# Obama or Romney?



## jhendereson (Oct 22, 2010)

Well, the election is almost upon us. Thank God it will soon be over. I cannot ever remember a presidential election being so polarized, so vicious, and so intriguing. If I were a better writer I would seriously consider writing a novel based on current events. Regardless of who wins, the USA will not sink into the abyss. Again: whomever wins, the USA will not sink into the abyss. Worth repeating because a whole lot of people think otherwise. Hope it doesn't end in a tie, or one wins the popular vote but loses the electoral college. Imagine the head-bashing that would ensue. So get out and vote--and hope your guy wins. God bless America!


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## Colin (Aug 6, 2011)

I can see this post getting pulled unless someone can come up with a "how will the election result effect ebook sales" slant!


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## camistarr (Oct 30, 2012)

Not sure who I expect to win, but I'm guessing my candidate won't because I'm voting for former Governor Gary Johnson, the Libertarian Party's nominee. 

Ebook sales will flourish if Gary Johnson is elected president. 

_(and he has a book out on Kindle!)_


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## Colin (Aug 6, 2011)

From my limited knowledge of the U.S. election campaign thus far, Romney flip flops while Obama just flops.

But on a more serious ebook (thread saving) note. I think sales will definitely suffer on election day.


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## Fredster (Apr 11, 2011)

This is the most important election the country has ever faced, folks. If [my guy] doesn't beat [the other guy], this may LITERALLY be the end of the country as we know it. Listen, [the other guy] is just plain dangerous, and if [my guy] fails, well, I weep for the soul of this great nation. We'll descend into third-world chaos, a tailspin we can never pull out of in this already lackluster economy. And we can only blame ourselves for not getting out there and stopping [the other guy].

We can do this, people! Get out on Tuesday and vote for [my guy]!

WHO'S WITH ME?


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

This thread will stay open exactly as long as it stays non-partisan and no more politically specific than it has, or until Harvey gets up on the US west coast and locks it, which ever comes first.

Just to be clear--the ebook aspects won't keep it from being locked, necessarily, it'll just keep the discussion in the Writers' Café.  We've locked many an ebook discussion.  

And as for the nastiest, clearly you haven't read any of the things said about Lincoln during his second campaign.    Or about John Adams during his run.  Our campaigns these days are models of civility.  Just like the Writers' Café.  

Betsy


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## Justawriter (Jul 24, 2012)

I wish they'd overhaul the whole voting system, getting rid of the electoral college and so that it doesn't go by state, that there's just a true popular vote, where every person's vote really does matter. The way it is now, it comes down to a handful of swing states, with all the others fairly pre-determined.


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## TJHudson (Jul 9, 2012)

I'm just about to publish a new book, I think my timing could have been a little better.


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## Hugh Howey (Feb 11, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Our campaigns these days are models of civility. Just like the Writers' Café.


Agreed. Politicians used to get into fistfights and spit on one another in the House. They used to shoot each other in the streets. All of life has grown more civil, politics included.


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## Colin (Aug 6, 2011)

TJHudson said:


> I'm just about to publish a new book, I think my timing could have been a little better.


Don't you just hate it when the democratic process gets in the way of publishing.


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## Colin (Aug 6, 2011)

Hugh Howey said:


> Agreed. Politicians used to get into fistfights and spit on one another in the House. They used to shoot each other in the streets. All of life has grown more civil, politics included.


They get their aides to do for them nowadays.


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## Pawz4me (Feb 14, 2009)

Hugh Howey said:


> Agreed. Politicians used to get into fistfights and spit on one another in the House. They used to shoot each other in the streets. All of life has grown more civil, politics included.


And don't forget May 22, 1865, when Senator Preston Smith Brooks attacked Senator Charles Sumner with his cane, causing serious injury. And the attack took place right on the floor of the Senate.

Politics now is comparatively very civilized.


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## brendajcarlton (Sep 29, 2012)

There is a Presidential election in Book 3 of The Accident at 13th and Jefferson, if anyone is in the mood to read such material.  (Gentle hint)  Actually there is a Presidential election in Book 3 of The Accident at 13th and Jefferson, even if you are not in that mood.  I've never known what to do about that particular sentence construction problem.


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## Debbiek (Aug 7, 2010)

I think that if the wrong person gets in office it will send our country down a path of destruction...we are very political at my house... 

But, with that being said nothing fries me more then people who complain and complain about our government then you ask them if they voted or will be voting and they say no.

You only have a say if you vote and you have no right to complain if you don't.

But, God bless america we have this oppurnity.

Oh by the way you forgot Johnson...he is a liberterian and my sons favorite canadate.


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## Danielle Kazemi (Apr 2, 2011)

The election of 1828 has to be one of the funniest. I recommend reading about it even if you just wiki it. John Q. Adams was running against Andrew Jackson. Adams accussed Jackson of committing adultry by marrying his wife before she had an official divorce and accused Jackson's wife of bigomy. Jackson in turn called Adams a pimp for setting up an "arrangement" between an American call girl and a Russian diplomat. It was crazy.


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## smallblondehippy (Jan 20, 2012)

Now, that's food for thought. I was going to bring out my new book on election day. Should I wait until after? Nah, what the heck, I'm hoping us Brits will still be snapping up books on US election day.


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## Ali Cooper (May 1, 2010)

I'm UK so in a sense of voting (which obviously I'm not) it doesn't affect me.

What does bother me with general elections in US, UK, and doubtless many other countries is that there are questions of human rights which in my view should be governed by an international organisation and taken out of party politics. Not sure how easy or practicable this would be to do though.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

For those who only read the last few posts in a thread, I think this thread can stay open as long as we don't get into any specifics.  Or until Harvey gets up on the west coast, whichever comes first!

I know, I'm no fun at all...  

Betsy


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## TaraWest (Jul 9, 2011)

Honestly, I'd much rather watch our politicians beat each other with canes than all of these negative campaign ads.


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## KVWitten (Apr 11, 2011)

Debbiek said:


> But, with that being said nothing fries me more then people who complain and complain about our government then you ask them if they voted or will be voting and they say no.
> 
> You only have a say if you vote and you have no right to complain if you don't.


You're 100% right but... (you knew there had to be a 'but', right?), with our current system (where all of a state's electoral votes go to the candidate that wins that state), it seems to many people that their vote *doesn't* count. Why do you think the candidates are focusing their attentions on a handful of states?

If the election were determined by *popular* vote, everyone's vote would mean something.


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## MegHarris (Mar 4, 2010)

I am proud of my dad, who'll be getting out and voting this year (and we are in Virginia, perhaps the closest swing state, where every vote may count). My father is ninety-five, and this may just possibly be his last presidential election. Then again, the way he keeps going and going, it may not be.  

I agree with KVWitten. I'd like to see us get rid of the Electoral College and go to a popular vote system. Not only would it be a better and more fair method, but the rest of the country would have to be inundated with constant ads the way Virginia and the swing states have been.


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## NRWick (Mar 22, 2011)

Debbiek said:


> But, with that being said nothing fries me more then people who complain and complain about our government then you ask them if they voted or will be voting and they say no.
> 
> You only have a say if you vote and you have no right to complain if you don't.


Some people, like myself, don't believe in voting for voting's sake. In fact, I find it to be wrong. So, I will not vote just to appease some ridiculous idea that in order to voice my distaste, I have to be a part of the the problem. More so, I'm not going to vote "for the lesser of two evils" as I've been told to do on many occasions. It feels wrong. And while I would like to agree with your sentiment, I also have to add that we do live in America, and therefor, have the right to complain, even if we do not vote.


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## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

KVWitten said:


> ...with our current system (where all of a state's electoral votes go to the candidate that wins that state)...


It's even worse than that. The electoral college members vote however they want. The popular vote is just a suggestion.

"Are there restrictions on who the Electors can vote for?

"There is no Constitutional provision or Federal law that requires Electors to vote according to the results of the popular vote in their States. Some States, however, require Electors to cast their votes according to the popular vote. These pledges fall into two categories-Electors bound by State law and those bound by pledges to political parties.

"The U.S. Supreme Court has held that the Constitution does not require that Electors be completely free to act as they choose and therefore, political parties may extract pledges from electors to vote for the parties' nominees. Some State laws provide that so-called "faithless Electors"; may be subject to fines or may be disqualified for casting an invalid vote and be replaced by a substitute elector. The Supreme Court has not specifically ruled on the question of whether pledges and penalties for failure to vote as pledged may be enforced under the Constitution. No Elector has ever been prosecuted for failing to vote as pledged.

"Today, it is rare for Electors to disregard the popular vote by casting their electoral vote for someone other than their party's candidate. Electors generally hold a leadership position in their party or were chosen to recognize years of loyal service to the party. Throughout our history as a nation, more than 99 percent of Electors have voted as pledged."

http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/electors.html#restrictions


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## Sam Rivers (May 22, 2011)

I would like to see voting by Internet.  That would make it very easy to vote and prevent long lines.  Perhaps we should also be allowed to go online and change our vote through election day.  Allow people to vote using computers, tablets, and even Kindles.

Make early voting a full month for the entire nation.  

I think the Democrats would love this idea, but I doubt the Republicans would.  Easier voting seems to benefit the Democrats.

Of course, those that still wanted to vote by traditional methods could still be allowed to do so.


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## KVWitten (Apr 11, 2011)

EllenFisher said:


> <snip>
> 
> I agree with KVWitten. I'd like to see us get rid of the Electoral College and go to a popular vote system. Not only would it be a better and more fair method, but *the rest of the country would have to be inundated with constant ads the way Virginia and the swing states have been*.


I take my suggestion back. Let's stick with the current system.


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

> Some people, like myself, don't believe in voting for voting's sake. In fact, I find it to be wrong. So, I will not vote just to appease some ridiculous idea that in order to voice my distaste, I have to be a part of the the problem. More so, I'm not going to vote "for the lesser of two evils" as I've been told to do on many occasions. It feels wrong. And while I would like to agree with your sentiment, I also have to add that we do live in America, and therefor, have the right to complain, even if we do not vote.]


I completely agree. Our freedom to voice our complaints is not mandated by if you vote. However, I am going to vote because I feel this election is extremely important. VOTE!


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Folks, I've edited some posts that got too far into specifics.  Political discussions and debate are not allowed on KindleBoards because they never go well.

I suspect that this thread will be locked eventually because the urge to post strong opinions is just too great.  But I'm ever hopeful, so, for now, I'll leave it open.

Betsy
KB Moderator


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

Betsy, please don't run for president.  I enjoy my freedom of speech.    I do understand, though.  Just wanted to tease you a little.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

You're free to speak.  Forum posts here, on our privately run forum, are another thing entirely.   You've agreed to abide by our rules and accept moderation.

And the press would have a field day with my past if I ever ran for office.    And probably with my future, as I haven't really changed much nor do I expect to.  

Betsy


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## Kwalker (Aug 23, 2012)

I do think that the best thing about election day may mean that the  overabundance of ads ends.

I also think that we, as adults, need to learn to be a lot more careful about what we say, because I can't believe some of the rhetoric my kids have been exposed to through their friends.

My daughter came home from school the other day and asked: Do you still want _____ _____ to win? to which I said: Yes. She goes: Well, my friend so and so said that if _____ _____ wins, he is going to take away education. 

Really? I would love it if both sides would tone it down, stick to at least some version of the truth, and stop using scare tactics because kids scare easily and it is insane. Aside from that, in my perfect world, they'd ditch spending billions on ads, and throw those billions at something productive and useful that could benefit all of us.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Fredster said:


> This is the most important election the country has ever faced, folks. If [my guy] doesn't beat [the other guy], this may LITERALLY be the end of the country as we know it. Listen, [the other guy] is just plain dangerous, and if [my guy] fails, well, I weep for the soul of this great nation. We'll descend into third-world chaos, a tailspin we can never pull out of in this already lackluster economy. And we can only blame ourselves for not getting out there and stopping [the other guy].
> 
> We can do this, people! Get out on Tuesday and vote for [my guy]!
> 
> WHO'S WITH ME?


I'm with you. I already went and voted on Friday. Here in Florida they have early polling places open.


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## jnfr (Mar 26, 2011)

I'll make a bold and controversial statement, that even if [my candidate] loses, our country will not fall into tyranny nor will our democratic system vanish!

What will happen is that there will be a higher chance of policies I disagree with being passed anyway, and a lower chance of policies I agree with passing. I think that would be bad for the country overall, but it's not the end of the country or of the world (yet  )

Anyway, I voted already (here in CO we can have permanent mail-in votes), and I encourage everyone to do the same. I believe in people voting.


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## NS (Jul 8, 2011)

I became a US citizen two months ago and it will be my first trip to a voting booth. Pretty exiting and I hope "my guy" wins.


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## Claudia Lefeve (Dec 17, 2010)

link removed...

Disclaimer: This video may or may not reflect my political beliefs, however, I AM ready for a zombie apocalypse. Are you?

Edit: Sorry, couldn't figure out how to display the video...you'll just have to click it!

_Actually, I've removed the link as some would consider it pro one of the candidates; the same video (by Josh Whedon) started some lively debate already in the WC a coulple of days ago. Thanks for understanding. Those really interested can do a search for Josh Whedon zombie apocalypse video. --Betsy _


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## Robert Brumm (Jul 17, 2012)

A few days ago I realized I should have saved every scrap of election junkmail we've gotten in the mail over the last few month instead of tossing them in the bin. I don't know what I would have done with them but it would have been interesting to at least pile all them up on the kitchen table for some pictures.

I don't know about you guys, but I live in a so called swing state and we get a minimum of three pieces of propaganda in the mail every day. I wish I was exaggerating.

I guess that's all I have to contribute to the discussion. Sorry.   I'm glad I voted early and I can just hibernate until it's over.


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## Kathleen Valentine (Dec 10, 2009)

Well, as long as everyone is putting their 2 cents in:

I want complete Congressional reform with term limits and caps on their earnings and benefits (personally, I'd like for them to be paid minimum wage but that's not going to happen.)

I want big money OUT of politics and an end to these Super PACs.

I want all elected officials - from President to the local dog catcher (do they still have those?) to be barred from signing any kind of pledge or take any oath other than the Pledge of Allegiance and the Oath of Office.

That's it for now.


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## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

I'm a registered Independent, and I l ive in a swing state. My phone rings multiple times a day with robocalls. My mail box is stuffed with flyers for this candidate or that political ideal. I walk directly from the mail box to the shred bin and at least 70% of the mail goes directly into the bin.) I've taken part in so many phone polls that I should start charging for my opinion.

The interesting thing is, ALL the calls and ALL mail I've received have been from the _same side and/or party. _ I may vote for the other guy just on principle, and gratitude that his 'team' left me alone. 

(Actually, I already voted during early voting. Too bad there's no way for the phone-bank people to know that, so we wouldn't be pestered once we pulled the lever.)


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

A funny thing happened on the way to the forum on Friday. A lady running for office invited me to come speak at the Rotary Club (about my books.)


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

It's interesting to me that, if you read Team of Rivals by Doris Kearns Goodwin, that targeting likely voters, if not started by, was certainly perfected by Abraham Lincoln for his era. It was fascinating to read how he reached out to likely voters in his campaign....

Betsy


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## btsc99 (Oct 12, 2012)

Jena H said:


> My phone rings multiple times a day with robocalls.


That is something that has started in the UK, real people as opposed to robots though, the conversation goes like this (after a few introductory pleasantries) :-

Who will you be voting for?

_That nice Mr Churchill_

But he is dead!

_Really?_

... Dial tone ...


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## Claudia Lefeve (Dec 17, 2010)

Claudia Lefeve said:


> link removed...
> 
> Disclaimer: This video may or may not reflect my political beliefs, however, I AM ready for a zombie apocalypse. Are you?
> 
> ...


No worries Betsy! I thought my little "disclaimer" would let it slide...I just love Joss Whedon! LOL


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

As do I, Claudia.  Unfortunately, your disclaimer does not mean others won't start in on it.  No biggy!

For YouTube videos, click on the first icon on the left above the smileys and paste your link between the YouTube tags.

Folks, final warning (my fourth warning, I think).  This thread will only stay open as long as posts stay away from specifics and talk history or generalities that apply to both sides.  I've removed two posts. 

Betsy


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

btsc99 said:


> That is something that has started in the UK, real people as opposed to robots though, the conversation goes like this (after a few introductory pleasantries) :-
> 
> Who will you be voting for?
> 
> ...


I've told people in the past who have asked that the nice thing about Voting is that it is PRIVATE... I think I may change it to "I'm voting for Mark Twain."


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

btsc99 said:


> That is something that has started in the UK, real people as opposed to robots though, the conversation goes like this (after a few introductory pleasantries) :-
> 
> Who will you be voting for?
> 
> ...


Hehe


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## Brenda Carroll (May 21, 2009)

I've heard that one before, but it's still funny.   This certainly has to be the most polite discussion I've seen in a while concerning the election. I just wanted to say that I believe a lot of the truly incredible things being thrown about by opposing parties has only seemed worse than usual due to the rise of Facebook and other social media sites, which allow a lot of "In Your Face" politics when you least expect it. Facebook, for example, is an odd place these days. I go there and see cute kids, fuzzy kittens, funny dogs, inspirational quotes and then BAM! A post from one of my "friends" telling me I'm an idiot because I don't agree with their politics. Doesn't make me feel good, nor does it give me the slightest inclination toward changing my own political opinions; however, it does change my opinion of the poster. 
I've actually sworn to stop watching the news and listening to talk radio after this election because of all the nastiness coming out in this campaign. I hope things can be worked out in Congress after this election and they can get something done whether for better or worse.


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## Cege Smith (Dec 11, 2011)

Natasha A. Salnikova said:


> I became a US citizen two months ago and it will be my first trip to a voting booth. Pretty exiting and I hope "my guy" wins.


Congratulations!! I still remember my first trip to the polls when I was 18. It is pretty cool when you think about it.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

We realized that when the next federal election comes (Canada), my eldest step-son will be old enough to vote if they call it after March*. I felt very, very old and haven't recovered since.


*We don't have set dates up here. The government calls an election, and there's usually 6-8 weeks of endless ads with looming voices saying how the conservatives/liberals/ndp will end the world. Followed by 4 years of doom and gloom


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## KBoards Admin (Nov 27, 2007)

I'm up! (Thanks, Betsy.) I'm impressed we've hit two pages of posts without this thread deteriorating (albeit with some careful pruning by Betsy - thank you.)

Anyway, we'll keep it open until the first post hits with a partisan rant, and then - in keeping with our traditional way of handling this - we'll lock the post. Rantings or partisan comments about politics and operating systems aren't allowed on KB, per our forum rules. 

Thanks to our wonderful WC participants for the civility of this discussion!


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## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

Krista D. Ball said:


> *We don't have set dates up here. The government calls an election, and there's usually 6-8 weeks of endless ads with looming voices saying how the conservatives/liberals/ndp will end the world. Followed by 4 years of doom and gloom


That's an interesting way to do federal elections. One of the downsides to the US method is that campaigning starts a full two years before the actual election (primaries, in-party debates, etc.), and turns on full steam during the actual election year, starting Jan 1, and not ending until election day in November.


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## ChristopherDavidPetersen (Mar 24, 2011)

I don't like to vote and haven't in many years, simply because registering always flags me for jury duty - lol. Fortunately, the states I've lived in, over the past fifteen years, have slanted overwhelmingly toward the candidate that I supported so there was really no need for me to register. And for those who are shocked by this, here's another shocker: I won't vote if I don't like any of the candidates...


EDIT: I forgot to add... before I'm labelled an anarchist, there ARE times when I do vote, like when the office sends for take-out. I make d*mn sure my vote is cast for my favorite foods - lol.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Krista D. Ball said:


> We realized that when the next federal election comes (Canada), my eldest step-son will be old enough to vote if they call it after March*. I felt very, very old and haven't recovered since.


Imagine how old I feel! My two oldest step-GRANDkids are old enough to vote...and the next one in line isn't far behind (and is the most politically interested of the three...)

Sigh....oh, well, I'm still much, much younger than my husband. 

And good morning, Harvey!

Betsy


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## NS (Jul 8, 2011)

cegesmith said:


> Congratulations!! I still remember my first trip to the polls when I was 18. It is pretty cool when you think about it.


Thanks!


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Jena H said:


> That's an interesting way to do federal elections. One of the downsides to the US method is that campaigning starts a full two years before the actual election (primaries, in-party debates, etc.), and turns on full steam during the actual election year, starting Jan 1, and not ending until election day in November.


In the couple months leading up to when we know an election is about to be called, there is a lot of jockeying and whatnot. You can taste it in the air 

However, we don't vote for a president. We vote for a local Member of Parliament and whichever party gets the most members in forms the government. The leader of that party is prime minister. But let's say if the PM gets cancer and leaves off, we don't have a new election. The party in power has an internal vote amongst their members and they select the leader.

It has it's bad and good points and we fight a lot about "first past the post" in Canada. Since it's a different system, it's hard to compare yours and ours.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Imagine how old I feel! My two oldest step-GRANDkids are old enough to vote...and the next one in line isn't far behind (and is the most politically interested of the three...)


Things get pretty tense up here, especially in the last election. My partner is a liberal sometimes dipper, I'm a vocal liberal sometimes dipper, and his parents are hardcore conservative. It makes for very tense dinner conversation.

*Liberal = liberal party of Canada 
*Dipper = New Democratic Party, NDP
*Conservative = Conservative Party of Canada aka "Tories" (though you'll hear up there "old tories" and "no tories left" and how the CPC is "reform." There was a party meager. Lots of hard feelings going around)


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Krista D. Ball said:


> It makes for very tense dinner conversation.


Our family is quite divided politically, so we seldom discuss politics because we want to continue to like each other.  Although, we can find a lot of things we agree on, like how annoying calls are. It's what made me love caller ID.

Betsy


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Anyone who follows me on Facebook knows my feelings. 

_Sorry, Michelle, that was partisan.  Removed. --Betsy_

1. I never actually said. 

2. But I understand.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

We've had two in person visits -- one from each side. In both cases I told them to go away. I probably should also have said, "Make a note on your list to not visit again -- ever -- and don't call either."

We don't _really_ discuss it. . . . but I'm fairly certain my husband and I pretty much cancel each other out at the voting booth.


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## David Kazzie (Sep 16, 2010)

Pawz4me said:


> And don't forget May 22, 1865, when Senator Preston Smith Brooks attacked Senator Charles Sumner with his cane, causing serious injury. And the attack took place right on the floor of the Senate.
> 
> Politics now is comparatively very civilized.


I had a history professor in college who re-enacted this incident in a one-man show in class. it was a little unnerving, because he really got into it.


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## MegSilver (Feb 26, 2012)

Didn't they used to have dueling grounds in DC?

And 'Obamney' has been a thing in this house for a while now; it's all branding anymore, not really politics. Spokesmodels have overtaken statesmen by about 500:1.


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## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

Brendan Carroll said:


> ...Facebook, for example, is an odd place these days.
> I go there and see cute kids, fuzzy kittens, funny dogs, inspirational quotes and then
> BAM! A post from one of my "friends" telling me I'm an idiot because I don't agree with their politics.
> Doesn't make me feel good, nor does it give me the slightest inclination toward changing my own political opinions;
> however, it does change my opinion of the poster...


It changes my opinion of the poster, too. I 100% agree; Facebook is messed up come election time.

I want a politics blocker so I can still like my friends.


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## MegSilver (Feb 26, 2012)

Cherise Kelley said:


> I want a politics blocker so I can still like my friends.


I have to admit I unfriended someone a couple days ago for a political post.

In my defense, the post was pretty egregious.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

See, my problem is that my thoughts of kids, dogs, and cats, and just about everything else, informs my political views, and so it is hard to excise that from my feed. I am sure my friends will enjoy me a lot more in a few days. 

I unfriended someone a week or two ago, not because I couldn't respect her choice, but because she was sharing some pretty racist stuff as a result.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Ann in Arlington said:


> I probably should also have said, "Make a note on your list to not visit again -- ever -- and don't call either."


Which may or may not have accomplished anything....depends on the data entry and how long they keep that list.


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## T. B. Crattie (Aug 6, 2012)

I say let's wake Winston up (as a zombie, he'd be a lot more lively than most of our current crop) and bring him over the pond! "Seriously", I think I'm going to sell about the same number of books (0) no matter who is sitting in the comfy chair on Air Force One.


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## Kwalker (Aug 23, 2012)

I try very hard to not push my views on Facebook. I mean it isn't hard to figure out who I support, because I've only liked one candidates page. But, the few times I do hit share on someone elses political post that I agree with, I customize who can view it. Specifically to block my mother from seeing it, but unspecifically to make sure that only those who I know will appreciate seeing it, see it.


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## Richardcrasta (Jul 29, 2010)

I voted for the first time . . . in my life. (Explaining why and how would take too much space.)

However, I am a "political" writer even when I am not overtly political--even my humor is political in the broadest sense of the term--so I imagine every potential reader of mine is too busy watching the election to buy a single book of mine during the first ten days of November.


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## Kathleen Valentine (Dec 10, 2009)

Cherise Kelley said:


> I want a politics blocker so I can still like my friends.


I have NO problem with informational posts from either side or party. I have a big problem with nasty, name calling, you're-an-idiot posts. I blocked two trolls but otherwise I just keep scrolling.


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## Jan Strnad (May 27, 2010)

I think we ought to make all members of Congress wear rubber clown noses or Groucho glasses, or maybe we'd have a whole selection of novelty devices that we'd cycle through. Bee costumes one day, goofy ties the next, then the next day they'd have to black out their two front teeth. Just to keep their egos in check.


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## MegSilver (Feb 26, 2012)

"Someone That I Used To Know" just came on my playlist. I think it's the US citizen theme song come Nov. 7th.


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## Incognita (Apr 3, 2011)

My husband's and my plan for election day is to vote, then get in the car and drive down to tour the wineries in Temecula and try to forget about the whole thing until it's over...


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## Bec (Aug 24, 2012)

To those of you who don't vote... don't you also have other things to vote for, not just the president? I know that they're voting on legalizing gay-marriage and pot (and a bunch of other stuff, they're the two that got my attention) down in Washington State (we get a lot of Seattle stations in B.C.), and even if I didn't like either presidential candidate, I'd still want to vote on those things. 

I'm from a country (Australia) where voting is compulsory. You get fined if you don't vote - well, don't turn up and get your name crossed off to be exact. Technically now I don't have to vote seeing as I'm living overseas, but I still march down to the embassy and vote for the federal and state elections (did get out of voting for the local council ones thanks to my Mum telling them I was overseas and saving me a $70 fine).


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## Kathleen Valentine (Dec 10, 2009)

ChristinePope said:


> My husband's and my plan for election day is to vote, then get in the car and drive down to tour the wineries in Temecula and try to forget about the whole thing until it's over...


I voted early and am considering staying drunk until November 7th.... Hemingway would be proud of me.


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## jhendereson (Oct 22, 2010)

Yes, there is a tremendous amount of tension with this election. Pray and hope it does not resort to ugliness and downright insanity. It amazes me how some people get upset when someone else doesn't share their viewpoints. IMO, as demonstrated by many of the posts here, writers and avid readers understand the concept of opposing viewpoints: conflict, the heartbeat of good storytelling. In other words, we see the strings manipulating the puppets, and don't get all bent out of shape about it. Hope and pray all goes well.


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## Incognita (Apr 3, 2011)

Kathleen Valentine said:


> I voted early and am considering staying drunk until November 7th.... Hemingway would be proud of me.


That's probably the wisest course of action at this point!


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

I'm always shocked with how some of my friends act during elections. Just because a person doesn't agree with me doesn't make them the devil and I try to keep this in mind. 

At least I'm not from Ohio and their 308 ads on TV a day.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

If you don't vote you can't really complain about what you're stuck with. We had judges on  the state supreme court level, district judges, a county sheriff, clerck of the courts, and even mosquito control board positions to vote in/out. Not to mention several amendments to the state constitution. I research everyone and vote for who I think will do the best job.


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## David Kazzie (Sep 16, 2010)

I live in Virginia and once lamented the fact that I didn't live in a swing state. 

Well, I got my wish. Virginia's a swing state.  

STUPID, STUPID ME.


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## Lily_T (Sep 25, 2011)

Ann in Arlington said:


> We've had two in person visits -- one from each side. In both cases I told them to go away. I probably should also have said, "Make a note on your list to not visit again -- ever -- and don't call either."
> 
> *We don't really discuss it. . . . but I'm fairly certain my husband and I pretty much cancel each other out at the voting booth. *


I am beyond fascinated by this:both the not discussing and the canceling. Do you never watch television together or just endlessly bite your tongue? Parents and children who disagree ideologically are interesting...but spouses? Mind blown.


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## Kathleen Valentine (Dec 10, 2009)

David Kazzie said:


> I live in Virginia and once lamented the fact that I didn't live in a swing state.


I live in Massachusetts so am totally irrelevant to this whole discussion.


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## Incognita (Apr 3, 2011)

Kathleen Valentine said:


> I live in Massachusetts so am totally irrelevant to this whole discussion.


Here in California you can't even tell there's a presidential election going on.  (Well, unless one of the candidates comes over here to get a withdrawal from the campaign ATM. Cha-ching!)


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

R.M. Allinson said:


> I'm from a country (Australia) where voting is compulsory. You get fined if you don't vote - well, don't turn up and get your name crossed off to be exact.


I admire many things about Australia, but this one detail has always been near the top of my list. I love the fact that y'all have collectively decided that voting is a responsibility, not a privilege. Even in a closely contested election like the one we're about to have here in the U.S., only 50% to 60% of eligible voters will cast votes. I try not to think about that fact too often. It makes me feel bad about my countrymen.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Lily_T said:


> but spouses? Mind blown.


I know a couple (in Canada) where one votes for whoever is in power if they are OK and the other votes Green Party (who is never in power). The last federal election was quite dirty and "American" style, for lack a better work (the attack ads, spin doctoring, etc). They were very, very careful when talking.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

A friend of mine in Finland, in an email, said that their recent election turnout was very low--only 58%.  I looked up US voting rates.  Until the 2008 election, 58% would have been higher than the highest turnout we'd had in some time.  (64% in 2008, from what I've read.)  Finland's average is 79%, I think I read.

Betsy


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> A friend of mine in Finland, in an email, said that their recent election turnout was very low--only 58%. I looked up US voting rates. Until the 2008 election, 58% would have been higher than the highest turnout we'd had in some time. (64% in 2008, from what I've read.) Finland's average is 79%, I think I read.


I think mandated voting is the only way to get nearly universal turnout.


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## jdfield (Oct 4, 2011)

It's all relative, though.

I live in the middle-east and friends here love the standard of debate in the US Election, the clarity of argument, the taking of positions, and the lack of personalisation...


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Lily_T said:


> I am beyond fascinated by this:both the not discussing and the canceling. Do you never watch television together or just endlessly bite your tongue? Parents and children who disagree ideologically are interesting...but spouses? Mind blown.


Have you not heard of James Carville and Mary Matalin? 

Seriously, though, it's not like we're a couple of wing-nuts;  mostly we're pretty much in the middle. But I'm pretty sure that, on some of the details, he leans a little to one way where I lean the other. If he expresses an opinion I don't agree with, I don't see any point in arguing, though: I respect that he's allowed to have a different opinion. We're both informed, just not interested in having political discussions.

We've been married over 30 years, so I'm going to say it works for us.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I'm in Minnesota, so I'll also be voting on whether or not to have an amendment to the state constitution to define marriage as one man and one woman. 









...and a voter i.d. thing.


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## Lily_T (Sep 25, 2011)

Becca Mills said:


> I admire many things about Australia, but this one detail has always been near the top of my list. I love the fact that y'all have collectively decided that voting is a responsibility, not a privilege. Even in a closely contested election like the one we're about to have here in the U.S., only 50% to 60% of eligible voters will cast votes. I try not to think about that fact too often. It makes me feel bad about my countrymen.


True story. This got brought up once at a college round table I was a part of: bright young people of varying political bents. 
85% disagreed with mandatory voting. (one or two because they thought it was overreaching, but the vast majority did because each side could think of certain low-info groups that they did not want voting) It was the closest we came to consensus.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

MichelleR said:


> I'm in Minnesota, so I'll also be voting on whether or not to have an amendment to the state constitution to define marriage as one man and one woman.
> ...and a voter i.d. thing.


How is the marriage thing polling, Michelle? Is it likely to pass?


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Becca Mills said:


> How is the marriage thing polling, Michelle? Is it likely to pass?


Let's not go there. . . . .keep this very 'non-issue oriented' to avoid the need to lock it.  Thanks.


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## Cliff Ball (Apr 10, 2010)

If I don't like what someone on my Facebook feed says, then I unsubscribe from their feed, but keep them as friends.

I thank God that I live in a state that not only doesn't have many Presidential ads, but barely any for the U.S. Senate seat. The most I've seen are for a State Senate seat in Tarrant County, and one candidate sure has some snarky ads for his opponent.


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## Lily_T (Sep 25, 2011)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Have you not heard of James Carville and Mary Matalin?


Honestly...I'm not sure I buy the James Carville and Mary Matalin narrative. I don't think either of them are as committed to political ideals as they present themselves to be. It's just what they do for a living.



Ann in Arlington said:


> Seriously, though, it's not like we're a couple of wing-nuts;  mostly we're pretty much in the middle. But I'm pretty sure that, on some of the details, he leans a little to one way where I lean the other. If he expresses an opinion I don't agree with, I don't see any point in arguing, though: I respect that he's allowed to have a different opinion. We're both informed, just not interested in having political discussions.
> 
> We've been married over 30 years, so I'm going to say it works for us.


I figured you were in the middle. You kinda have to be to make it work. But I'm still fascinated. And burning with all kinds of nosy questions that I was raised better than to ask.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Becca Mills said:


> How is the marriage thing polling, Michelle? Is it likely to pass?


I would say that it's too close to predict. I saw a poll several weeks ago that looked like it might pass, but I believe that the dial has moved a little. Neither result would surprise me.


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## Pawz4me (Feb 14, 2009)

Lily_T said:


> the vast majority did because each side could think of certain low-info groups that they did not want voting)


^^This.^^


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Lily_T said:


> I figured you were in the middle. You kinda have to be to make it work. But I'm still fascinated. And burning with all kinds of nosy questions that I was raised better than to ask.


And that I wouldn't answer if you did.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Let's not go there. . . . .keep this very 'non-issue oriented' to avoid the need to lock it.  Thanks.


Sorry, Ann -- didn't see this before I answered. My response was very non-controversial.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

MichelleR said:


> I would say that it's too close to predict. I saw a poll several weeks ago that looked like it might pass, but I believe that the dial has moved a little. Neither result would surprise me.


Huh. Thanks for the info. I wonder how many states are voting on such amendments this time around.

ETA: Sorry, Ann ... responded before scrolling down.


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## HAGrant (Jul 17, 2011)

Grrr... the doorbell just rang again. My fourth visit this week from people holding clipboards and wearing buttons. They just asked if I need a ride to vote on Tuesday (my car is sitting in the driveway)... does this happen in urban areas? With gas at $4 a gallon, I should have asked for a ride to the grocery store.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

HAGrant said:


> Grrr... the doorbell just rang again. My fourth visit this week from people holding clipboards and wearing buttons. They just asked if I need a ride to vote on Tuesday (my car is sitting in the driveway)... does this happen in urban areas? With gas at $4 a gallon, I should have asked for a ride to the grocery store.


It's all mobilization at this point, and no one is taking for granted that the car in the driveway is yours.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

MichelleR said:


> It's all mobilization at this point, and no one is taking for granted that the car in the driveway is yours.


Or that it runs or that you'll have access to the car on election day or that driving isn't difficult enough for you (for example, the elderly or infirm) that driving wouldn't make it easier for you to be driven.

Betsy


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## HAGrant (Jul 17, 2011)

DarkScribe said:


> It is a no-brainer. Harry's Bar in Paris, one of the word's most famous literary haunt in the world, says so. They have only been wrong twice. Really that is only once as they were wrong about Bush - and as everyone was wrong about Bush - that sort cancels itself out.


Now I have to look up Harry's. 

Here's another one:

KANSAS CITY, Mo. - A national chain of Halloween stores is reporting their sales of political masks can predict the next president.

Read more: http://www.kshb.com/dpp/lifestyle/can-sales-of-political-halloween-masks-predict-election-outcome#ixzz2BHvH3pU7


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Folks, it's been a bit since we've said this in this thread, so for those joining the thread late and think tl;dr--this thread isn't really asking for your choice.  We're just kicking elections in general around. If you've got a historical or personal comment about voting in general or elections in general, welcome!  Partisan comments have been and will be removed.

Please read through if you have any questions.  We're trying our hardest to keep this thread open so people can vent a bit.  

Betsy


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## Lily_T (Sep 25, 2011)

Does anyone think the pendulum will start to swing to more objective-style primaries and presidential campaigns? Like instead of the current-day thinking of "I want to have a beer with this guy" people start to think "this is the kind of guy I'd hire to do my taxes?"

Ever since I was a kid I figured that if people are falling over themselves to get elected to public office then the incentives must be skewed (well not in that language obviously). In my ideal world being elected should elicit the same level of enthusiasm a jury summons or an extended combat tour does (not that these two things are remotely equivalent). That's when you know you're serving your country.


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## HAGrant (Jul 17, 2011)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Or that it runs or that you'll have access to the car on election day or that driving isn't difficult enough for you (for example, the elderly or infirm) that driving wouldn't make it easier for you to be driven.
> 
> Betsy


MichelleR and Betsy, true... actually, I should have accepted the ride for the experience and then written something about it.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

HAGrant said:


> MichelleR and Betsy, true... actually, I should have accepted the ride for the experience and then written something about it.


Except that the number of volunteers providing rides is limited and really should be left to those really needing the ride. 

You could offer to give rides if you want to learn about the experience. 

Betsy


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

In Belgium you don't have to vote. You have to show up though, but there is an option on the screen to vote "blank/invalid." On average about 4% "vote" that way.

This is about right, I think, because the uniformed are often very loud in voicing their "opinions."

Far be it from me to make this thread controversial by suggesting you take a look at your reviews to confirm this.


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## Pearson Moore (Mar 14, 2011)

I've decided there's only one truly fair and impartial way to decide on the correct candidate for the Office of President. In some counties, Barack and Mitt are spending as much as $62 per resident on advertising. I've already written to both campaigns expressing my preference that they spend* my* $62 not on advertising but on book purchases. Whichever candidate purchases more of my books will win my vote--with some possible exceptions.

Now, I recognize the fact that the two campaigns enjoy practically unlimited funding. So $62 per voter is by no means the limit. So let's say one candidate decides to purchase, say, $300 of my books, while the other candidate purchases only $250. The first candidate spent more. But let's suppose the *second* candidate wrote the better five-star reviews of my books. [There will have to be reviews, of course, and they will have to be five stars] Perhaps the first candidate hired J. K. Rowling to write all 18 reviews, while the second candidate hired John Grisham. Now, you might say, the first candidate hired the more expensive author, so Candidate One again wins. But, unbeknownst to Candidate One, I actually prefer John Grisham's prose over that of Ms. Rowling.

Okay, I already know what you're thinking. "You said you were going to be fair and impartial! Why would Mr. Grisham's exceptional prose have any bearing on this discussion?" In that sense you would certainly be correct. However, we need to take the long view of this. What is the impact on book sales of a truly well written five-star review? Who is to say that Mr. Grisham, rather than spending a miserly six hours on structuring each review, as Ms. Rowling did, instead spent an entire week on each review, fretting over the placement of each well-researched phrase? And wouldn't sixty hours of Mr. Grisham's time--1200 hours for all 18 book reviews--be worth more in the end than Ms. Rowling's 100 hours? In such a scenario, I would probably choose the candidate who decided to spend $250 to purchase my books and 1200 hours to write five-star reviews on all 18 of my books. I feel that's the only fair and impartial way to decide my vote.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I will say, and I know that the gang has no say over this, I'm getting a ton of political ads on KB. 90% holding sentiments that are not aligned with my own. (The other presidential candidate, the congressional candidate I don't like, and the marriage amendment choice there is no chance of me supporting.)


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

MichelleR said:


> I will say, and I know that the gang have no say over this, I'm getting a ton of political ads on KB. 90% holding sentiments that are not aligned with my own. (The other presidential candidate, the congressional candidate I don't like, and the marriage amendment choice there is no chance of me supporting.)


Let us know when you see one...I believe Harvey has the ability to not allow certain types of ads from Google.

Sent from my Kindle Fire HD via tapatalk


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Are you talking about the ads on the bottom?  As far as I know, they are based on your overall browsing history.  For example, the ad for me currently is for information on diabetes, despite the fact that I've been browsing this thread most of the day.  On a different computer, I've been looking at a lot of sites with information about diabetes, and apparently Google's algorithm followed me here.

And what Ann said.

Betsy


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Are you talking about the ads on the bottom? As far as I know, they are based on your overall browsing history. For example, the ad for me currently is for information on diabetes, despite the fact that I've been browsing this thread most of the day. On a different computer, I've been looking at a lot of sites with information about diabetes, and apparently Google's algorithm followed me here.
> 
> And what Ann said.
> 
> Betsy


Oh, I figured I did it to myself, and it was based on my browsing, but by any algorithm, they're targeting me all wrong. And making me want to donate more to the people and things I value. 



Ann in Arlington said:


> Let us know when you see one...I believe Harvey has the ability to not allow certain types of ads from Google.
> 
> Sent from my Kindle Fire HD via tapatalk


They're fair. Just wrong for me.


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## George Berger (Aug 7, 2011)

We can put a guy on the moon, we can put robots on Mars, for crying out loud. We have machines the size of a box of matches that hold the equivalent of a thousand or so LPs worth of music. We have computing and networking resources that were absolutely unthinkable twenty years ago. We've mapped the human genome. We've cloned sheep, even if nobody is particularly clear on why.

We still lack the technology, apparently, to prevent people like me who live in a "media market" that spans two states having to sit through five minutes of vicious and stupid attack ads every night for candidates _in the next state over_.

_--George, ah, politics - where eagerness to do a job is, as far as I've been able to tell, inversely proportional to one's actual qualification to do so..._


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I do think Harvey had opted out of political ads...but I'm not entirely sure how it works.

Betsy


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## DarkScribe (Aug 30, 2012)

HAGrant said:


> Now I have to look up Harry's.
> 
> Here's another one:
> 
> ...


If you ever get to Paris you will have to go there. A lot of history.

Not sure about sales of masks, would depend on whether the purchaser was intending to support or mock the candidate.

A curious thing. I noticed in your quote on my post that I had a superfluous "world" in there (comes from responding using an iPhone on a ferry) but when I went to edit it - my post was gone. Very strange.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

Andrew Ashling said:


> In Belgium you don't have to vote. You have to show up though, but there is an option on the screen to vote "blank/invalid." On average about 4% "vote" that way.


That's perfectly reasonable. I respect the choice to refuse to vote as a form of protest.


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## Justawriter (Jul 24, 2012)

HAGrant said:


> Grrr... the doorbell just rang again. My fourth visit this week from people holding clipboards and wearing buttons. They just asked if I need a ride to vote on Tuesday (my car is sitting in the driveway)... does this happen in urban areas? With gas at $4 a gallon, I should have asked for a ride to the grocery store.


I got a call today asking for my support for the State Senator that I am not planning to vote for. The woman calling was pleasant enough and I felt bad telling that I was planning to vote for the other candidate. She then asked me if I needed a ride to go vote, which surprised me. I don't, but would have thought they'd be better served giving rides to people who will vote for their candidate, not the competition.


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

Fredster said:


> This is the most important election the country has ever faced, folks. If [my guy] doesn't beat [the other guy], this may LITERALLY be the end of the country as we know it. Listen, [the other guy] is just plain dangerous, and if [my guy] fails, well, I weep for the soul of this great nation. We'll descend into third-world chaos, a tailspin we can never pull out of in this already lackluster economy. And we can only blame ourselves for not getting out there and stopping [the other guy].
> 
> We can do this, people! Get out on Tuesday and vote for [my guy]!
> 
> WHO'S WITH ME?


I agree with you for the most part. That said, it might be argued that many on both sides are saying much the same thing. Odd that we can feel the same way about [our guy], regardless of which side we are on. In the words of our wonderful sage, Geoffthomas, "just sayin' ."


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## LilianaHart (Jun 20, 2011)

Wow...I've got to say I'm impressed by this thread. I just read all 5 pages, and I can't believe the conversation didn't spiral into the political pit of doom. Way to go KBers! And Betsy for your editing skills


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

PamelaKelley said:


> I got a call today asking for my support for the State Senator that I am not planning to vote for. The woman calling was pleasant enough and I felt bad telling that I was planning to vote for the other candidate. She then asked me if I needed a ride to go vote, which surprised me. I don't, but would have thought they'd be better served giving rides to people who will vote for their candidate, not the competition.


I think there is still a strategy there. The "voting is important, no matter which candidate you chose, and having said that, and offered to take you to the polls, how to you like our guy/gal now?" plan.


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## Debbiek (Aug 7, 2010)

I am in the swing state of Ohio. This year we have 4 voters in our house (two of my kids will be voting their first presidential election)  We get multiple calls for each one of us and it is getting worse the closer it gets to election day. *sigh*  I can't wait till the elections are over.

Will Sandy have caused problem for the voters?


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

I am going to be real glad when its over. Hopefully it will be over on Wednesday. We have a lot of local trash ads too here in Texas. They are so bad. I swear, sometimes I feel like I live in Mayberry and not the 7th largest city in the country. The quality of the local stuff is just embarrassing. 

I also have stopped pretty much watching live TV, news or anything else. 

And to an earlier discussion about how you deal with opposing viewpoints in the same family, my husband and I are on polar opposites. You have to learn to pick your battles. I have to say though that it has never been as bad as this election. I don't know why, but I pretty much bow out to the other room when anything political is being discussed on TV. Its not worth it to me. I rather huddle elsewhere and read.  

I wasn't raised in the US, but in Europe, so sometimes I feel I am having to put myself into boxes I don't really belong too. For lack of any options I guess. Its still a bit confusing to me. 

I can't vote, yet. But I'll have to get the hang of some of this stuff since in the near future I intend on applying for US citizenship. They ask a lot of questions I think about the system. 

Where I live most of the people are on the other side of what I believe in. But its been like this almost all my life so I am used to being a minority that way  
I learned to just talk about something else or walk away. 

I just can't take all this yelling over each other on TV or radio. Ads, debates, its all just too "loud" for me. I am more one to discuss things, but with respect. I mean its not like anyone is going to be changing their mind by being yelled at. 

I do find going back in history interesting though. How things were done. 

I am always reminded of when my grandpa was still alive, back in Bavaria. All the old guys would go to the pub each afternoon for cards and beer. And they would argue and yell about politics for hours. Then they did a prosit and see ya and did it all again the next day. No hard feelings. 

It just seems like the tone is more "sharp" this time around.

All the calls here though are robo calls. Maybe there are too many people living here for personal calls.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Tip:  If you say you've already voted AND don't want to volunteer, they'll, in most cases, stop calling you.  No system is perfect.    And you may not be willing to, er, lie.  But, like Lincoln, the campaigns spend their efforts where it's going to do the most good.  And if they don't need to get you to vote, and you're not willing to volunteer, they'll move on for this election.

Betsy


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

I'm not sure anyone in our home votes exactly the same way as anyone else. This year we will have our 5th voter, DD turned 18 back in May. I told my kids, "Look at the issues, research what is important and vote the way your heart says."

DH & I are registered one party, but have never voted straight ballot and often we differ on certain things.


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## Shelley K (Sep 19, 2011)

Totally non-partisan--George Carlin makes more sense to me than any politician in recent memory. The video includes words that George Carlin often uses, so be warned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o5jpcTmcqk


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## WhizCat (Oct 2, 2010)

I think the great thing about voting in this country is that you are allowed to leave any or all of your ballot blank or put in a write-in candidate if you don't like any candidate in a certain field.

I never thought I would do that (leave a slot blank), but I actually did a couple of years ago, so I got to vote for ballot initiatives, judges, and everyone else on the ticket! So don't be turned off from voting because of any particular seat race. There are usually lots of important issues on any one ballot.

I live in what may or may not be a swing state -- meaning not Ohio but where we still get poll surveys, robocalls, and campaign spokespeople calling at least five times a day and at least 10 minutes of political ads on TV every hour. (AAAAAUGH!) I usually feel compelled to vote for one or the other of the top two presidential candidates. I wish, though, that someday we will hold a Constitutional Convention and overthrow the electoral college system, or barring that, enough states will sign the national vote compact or whatever it is and essentially do the same thing. Everyone should have an equal say.


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## Al Dente (Sep 3, 2012)

I won't say who I voted for, but I did vote early this election. The only thing I'll say is that things have gotten so heated in my state, people are actually keying cars and stealing campaign signs out of yards. I also know one person who had a beer bottle thrown at her car because of her campaign magnet / sticker. 

Me? I was shocked that the same thing didn't happen to me when I went to the early voting place last week. I won't reveal my candidate because I don't want to upset anyone or stir anything up, but I will say that my choice has not been received well by family or friends. I tend to ignore the negativity, though. I'm not a member of any political party. I tend to vote based on issues that are important to me at the time. I've voted for both major parties and third party candidates in the past.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> I wish they'd overhaul the whole voting system, getting rid of the electoral college and so that it doesn't go by state, that there's just a true popular vote, where every person's vote really does matter. The way it is now, it comes down to a handful of swing states, with all the others fairly pre-determined.


Freely predetermined by the voters of those states. And as we may see Tuesday, a number of those predeterminations may easily prove to be bogus.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Folks,

despite the title of the thread, we are not taking a poll of how you would vote here, it's a general discussion. Partisan comments are not allowed and will be or have been deleted. We do not allow political debate here on KindleBoards.

(Note that the post that caused me to step in here is one of those that got deleted, so if your post is still here, I'm not responding to it. )

Thanks for understanding.

Betsy
KB Moderator


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## Revolution (Sep 17, 2012)

My first deletion, woo, not!

How you can have a thread titled "Obama or Romney" and not allow political debate seems oxymoronic. 

What is meant to be discussed? Their toilet habits? What coffee they drink?


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## Incognita (Apr 3, 2011)

I doubt Romney drinks coffee...


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## Sapphire (Apr 24, 2012)

1- I will be showing my photo ID at the polls.  It is not required in my state, but showing it is my personal statement that I believe it should be a requirement in order to protect my voting rights.

2- The Electoral College would function well if all states worked like Nebraska and Maine.  In those states. electoral votes are allocated by congressional districts, with the 2 remaining votes according to the majority state vote, rather than winner take all.  That method breaks up the electoral votes coming from a state and prevents a handful of states from determining the election.  It also would make almost impossible for a candidate to win the popular vote and lose the electoral vote.

3- I understand the belief that a 3rd, or even 4th and 5th, major party may be needed.  However, at this time it is a given that one of two men will be President for the next 4 years.  In my opinion, if there is one you really don't want in the Oval Office, you should be voting for the other one.  A 3rd party candidate vote may make you feel good, but it doesn't help keep anyone out of the presidency.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Revolution,

sorry for any confusion. I suggest you, and any other newcomers ot the thread, read through the thread, or at least the first post which I've quoted below for your conveniece.



jhendereson said:


> Well, the election is almost upon us. Thank God it will soon be over. I cannot ever remember a presidential election being so polarized, so vicious, and so intriguing. If I were a better writer I would seriously consider writing a novel based on current events. Regardless of who wins, the USA will not sink into the abyss. Again: whomever wins, the USA will not sink into the abyss. Worth repeating because a whole lot of people think otherwise. Hope it doesn't end in a tie, or one wins the popular vote but loses the electoral college. Imagine the head-bashing that would ensue. So get out and vote--and hope your guy wins. God bless America!


Political discussions are not allowed here on KindleBoards as they always end badly. We are allowing this thread that is, so far, talking about elections in general as long as it remains as civil as it has; however partisan posts have been and will be removed, as has been said several times throughout the thread.

People are mostly sharing their feelings about the types of campaigns that are run these days.

Thanks,

Betsy
KB Moderator


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

Sapphire said:


> 1- I will be showing my photo ID at the polls. It is not required in my state, but showing it is my personal statement that I believe it should be a requirement in order to protect my voting rights.
> 
> 2- The Electoral College would function well if all states worked like Nebraska and Maine. In those states. electoral votes are allocated by congressional districts, with the 2 remaining votes according to the majority state vote, rather than winner take all. That method breaks up the electoral votes coming from a state and prevents a handful of states from determining the election. It also would make almost impossible for a candidate to win the popular vote and lose the electoral vote.
> 
> 3- I understand the belief that a 3rd, or even 4th and 5th, major party may be needed. However, at this time it is a given that one of two men will be President for the next 4 years. In my opinion, if there is one you really don't want in the Oval Office, you should be voting for the other one. A 3rd party candidate vote may make you feel good, but it doesn't help keep anyone out of the presidency.


Ditto (except that I'm in another Midwestern state near Nebraska).


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## KVWitten (Apr 11, 2011)

Sapphire said:


> <snip>
> 2- The Electoral College would function well if all states worked like Nebraska and Maine. In those states. electoral votes are allocated by congressional districts, with the 2 remaining votes according to the majority state vote, rather than winner take all. That method breaks up the electoral votes coming from a state and prevents a handful of states from determining the election. It also would make almost impossible for a candidate to win the popular vote and lose the electoral vote.
> <snip>


I like this idea. I didn't know some states do it this way, I assumed all states operated the same way (as in all their electoral votes go to the majority winner, ie 'winner takes all').

I well remember the big debate about the electoral college after the 2000 Bush/Gore election. Why wasn't something done about it then??


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> The Electoral College would function well if all states worked like Nebraska and Maine.


It functioned well for many years before Nebraska and Maine changed their laws.


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## Cliff Ball (Apr 10, 2010)

I Think the Electoral College ought to have 1 vote per state, that seems fair. If we go to exclusively popular vote, none of the ones that everyone fights over, like Iowa, New Hampshire, and some of the much smaller states, won't have any reason to vote because bigger states like California, New York, Illinois, Florida, and Texas (they'd be the fly in the ointment) would decide the election of President. At least that's what I think might happen, but who knows.

I have an idea: Let the candidates fight a duel, like Hamilton vs Burr. Whoever wins, becomes the President.


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## Vegas_Asian (Nov 2, 2008)

I just cannot wait for the ads to start. Apparently I live in the city that has the highest number of political ads in the nation. I just dvr now so I can fastforward through the endless ads. I came home yesterday at 1pm after an early shift at work and there were fifteen political messages on the answering machine

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Can I ask a question about the photo ID issue because I think a lot of Canadians are getting confused by it (if Twitter and Facebook is any indicator)? I don't care about the politics. I just want to understand it.

In Canada, I have to show photo ID. If I don't have any, I bring a piece of ID that has my mailing address on it and another piece of government ID. Then I go with someone who has photo ID and I'm verified that way. That used to happen before I had a driver's licence. I just went with a friend or whatever.

That's how "registering" happens, too. Normally, you just check off on your taxes if you want to register to vote that way. Otherwise, you can show up at the polls on Election Day and register there. If you don't have ID, you do the same as above (my Landlord came with me when I was university. I lived in the upstairs apartment in his house, so he gave me a ride and everything  ).


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

In the states it's a literal thing, at least from the ones I know of. You show up with a state ID that has your current address and picture on it. That's it. btw- You have to pay for this ID in order for you to have the _privileged_ to vote that is normally considered a constitutional right.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I don't know how many states have same-day registration. In Virginia there is no same day registration. I _think_ you had to have registered by the 15th of October.

Betsy


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

Wisconsin used to but I'm not certain now with the ID. They have been going to court off and on over it for the past 9 months so I'm betting it has been settled one way or another.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Bethany B. said:


> In the states it's a literal thing, at least from the ones I know of. You show up with a state ID that has your current address and picture on it. That's it. btw- You have to pay for this ID in order for you to have the _privileged_ to vote that is normally considered a constitutional right.


Ah! Ok now that makes sense. We have a mechanism to adjust for those who cannot afford/do not have Provincial ID (which you'd have to pay for).


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I don't know how many states have same-day registration. In Virginia there is no same day registration. I _think_ you had to have registered by the 15th of October.
> 
> Betsy


That's something I never understood, either. Then again, we don't have 6 hour waiting lines in Canada, either. There are two polling locations within 5 minute walking distance of my house when federal elections are held. Inside each station, there are 2-4 stations. Plus we do a lot of early voting, too.

Are you allowed to take time off work to vote in the US?


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Ah! Ok now that makes sense. We have a mechanism to adjust for those who cannot afford/do not have Provincial ID (which you'd have to pay for).


I think I would have less a beef with it if people didn't have to pay or could get help paying. A right is a right regardless of your financial situation.  It is interesting to see how other countries vote and what they have to do.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Krista D. Ball said:


> That's something I never understood, either. Then again, we don't have 6 hour waiting lines in Canada, either. There are two polling locations within 5 minute walking distance of my house when federal elections are held. Inside each station, there are 2-4 stations. Plus we do a lot of early voting, too.
> 
> Are you allowed to take time off work to vote in the US?


Six hour waiting lines are pretty rare; I've never waited more than about fifteen minutes to vote. No, no time off to vote in most cases.

USA philosophy until recently has been to make it as hard as possible so people could prove how important the right to vote was to them.  Or at least that's how it seems like to me.  However, early voting is becoming more common; and people can register to vote in some states when they get or renew their drivers' license.

Betsy


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Bethany B. said:


> In the states it's a literal thing, at least from the ones I know of. You show up with a state ID that has your current address and picture on it. That's it. btw- You have to pay for this ID in order for you to have the _privileged_ to vote that is normally considered a constitutional right.


In FL you can get a free picture I. D. from the state, but you have to bring in your birth certificate, social security card, marriage certificate (if you changed your name when you married) plus a current electric or water bill for your residence in your name. I just did this to renew my driver's license, which you do have to pay for.

And yes, you have to be preregistered to vote. I forget by what date, it might have been as late as October 20th here.


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## MalloryMoutinho (Aug 24, 2012)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Are you allowed to take time off work to vote in the US?


HAHAHAHA HAHA HAHA HA.......no.......

Well, maybe, for all I know. But I do know my husband cannot vote this year because of his work schedule. I've never been able to take time off of work to go.


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> In FL you can get a free picture I. D. from the state, but you have to bring in your birth certificate, social security card, marriage certificate (if you changed your name when you married) plus a current electric or water bill for your residence in your name. I just did this to renew my driver's license, which you do have to pay for.
> 
> And yes, you have to be preregistered to vote. I forget by what date, it might have been as late as October 20th here.


What no blood or first born?


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Bethany B. said:


> What no blood or first born?


Lol, I showed up three times, each time missing some piece of paperwork. One time the 80 year old lady in front of me couldn't remember what county she got married in some 60+ years ago and had no idea how to track it down. Her husband was deceased, and now she couldn't get her license renewed!

The next time I went, there was a lady about my age there, and common law marriage (just saying you were married) used to be legal, so she had no official peperwork! She'd brought in a marriage certificate they had signed in front of a preacher (in her mother's living room), but it wasn't good enough, because it didn't have the official seal! She was so frustrated. People are so screwed now.


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## jlmarten (May 9, 2012)

I live in Ohio and, ugh, I can't wait for this election to end. I'm glad I don't watch much TV, but my mailbox is stuffed with political ads everyday. And while I feel very strongly about which candidate is worthy of the office of president, I can't condone the vitriol spewed by either side, whether or not they seem tame by historic comparison.

Also, after it ends, I won't have to listen to my middle son, whose political views are polar opposite of mine, berate me - or my opinions. Being young and in college and, of course, knowing so much more than I do (knowledge and intellect sprouts wings as we age, I guess), he loves to debate me. What he doesn't seem able to grasp is that, while I believe his view of things incorrect, even egregious at times, I'd fight to the death for his (or anyone else for that matter) to have the right to voice them.


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## Richardcrasta (Jul 29, 2010)

Re: a dilemma some writers may face about expressing political views and thus losing readers, and my take (even though most of it is obvious and unoriginal, just felt like stating it, for my own self--just as Catholics periodically need to recite the "I Believe").

Political choices are not like choosing flavors of ice cream. I like vanilla, and you like chocolate, and that's okay, it doesn't bother me that you choose chocolate, I can still get my vanilla. In politics, if the chocolate guy (or strawberry guy) wins, he may take away my right to eat vanilla, or to be vanilla. Governments (run by the politician that wins, and the businesses that supported him) do take away our rights, and have steadily done so.

So I have some political views, and I express them in my books, and recently, in a few tweets and on one particular FB Book Page (page for a specific book). And noticed, as a result, that my likes had gone down from 164 to 160, despite a few people adding me. So, I guess, people were dropping me for expressing or sharing political views.

Can't help it. A man (or woman, though I can't claim to speak for them, or for all men) must stand up for what he believes in. Or else, what are we?

In that, a writer, I feel, is not like a business. Coca Cola can't afford to choose one candidate over the other, because they might lose half their customers. But a writer needs to have some backbone (even though mine has recently become rubberized in the "Let me stay away from controversy, what difference does it make anyway?" kind of attitude, vestiges of it still remain).

And if I lose a few readers for having expressed myself, well, too bad--my purpose in life cannot be merely to sell books.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

MalloryMoutinho said:


> HAHAHAHA HAHA HAHA HA.......no.......
> 
> Well, maybe, for all I know. But I do know my husband cannot vote this year because of his work schedule. I've never been able to take time off of work to go.


Oh. Wow. No, you have to be allowed to go vote here, especially if you work long shifts. There was a huge issue last election because some of the Patch workers weren't allowed/given access to vote.

Thanks for answering my questions!


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

Voting laws are determined by each individual state. There is no single way it works for all states. It's a mistake to think the voting laws in New York are the same as those in Utah.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

MalloryMoutinho said:


> HAHAHAHA HAHA HAHA HA.......no.......
> 
> Well, maybe, for all I know. But I do know my husband cannot vote this year because of his work schedule. I've never been able to take time off of work to go.


Legally, your employer must not interfer with your right to vote, that is federal law, so if you are working during the hours the polls are open, you could have a case if they don't let you go to vote. Not only that, but I'm sure you could have received an absentee ballot and mailed it in.

I checked into this further and amended my statment per this site:
http://www.laborlawyers.com/files/33318_Voting%20Leave%20Laws%20by%20State%20-%202012.pdf


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

Terrence is right and so I went to find a map. 

http://www.ncsl.org/legislatures-elections/elections/voter-id.aspx

I actually thought there were more strict photo ID states.


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## Not Here (May 23, 2011)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> Legally, your employer must give you two hours off to vote (without pay). Not only that, but I'm sure you could have received an absentee ballot and mailed it in.


I've been in a few states that were very strict about absentee ballots. Seems silly but I think AZ was one that wasn't fond of them or had really special rules with them.


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## MalloryMoutinho (Aug 24, 2012)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> Legally, your employer must give you two hours off to vote (without pay). Not only that, but I'm sure you could have received an absentee ballot and mailed it in.


Yeah, but in the medical field A) we don't get our schedules in time to get an absentee ballot and B) they may legally have to, but the don't.

Also, other jobs I've had wouldn't really let me go either. Kind of like the idea of legally being allowed two fifteen minute breaks and a half hour lunch...but those almost never happening. (I've lived in a few different states...so this doesn't apply to all of them)

ETA: CT does NOT have a law allowing us time off to vote


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

I don't understand how states can pass laws to determine how people can vote federally.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

MalloryMoutinho said:


> Yeah, but in the medical field A) we don't get our schedules in time to get an absentee ballot and B) they may legally have to, but the don't.
> 
> Also, other jobs I've had wouldn't really let me go either. Kind of like the idea of legally being allowed two fifteen minute breaks and a half hour lunch...but those almost never happening. (I've lived in a few different states...so this doesn't apply to all of them)


If you have any questions regarding your state's laws, they're answered here:
https://www.usvotefoundation.org/state-elections/state-voting-laws-requirements

My mother was an RN in surgery and never missed voting. She was on call, worked twelve hour shifts, and still managed to absentee vote or get to the polls. Yes, it takes forethought.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

MalloryMoutinho said:


> ETA: CT does NOT have a law allowing us time off to vote


CT dows allow absentee voting with excuse (just write it in), and it's federal law that they must not interfer with your right to vote.

I guess it all depends on how much you want to vote, as to whether you make the necessary arrangements to do so.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> I don't understand how states can pass laws to determine how people can vote federally.


The only elected federal officials are president and vice president. The people don't vote for them directly. In each state a slate of electors are elected. These electors form the Electoral College. So the people in New York are selecting a slate of electors from New York who will then elect the president. In 48 states the complete slate pledged to one candidate or the other is elected. In Nebraska and Maine, the electors represent the proportionate vote each candidate received.

So, all elections are actually state elections.


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## Claudia Lefeve (Dec 17, 2010)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> Legally, your employer must give you two hours off to vote (without pay.) Not only that, but I'm sure you could have received an absentee ballot and mailed it in.


In the government agencies I've worked for, we're allowed paid leave (1 hr - 2 hr...I don't remember) to vote.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> So where is this belief that those rights can be taken away coming from? Am I missing something?


You are speaking of natural rights. There are many other things called rights which derive from legislation. For example, the right to practice medicine is governed by legislation.


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## Revolution (Sep 17, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Revolution,
> 
> sorry for any confusion. I suggest you, and any other newcomers ot the thread, read through the thread, or at least the first post which I've quoted below for your conveniece.
> 
> ...


I think I might opt out all together, anything concerning politics/ government isn't good for my blood pressure, I find it all too frustrating


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## bookworm77 (Mar 10, 2012)




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## Romana Grimm (Mar 19, 2012)

I only read the last few posts, and good lord, you Americans sure make voting complicated! In my country, people vote directly for their party. There's none of that "vote for a guy to vote for your presidential candidate" thing going on. Also, our elections take place on Sundays, which makes it possible for all people to vote without having to take a day off work or getting in a clinch with their boss. Those few who're sick or abroad or otherwise not able to vote on that Sunday can hand in their vote by mail. 

Does anybody know whether there are plans to overhaul the American election system? Maybe it's not my place to say so, but it does seem a bit ripe for reinvention ...


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

Romana Grimm said:


> I only read the last few posts, and good lord, you Americans sure make voting complicated! In my country, people vote directly for their party. There's none of that "vote for a guy to vote for your presidential candidate" thing going on. Also, our elections take place on Sundays, which makes it possible for all people to vote without having to take a day off work or getting in a clinch with their boss. Those few who're sick or abroad or otherwise not able to vote on that Sunday can hand in their vote by mail.
> 
> *Does anybody know whether there are plans to overhaul the American election system? Maybe it's not my place to say so, but it does seem a bit ripe for reinvention* ...


Changing the electoral college (our method for choosing president) would require amending the constitution, which is a pretty big deal. It seems like people complain about the electoral college every four years, but nothing is ever done about it. Probably because we're all so sick of politics by the end of the election that we can't stand to talk about it anymore  let alone attempt to tackle a constitutional amendment.


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## Romana Grimm (Mar 19, 2012)

Oh yes, I know what you mean, Rachel. It'd be worth it, though, especially in these modern times. Kind of right up the alley with new underground power lines, storm proof building and whatnot ... (From an outside point of view, many houses in America seem kind of provisional, as in easy and cheap to build but difficult to maintain in cases of inclement weather).


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Pawz4me said:


> And don't forget May 22, 1865, when Senator Preston Smith Brooks attacked Senator Charles Sumner with his cane, causing serious injury. And the attack took place right on the floor of the Senate.
> 
> Politics now is comparatively very civilized.


Amen, I love that example. It appears someone other than me may have read Shelby Foote's three-volume (I think) account of the Civil War... it's great for lending some historical perspective to all these wild claims we get every four years that "this year's election cycle is the worst/most uncivil/most negative in history..."

It's just not so. And hasn't been since at least ... I'm gonna go with 1916...

Survey says....

(Family Feud reference)

And going really far back, 1828 was perhaps the worst of all... http://history1800s.about.com/od/leaders/a/electionof1828.htm


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

If it does turn out that one candidate wins the popular vote and the other wins the electoral vote, it doesn't really mean anything, because the popular vote doesn't really mean anything.  The candidates tailor their campaigns to win based on the rules, and the rules are that the one with the most electoral votes wins.   So, they're not even attempting to win the popular vote.

It would be like after a baseball game, pointing out that the losing team had more hits than the winning team.  So what?  It's not the goal of the game to get more hits than the opponent.  If it was the goal, then the teams would modify their strategy to get more hits, not more runs.

Also, about the idea that it's everyone's duty to vote.  Yes, it is, but it's just as much their duty to become informed about who and what they're voting for.  Voting while ignorant is just as bad as not voting at all.

And finally, it's become extremely clear that the concept of unbiased journalism in the U.S. has been tossed by the wayside.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Cliff Ball said:


> I Think the Electoral College ought to have 1 vote per state, that seems fair.


I don't think that would be fair at all. Why should a state like Wyoming, with less than 600,000 people, have the same voting power as California, a state with almost 38 million people?

By the way, the Electoral College mirrors the makeup of the Senate and House of Representatives, so your concept of one vote per state is incorporated into the system since each state is guaranteed at least two electoral votes (and two Senators) regardless of population. But added to that electoral vote count is the number of Reprentatives they have, so population is taken into account also.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

swolf said:


> I don't think that would be fair at all. Why should a state like Wyoming, with less than 600,000 people, have the same voting power as California, a state with almost 38 million people?
> 
> By the way, the Electoral College mirrors the makeup of the Senate and House of Representatives, so your concept of one vote per state is incorporated into the system since each state is guaranteed at least two electoral votes (and two Senators) regardless of population. But added to that electoral vote count is the number of Representatives they have, so population is taken into account also.


Oh, those Founding Fathers... always thinking of Roger Sherman-like ways to meet in the middle on things.  LOL


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## Sapphire (Apr 24, 2012)

Re: swolf's statement that it is as bad to vote ignorant as it is to not vote at all....

I think it IS FAR WORSE to cast an ignorant vote than to not vote.  We are all entitled to our opinion and the choice is ours, so first one must have an opinion of their own.  It is unforgiveable to vote for a person because you think they're attractive, you recognize their name, your friend told you that candidate was best, someone quoted one sound bite to you, you've always voted for that party, etc., etc., etc.  I am shocked by the number of people who cannot name the Vice-president or their Congressman or their Governor or any of the Supreme Court Justices.  It only takes a little effort to become informed.  Listen to both candidates.  Study their backgrounds.  Look at what they have done.  Give it some serious thought and THEN go the polls and cast a vote that has meaning.


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## ◄ Jess ► (Apr 21, 2010)

I can't vote this year because I didn't realize I had to change my voter registration when I moved last month, whoops. I wish all states would do mail-in ballots, so you can sit down and read everything over, and vote at your convenience. How does anyone get a chance to vote when they're working? Even if I had changed my registration, I'm gone from the house for 12 hours/day.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Sorry you missed the window to register!  However, having a combined work/commute of that many hours is a reason to be able to vote early in person here in VA; perhaps the same in Illinois?  At any rate, you can register at any time--if it were me, I'd change my voter registration now while it's on your mind...  

Edited to add:  You surely can get a sample ballot well in advance of the election to study at your leisure.  It's what I do.

Betsy
whose immigrant grandparents (did I mention Hibbing in this thread yet? ) didn't come to the Frozen North from beautiful coastal towns in Yugoslavia so that she could ignore her civic duty...I don't want them haunting me, LOL!


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## btsc99 (Oct 12, 2012)

◄ Jess ► said:


> I can't vote this year because I didn't realize I had to change my voter registration when I moved last month, whoops. I wish all states would do mail-in ballots, so you can sit down and read everything over, and vote at your convenience. How does anyone get a chance to vote when they're working? Even if I had changed my registration, I'm gone from the house for 12 hours/day.


In the UK we have, to quote Baldrick "A cunning plan my Lord", regarding County and Borough constituencies. This involves the changing of constituency boundaries every few years, if you are unlucky enough to live close to the edge of a particularly contentious (for local, general, Police Commissioner elections, and the odd by-election) constituency, I reckon you might end up having to re-register about twice a fortnight. Who says we Brits don't lead exciting lives?


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## David McAfee (Apr 15, 2010)

camistarr said:


> Not sure who I expect to win, but I'm guessing my candidate won't because I'm voting for former Governor Gary Johnson, the Libertarian Party's nominee.
> 
> Ebook sales will flourish if Gary Johnson is elected president.
> 
> _(and he has a book out on Kindle!)_


Late to the party, but I voted for Johnson, too. Just because I want ebook sales to flourish.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Sorry you missed the window to register! However, having a combined work/commute of that many hours is a reason to be able to vote early in person here in VA; perhaps the same in Illinois? At any rate, you can register at any time--if it were me, I'd change my voter registration now while it's on your mind...
> 
> Edited to add: You surely can get a sample ballot well in advance of the election to study at your leisure. It's what I do.
> 
> ...


Most states will switch your voter ID at the same time you get your new driver's license (just ask) with updated address. FL does.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

David McAfee said:


> Late to the party, but I voted for Johnson, too. Just because I want ebook sales to flourish.


Dang. And here I was thinking it was David McAfee I was supposed to vote for... I was getting McAfee-Dalglish 2012 bumper stickers all prepared, 'n' everything!

(And no, thanks to the Obama-Romney Freedom from Gingers Act of 2011, Dalglish cannot be at the top of the ticket.)  j/k


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## Gone To Croatan (Jun 24, 2011)

◄ Jess ► said:


> I wish all states would do mail-in ballots, so you can sit down and read everything over, and vote at your convenience.


Mail-in ballots are notoriously easy to abuse. If you actually go to a polling centre, at least they know that you were the one who voted in your name and no-one else can force you to vote for someone you didn't want to vote for since they have no way of verifying who you voted for.


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## Jan Strnad (May 27, 2010)

Getting rid of the electoral college would require a constitutional amendment, which would be a major, major undertaking.

It could happen in another way, though. Apparently some states are getting together to agree-to-agree to award their electoral votes to the winner of the popular vote. Once enough states have agreed-to-agree such that their total electoral votes equals the 279 majority, the agreement would take effect and we'd have election of the President by popular vote.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> whose immigrant grandparents (did I mention Hibbing in this thread yet? ) didn't come to the Frozen North from beautiful coastal towns in Yugoslavia so that she could ignore her civic duty...I don't want them haunting me, LOL!


Oh, this is so familiar! My also Yugoslavian immigrant great grandparents didn't come to a frozen wasteland quite close to Hibbing ... yada yada.

My grandmother is telling me an average of once a day about how her father came here unable to speak the language, learned it, became a citizen and then headed right into WWI, where they sent him to a place where he didn't know the language. And he DRESSED-UP to go vote. 

My grandmother has surprisingly little compassion, considering, for people who come to this country and can't speak the language, or -- er -- people who come to this country.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> I don't think that would be fair at all. Why should a state like Wyoming, with less than 600,000 people, have the same voting power as California, a state with almost 38 million people?


If there is a tie in the Electoral College, the president is selected by the House of Representatives. In that selection, each state gets one and only one vote.


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

Terrence OBrien said:


> If there is a tie in the Electoral College, the president is selected by the House of Representatives. In that selection, each state gets one and only one vote.


True, and the Senate chooses the VP. Could this potentially mean we end up with a Romney-Biden white house 

I've always wondered how the house voting thing would play out. I would think, in a lot of states, getting the reps to agree on a candidate would be....messy.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Not unprecedented; originally, the runner-up in the Presidential election was the VP, per Article II of the US Constitution.  Changed by the 12th Amendment.  Which, if electors were free to follow their hearts as some think they should, could result in the same thing as they are voted for on separate ballots according to the 12th Amendment. (Edit:  looked it up to be sure.)


Betsy


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## JRHenderson (Dec 4, 2011)

T.L. Haddix said:


> we could have a - wait for it - Romney/Biden ticket.


They'd be like a gaffe tag-team! 



T.L. Haddix said:


> Or an Obama/Ryan ticket.


"So can we buy..."
"No."
"But can't we just spend..."
"No."
"How about allocating some money..."
"No."


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

JRHenderson said:


> "So can we buy..."
> "No."
> "But can't we just spend..."
> "No."
> ...


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

T.L. Haddix said:


> I am torn on that - on the one hand, I'd like to think that would work and work well. However, on the other hand (the cynical hand), I know it would never work. Can you imagine the tension in the White House if we followed that tradition these days? Romney and Obama strongly dislike each other. Added to that, how much would they be able to trust the person who's just spent the last year driving their reputation in the mud? On local politics, I know that's why a lot of county-level elected officials clean house after they come into office. You never know who has your back and who has the knife to stick in it.
> 
> JR - LMAO!


Well, that IS the reason why they changed Article II with the 12th Amendment. It didn't work....


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Terrence OBrien said:


> If there is a tie in the Electoral College, the president is selected by the House of Representatives. In that selection, each state gets one and only one vote.


And what makes that even weirder, is that it's voted on by the next session of the House, not the current one. So we'd have to wait until January to find out who officially won.

I would imagine there would be a lot of promises made during the two months.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

T.L. Haddix said:


> And the VP is selected by the Senate, IIRC. So in theory, if we had a 269/269 split, we could have a - wait for it - Romney/Biden ticket.


I can imagine Romney's inaugural address:

"I promise to not decrease the military. I promise to not raise taxes. And most of all, I promise not to.." *Looks at Biden* "...die."


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## jackz4000 (May 15, 2011)

I'm gonna try to enjoy the election, because it's going to get mean and ugly around midnight tomorrow. Lawsuits will be flying by noon.


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## 31842 (Jan 11, 2011)




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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

T.L. Haddix said:


> Fillion should be at the top of the ticket.....


Clearly.

When did Wesley ever captain anything?


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## Eltanin Publishing (Mar 24, 2011)

swolf said:


> If it does turn out that one candidate wins the popular vote and the other wins the electoral vote, it doesn't really mean anything, because the popular vote doesn't really mean anything. The candidates tailor their campaigns to win based on the rules, and the rules are that the one with the most electoral votes wins.


The electoral college not only affects how the candidates campaign - it affects who votes. I'm sure there will be plenty of people in the hurricane zone who are struggling with every day living right now, and will NOT make the effort to vote because they know it won't matter - NJ, NY, and CT will go blue regardless. But they (and many people in non-battleground states) would have made the effort to vote if it had been simply a popular vote election. So it's true - you can't say what the outcome would have been if the rules had been different.


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## KVWitten (Apr 11, 2011)

KateDanley said:


>


Oh, I like this one (though I agree Fillion should be on top).


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## Quiss (Aug 21, 2012)

Being Canadian, I haven't followed this thread.

But this is surely must-see TV tomorrow

http://www.comedycentral.com/live-election-night/


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## Incognita (Apr 3, 2011)

Quiss said:


> Being Canadian, I haven't followed this thread.
> 
> But this is surely must-see TV tomorrow
> 
> http://www.comedycentral.com/live-election-night/


Watching Jon Stewart is the only way I will survive election night.


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## Michael Kingswood (Feb 18, 2011)

jhendereson said:


> I cannot ever remember a presidential election being so polarized, so vicious, and so intriguing.


Might want to read about the election of 1800 sometime. The vitriol makes modern finger-pointing look tame. There was almost an armed uprising over the results. Oh, and Aaron Burr killed Alexander Hamilton in a duel (though that was more because they hated each other than anything else). Lets see...I recall reading 1968 and 72 were not exactly picnics. 2004 had some over-the-top rhetoric as well. The elections of the late 1800s got pretty rough too, if memory holds.

Point is, there is nothing new under the sun. Every generation likes to think things have never been more (fill in the blank) in their time than ever before, and that past times were so much better than the present. It's never true.

I concur with your point that the world is not going to come to an end either way, though. That's one of the beautiful aspects of our republican (small r) system - it is exceedingly difficult to really change things, and then there is always the capability to erase those changes if we find they were for the ill.

It makes for great theater, though.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> I cannot ever remember a presidential election being so polarized, so vicious, and so intriguing.


Democratic Convention in Chicago 1968?


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## MalloryMoutinho (Aug 24, 2012)

ChristinePope said:


> Watching Jon Stewart is the only way I will survive election night.


Ha, I just got this email from Stephen Colbert's Super PAC I donated to a while ago. I always find these amusing.

Dear Friends of Colbert Super PAC,

I know it's been a while. I'm sorry I haven't called, written, stopped by, or appeared naked astride a centaur in your dreams. On behalf of myself, Colbert Super PAC, and the centaur, I apologize.

But do not assume that Americans For A Better Tomorrow, Tomorrow has been powerless. In fact, it's quite the opposite: we've been unpowerless. For proof, please enjoy the first five seconds of this clip of Mitt Romney earlier today. Go ahead, I've already seen it, I'll wait for you here in this email.

As you can see, as a contributor to Colbert Super PAC, your voice has clearly been heard, in the form of money. But as an American, you should also make your voice double-heard, in the form of a voice. So tomorrow, please find your nearest polling location and vote.

Remember: this is the most important election of our lifetime*, and will continue to be right up until the next most important election of our lifetime. So whoever you support, please vote. If you don't, the federal authorities consider wearing an "I Voted" sticker as an act of counterfeiting.

Yours sincerelyish,

Stephen Colbert
President and Tallymaster
Americans For A Better Tomorrow, Tomorrow

* Non-Reality-Show-Related Division

Paid for by Americans for a Better Tomorrow, Tomorrow
Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.
www.colbertsuperpac.com


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## Cliff Ball (Apr 10, 2010)

The Election of 1860 caused a Civil War, I think that would be a time of real divisiveness and polarization.


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## Angela Kay Austin (Dec 29, 2010)

PamelaKelley said:


> I wish they'd overhaul the whole voting system, getting rid of the electoral college and so that it doesn't go by state, that there's just a true popular vote, where every person's vote really does matter. The way it is now, it comes down to a handful of swing states, with all the others fairly pre-determined.


I agree. The current systems does make people feel a little like their votes fall into a black hole. I don't think any member of the electoral college would completely vote against the voters' wishes, but I guess they do have the power.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Nuff said.


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## Satchya (Sep 5, 2012)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> Nuff said.


Lol!!

If he can keep her on her meds, I'd consider that ticket .


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Obviously, I'm spending too much time on KB, I don't know those people....though I recognize that he's an actor.  Wait...Google tells me they're in Homeland?  Which I've never seen....

Betsy


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## Pawz4me (Feb 14, 2009)

Angela Kay Austin said:


> I don't think any member of the electoral college would completely vote against the voters' wishes, but I guess they do have the power.


There have been several instances over the years of "faithless electors." But never in an instance where it changed the outcome of an election.


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## Satchya (Sep 5, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Obviously, I'm spending too much time on KB, I don't know those people....though I recognize that he's an actor. Wait...Google tells me they're in Homeland? Which I've never seen....
> 
> Betsy


Betsy, I kept hearing how good Homeland was but I hate being told I "must see" something. So, since I watch maybe two t.v. shows a year I didn't check it out until a few weeks ago. Finally, enough people whose opinions I truly respect just couldn't stop talking about it, so Dh and I decided to give at least the first few episodes a try. (Showtime still has all of Season One on demand, and past episodes of Season Two. You can probably get them elsewhere, too, but that 's what we did.)

Let me just say that I'm glad we didn't start watching it until now, because it is the most addictive, finely crafted, incredibly acted show I've seen in s long time. It's intelligent, emotional, and Dh and I were basically chain-smoking on-demand episodes for days every chance we got (in between work and taking care of three kids, lol), and we are already all caught up.

Love, love, love Homeland!!


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## J Dean (Feb 9, 2009)

How about "none of the above"?

I look at them and see twiddledumb and twiddledumber.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

J Dean said:


> How about "none of the above"?
> 
> I look at them and see twiddledumb and twiddledumber.


I'm having flashbacks to the Hannity boards.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

Well, hubby and I are heading off to vote. This will be the first night all year I'll really regret not having cable!


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## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

Becca Mills said:


> Well, hubby and I are heading off to vote. This will be the first night all year I'll really regret not having cable!


Two words: "Net" and "flix." Or maybe "Red" "box."


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## MegSilver (Feb 26, 2012)

"Nathan Fillion" and "on top" in the same thread and I'm not supposed to say something lewd?

Okay, I admit I'm afraid of Betsy.

So here's this:


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## Eltanin Publishing (Mar 24, 2011)

Becca Mills said:


> Well, hubby and I are heading off to vote. This will be the first night all year I'll really regret not having cable!


Do you have over-the-air broadcasts, or nothing at all? We don't have any news channels (well, we have New England Cable News and C-Span) but a lot of things stream live over the internet. I just saw that the Stewart/Colbert thing is streaming live. I'll probably have that on the laptop and NBC on the telly.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

Jena H said:


> Two words: "Net" and "flix." Or maybe "Red" "box."


Oh, we do have Netflix. I meant this is the one right I'd rather watch CNN than _Downton Abbey_, or whatever else is in our queue!

ETA: Heh, heh. One person's "annoying" is another person's "popcorn spectacular." I love watching general election returns.


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## KVWitten (Apr 11, 2011)

MegSilver said:


> "Nathan Fillion" and "on top" in the same thread and I'm not supposed to say something lewd?


I had to bite my tongue.



MegSilver said:


> Okay, I admit I'm afraid of Betsy.


Me too. (Though I bet Betsy had the same thoughts...  )


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## J Dean (Feb 9, 2009)

One thing is for sure... I'll be glad when today is over..


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## H. S. St. Ours (Mar 24, 2012)

ChristinePope said:


> Watching Jon Stewart is the only way I will survive election night.


^^^This!


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> One thing is for sure... I'll be glad when today is over..


Enjoy it. Tomorrow the campaigns for the 2014 congressional elections begin.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Satchya said:


> Betsy, I kept hearing how good Homeland was but I hate being told I "must see" something. So, since I watch maybe two t.v. shows a year I didn't check it out until a few weeks ago. Finally, enough people whose opinions I truly respect just couldn't stop talking about it, so Dh and I decided to give at least the first few episodes a try. (Showtime still has all of Season One on demand, and past episodes of Season Two. You can probably get them elsewhere, too, but that 's what we did.)
> 
> Let me just say that I'm glad we didn't start watching it until now, because it is the most addictive, finely crafted, incredibly acted show I've seen in s long time. It's intelligent, emotional, and Dh and I were basically chain-smoking on-demand episodes for days every chance we got (in between work and taking care of three kids, lol), and we are already all caught up.
> 
> Love, love, love Homeland!!


I don't get Showtime...but I'm sure Netflix or Amazon Prime will have them. Eventually....right now I'm watching Sons of Anarchy...



MegSilver said:


> "Nathan Fillion" and "on top" in the same thread and I'm not supposed to say something lewd?
> 
> Okay, I admit I'm afraid of Betsy.


Be afraid....be very afraid.


Betsy


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I voted for the unspecified persons and the unspecified things that are close to my heart!


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Yay, Michelle!  I voted early....now I know Grandma won't be back to haunt me.


Betsy


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

I am putting some nice french wine on ice, I am going to need it. Make that 2 bottles.  

Should have gone out and got something stronger, like some Schnapps.......


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## MalloryMoutinho (Aug 24, 2012)

I'm gonna write Betsy in for President


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Even though the polls close in Virginia at 7, and so we could hope for some relief, they're still open 'till 8 in MD and DC.  So I guess we won't be finished with the tv ads until then.


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

I'm gonna hide in the back room & watch Magic Mike. Much better than constant news coverage that DH will be watching.


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## Claudia Lefeve (Dec 17, 2010)

Atunah said:


> I am putting some nice french wine on ice, I am going to need it. Make that 2 bottles.
> 
> Should have gone out and got something stronger, like some Schnapps.......


We have wine to drown our sorrows and/or Champagne to celebrate! Don't know which one we're going to open yet!


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

Claudia Lefeve said:


> We have wine to drown our sorrows and/or Champagne to celebrate! Don't know which one we're going to open yet!


Well around here at least one of us will be happy. Almost got the first bottle down. Don't think my stomach can handle another. . Having a split marriage is not for sissies. . I should have done 10 questions before, you know. 

At least french wine doesn't give me a headache the next day. 

I was streaming german Tageschau news live stream. They have their priorities straight. They baked the recipes of the cookies that Michelle Obama and Ann Romney had put on their site and the guy did a tasting.


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## PaulLev (Nov 2, 2012)

9pm Eastern: And every swing state too close or too early to call. This may be remembered as the election of super-cautious media.


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## AshMP (Dec 30, 2009)

I baked a ton of cookies, opened some red wine ... I'm not normally a political person, but this year I am, I'd be silly not to be.


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## D.A. Boulter (Jun 11, 2010)

All I know is my sales took a big drop today -- wonder why. Of course, this was not unexpected.


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## Incognita (Apr 3, 2011)

H.S. St.Ours said:


> ^^^This!


But the coverage doesn't start until 8 o'clock Pacific time...what the heck am I supposed to do until then? The hubby and I already drank our way through the wine tasting rooms in Temecula...


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## PaulLev (Nov 2, 2012)

Not a bad way to prepare for election night!


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

I'm for bed.  Polls closed in all east coast states by 8 p.m. but in many places they're still voting because that many people were already in line.  I've got Stewart and Colbert set to record, though. . . . . . I'll watch 'em tomorrow.


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## Claudia Lefeve (Dec 17, 2010)

Atunah said:


> Well around here at least one of us will be happy. Almost got the first bottle down. Don't think my stomach can handle another. . Having a split marriage is not for sissies. . I should have done 10 questions before, you know.
> 
> At least french wine doesn't give me a headache the next day.
> 
> I was streaming german Tageschau news live stream. They have their priorities straight. They baked the recipes of the cookies that Michelle Obama and Ann Romney had put on their site and the guy did a tasting.


I'm tired of watching the news....I may never have a drink (either way) at this point! LOL

Wish I had thought of the cookie tasting!


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

I'm nonpartisan, no matter which one gets elected, they won't fix the trillion dollar per year deficit which is my main concern


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## MalloryMoutinho (Aug 24, 2012)

Well, now that voting is basically over...here's a fun image for anyone who favors one candidate over the other


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

MalloryMoutinho said:


> I'm gonna write Betsy in for President


Blatant suckup.


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## PaulLev (Nov 2, 2012)

With MN going to Obama, David Axelrod's moustache is safe ... I can relate.


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## Lily_T (Sep 25, 2011)

It's eleven on the east coast and they still haven't called it. They definitely called it by now last time.


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## Sapphire (Apr 24, 2012)

OUCH!!!


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## Writerly Writer (Jul 19, 2012)

Me and my partner have taken off work here in Australia to watch the election.  I wonder who we're going for? Hrmm... hrmmm ... I wonder...


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## BrianKittrell (Jan 8, 2011)

They called it.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Looks like the answer is...Obama.


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## That one girl (Apr 12, 2011)

Oops. Looks like it's time to lock the thread.


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## Soothesayer (Oct 19, 2012)

I knew whoever took Ohio was going to take it all. Romney did well, all things considered, but not well enough.

Personally I don't feel the economy is going to get better with either of them. Too much structural damage. Deficit, student loans, medicare/SS. 

Four years of gridlock.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

T.S. Welti said:


> Oops. Looks like it's time to lock the thread.


LOL


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

I predict post-apopalyptic literature will be a big seller for the next four years.


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## Michael Kingswood (Feb 18, 2011)

Soothesayer said:


> Four years of gridlock.


Gridlock is the best thing that can ever realistically happen in DC. The less the government does, the more likely things will get better, because all government can do is screw things up. The examples from history that confirm this truth are too numerous to name. If only there had been gridlock for the entirety of the President's first term, he might have gone down as one of the best in history.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> Four years of gridlock.


God Bless gridlock.


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## Lily_T (Sep 25, 2011)

Since this is _Kindle_ Boards I feel safe in saying that the headline-making referendum supported by Jeff Bezos passed in Washington State. 

And noting that we may have all indirectly paid for that advertising.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Well, folks, this thread has had a good run; I want to thank all of you for the good discussion.  But, the subject's question has been answered, the political ads will end, and this thread has run its course.  

Everyone have a good evening with their beverage of choice!

Betsy
KB Moderator


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