't explain why other Kindles rate four stars and iPads rate 4.5. If you're going to off-handedly dismiss the value of Amazon's review system because of human nature, you have to dismiss it for _everything_.

All things being equal, though, I trust crowd-sourced reviews (once you have a high enough number of reviews) because 'haters' and 'fanboys' will generally cancel each other out.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

Someone went through 8 K2s before getting one without the sun fade problem. I owuldn't worry about contacting them. As has been noted, there is clearly an issue with some percentage of the screen. That percentage of bad screens is higher when a new device is released. Amazon knows that. That is why they have set aside devices to replace defective ones even when they have a waiting list. 

If your device has green blotches, send it back. Keep sneding it back until you get one that works or you decide to get a refund and wait a few months for the initial run of screens to have been sent out. Keep in mind that Amazon has been building up a device stockpile. Now that they are getting defective units back they can work with the manufacturer to figure out if it was a specific run or two that had issues or if there is something wrong on the line that is causing problems and get that fixed. I would expect that in a very short period of time we will not hear about this problem because they will have figured out what happened.

Hang in there. Get your replacement. You paid for a device and deserve one that works as advertised. Do not settle for something because you fear Amazon's response. They know that there is an issue and they are working on fixing it for the customer now and for later customers.


----------



## NightReader

Well, I have the return label printed out, but I put the box aside for a few days.  Then I pulled it out last night to deregister it and turn off the wireless...and it looks better to me.

I walked it around in different lighting and I don't think I'm imagining it.  It's not blotchy anymore and the text is more even/darker.  It does still have the bottom shadows though. 

Maybe the screens need to set or burn in?  That might explain why replacements are looking inferior to the ones they are replacing.  Maybe they need to age?

I think I'll read a book this weekend and reconsider sending it back.


----------



## PinkKindle

Well, I've given my replacement PW several days of use -- and I'm still not sure what I want to do.   I think it is better than my original unit.  However, there is still a definite pink area and a definite darker/greenish area -- just not as bad as the first one.  The Kindle is absolutely still readable, though, and I still like it better than the Touch, but I can't say that it's "perfect."  However, I just don't think sending this one back for another replacement is going to give me a perfect one either.  So I decide to keep it and decide that it's good enough -- but then I pick it up at night again and decide maybe I do need to call and exchange again!   

I feel logically like it would be best to wait a little while before another exchange -- wait until they figure out the problem and get some stock that definitely doesn't have the problem -- but then I'm hesitant to really set up the collections on this Kindle and skin it and make it "mine" if I'm going to be exchanging it!  I feel like I can't get comfortable with it, if that makes sense.  So that makes me want to go back to exchanging now . . .


----------



## Atunah

PinkKindle said:


> Well, I've given my replacement PW several days of use -- and I'm still not sure what I want to do.  I think it is better than my original unit. However, there is still a definite pink area and a definite darker/greenish area -- just not as bad as the first one. The Kindle is absolutely still readable, though, and I still like it better than the Touch, but I can't say that it's "perfect." However, I just don't think sending this one back for another replacement is going to give me a perfect one either. So I decide to keep it and decide that it's good enough -- but then I pick it up at night again and decide maybe I do need to call and exchange again!
> 
> I feel logically like it would be best to wait a little while before another exchange -- wait until they figure out the problem and get some stock that definitely doesn't have the problem -- but then I'm hesitant to really set up the collections on this Kindle and skin it and make it "mine" if I'm going to be exchanging it! I feel like I can't get comfortable with it, if that makes sense. So that makes me want to go back to exchanging now . . .


I hear you. I have #3 coming. It was horrible to do the chat and then I had to call anyway. I have issues with the phone and so thought I do the chat and it was awful. My first unit had a "hole" but more it has the font lop sided. Its been put together crooked so the text drops off to the right. It has a pretty good screen otherwise. The second one has one of the lights on the bottom so bright its very distracting. Its like a flashlight shines through and it goes into the first 2 lines from the bottom up. Like a thumbsize spot. And it has more triangle shaped lighting issues higher up. Almost up to the 3rd of the device. I thought I could try to live with that one as the thought of contacting them again was giving me hives.

But I just couldn't enjoy it as I constantly stared at that very bright blue blob of light. When I did the chat it didn't go anywhere. It was like talking to a robot. 
Then I called later and I could barely understand what he was saying. Then he told me to take off the back of the Kindle. 
I am not kidding.  . Then he apologized and said he was looking at my K1. This is after I explained and explained about the light issue. He thinks I am talking about the K1. . It was a very difficult call as he wasn't keen on doing a replacement. At least I think so as again I could barely understand him.

I am getting another replacement, will be PW #3. I am so frustrated at this moment. And yes, I can't enjoy them as I can't really make them mine. I can't really set up anything on them and enjoy reading books on them. That is all I want. I just want to read. .

I don't even care about the shadows on the bottom. That would be the least of my issues. I don't even expect perfection. Just not the issues I have been dealing with.


----------



## TraumaDoll

PinkKindle said:


> Well, I've given my replacement PW several days of use -- and I'm still not sure what I want to do.  I think it is better than my original unit. However, there is still a definite pink area and a definite darker/greenish area -- just not as bad as the first one. The Kindle is absolutely still readable, though, and I still like it better than the Touch, but I can't say that it's "perfect." However, I just don't think sending this one back for another replacement is going to give me a perfect one either. So I decide to keep it and decide that it's good enough -- but then I pick it up at night again and decide maybe I do need to call and exchange again!
> 
> I feel logically like it would be best to wait a little while before another exchange -- wait until they figure out the problem and get some stock that definitely doesn't have the problem -- but then I'm hesitant to really set up the collections on this Kindle and skin it and make it "mine" if I'm going to be exchanging it! I feel like I can't get comfortable with it, if that makes sense. So that makes me want to go back to exchanging now . . .


A lot us are in this boat. I change my mind every day regarding the unit I still have in hand. (Keep, exchange or go back to KK.) Have yet to see a replacement unit photo that looked flawless to me.

I was one of the people asked to ship a unit directly to engineering in Cupertino. The Kindle specialist I talked to at the time (two days ago) did not want to make me any promises about whether replacements done *right now* would look any better. Those Cupertino units should be arriving this week (for example, mine's supposed to be there today). They'll still need time to identify the problem, decide if it needs a fix (or if some of us are just too color-sensitive visually), and then implement the fix, if any.

(Or I suppose it's possible it's a QC issue that'll get addressed soon and we'll start seeing people get 'good' replacements anyway. Only time will tell. And yeah, it does leave a lot of us in ownership limbo.)


----------



## sparklemotion

PinkKindle said:


> Well, I've given my replacement PW several days of use -- and I'm still not sure what I want to do.  I think it is better than my original unit. However, there is still a definite pink area and a definite darker/greenish area -- just not as bad as the first one. The Kindle is absolutely still readable, though, and I still like it better than the Touch, but I can't say that it's "perfect." However, I just don't think sending this one back for another replacement is going to give me a perfect one either. So I decide to keep it and decide that it's good enough -- but then I pick it up at night again and decide maybe I do need to call and exchange again!
> 
> I feel logically like it would be best to wait a little while before another exchange -- wait until they figure out the problem and get some stock that definitely doesn't have the problem -- but then I'm hesitant to really set up the collections on this Kindle and skin it and make it "mine" if I'm going to be exchanging it! I feel like I can't get comfortable with it, if that makes sense. So that makes me want to go back to exchanging now . . .


I'm in the same boat too. My replacement unit is better than my original (no glowing speck, for one, and no blue tint) but my new one has some pinkness in spots to it. I'm really not sure what to do either. I won't exchange it again because from what I have seen all of the PW screens have the rainbow effect to some degree, it's just some people don't see it, but I do. I have seen people post photos where they say theirs is perfect and there is color blotches all over them. So... right now I'm weighing the pros and cons and deciding if it's worth keeping it. My original PW suddenly developed a pink blotch in the left corner so I can see my current screen becoming worse as well. I'm just trying to decide if I can live with the issue on my current one. I could go back to using my Touch with a clip on light, but is that a better alternative than using the PW? I'm not sure.


----------



## northofdivision

PinkKindle said:


> Well, I've given my replacement PW several days of use -- and I'm still not sure what I want to do.  I think it is better than my original unit. However, there is still a definite pink area and a definite darker/greenish area -- just not as bad as the first one. The Kindle is absolutely still readable, though, and I still like it better than the Touch, but I can't say that it's "perfect." However, I just don't think sending this one back for another replacement is going to give me a perfect one either. So I decide to keep it and decide that it's good enough -- but then I pick it up at night again and decide maybe I do need to call and exchange again!
> 
> I feel logically like it would be best to wait a little while before another exchange -- wait until they figure out the problem and get some stock that definitely doesn't have the problem -- but then I'm hesitant to really set up the collections on this Kindle and skin it and make it "mine" if I'm going to be exchanging it! I feel like I can't get comfortable with it, if that makes sense. So that makes me want to go back to exchanging now . . .


your threads and experiences with your PW so far has been pretty spot on with mine. My replacement is clearly better (three friends in a blind "hey, which one's better" all immediately picked the new one) but that not quite right factor is still going on. And you're right, I still have two definitive pink hued areas (bottom right and top right) and the middle has a darker shade consistently through pages. As i said in a previous post, the entire left side of my kindle (for an inch out) is perfect. What I imagine those happy with theirs are experiences on the whole screen. I'm with you on the logic that in a few weeks or months they'll get it patched up (i'm still curious how a good majority of us who got the second replacements all got simliar more brownish/yellowish hued models. I have the same creating a collections conundrum too. haha. right now i'm carrying both my K4nt and my pw in my messenger bag.


----------



## PinkKindle

Well, it's good to see that I'm not the only one with this dilemma! 

I like the phrase "ownership limbo" that TraumaDoll used above -- that's exactly what it feels like!  I really feel like I should wait and keep my definitely usable but not "perfect" PW for a while and see what happens.  The problem is not knowing how long "a while" is!   I think I would be happier with it when I put a skin on it and get it all set up how I'd like, but I'd hate to do that and then need to return it in a couple of weeks, either because I just decide it really is too defective, or it gets worse, or maybe even because they resolve the problem!  But what if it takes several months for the issues to be resolved -- or they don't get resolved at all until the next Kindle release -- then maybe it would have been worth it to get the full enjoyment out of this unit for the time I have it and just learn to ignore the color splotches.  

Yeah, it's very possible that I'm driving myself crazy with this!


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

I'm sorry so many are having issues with their PWs.  It's frustrating, I know.  And maybe it's my eyes, but I've looked and looked for blotches or colors on mine and just don't see them.  Some small shadows at the bottom where the LEDs are, yes, but I barely see those at the setting I use.  So, there could be many reasons why some are satisfied with their PWs.  One reason could be the simplest--there's nothing wrong with the units they have. 

I have confidence in Amazon making things right for those who have problem units.  Keep posting here, we'll commiserate with you.  It's the KindleBoards way...



Betsy


----------



## techiegirl

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I'm sorry so many are having issues with their PWs. It's frustrating, I know. And maybe it's my eyes, but I've looked and looked for blotches or colors on mine and just don't see them. Some small shadows at the bottom where the LEDs are, yes, but I barely see those at the setting I use.
> Betsy


It definitely differs from person to person. I'm on replacement #2 and I see pink tint on mine, but hubby does not.


----------



## BenReem

I did a google search and found this interesting (although i don't know how useful) info on LEDs and greenish cast:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/archive/index.php/t-250994.html

"Yes, some leds are more susceptible to green shift or as some will call it a greenish cast. Leds come in many flavors from low cost mass produced and little if any quality control check to the high output, high efficiency and high CRI varieties along with a large menu of everything between the two extremes. Manufacturers of led light units are there to make money of course and there are really few choices to make as far as the overall plan of attack. They can make them really cheap with a really cheap price offering, better with a mid range price and extra features, good with high output and desirable features along with a decent light quality and finally go all out and make a pro unit designed with light quality/high CRI/ even beam spread/robust build and pro powering options. Most first time buyers of led lights (and this is my opinion) are "had" with the usual overrated specs and are impressed with the multi teeney weenie leds and of course the affordable low price with total disregard to eveness of beam spread, color rendition and build quality. I often hear them say that the greenish cast cam be corrected with a proper white balance or in post editing. True, there are units that have multi small leds with great color qualities without green spikes but be prepared to pay a premium. I have seen led units from the same manufacturer and the same model light exhibit different color casts on side by side comparisons, and those were not models from different dates of manufacture. When leds are manufactured ( the led emitters themselves) they are put in what is called led "binning" categories which denotes their output class, color temperature in chart ansi grid placement, and other photometric classification based on design parameters. If led emitters come from the same batch and bin, well you have a match array or group of leds that will perform in a very identical manner. Most affordable led light units out there do not have that strict tightness of quality control and therefore production units vary in color and performance as the leds come from not only different batch production but from different sources as well. A led emitter manufacturing company that produces millions if not billions of tiny leds has a huge surplus of greenish cast ones will eventually source them out for a dime a dozen to be eventually used in them el cheapo units to "it's too good to be true price" buyers."


----------



## northofdivision

BenReem said:


> Manufacturers of led light units are there to make money of course and there are really few choices to make as far as the overall plan of attack. They can make them really cheap with a really cheap price offering, better with a mid range price and extra features, good with high output and desirable features along with a decent light quality and finally go all out and make a pro unit designed with light quality/high CRI/ even beam spread/robust build and pro powering options. Most first time buyers of led lights (and this is my opinion) are "had" with the usual overrated specs and are impressed with the multi teeney weenie leds and of course the affordable low price with total disregard to eveness of beam spread, color rendition and build quality. I often hear them say that the greenish cast cam be corrected with a proper white balance or in post editing. True, there are units that have multi small leds with great color qualities without green spikes but be prepared to pay a premium. I have seen led units from the same manufacturer and the same model light exhibit different color casts on side by side comparisons, and those were not models from different dates of manufacture. When leds are manufactured ( the led emitters themselves) they are put in what is called led "binning" categories which denotes their output class, color temperature in chart ansi grid placement, and other photometric classification based on design parameters. If led emitters come from the same batch and bin, well you have a match array or group of leds that will perform in a very identical manner. Most affordable led light units out there do not have that strict tightness of quality control and therefore production units vary in color and performance as the leds come from not only different batch production but from different sources as well. A led emitter manufacturing company that produces millions if not billions of tiny leds has a huge surplus of greenish cast ones will eventually source them out for a dime a dozen to be eventually used in them el cheapo units to "it's too good to be true price" buyers."


very nice. that makes a lot of sense.


----------



## Sage

I'm also in "ownership limbo".  When my KPW first arrived, it looked good.  Except for the shadows from the LEDs at the bottom (of which the right one was brighter than the others), my screen had a nice uniformly white shade all over.  Then after using it for several days, the screen developed a definite blue tinge in the form of blotches or "clouds" that start about middle left and go up towards the top right of the device.  

After reading about so many members getting defective ones, I'm hesitant to call Amazon and request a replacement.  I'm thinking maybe I should wait till near the end of the 30 days to see if the issues get sorted out by then.  In the meantime, I really want to love this kindle but it's hard to "bond" with it because I don't know if I can live with it or not.  I've owned every previous generation and this is the first time I've considered sending a kindle back or asking for a replacement because of a defect.  While I'm confident Amazon will continue to offer excellent customer service, I feel like the Kindle Paperwhite launch has been a disappointment for many.


----------



## Kathy

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I'm sorry so many are having issues with their PWs. It's frustrating, I know. And maybe it's my eyes, but I've looked and looked for blotches or colors on mine and just don't see them. Some small shadows at the bottom where the LEDs are, yes, but I barely see those at the setting I use. So, there could be many reasons why some are satisfied with their PWs. One reason could be the simplest--there's nothing wrong with the units they have.
> 
> I have confidence in Amazon making things right for those who have problem units. Keep posting here, we'll commiserate with you. It's the KindleBoards way...
> 
> 
> 
> Betsy


I agree. I have no color of any kind on mine and I certainly wouldn't want to keep it if I did. I persistent and would keep trying.


----------



## Pushka

I just hope that you all do get a ppw without any colouring eventually, because when you do, you will love it. OK, so the bottom shadowing is always going to be there, but the experience of reading on an otherwise perfect ppw is a joy.


----------



## NogDog

I'm sort of torn right now, in that I have the issue where the touch screen malfunctions when the charging/USB cord is plugged in yet works fine otherwise, and the screen is just fine. (Yes, it has the bottom-of-the-screen blotchiness that they all do, and even Amazon admits.) Since I normally don't need to ever read with the cord plugged in (unless I'm really remiss about ever plugging it in when not reading), right now I'm leaning toward sticking with what is otherwise a very pleasing user experience rather than risking getting a replacement with any actual screen defect.


----------



## Broadus

Frankly, I don't know if mine is as it should be or not. It doesn't have the obvious tell-tale signs such as blue or pink colors. There are the typical bright and "shadowy" areas at the bottom, and the bright "lamps" from the LEDs extend diagonally about 20% up from the bottom. Above that is not quite "white" at full brightness in a decently-lit room. Rather, it is a little "dingy."  As a matter of fact, the "shadows" at the bottom are really not what's different in the display. It's the brightness from the lights that's different from the rest of the display. My descriptive words are probably less-than-completely helpful at communicating what I'm seeing, but I doubt that my iPhone camera would be particularly helpful.

Nevertheless, when the light setting is fairly appropriate for the general lighting in the room, as in no brighter than necessary to read easily, the display looks fairly evenly-lit. The "dinginess" is fairly even. This makes me wonder if what I have is about as good as the technology gets at present.

Having re-read my post, I'm sure this is as clear as mud.


----------



## CAR

NogDog said:


> I'm sort of torn right now, in that I have the issue where the touch screen malfunctions when the charging/USB cord is plugged in yet works fine otherwise, and the screen is just fine. (Yes, it has the bottom-of-the-screen blotchiness that they all do, and even Amazon admits.) Since I normally don't need to ever read with the cord plugged in (unless I'm really remiss about ever plugging it in when not reading), right now I'm leaning toward sticking with what is otherwise a very pleasing user experience rather than risking getting a replacement with any actual screen defect.


I was wondering how it worked out for you NogDog. Glad to hear your screen is good. Have you tried one of those Amazon fast chargers or maybe a filtered cord might help.


----------



## TraumaDoll

Broadus said:


> My descriptive words are probably less-than-completely helpful at communicating what I'm seeing, but I doubt that my iPhone camera would be particularly helpful.


Actually, doing the following results in a pretty good image in terms of capturing the possible blotchiness:

1) Make the room slightly darkened (just to make sure your PW screen is not being obviously lit by an external source--this won't work in bright light or sunlight).

2) Set your PW to light level 24.

3) Snap a pic with your iPhone with flash off.

There's a big downside to this--it seems like there are people who can see the pink and green hues, and people (lucky people) who can't. It's entirely possible you'll post pics and then some of us will be saying 'yep, pink and green/blue', and if you haven't formerly noticed it, it could start making you crazy trying to see it.  (I haven't seen a unit photographed with the EXACT steps above that doesn't have pink and green/blue, but it doesn't give me much pleasure to say that--I keep hoping I'll see one that doesn't have it, so I can go ahead and try for replacement #2.)


----------



## Emily King

NogDog said:


> I'm sort of torn right now, in that I have the issue where the touch screen malfunctions when the charging/USB cord is plugged in yet works fine otherwise, and the screen is just fine. (Yes, it has the bottom-of-the-screen blotchiness that they all do, and even Amazon admits.) Since I normally don't need to ever read with the cord plugged in (unless I'm really remiss about ever plugging it in when not reading), right now I'm leaning toward sticking with what is otherwise a very pleasing user experience rather than risking getting a replacement with any actual screen defect.


What kind of weird touch screen things is yours doing? I haven't had any issues with mine until I was on the bike at the gym. It went nutso (the PW, not the bike). When I tried to turn the pages, the graduating A's that you select to change fonts popped up. I couldn't select anything, but when I touch the screen, the font size changed. Couldn't turn the pages at all. As soon as I picked it up off the holder part on the bike, it was fine. I didn't have issues with any other machines at the gym, either.

This is what my screen looks like when I'm in the dark (this is at around 8 or so)... it's white if I crank it way up, but it kills my eyes to crank it up (too much light/contrast).


----------



## sparklemotion

TraumaDoll said:


> I haven't seen a unit photographed with the EXACT steps above that doesn't have pink and green/blue


Same here, TD. I have now seen 8 or more people post pics and say they don't have the color blobs, only to easily spot them myself. 
I keep hoping to see one that actually doesn't have it too. Maybe I'd try for yet another replacement then.


----------



## northofdivision

Emily King said:


> What kind of weird touch screen things is yours doing? I haven't had any issues with mine until I was on the bike at the gym. It went nutso (the PW, not the bike). When I tried to turn the pages, the graduating A's that you select to change fonts popped up. I couldn't select anything, but when I touch the screen, the font size changed. Couldn't turn the pages at all. As soon as I picked it up off the holder part on the bike, it was fine. I didn't have issues with any other machines at the gym, either.
> 
> This is what my screen looks like when I'm in the dark (this is at around 8 or so)... it's white if I crank it way up, but it kills my eyes to crank it up (too much light/contrast).


Wow. To me, I see a lot of pink and discoloration in that pic. Others? Sorry about the bad luck, Emily


----------



## Broadus

TraumaDoll said:


> Actually, doing the following results in a pretty good image in terms of capturing the possible blotchiness:
> 
> 1) Make the room slightly darkened (just to make sure your PW screen is not being obviously lit by an external source--this won't work in bright light or sunlight).
> 
> 2) Set your PW to light level 24.
> 
> 3) Snap a pic with your iPhone with flash off.
> 
> There's a big downside to this--it seems like there are people who can see the pink and green hues, and people (lucky people) who can't. It's entirely possible you'll post pics and then some of us will be saying 'yep, pink and green/blue', and if you haven't formerly noticed it, it could start making you crazy trying to see it.  (I haven't seen a unit photographed with the EXACT steps above that doesn't have pink and green/blue, but it doesn't give me much pleasure to say that--I keep hoping I'll see one that doesn't have it, so I can go ahead and try for replacement #2.)


Thanks for the instructions. Here you go:

















Looks like we have pink and blue going on, unless I'm starting to look for what I had only very faintly noticed before. Is the pink and blue just the physics of the way the light emanates and is photographed? Also, is this really as good as we can expect? This is a long thread and this may have been mentioned. At any rate, such stuff is beyond my expertise.

Cranked up to 24, though, it does look brighter than how it photographs, not as "dingy" looking as the photographs.


----------



## Robbiegirl

Dear paperwhite goddess
This is my first Kindle which I have ordered. I pray you have amazon send me one which is perfect without any blinks,blotches or blips. I will be forever grateful to you. This thread has me concerned.


----------



## northofdivision

Via Gizmodo's post:
http://gizmodo.com/5951428/amazon-admits-that-the-kindle-paperwhite-has-some-problems
Amazon Admits That the Kindle Paperwhite Has Some Problems
Casey Chan
"The Kindle Paperwhite is an awesome, awesome e-reader. But it's not without problems! Users have been complaining about uneven lighting in the Paperwhite and other issues and it's gotten so loud that Amazon has decided to respond."

The pictures they posted look pretty darn good to me. If i can get my hands on one that looks like the one they're putting pictures up on, i'll be very happy. I can live without text to speech if i had a screen like the one they're showing. 2gb storage. plenty. Responsive, quick, great screen texture. I feel it's somewhat peculiar that they put the lighting issue sandwiched between two issues that i haven't heard much complaints about on threads and boards. Customer control maybe?


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

People here have commented and some have complained about the lack of TTS.  And storage space is a constant complaint ever since they removed the SD card from the first Kindle.  I don't see either of those as "problems" since they are done by design though I'm sure Amazon gets complaints about them.  So it doesn't seem quite right to me that the screen issue is paired with them. 

Betsy


----------



## TraumaDoll

Broadus said:


> Looks like we have pink and blue going on, unless I'm starting to look for what I had only very faintly noticed before. Is the pink and blue just the physics of the way the light emanates and is photographed? Also, is this really as good as we can expect? This is a long thread and this may have been mentioned. At any rate, such stuff is beyond my expertise.
> 
> Cranked up to 24, though, it does look brighter than how it photographs, not as "dingy" looking as the photographs.


I don't really know the technical explanation. Someone posted a photo of a 'defective' Kobo Glo that had almost the identical pattern of pink and green/blue, but apparently (hard to say, not a lot of units sold yet, none in US) it's not as common with the Kobo Glo--they said that unit was an outlier. So yes, I think it has something to do with the embedded LED tech that both products have in common, but my (nonscientific) theory is also that something went wrong with trying to keep the manufacturing cost of these units so cheap. It's possible that Amazon's entire first couple of months of production just had a major component or assembly QC issue.

Is it as good as we can expect? Despite their owner's claims, I've never seen an actually 'white' unit when photographed with the steps above. (The only reason I mention those steps is that with MY pink green unit, that showed most clearly exactly what I saw *in real life*.) So this week at least, yes, I think it's the best we can expect. A lot of us are still waiting/hoping to see pics of someone getting a good unit.



> People here have commented and some have complained about the lack of TTS. And storage space is a constant complaint ever since they removed the SD card from the first Kindle. I don't see either of those as "problems" since they are done by design though I'm sure Amazon gets complaints about them. So it doesn't seem quite right to me that the screen issue is paired with them.


I'm 100% sure that Amazon picked those specific issues to address because they are driving the majority of 1- and 2-star reviews that are bringing the PW's overall rating on amazon.com down so low. You guys are seeing those of us with screen issues make a lot of noise online because we WANT a good screen (and we keep hanging around hoping to get one), but for every screen-related review there are plenty of people who didn't read the specs and are review-bombing Amazon about the lack of TTS or storage. Amazon can't do anything for those people except try to do damage control. (I don't sympathize with people who didn't read the specs, FWIW.)


----------



## mooshie78

http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html/ref=amb_link_365798002_1?ie=UTF8&docId=1000841001&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-1&pf_rd_r=08J7FB0445MF318Q6D27&pf_rd_t=1401&pf_rd_p=1404805882&pf_rd_i=1000841011

Sorry if already posted in this thread, but just saw this in another thread. Amazon posted some more realistic pics of what the screen looks like in different lighting conditions.

This is exactly how my screen looks--not really any noticeable shadows at the bottom in bright lighting, some in dimmer lighting or darkness, but not other blotches/color patches (that my eyes can see).

o those with defective units can look at these Amazon pics--if those don't look good to you, then probably time to give up on PW. If they do look good, take heart that some of us got lucky and got screens that look just like those pics.


----------



## sparklemotion

Broadus said:


> Thanks for the instructions. Here you go:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like we have pink and blue going on, unless I'm starting to look for what I had only very faintly noticed before. Is the pink and blue just the physics of the way the light emanates and is photographed? Also, is this really as good as we can expect? This is a long thread and this may have been mentioned. At any rate, such stuff is beyond my expertise.
> 
> Cranked up to 24, though, it does look brighter than how it photographs, not as "dingy" looking as the photographs.


Thanks for the pics, Broadus. Yes, lots of pink and blue going on, which shouldn't be happening. We can only hope Amazon fixes this in the next hardware update.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

I think Amazon is surprised that somany people want the TTS. I wonderwhenthay are going to put in room for a storage card since every other ereader has one.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

MamaProfCrash said:


> I wonderwhenthay are going to put in room for a storage card since every other ereader has one.


I doubt they will. They made the decision to REMOVE it after the 1st generation Kindle. And their argument is that everything is instantly availlable on the cloud anyway.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

But when the Nook, Kobo, and Sony has one and people are annoyed there isn't one they might change their mind. I doubt it but it is a possibility.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

MamaProfCrash said:


> But when the Nook, Kobo, and Sony has one and people are annoyed there isn't one they might change their mind. I doubt it but it is a possibility.


Yeah, but people have been 'annoyed' since February of 2009 when the 2nd gen Kindle was released. And there have been a half dozen models released since -- not counting the 3G or not options.


----------



## mooshie78

Yeah, memory card spots aren't coming back.

Things are moving to cloud storage in general, and Amazon is one of the biggest proponents of that movement.


----------



## sjc

NogDog said:


> I'm sort of torn right now, in that I have the issue where the touch screen malfunctions when the charging/USB cord is plugged in yet works fine otherwise, and the screen is just fine. (Yes, it has the bottom-of-the-screen blotchiness that they all do, and even Amazon admits.) Since I normally don't need to ever read with the cord plugged in (unless I'm really remiss about ever plugging it in when not reading), right now I'm leaning toward sticking with what is otherwise a very pleasing user experience rather than risking getting a replacement with any actual screen defect.


NogDog: I agree with you. I would keep what is mostly good for fear of inheriting a unit with issues.

TO ALL: I have read all posts re: PW. I backed out of my order and am waiting for things to be resolved. I will then order; as I am in no hurry...My K3 is fine for now. Yes, I do find the lighted cover annoying. HOWEVER, I do sympathize with those having problems with their PW and want to assure you that AMAZON is very reputable; just be patient. I'm certain that this will be resolved; as Amazon does pride themselves on customer satisfaction. They have never failed me as far as CS goes. Patience and...Best of luck.


----------



## northofdivision

Ann in Arlington said:


> Yeah, but people have been 'annoyed' since February of 2009 when the 2nd gen Kindle was released. And there have been a half dozen models released since -- not counting the 3G or not options.


If any of you really want tts and like that feature, just download the app "pocket"...its free on both iphone and androids and the text to speech is pretty remarkable and non robot sounding (even british accents if you like). its a nice workaround if you like that feature for articles (you can also use calibre to convert mobi to epub). I'm ok without it on my kindle. All that matters to me is a good screen.


----------



## PinkKindle

Judging by the pics others are posting in this thread, I think mine really looks like everyone else's -- I think they all have the pink/blue and it may have to do with our individual eyes and color perception as to how much we each see it. I am glad that I got my first replacement, because the original PW I had was worse and also had a diagonal white line in the top left corner that I DON'T see on other PWs pictured (or on my replacement), but I honestly don't think I'm going to get anything better than I have right now regarding the pink/blue at this point.

I'm not mad at Amazon or anything like that. I'm definitely NOT going to give up on the PW -- I think it's a fantastic Kindle!!  I think even with the pink/blue it's very readable and better than booklights, and I think the touchscreen on it is fantastic. But as far as another replacement, I think I just need to wait and see what Amazon does about the pink/blue problem going forward. It might take a couple of months, but this is Amazon -- they will do something to make it right! 

At this point I think I probably need to put a skin on it, set up my collections, and just start enjoying my new Kindle. Well, at least until I change my mind again . . .


----------



## NogDog

Emily King said:


> What kind of weird touch screen things is yours doing? I haven't had any issues with mine until I was on the bike at the gym. It went nutso (the PW, not the bike). When I tried to turn the pages, the graduating A's that you select to change fonts popped up. I couldn't select anything, but when I touch the screen, the font size changed. Couldn't turn the pages at all. As soon as I picked it up off the holder part on the bike, it was fine. I didn't have issues with any other machines at the gym, either....


That's pretty much the same as the problem I have if I plug it in to charge while reading.


----------



## WilliamG

Well, I'm going to go as far as to say that the Paperwhite is simply not even CLOSE to the device Amazon advertises.

First, the "print" on the Paperwhite doesn't even come close to that of the Kindle Touch. It's obvious there's a layer above the Paperwhite display for the capacitive touchscreen, and it simply fades the text and makes it look decidedly UN-book-like.

I took a few photos since pictures, in this case, can contain many words (literally, and figuratively).

You can clearly see that the Kindle Touch has the better book-like text. It's a night/day difference, and the Touch is much easier on the eyes.










Second, as both images show, the uniformity of the screen is a huge distraction. I'm not even talking about the ridiculous stage-lighting at the bottom. Look at the hues!










So while the lighting may not be even on the Kindle Touch, it was never even reading a REAL BOOK, so the "authenticity" is intact. With the Paperwhite, I'm oh-so acutely aware that I'm reading using technology that wasn't ready for release.

It will frustrate me when people inevitably reply, "I don't see any color casts on your screen. You're just crazy," but there's not much I can do about that I suppose. I say we should be holding Amazon to a higher standard, especially since they spent so many years "perfecting" this. THIS is the result of years of R&D? Someone should be fired.

These will be the first Kindles my wife and I have ever sent back (two replacements for the defective two had the same issue). I've owned every single Kindle release (and the Sony Reader PRS-500 before it), so I'm sad that this wasn't meant to be this time.


----------



## BenReem

WilliamG, your post may have pushed me to take my KT off ebay and keep it. The difference is astounding and I'm a little shocked.


----------



## WilliamG

BenReem said:


> WilliamG, your post may have pushed me to take my KT off ebay and keep it. The difference is astounding and I'm a little shocked.


BenReem I was in the same boat as you. I was this close to selling my wife's and my Kindle Touch devices before the Paperwhites came out. After all, while not perfect, I've really enjoyed upgrading my Kindles. This is the first generation of Kindles that is a massive disappointment. Even Amazon's press photos are doctored by "cooling" off the color temperature to hide the pinkish hues. You'll note their "announcement" page here.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html/ref=amb_link_365798002_1?ie=UTF8&docId=1000841001&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-1&pf_rd_r=08J7FB0445MF318Q6D27&pf_rd_t=1401&pf_rd_p=1404805882&pf_rd_i=1000841011&tag=vglnk-c1533-20

Look at the dark-room pictures Amazon posted (where it's easiest to see the different hues). They cooled off the color temperature which has given the page a distinctive green look to hide the reddish hues that are doubtless present in the device in the photos. (In the daytime you don't notice the different hues as the ambient light overpowers the LEDs in the Paperwhites so there was no need to Photoshop those images).

Here's a 3-second modification to one of my photos that shows what Amazon did to hide the pink:

Original:










3-second modification:










Looks strikingly similar to what Amazon has likely doctored, right?










^ ^ Nobody's Paperwhite looks like that in the dark, because quite simply it appears to be doctored. Even with their doctoring you can tell the different casts of color in Amazon's images. It's impossible to hide completely.

Shame on Amazon. Shame.


----------



## sparklemotion

WilliamG said:


> It will frustrate me when people inevitably reply, "I don't see any color casts on your screen. You're just crazy," but there's not much I can do about that I suppose. I say we should be holding Amazon to a higher standard, especially since they spent so many years "perfecting" this. THIS is the result of years of R&D? Someone should be fired.
> 
> These will be the first Kindles my wife and I have ever sent back (two replacements for the defective two had the same issue). I've owned every single Kindle release (and the Sony Reader PRS-500 before it), so I'm sad that this wasn't meant to be this time.


I understand your frustration and disappointment, William. It really is a shame.  I'm one who believes they all suffer from the color hue issue, some people just don't see it. Hopefully the next Paperwhite will be the PW we were hoping for.


----------



## Kathy

I have both the Touch and the PaperWhite. I took them both to work this morning and everyone liked the PaperWhite over the Touch. I had taken the Touch to sell at work and wound up convincing them to buy the PaperWhite. That doesn't mean that you have a good one but I wouldn't give up.


----------



## WilliamG

Kathy said:


> I have both the Touch and the PaperWhite. I took them both to work this morning and everyone liked the PaperWhite over the Touch. I had taken the Touch to sell at work and wound up convincing them to buy the PaperWhite. That doesn't mean that you have a good one but I wouldn't give up.


Yep, at work, in perfect lighting, I might pick the Paperwhite, too. They may change their mind when they get into bed and read in dim light. Or, like many people, they just won't care. 

I updated my post a few posts up to reflect my findings, so curious as to what others think (aside from my being crazy etc).


----------



## CAR

WilliamG said:


> Yep, at work, in perfect lighting, I might pick the Paperwhite, too. They may change their mind when they get into bed and read in dim light. Or, like many people, they just won't care.


Not everyone has a bad PW. It's not the users fault that they got a good one and like it.


----------



## mooshie78

Blatant defects aside, it really just comes down to each person's eyes, what they see, what bothers them or not etc. in determining whether they'll like the Paperwhite or not.

My unit looks like the newer Amazon pictures, and the doctored ones posted above, to my eyes.  If there are colored hues or blotches other than the shadows on the bottom above the lights on my unit, my eyes can't see them.  And it could well be that others could see it, as I"m not great with subtle shades due to having some mild color blindness (can distinguish most colors, just struggle with close shades and can't see very many of the numbers in the dot pattern tests).

In an case, mine looks great to my eyes.  As someone who reads in dim lighting and actually loves back lit screens (just find my iPad to bulky for novel reading), it's the best Kindle I've had (and I've had all but the K4 and KT) as it's the most readable and best looking to my eyes.

I hate that some people aren't liking there PWs, but there are still the old models thankfully, and the $69 model, for people who don't like it.  Hopefully the next revision will get the light more uniform and looking white to everyone's eyes so all Kindlers can enjoy the lit screen.


----------



## Tatiana

> WilliamG on Today at 08:52:39 PM
> Yep, at work, in perfect lighting, I might pick the Paperwhite, too. They may change their mind when they get into bed and read in dim light. Or, like many people, they just won't care. Sad





CAR said:


> Not everyone has a bad PW. It's not the users fault that they got a good one and like it.


My PW has a bluish tinge to the screen in total darkness with the light on 18 or above. Everything else works perfectly (except importing my KT collections which is now a moot point). I'm extremely happy with my PW and don't have any desire to ask for a replacement because of the bluishness of the screen.

Personally, it doesn't bother me at all after the first 10 seconds of reading when I become totally engrossed in the book. So many other things could be wrong and the touch screen is so much better than my KT that the slight color to the screen is minor to me. Many people will think I am ridiculous or foolish to accept this PW, so be it, it's MY eReader and MY choice..

This attitude is just ME and not everyone is able to accept a device with some flaws and that is fine for them. *Each PW owner has to do what they feels is best for them.* Many may not understand why another person is unhappy with their PW, but that should be of little consequence to the owner of the imperfect PW. Each person has the right to keep, replace or return their device as they see fit or until they are satisfied with their PW without having to justify their decision to anyone (or criticize anyone who chooses to accept the flaws).

[Stepping quietly off my small soapbox now.  ]


----------



## CAR

Tatiana said:


> My PW has a bluish tinge to the screen in total darkness with the light on 18 or above. Everything else works perfectly (except importing my KT collections which is now a moot point). I'm extremely happy with my PW and don't have any desire to ask for a replacement because of the bluishness of the screen.
> 
> Personally, it doesn't bother me at all after the first 10 seconds of reading when I become totally engrossed in the book. So many other things could be wrong and the touch screen is so much better than my KT that the slight color to the screen is minor to me. Many people will think I am ridiculous or foolish to accept this PW, so be it, it's MY eReader and MY choice..
> 
> This attitude is just ME and not everyone is able to accept a device with some flaws and that is fine for them. *Each PW owner has to do what they feels is best for them.* Many may not understand why another person is unhappy with their PW, but that should be of little consequence to the owner of the imperfect PW. Each person has the right to keep, replace or return their device as they see fit or until they are satisfied with their PW without having to justify their decision to anyone (or criticize anyone who chooses to accept the flaws).
> 
> [Stepping quietly off my small soapbox now.  ]


Very Good post Tatiana, Agree with you completely.


----------



## Kathy

WilliamG said:


> Yep, at work, in perfect lighting, I might pick the Paperwhite, too. They may change their mind when they get into bed and read in dim light. Or, like many people, they just won't care.
> 
> I updated my post a few posts up to reflect my findings, so curious as to what others think (aside from my being crazy etc).


I actually took the PW into a conference room with all the lights out, so it wasn't in perfect lighting. We also looked at it in good overhead lighting and outside at lunch time. I'm not saying yours doesn't have a problem just that mine doesn't. I went through 4 K2s with the sun fade issue so I know there can be issues.


----------



## WilliamG

Kathy said:


> I actually took the PW into a conference room with all the lights out, so it wasn't in perfect lighting. We also looked at it in good overhead lighting and outside at lunch time. I'm not saying yours doesn't have a problem just that mine doesn't. I went through 4 K2s with the sun fade issue so I know there can be issues.


I'd love to see a photo of your Paperwhite in a dark room. Give me hope, please? 

Heck, anyone who thinks they have a non-hued Paperwhite in a dim/dark room, show it off!


----------



## sparklemotion

WilliamG said:


> I'd love to see a photo of your Paperwhite in a dark room. Give me hope, please?
> 
> Heck, anyone who thinks they have a non-hued Paperwhite in a dim/dark room, show it off!


We did this on another forum and many people who felt their PW's are perfect, well, many of us saw the same color hues in them.

I think it really just depends on the person and how their eyes see it. If it looks fine to someone, that's great, they can enjoy it and I'm happy for them. Every one I have seen has a color hue issue. It's just some people don't see it. Also, some do see it, but don't feel theirs is bad enough to return. I returned my original, due to a glowing speck and color hue issues. I'm keeping my replacement as it's much better, but it's definitely not perfect and still has slight hue issues. I chose to keep it because I prefer using it to using a kindle with a clip on light. It's really just up to the individual and their own experience, but there's no doubt the PW's do have a color hue problem.


----------



## WilliamG

sparklemotion said:


> We did this on another forum and many people who felt their PW's are perfect, well, many of us saw the same color hues in them.
> 
> I think it really just depends on the person and how their eyes see it. If it looks fine to someone, that's great, they can enjoy it and I'm happy for them. Every one I have seen has a color hue issue. It's just some people don't see it. Also, some do see it, but don't feel theirs is bad enough to return. I returned my original, due to a glowing speck and color hue issues. I'm keeping my replacement as it's much better, but it's definitely not perfect and still has slight hue issues. I chose to keep it because I prefer using it to using a kindle with a clip on light. It's really just up to the individual and their own experience, but there's no doubt the PW's do have a color hue problem.


One of mine had a glistening speck in it, too. Drove me bonkers. It looked like a piece of dust that was on top of the screen, but it must have been in between the touch layer and the e-ink.


----------



## TraumaDoll

WilliamG, I can even see the pink on your screen while browsing on my older/small MacBook, which typically makes the PW user screenshots look okay (I don't normally bother commenting on anyone's images until I see them on another screen besides this one).

(Pretty sure some user pics on other forums have been desaturated by the posters, but that's neither here nor there.) I'm not sure why some people who are happy with their units are seemingly obsessed with telling those of us with problems that we're wrong. It's not like Amazon is going to go out of business over this, and I still order tons of stuff from them every week.

Speaking of: the SO's PW will arrive on Friday, so I'll have another fresh unit to look at / post pics of then, my first new one since my initial two bad (color blob) units. I'll post an update then. (He thinks he'll be fine even with color blobs, but he's asked me not to mention if I can see them, and I'm of course going to respect that, but it'll affect whether I try for another replacement or go for a final refund.)


----------



## Kathy

WilliamG said:


> I'd love to see a photo of your Paperwhite in a dark room. Give me hope, please?
> 
> Heck, anyone who thinks they have a non-hued Paperwhite in a dim/dark room, show it off!


Trying to get a picture that represents what you see is really hard. I've looked at some that have the color hue but I just don't see it on mine at all. I have shadows in the bottom but they are only on the very bottom in a dark room. I'm very picky with my electronics, iPad, iPhone and Kindle. Believe me if I saw a problem I would send it back. I sent 4 back before I got a good one. I'm sure there will be a new release next year. It improves with every release. If you are sure you can't enjoy it then I would wait until later. I feel,your pain and I'm not trying to minimize your issue just stating my observation with today's experience at my office. Heck I had 2 people that wanted to buy my Touch and changed their minds.


----------



## BenReem

I do have to say, if there are shadows/hues in a very dark room and the light setting is on, say, 20, would amazon even be responsible for that when they clearly say not to use high lighting in dark rooms?


----------



## WilliamG

Kathy said:


> Trying to get a picture that represents what you see is really hard. I've looked at some that have the color hue but I just don't see it on mine at all. I have shadows in the bottom but they are only on the very bottom in a dark room. I'm very picky with my electronics, iPad, iPhone and Kindle. Believe me if I saw a problem I would send it back. I sent 4 back before I got a good one. I'm sure there will be a new release next year. It improves with every release. If you are sure you can't enjoy it then I would wait until later. I feel,your pain and I'm not trying to minimize your issue just stating my observation with today's experience at my office. Heck I had 2 people that wanted to buy my Touch and changed their minds.


Fair enough, and I appreciate the response. 

Part of the issue appears to be Amazon's use of cheaply-sourced LEDs to do the lighting. This would explain the tinges in the screen, which simply aren't there in a bright room with the light set to lowest (why, Amazon, can't you turn the lighting completely off?!). So that part, to me at least, appears to be quality-control related.

The spotlighting issue is a result of the technology, and Amazon simply misled us all with its marketing materials. Phooey, I say. They're not getting my money this year (not that they care since they make the money from the content, not the hardware, hah!).


----------



## Robbiegirl

WilliamG, I am afraid..very afraid.  I can always send it back if I don't like it.


----------



## stevene9

sparklemotion said:


> I understand your frustration and disappointment, William. It really is a shame.  I'm one who believes they all suffer from the color hue issue, some people just don't see it. Hopefully the next Paperwhite will be the PW we were hoping for.


I am color intensity blind, which means that I can only see colors if they are in big blotches or have a very strong light on them. I haven't gotten my PW yet, but this could be the first time in my life when my deficiency may come in handy.

Steve


----------



## northofdivision

WilliamG... That pic you posted has the exact problem of my replacement though yours has a much bigger pink splotch on the top right and bottom right. Glad you returned it.  My original pw was like a rainbow of pink splotches. The cheap leds is a good explanation. It's so much nicer reading without a clip on light but i can't quite settle in with two my pink splotches. Giving it another week or two (only talking about viewing in the dark. During the day or in lit rooms, it's very clean. I will say that I agree with whoever made that comment about noticing the layers. In the day dust will fall on the screen and that's when I'll notice its distance from the font unlike my k4. Such is the trade off. Does look pretty darn good though for  having two layers in the way).. Pinkkindle, you still standing pat for awhile? Stevene9, that's awesome. Let us know. Very jealous if that holds true.


----------



## mooshie78

I don't think anyone is trying to tell those who can't get a unit that they like that they're wrong.  It sucks that some people can't find a PW they're happy with, and all that matters is whether each individual is happy with the screen(s) they get or not.

It's just that some of us do have units we're happy with.  Whether it's because there are some units that don't have color tint problems or shadows/blotches beyond the bottom, or whether some of us just can't see the color tinting is anyone's guess.  But I think it's good to have those voices out there too so that people on the fence about buying one can see both sides of it--that some are perfectly happy with the screen and loving their PW, and that others are seeing screen flaws and can't seem to get one they like.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

mooshie78 said:


> I don't think anyone is trying to tell those who can't get a unit that they like that they're wrong. It sucks that some people can't find a PW they're happy with, and all that matters is whether each individual is happy with the screen(s) they get or not.
> 
> It's just that some of us do have units we're happy with. Whether it's because there are some units that don't have color tint problems or shadows/blotches beyond the bottom, or whether some of us just can't see the color tinting is anyone's guess. But I think it's good to have those voices out there too so that people on the fence about buying one can see both sides of it--that some are perfectly happy with the screen and loving their PW, and that others are seeing screen flaws and can't seem to get one they like.


There is, however, clearly a lot of frustration. On both sides.

Those with units they perceive as defective are feeling defensive because others say they don't see a problem. They feel like they're being told they're too picky and are seeing problems that don't exist.

Those with units they perceive as just fine -- great, even -- are being accused, in some cases, of lying about their device or told their device does have a problem, they're just too blind or stupid to see it.

O.K. Perhaps it's not gotten _quite_ that nasty here. . . .but I am feeling a lot of resentment in the subtext. 

Bottom line -- as many have stated but some still seem to not quite get -- all that really matters, is how do YOU like the device YOU have.


----------



## mooshie78

Yep.  If you like your PW, be happy and enjoy it.  If you don't, send it back.  If you can't get one you like, give up for now.  No reason for anyone to be defensive or attacking others with different views.

It is an interesting question of whether there are some units without problems, or just some people who don't notice them though.  Everyone's eyes are different so it may be that some are more sensitive to color tints/color temperature issues than others and will see them on every unit.

I'm certainly not since I have some mild color blindness issues and I'm just not super picky about things like that in general.  Have used energy efficient light bulbs for years, never had an issue though I know many who don't like the type of light given off.  All my walls are colors (blue, green, orange, brown etc.), so light probably reflects with color on screens and paper in my condo anyway.  I also can't post much on Blu-ray forums as I get annoyed by people nitpicking picture quality rather than discussing the movies etc.  I'm just not a picky person about things like color, picture quality etc.

I'm relatively easy to please and didn't really expect a perfectly evenly lit screen on the PW since I know a backlight is really the only way to achieve complete uniformity--and those aren't possible with opaque e-ink screens (and many would hate it anyway since many get eye strain with backlights). That said, I was surprised how even the lighting was compared to the Nook glow that has a lot more shadow issues.  Between that and not noticing any color tint I've been super pleased with my PW as it's a huge improvement over the ambient shadows I got on my K3 trying to read with the lamps in my house or the clip on light.

But others are very annoyed by shadows and color tint and can't read on it as it distracts them too much.  For those then an older Kindle is going to remain superior until Amazon improves the front lighting so that no one sees any color or shadows.


----------



## BenReem

After reading more about cheap LEDs, i'm convinced the problem is that. I'm thinking if they'd had, say, 6 lights instead of the 4, the spread would be better and the color hues more cancelled out, since from the link I posted a few pages back that seems to be the issue.


----------



## Broadus

I'm in pretty much the same boat as William G (well--I, too, really am a "William G"   ). The longer I've used my Paperwhite, the more it bothered me, especially at night. The "splotches" seem to make the affected fonts a little less dark and the screen sort of smudged. If it were only the bottom "shadows," it would not be an issue. I guess I'm "persnickety plus" when it comes to displays, so I am returning mine today and may wait till next year's update to order again.

If someone is on the fence, I suggest ordering to see for yourself. You may get a great one or may not notice any "problem" which may be there. If you don't like it, you can have it replaced or get a full refund. Amazon's customer service, as noted throughout KB, is typically outstanding.


----------



## DD

Ann in Arlington said:


> There is, however, clearly a lot of frustration. On both sides.
> 
> Those with units they perceive as defective are feeling defensive because others say they don't see a problem. They feel like they're being told they're too picky and are seeing problems that don't exist.
> 
> Those with units they perceive as just fine -- great, even -- are being accused, in some cases, of lying about their device or told their device does have a problem, they're just too blind or stupid to see it.
> 
> O.K. Perhaps it's not gotten _quite_ that nasty here. . . .but I am feeling a lot of resentment in the subtext.
> 
> Bottom line -- as many have stated but some still seem to not quite get -- all that really matters, is how do YOU like the device YOU have.


Well said, Ann. I also felt the undercurrent when I returned this PW and with the K2 when I had so many bad units. So much so, that I stayed away from the KB's for a while because I felt like I was being judged for having an opinion of MY Kindle and deciding to return it. On the whole, though, all my experiences with KB's has been positive and I have learned so much here. We shouldn't judge each other. Each person has their own perception of what 'perfect' is for them.


----------



## BeastMD

I decided to ask for a replacement for mine. The light issue at the bottom screen of course I had just like the rest of the world. However I had more of an issue with inconsistent text. It was much lighter than my touch, and setting refresh to every page didn't seem to help much. Plus I had a few light streaks at the bottom of the screen where there was a brighter light shining through. 

I am really disappointed in Amazon this go round, as they seemed to lie or over exaggerate the evenness of the screen. I also hate that they removed Text to Speech and lowered the storage capacity. Also the PW does not seem to have the same overall build quality that I expect from them.

Anyway, wish you all(and me) luck.


----------



## FearIndex

mooshie78 said:


> But others are very annoyed by shadows and color tint and can't read on it as it distracts them too much. For those then an older Kindle is going to remain superior until Amazon improves the front lighting so that no one sees any color or shadows.


Very good points mooshie78. Even though our experience has been different, I agree with your points.

I have just one thing to add to the quote above. I'm not convinced even a completely even, purely white frontlight would make the Kindle Paperwhite the Kindle of choice for some of us fans of older Kindles and e-ink in general. Because for me, I don't think the slightly uneven light was the main problem, rather than the fact that the screen is lit at all (and has the feeling of a screen with additional layers on top of e-ink). When reading in the dark, a lit screen can be a more taxing experience on the eyes than a light that falls more softly over a larger area (for those who haven't read it, I put my Maglite comparison in my review: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,129852.0.html).

So, it may well be, for some people (like me) who prefer the e-ink way, no frontlight ever will be quite as satisfying as the emulation of paper pure e-ink can give. Okay, maybe "ever" is too big a word to put there, but I'm hoping you guys get the idea. At the moment, personally, I'm hoping they can make e-ink whiter and more contrasty and still have frontlightless versions available in the future (or make the light layer even more invisible and the light switch-offable for those of us who'd rather use some other light).

But I'd have to see that perfect Paperwhite "2" screen first, of course, to really comment.


----------



## Cardinal

Is anybody else having these issues?

I am sorting by Most Recent, and at first my Paperwhite was acting normal:  open a book and it puts it first.  It then stopped doing that, and a book opened didn't jump to the top but stayed where it was.  Toggling through Collections, Authors, Titles and coming back to Most Recent didn't change that, and neither did doing a restart or a reset.  When I deleted a book and redownloaded it, then the Paperwhite went back to normal Most Recent sorting.

When turning a page, it has jumped to the very front of the book.

It has reset on its own.

When I got the Kindle I charged it fully, and exactly one week later it needed to be recharged again.  I estimate, it was used for less than ten hours.  After fully charging it, it was already down a bar with less than one hour of use.


----------



## mooshie78

FearIndex said:


> Very good points mooshie78. Even though our experience has been different, I agree with your points.
> 
> I have just one thing to add to the quote above. I'm not convinced even a completely even, purely white frontlight would make the Kindle Paperwhite the Kindle of choice for some of us fans of older Kindles and e-ink in general. Because for me, I don't think the slightly uneven light was the main problem, rather than the fact that the screen is lit at all (and has the feeling of a screen with additional layers on top of e-ink). When reading in the dark, a lit screen can be a more taxing experience on the eyes than a light that falls more softly over a larger area (for those who haven't read it, I put my Maglite comparison in my review: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,129852.0.html).
> 
> So, it may well be, for some people (like me) who prefer the e-ink way, no frontlight ever will be quite as satisfying as the emulation of paper pure e-ink can give. Okay, maybe "ever" is too big a word to put there, but I'm hoping you guys get the idea. At the moment, personally, I'm hoping they can make e-ink whiter and more contrasty and still have frontlightless versions available in the future (or make the light layer even more invisible and the light switch-offable for those of us who'd rather use some other light).
> 
> But I'd have to see that perfect Paperwhite "2" screen first, of course, to really comment.


Oh definitely. I'm sure that there are plenty of people who'll just never like a lit screen. And that I like them more than most since I don't even mind back lit screens and was always lukewarm on e-ink (mainly loved the small light device, relative to my iPad, and long battery life).

A few years down the road when they get tablets lighter, battery life longer, and perfect screen tech that can switch between an LCD mode and a more paper like (but still lit) reading mode I doubt I'll keep having two devices. As for now, the paperwhite is a great novel reading device--nice lit screen, small and light, long battery life etc.--while my iPad will get used for everything else (other than real work that requires a computer).


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

As for battery use, is the light staying on when asleep?  If so, do a restart:  Menu > Settings > Menu > Restart

Is the time set correctly on the device?  And have you had WiFi on so it can connect with the mothership?

Betsy


----------



## mooshie78

Also, do a search for a nonsense string (like "alfjljlabjl") to check if there are any books that got stuck trying to index.  That's a common culprit of battery problems.  Especially if you get a new Kindle and download a bunch of books to it at once.

I got mine on 10/2, charged it that night and haven't charged it sense.  I'd guess it's around 25-30% remaining based on the battery gauge.  Not sure how much usage time, usually 20-30 minutes a night.  With a few longer days early on when I was playing around with it a lot.


----------



## Cardinal

Betty and Mooshie,

When I charge the battery, wireless is on.  The rest of the time it is off unless I am downloading a book or sample.

I did the jibberish search; everything has indexed.  

I have three samples, seventeen books, and the preloaded Amazon content (welcome letter, dictionaries, user guide).  The books and samples were put on in three sessions.  I had one Collection for the Amazon content, and I just deleted it to see if it makes a difference.

When I'm done reading, I usually turn the Kindle off manually, but I just let it sit there and it turned off after about ten minutes.  The light is completely off.

After every menu restart and hard reset, I've reset the time.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Cardinal, I recommend you contact Kindle CS:

Amazon US customers inside the US: 1-866-321-8851, outside the US: 1-206-266-0927. Other customers, see here.

Betsy


----------



## BenReem

Well, everyone. We received another replacement (i think this is the 4th now? i lost count.). And the screen looked great......


......but the power button doesn't work. The only way to turn it on is to plug it in to a charger.


I'm so disappointed I can't even explain. At this point, we're no longer going to do any exchanges. If amazon comes up with a fix in a month or 2 I will be first in line to ask them to replace our defective device, since we already sold his fire he needs something to read on. Every replacement has been worse than his in some way.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

BenReem said:


> Well, everyone. We received another replacement (i think this is the 4th now? i lost count.). And the screen looked great......
> 
> ......but the power button doesn't work. The only way to turn it on is to plug it in to a charger.
> 
> I'm so disappointed I can't even explain. At this point, we're no longer going to do any exchanges. If amazon comes up with a fix in a month or 2 I will be first in line to ask them to replace our defective device, since we already sold his fire he needs something to read on. Every replacement has been worse than his in some way.


Don't give up. Keep at it. What use is a Kindle where the power button doesn't work?


----------



## NightReader

BenReem said:


> Well, everyone. We received another replacement (i think this is the 4th now? i lost count.). And the screen looked great......
> 
> ......but the power button doesn't work. The only way to turn it on is to plug it in to a charger.
> 
> I'm so disappointed I can't even explain. At this point, we're no longer going to do any exchanges. If amazon comes up with a fix in a month or 2 I will be first in line to ask them to replace our defective device, since we already sold his fire he needs something to read on. Every replacement has been worse than his in some way.


Can you trick it into turning on by using a magnet and making it think it's in the magnetic cover? Just a thought, if you want to keep it a while.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

BenReem said:


> Well, everyone. We received another replacement (i think this is the 4th now? i lost count.). And the screen looked great......
> 
> ......but the power button doesn't work. The only way to turn it on is to plug it in to a charger.
> 
> I'm so disappointed I can't even explain. At this point, we're no longer going to do any exchanges. If amazon comes up with a fix in a month or 2 I will be first in line to ask them to replace our defective device, since we already sold his fire he needs something to read on. Every replacement has been worse than his in some way.


I'd recommend exchanging it now. . . .continue to be firm, but polite. FWIW, a power button that didn't work on a new kindle would be a dealbreaker for me -- and there are a lot of things discussed here that bother folks that wouldn't even begin to be an issue for me.

Further, I don't anticipate any real changes for at least a year. The PW IS the current device and until they upgrade the technology it is what it is. Yes, later 'print runs' might be better quality, but there's no guarantee of that and no way to know how long you should wait. I don't expect Amazon to say, in a couple of months, "The first bunch of these we sold were bad, but buy one now, we've fixed 'em."  A software update is, of course, possible, but that wouldn't fix a power button that doesn't work.

Alternatively, I have heard, from several folks VERY good things about the basic K5 -- the $69 Kindle. Many say it has a superior screen to the K4, as good as the PW but without the integrated light, and it's obviously much less expensive than the PW. You might just return the PW and get the basic for now. Remember if you want a refund you need to do that within 30 days.


----------



## sparklemotion

Cardinal said:


> Is anybody else having these issues?
> 
> I am sorting by Most Recent, and at first my Paperwhite was acting normal: open a book and it puts it first. It then stopped doing that, and a book opened didn't jump to the top but stayed where it was. Toggling through Collections, Authors, Titles and coming back to Most Recent didn't change that, and neither did doing a restart or a reset. When I deleted a book and redownloaded it, then the Paperwhite went back to normal Most Recent sorting.


Yes, that happened to me and it's because the time was wrong from a reset. When you connect to w-fi it fixes it.


----------



## BenReem

Ann in Arlington said:


> I'd recommend exchanging it now. . . .continue to be firm, but polite. FWIW, a power button that didn't work on a new kindle would be a dealbreaker for me -- and there are a lot of things discussed here that bother folks that wouldn't even begin to be an issue for me.
> 
> Further, I don't anticipate any real changes for at least a year. The PW IS the current device and until they upgrade the technology it is what it is. Yes, later 'print runs' might be better quality, but there's no guarantee of that and no way to know how long you should wait. I don't expect Amazon to say, in a couple of months, "The first bunch of these we sold were bad, but buy one now, we've fixed 'em."  A software update is, of course, possible, but that wouldn't fix a power button that doesn't work.
> 
> Alternatively, I have heard, from several folks VERY good things about the basic K5 -- the $69 Kindle. Many say it has a superior screen to the K4, as good as the PW but without the integrated light, and it's obviously much less expensive than the PW. You might just return the PW and get the basic for now. Remember if you want a refund you need to do that within 30 days.


Honestly, I'm starting to feel wary of CS. It feels very awkward contacting them about the 4th kindle replacement. That's 5 defective kindles. I'm starting to feel like they don't even want to deal with my problem. I just want to be done with it and have a functioning kindle!


----------



## Ann in Arlington

BenReem said:


> Honestly, I'm starting to feel wary of CS. It feels very awkward contacting them about the 4th kindle replacement. That's 5 defective kindles. I'm starting to feel like they don't even want to deal with my problem. I just want to be done with it and have a functioning kindle!


Obviously, you need to do what you think is best. Some of the problems you've reported earlier are things that wouldn't have bothered me, but a defective power button definitely would.


----------



## BenReem

My conversation with CS (I'm satisfied. At this point, I just want a rest from it all. We'll deal with our warranty when a fix is available) :

Jose David:Thank you very much for waiting. I apologize for the long delay.

Me:That's okay, thank you for all your help.

Jose David:It seems this issue with the screen on the paperwhite has been reported. We've getting many of those, so I think the best way to go in this case is to send the kindle back for a refund, and then wait a little bit while our technical team is working on those tickets.
If we send you another one, we can't guarantee it won't have any screen issues, so I think the best decision in this case would be to refund the kindle.
I apologize on behalf of the company for this inconvenience you're having with the kindle paperwhite.

Me:Thank you for your input, david. I agree that there is no use in sending another unit.
I will package up this replacement and send it back....however, if we send back the original defective one, my fiance will not have a kindle to read on (we sold his kindle fire when we pre-ordered) so I think we will keep it regardless of the defects and hope that we can take advantage of our warranty if amazon does work out the kinks later. While it is disappointing, it's still better than no kindle at all.

Jose David:Ok. Yes, definitely, the kindle will still be covered by the 1 year warranty, so once the issue is taken care of, we can get you a working unit.

Me:Great. Then that is settled. Thank you very much for your help, David. Would it be okay if I just sent this kindle back using the label I was going to use for the original defective kindle?

Jose David:You're welcome. Yes, that would be fine, you can use that label.

Me:Thank you again.
I will send it back and look forward to a future fix
We love amazon and this does not deter us from purchasing again.

Jose David:Thank you for your understanding.
Have a nice day 

Me:You too!


----------



## sparklemotion

Glad you're satisfied, BenReem. I had a similar discussion with CS and they told me they are well aware of the color hue defect, that they're received a lot of calls about it. I have had other issues as well, my current replacement now has a black speck. Not a glowing one this time, but a black speck. Sigh. Quality control on the PW is abysmal. I'm hoping there will be a hardware update before the year is out. No point in them continuing to send out defective units. I guess we'll see.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

Ben, did yuou end up with a Kindle? It sounds like you might never have returned your original Kindle PW and you are holding on to that.

An alternative could be to return the original PW if it is problematic and pick up one of the $69 jobs for the time being.


----------



## BenReem

MamaProfCrash said:


> Ben, did yuou end up with a Kindle? It sounds like you might never have returned your original Kindle PW and you are holding on to that.
> 
> An alternative could be to return the original PW if it is problematic and pick up one of the $69 jobs for the time being.


We have not yet returned the original defective one, no. Our logic was that we would wait and see what the replacement was like so that we wouldn't wind up with no kindle at all (i've heard of defective replacements before thanks to the folks here at KB). So we will just keep our original defective one, because some pinholes and a slight cast (albeit not anywhere near as bad as some of the others on here) is something we're willing to deal with since the rep agreed we can later get a replacement under the warranty.


----------



## sparklemotion

BenReem said:


> We have not yet returned the original defective one, no. Our logic was that we would wait and see what the replacement was like so that we wouldn't wind up with no kindle at all (i've heard of defective replacements before thanks to the folks here at KB). So we will just keep our original defective one, because some pinholes and a slight cast (albeit not anywhere near as bad as some of the others on here) is something we're willing to deal with since the rep agreed we can later get a replacement under the warranty.


This has been my feeling as well about keeping my PW replacement. The only catch is once you get past the 30 days, your replacement will likely be a refurbished kindle and not a new one.


----------



## larryb52

MamaProfCrash said:


> Ben, did yuou end up with a Kindle? It sounds like you might never have returned your original Kindle PW and you are holding on to that.
> 
> An alternative could be to return the original PW if it is problematic and pick up one of the $69 jobs for the time being.


that's what I did its a very nice screen and is better than last years as I have that one as well & when you compare it you can see its a whiter background and a darker fonts,


----------



## BenReem

sparklemotion said:


> This has been my feeling as well about keeping my PW replacement. The only catch is once you get past the 30 days, your replacement will likely be a refurbished kindle and not a new one.


Refurb vs. New was never something I cared deeply about. As long as it looks new and functions new, I'm happy with it!


----------



## northofdivision

BenReem said:


> Refurb vs. New was never something I cared deeply about. As long as it looks new and functions new, I'm happy with it!


BenReem (haha. 4th replacement. legendary and helpful for those of us with ones we haven't been completely happy with). Thanks for the note about the warranty for the year... Great point. I didn't even think about that... I've been on the fence sending back my PW replacement within 30 days (already sent my original PW back) as day reading is exceptional on it (not enjoyable at night: two big pink splotches on the right side when i'm in the dark which bugs the crap out of me). Night reading was my hope but for now i'm using my K4 with a lighted case at night (which is ok and a better experience for me than the PW) and the PW during the day. I've been hesitant to put on this decal girl black matte skin (which solves all smudge issues - looks amazing on my k4 so i bought one for the pw) and to make collections but now i think i will. Thanks.

LarryB52. Do you have the K4 also? If so, could you tell me your thoughts on the differences since they're the same size and same PPI.


----------



## Cardinal

sparklemotion said:


> Yes, that happened to me and it's because the time was wrong from a reset. When you connect to w-fi it fixes it.


That makes since. It started working correctly when I connected with wifi (to re-download the book).



Betsy the Quilter said:


> Cardinal, I recommend you contact Kindle CS


Betty, I think I am going to wait another week or two and see how it goes.


----------



## larryb52

northofdivision said:


> BenReem (haha. 4th replacement. legendary and helpful for those of us with ones we haven't been completely happy with). Thanks for the note about the warranty for the year... Great point. I didn't even think about that... I've been on the fence sending back my PW replacement within 30 days (already sent my original PW back) as day reading is exceptional on it (not enjoyable at night: two big pink splotches on the right side when i'm in the dark which bugs the crap out of me). Night reading was my hope but for now i'm using my K4 with a lighted case at night (which is ok and a better experience for me than the PW) and the PW during the day. I've been hesitant to put on this decal girl black matte skin (which solves all smudge issues - looks amazing on my k4 so i bought one for the pw) and to make collections but now i think i will. Thanks.
> 
> LarryB52. Do you have the K4 also? If so, could you tell me your thoughts on the differences since they're the same size and same PPI.


i have the k4 & the k5 is vastly better, whiter background & darker fonts & newer fonts, its done very nicely, it looks so good I though one time I had the PW & touched the screen to advance the page  , it's really a nice device, I intend to get another PW but this is not a large expense yet gives you all the pluses of a newer device with an excellent display and is IMO day & night different than k4, I asked my wife what she preferred as I sat the 2 (k4, k5) in front of her & she reads DTB & she chose the k5 for all the above reasons...


----------



## northofdivision

thanks Larry... crap, tempting even though i'm really happy with my k4nt (hacked with fonts and screensavers) and find the smaller size makes a difference caseless.. sadly, I don't think i can justify owning all three (pw, 79$ k4 nt and the newest basic). Keeping my slightly blotchy PW and use it on 10 during the day and starting to enjoy the touch (ironically don't use it at night)..new basic kindle being solid is good to know... knee deep in newtoysyndrome. #middleclassproblems

"don't forget about me. my light is still good and tender." -Ms. Bedside Lamplight


----------



## katy32

I'm finally getting a pw next week (supposedly) I hope it works when it comes, but this thread is making me nervous


----------



## BeastMD

Well this is fun, I requested a replacement kindle due to some light/inconsistent text issues with my PW. It was supposed to show up yesterday and was "out for delivery" all night. So It still does not arrive today either and it changes to "undeliverable" from my cell phone. I check the status from my computer and it says that it was stolen. Sucks right? Well thats not the half of it. I go to purchase some stuff from amazon and I notice that my giftcard balance is less than half of when I had about $140 dollars in there the other day.. Well whoever the jerk was that stole my kindle went on an absolute spending spree on my account.. 

Hope whoever the thief is rots in hell and enjoys her now hopefully bricked and empty kindle. (I know it was probably a she by the stuff that they bought) Hope she was in the middle of reading in bed when poof it all went away.


----------



## Kathy

BeastMD said:


> Well this is fun, I requested a replacement kindle due to some light/inconsistent text issues with my PW. It was supposed to show up yesterday and was "out for delivery" all night. So It still does not arrive today either and it changes to "undeliverable" from my cell phone. I check the status from my computer and it says that it was stolen. Sucks right? Well thats not the half of it. I go to purchase some stuff from amazon and I notice that my giftcard balance is less than half of when I had about $140 dollars in there the other day.. Well whoever the jerk was that stole my kindle went on an absolute spending spree on my account..
> 
> Hope whoever the thief is rots in hell and enjoys her now hopefully bricked and empty kindle. (I know it was probably a she by the stuff that they bought) Hope she was in the middle of reading in bed when poof it all went away.


I'm surprised they could register it. You have to sign into your account before the registration is final. I thought I could just turn my on and start downloading because I had a serial number on my Manage My Kindle page, but I had to sign into Amazon from my Kindle before it was active. What a nasty thing to have happen.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

Kathy said:


> I'm surprised they could register it. You have to sign into your account before the registration is final. I thought I could just turn my on and start downloading because I had a serial number on my Manage My Kindle page, but I had to sign into Amazon from my Kindle before it was active. What a nasty thing to have happen.


I don't think that's the case. In general, they're registered when they ship. . . that's why there's already a serial number and all listed even before you get it. I didn't have to sign into my Amazon account, just had to connect wirelessly and it completed the registration process.

So, yeah, someone who steals it would have access to your account until it's locked down by Amazon. Fortunately, all the person can do is buy kindle books, but it is annoying. Definitely an argument for marking the device as a gift so it arrives unregistered. A little more trouble when you get it, but at least your GC balance is safe.

Of course, once it's reported stolen -- and Beast, if you've not done that you should, messages notwithstanding -- Amazon will refund that money, I'd expect, so you'd not really lose anything. . . .except that now you have to wait again for delivery of a kindle!


----------



## Atunah

Oh that is horrible BeastMD. 

I didn't have to sign in to my Amazon account on my PW, not on the replacement either. It just asked me if I want to use such and such account, which was my name and you just click on that and you are good to go. 

So if it was out for delivery, did someone steal it off the truck? 

So sorry, but I hope you got your Gift card money back at least.


----------



## BeastMD

Took me a while to explain to CS what I thought happened but they refunded my money(gc).  One more issue is that they also deregistered my currently "defective" PW as well as the stolen device. Oh well. I havent tried to reregister and wont until I get my new device.

Here is what the tracking looked like..

Laurel, MD, United States 
10/18/2012 4:21 P.M.	Damage reported. / Damage claim under investigation.
10/18/2012 4:15 P.M.	Merchandise is missing. UPS will notify the sender with additional details. / All merchandise missing, empty carton was discarded. UPS will notify the sender with details of the damage.
Laurel, MD, United States 
10/17/2012 7:01 A.M.	Out For Delivery
10/17/2012 5:50 A.M.	Arrival Scan
Philadelphia, PA, United States 
10/17/2012 3:30 A.M.	Departure Scan
Philadelphia, PA, United States 
10/16/2012 12:59 P.M.	Arrival Scan
Oakland, CA, United States 
10/16/2012 5:00 A.M.	Departure Scan
10/16/2012 2:19 A.M.	Arrival Scan
Sparks, NV, United States 
10/15/2012 7:20 P.M.	Departure Scan
10/15/2012 3:32 P.M.	Origin Scan
United States 
10/15/2012 4:34 P.M.	Order Processed: Ready for UPS

First purchase on it was the 17th at about 8pm and then a whole bunch of games and books on the 18th. Totaling about $83


----------



## Kathy

Ann in Arlington said:


> I don't think that's the case. In general, they're registered when they ship. . . that's why there's already a serial number and all listed even before you get it. I didn't have to sign into my Amazon account, just had to connect wirelessly and it completed the registration process.


Mine was registered but until I signed into my Amazon account nothing could be downloaded. I was surprised when I turned it on and entered my home wireless that the books didn't start downloading. I had to sign on to Amazon and got a message that registration was now complete.


----------



## Robbiegirl

It came today! I love it. I do see some minimal shading and what appears to be a pinkish hue in spots but it is tolerable.


----------



## sjc

Robbiegirl:  Congrats on getting a keeper.  Enjoy!!


----------



## northofdivision

2nd Kindle Paperwhite replacement received today. This time the pink is all over the left side and a splotch on the middle right (and my first dead pixel at the bottom right). Sadly going to have to concede the hope to find a Paperwhite that works for me (note: 20/20 vision). Unfortunately, gotta face the facts that i own one of those set of eyes that catches the LED flaws of pinks and blues (CS, i have three different PW's all with different light splotches and brightness!!!!) and now with four i've examined thoroughly (3 plus my mothers), its time to give up. BENREEM feel your pain, my friend. Love the implementation, the touch responsiveness, the matte, the grippy back. just not meant to be this generation. Will remain a kindle loyalist (just say no to nooks and kobos. haha) as i will love e-ink till the end. haha. My trusty K4 and the OEM lighted case is gonna have to keep me goin till next september when PW2 comes out. *optimism* Cain's 'Quiet', Murakami "Dance Dance Dance," Eudora Welty Collection and Eugenides on tap...Three kindle PW's in boxes to be shipped back in the morning. Complete and utter envy/jealousy to the many of you who are exceptionally happy with your PW's. In the end, all that matters is we're all reading well. Enjoy, everyone...#kindlefailblues


----------



## BeastMD

After my experience with the stolen in shipping and the quality inconsistencies and my replacement coming in a pretty beat up box I am starting to think that maybe its not meant to be. This one is notably darker than the one I returned and it has a corner that is noticeably brighter than the rest of the screen.. I dont know if I should just buck up and take it or try another. I am really starting to think the PW needed some more development time.


----------



## WilliamG

BeastMD said:


> After my experience with the stolen in shipping and the quality inconsistencies and my replacement coming in a pretty beat up box I am starting to think that maybe its not meant to be. This one is notably darker than the one I returned and it has a corner that is noticeably brighter than the rest of the screen.. I dont know if I should just buck up and take it or try another. I am really starting to think the PW needed some more development time.


I truly believe they're all faulty. As I said earlier in the thread, if you notice the brightness inconsistencies and color blotches/tints, just give up now. There is no Paperwhite out there that doesn't have this issue at the present time.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

WilliamG said:


> I truly believe they're all faulty. As I said earlier in the thread, if you notice the brightness inconsistencies and color blotches/tints, just give up now. There is no Paperwhite out there that doesn't have this issue at the present time.


It seems to me they're not faulty, they're just not what _you_ expected/want to see. That's a shame, but it's not a fault in the device, just a difference in what your eyes perceive. Mine, as far as I'm concerned, is just fine. GREAT, even. I'm thrilled with it. And there are many others here who've said the same thing.

No doubt there are some that are not perfect. . . some of the pictures posted here are discernibly blotchy (though there are others that look just fine to me -- but don't to the people that posted them ). Anyway, that's to be expected with mass production, but it's absolutely not true that they are ALL faulty.


----------



## FearIndex

Ann in Arlington said:


> It seems to me they're not faulty, they're just not what _you_ expected/want to see. That's a shame, but it's not a fault in the device, just a difference in what your eyes perceive. Mine, as far as I'm concerned, is just fine. GREAT, even. I'm thrilled with it. And there are many others here who've said the same thing.
> 
> No doubt there are some that are not perfect. . . some of the pictures posted here are discernibly blotchy (though there are others that look just fine to me -- but don't to the people that posted them ). Anyway, that's to be expected with mass production, but it's absolutely not true that they are ALL faulty.


Asking all you who have long experience on this fine board (as I'm just a noob):

It seems the quality variance is one of the major issues people are reporting: very few if any report seeing the same screen when comparing two PWs, better or worse, they are rarely similar. Brightness, color hue, anomalies are different or located differently. Just about the only constant seems to be the four LEDs and their shadow, but even that seems to vary for people.

Would you guys say the PW has received a normal amount, or less or more of such complaints, compared to past Kindles released and discussed here?


----------



## Ann in Arlington

FearIndex said:


> Would you guys say the PW has received a normal amount, or less or more of such complaints, compared to past Kindles released and discussed here?


I think it's maybe slightly more than the issues reported with the K2 -- the problem with that device was, for some unexplained reason, the image seemed to fade on many screens if it was in extremely bright sunlight. I'm not sure if it was ever determined why -- my hypothesis was that the sunlight heated the screen and caused the problem. Amazon adjusted the manufacturing to include something that seemed to fix the problem.

That said, we have at least 3 or 4 times as many members now as we did when K2 was released -- so it's not really surprising that there are proportionally more reports of dissatisfaction. As is typical, those who are NOT having problems are, for the most part, *not* logging on to tell people the thing works just great -- at least not more than once (many who report problems comment multiple times just by way of normal discussion). . .they're just getting on with reading on it.

So, all things considered, I'd say it's probably about the same.

There were practically NO issues reported with the K3K as I recall -- oh, except on some devices a very small crack occasionally formed on one of the corners of the screen. Didn't affect use of the device at all but it bothered some enough to request replacements.

There were somewhat more for the Touch -- mostly in terms of responsiveness, but also a fair number of folks who just didn't feel the screen was good enough when compared with other non-Touch kindles.


----------



## skyblue

Ann in Arlington said:


> I think it's maybe slightly more than the issues reported with the K2 -- the problem with that device was, for some unexplained reason, the image seemed to fade on many screens if it was in extremely bright sunlight. I'm not sure if it was ever determined why -- my hypothesis was that the sunlight heated the screen and caused the problem. Amazon adjusted the manufacturing to include something that seemed to fix the problem.
> 
> That said, we have at least 3 or 4 times as many members now as we did when K2 was released -- so it's not really surprising that there are proportionally more reports of dissatisfaction. As is typical, those who are NOT having problems are, for the most part, *not* logging on to tell people the thing works just great -- at least not more than once (many who report problems comment multiple times just by way of normal discussion). . .they're just getting on with reading on it.
> 
> So, all things considered, I'd say it's probably about the same.
> 
> There were practically NO issues reported with the K3K as I recall -- oh, except on some devices a very small crack occasionally formed on one of the corners of the screen. Didn't affect use of the device at all but it bothered some enough to request replacements.
> 
> There were somewhat more for the Touch -- mostly in terms of responsiveness, but also a fair number of folks who just didn't feel the screen was good enough when compared with other non-Touch kindles.


Interesting to know! I just wish I could have gotten a Paperwhite from *Jeff Bezo's* private collection.  I'm sure his Paperwhite doesn't have any screen defects.


----------



## FearIndex

Thanks Ann!

skyblue: Had a chuckle at the thought of Jeff Bezos bitching on the Amazon intranet about pink splotches on his PW and Q&A telling him he is imagining things, theirs is just fine.


----------



## larryb52

my new PW develped a pinkish hue and battery problem and its going back this afternoon to Best Buy after work. I'm sort of disappointed in the lack of quality control. You know Apple makes their devices in China as well why is it Amazon has such problems but most Apple issues are software. In retrospect if this was a software issue you could actually go with that till you got a fix but this is hardware & IMO it would be best for version 2. I'm real disappointed that they tried to do a compasitive touch & lighting in this model, maybe best to perfect the touch portion before moving onto lighting & I still have my k5 to read...


----------



## Ann in Arlington

FearIndex said:


> Thanks Ann!
> 
> skyblue: Had a chuckle at the thought of Jeff Bezos bitching on the Amazon intranet about pink splotches on his PW and Q&A telling him he is imagining things, theirs is just fine.


Well I haven't heard that Amazon's approved response to customers expressing concern about the screen is, "It's just your imagination." So that's a bit unfair.

And I don't think that's been the general response here, either. Many of us have devices that are just fine. But we acknowledge that others have issues and encourage you to provide feedback to Amazon ot request a replacement.

Sent from my Kindle Fire HD via tapatalk


----------



## FearIndex

Ann: My apologies. I was trying to fairly parody us all, on all sides of that argument - not that I think there are even sides to it, we all have our wildly different opinions.  But my intent wasn't to be snide.


----------



## mooshie78

There definitely seems to be some QC issues as people with multiple replacements noting problems in different places on the screen etc.  So it's not some standard defect causing the same type of problems in the same part of the screen.  Some are better, and some are worse.

I think mine looks great.  Color tint I can tell, just the shadows at the bottom right above the lights.  But that doesn't mean it's perfect.  My eyes aren't great at seeing subtle color tints, so maybe others complaining about pink hues and what not would see them on mine where my eyes can't.

And I'm just not super picky on such things.  I'm just happy to finally have an e-ink device I can read on without having to have an external light source as the screen is a ton better to my eyes, in the lighting conditions I lead in, than my K1, K2 or K3 were.  Heck, if there had been $200 7" tablets around back when I first got into e-books I'd probably have never gotten into e-ink.  But there wasn't and I got sucked into Kindle and lost any interest in small tablets after getting an iPad and realizing I need the bigger screen for a lot of what I do on a tablet.  So I'm very happy to have an e-ink device where I finally truly like the screen.


----------



## silenceiseverything

I received my PW on Oct. 3 and LOVED it.  Last week, though, I noticed 2 greenish-blue and pink blotches.  So, either my eyes are getting better (or worse) or the blotches just developed seemingly overnight.  I also noticed that the text seems faded in a couple of the "pages".  So, now I don't know whether to get it replaced or just wait for the kinks to be worked out and then request a replacement.  I just don't want to end up with one that's worse than the one I have now.


----------



## mooshie78

You can get a replacement and if it's worse keep the original and send the replacement back (just have to call Amazon and arrange that).  You're not forced to send the original back if the new one is worse.


----------



## vyv

WilliamG said:


> I truly believe they're all faulty. As I said earlier in the thread, if you notice the brightness inconsistencies and color blotches/tints, just give up now. There is no Paperwhite out there that doesn't have this issue at the present time.


Sorry but going to have to agree with WilliamG here. I've seen a lot of pictures of people's "perfect" pw screens on this forum and others and all I see are splotches. I think I'm one of the sensitive ones. I received my PW on Tuesday and I can see very faint splotches of pink/green. It is more noticeable on certain pages of books...(not sure why). But I can see why "older" eyes might not be able to see the splotches because it is pretty faint on this one. I haven't seen one where I do not see a splotch at all unless you count Amazon's original ads. I really hope they figure out whats causing the issue. Whether its because of the manufacturing process of the screen or whether several layers of screens create a rainbow effect, I don't care. I just want them to address it to the public! I'm kinda sad but I'll live. I can still read and thats whats important. Maybe one day everything will be fixed and I can trade it in


----------



## mooshie78

an9el3md said:


> But I can see why "older" eyes might not be able to see the splotches because it is pretty faint on this one.


I'm not sure it's an old eyes thing. I see no splotches on mine and I'm only 33, and while I've always been near sited I don't need reading glasses or anything.

I think some eyes are just more senstive to seeing color hues and some people are just more picky about screen quality etc. I had similar experience with the iPad 2--lots of people complaining about light leakage and I just didn't care as I couldn't notice it unless I tried to see it (i.e. display a dark screen in a dark room). Some people are just more picky and have higher standards for what a perfect screen is. On top of their maybe being some issues with the PW where some people just see color tints and some don't.


----------



## vyv

You're only a couple years older than me.  I used older in quotations meaning its not necessarily old eyes but eyesight that isn't as sharp or sensitive.  Both which can happen when people get older.  Sorry for the confusion and hope I'm not insulting anyone.


----------



## bordercollielady

an9el3md said:


> You're only a couple years older than me. I used older in quotations meaning its not necessarily old eyes but eyesight that isn't as sharp or sensitive. Both which can happen when people get older. Sorry for the confusion and hope I'm not insulting anyone.


This thread is becoming somewhat comical.... I'm one of the oldest ones around here (close to 64) - and I don't think age has anything to do with the screen issues- been reading these threads over the last 3 weeks - and there was a wide variety of ages that noticed or did not notice issues.. If anything - old age makes your eyes more sensitive to light/glare/eyestrain etc..


----------



## CAR

bordercollielady said:


> This thread is becoming somewhat comical.... I'm one of the oldest ones around here (close to 64) - and I don't think age has anything to do with the screen issues- been reading these threads over the last 3 weeks - and there was a wide variety of ages that noticed or did not notice issues.. If anything - old age makes your eyes more sensitive to light/glare/eyestrain etc..


I was going to post the same thing. I am older too hehe. Lets just keep it simple. If you like the device keep it. If you don't like the device return it. And if you think you got a defective device, exchange it or return it 

Sent from my outdated iPad 3.0 using Tapatalk HD


----------



## sparklemotion

skyblue said:


> I just wish I could have gotten a Paperwhite from *Jeff Bezo's* private collection.  I'm sure his Paperwhite doesn't have any screen defects.


I wouldn't be so sure.


----------



## BenReem

CAR said:


> I was going to post the same thing. I am older too hehe. Lets just keep it simple. If you like the device keep it. If you don't like the device return it. And if you think you got a defective device, exchange it or return it
> 
> Sent from my outdated iPad 3.0 using Tapatalk HD


lol, i love the "sent from my outdated ipad 3"


----------



## Kathy

bordercollielady said:


> This thread is becoming somewhat comical.... I'm one of the oldest ones around here (close to 64) - and I don't think age has anything to do with the screen issues- been reading these threads over the last 3 weeks - and there was a wide variety of ages that noticed or did not notice issues.. If anything - old age makes your eyes more sensitive to light/glare/eyestrain etc..


Lol, I just turned 63 and I pay good money to see. These glasses aren't cheap. I'm on my computer at work all day, then on my iPad checking out Kindle Boards and playing games. I switch to the Kindle to relax before going to sleep. If age is keeping me from seeing flaws on my PowerWhite then I'm glad getting older has some advantage.


----------



## WilliamG

Ann in Arlington said:


> It seems to me they're not faulty, they're just not what _you_ expected/want to see. That's a shame, but it's not a fault in the device, just a difference in what your eyes perceive. Mine, as far as I'm concerned, is just fine. GREAT, even. I'm thrilled with it. And there are many others here who've said the same thing.
> 
> No doubt there are some that are not perfect. . . some of the pictures posted here are discernibly blotchy (though there are others that look just fine to me -- but don't to the people that posted them ). Anyway, that's to be expected with mass production, but it's absolutely not true that they are ALL faulty.


See, I say they are all "faulty." Let me rephrase, they all have "faults." It's not perception. It's fact. Just because your eyes don't perceive the issue doesn't mean it's not FACTUALLY there.

In any case, I'm hoping Amazon can do something about the Paperwhites, but my guess is they can't/won't.


----------



## Leslie

WilliamG said:


> See, I say they are all "faulty." Let me rephrase, they all have "faults." It's not perception. It's fact. Just because your eyes don't perceive the issue doesn't mean it's not FACTUALLY there.
> 
> In any case, I'm hoping Amazon can do something about the Paperwhites, but my guess is they can't/won't.


Sorry William, I disagree, on two points.

First off, Amazon seems to be very consumer-centric and does try to make things right. They listen to customer concerns and make changes. In fact, I have just discovered they have implemented a menu so that you can report book problems (typos, etc) right from your Kindle Paperwhite. Does it work with other devices? I don't know. But they have it on the PW.

Your other assertion...my PW doesn't have a fault. It's just fine. Is it perfect? I don't know. But what's perfect? It's perfect to me. So don't claim that 100% of PW are faulty. That's false.

L


----------



## CAR

Leslie said:


> Sorry William, I disagree, on two points.
> 
> First off, Amazon seems to be very consumer-centric and does try to make things right. They listen to customer concerns and make changes. In fact, I have just discovered they have implemented a menu so that you can report book problems (typos, etc) right from your Kindle Paperwhite. Does it work with other devices? I don't know. But they have it on the PW.
> 
> Your other assertion...my PW doesn't have a fault. It's just fine. Is it perfect? I don't know. But what's perfect? It's perfect to me. So don't claim that 100% of PW are faulty. That's false.
> 
> L


I agree my PW is perfect for me. What electronic device is "Perfect" for everyone in all ways?


----------



## Pushka

While I think the statement that they are all flawed is incorrect, at the same time, none of the kindles are as perfect as the ones shown during the announcement with no shadows at the bottom. Having said that, the kindles when they are as good as they can be, are brilliant.


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

I've seen 2 new PWs and both have been different...one very good quality IMO with only minor marquee lighting at the bottom which does not bother me at all...I barely notice when reading.

Then I looked at the display model at Best Buy. I cant say I have reproduced that ambient light quality when testing the work PW, but I've tried a variety of lighting now and havent seen it. But the one at BB definitely had some blotchy pink tinting.

I cannot speak to how long the BB model was on display and if it had developed over time. I can say that the one at work is getting sporadic reading and no issues have come up.

I _am _concerned about quality...I want to buy a PW but until I can feel more confident in the quality of the device (or the ability to try it at the BB store) I wont be purchasing. (And am troubled that some people say that screen issues show up after time).

I know I'd be completely satisfied with a device that is the same quality as the one at work (& have offered to buy it after the pilot! But we will probably donate it and all the other e-reader devices we are piloting).


----------



## Leslie

If it is any comfort, Lursa, I've been using my PW pretty much non-stop since it arrived on Oct 3rd since I have a certain book to finish...LOL. And because of that book, I've been putting my PW through its paces. The screen looks as good today as it did the first minute I opened it. I don't see any changes at all.

L


----------



## skyblue

I was positive the Paperwhite was my "dream Kindle".  However, I was extremely disappointed with the faded text, marquee lighting, and pink and blue splotches on the two Paperwhites I had.  There was distinct variance between the two I had.  I kept trying to "blink away" the issues, but it wasn't my eyes.  I am waiting for either stricter quality control, or a new Paperwhite model.  Until then, I am happily reading on my Kindle Keyboard and Fire HD.  I still love Amazon and the Kindle family, but I am envious of the perfect Paperwhites some of you have received.


----------



## mooshie78

Leslie said:


> If it is any comfort, Lursa, I've been using my PW pretty much non-stop since it arrived on Oct 3rd since I have a certain book to finish...LOL. And because of that book, I've been putting my PW through its paces. The screen looks as good today as it did the first minute I opened it. I don't see any changes at all.
> 
> L


Same here. No changes at all. Uniform lighting other than the shadows at the bottom, no color blotches that I can see.


----------



## Andra

I am enjoying my paperwhite.  I see a bit of the ghosting at the bottom and it sometimes seems to be in the last line of text, but I don't notice any color variations.
Make sure that you contact Amazon to provide feedback on the PW even if you decide that you are not going to purchase or have had issues.  The more emails they get, the more likely they will do something about the issue.


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

WHat I would really like to do is get one at Best Buy, and open it and turn it on there. 

Hey, if they wont let me, I'll do it out in my car and exchange it right then and there!


----------



## mooshie78

Andra said:


> I am enjoying my paperwhite. I see a bit of the ghosting at the bottom and it sometimes seems to be in the last line of text, but I don't notice any color variations.
> Make sure that you contact Amazon to provide feedback on the PW even if you decide that you are not going to purchase or have had issues. The more emails they get, the more likely they will do something about the issue.


Do you have the page refresh option in the settings menu turned on? That will do the full page refresh every page turn instead of every six and should get rid of any ghosting.


----------



## northofdivision

interesting (and hopeful) conversation i had with Amazon CS today to check in that they received my 2nd PW replacement that i returned last week. his exact quote:

"Yeah, we've gotten so many returns over reports of pink and blue lighting problems and we're definitely working on it. In the next few weeks there will be a software update which will be addressing these "splotching issues on the screen" *his words not mine* I recommend you wait a few weeks and try again because like i said, we're putting out a software update to address these issues specifically."

i love that there's been enough noise made that they're working on clearing up the issue *and admittedly, i sure do miss that incredible small font Palatino on the PW* but i'm pretty skeptical how something like LED issues can be addressed through a software update. Bravo to CS regardless. Good reminder why i'm a kindle loyalist


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

northofdivision said:


> interesting (and hopeful) conversation i had with Amazon CS today to check in that they received my 2nd PW replacement that i returned last week. his exact quote:
> 
> "Yeah, we've gotten so many returns over reports of pink and blue lighting problems and we're definitely working on it. In the next few weeks there will be a software update which will be addressing these "splotching issues on the screen" *his words not mine* I recommend you wait a few weeks and try again because like i said, we're putting out a software update to address these issues specifically."
> 
> i love that there's been enough noise made that they're working on clearing up the issue *and admittedly, i sure do miss that incredible small font Palatino on the PW* but i'm pretty skeptical how something like LED issues can be addressed through a software update. Bravo to CS regardless. Good reminder why i'm a kindle loyalist


That doesnt necessarily sound like something a 'software update' can fix, but I'm glad I'm waiting a bit before purchasing a PW (even tho I have seen one very good screen and one with the pink tinting...50-50....not the greatest odds!).


----------



## Cloysterpete

mooshie78 said:


> Do you have the page refresh option in the settings menu turned on? That will do the full page refresh every page turn instead of every six and should get rid of any ghosting.


My refresh thing just does its own thing, It will do a page refresh like one in six or whatever for a while but then it'll go and do thirty refreshes in a row then go back to normal for a bit then do another load of refreshes. I also don't like how the text isn't weighted properly, or some pages I have a line of text that is way bolder than anything else on the screen.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

Part of the wait a few weeks for a firmware fix could be "give us enough time to get models out with better LED or quality control so that the next replacement is a good one".


----------



## sjc

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> WHat I would really like to do is get one at Best Buy, and open it and turn it on there.
> 
> Hey, if they wont let me, I'll do it out in my car and exchange it right then and there!


CAREFUL: Best Buy charges re-stocking fees for electronic returns. Check policy before purchasing.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

sjc said:


> CAREFUL: Best Buy charges re-stocking fees for electronic returns. Check policy before purchasing.


They shouldn't for defective items.


----------



## BenReem

So they're releasing a software update? That would apply to all paperwhites, right? not just to the ones that haven't yet been shipped?


----------



## Ann in Arlington

If Amazon releases an update it will be for all kindles with the base OS. . .so, yes, if it's for the PW it won't ONLY be for ones that haven't yet been sold.

Believe me, you'll hear it here first!


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

sjc said:


> CAREFUL: Best Buy charges re-stocking fees for electronic returns. Check policy before purchasing.


Thank you! As Ann said, hopefully it doesnt apply to defective items but I may have to prove that the funky screen is 'defective.'

OTOH, I also plan to let them know about it before I purchase...about what I've seen and heard about the screens and that I wont buy one if I cant return it easily. If there's any way they'll let me test it in the store, with the agreement that I'll buy it if it's ok, that would be great....but I have my doubts they'll do that.

The one at work lit up great right out of the box, even tho I believe it only had a partial charge. So that would be my expectation.


----------



## sjc

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> Thank you! As Ann said, hopefully it doesnt apply to defective items but I may have to prove that the funky screen is 'defective.'
> 
> OTOH, I also plan to let them know about it before I purchase...about what I've seen and heard about the screens and that I wont buy one if I cant return it easily. If there's any way they'll let me test it in the store, with the agreement that I'll buy it if it's ok, that would be great....but I have my doubts they'll do that.
> 
> The one at work lit up great right out of the box, even tho I believe it only had a partial charge. So that would be my expectation.


Well; that is what I was thinking: They may not see it as defective. Good luck; let us know how you make out.


----------



## WilliamG

Leslie said:


> Sorry William, I disagree, on two points.
> 
> First off, Amazon seems to be very consumer-centric and does try to make things right. They listen to customer concerns and make changes. In fact, I have just discovered they have implemented a menu so that you can report book problems (typos, etc) right from your Kindle Paperwhite. Does it work with other devices? I don't know. But they have it on the PW.
> 
> Your other assertion...my PW doesn't have a fault. It's just fine. Is it perfect? I don't know. But what's perfect? It's perfect to me. So don't claim that 100% of PW are faulty. That's false.
> 
> L


I'll disagree with both your statements. First, Amazon is BUSINESS-centric, with consumers being a LARGE part of that. That said, if only a small minority of people are complaining about the Paperwhite issues, they simply won't get fixed. Amazon says it isn't making any money on the hardware as it is, so you can bet they're not going to spend anymore R&D funding to correct the LED inconsistencies which I believe cause the color casts (even aside from the stage-lighting at the bottom which is due to a flawed design).

Your PW does have a fault. There's no such thing as "perfect to you." It's either completely white as Amazon makes it out to be, or it's not. Just because "you" cannot see its faults does not mean it's not faulty. Am I taking anything away from you by stating this? No. You quite clearly have decided that despite its faults (ones you do or do not perceive) you will continue to use your Paperwhite. Good for you (I mean this sincerely). I wish I could do the same, but those same faults are too glaring to me.

Feel free to post an image of your Paperwhite display if you think my statements are still untrue. I'd be happy to point out the obvious (to me) red and green areas of the display.


----------



## WilliamG

northofdivision said:


> interesting (and hopeful) conversation i had with Amazon CS today to check in that they received my 2nd PW replacement that i returned last week. his exact quote:
> 
> "Yeah, we've gotten so many returns over reports of pink and blue lighting problems and we're definitely working on it. In the next few weeks there will be a software update which will be addressing these "splotching issues on the screen" *his words not mine* I recommend you wait a few weeks and try again because like i said, we're putting out a software update to address these issues specifically."
> 
> i love that there's been enough noise made that they're working on clearing up the issue *and admittedly, i sure do miss that incredible small font Palatino on the PW* but i'm pretty skeptical how something like LED issues can be addressed through a software update. Bravo to CS regardless. Good reminder why i'm a kindle loyalist


I simply don't believe this (ermm.. I believe the CS rep said it, but I think he's talking poop). I think it's a hardware issue. That said, I'd love love LOVE to be proven wrong.


----------



## CAR

WilliamG said:


> I simply don't believe this (ermm.. I believe the CS rep said it, but I think he's talking poop). I think it's a hardware issue. That said, I'd love love LOVE to be proven wrong.


Somehow I don't think you like the PW, WilliamG. Be happy for us that do like it


----------



## WilliamG

CAR said:


> Somehow I don't think you like the PW, WilliamG. Be happy for us that do like it


You're right. I don't like the PW. That said, I _want_ to like the PW.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

If a Kindle Paperwhite is defective in the forest and there is no one there to see it, is it still defective?  

Folks, this is the thread for those who consider their PWs defective.  It's entirely reasonable for people posting here to be unhappy.    The unhappy people need to have a place to vent and share experiences.  We have some other threads for people who are happy with their PWs.  For example, since my PW isn't defective, the only reason I'm here is because I'm a moderator.  

Peace, everyone!

Betsy


----------



## WilliamG

Betsy the Quilter said:


> If a Kindle Paperwhite is defective in the forest and there is no one there to see it, is it still defective?


It's definitely defective at that point, because it had to be left there _because_ it's defective, right?


----------



## Pushka

I think it's a hardware/quality control issue too. So not sure a solution is in an update. Unless it turns the lights off 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## CAR

Betsy the Quilter said:


> If a Kindle Paperwhite is defective in the forest and there is no one there to see it, is it still defective?
> 
> Folks, this is the thread for those who consider their PWs defective. It's entirely reasonable for people posting here to be unhappy. The unhappy people need to have a place to vent and share experiences. We have some other threads for people who are happy with their PWs. For example, since my PW isn't defective, the only reason I'm here is because I'm a moderator.
> 
> Peace, everyone!
> 
> Betsy


Yes Betsy you are are correct, I will stay in the happy threads.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

WilliamG said:


> It's definitely defective at that point, because it had to be left there _because_ it's defective, right?


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> If a Kindle Paperwhite is defective in the forest and there is no one there to see it, is it still defective?
> 
> Folks, this is the thread for those who consider their PWs defective. It's entirely reasonable for people posting here to be unhappy. The unhappy people need to have a place to vent and share experiences. We have some other threads for people who are happy with their PWs. For example, since my PW isn't defective, the only reason I'm here is because I'm a moderator.
> 
> Peace, everyone!
> 
> Betsy


Hi Betsy. I came to this thread to learn more about what to look out for when I buy my PW. I sympathize with those with defective devices and with those disappointed overall.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> Hi Betsy. I came to this thread to learn more about what to look out for when I buy my PW. I sympathize with those with defective devices and with those disappointed overall.


And there's nothing wrong with that. That's the "share" experience part.  My point was only that participants in this thread should expect to find negative comments about the PW; it's kind of the point...


Betsy


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> And there's nothing wrong with that. That's the "share" experience part.  My point was only that participants in this thread should expect to find negative comments about the PW; it's kind of the point...
> 
> 
> Betsy


Tru dat.


----------



## FearIndex

I understand where WilliamG is coming from - and do feel some people may get a tad bit defensive about the PW, confusing the issue of being happy with it, with discussion of the possible limitations of the technology and/or execution. I'm sure nobody here is asking anyone to be unhappy about their PW if they are not.

On the other hand, I think WilliamG puts it a bit strongly by saying all are flawed. Though I have yet to see a picture posted of a "perfect" PW. I am leaning on the opinion that those probably are very rare or do not exist. But that is different from a proclamation that all are flawed... I think in most cases though, the frontlight as it is, is not only uneven at the bottom (something I guess we all agree on), but uneven around the screen. Uneven in ways that at least anecdotally vary from unit to unit too. The variance alone, I think, is a big flaw reported by all who have seen more than one. But even many good ones have some variance.

Not even my PW, which I consider to be one of the good ones, is perfect. Not really, objectively speaking. There are areas where the light is darker and it is not simply a gradient from bottom towards the top, but a little more nuanced than that. It is not majorly blotchy as some are, but it isn't perfect either. I'm fairly certain most of you happy with PW would be happy with my unit - and indeed, for me the light unevenness wasn't even the issue to put the PW on the backburner, it was dislike for the frontlight vs. pure e-ink overall.

So, I do think for the sake of objectivity, it must be said the frontlight technology does seem to produce uneven results. If you think you have a perfect specimen, feel free to post a picture, but I do think it is fair to at least say the likelyhood is extremely high that when you buy a PW, the light will be somewhat uneven around the screen and not just around the bottom - especially when reading in darkness where ambient lighting isn't evening out the screen. Not all will see or be bothered by it, but in all likelyhood it will be there.

We don't have any issues saying the $69 Kindle 5 lighted cover produces uneven results with it's light, I don't think making a similar observation about the PW is unfair either. The limits of the technology and/or of the implementation are delivering at the moment large variances in the PW units shipping as well as a variyingly uneven light around the screen - which you may or may not notice or be bothered by. Maybe even most people aren't bothered by it, but that doesn't mean unevenness couldn't be there - I have seen it in many pictures where people have posted concerning units they are happy with.


----------



## PinkKindle

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> Thank you! As Ann said, hopefully it doesnt apply to defective items but I may have to prove that the funky screen is 'defective.'
> 
> OTOH, I also plan to let them know about it before I purchase...about what I've seen and heard about the screens and that I wont buy one if I cant return it easily. If there's any way they'll let me test it in the store, with the agreement that I'll buy it if it's ok, that would be great....but I have my doubts they'll do that.
> 
> The one at work lit up great right out of the box, even tho I believe it only had a partial charge. So that would be my expectation.


I returned the PW I bought at Best Buy after 1 day. The screen was much pinker than the one I have from Amazon and it also had one tiny spot that looked like "glitter" in the screen -- I guess dust between the screen layers. The screen itself was probably more even than the PW I kept (less splotchy), but much more pink overall.

When I brought it back to Best Buy the next day (with the receipt), I had no problem at all returning it. No restocking fee, no argument, nothing. They did take it out of the box and took it over to the Geek Squad area to try it and came back and said that they didn't see anything wrong with it and did I want to exchange it. I told them honestly that I had just wanted to try out one from the store to see if it was better than the one I had direct from Amazon, but the screen was too pink for me on this unit and so I was going to keep the Amazon one, and that I just wanted to return it. They said "no problem" and gave me a full refund right then -- easy peasy! 

I know some people have problems with Best Buy, but I have to say this was a very typical experience for me -- I always have great customer service from them. I don't return things that often, but when I do, I've never had the slightest issue, and I've never even heard them mention a restocking fee. They've also always been extremely accommodating with price matches, coupons, giving back the price difference when the product goes on sale within a month after purchasing it, etc. Sometimes it's taken a few minutes as they figure out how to do something or had to get a manager to fix something, but I've always left the store completely happy and satisfied.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

I think it's understandable that people who see nothing wrong with their Paperwhite may get defensive when told their device is flawed. 

Here's what I'd like to see, from a moderator point of view. It's the approach I take with all kinds of Kindle issues. 

If you think your device is flawed, we'll accept that.  If you think your device is not flawed, we'll accept that too.  Those who have devices they think are flawed will not be told their devices aren't flawed, and those who think their devices aren't flawed will not be told that their devices are flawed.  We'll agree to accept people's assessment of their own devices and leave it at that.

This being separate from purely technical discussions.

Perhaps we could agree to that and move on?



Betsy
KB Moderator


----------



## northofdivision

mooshie78 said:


> Yeah, it's only fair for companies to hold back some stock to replace the inevitable lemons that go out defective. A customer that gets a defective item has paid for something that doesn't work properly.


Interesting. Anyone know about this little guy?

"The Kobo Glo e-reader is the company's answer to the Nook Simple Touch with GlowLight and the Kindle Paperwhite. Like both of those devices, the Kobo Glo lets you read in the dark. Unlike the Nook and Kindle, however, the Glo has nearly eliminated the lighting inconsistencies that plague the other two devices."


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

It seems to me it came out about the same time as the Paperwhite, and I've read reviews both ways?  Anyone have actual experience with it?

Betsy


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

PinkKindle said:


> I returned the PW I bought at Best Buy after 1 day. The screen was much pinker than the one I have from Amazon and it also had one tiny spot that looked like "glitter" in the screen -- I guess dust between the screen layers. The screen itself was probably more even than the PW I kept (less splotchy), but much more pink overall.
> 
> When I brought it back to Best Buy the next day (with the receipt), I had no problem at all returning it. No restocking fee, no argument, nothing. They did take it out of the box and took it over to the Geek Squad area to try it and came back and said that they didn't see anything wrong with it and did I want to exchange it. I told them honestly that I had just wanted to try out one from the store to see if it was better than the one I had direct from Amazon, but the screen was too pink for me on this unit and so I was going to keep the Amazon one, and that I just wanted to return it. They said "no problem" and gave me a full refund right then -- easy peasy!
> 
> I know some people have problems with Best Buy, but I have to say this was a very typical experience for me -- I always have great customer service from them. I don't return things that often, but when I do, I've never had the slightest issue, and I've never even heard them mention a restocking fee. They've also always been extremely accommodating with price matches, coupons, giving back the price difference when the product goes on sale within a month after purchasing it, etc. Sometimes it's taken a few minutes as they figure out how to do something or had to get a manager to fix something, but I've always left the store completely happy and satisfied.


Thanks Pink. I've always had decent experiences with BB too, but it really helps to go when they are not real busy.

btw, I've heard what you describe as the single little bit of 'glitter' as a bad pixel...and there can be multiple bad ones. That is a defect.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> Thanks Pink. I've always had decent experiences with BB too, but it really helps to go when they are not real busy.
> 
> btw, I've heard what you describe as the single little bit of 'glitter' as a bad pixel...and there can be multiple bad ones. That is a defect.


Definitely. It could be a bad pixel or indeed something that got onto the screen during assembly despite the dust free environments they make these in.

Betsy


----------



## MamaProfCrash

There are folks who have had both at Mobil Read. The Kobo has not had the same problem with the screeen.


----------



## GBear

Engadget just posted a review of the Kobo Glo about an hour ago where they compared it to, mainly, the Kindle Paperwhite.

http://www.engadget.com/2012/11/02/kobo-glo-review/


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

GBear said:


> Engadget just posted a review of the Kobo Glo about an hour ago where they compared it to, mainly, the Kindle Paperwhite.
> 
> http://www.engadget.com/2012/11/02/kobo-glo-review/


This jumped out at me, "the text contrast suffered noticeably." (referencing the screen lighting)

What good is the light if it doesn't enhance the overall readability?


----------



## CAR

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> This jumped out at me, "the text contrast suffered noticeably." (referencing the screen lighting)
> 
> What good is the light if it doesn't enhance the overall readability?


The way I read the review, they liked the text and screen color (white) better on the Paperwhite.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## sjc

Betsy the Quilter said:


> If a Kindle Paperwhite is defective in the forest and there is no one there to see it, is it still defective?
> 
> Folks, this is the thread for those who consider their PWs defective. It's entirely reasonable for people posting here to be unhappy. The unhappy people need to have a place to vent and share experiences. We have some other threads for people who are happy with their PWs. For example, since my PW isn't defective, the only reason I'm here is because I'm a moderator.
> 
> Peace, everyone!
> 
> Betsy


I love you Betsy: We should start a three category thread: 
PW (paperwhite) 
PBW (paper blotchy white) 
PGP (paper green and pink)

SERIOUSLY FOLKS: I have to back Betsy up here (not that she needs it) but we do have different perceptions and all opinions are welcome. What one may see as defective; another may not. Technology has come a long way and it will keep changing and improving. If it is defective OR IF YOU DEEM IT TO BE: Send it back. If not, ENJOY!! You do that while I blow the dust off of my 8 pound VCR that cost me $600 back in the day or better yet; let me dig out my 8 tracks...bet they don't sound too scratchy!!


----------



## northofdivision

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> This jumped out at me, "the text contrast suffered noticeably." (referencing the screen lighting)
> 
> What good is the light if it doesn't enhance the overall readability?


what really stands out to me is that you can change the font sharpness and weight. that's pretty awesome. but i've seen the older kobo and the build quality just didn't match what amazon has put out (nooks too for that matter). kindles i've always seen as the best built ereaders hands down. but you're right, lursa, seems like all three companies can't get the lighting right (imho).


----------



## FearIndex

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I think it's understandable that people who see nothing wrong with their Paperwhite may get defensive when told their device is flawed.


Perhaps, however I must stress any discussion from my part - and hopefully others - on possible flaws of PW is not a commentary of any member here, but obviously just discussion of the device in question. So, please, nobody take it personal because it is not.



Betsy the Quilter said:


> If you think your device is flawed, we'll accept that. If you think your device is not flawed, we'll accept that too. Those who have devices they think are flawed will not be told their devices aren't flawed, and those who think their devices aren't flawed will not be told that their devices are flawed. We'll agree to accept people's assessment of their own devices and leave it at that.


That is perfectly fair of course, because being "flawed" is a very subjective experience and being happy with a device also. Nobody should question the choices and needs of others, I agree. If you are happy, great. Sincerely. But I do feel, for the sake of informative discussion, a more objective discussion on the merits (and lack thereof) of things like the PW frontlight might often require a less trusting approach. Just because a lot of people might not see or feel or care about a certain imperfection, doesn't really mean it couldn't be there - and vice versa of course.

To serve the community with the best possible information might require more than just trusting single experiences blindly. Just because some say their PW "is perfect", it is really hard to say if there are perfectly even PW frontlights out there. Not because we don't trust the word, but because it is really hard to say if the circumstances and the subjective experiences of the writer are comparable to others. Maybe if they post a picture of a "perfect one", that could give people real hope? If some others are looking for the "perfect one", factual information on this (one way or the other) would be useful for them, and simply trusting the experience of others blindly might not serve them as well as a good, open discussion on it.

I guess what I'm saying is, those who feel happy with their PW shouldn't really take it personal if others who have yet to see a perfect PW feel like it might not exist with this many inperfect ones out there. Maybe those could help by posting a picture or something. I'm sure it would genuinely help those who are looking for a perfect unit, to know if there really are such "unicorns" out there. We're all Kindle fans here, I'm sure most of us want to like the PW. But I must say I'm yet to see a single picture of a perfect PW frontlight (and not just meaning the bottom shadows). If others say they have a "perfect" one, it might useful to at least quantify through discussion what that perfect means, for the sake other readers seeking for information.

At least, that has been my own goal, to furnish others with as accurate information as I can with my posts. That said, I will obviously respect the moderators line when responding to experiences of others. I am just a newbie here, so I don't have full knowledge of history and events here that might warrant otherwise.


----------



## Morf

Ann in Arlington said:


> There were practically NO issues reported with the K3K as I recall -- oh, except on some devices a very small crack occasionally formed on one of the corners of the screen. Didn't affect use of the device at all but it bothered some enough to request replacements.


My original K3 cracked at both bottom corners of the screen, and was replaced by Amazon after about 16 months (yes, well out of warranty). The replacement is about 10 months old and has cracked at the left-hand bottom corner. I suspect it's to do with the genuine Amazon case.

Oh, and while we're at it, what about all the K3's rebooting because of faulty cases? That was a major problem for a while.

So yes, we have seen a good number of problems with K3's


----------



## Morf

FearIndex said:


> At least, that has been my own goal, to furnish others with as accurate information as I can with my posts. That said, I will obviously respect the moderators line when responding to experiences of others. I am just a newbie here, so I don't have full knowledge of history and events here that might warrant otherwise.


FearIndex,

Personally, I'm grateful for what you have been posting on here.

In the UK we didn't get PW's for about a month after the US. Reading your comments (and other peoples as well) made me realise that, as with all things electronic, the PW was not perfect by any means.

As a result, when it arrived I approached it with an open mind. I saw all the flaws that have been reported (dark areas at the bottom, blotchiness in the light, fonts less dark than other Kindles), and I decided to not spend too long looking at those things, but instead I got my books onto it and got back to reading with it.

As a result, I quickly decided that while it isn't perfect, for me the benefits of the light outweigh the problems, and having used it for a week or so I don't want to go back to my old (and loved) K3.

If I'd been one of the early recipients, and I hadn't had the opinions on here to read and consider, I would probably have fixated on the failings and returned it.

At the end of the day, there still isn't a perfect ebook reader around, and probably won't be for another 5 years or more. For me, I'm happy with the PW for now: clearly you're happier with the K5.

That's life!


----------



## PinkKindle

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> Thanks Pink. I've always had decent experiences with BB too, but it really helps to go when they are not real busy.
> 
> btw, I've heard what you describe as the single little bit of 'glitter' as a bad pixel...and there can be multiple bad ones. That is a defect.


Yep -- that was the main factor in deciding to return the BB PW, the bad pixel or dust or whatever it was. The two screens had very different defects, and I really might have decided that all pink was better than splotchy, but that one having a bad pixel made the decision for me! Which is good, because I probably would have driven myself crazy with indecision otherwise!


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Just to clarify, I think it's perfectly appropriate and helpful to have this thread.  And I don't think members who are happy with their Paperwhites object to the thread.  Where I've seen a problem is with comments to the effect that "all Paperwhites are defective, therefore your Paperwhite must be defective."  As long as those kinds of comments are put behind us, I think everything will go smoothly and I see no reason to keep bringing it up.

As a side note:  I don't doubt that there are defective Paperwhites; obviously, there hasn't been a product released in the history of the world that has had every item sold be perfect.  I would say, though, that there is a difference between "defective" and "Amazon's advertising oversold the product."    The product could very well be functioning perfectly and still not be quite like Amazon's marketing photos.  Much the way I've never seen a Big Mac look like the photos in McDonald's advertising.  That discrepancy doesn't mean the Bic Mac I (might) buy is defective (though a different argument could be made that their very nature makes them defective).  

Just some random thoughts.  Carry on.  The thread has been very useful in ensuring members have reasonable expectations when considering a Paperwhite, and what to do if they get one that doesn't meet the standard.

Betsy


----------



## gajitldy

Morf - I have had my K3 for over two years and it cracked in both lower corners outward from the screen.  I never had it replaced because it works fine.  It has been in an Oberon case since day 1.

Diane


----------



## Morf

Interesting, I had assumed it was due to the way that the case held the K3 but clearly not.

Maybe it's just down to the way in which they are held.

Of course, sharp corners like that with only a small radius are always going to be a point where stress fractures happen - just look at what happened to the early De Havilland Comets with rectangular windows.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

Morf said:


> My original K3 cracked at both bottom corners of the screen, and was replaced by Amazon after about 16 months (yes, well out of warranty). The replacement is about 10 months old and has cracked at the left-hand bottom corner. I suspect it's to do with the genuine Amazon case.
> 
> Oh, and while we're at it, what about all the K3's rebooting because of faulty cases? That was a major problem for a while.
> 
> So yes, we have seen a good number of problems with K3's


I still think the case crack issue is pretty minor. . .but I had forgotten about the hinge case shorting issue. . .that did affect a fair number of folks -- but Amazon got it fixed fairly quickly as I recall.

And, even so, if you didn't use that particular case, there wasn't a problem. . .so. . .arguably, it was a problem with the case, not the kindle.


----------



## Morf

Ann in Arlington said:


> I still think the case crack issue is pretty minor. . .but I had forgotten about the hinge case shorting issue. . .that did affect a fair number of folks -- but Amazon got it fixed fairly quickly as I recall.
> 
> And, even so, if you didn't use that particular case, there wasn't a problem. . .so. . .arguably, it was a problem with the case, not the kindle.


I'd agree that the cracks are minor in terms of their impact on the device, but quite a few of the K3 owners I know have noticed them, so I think that they have happened to a lot of devices, maybe people just haven't bothered about them (or even noticed them... they aren't obvious).

Anyway, my point was simply that there have been "teething troubles" with various Kindles in the past. I wonder if Amazon make a conscious decision to save time and money by skipping intensive product testing, and cover that with excellent customer service?


----------



## bordercollielady

Morf said:


> what about all the K3's rebooting because of faulty cases?


I had forgotten about that too.. I remember now some of the theories about the hinges causing shorting. Mine stopped rebooting when I stopped using the lighted case..


----------



## FearIndex

Morf said:


> As a result, when it arrived I approached it with an open mind. I saw all the flaws that have been reported (dark areas at the bottom, blotchiness in the light, fonts less dark than other Kindles), and I decided to not spend too long looking at those things, but instead I got my books onto it and got back to reading with it.
> 
> As a result, I quickly decided that while it isn't perfect, for me the benefits of the light outweigh the problems, and having used it for a week or so I don't want to go back to my old (and loved) K3.


Morf, thank you for the response - this is a very fair comment to make. Clearly you went through the discussion, made your own decisions and observations, and chose what is best for you. I doubt anyone (anyone reasonable anyway) could find fault with that. Like said, not even the $69 Kindle 5 is perfect as mine has a piece of cardboard attached to its lighter cover to fix the glare issue.  Something with a piece of cardboard glued on it is hardly perfect, but it is so far the best compromise for me.

I think what the value of forums like this one, in addition to moral support and camaraderie, is to furnish people with the best information possible. Often user forums are the best place for gaining such information and distilling the best possible information sometimes requires looking at experiences of others criticially too.



Betsy the Quilter said:


> As a side note: I don't doubt that there are defective Paperwhites; obviously, there hasn't been a product released in the history of the world that has had every item sold be perfect. I would say, though, that there is a difference between "defective" and "Amazon's advertising oversold the product."  The product could very well be functioning perfectly and still not be quite like Amazon's marketing photos. Much the way I've never seen a Big Mac look like the photos in McDonald's advertising. That discrepancy doesn't mean the Bic Mac I (might) buy is defective (though a different argument could be made that their very nature makes them defective).


First, Betsy, thank you for encouraging discussion on this topic and trying to maintain order. Appreciated.

What you say above is true, of course. I think it is too much to call all the PWs "flawed", although certainly some variance in the units probably could and should be called that (those with major color hues and other issues). But it is quite possible the PW frontlight technology or its current manufacturing process is imperfect in the sense that it is not evenly lit as some people clearly expect it to be - I'm referring to the blotchiness of light distribution as well as the bottom shadows. In that sense, it seems possible all are unevenly lit, even beyond the bottom shadows everyone seems to agree on.

I think that is something a lot of people have tried to come to grips with - are there really perfect units out there or are there not? Having seen pictures of none, I too am now leaning towards probably not. While helpful in a way that some say they have "perfect" units, I also worry how misleading that may be - are they really that perfect when compared? Are the experiences and observations of others comparable? It would be useful to know what "perfect" can be expected of the PW, for those looking for replacements or still trying to make up their minds. What is the best PW technology can deliver and what it cannot etc. Once people know what to expect as accurately as possible, they can also best decide what they can settle with or not.

As for the Big Mac example, I think that actually is a good one to consider. If this were the "McDonalds Boards", I think first of all it would be a useful discussion to note that the promotional pictures are misleading. Secondly, it would be useful to discuss what is the best or reasonable to expect when buying a Big Mac. If someone comes online to say theirs is just like in the PR pictures, I know I would have a hard time believing that without seeing.  Not because I'd doubt the integrity of the poster, or wish them to be unhappy about their Big Mac, but merely because I would wonder if their observation was accurate or comparable to my own.

That said, I'm hardly as picky about my Big Macs as I am about my e-ink experience.


----------



## Morf

I personally believe that my PW is typical: the light is not perfect, but it's good enough to be an improvement as far as I am concerned.

I tend to be very pragmatic with things like this. Let's look at what Amazon have achieved:

They've found a way to distribute light from 4 LED's across a flat surface, using a piece of plastic (I don't care what clever words they use, it's a piece of plastic) probably less than 1mm thick, in such a way that the light is pretty evenly distributed.

They've then found a way to manufacture that at a low enough cost that the final device is retailing for about the same price as the previous device that didn't have it.

Then being McDonalds Amazon, they've hyped it up to be the most fantastic thing that has ever been done by anybody ever in the whole universe - and with onions! 

It isn't!  No surprise there. It doesn't look as good as the adverts. No surprise there, remember Apple and the "some sequences are shortened" ads?

Is it perfect? No. Is it defective? Generally, I'd say no - though I'm sure some are. Have Amazon over-hyped it? Yes.

Do I think it's better than my old K3? Yes.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Wait, Morf, yours came with onions?


Betsy


----------



## Morf

Hey, we Brits have to have some bonuses!


----------



## FearIndex

I would say, though, all the onions shipping with PW are flawed.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter




----------



## sparklemotion

Good to see the color hue defect given more attention in reviews.

http://afr.com/p/technology/kindle_paperwhite_you_ll_love_it_bZ69bcBHmnf5hKNsoq0zgK


----------



## GBear

sparklemotion said:


> Good to see the color hue defect given more attention in reviews.
> 
> http://afr.com/p/technology/kindle_paperwhite_you_ll_love_it_bZ69bcBHmnf5hKNsoq0zgK


Nice review. Fairly presented both perspectives, I think.


----------



## northofdivision

Great review.

Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2


----------



## sparklemotion

GBear said:


> Nice review. Fairly presented both perspectives, I think.


I agree!


----------



## sjc

Solid, fair review.  Well done!!


----------



## Pushka

Did you realise that was an Australian review?


----------



## FearIndex

Nice review. I applaud the effort to see both sides of the story. Trying to apply such percentages this early in the game seems a little much to me, but it is probably true a majority is fine with the PW.

Although this part is definitely not true:



> In its figure-hugging $US40 case, this is the smallest Kindle ever.


The $69 Kindle 5 is clearly smaller in all dimensions, thinner and lighter outside or inside its similar Amazon case. The PW is very hefty compared.

Add a lighted cover and the $69 Kindle 5 might become a tad bit taller due to the light, but it is still less wide, thinner and lighter.

(Edited to add: Obviously same applies to the $79 Kindle 4, which is the same size as the $69 Kindle 5.)


----------



## shalym

Morf said:


> I'd agree that the cracks are minor in terms of their impact on the device, but quite a few of the K3 owners I know have noticed them, so I think that they have happened to a lot of devices, maybe people just haven't bothered about them (or even noticed them... they aren't obvious).
> 
> Anyway, my point was simply that there have been "teething troubles" with various Kindles in the past. I wonder if Amazon make a conscious decision to save time and money by skipping intensive product testing, and cover that with excellent customer service?


There were LOTS of complaints about quality issues with the K3--remember the slow page turns when in direct sunlight? Remember the keys fading? Nothing is ever perfect...especially not our memories.

Shari


----------



## Morf

shalym said:


> There were LOTS of complaints about quality issues with the K3--remember the slow page turns when in direct sunlight? Remember the keys fading? Nothing is ever perfect...especially not our memories.
> 
> Shari


I think the slow page turns when hot (or cold) is actually inherent in e-ink screens, it's certainly still there (when cold) on the PW.

I spent last weekend in a caravan in the UK, although not sub-zero (even centigrade!) it was pretty cold at night. When I woke the PW up in the morning, page changes were noticeable slower than normal, and remained so until it warmed up a bit.

Oh, and interestingly, when the screen mists over (cold Kindle and warm hands) it seems to interfere with the light, so you get bright patches - even more than usual!


----------



## grah8303

I just have to say that I got on here to make it clear that THERE IS a problem with the paperwhite screen, and that it should be known that it is probably not an issue that can be fixed by "sending it back" to the factory. I bought mine yesterday, and I have already noticed that there is a blue tint (presumably from the dark color representing the ink in the background of the kindle). There is an uneven bluish color that covers the screen, and can be extremely distracting while reading. When the light is off it cannot be seen, but that is because the light is not pushing the dark base color of the kindle to the front of the screen. BE WARNED! If you buy one of these you will see the unevenness in color. I can't see how replacing for another kindle can fix this issue.


----------



## Leslie

grah8303 said:


> I just have to say that I got on here to make it clear that THERE IS a problem with the paperwhite screen, and that it should be known that it is probably not an issue that can be fixed by "sending it back" to the factory. I bought mine yesterday, and I have already noticed that there is a blue tint (presumably from the dark color representing the ink in the background of the kindle). There is an uneven bluish color that covers the screen, and can be extremely distracting while reading. When the light is off it cannot be seen, but that is because the light is not pushing the dark base color of the kindle to the front of the screen. BE WARNED! If you buy one of these you will see the unevenness in color. I can't see how replacing for another kindle can fix this issue.


Not everyone has screens with uneven bluish colors--I don't. I've bought two PW and the screens on both have been fine.

There seems to be some variability in the screen so if you return it, you may get one that doesn't have the uneven bluish tint and it will be fine for you. Based on posts here, some PW screens have problems, but not all do.

L


----------



## grah8303

Hmmm, I think we are going to have to disagree here. I believe that you are probably just not seeing what the others are seeing. It's like the magic eye pictures. Is the blue tint bad on mine? No, it isn't terrible, but there is some tint there. To think that there are screens out there that are perfectly white with no tint is not likely in my opinion. If you turn the light all the way down the kindle turns a dark brownish grey. Once you turn the light on you can see that the kindle does turn white with light, but the original brownish grey color is still there. It does not go away... When the light is turned on it forces that brownish grey color to come to the surface, showing through a light bluish grey color mixed with the light. Maybe you can't see it very well on yours, but it is there. To tell me that yours is completely white would be like telling me yours does the job with perfection, while all of ours does not... I don't believe it.. Anyway, I have just been turning the light down so as to not see the discoloration. The Kindle is new so I am nitpicking about it, but I'm sure that I will get over it. When the light is off the kindle works great.. I'm just trying to tell everyone that more than likely (almost certainly) there will be a slight discoloration when the light is on. You can live with it or not get a touch kindle, but the regular one. I'm going to live with it though.


----------



## telracs

grah8303 said:


> Hmmm, I think we are going to have to disagree here. I believe that you are probably just not seeing what the others are seeing. It's like the magic eye pictures. Is the blue tint bad on mine? No, it isn't terrible, but there is some tint there. To think that there are screens out there that are perfectly white with no tint is not likely in my opinion. If you turn the light all the way down the kindle turns a dark brownish grey. Once you turn the light on you can see that the kindle does turn white with light, but the original brownish grey color is still there. It does not go away... When the light is turned on it forces that brownish grey color to come to the surface, showing through a light bluish grey color mixed with the light. Maybe you can't see it very well on yours, but it is there. To tell me that yours is completely white would be like telling me yours does the job with perfection, while all of ours does not... I don't believe it.. Anyway, I have just been turning the light down so as to not see the discoloration. The Kindle is new so I am nitpicking about it, but I'm sure that I will get over it. When the light is off the kindle works great.. I'm just trying to tell everyone that more than likely (almost certainly) there will be a slight discoloration when the light is on. You can live with it or not get a touch kindle, but the regular one. I'm going to live with it though.


Until you've looked at a whole bunch of PW screens, don't try and tell us what we see.

My PW is not now nor has it ever been blueish. It is white when the light is up high, grey when it's low or off.

If you don't like your PW, return it for another one. You might (probably will) be surprised....


----------



## grah8303

hahaha. Okay, well when people have said that they have sent 4-5 kindles back and they all do the same thing, then I have to think that it's not just one but all kindles that do it. For you guys to think that you have the only working kindles is funny to me. You just aren't seeing what we see... are there probably some that have very little to no discoloration? Sure. But My guess is that these are few and far inbetween. We all seem to have the same issue with only a very small amount of people not experiencing this problem. It has even been stated in numerous reputable reviews that the screens have discoloration, but you want to argue that fact. If yours work, great. But you can't sit there an deny that there is a widespread problem, and it's not something that sending mine back for a replacement will fix. I'll end up sending 5 back with the same problem. Simple as that. Anyway, if you're thinking of buying a Kindle then please take what I've said into consideration. It's the truth. For you to get one that is "perfectly" white is probably a 1 in 10000 shot. I do like the product though. Hopefully they can figure out a way to light the thing without there being a background foreshadowing a color through the light.


----------



## CAR

grah8303 said:


> hahaha. Okay, well when people have said that they have sent 4-5 kindles back and they all do the same thing, then I have to think that it's not just one but all kindles that do it. For you guys to think that you have the only working kindles is funny to me. You just aren't seeing what we see... are there probably some that have very little to no discoloration? Sure. But My guess is that these are few and far inbetween. We all seem to have the same issue with only a very small amount of people not experiencing this problem. It has even been stated in numerous reputable reviews that the screens have discoloration, but you want to argue that fact. If yours work, great. But you can't sit there an deny that there is a widespread problem, and it's not something that sending mine back for a replacement will fix. I'll end up sending 5 back with the same problem. Simple as that. Anyway, if you're thinking of buying a Kindle then please take what I've said into consideration. It's the truth. For you to get one that is "perfectly" white is probably a 1 in 10000 shot. I do like the product though. Hopefully they can figure out a way to light the thing without there being a background foreshadowing a color through the light.


White screen on mine at full brightness, and grey at very low brightness (5) on my Paperwhite. Think we have been down this road before.


----------



## grah8303

I would like for all of you that are saying your screen is "completely" white to post very clear pics of this... Why I haven't seen a pic of a clear white Kindle is still beyond me. All of these people are saying that there screen is "perfectly" white, but yet I have yet to see a picture of one.


----------



## grah8303

And I'm telling you, I'm looking at manufacturer pictures right now, and they do not show a WHITE SCREEN. The screen is exactly how I describe. I'm happy for you all that you only see white and not what the rest of us see, but what you are saying just isn't true. If all you see is white, GREAT, but the vast majority of us see discoloration.


----------



## telracs

don't look at pictures.  look at paperwhites.

yes, some of them have issues.  yours does.  mine does not.  leslie's does not.  

and please, don't claim in your first 3 posts here,  that the "majority" see discoloration.  people with problems complain about them.  people with good PW (the real majority) are off reading on them.

and that's what i'm gonna go do.  have a nice life.


----------



## grah8303

Haha, I'm just trying to make sure that people aren't on here spreading lies. I'll do that. I'll go to best buy and look at paperwhites to see if they are different, but I'm pretty darn sure that it is physically impossible for them to be any different than the one I have. Physics doesn't lie, and the way the light is shown over the kindles background leaves some discoloration. I don't see how this can be any different on any other kindle. You just must think that your kindle is better or something. lol. Too funny. Anyways, I'll stop by best buy just to prove myself right, but after hearing countless people say they have exchanged their kindle numerous times with the same result, I'm going to go ahead and deduce that the problem is as I have described it. Now, I will go read my kindle and I will have a great life. If people were smart they would listen to someone like me that came here to express an opinion that opposes the people that obviously spend time on this board gloating over a product that is far from "perfect".


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Grah8303,

Welcome to KindleBoards!

I'm sorry to hear that you've received a Paperwhite which you were dissatisfied with. If you read through this entire thread, I think you'll find that it's been acknowledged that there has been an issue with some, perhaps many Paperwhites. AND that at least some people who had Paperwhites with problems initially got later Paperwhites as replacements and were happy (eventually) with the replacement devices they received. There is no great cover-up here.

Enjoy your Kindle! I hope you'll take a look at other areas of the forum where we have book recommendations and discussions and, of course, there's Not Quite Kindle, where you can discuss almost anything!

Betsy


----------



## hamerfan

FWIW, good screen here. I will try to post pics (both bright light and low light) of it tomorrow, if I remember.


----------



## dwaszak

grah8303 said:


> I just have to say that I got on here to make it clear that THERE IS a problem with the paperwhite screen, and that it should be known that it is probably not an issue that can be fixed by "sending it back" to the factory. I bought mine yesterday, and I have already noticed that there is a blue tint (presumably from the dark color representing the ink in the background of the kindle). There is an uneven bluish color that covers the screen, and can be extremely distracting while reading. When the light is off it cannot be seen, but that is because the light is not pushing the dark base color of the kindle to the front of the screen. BE WARNED! If you buy one of these you will see the unevenness in color. I can't see how replacing for another kindle can fix this issue.


the first PW I received had the same thing- it was definitely bluish gray running g diagonally across the screen. I called CS and the replacement is totally different- no tinting at all. so there is definitely an issue with the screens.


----------



## LauraB

I've had my paper white since the first batch. I see no discoloration no matter what I do with the light.  It is not completely white like my back lit iPad, but I didn't expect it to be, and don't want it to be. But aside from the little area around the lights on bottom, which I expected, I see an evenly toned background. I won't call it "white" it is closer to a new paperback page. That is the best way I can describe it. If people have color problems on the screen I agree with the posters who said to call. I hope your issues (those of you who have them) get resolved.


----------



## larryb52

its just my take on the PW topic but no 2 people see the same thing the same way & there does seems some folks upset about others not seeing what they do. The PW I got and use looks fine to me but to my wife it looks blueish on the side...my point is preception and opinions... everyone sees color hues differently & everyone has an opinion on others preception & just don't get angry about it everyone is intitled to an opinion, its just that you see what you see either it works or it doesn't an amazon is trying to please you so if you like the product just stick to it till you get satisfied...


----------



## sjc

Nice response Betsy.
Love the Mods.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

A public service announcement from your friendly neighborhood moderator:  

We've got some new folks here who may not be aware of it, but "troll" in considered a four letter word here at KindleBoards.  And name calling is against Forum Decorum. Using four letter words or name calling will cause your post to be edited or removed. We prefer that posts be taken at face value until proven otherwise and if responded to, responded to courteously.  If you have an issue with a post, that's what the report feature is there for.

Thanks!

Betsy


----------



## dwaszak

LauraB said:


> I've had my paper white since the first batch. I see no discoloration no matter what I do with the light. It is not completely white like my back lit iPad, but I didn't expect it to be, and don't want it to be. But aside from the little area around the lights on bottom, which I expected, I see an evenly toned background. I won't call it "white" it is closer to a new paperback page. That is the best way I can describe it. If people have color problems on the screen I agree with the posters who said to call. I hope your issues (those of you who have them) get resolved.


With the first I got and then the replacement, I can honestly say when the screen is bad it's very obvious- the new screen is very even toned and very easy to read from. The first was definitely shaded in areas, making it very hard on the eyes- I did not enjoy reading on the first one, and it gave me headaches.


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

As I wrote earlier, I have had 4 Paperwhites side by side for comparison. Serously...lined up on my desk at work, right next to each other.
--varying lighting conditions
--varying light levels on the devices
--multiple people viewing

I set every PW to the same page in the Kindle User's Guide, same font size, same light levels (all tested against each other at exactly the same light levels, testing a variety of light levels)

I also ran 2 PW's thru similar paces at 2 different Best Buys, altho they were not side-by-side and had fewer testing controls.

All were slightly different, some more so than the others. All showed some of the 'marquee lighting' at the bottom where the LEDs are located. 2 were high quality (IMO and others at work) and 2 were poor..one quite noticeably worse than the other. 

None were perfect but 2 were very good, as well as one at one of the Best Buys. All showed at least a faint dimmer band diagonally across the screen, the 2 poor quality ones showed distinct pink mottling around the band. 

For the poorer quality devices (screens), different light levels could exacerbate the mottling or make it nearly disappear. It also depended on ambient lighting. Of the 2 'good' devices, one had the LED in one corner slightly exposed, causing a bright spot. Some people found this bothersome. I didnt notice it until someone pointed it out but it was a valid concern.

We also noticed a different in font contrast...again, doing exact comparisons on the devices. 

We kept the 2 better devices, of course. One is part of our e-reader pilot program at work, one is now mine.


----------



## NogDog

FWIW, and something I think was mentioned somewhere earlier in this thread, apparently LED's can and do vary in their color accuracy, and it's probably most noticeable with white ones, and probably more likely to be a problem with cheaper LED's. Considering the comparatively low price the Kindle is sold at (a matter of opinion, I realize), it's very conceivable that Amazon's manufacturers have not been purchasing the highest priced LED's (which would, presumably, have the highest quality control, too). 

It would be interesting to be a fly on the wall at Amazon to find out if they have bitten the bullet and demanded better LED quality on new Paperwhites (and corresponding cut in their margins) or not. Any Amazon employees lurking here care to comment on that?


----------



## KimberlyinMN

I just chatted online with Kindle Customer Service about getting my 4th PW replaced. Of the four, this one is the best - however it has a grayish blob in the middle and left of the screen. While the blob isn't totally noticeable, it does make the text hard to read. My eye have a very hard time focusing on the words. The first three PW had pink and blue blobs swirled around. I really just want crisp text.

I tried changing the fonts but that didn't make a difference. To me, Helvetica looks the darkest. I have the font size on the fifth setting from the left. If I make the font size smaller, the font color (or bolding) difference _really _shows up. I wish a photograph would show the difference, but it doesn't seem to.

I even waited a couple of weeks before contacting Kindle CS, just in case the gray blob/font issue cleared up.

PW Kindle #5 is supposed to arrive on Friday. (Yay!) (Oh crap, now I need to get more screen protectors.)


----------



## Atunah

Yeah, kindles are notoriously difficult to photograph. They never look like they do in real life and the defects just never come across right. You have to go with your eyes. If it makes it difficult for you to read that there is no point in trying to make it work. I really hope you are getting a good one on Friday. Let us know.


----------



## LDB

How much more could it really cost to use top quality LED's vs. let's cheap out ones? A dollar per unit? Two dollars? Granted, that much times all the units is a lot of money but they certainly have the money to absorb the cost or they could have included it in the price from the beginning with close to if not zero impact.


----------



## CAR

Just got my wife's Paperwhite tonight, and if anything her screen is even better then mine!    And if you have been following my posts on my Paperwhite I thought it was great, and still do.    Maybe that's why she got the Fuchsia color cover, so I would not grab hers.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

Well, Kindle #5 arrived. It is remarkably whiter!! The sad news is that it has dust under the screen in a few spots (5) that are very noticeable. Makes me think of "Pixie Dust" because they really sparkle. I do like sparkly things, I find them very distracting while reading.  Rats.

Kindle #6 should be here Tuesday.


----------



## LDB

I would probably be thinking there was some underlying problem or conspiracy by the third unit but six? It may be time to accept we're talking Chinese made and in their own way each may be as good as it gets.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

LDB said:


> I would probably be thinking there was some underlying problem or conspiracy by the third unit but six? It may be time to accept we're talking Chinese made and in their own way each may be as good as it gets.


Ha! Yeah, the one that arrived today is SOOOO close to perfect. "Missed it by that much" (From Get Smart)


----------



## SilverMaple

My Paperwhite came last week, and I'm disappointed.  Pink and blue splotches are evident on the screen, and the text is uneven.  The worst part is that one of the LED lights on the bottom is far brighter than the rest, making part a flare in one part of the screen.  Amazon is sending me a replacement.  I'm really hoping the replacement is better.... reading through this thread makes me wonder.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

SilverMaple said:


> My Paperwhite came last week, and I'm disappointed. Pink and blue splotches are evident on the screen, and the text is uneven. The worst part is that one of the LED lights on the bottom is far brighter than the rest, making part a flare in one part of the screen. Amazon is sending me a replacement. I'm really hoping the replacement is better.... reading through this thread makes me wonder.


Don't give up hope!!  The good news is that we CAN get replacements. The replacement that I got for the Kindle with the dust under the screen (which lit up), ended up having the pink and blue splotches - almost like I was starting over. I started a chat conversation with Kindle support asking if I could return the replacement and keep the one it was supposed to replace (the one with the bright dust spots). Kind of funny, but I don't think she understood what I was asking, so I have another replacement on its way.

The Kindle with the few dust spots is the brightest and whitest PW that I have ever had in my possession. I'd REALLY like one just like it, but without those lit up dust spots.

Also, I think the replacement Kindle that is being sent back was pre-owned as it had a little red and green glitter on the back and a speck of red glitter on the front. I dropped off two PW Kindles at the UPS store today.


----------



## acti0n

Hey everyone,

Over the past week I've gone through 5 defective Paperwhites with a 6th on the way:

#1: 1 inch long distracting bright spot on left edge near the bottom. Uneven lighting at bottom.
#2: Small bump in outer rubber, blueish-green tint to the light. This was the only unit that had even lighting on the bottom.
#3: The top inner border of bezel was not cut straight. There was a 4x1mm piece of plastic jutting out over the screen. Uneven lighting at bottom.
#4: 1 inch scratch on the lower right part of the screen.  Uneven lighting at bottom.
#5: 3mm scratch on the lower left part of the screen. Bright dust specs under screen. Uneven lighting at bottom.

I've got a 6th one being delivered tomorrow, but I'm not optimistic. I can tolerate a moderate amount of uneven backlighting on the bottom -- all units appear to have this to some extent, but it really doesn't distract me. However, bright spots, scratches, and discolorations simply ruin the reading experience. What concerns me is that all 5 of the Paperwhites I've received so far have been totally different -- there is no consistency to the defects, just random quality control issues. 

If I hadn't already spent $30 on a third-party case and a couple books, I would've just asked for a refund at this point, but again, I'll be out an additional $30 if I give up.


----------



## mlewis78

How could you have gone through 5 paperwhites in one week?  Did you order 5 at one time?  I notice this is your first post.

I have not ordered one.  I bought the $69 model in October.  It has the best screen I've seen, with or without my clip-on light.  I looked at a PW in Best Buy last month, but I didn't think it was worth adding to my collection.  It did not appear to be defective, but it had the cones of light/shadows at the bottom.


----------



## acti0n

mlewis78 said:


> How could you have gone through 5 paperwhites in one week? Did you order 5 at one time? I notice this is your first post.


Amazon sent each replacement via overnight shipping. If you notify them of the issue early enough in the evening, it'll make the cutoff to arrive the next day. Their customer service has been excellent.


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

Yup...I went thru 3 in a week.

Cant fault Amazon for that at least.


----------



## katbird1

I have had 3 PW's, the first I describe as a pleasant muted sunset (soft pinks and blues); #2 looked like storm clouds on the way (lots of yellow, gray, bright lights); #3 still had pink, blue, gray, and a little yellow.  So, I returned #2 and #3.  I can read just fine on my first one and really don't mind the soft colors.


----------



## acti0n

6th unit arrived. Turned it on, immediately noticed a 3mm scratch near the bottom of the screen. This is the 3rd consecutive replacement that came scratched.


----------



## Alice Coyl

acti0n said:


> 6th unit arrived. Turned it on, immediately noticed a 3mm scratch near the bottom of the screen. This is the 3rd consecutive replacement that came scratched.


I may be wrong but I think they are recycling returns thinking that someone else will accept them. Like mine arriving completely set up in German with all the choices already made and the most recent update installed. It went back and when I received a replacement, it came ready for me to set it up and download the update. There are just too many reports of problems. If all the replacements were absolutely new, I think the bad ones would disappear.

Are you an on the Amazon "hit list" for returning so many?


----------



## acti0n

Alice Coyl said:


> I may be wrong but I think they are recycling returns thinking that someone else will accept them. Like mine arriving completely set up in German with all the choices already made and the most recent update installed. It went back and when I received a replacement, it came ready for me to set it up and download the update. There are just too many reports of problems. If all the replacements were absolutely new, I think the bad ones would disappear.
> 
> Are you an on the Amazon "hit list" for returning so many?


I asked about that and they assured me all were new devices. I'm going to try my luck at Best Buy today, and if all goes well, I'll just call and cancel the 7th unit from Amazon.


----------



## acti0n

Just got my 7th unit, this time from Best Buy. Bright dust specs under screen, large hotspot on left side of screen, large pink discolorations. Also, the light was noticeably dimmer than the previous units (max brightness on this unit was equivalent to about 18 on others). Ironically, this device actually had the most even lighting on the bottom (no blotches).

Going to exchange for another and will report back.


----------



## katbird1

My 3rd one came in a box with a serial number on it that did NOT match the serial number of the PW.  Also, on the label on the box, the boy under the tree, the tree had an "R" on it, and my other two boxes were just a white tree; however, the last one was not an offers one, while the first two were, so I didn't know if that was why the "R"?


----------



## acti0n

katbird1 said:


> My 3rd one came in a box with a serial number on it that did NOT match the serial number of the PW. Also, on the label on the box, the boy under the tree, the tree had an "R" on it, and my other two boxes were just a white tree; however, the last one was not an offers one, while the first two were, so I didn't know if that was why the "R"?


R = Refurbished


----------



## acti0n

I exchanged #7 at Best Buy, and I opened the new device (# there in front of them. This one had large blue and pink discolorations, which one employee saw bright as day, but another couldn't see anything wrong. I want ahead and returned this one.

One defective device is understandable, two is bad luck, but eight in a row is telling me all are going to have some issue. I await Kindle #9 from Amazon Monday.


----------



## Alice Coyl

acti0n said:


> I exchanged #7 at Best Buy, and I opened the new device (# there in front of them. This one had large blue and pink discolorations, which one employee saw bright as day, but another couldn't see anything wrong. I want ahead and returned this one.
> 
> One defective device is understandable, two is bad luck, but eight in a row is telling me all are going to have some issue. I await Kindle #9 from Amazon Monday.


I'm now wondering if the replacements are not new but refurbished ones. My first one came from back east and took almost a week to get here even with Prime two day shipping and my replacement came from Commerce, CA which is just 120 miles or so up the road near Los Angeles. I received it overnight. I would be pissed off big time if I received a refurbished one for the price I paid for a new 3g ad free one. It was $199 and I don't expect to get someone's refurbished return for that price. Does anyone know if there is any way we can find out the history of our serial number?


----------



## Alice Coyl

When I ordered my first Paperwhite, I also paid for the extended warranty. I shipped the first PW back and when I received my replacement I notified the warranty company to transfer the warranty to the replacement PW. They have not sent me confirmation that they have done that and in checking the order for the warranty, it says I do not have a qualifying Kindle for the warranty that I paid for. However, when I check my devices on "manage my Kindle", the new PW has "extended warranty" listed.

Should I receive new paperwork showing the correct Kindle? I think so. I sent another inquiry to the seller today and hope that someone will respond. Have any of you run into this situation? I used to work for an insurance company and I know they try to pay all legitimate claims but if anything is out of order, they have the right to deny the claim.

Also, from what I can find out, a refurbished Kindle cannot be covered under an extended warranty. Is this correct?


----------



## acti0n

Once #9 arrives Monday that will be the last. Unless it's somehow perfect, I'm just gonna stick with unit #3, which I find to be the most tolerable of the replacements -- I managed to remove the aforementioned piece of plastic sticking out of the top inner border after a little fiddling. While it does have some blotchiness on the bottom, it does not distract me from reading as bright dust specs, scratches, and discoloration would. So, while not perfect, I can at least get down to reading.

I guess this is what can happen when you're an early adopter. The Kindle Paperwhite, Nook Glow, and Kobo Glow are all the first generation of front-lift ereaders, and neither is without its issues.


----------



## Atunah

acti0n said:


> Once #9 arrives Monday that will be the last. Unless it's somehow perfect, I'm just gonna stick with unit #3, which I find to be the most tolerable of the replacements -- I managed to remove the aforementioned piece of plastic sticking out of the top inner border after a little fiddling. While it does have some blotchiness on the bottom, it does not distract me from reading as bright dust specs, scratches, and discoloration would. So, while not perfect, I can at least get down to reading.
> 
> I guess this is what can happen when you're an early adopter. The Kindle Paperwhite, Nook Glow, and Kobo Glow are all the first generation of front-lift ereaders, and neither is without its issues.


Yikes, I feel for you, I really do. I ended up settling on my #3. I just didn't want to deal anymore. My first had a bright speck and the screen was crooked put in. The text actually was tilting. It was also pink and blue. 
The next had a very bright light bleed on the lower left border and a bright led on the right. So bright I couldn't ignore even in daylight.

The one I settle with had a frame that isn't glued all the way, its lifted up at the edges, next to the rubber part. And its a little tilted as far as the text goes. It also has the most dark splotches between the lights out of all 3. But I settled with that one. I slapped it into the cover and hope for the best. .
I keep my light fairly low and its good to go.

So far so good and I really love everything else about my PW.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Alice Coyl said:


> Also, from what I can find out, a refurbished Kindle cannot be covered under an extended warranty. Is this correct?


I'm not sure who you got the extended warranty through? When I got an extended warranty on my netbook that was refurbished, Square Trade said there was no problem, as long as it was sold by a retailer.

Betsy


----------



## Alice Coyl

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I'm not sure who you got the extended warranty through? When I got an extended warranty on my netbook that was refurbished, Square Trade said there was no problem, as long as it was sold by a retailer.
> 
> Betsy


After two emails, Square Trade transferred my warranty. I have no idea if my replacement was a refurbished one or not. According to amazon.com refurbished units do not have a quick start guide and mine didn't have one. It is working fine so as long as the extended warranty is good, I won't worry about it.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Alice Coyl said:


> After two emails, Square Trade transferred my warranty. I have no idea if my replacement was a refurbished one or not. According to amazon.com refurbished units do not have a quick start guide and mine didn't have one. It is working fine so as long as the extended warranty is good, I won't worry about it.


Glad to hear that, Alice! That's consistent with what they told me...

Betsy


----------



## SilverMaple

gajitldy said:


> Morf - I have had my K3 for over two years and it cracked in both lower corners outward from the screen. I never had it replaced because it works fine. It has been in an Oberon case since day 1.
> 
> Diane


My K3 cracked in the corners, too, but it didn't affect the device. I covered the front with a DecalGirl skin so I didn't see the cracks and it works fine. It's been in an Oberon case since day one, and cracked after about a year of use.


----------



## SilverMaple

acti0n said:


> Amazon sent each replacement via overnight shipping. If you notify them of the issue early enough in the evening, it'll make the cutoff to arrive the next day. Their customer service has been excellent.


Overnight shipping? I called Amazon about the defective Kindle on the 10th and the replacement isn't supposed to be here until the 23rd. It's coming USPS, not FedEx or UPS either. I just checked tracking and it's been in California for 4 days, hasn't moved.

*pouts*


----------



## KimberlyinMN

I just received another replacement (#7 maybe?). More blobs although not as bad as some of them. It is going back today. I'm keeping the one with the dust spots. At least that one is SUPER white.

Sent from my SPH-M950 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Someone Nameless

KimberlyinMN, can you take a picture of the one with the white screen and dust specks?


----------



## ayuryogini

After frustration with 2 Kindle Paperwhites (the first: a battery life of 3 to 5 days, even on Airplane mode and no indexing, the 2nd: a grey screen even with the light at full capacity and very uneven lighting from below) I decided to return my Kindle Paperwhite 3G no SO, and order a new one. 

When the CS rep told me they would send another replacement with "the first one that comes off the shelf", I asked her if it would be  a brand new one, and told her that I didn't want to replace my brand new Kindle that I paid over $200 for (with tax), with a refurbished one. She repeated that it would be the next in line off the shelf, meaning that it could be new, but just as likely a refurbished one. 

I decided I didn't want to deal with someone else's reject, so I decided to return it altogether. I want to be guaranteed a brand new one. I'm hoping this next is "the ONE". (If it wasn't for the super short battery life, I would have been happy with the first one, so if anyone has any recommendations on trouble shooting that, I'd be obliged, though CS had me try a few things and determined it was a hardware issue). 

I noticed, too, that there is no longer a possibility of next day delivery with the Kindle PW; the only option was free 2 day shipping. I wonder why.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

If it's been less than 30 days, then they SHOULD replace with brand new.  If that's the case, suggest you call back and ask to speak to a supervisor.

If it's been more than 30 days, they will replace with whatever is available.  In my experience, refurbished units are usually as good as new, and have the same warranty.  Though of course there are exceptions.

Whether or not next day delivery is available is partly dependent upon what time of day it is that you're placing the order . . . if it's late enough in the day that there's no way they can get it to you the next day, they don't give that as an option.  I see you posed the above around 7:30 p.m. your time, so that might be the reason.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

Someone Nameless said:


> KimberlyinMN, can you take a picture of the one with the white screen and dust specks?


I will try to get a photo tonight. I know the screen pics don't seem to accurately show what the eye sees.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

My PW is so bright that I can read on level 1 in a dark room with no effort. Level 1 was equal to 5 on the previous unit.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

I forgot to take pictures last night.... BUT I remembered tonight! There are five or six dust specks but realistically, when I am reading a book, they don't show up. If the specks happen to be where a letter is, you can see it - but that doesn't happen often. I don't seem to read books with photos. This Paperwhite is SUPER white - the LEDs really work great. As I mentioned before, I can actually read with this at setting 1 in our dark bedroom. I've decided that I am VERY happy with this unit.  One out of eight is great! I know I am picky, but I think that's because there ARE good PWs out there and I didn't want to settle. Hmmm... kind of like I didn't get married until I was 37 because I was waiting for MY Mr. Right.  (And it really isn't my fault that the last two exes are dead.)

I don't think the photos are accurately showing just how good it is. (Or maybe they do.) I was going to take a picture at setting 1, but on the camera screen, it didn't seem to show up.

Light setting at 3:









Light setting at 24:









Picture showing dust specks... can you see the two in the photo?:









Arrows added to point out the specks:


----------



## Someone Nameless

It looks pretty good.  I couldn't see the specks until you pointed them out with the red arrows.  I tried to (pinch and) zoom in on the page with the text and I can't see them at all there.


----------



## SilverMaple

So, how did those of you who got overnight/2-day shipping on a replacement for a defective PW manage it?  My replacement Kindle is still in transit and it's been nearly 2 weeks.... I called Amazon again and they said it was their 'standard replacement shipping' method, which is not true as so many have received multiple replacements in the time it took them to send me one.  At this rate, I won't have time to replace it more than once if the first replacement isn't up to par.  Wonder if that's their new plan now that so many of the PW's have been returned multiple times?

My best friend is on #9 from Best Buy.  If #10 isn't better, she's giving up.  This is really disappointing.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

Where do you live? In most of the US it is, from reports here, their standard policy.

The one time I needed a kindle replaced I contacted Amazon and they sent it straight away.  I'm pretty sure I had it the next day and just needed, then, to return the defective one within 30 days to avoid being billed for the replacement.  

I do have a Prime membership; don't know if that makes a difference, but I don't think so.  As a rule they want working kindles in customers hands because that's the only way customers will buy books! 

It's also possible there are delays because of a higher than expected number of exchanges after Christmas: anything purchased in November or December is covered under the holiday return period that runs to the end of January.

I'd suggest that you contact them again and firmly explain that the device you purchased is defective and that you've requested a replacement and it's not come yet and what are they going to do?  If the person you're speaking to can't or won't help you, ask to speak to a supervisor.


----------



## Morf

In the UK, even without a prime membership, my replacement K3 (12 months or more ago) was shipped Royal Mail First Class, which meant I got it either the next day or the day after. 

Replacements for other faulty devices (including the replacement for a DVD player that the courier delivered by throwing over a gate...) have been shipped the same way.


----------



## skyblue

Wow, NINE faulty Paperwhites!! . I gave up after TWO!  I opted instead for a Kindle Fire HD and I LOVE it!  I'll stick with the Fire HD and my Kindle Keyboard.  Perhaps someday I will try for the Paperwhite, but not until they get the bugs worked out.


----------



## SilverMaple

My replacement kindle FINALLY got here today.... took nearly 2 weeks!  I'm going to have to call Amazon anyway, because there isn't any return shipping label or anything with it, and I'll be darned if I'm paying out of pocket to send the faulty one back when it took two weeks for the replacement to get here....

It's got an R on the box, but it is MUCH better than the old one.  The big light flare is not there, and it's much less 'pink'.  So far so good....


----------



## Ann in Arlington

SilverMaple said:


> My replacement kindle FINALLY got here today.... took nearly 2 weeks! I'm going to have to call Amazon anyway, because there isn't any return shipping label or anything with it, and I'll be darned if I'm paying out of pocket to send the faulty one back when it took two weeks for the replacement to get here....
> 
> It's got an R on the box, but it is MUCH better than the old one. The big light flare is not there, and it's much less 'pink'. So far so good....


In general, when you contact them about a return/exchange, they send you the return label via email.

And I would still address the delay in shipping the replacement. That shouldn't have happened.


----------



## sjc

Yay!!  SILVERMAPLE

Congrats on getting a keeper!!  Enjoy.


----------



## SilverMaple

I'm glad my new one is OK, but I'm really not happy it took 2 weeks to get here.  I called Amazon this morning, and they were completely unable to address why it took so long...  "we don't have any information to see why that happened..."

Since it took so long to get here, I hope the returned one gets to them in time to NOT be charged for two!


----------



## MamaProfCrash

You would probably need to call the delivery company


----------



## SilverMaple

Called again about the shipping-- apparently they were 'awaiting a new shipment of the Paperwhites' when mine was supposedly sitting in California for nearly a week.... I asked if that had something to do with all the returns, and the person 'didn't know'.  

Oh well, I got one that worked. Not real pleased that the full price was paid and I ended up with one that was refurbished, but at least it was in a new box and wasn't set up for someone else already.  And the sales rep sent me an email stating that she had personally made sure my account would not be charged if the replacement wasn't returned in time due to the shipping problem.  So as long as that happens, I am OK with it.


----------



## skyblue

This is another reason I don't want a Paperwhite at this time:  I don't want to pay for a new unit and receive a refurb!


----------



## Riverrun

Just to say I ordered my PW over the weekend, received notice around noon yesterday that it had been shipped, and the postman had it at our door at 0930 this a.m. It's adorable. BUT . . .

I bought it from Canada - I live there - whereas my others (two Kindle 4s, one used by the dh) were bought through the USA store since not available in Canada at the time. It came registered, of course. But there are no other devices registered to my account (maybe I used the wrong phone no. or wrong version of my name or alternate email address on this order since my Amazon.ca account was set up some time ago. Still checking.) which means I can't download the books I'm currently reading on my Mango (aka Kindle4 no. 1). Would it be easier to deregister this Kindle and register it according to details re my other Kindles? I've done nothing to it except tell it how cute it is and get it on WiFi and give it a name.

Thanks if you can help/advise.


----------



## Riverrun

Sorry, I just realized that this was probably the wrong place to post my previous query - unless of course it's a glitch, whatever that could be. I'm not very savvy re technology obviously.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

No problem, Riverrun, and glad to hear in the other thread that you've deregistered and registered successfully!  Enjoy!

Betsy


----------



## alicepattinson

Hi everyone. I've been having some issues with my Kindle Paperwhite recently and the basic troubleshooting helped it 
1st is to restart! Restarting your system can fix troubles such as a frozen screen or issues downloading content. Right after 20 seconds, let go of the power key. The charge indicator light will switch on soon after moments. If you've successfully re-booted your Kindle, you will notice the start-up panel. Pls remember that when you restart, everything will be set to default so better back up everything.


----------



## KimberlyinMN

alicepattinson said:


> Hi everyone. I've been having some issues with my Kindle Paperwhite recently and the basic troubleshooting helped it
> 1st is to restart! Restarting your system can fix troubles such as a frozen screen or issues downloading content. Right after 20 seconds, let go of the power key. The charge indicator light will switch on soon after moments. If you've successfully re-booted your Kindle, you will notice the start-up panel. Pls remember that when you restart, everything will be set to default so better back up everything.


That is incorrect. Restarting does not set everything back to default. It just shuts the Kindle off and turns it back on. Now, if you Reset the Kindle, that WILL set it back to factory settings. To reset, go to Settings, then click the menu button at the top right corner and tap Reset Device.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

Kimberly is correct -- there are two procedures.

The less invasive is to restart the device, which is like a reboot. That can be done from settings: menu/settings/menu RESTART. OR it can be done via the hardware if the device is unresponsive: Presss/Slide and hold the switch -- we usually suggest at least 40 seconds or until your finger hurts  -- and the put it down and let it reboot. You will NOT lose data by doing either of these, and if often fixes any glitches. The furthest point read _may_ be lost in your current book, if the device had been unable to sync with Amazon before you performed a restart. But your previous furthest point will have been saved.*

If a reboot doesn't fix it, a RESET may be needed. You can't do this via the hardware, but you can via the menu system: menu/settings/menu/reset to factory. It will shut off and will restart from scratch. In this case you WILL lose data. Depending on the device, it may be de-registered from Amazon and none of your books will show. It will be back to, essentially, the state it was in when you first took it out of the box. It won't remember any wifi networks you've used or have any personalized information. This is generally NOT recommended unless nothing else has work.

Neither of these things will fix something like a defective screen.

*If you do not have wifi turned on when you do a restart, then your books won't appear. . .but turn wifi on and do a sync and they'll be there again.


----------



## alicepattinson

KimberlyinMN said:


> That is incorrect. Restarting does not set everything back to default. It just shuts the Kindle off and turns it back on. Now, if you Reset the Kindle, that WILL set it back to factory settings. To reset, go to Settings, then click the menu button at the top right corner and tap Reset Device.


Oh I mean Reset all along. Sorry for the wrong term


----------



## heatherlynn

no one has posted in this thread in a while and i hate to be the one that has to :/ i just received my paperwhite today and as far as the screen lighting goes, it's pretty great. it wasn't perfect but the shadows were barely noticeable and it only had a slight green hue at the top. i could totally overlook it and call this device amazing, except mine has like four or five bright, white pixels scattered over the screen and they are extremely distracting. ugh :/ so it is going back and i ordered the replacement already. i hope this one is a keeper because i do not want to exchange this several times


----------



## WilliamG

heatherlynn said:


> no one has posted in this thread in a while and i hate to be the one that has to :/ i just received my paperwhite today and as far as the screen lighting goes, it's pretty great. it wasn't perfect but the shadows were barely noticeable and it only had a slight green hue at the top. i could totally overlook it and call this device amazing, except mine has like four or five bright, white pixels scattered over the screen and they are extremely distracting. ugh :/ so it is going back and i ordered the replacement already. i hope this one is a keeper because i do not want to exchange this several times


It's not white pixels, fyi. It's dust particles that have gotten in between the touch layer and the e-ink panel, unfortunately. Several of my Paperwhites suffered from it (along with green/pink) displays. After 3 or 4 replacements I gave up and went back to my Kindle Touch.


----------



## WilliamG

Thought you guys would be interested in seeing this. It's a review of the new Kobo. Not that interesting (or relevant) in of itself, but this comparison shot of night-time reading really shows the direction the Kindle needs to go.

Part-way down the article you can see a picture comparison of the Kobo and Paperwhite, in a dark environment. On the left, you can see the Kobo looking nice and white/uniform, and on the right is the Kindle Paperwhite looking all green and splotchy as most (all?) of them do.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/04/23/kobo-aura-hd-review/#continued

If I could get a Paperwhite that looked like the Kobo, I'd be on it in a second. I've invested for years in the Kindle store, so I'll stick with my Kindle Touch for the time being. Bah...

I really wish Amazon would fix the Paperwhite.


----------



## bordercollielady

WilliamG said:


> on the right is the Kindle Paperwhite looking all green and splotchy as most (all?) of them do.


Just a comment that I bought a PW a couple of weeks ago and my screen is perfect.. no green, no splotchies,
I was expecting issues and its flawless..

So they are improving!


----------



## telracs

WilliamG said:


> Thought you guys would be interested in seeing this. It's a review of the new Kobo. Not that interesting (or relevant) in of itself, but this comparison shot of night-time reading really shows the direction the Kindle needs to go.
> 
> Part-way down the article you can see a picture comparison of the Kobo and Paperwhite, in a dark environment. On the left, you can see the Kobo looking nice and white/uniform, and on the right is the Kindle Paperwhite looking all green and splotchy as most (all?) of them do.
> 
> http://www.engadget.com/2013/04/23/kobo-aura-hd-review/#continued
> 
> If I could get a Paperwhite that looked like the Kobo, I'd be on it in a second. I've invested for years in the Kindle store, so I'll stick with my Kindle Touch for the time being. Bah...
> 
> I really wish Amazon would fix the Paperwhite.


my paperwhite has never been splotchy. and call me cynical, but does anyone else think that maybe the kobo guys had a reason to make the PW look worse than most of them do?


----------



## FearIndex

telracs said:


> my paperwhite has never been splotchy. and call me cynical, but does anyone else think that maybe the kobo guys had a reason to make the PW look worse than most of them do?


Are you suggesting Engadget rigged their review?

That said, I actually see pink splotches in the Kobo too, in the first image.  Hard to tell if it is just the photograph or what...


----------



## Ann in Arlington

FearIndex said:


> Are you suggesting Engadget rigged their review?
> 
> That said, I actually see pink splotches in the Kobo too, in the first image.  Hard to tell if it is just the photograph or what...


Though quoting the post by William which linked to an engadget review, I think the poster might have been referring to the Kobo promo pictures. . .which were linked to in another thread. (http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,148678.0.html)

I do think Engadget is generally pretty objective. That said, in all their side-by-side pictures, the Kindle, to my eye, looks better. YMMV of course. And I'm not interested in a bigger screen or heavier device so. . . .no temptation here.

I do think it is extremely likely that the Kobo people didn't go to any great trouble to find the best PW they could. And I expect they played with the lighting conditions so that their device would look as good as possible in comparison. It would, of course, be unethical, to use a kindle that they knew to be damaged or defective in their comparison. But a stock model that happened to display the splotchiness next to their hand picked best-screen-we-can-find example is just good marketing.


----------



## FearIndex

Thanks Ann in Arlington for pointing me towards that thread, that clarifies the comment.


----------



## telracs

just to clarify, i was NOT accusing endgadget of anything. i wasn't accusing anyone of anything nefarious.  i don't know who took the pictures in question, and honestly, i don't care.

i was simply stating that if an advertiser is trying to show that one e-reader is better than another, and is under the impression that PWs have splotch issues, they may not have gone out for their way to find out that most PWs don't have splotch issues and they may not have gone out of their way to find one that doesn't.


----------



## WilliamG

telracs said:


> just to clarify, i was NOT accusing endgadget of anything. i wasn't accusing anyone of anything nefarious. i don't know who took the pictures in question, and honestly, i don't care.
> 
> i was simply stating that if an advertiser is trying to show that one e-reader is better than another, and is under the impression that PWs have splotch issues, they may not have gone out for their way to find out that most PWs don't have splotch issues and they may not have gone out of their way to find one that doesn't.


See, I'm in the camp that believes that most PWs DO have the splotch issue. I've never seen one without. Hell, I was in London last month and bought my mother a brand new one from John Lewis (in Brent Cross, for those Londoners out there). Splotch-tastic! Of course, she doesn't notice, and neither does my sister who bought a Paperwhite the day after seeing my mother's. Good grief.

So, I unquestionably believe it's not a case of PWs not having the splotch issue; it's the case of most people simply not noticing it. And because of this, Amazon probably won't care to address the problem.

And for those who haven't followed my posts, the reason this bothers me so much is because I (and my wife both) REALLY want a Paperwhite. *sigh* Next time, Amazon. Next time..


----------



## CAR

WilliamG said:


> See, I'm in the camp that believes that most PWs DO have the splotch issue. I've never seen one without. Hell, I was in London last month and bought my mother a brand new one from John Lewis (in Brent Cross, for those Londoners out there). Splotch-tastic! Of course, she doesn't notice, and neither does my sister who bought a Paperwhite the day after seeing my mother's. Good grief.
> 
> So, I unquestionably believe it's not a case of PWs not having the splotch issue; it's the case of most people simply not noticing it. And because of this, Amazon probably won't care to address the problem.
> 
> And for those who haven't followed my posts, the reason this bothers me so much is because I (and my wife both) REALLY want a Paperwhite. *sigh* Next time, Amazon. Next time..


Well we love both our Paperwhites, hope the next Kindle version works better for you!


----------



## WilliamG

CAR said:


> Well we love both our Paperwhites, hope the next Kindle version works better for you!


Thanks, me too!


----------



## northofdivision

Just want to do a six month check in. I tried five paperwhites in nov to december when they first came out and they were all kinds of terrible to me (mostly due to the blue or pink or yellow or unequal lighting throughout the screen). amazon has always done a stand up job with returns and i will continue to support them fully. its well known by those small number of us who seem to have eyes that catch the tints and blotches that this is the main issue. for me the lighting at the bottom being slightly off didn't/doesn't bother me one bit and i never had problems with specs. functionality i was really impressed by on the PW, the battery life, the look of it overall (its incredibly smooth and great looking), the list view is solid. by xmas i was exhausted of the return open boxup return process and just went back to a black k4 (my favorite of kindles). i also tried nook, kobo and sony's latest and liked the send-it feature of kindle too much so i returned those as well.

**for those of you who hate pdf's on kindles, i gotta admit, sony readers really hit it on the nail with PDFs. i am pretty blown away by how well they read on sony readers. i'm heavily in the kindle camp for ereading but decided to keep a mini 5" sony prs 350sc for a dedicated PDF reader (don't get the prs 300 as its the older slower model) i got mint on ebay for 40 bucks. 

months go by. i keep seeing the paperwhites around. jan, feb, march, april. i keep saying "just be happy with the k4. its a great reader". but i fall prey to "latest model syndrome" so this month i gave it another shot and purchased my sixth PW hoping they worked out the kinks (for people like me with great 20/20 or crappy sensitive eyes, you choose). charged it up, loaded up a few books. then waited till nighttime. i noticed that it was better than the previous models i had in NOV where some had a pink blue yellow and green hues and tints on it which makes me think they have been taking all the complaints to heart). this one was better. it was most lit at the top two centimeters, clean at the bottom, and the sides were pretty even which was great. at the center and middle third of the device however there it was, color splotch, deeper and a bit bluish. all of this is only in the dark or when i put it higher than 12-15 when its not too dark. in the dark, i can see it at 6-8 light levels. I would read in the dark at 2-4. i gave it a few weeks but the lighting unevenness just doesn't work for my eyes. its definitely not even to me so i'm conceding the PW.  just boxed it up and dropped it in the mailbox for return. no hard feelings. if it was even, i would be able to love it but the LED issues are still there for me. I'm pretty hopeful they're going to improve upon it come the next one at the end of the year. looking forward to it. till then, back to the black k4. its my favorite reader and i appreciate the one handedness (i can use it and turn pages with my palm while riding on the subway something i can't do with a pw). as a workaround for the dark, i picked up a coleman mini led lantern and it works pretty great. just not as good as being able to fall asleep like a paperwhite knowing it'll just turn off. the PW has some great features and by far is the best looking reader out there. 

currently reading Jenny Lawson "let's pretend this never happened", Zadie Smith' "the book of other people," and Miranda July "it chooses you". Great reads.


----------



## sjc

Northofdivision:  Thanks for the review and the time/effort.


----------



## spotsmom

I know this has been addressed way back in the thread, but...

I got my PW late Fall and though I don't have any issues with the lighting on the screen the unit has, on occasion, skipped pages.  Then I lent it to DH and it would be at 10% and then skip to 70%, or something else ridiculous. Note that he is rather "technically challenged".    I called CS and they had me restart it, etc. and I've hung in with it even though it will occasionally skip pages.

But lately I have gotten error messages and the unit has hung up (most recently on a book I downloaded from the library).  I have restarted it twice this weekend.

Should I ask for another?  And no, it's been a day since I got the error messages.  Remember what they said?


----------



## MamaProfCrash

Yes, ask for a replacement


----------



## Ann in Arlington

spotsmom said:


> I know this has been addressed way back in the thread, but...
> 
> I got my PW late Fall and though I don't have any issues with the lighting on the screen the unit has, on occasion, skipped pages. Then I lent it to DH and it would be at 10% and then skip to 70%, or something else ridiculous. Note that he is rather "technically challenged".  I called CS and they had me restart it, etc. and I've hung in with it even though it will occasionally skip pages.
> 
> But lately I have gotten error messages and the unit has hung up (most recently on a book I downloaded from the library). I have restarted it twice this weekend.
> 
> Should I ask for another? And no, it's been a day since I got the error messages. Remember what they said?


Well the fast skipping could be the 'technically challenged' holding a finger on the screen too long.  But if it's doing it for you as well, that's different. And the other stuff doesn't seem like something caused by 'user error'. 

I'd say try a few home remedies first but it may be time to ask for a replacement.

Make sure it's completely charged and do a restart -- either via the menu or via the button. It sounds like you've done that, though, so if the error message, especially, keeps coming up, definitely call. I'd probably suggest waiting until you see the error message again so can note what it says and be able to tell them when you call.

A 'hang up' can just be a computer glitching. How full is the PW. . . . it's _supposed_ to hold 1100 books but we've found with all varieties of kindle that once you get to a third or more of that number, especially if you use collections, responsiveness can slow.

Also, if all the books aren't indexed properly -- sometimes one is a bad download and will hang up that process -- it can cause responsiveness issues. You most often notice it, though, because the battery is draining faster than expected. You can check for that by searching on a 'word' that won't exist, like tcxj, and note if it tells you there's anything not yet indexed.

So if it's potentially just 'fullness' that's causing issues you'd have to delete some things. Or do a real 'spring clean' and reset it to factory conditions via the menu. Then start adding books slowly back. That's a MAJOR step, of course -- you'll use all your personalization, have to re-teach it any wifi networks it now uses, etc. It will probably de-register it so you'll have to do that again though when you do it should, at least remember its name.

If the 'hanging up' is in downloading, toggling wireless off and on again sometimes fixes that. Or forget your wifi network and then re-enter the info. We have two broadcasts at our house on two different bands so I will sometimes toggle between them and that's enough to trigger the wifi radio to seek the outside world.


----------



## spotsmom

Thanks, Ann.  I had considered the technically challenged leaving his finger on the screen too long.    But I only have a little over 100 books on the PW, so I don't think that's the problem.  I shall wait for the error message(s) again and WRITE THEM DOWN.

I did the restarts by holding the button 20 seconds and then letting it go.  If there's anything other than that, I don't know about it.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

spotsmom said:


> I did the restarts by holding the button 20 seconds and then letting it go. If there's anything other than that, I don't know about it.


There's also a restart option via the menu: menu/settings/menu/restart. It's generally preferable to do it that way if you can access the menu; less wear and tear on the switch, etc. (Be sure to RESTART and not RESET to Factory!) But, of course, if it's locked up and UN-responsive, the switch is the only way.

You're right, though. . .100 books shouldn't be causing problems. . .unless one of the files is corrupt but, even then, seems like you'd only have the problem when using that one book.


----------



## spotsmom

thanks, Ann.  I did it and will keep my fingers crossed that all is well.


----------



## FearIndex

northofdivision said:


> months go by. i keep seeing the paperwhites around. jan, feb, march, april. i keep saying "just be happy with the k4. its a great reader". but i fall prey to "latest model syndrome" so this month i gave it another shot and purchased my sixth PW hoping they worked out the kinks (for people like me with great 20/20 or crappy sensitive eyes, you choose). charged it up, loaded up a few books. then waited till nighttime. i noticed that it was better than the previous models i had in NOV where some had a pink blue yellow and green hues and tints on it which makes me think they have been taking all the complaints to heart). this one was better. it was most lit at the top two centimeters, clean at the bottom, and the sides were pretty even which was great. at the center and middle third of the device however there it was, color splotch, deeper and a bit bluish. all of this is only in the dark or when i put it higher than 12-15 when its not too dark. in the dark, i can see it at 6-8 light levels. I would read in the dark at 2-4. i gave it a few weeks but the lighting unevenness just doesn't work for my eyes. its definitely not even to me so i'm conceding the PW. just boxed it up and dropped it in the mailbox for return. no hard feelings. if it was even, i would be able to love it but the LED issues are still there for me. I'm pretty hopeful they're going to improve upon it come the next one at the end of the year. looking forward to it. till then, back to the black k4. its my favorite reader and i appreciate the one handedness (i can use it and turn pages with my palm while riding on the subway something i can't do with a pw). as a workaround for the dark, i picked up a coleman mini led lantern and it works pretty great. just not as good as being able to fall asleep like a paperwhite knowing it'll just turn off. the PW has some great features and by far is the best looking reader out there.


Thank you for the "six month update". Good to hear experiences on the progress on this one. I think we can quite safely chalk "the blotches" up as a feature, but also one that only some people see or find bothersome - especially because it mostly bothers those who read in the dark as opposed to reading in lit areas.

I myself have to say I have been happy with the $69 Kindle 5 I bought after my disappointment with PW. I do still have the PW, play with it occasionally, but it just isn't my reader (for those tuning in, I chose against returning it at the time for various reasons, including due to cost because it was ordered to a foreign destination through a third-party courier service).

I have bought one (or now two) of every Kindle generation since the first international model (second gen). I'm beginning to wonder if PW is updated for 2013, I might have to give it a pass. I think even if they even it out, the frontlight experience just isn't for me. It just lacks that papery, e-ink feeling.

However, if Amazon comes out with a revised regular e-ink reader, I'll be all over that pre-order button...


----------



## renrenlwg

Thanks for the review


----------



## WilliamG

After all my kvetching about the Paperwhite's uneven lighting and pink/green splotches, I'm hopeful Amazon has addressed these issues with the rev. 2 Paperwhite. I have one on order. Come on, September 30!


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

telracs said:


> my paperwhite has never been splotchy. and call me cynical, but does anyone else think that maybe the kobo guys had a reason to make the PW look worse than most of them do?


I realize this is an old post but I have seen 4 (and tested under a variety of lighting conditions and PW light settings) side by side and every single one showed what the author did with the pink mottling and the gray diagonal band. Not all were as noticeable but during our pilot testing, each tester observed it. It bothered some people, others it did not. Also, you can minimize it somewhat depending on the PW settings you choose.

Another issue, besides the dust specs, were 'hot spots' where the lights at the bottom were more exposed and not adequately recessed. THat also bothered some people...the one I finally accepted had one of those. I dont really notice it when I'm reading. I went for the screen with the most uniform overall lighting I could find at the time.

And the marquee lighting at the bottom was present in all as well.


----------



## northofdivision

this is a good example of lighting in the dark (between a paperwhite and a aura hd). i can see the shadows on the paperwhite and it bothers me. i wonder how many of those who say they have perfect screens don't see the splotches in this youtube darkness demo. From what it looks like, the paperwhite 2 coming out at the end of the month will have improved upon the lighting significantly. Very excited. *optimism* Don't want an aura HD but maybe will have to pick up the new aura 6" that has the same lighting. at the same time, the paperwhite software and prime option sells it for me. From 3:55 they actually talk about the lighting itself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uyniTpucQ8


----------



## northofdivision

For the many of you who vented on this thread about the color splotches, the news in so far is really great. all of the people on Amazon.com reviewing the PW2 are all happy with the new gen lighting...:

"The first generation Kindle Paperwhite was plagued with "issues." The main issue that consumers complained about was that the screen wasn't nearly white enough and in many cases the screen had a pink/green bleed through their screen. This led to a flurry of people who exchanged their Paperwhite six or seven times in a row in order to get the perfect white e-reader. This led to amazon responding by saying that the off color in places is considered a normal occurrence.There has only been limited use of this item so far but I am here to say that the screen is definitely whiter. It has a brilliant brightness and there is definitely a noticeable increase in resolution."

"the screen lighting is AMAZING, and much better than my first PW. It's even, no spotlighting or colored blotches, Hopefully, all will agree. I got a decent PW V.1 on my second attempt, but this is definitely an improvement."

*optimism*


----------



## WilliamG

northofdivision said:


> For the many of you who vented on this thread about the color splotches, the news in so far is really great. all of the people on Amazon.com reviewing the PW2 are all happy with the new gen lighting...:
> 
> "The first generation Kindle Paperwhite was plagued with "issues." The main issue that consumers complained about was that the screen wasn't nearly white enough and in many cases the screen had a pink/green bleed through their screen. This led to a flurry of people who exchanged their Paperwhite six or seven times in a row in order to get the perfect white e-reader. This led to amazon responding by saying that the off color in places is considered a normal occurrence.There has only been limited use of this item so far but I am here to say that the screen is definitely whiter. It has a brilliant brightness and there is definitely a noticeable increase in resolution."
> 
> "the screen lighting is AMAZING, and much better than my first PW. It's even, no spotlighting or colored blotches, Hopefully, all will agree. I got a decent PW V.1 on my second attempt, but this is definitely an improvement."
> 
> *optimism*


Just got mine. The lighting is definitely an improvement. I'm extremely picky, so my particular unit still does have those shadows at the bottom, but they're much, MUCH more diffused about the bottom half of the page. I still think the uniformity could be better. While there's no longer any REALLY obvious green and pink (at least in mine) visible throughout the page like on the previous generation, there's still a general&#8230;. patchiness to the image.

Sadly, mine has some reflective matter of some sort under the capacitive layer, which is reflective and unpleasant, so I'm exchanging it (only going to do this once).

If my replacement is no better, or worse, I'll stick with my Kindle Touch yet another year.

Here's my Paperwhite 2, complete with not-completely-uniform image (noticeably brighter at the top, for example), with the shadowy patches at the bottom. And yeah, it's a tad green, too. So it goes...


----------



## northofdivision

nice observations. sorry to hear about the return.  i just got my pw2. there are a few dust particles between the capacitative layer and the e-ink screen (not pinholes but dust i'm guessing) but the lighting is so much improved i may just be alright. so far so good.


----------



## WilliamG

northofdivision said:


> nice observations. sorry to hear about the return. i just got my pw2. there are a few dust particles between the capacitative layer and the e-ink screen (not pinholes but dust i'm guessing) but the lighting is so much improved i may just be alright. so far so good.


Yeah, I just hope I can get one without OBVIOUS reflective particles in between the touch layer and the e-ink display. Amazon should be more careful with dust and their screens...


----------



## Kindle-lite

Just received my PW2 today too and all is perfect except one "dust spot" at the very bottom at the page number/location area.  Not really noticeable while I'm reading text but can be seen even in low light.  Bummer, but since the rest of screen is perfect and the lighting is very even, I will keep it.


----------



## teralpar

WilliamG said:


> Just got mine. The lighting is definitely an improvement. I'm extremely picky, so my particular unit still does have those shadows at the bottom, but they're much, MUCH more diffused about the bottom half of the page. I still think the uniformity could be better. While there's no longer any REALLY obvious green and pink (at least in mine) visible throughout the page like on the previous generation, there's still a general&#8230;. patchiness to the image.
> 
> If my replacement is no better, or worse, I'll stick with my Kindle Touch yet another year.


My PW2 somewhat looks like yours, although there's no green tinge. As I read on it more, I'm starting to get used to it...however, I did contact Amazon last night and they are sending a replacement, which should arrive tomorrow. I will compare that one to the one I have now and see which screen is better. If I'm not happy with either one of them I may just return both of them and hold out for the Fire HDX 7" or iPad Mini Retina (if released).


----------



## FearIndex

The words "I want to believe" crossed my mind when comparing beliefs from just a few days a go to what now starts to emerge.

First, PW2 can't turn off the LEDs in the lowest setting, contrary to first reports. A minor niggle, I'll survive. Second, reports again of dust speckles inside the screens. O-o, well hope I don't get one of those. Third, now reports of uneven lighting. Possibly a showstopper. (Then there is the question of warm white on the PW2 compared to cool white on the PW1, although this may be an improvement.)

I think my hopes have taken a notch backwards again. In all ways PW2 seems to be an improvement on the PW1, even in the first three areas I listed above, but still when the real comparison to me isn't really PW1 (which I don't use much) - but every other e-ink Kindle, the standard is high. The $69 Kindle 5 I use now has by far the best e-ink experience I have ever seen.

Can PW2 match or improve on the pure e-ink bliss on $69 Kindle 5? Or will it again be a letdown?

I guess I'm still keeping my pre-order (international ones won't ship until 15th). At least this time I'm ordering direct shipping from Amazon so returns are more realistic, if need be.

p.s. WilliamG, would it be possible to get some photos of the PW2 lighting with the screen refreshed better - now it has e-ink residue from the text of past screens that makes it harder to discern what is just leftover text (that happens on other Kindles too if you don't use full refresh, and sometimes even then) and what is uneven lighting?


----------



## Kevin B. Leigh

I just got my first Paperwhite (or should I call it Paperweight) yesterday too. Thanks for the tip on the off power reboot because I was loosing it. Getting ready to make it a chew toy for my dog who would love to slobber all over it. (just kidding, I would never let him eat plastic) 
Now I have to say I love it, and ended up staying up till now reading (3:45am), thanks a lot Amazon, I'm obsessed with your stuff.


----------



## Ann in Arlington

I see absolutely nothing wrong with the screen in the picture William G posted.

So . . . as we discovered a year ago. . . . people see things differently.  

FWIW, I thought my PW1 was just about perfect and I'd have to say the PW2 is better. Which, frankly, surprised me.  I was mostly ordering because, well, it's a new gadget.  Need I say more?  Yes the 'white' is a different shade of white -- neither better nor worse, just different -- but I do think the print it darker/sharper.  It's definitely faster.

I would encourage people to not judge by what you see in pictures here. . . .they're moderately illustrative but what YOUR EYES perceive in real life may be something different.  AND, you will have a different device. Henry Ford's assembly line notwithstanding, no two things are EXACTLY alike.


----------



## WilliamG

FearIndex said:


> The words "I want to believe" crossed my mind when comparing beliefs from just a few days a go to what now starts to emerge.
> 
> First, PW2 can't turn off the LEDs in the lowest setting, contrary to first reports. A minor niggle, I'll survive. Second, reports again of dust speckles inside the screens. O-o, well hope I don't get one of those. Third, now reports of uneven lighting. Possibly a showstopper. (Then there is the question of warm white on the PW2 compared to cool white on the PW1, although this may be an improvement.)
> 
> I think my hopes have taken a notch backwards again. In all ways PW2 seems to be an improvement on the PW1, even in the first three areas I listed above, but still when the real comparison to me isn't really PW1 (which I don't use much) - but every other e-ink Kindle, the standard is high. The $69 Kindle 5 I use now has by far the best e-ink experience I have ever seen.
> 
> Can PW2 match or improve on the pure e-ink bliss on $69 Kindle 5? Or will it again be a letdown?
> 
> I guess I'm still keeping my pre-order (international ones won't ship until 15th). At least this time I'm ordering direct shipping from Amazon so returns are more realistic, if need be.
> 
> p.s. WilliamG, would it be possible to get some photos of the PW2 lighting with the screen refreshed better - now it has e-ink residue from the text of past screens that makes it harder to discern what is just leftover text (that happens on other Kindles too if you don't use full refresh, and sometimes even then) and what is uneven lighting?


Here's another image. This one is still going back. I just can't deal with a patchy orange/green backlight/display, and it's REALLY bothering me. I love my Kindle Touch, and it just puts out a "cleaner" image.

And if you have really good eyes when looking at this image, you can see the glinting piece of dust in the bottom third of the display, bang smack in the middle. A small, reflective "dot."

The more I use the Paperwhite 2, the more I think the lighting really isn't that much better than Paperwhite 1. It's just&#8230; different.


----------



## WilliamG

Ann in Arlington said:


> I see absolutely nothing wrong with the screen in the picture William G posted.
> 
> So . . . as we discovered a year ago. . . . people see things differently.
> 
> FWIW, I thought my PW1 was just about perfect and I'd have to say the PW2 is better. Which, frankly, surprised me. I was mostly ordering because, well, it's a new gadget. Need I say more?  Yes the 'white' is a different shade of white -- neither better nor worse, just different -- but I do think the print it darker/sharper. It's definitely faster.
> 
> I would encourage people to not judge by what you see in pictures here. . . .they're moderately illustrative but what YOUR EYES perceive in real life may be something different. AND, you will have a different device. Henry Ford's assembly line notwithstanding, no two things are EXACTLY alike.


Yep, you're not wrong (well, objectively speaking you are, since the color variances can be measured in Photoshop etc etc). But that it doesn't bother you is absolutely true, of course.


----------



## FearIndex

Thanks WilliamG.

Looking at the image inverted, the splotchiness and bottom shadows are easier to discern:










I can also confirm Photoshop shows color variances all over the screen, although of course a photograph suffers from limitations of the camera, JPG compression etc.


----------



## FearIndex

To be fair, even many LCDs (most e.g. laptop and PC screens) are splotchy, there is light leakage etc. and all sorts of issues with LCDs (AMOLEDs are better in this regard).

It is just that in a lower lit e-reader it really matters in a different way than it does on a PC screen. Also the nature of the PW splotchiness is a little different than on LCDs.

LCD issues also bother people in varying ways. They are very real, though.


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

WilliamG said:


> Yep, you're not wrong (well, objectively speaking you are, since the color variances can be measured in Photoshop etc etc). But that it doesn't bother you is absolutely true, of course.


I totally see it William. The pink and green/gray mottling. I've seen 6 original PWs 'in real life' and all had it to some degree or another.

The one I kept, out of 4, had that more minimally than others. Most common, in everyone I saw, there was a darker diagonal band across the screen.


----------



## WilliamG

Thanks, guys, and especially for that inverted image. That really shows EXACTLY what I see (well, inverted, of course!).

I'll see how the replacement looks, but if it's no better or similar, I'll stick with my Kindle Touch. I know the case with built-in-light from Amazon for the Touch isn't perfect, but that's fine with me, since it's consistent, and very much like a NORMAL light should be! Looks like I won't be upgrading my Kindle this year, either.


----------



## FearIndex

It almost looks like there are diagonal light guides going from the leftmost and rightmost  bottom LED to the middle of the screen, creating diagonal splotch-lines upwards from the bottom corners, and then these beams of splotch adjoin in the middle to create a great ball of splotch.

It looks a bit like a heart shape in the middle with diagonal supporting prongs beneath it holding it up.

The splotches lessen or change color in the top-most quarter of the screen and also in the middle of the bottom quarter.

And of course in the bottom there are the four "balls" from the LEDs.


----------



## northofdivision

WilliamG said:


> Thanks, guys, and especially for that inverted image. That really shows EXACTLY what I see (well, inverted, of course!).
> 
> I'll see how the replacement looks, but if it's no better or similar, I'll stick with my Kindle Touch. I know the case with built-in-light from Amazon for the Touch isn't perfect, but that's fine with me, since it's consistent, and very much like a NORMAL light should be! Looks like I won't be upgrading my Kindle this year, either.


My eyes catch that upper middle section on your pics and it would bother me but keep it optimistic till the next one they send. Never know. i was pretty much the #1 anti pw1 threader for the entire year because of my frustration with all the splotches, hue and font weight issues. The pw2 i got is solid. I can see some minor issues (i mentioned a few dust particles i can see when i turn it up to 22) but like you, one of my main wants with lighting is for it to get out of the way and let me just read and i think i might have found it. Don't settle unless you get one that works for you. My friend recently said "why would i upgrade from the pw (original)? its the perfect reader with the perfect screen" and i look at him like he's the craziest person on the planet with his rainbow hue wonderland that he sees at perfect white... Worst case scenario is you read phenomenal books via your ktouch. Not a bad fate either way.


----------



## WilliamG

northofdivision said:


> My eyes catch that upper middle section on your pics and it would bother me but keep it optimistic till the next one they send. Never know. i was pretty much the #1 anti pw1 threader for the entire year because of my frustration with all the splotches, hue and font weight issues. The pw2 i got is solid. I can see some minor issues (i mentioned a few dust particles i can see when i turn it up to 22) but like you, one of my main wants with lighting is for it to get out of the way and let me just read and i think i might have found it. Don't settle unless you get one that works for you. My friend recently said "why would i upgrade from the pw (original)? its the perfect reader with the perfect screen" and i look at him like he's the craziest person on the planet with his rainbow hue wonderland that he sees at perfect white... Worst case scenario is you read phenomenal books via your ktouch. Not a bad fate either way.


I'll be positive! Replacement will be here tomorrow!


----------



## KimberlyinMN

On my PW2, I noticed a very teensy bit of the shadowing at the bottom. Barely noticeable. It's so minor, that I'm keeping this baby.  (And yes, I am the person who goes through EVERY item on the shelf or rack to make sure I'm getting the best of the bunch - shirts, pants, purses. I check all the stitching and all that. Drives the Hubs nuts.)

The one other thing I noticed, however, is that it isn't as "bright" as my PW1. It could be just the difference between the _warm _white of the PW2 and the _cool _white of the PW1. I traded the PW1 already, so I'm not able to do a side-by-side shot. What I mean is that I could easily read on level 3 or 4 in my mostly dark bedroom without any problems. With the PW2, I need to be on about a level 6. However, my final PW1 was SUPER bright. I'd gone through 8 or 9 of them and settled on that one. It did have a little bit of the blotchy stuff, but barely. Even the shadowing at the bottom wasn't bad. It also had a couple of the dust spots, but they really only showed up if I was looking at the cover of a book.

Gosh, it feels almost ODD to be satisfied with the first PW2.


----------



## WilliamG

Got my second Paperwhite 2, today, and if anything it's worse. More patchy, more non-uniform, weird speckles everywhere etc...

New one on the left - old Paperwhite 2 on the right... - you can see how orange, green, and patchy the new one is. I'm sending them both back, and will be sticking with my Kindle Touch another year. 

Feel free to do that invert thingy on it!


----------



## FearIndex

Thank you for posting, WilliamG. Sorry to hear that. 

Yes, the bottom shadows for example are discernibly worse on your new one already in the "white" image. Inversion brings out other points easier...

Here is the inverted:


----------



## WilliamG

Thanks for those images. Unfortunately, I can't recommend the Paperwhite 2 at all.


----------



## FearIndex

WilliamG said:


> Thanks for those images. Unfortunately, I can't recommend the Paperwhite 2 at all.


It seems like quality variances from unit to unit still remain in the PW2 era. The fact that so many people seem to point out dust or something under their screens is very unfortunate too.

I guess the earlier theory or info about PW light-guide simply being very hard to manufacture to an exacting standard remains with PW2 too.

Well, it will still take some time to gather more information about how much of the same or how much of an improvement PW2 is over the PW1 in the wider opinion.


----------



## WilliamG

FearIndex said:


> It seems like quality variances from unit to unit still remain in the PW2 era. The fact that so many people seem to point out dust or something under their screens is very unfortunate too.
> 
> I guess the earlier theory or info about PW light-guide simply being very hard to manufacture to an exacting standard remains with PW2 too.
> 
> Well, it will still take some time to gather more information about how much of the same or how much of an improvement PW2 is over the PW1 in the wider opinion.


Yeah. Pretty bummed about it right now, that's for sure. I was really, really looking forward to the new Paperwhite, as I didn't think Amazon could mess up after another year. But...alas...


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

WilliamG said:


> Yeah. Pretty bummed about it right now, that's for sure. I was really, really looking forward to the new Paperwhite, as I didn't think Amazon could mess up after another year. But...alas...


Really sorry William, but I saw what you meant in the pics.

What is really frustrating (and I BEGGED Amazon CS to do this for my 3rd PW) is that they do not bother to do any quality control or checking when responding to a replacement. No one opens them up and checks to see if you are getting a quality unit. I guess you just get another random one from the pool. My 3rd one has a bright spot at the bottom, but has the most even screen of 4....my co-worker couldnt stand the bright spot but I barely notice it and prefer the more even screen.

For me tho, the lighted screen still beats a clip on, so I kept...and enjoy...my PW1.


----------



## WilliamG

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> Really sorry William, but I saw what you meant in the pics.
> 
> What is really frustrating (and I BEGGED Amazon CS to do this for my 3rd PW) is that they do not bother to do any quality control or checking when responding to a replacement. No one opens them up and checks to see if you are getting a quality unit. I guess you just get another random one from the pool. My 3rd one has a bright spot at the bottom, but has the most even screen of 4....my co-worker couldnt stand the bright spot but I barely notice it and prefer the more even screen.
> 
> For me tho, the lighted screen still beats a clip on, so I kept...and enjoy...my PW1.


Yeah.. I'll be sad if my Kindle Touch dies. I love the thing, even though the case with light is terribly designed compared to its predecessor's light - so much glare, gah! Still better than looking at an orange/green/patchy Paperwhite display. 

Next year, Amazon..., please?


----------



## FearIndex

The third generation Kindle wad so great, the light, the case, the screen, everything really. I loved Kindle 2 too. As can be read from ny signature review links, I think every generation since has had some sort of large issues - stemming from splitting the product line (only some models get some upsides but none get all), the changed lighted case design (glare to eyes, hotspotting to screen), to case leather quality, to software issues like no all-the-time refresh in early 4th-gen models to, finally, the PW1/2 screen quality evenness issues. Again, to get the best screen and blacks, $69 Kindle 5, but to get the best features, PW... And Fire if you need audio...

I know all Kindle generations have had their quality issues, but since the fourth generation choosing the perfect Kindle has arguably become impossible. Too bad. I think $69 Kindle 5 can be made to work, as I and others have done by modding the light a little, but there's always that little compromise in the air that wasn't there with the third generation. Too bad going back to third generation would seem like a compromise now too.

I hope one day Amazon makes the definitive e-ink experience, no compromise experience again.

Rationally I think I should cancel the PW2 order. I guess I won't yet, though.


----------



## larryb52

its just my opinion and not saying anything about what is seen or not seen but e ink itself has never been perfect, its just easier on the eyes than say a ipad for reading and again I say that as a generality. But on any given PW2 screen you get your going to find there will be something that is not perfect. The device is revolutionary in and of itself. It works for some. But lets be honest. Its a reader , try reading on it not starring at the screen looking for imperfections. Again I'm not saying WilliamG doesn't see what he sees but to invert the picture the white letters on black is a bit of a stretch. Trust me, I'm a nit picker and I have always said if you want to see something negative about something yes you will find it. I would say you have 30 days to return it why not use it as a reader with words on a page and read. If its a good book I think you may find that you will see the words not the imperfections and to anyone I may have insulted I am sorry this was not my intent. This is just my 2 cents...


----------



## Ann in Arlington

Larry, I agree. And I know from your past posts here that you are. . . . particular. 

But, yeah. . . just read on the darn thing. Don't go staring at it until your eyes cross looking for problems. Take a deep breath. Relax, start reading. _Maybe_ you'll find that what seems so obvious when you're inspecting it with such precision is really not a big deal when you're immersed in a story.

OR -- it may be that the imperfections do continue to bother you. You know what? Everyone's eyes are different. (My husband doesn't see shades of color particularly well -- I always imagine he sees the world like a cartoon on TV.  ) I've already said I don't see the problems William apparently does. He'd probably see problems on my PW as well. But I don't. Oh well. I do not have to read through his eyes and he does not have to read through mine! 

And, it is also true, that some people are more 'particular'  than others about their devices. That's also o.k. 

Again, though, I would caution folks reading this thread against making decisions based solely on a computer screen rendering of a picture. The quality of the image is going to be affected by the camera quality, the digitizing, and the monitor resolution. I once tried to take a picture of my PW1 and I could not, for the life of me, get a shot that i thought accurately represented what My Eyes saw! The photography process was introducing flaws that were not visible to me. And in fact the images earlier here look different to me depending which computer I'm using.

Bottom line: if you think you want a PW -- order one. Be realistic about your expectations -- you'll know yourself best, after all -- but keep an open mind. Take your 30 days to use it and read on it and see if it works for you. And if it doesn't, send it back. I, for one, think Amazon is AMAZINGLY generous with this policy.


----------



## northofdivision

front-lit lighting is a particular hardware challenge to get right for some people, regardless of the device/generation (aura/kobo/kindle). i still think it's in its infancy stages and gets tighter/better each year. it also seems people who are incredibly happy with their pws 1 or 2 find it very difficult to understand where a lot of us who have had/have problems with the lighting are coming from so they make comments like "try reading and don't look for imperfections" or "just read on the darn thing"...the entire point is that those who post on threads like this can't just read on them and that's part of the frustration for them. imagine looking at a screen right when you turn it on and all you see are pink splotches and light shadows running all through it. this is what some are experiencing. from my year of 7 pw1s last year, i can tell you its horribly maddening. my pw2 has dust particles and a pinhole but i'm incredibly satisfied as the light finally works for my eyes and i finally "can just read" (been doing reading benders till 5am the past few days). inverting screens is just a way for some of our e-reading community to attempt to sort through some of the questions on why its not working for some. i fully agree with ann -who even though i'm quoting in this is a phenomenal moderator- who suggests using all 30 days (amazon is amazing with their customer service imo) and at the same time know from experience the feelings of pure and utter defeat when one's eyes catch imperfections that prevent the reading experience from being fluid. just out of curiosity, has anyone unhappy with their pws tried the kobo glo or that new aura with the flushed bezel? i'd be interested to hear of their experiences with those front lit lighting implementations.


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

larryb52 said:


> its just my opinion and not saying anything about what is seen or not seen but e ink itself has never been perfect, its just easier on the eyes than say a ipad for reading and again I say that as a generality. But on any given PW2 screen you get your going to find there will be something that is not perfect. The device is revolutionary in and of itself. It works for some. But lets be honest. Its a reader , try reading on it not starring at the screen looking for imperfections. Again I'm not saying WilliamG doesn't see what he sees but to invert the picture the white letters on black is a bit of a stretch. Trust me, I'm a nit picker and I have always said if you want to see something negative about something yes you will find it. I would say you have 30 days to return it why not use it as a reader with words on a page and read. If its a good book I think you may find that you will see the words not the imperfections and to anyone I may have insulted I am sorry this was not my intent. This is just my 2 cents...


I agree. I have definitely complained about the PW1 lighting but in some ways, the lack of quality control was more aggravating than anything else. The fact that I'm paying $$ that for me, is a lot.

And then I realized that if I wanted perfect, I'd probably have to PAY for perfect and that might put e-readers out of the majority of their market's reach (like me). I'm sure (almost) perfect is possible...but at what price point? Amazon aint stupid.

I often think...what did people do when they read hard copy books! We couldn't customize those! We dealt with the weight, page turning, paper quality, lighting, fonts, etc etc etc....and LOVED them anyway. Lord, I can remember some muddy, crummy contrast fonts on books. Sometimes I think we were happier when we didn't have choices. I know I'm spoiled now.


----------



## northofdivision

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> I agree. I have definitely complained about the PW1 lighting but in some ways, the lack of quality control was more aggravating than anything else. The fact that I'm paying $$ that for me, is a lot.
> 
> I often think...what did people do when they read hard copy books! We couldn't customize those! We dealt with the weight, page turning, paper quality, lighting, fonts, etc etc etc....and LOVED them anyway. Lord, I can remember some muddy, crummy contrast fonts on books. Sometimes I think we were happier when we didn't have choices. I know I'm spoiled now.


indeed. the imperfections were the charms.remember the old reader's proof copies filled with typos before the final ediiting. loved those.


----------



## cleee

I looked at the pictures that William posted and on the non-inverted ones I don't see any color splotches or tints or anything. It looks great to me. I'm only saying this to demonstrate that every pair of eyes is very different. I don't know if it's a sensitivity thing or what but I honestly think both of the devices look absolutely fine.  I do see the splotches in the inverted pictures though so maybe my eyes just are not catching it in white mode on the photo. I'm sorry that you got devices that did not work for you, William.

For myself, the idea that I can lay in bed or outside after dark with a book and light the screen is something I have always wanted. I never liked clip lights or case lights at all so I am thinking that my extreme joy at having a device with a built in light may be so overwhelming that any imperfections that exist are not registering because I'm so happy to have a device with this capability. There is something so wonderful about sitting in a dark room and reading with the light on. It's like memories of being a kid in a closet with a flashlight and a book or under the covers in the dark with a flashlight reading. 

The Kobo device linked to in the youtube video upthread is a great looking e-reader. I haven't owned a Kobo and for a while was tempted to buy the tiny Kobo but found it was too square to fit in a pocket so I passed. Does Kobo have a decent market share? They definitely hit a home run with that reader. The light looks beautiful.


----------



## sparklemotion

WilliamG said:


> Yeah. Pretty bummed about it right now, that's for sure. I was really, really looking forward to the new Paperwhite, as I didn't think Amazon could mess up after another year. But...alas...


Same here, William. I easily see everything you mentioned about yours, the colors, the glowing speck. I tried two PW2's this year and have already returned them both as well. Mine had glowing specks and black specks under the screen. I still have my PW1 that I settled on from last year. It is actually better than both the PW2's I had. The e-ink on both my PW2's was also quite faded. I don't know if it was the yellow screen or what, but it was very washed out. Hopefully next year, but I'm thinking it may take a bit longer. I'm disappointed in their QC letting so many glowing specks and flecks of dust under the screen get by too.


----------



## llc328

Hi all..... 
I received my Kindle paperwhite2 a few days ago.. Much better lighting than the Paperwhite1........ my Paperwhite1 was splotchy and had that classic pink and blue/green hue to the page.. uneven lighting on the bottom etc.... very hard on the eyes.. I could not use it..:-(.. I did traded in in to Amazon.. and used my credit for the new Paperwhite2.......

My Paperwhite2 does have one light all the way on the bottom left that's a tad brighter than the rest.. I only notice it when I am in the dark.. but I thought why not try to get a more perfect Kindle paperwhite2, since so many have received great quality ones........ but then there is an issue of many having pin dots (bright light specs) dust between the screen.. uneven lighting again etc..............but still Amazon has GREAT customer service so I thought why not get another...  do I have to loose?...... nothing... 

My replacement Kindle Paperwhite2 arrived today... I did keep the first to compare them...the replacement was a disappointment.... a bright pin dot on the lower portion of the screen...not really where text would be but none the less.. I feel the screen should not have any of these at all....... also... the light has a blueish tinge.. like the Paperwhite1 had......... and I see some pinkish/blue hues here and there........while the lighting Is more even on the bottom (not like my original Paperwhite2 that was sent to me with the one brighter light to the very left)...... but the blueish hue ....and the bright pin dot, will make me keep the first one I received....I will not try and order another as I am afraid amazon may want the first one back then too?..To be honest ...It was bit d of a hassle to get the replacement as it is...(could have just been the rep I was talking too).... even with Amazon great customer service..it was annoying to me.... I had the customer support person walk me on the phone through a hard re-set.. asking me SO many questions about pages I was on.. go back to the hmoe page.. now open a book again........ lighting numbers settings I was on etc.. I still said after all the nonsense I had to preform while on the phone..... I have one brighter light than the rest........ NO re-set.. hard reset whatever.... is going to fix this problem...... unless I can manually remove the light bulb that's brighter.....and replace that bulb a bulb that matches the rest in Brughtness on the screen.. this unit cannot be fixed....;-)....so in terms of me getting another Paperwhite2 to then see again if there is a better unit out there for me.....I feel I can't keep the first one...... and keep comparing different units to it?!?..........

In my  conclusion the First Kindle Paperwhite2 I received has a warmer light.. but there is a defect of  one light being a tad brighter on the bottom left............ the second Paperwhite2 (replacement) I got today has a cooler light/blueish and I do feel that leads to the pinkish/blueish hue to the screen (Like the Paperwhite1 had in some units) and also a bright pin dot on the screen..:-(

I think its a roll of the dice with quality control with these units.. side by side I tried so hard to capture the color differences/temperatures  of the light on Both Paperwhite2's.....so I could post the pics here... but my camera phone had  very hard time capturing  it on its screen in a Photo.... But in reality It IS very noticeable to my eyes that the 2 Paperwhite2's I now have here in my home....have totally different color temperatures to their lights when set at the Exact same number settings.............. 

Also...overall on Both Paperwhite2 units  the text is lighter than mt K3 and my Basic kindle........ but I will be keeping the first  Paperwhite2 I received for outings where I do not want to carry along a added light or use a lighted case......... I still prefer the text on my K3 and my Basic Kindle...... I REALLY wish on the Paperwhite2's text color  could be as rich/dark and bold as it is on the K3 and the Basic Kindle......I know I will most likely use those more for reading.. and use this for when I don't want to bother others with my lighted cases or my clip on lights.;-)

Hope this helps some,,, as all your posts have helped me..

Hope this helps others out there...


----------



## dax123

I'm reading about it here and on mobileread and I'm beginning to think I'm better off canceling my order of the PW2 for the time being. 

I live in The Netherlands so returning a defect PW will be quite a hassle I think..although I haven't had experience with it.

I do have a PW1 so I can wait if necessary.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Hi, we've got a thread discussing the problems in Paperwhites, so I've merged your post with it, dax.

I'm not sure we can really say how common the problems are because generally people without problems don't post on a forum.  I had no problems with my PW.

Betsy


----------



## dax123

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Hi, we've got a thread discussing the problems in Paperwhites, so I've merged your post with it, dax.
> 
> I'm not sure we can really say how common the problems are because generally people without problems don't post on a forum. I had no problems with my PW.
> 
> Betsy


Thanks I still have some time to consider it won't ship for a while yet. Also can someone tell me how big those pin holes are? Are there pics of any, so I know what it looks like? If it's small and outside the reading area i might not have any problem with it..(if I'm not too ocd with it).


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

dax123 said:


> Thanks I still have some time to consider it won't ship for a while yet. Also can someone tell me how big those pin holes are? Are there pics of any, so I know what it looks like? If it's small and outside the reading area i might not have any problem with it..(if I'm not too ocd with it).


Hopefully someone will post. My PW is fine, I don't know anything about the pinholes and have't seen any pictures where I could detect anything.

Betsy


----------



## WilliamG

Here's a question: Can I buy a Kobo Aura HD and then strip the DRM from Kindle books and have them work on the Kobo? I don't really want to have to re-buy all my books if I go that route.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

WilliamG said:


> Here's a question: Can I buy a Kobo Aura HD and then strip the DRM from Kindle books and have them work on the Kobo? I don't really want to have to re-buy all my books if I go that route.


I'll note here that discussions of how to strip DRM from books is not allowed as it is against Amazon's ToS. But yes, it's possible.

Betsy


----------



## Chad Winters

I don't notice any defects on my PW2, not sure if they are not there or I am not sensitive to them....


----------



## WilliamG

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I'll note here that discussions of how to strip DRM from books is not allowed as it is against Amazon's ToS. But yes, it's possible.
> 
> Betsy


Fair enough.

In any case, I checked out a Kobo Aura HD. The light on it is MUCH more uniform. No shadowing, no weirdness. I noted a slightly warmer tone toward the top of the display, though. The deal-killer, though, was an absolute ton of those reflective bits of dust or whatever it is, in between the touch layer and screen. I opened it in the store and even the guy who works there said it was crazy.

Seems like the Kobos are not immune to this issue. I might have bought one otherwise.

It's a weird device, but the screen is pretty darn nice, and noticeably more resolution than the Paperwhite.

Sigh... back to the Kindle Touch!


----------



## FearIndex

I have noticed that some may wonder about the detailed analysis on this problem or other Kindle questions, but I must stress it isn't done to mislead anyone - it is simply done to offer information. I think the great thing about forums like this is to get really detailed experiences about the devices themselves, something you won't usually get from just retailer site reviews or at your local book club meeting. Here the techies and bookworms can mingle to the benefit of all. So, at least for me, the attempt here is to hash out the best possible information to the benefit of this great community.

I again today had the pleasure of unboxing a baby Kindle. This was, I think the sixth regular e-ink Kindle I have unboxed. While I have some issues with the official lighted covers, the Kindles themselves have always been perfect for me. (I know some Kindle 2's suffered from sunfade and lower contrast compared to Kindle 1, but mine was fine.) The e-ink screen experience has been very consistent, improving every generation after Kindle 2. Again, checking the latest baby Kindle I opened, I marveled at the perfectly positioned and level screen, no dead pixels, very even color, great, great text blackness, same as my other similar product.

Contrast all these regular e-ink Kindles to my Kindle Paperwhite, which has a slightly crooked screen, low text blackness and a somewhat uneven screen - if I recall it may also have one pinhole. It is, though, better than the worst PWs and since returns from abroad are a hassle, I kept it. Reading up on these topics, it seems clear to me aligning the light guides, LED quality allowances, and multi-layered screen design (also more susceptible to dust etc.) is impacting the consistency of the product a lot - frontlit readers vary much more wildly from one to the other than they do on other e-ink readers.

I sincerely believe mine is probably quite representative of a fairly OK Paperwhite 1. I probably could live with it, weren't it for the fact that $69 Kindle 5 offers such a superior e-ink experience and I just couldn't get to liking the frontlight.

I do love many of the features in the PW and I did get used to changing pages with touch, so I'm still thinking about giving the PW2 a go. One week still to hear experiences and decide. Exchanges are at least now possible since Amazon ships directly abroad (starting from 15th), but anyone can wonder how nice returns/exchanges become when you have to involve the friendly customs officers etc...


----------



## FearIndex

WilliamG said:


> Fair enough.
> 
> In any case, I checked out a Kobo Aura HD. The light on it is MUCH more uniform. No shadowing, no weirdness. I noted a slightly warmer tone toward the top of the display, though. The deal-killer, though, was an absolute ton of those reflective bits of dust or whatever it is, in between the touch layer and screen. I opened it in the store and even the guy who works there said it was crazy.
> 
> Seems like the Kobos are not immune to this issue. I might have bought one otherwise.
> 
> It's a weird device, but the screen is pretty darn nice, and noticeably more resolution than the Paperwhite.
> 
> Sigh... back to the Kindle Touch!


Kindle Touch not having a touch layer but using infrared or whatever it is using coming in handy, there.


----------



## FearIndex

Lursa (aka 9MMare) said:


> I agree. I have definitely complained about the PW1 lighting but in some ways, the lack of quality control was more aggravating than anything else. The fact that I'm paying $$ that for me, is a lot.
> 
> And then I realized that if I wanted perfect, I'd probably have to PAY for perfect and that might put e-readers out of the majority of their market's reach (like me). I'm sure (almost) perfect is possible...but at what price point? Amazon aint stupid.
> 
> I often think...what did people do when they read hard copy books! We couldn't customize those! We dealt with the weight, page turning, paper quality, lighting, fonts, etc etc etc....and LOVED them anyway. Lord, I can remember some muddy, crummy contrast fonts on books. Sometimes I think we were happier when we didn't have choices. I know I'm spoiled now.


I agree with the inconsistency part and disagree with the previous poster's comment that e-ink hasn't been perfect, though.

I think e-ink has been very consistent up until the frontlit models, much more consistent than most display technologies in fact. Some teething problems over the years, but mostly very consistent experience.

That's the bummer for many of us. E-ink on the $69 basic Kindle is excellent. Great consistency from unit to unit, great text blackness etc.

It is Paperwhite and perhaps other frontlit models that have introduced the inconsistency factor, apparently due to the difficulty of aligning and building a multi-layered screen assembly.

And obviously, if the product is working for you and you are enjoying it, nobody here wants to disagree with that. That is great for you, of course.


----------



## FearIndex

llc328 said:


> Also...overall on Both Paperwhite2 units the text is lighter than mt K3 and my Basic kindle........ but I will be keeping the first Paperwhite2 I received for outings where I do not want to carry along a added light or use a lighted case......... I still prefer the text on my K3 and my Basic Kindle...... I REALLY wish on the Paperwhite2's text color could be as rich/dark and bold as it is on the K3 and the Basic Kindle......I know I will most likely use those more for reading.. and use this for when I don't want to bother others with my lighted cases or my clip on lights.;-)


This was my experience with PW1 vs. Kindle 3, 4 and 5. I posted extensive tests about this last year. Only Kindle 2 had worse text blackness than PW1, all the rest have progressively better text blackness than my PW1. Reading MobileRead and here, PW2 seems to be a slight improvement in text blackness over PW1, but not enough to be anywhere near the inky blacks of the $69 Kindle 5. That's a bummer for sure. I guess a little less than the levels in $69 Kindle 5 would be fine, but if the levels still seem below Kindle 3 levels, that's really unfortunate.

If I do end up getting the PW2, which is on international pre-order, I'll be sure to compare it again with my numerous regular e-ink Kindles.

Personally I'd forget about the PW2 if Amazon made a non-lit e-ink Kindle with all the advanced features. That's one thing about the $69 Kindle 5 keeping it away from perfection, but so far it has been the best solution for me. Make a, say, a new Kindle Touch with an official lighted leather cover and I'm good.

Also, I'd prefer to stay within the Amazon ecosystem due to convenience of the store.


----------



## llc328

FearIndex said:


> This was my experience with PW1 vs. Kindle 3, 4 and 5. I posted extensive tests about this last year. Only Kindle 2 had worse text blackness than PW1, all the rest have progressively better text blackness than my PW1. Reading MobileRead and here, PW2 seems to be a slight improvement in text blackness over PW1, but not enough to be anywhere near the inky blacks of the $69 Kindle 5. That's a bummer for sure. I guess a little less than the levels in $69 Kindle 5 would be fine, but if the levels still seem below Kindle 3 levels, that's really unfortunate.
> 
> If I do end up getting the PW2, which is on international pre-order, I'll be sure to compare it again with my numerous regular e-ink Kindles.
> 
> Personally I'd forget about the PW2 if Amazon made a non-lit e-ink Kindle with all the advanced features. That's one thing about the $69 Kindle 5 keeping it away from perfection, but so far it has been the best solution for me. Make a, say, a new Kindle Touch with an official lighted leather cover and I'm good.
> 
> Also, I'd prefer to stay within the Amazon ecosystem due to convenience of the store.


I did read ALL your reviews on here and they were all VERY helpful.. I even made myself a light shield for my K4 lighted case!!,, I have found I also like a cheaper lighted case called Verbatim 7-Inch Tablet Case with LED Light, Slate Silver, (98079)... the light is not as bright as the Kindle 4 official case and in the complete darkness I find it better on my eyes.. I have to read in bed at night in total darkness while my Husband sleeps..... so being this light is more yellow its softer and not as bright as the light is in the official K4 lighted case..,, the dimmer light is better in that circumstance for me.....I still did have to make a shield for my eyes to hep with the light.. so thank you for that Information you had on here!!....I look forward to a review from you when you get a PW2... I love these forums for the honesty and help everyone provides with all their individual reviews and preferences .....


----------



## FearIndex

llc328 said:


> I did read ALL your reviews on here and they were all VERY helpful.. I even made myself a light shield for my K4 lighted case!!,, I have found I also like a cheaper lighted case called Verbatim 7-Inch Tablet Case with LED Light, Slate Silver, (98079)... the light is not as bright as the Kindle 4 official case and in the complete darkness I find it better on my eyes.. I have to read in bed at night in total darkness while my Husband sleeps..... so being this light is more yellow its softer and not as bright as the light is in the official K4 lighted case..,, the dimmer light is better in that circumstance for me.....I still did have to make a shield for my eyes to hep with the light.. so thank you for that Information you had on here!!....I look forward to a review from you when you get a PW2... I love these forums for the honesty and help everyone provides with all their individual reviews and preferences .....


Thank you very much, llc328  And thank you for the great case tip too. Always welcome.

It really warms the heart to hear my efforts have helped someone. That's all I have wanted.  (In addition to getting some peer support in my trials of course! Much appreciated too!)

Slightly related, just yesterday (see the end of my signature) I took to comparing older and newer Kindle 4/5 official lighted covers and found that the LED had changed in the two years between their purchases. The newer LED is warmer and slightly less bright.


----------



## llc328

FearIndex said:


> Thank you very much, llc328  And thank you for the great case tip too. Always welcome.
> 
> It really warms the heart to hear my efforts have helped someone. That's all I have wanted.  (In addition to getting some peer support in my trials of course! Much appreciated too!)
> 
> Slightly related, just yesterday (see the end of my signature) I took to comparing older and newer Kindle 4/5 official lighted covers and found that the LED had changed in the two years between their purchases. The newer LED is warmer and slightly less bright.


Yes!.. I read your review after I posted my comment on this thread
And saw your pics and your full review of them all side by side.. I did not comment as I had to call it a night....Great job on the review!.... I bought my K4 covers in like new condition off Amazon a few months back.. So I am not sure what year they made etc.. And I tell You,.They are just like new!!!...I bought the wine/purple shade as it was only $20.00 and free shipping., the black was about $35.00 or so.. So the budget shopper that I am ....I went with the less expensive .. The color is lovely.. Although I did not realize the inside was gray.. I have a black K4... A few weeks later the black was $20.00 as well ....but I stumbled on the other covers....will have to pick myself up a black next time they are 20 bucks!!! The black is so classy!..;-)


----------



## FearIndex

Sky n Surf said:


> Got mine, has the spotlighting pretty bad...enough that the bottom third of the printed word changes color from white to a creamy beige color...so it's annoying.
> 
> New one on its way. Pray it's better. I've already paid for an expensive Oberon.





drew0020 said:


> I've tried 4 Paperwhite 2's. I have yet to see a screen without pinholes. I will probably wait out the PW2, because there are obviously production issues. I can handle dust specks on the screen, but that pinholes are really bothersome especially since I use the light.
> 
> I hope you have better luck!


(Moving to a more relevant thread.) Byt the way, could you describe what is the difference between a dust speck and a pin-hole in this context?

I have only thought of this from a "dead pixel" perspective. If I recall my PW has one that stays background colored all the time (you can see it on the Kindle booting screen which has black areas).

llc328:

Yeah, the wine purple cover is really nice on the K4/5.  Too bad about the grey interior with the black Kindle.


----------



## tingaling

My new paperwhite 2 arrived and the box was heavily dented so I was expecting some damage. After examining the device I was able to turn it on and noticed a bright pixel, dead center of the screen.... Also the text is very gray. My 1st gen paperwhite had better blacks. The lighting was very even though.

I just tried the chat feature on Amazon CS and it was even easier than over the phone. Just opened a chat window and explained my paperwhite issues. A replacement is on the way in 2 days, hope the new one is better.

Not sure why amazon ships kindles with the retail box. This offers zero protection from careless carriers.


----------



## drew0020

FearIndex said:


> (Moving to a more relevant thread.) Byt the way, could you describe what is the difference between a dust speck and a pin-hole in this context?
> 
> I have only thought of this from a "dead pixel" perspective. If I recall my PW has one that stays background colored all the time (you can see it on the Kindle booting screen which has black areas).
> 
> llc328:
> 
> Yeah, the wine purple cover is really nice on the K4/5.  Too bad about the grey interior with the black Kindle.


A dust speck is visible when the light is on or off (during power up for example). It looks like a black speck on the screen. The pinhole is only visible when the back light is on and the light typically shines through at a higher brightness (almost a greenish look).

My PW1 was perfect on the first try. Like I said I have seen multiple PW2's and all exhibit the problems noted above (dust speck is preferred because the pinhole is a real eye catcher to my eyes at least), but my PW2 had a dust speck and pinhole 

Hope this helps.


----------



## FearIndex

drew0020 said:


> A dust speck is visible when the light is on or off (during power up for example). It looks like a black speck on the screen. The pinhole is only visible when the back light is on and the light typically shines through at a higher brightness (almost a greenish look).
> 
> My PW1 was perfect on the first try. Like I said I have seen multiple PW2's and all exhibit the problems noted above (dust speck is preferred because the pinhole is a real eye catcher to my eyes at least), but my PW2 had a dust speck and pinhole
> 
> Hope this helps.


Thank you!

So, dust speck is a little like dead pixel (dark) on LCDs and pin-hole like a stuck pixel (stuck lighting red, green or blue) on LCDs. To make a crude comparison.

Sounds like the pin-holes are faults in the light guide that direct the light towards the reader instead of away from the reader.


----------



## drew0020

FearIndex said:


> Thank you!
> 
> So, dust speck is a little like dead pixel (dark) on LCDs and pin-hole like a stuck pixel (stuck lighting red, green or blue) on LCDs. To make a crude comparison.
> 
> Sounds like the pin-holes are faults in the light guide that direct the light towards the reader instead of away from the reader.


A dust speck almost blends into the Paperwhite surface depending on how big it is. It can be any size. A pinhole is more like a dead/stuck pixel and always looks like 1 pixel with light shining through and is very visible if you use the light. Wish I could get a good picture, but difficult with my iPhone 5s camera.


----------



## booklover888

After reading some of these latest posts and viewing pics, I had to take another look at my PW2. Yes there is some shadowing, but no glaring light patches like on my PW1, no blobs, no colors that I can see, just a perfect screen, to me. The shadowing is acceptable, whereas the huge blob of light on the PW1 really bothered me.


----------



## northofdivision

Almost dangerous to go looking out of your way for pinholes, booklover888. Haha. Glad you didn't find anything. I found a pinhole and a few dust specks when the light is all the way up to 22. i thought i'd be bothered but i don't notice them. I'm pretty set on the lighting at 10 in the pitch dark and i'm set. The pw1 lighting did not work for me at all. There are some who will have issues with the pw2 too. good to talk about.  What this thread is for. Do any of you have the specks and are bothered? If i had more than one pinhole, or one in the center, i'd send it back immediately.


----------



## drew0020

I finally got a PW2 (5th one) without a pinhole, but the screen is slanted and it is very noticable.  Maybe I should give up?  This is taking up too much of my time and eating into my reading time ha.


----------



## MamaProfCrash

Return it now and try again in a few months. Sorry that it has been so hard. I know that there were folks with the K2 that had a ton of returns.


----------



## drew0020

MamaProfCrash said:


> Return it now and try again in a few months. Sorry that it has been so hard. I know that there were folks with the K2 that had a ton of returns.


The problem is that I sold my perfect PW1 for a gift card so I am without a Kindle. Very dissapointed right now


----------



## llc328

drew0020 said:


> I finally got a PW2 (5th one) without a pinhole, but the screen is slanted and it is very noticable. Maybe I should give up? This is taking up too much of my time and eating into my reading time ha.


5th one!?!.. Oh my.. So sorry.. Sounds like what happened
with the PW1 with many that were trying to get a good one.. I feel that's why I am stopping at
at getting just the one replacement .. I am not sure what I'll get next!?!..and how could I keep the first one I got..send back the second (replacement) to then get another to compare it to the first!?!.. I doubt Amazon would allow that?!.. How is the screen slanted?.. Is there
anyway to take a picture and show that?..


----------



## FearIndex

llc328 said:


> 5th one!?!.. Oh my.. So sorry.. Sounds like what happened
> with the PW1 with many that were trying to get a good one.. I feel that's why I am stopping at
> at getting just the one replacement .. I am not sure what I'll get next!?!..and how could I keep the first one I got..send back the second (replacement) to then get another to compare it to the first!?!.. I doubt Amazon would allow that?!.. How is the screen slanted?.. Is there
> anyway to take a picture and show that?..


The $69 baby Kindle is really nice, if you can live with external lighting. That was my solution after the disappointment with PW1. I expect to stick to regular e-ink Kindles as long as they make them.

I still think I'll let the PW2 come, but my expectations are not that high to be frank.

(This is probably not a solution for anyone, but just to mention Kindle DX 3G is also just $189 and it's official case $9.98 now... fire sale.)


----------



## Patricia

Chad Winters said:


> I don't notice any defects on my PW2, not sure if they are not there or I am not sensitive to them....


I feel the same way. This is my first PW and it seems fine. I keep looking for defects. There is very slight shadowing or blotchiness at the bottom, but I think lowering the light helped. I really don't have anything to compare it to.


----------



## FearIndex

Patricia said:


> I feel the same way. This is my first PW and it seems fine. I keep looking for defects. There is very slight shadowing or blotchiness at the bottom, but I think lowering the light helped. I really don't have anything to compare it to.


May I recommend you stop looking. 

I'm one of those people that does have issues with the state of the e-ink frontlight, but if you aren't, I'll gladly recommend you just go enjoy it. I don't think the issues aren't real, I just think PW1 already showed us that most people don't see and care about them (even though I guess it is widely accepted by now PW1 was worse than PW2 in this regard). They just don't register as significant on their experience, because people experience some things differently. Of course, some devices are also better than others.

So, if you are enjoying your unit, you are just a part of this majority and that's great!


----------



## drew0020

llc328 said:


> 5th one!?!.. Oh my.. So sorry.. Sounds like what happened
> with the PW1 with many that were trying to get a good one.. I feel that's why I am stopping at
> at getting just the one replacement .. I am not sure what I'll get next!?!..and how could I keep the first one I got..send back the second (replacement) to then get another to compare it to the first!?!.. I doubt Amazon would allow that?!.. How is the screen slanted?.. Is there
> anyway to take a picture and show that?..


It's hard to get a good pic. I'm probably going to live with the slanted screen. I figured that's the easiest part of assembly and was excited that I finally found a good screen until I felt like the words were slightly off.


----------



## FearIndex

drew0020 said:


> It's hard to get a good pic. I'm probably going to live with the slanted screen. I figured that's the easiest part of assembly and was excited that I finally found a good screen until I felt like the words were slightly off.


Do you mean the whole screen is slightly tilted compared to the bezel? Yes, a common complaint from when PW1 launched. I have never seen a regular e-ink Kindle with a screen at an angle, but I have seen several PWs. Mine was easiest to see on the menu page, in the books that have no horizontal lines on top/bottom it is easier to ignore.

I always assumed the tilted screen had to do with the screen assembly process. Older Kindles have just the e-ink screen, so that's easier to get straight, but during the PW frontlight/touch layer assembly it is easier to imagine some part getting a little crooked in the process.

Indeed all my regular e-ink Kindles have very straight screens, where as the PW is a little tilted and also a little unevenly positioned to its frame, so it "peeks" a little on the top too.


----------



## Atunah

drew0020 said:


> It's hard to get a good pic. I'm probably going to live with the slanted screen. I figured that's the easiest part of assembly and was excited that I finally found a good screen until I felt like the words were slightly off.


I don't have a PW2 yet, but I had the slanted screen on 2 of my PW1. The first I got shipped had such a slant going down on the left side it was impossible for me to ignore. It was very very noticeable about 3 mm. My replacement at the time had one light so bright that I had a thumb sized light on the bottom. Even on low light settings. It also had the glue coming off at a part on the bezel on the bottom right so there was a lot of lightbleed. 
I kept the 3rd one which has a slight slanted screen (1mm), the frame isn't glued all the way down on the edge and it had the darkest smudges between the light. I settled with the 3rd one as they gave me a bit of hard time then with the replacements. 
The slant on this one isn't as noticeable as my first one was though, so I got used to it.

So I never had any of those color blobs as much like many people reported, the first one had those a bit, but my issues had always been more of the slant/frame glue type.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter

Well, I don't think of the PW1 as worse, I think of my PW2 as better! 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S2 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Tabatha

With my first PW1, I had the bad color blotches, but I waited until 20-25 days before returning it for a new one hoping it would be from another batch, which turned out to be what happened. The replacement was a perfect screen. So much so that I do miss it as I did like the blue tint better than this yellow/cream. I always kept the screen at 5-6 and it was perfect for night or day. My PW2 appears to be fine, only very lightly blotchy in the center if turned totally up to 24, which I would never do anyway. I find this one is perfect for me at 8. which has no shadows or blotches.

With the number of kindles sold, I think the defective ones are a very low percentage, and when people read this thread, they jump to see and test theirs and really scrutinize it to see if anything applies to them. It's mind over matter with some, and others may see what isn't even there. I did read that some with the PW1 had numerous bad units, but I think if you wait till later in the month to exchange, you may get one from a better batch/new shipment.


----------



## FearIndex

Tabatha said:


> With my first PW1, I had the bad color blotches, but I waited until 20-25 days before returning it for a new one hoping it would be from another batch, which turned out to be what happened. The replacement was a perfect screen. So much so that I do miss it as I did like the blue tint better than this yellow/cream. I always kept the screen at 5-6 and it was perfect for night or day. My PW2 appears to be fine, only very lightly blotchy in the center if turned totally up to 24, which I would never do anyway. I find this one is perfect for me at 8. which has no shadows or blotches.
> 
> With the number of kindles sold, I think the defective ones are a very low percentage, and when people read this thread, they jump to see and test theirs and really scrutinize it to see if anything applies to them. It's mind over matter with some, and others may see what isn't even there. I did read that some with the PW1 had numerous bad units, but I think if you wait till later in the month to exchange, you may get one from a better batch/new shipment.


I find it unlikely that most people posting here or elsewhere go looking for trouble at first (on their first unit anyway). The analysis naturally becomes deeper once it starts bothering you.

I think a far more likely difference between people's reactions is simply their different perceptions and tolerance levels - and of course the clear variance between units, some better than others. I believe most people wouldn't even see splotchiness on a splotchy PW, anymore than they'd notice lightleaks or dead pixels on a flatscreen TV (even though they are very common). The average user just doesn't care.

But those who do, for them it is a real issue. It's a bit like those reports of motionsickness with iOS 7. I'm sure most people have no issues, but those that do get nauseous from those zooming screens etc., for them it is a real problem that came up, they didn't go looking for it.

I still think the biggest issue here is the added layers on top of the e-ink screen on PW1/PW2. E-ink itself is pretty mature and proven technology by now, but getting those light guides and touch layers and LED light variances and all that stuff above the e-ink screen right is still a bit in its infancy - the woes may be subtle, but they do bother some people much more than others.


----------



## lunarjar

<irony>A picture is worth a thousand words.</irony>
So as you can see my first kindle, had a lower left corner problem, one of the leds didn't work properly, so reading on anything less than 15, created this dark spot, but even then the quality sucked.
I requested a replacement on Thursday and got a new one on Friday! As you can see it works fine.










_Edited image width to accommodate those with older monitors and tablets. Thanks. --Betsy_


----------



## Lursa (aka 9MMare)

drew0020 said:


> The problem is that I sold my perfect PW1 for a gift card so I am without a Kindle. Very dissapointed right now


Kinda what I'm worried about too. I went thru 3 the first time and the one I settled on isn't perfect. But its imperfection is one that I don't find that noticeable.

Your post makes me even more nervous and I'd HATE to be without my Kindle. Altho my K3 could still fill in.


----------



## WilliamG

lunarjar said:


> <irony>A picture is worth a thousand words.</irony>
> So as you can see my first kindle, had a lower left corner problem, one of the leds didn't work properly, so reading on anything less than 15, created this dark spot, but even then the quality sucked.
> I requested a replacement on Thursday and got a new one on Friday! As you can see it works fine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Edited image width to accommodate those with older monitors and tablets. Thanks. --Betsy_


Yeah that one on the right is clearly defective. Still, I don't like the one on the left, but that's how Paperwhites are. 

I'll wait for Paperwhite 3. Maybe it will actually live up to the name!


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## drew0020

I'm at the point where I am not sure what to do. I can't deal with pinholes and already traded my PW1 for $120 credit. I'm thinking maybe I will just read on my iPhone 5s until the new iPad Mini is released. I wish Amazon had minimal QA on the PW2 because I see the pinholes before it finished starting up. 

I haven't been Kindle less in 3 years...


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## MamaProfCrash

Have you sent the PW1 back? If not, keep it and return the PW2


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## drew0020

MamaProfCrash said:


> Have you sent the PW1 back? If not, keep it and return the PW2


 yes I did. They already sent me the gift card. I figured for $2 it was worthwhile to upgrade to the PW2.


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## MamaProfCrash

Gotcha. Return the PW until you get a good one


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## FearIndex

drew0020 said:


> I'm at the point where I am not sure what to do. I can't deal with pinholes and already traded my PW1 for $120 credit. I'm thinking maybe I will just read on my iPhone 5s until the new iPad Mini is released. I wish Amazon had minimal QA on the PW2 because I see the pinholes before it finished starting up.
> 
> I haven't been Kindle less in 3 years...


Do you guys feel it would be too hard to return to regular e-ink from frontlit? Maybe in wait for PW3 next year? For some reason the discussion quite often seems to skip this option. I don't know why people seem to have forgotten about the basic Kindle.

For me, the $69 Kindle has been the solution. And to be frank, I expect it to continue as that even once I get my PW2.

Sure, I'd love to enjoy some of the advanced features of PW, but for reading there is hard to find fault with it. It is just a very good e-ink experience with a lot less risk of variance in the quality of the product. Also, the basic Kindle is very cheap.

If you find yourself Kindleless and don't feel like risking more PW exchanges, the $69 Kindle is one alternative.


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## drew0020

FearIndex said:


> Do you guys feel it would be too hard to return to regular e-ink from frontlit? Maybe in wait for PW3 next year? For some reason the discussion quite often seems to skip this option. I don't know why people seem to have forgotten about the basic Kindle.
> 
> For me, the $69 Kindle has been the solution. And to be frank, I expect it to continue as that even once I get my PW2.
> 
> Sure, I'd love to enjoy some of the advanced features of PW, but for reading there is hard to find fault with it. It is just a very good e-ink experience with a lot less risk of variance in the quality of the product. Also, the basic Kindle is very cheap.
> 
> If you find yourself Kindleless and don't feel like risking more PW exchanges, the $69 Kindle is one alternative.


My problem with the basic kindle is simply the resolution. I don't need the frontlit feature but I feel like the PW is the bare minimum from a resolution standpoint. I'd like to see the basic kindle get more of an update. I'd gladly pay more for this.


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## FearIndex

drew0020 said:


> My problem with the basic kindle is simply the resolution. I don't need the frontlit feature but I feel like the PW is the bare minimum from a resolution standpoint. I'd like to see the basic kindle get more of an update. I'd gladly pay more for this.


Fair enough, I get the resolution point. Personally I think PW has wasted the resolution opportunity a little, though, by going so soft with the fonts. I find the $69 Kindle crisper even with lower resolution.

As for updates to the basic Kindle, that makes two of us. I hope they will update it rather than let it languish and eventually discontinue. I still think there is room for non-touch and especially regular e-ink.

I'd probably enjoy a PW with a good integrated lighted cover and without frontlight. Not that I expect Amazon to make that, unfortunately. An updated Kindle Touch might be great.


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## WilliamG

FearIndex said:


> Fair enough, I get the resolution point. Personally I think PW has wasted the resolution opportunity a little, though, by going so soft with the fonts. I find the $69 Kindle crisper even with lower resolution.
> 
> As for updates to the basic Kindle, that makes two of us. I hope they will update it rather than let it languish and eventually discontinue. I still think there is room for non-touch and especially regular e-ink.
> 
> I'd probably enjoy a PW with a good integrated lighted cover and without frontlight. Not that I expect Amazon to make that, unfortunately. An updated Kindle Touch might be great.


Paperwhite resolution is absolutely wasted. I had to stare and stare at both my Kindle Touch and my (now-returned) Paperwhite 2 (and 1) to see the difference. And I'm a resolution junkie, obsessed with ppi and (more importantly!) sppi. So I really don't see how anyone could tell any tangible difference (except maybe at the tiniest font size).


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