# What do you do when a reviewer bashes you



## 71089 (Jul 12, 2013)

So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild, but when I received back the review that was posted on goodreads it was quite a shock. She'd literally bashed the hell out of my work, pointing out all the things she was laughing at, making it look like a truckload of [crap] on paper.
I know there are always people who don't like your book, but what do you do when they don't even provide honest, constructive opinions/feedback and just blatantly skip to belittling and mocking the writer/book? Online? For everyone to see?
This person got 30 likes on the review ... and a hell of a lot of comments.
I'm so afraid it might damage my sales ...


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## Ashy (Jul 2, 2013)

There are sad, petty people everywhere.

Do not let them determine your outcome and who you are.

Keep on keepin' on.


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## NicoleSwan (Oct 2, 2011)

Ouch, just ouch 

In short, there's not a lot that can be done, especially on places like GR. If you go in there trying to resolve the situation it'll be like kicking the hornet nest. That's not going to ease the sting, but at least [ for now ] it's not on Amazon right?


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## sarahdalton (Mar 15, 2011)

It's really hard. I recently started one of these threads, but then afterwards I felt funny about what I'd done. They could easily find this post, it's a public forum. As hard as it is, I think you need to keep your reaction private. Quietly seethe in anger, but never, ever respond!


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## NicoleSwan (Oct 2, 2011)

Yes, it'd be nice if they just struck it down with a 1~2* and kept it terse.  I know most of my books languish on GR, I refuse to go read the reviews, especially since on Amazon they're doing pretty good overall (barring one).


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## LanelleH (Jul 4, 2013)

Sorry to hear that >< but did she bash you personally or the book.  If it's the book I don't know if there is anything to do, bad reviews are imminent and normal.  But if she bashed you personally that sucks, if I were in that situation I honestly wouldn't do much except hope for a positive review to outshine the negative.


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## Andrea Harding (Feb 27, 2013)

Yuck yuck yuck.

There is no need for this at all, I read it and it makes me want to punch people in their nasty, bullying, mean little faces.

Just no need.


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## BEAST (Mar 31, 2012)

Do what you want to resolve the issue in your mind. I went back and forth with a reviewer on Amazon over a free read. At the end she outlined in great detail why she didn't like the book. The initial review she had posted stated that she didn't read the book and that it wasn't "her cup of tea" which I took to mean she didn't want to read a gay book. After I commented, she went back, read the book and stated all the reasons why she didn't like it. The things she pointed out were things that my target audience actually liked. I ended up getting a two more one-stars, two five-stars and more downloads per month...

But honestly, I'd say it was a waste of time. I was respectful with my questions to her but the essay like back and forth took away from me writing. Sure, we are artist and very sensitive about our work. But hey, not everyone is going to like it. Do what you think is best but from the experience of many here, it is best to shrug and move on to the next story.


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## BEAST (Mar 31, 2012)

ClarissaWild said:


> Indeed. Funny thing is, she started 'quoting' stuff to laugh at that wasn't even in the book. She just made it up, typing out whatever she thought was in there. I checked with a CTRL+F and found her text nowhere...
> God I hate that.


Hmm, I wonder if you could contact a rep at Goodreads to have the review deleted since it is grossly inaccurate.


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## Rick Gualtieri (Oct 31, 2011)

Here's the thing, you're an author - a public figure.  When you send out a book for review (or put it up for sale) there are no promises, guarantees etc that someone is going to be nice, nor should there be.  If there is, that means someone is gaming the system.

My blunt advice is deal with it.  If you're going to be in this business, you're going to get harsh reviews no matter how beloved your writing is to the majority.

Read it, see if there's anything useful you can gleen from it, and then move on.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

Your thread title is misleading. The reviewer didn't bash you. I read the review, she never says anything about you. She is reviewing the book. I don't see any bashing either. She read the book you gave her. She even went through and named specific things she either found silly or didn't like. 
Reviewers really can't win. If she had left a 1 star with no text, she would be called a drive by and who knows what. This reviewer puts in a extended long review in detail and that isn't good either. 

I guess since you said you hoped was going to be "mild" with you, you expected a good review? 
She sounds honest in just not liking what she read. 
Are you saying that everything that she quoted in the review is made up? 

Erotica either works or it doesn't. Very few genres are as personal than that. And when erotica doesn't work, it can be a real bad experience for the reader. This reviewer just didn't like yours at all. 


eta: ah yes, the name calling of the reviewer is now beginning. The reviewer stuck with reviewing the product. No reason to attack them personally.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

I've been around these boards a while, and I'll just note that no good ever comes of these sorts of threads. As someone mentioned earlier, people need to realize this is a COMPLETELY public forum. Even attempting to keep something anonymous, as in this case, may not work. And the backlash could be way way worse than any temporary comfort you get from the virtual "there, there" offered by your fellow authors.

By all means: have a place you can share some virtual whine and GEEZ with. . . . but know that this might NOT be that place because of its public nature.

*I'll also note that any one who does post here should not be considered to be inviting people to get out the pitchforks and torches and storm the castle of the person whose post has bothered them! *

Clarissa, sorry this happened. Not much you can do that would be constructive, but I would suggest NOT sending that reviewer a copy of anything you write in the future. 

edit: on re-reading the posts since I started this one, I have deleted an outside link as WHOA. . . Probably best to move on at this point.


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## Andrea Harding (Feb 27, 2013)

ClarissaWild said:


> Agreed. You know what's even WORSE? This is so friggin' hypocritical, I can't believe it. Check this thread: [link removed by moderator.]
> She posted here, saying she AGREES with the fact that reviewers and authors should be respectful to one another, no matter if they liked or didn't like the work.


It angers me. I've said a few mean things in reviews on goodreads before I started working with authors (both about trad pub and indie pub, I'd like to point out) and it makes me cringe; though I won't go and change my opinions, I've merely changed my perspective now.

These days I just think there's a lot better ways to phrase things - I've never laughed at anyone, it's just cruel and bullying. What would be wrong with writing 'I found some of the phrasing to be contrived and unrealistic' rather than picking part and ridiculing it? And as for 'don't read it' - well - there's a lot to be said for letting people make up their own minds. A simple 'I didn't enjoy this and I won't be reading it again' would have sufficed!


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2013)

I saw the review - I'd ignore it if I were you. I'm not saying it doesn't sting and if she's misquoting you it's awful, but people on Goodreads will join together to attack you if you speak out against the review. Honestly, the review doesn't make me not want to read the book. I think just hope for more positive reviews to drown this out. I'd hate for you to respond and have dozens of people react terribly to that. I've seen it happen on Goodreads a lot, and it'll sting far worse than the pain you're feeling now.

I almost bought the book, BTW, but the only thing stopping me was there was only 1 review on Amazon. With a few more reviews I probably would have bought it, because it really does sound like a good book


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## Joshua Dalzelle (Jun 12, 2013)

This is one reason I don't solicit reviews, too unpredictable and I'd rather reviews of the work happen organically, if that makes sense.

That being said, I agree with what some others have already mentioned: nothing good comes from engaging in a debate with a reviewer. It only ever ends badly and I've never seen a review pulled or change at the protest of the author. The fact that readers frequent this forum is also good to keep in mind when talking about these things.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

What do I do?

I learn whatever I can from what they wrote. If they provided lots of detail, I am usually very happy. I see if I can fix what they said in either a revision or address it in the sequel, learn whatever I can and take those lessons onboard, I thank them for their time, I apologize, and I wish them well.

Then I forget about it. This part usually requires medicinal vodka applied directly. Then I work on the sequel.

Remember guys: Write drunk, edit sober!


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Clarissa--

Ann beat me to the initial moderation, but I want to explain for the new folk that we have a policy that "What Happens on Another Site" stays on that site. (WHOA)  What that means, in effect, is that while it's fine to talk about the general issue of "what do you do when a reviewer bashes you," the specifics, especially including links to the comments on another site, are discouraged.

Our experience has been that well-meaning people from this site descend on the other site and start a ruckus which then comes back to this site.  Which we don't want.

(LOL!  Ann and I were removing the WHOA link at the same time....)

Betsy
KB Mod


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## Donna White Glaser (Jan 12, 2011)

ClarissaWild said:


> Funny thing is, she started 'quoting' stuff to laugh at that wasn't even in the book. She just made it up, typing out whatever she thought was in there.


This is a pretty serious accusation. I'm surprised you had to Ctrl+F to figure out if the material was in your book. With as much as she quoted, wouldn't you have recognized it without having to search?

Bottom line: if you ask for reviews, you're going to get them-both positive and negative. So what if she didn't like it. I don't see any personal attack in her review; she was very specific about using actual quotes. (Unless, as you state, she made them up. Honestly, though, I doubt she did.) And I think you will be stirring up a storm if you keep kicking up a fuss about someone's opinion that you asked for.

I hope this doesn't cause you more problems than leaving the original review alone might have.


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## KellyHarper (Jul 29, 2012)

What to do? Write your next book and make it even better than everything else you've written.

And after you do that?....

Do it again.

It's hard not to get down in the dumps when these sorts of things happen. Just unplug from the internet. Take a walk. Pet your dog. Get some exercise (this will help quite a bit, actually). Then, come back to your computer with a clear head and keep moving forward.


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## LanelleH (Jul 4, 2013)

Atunah said:


> Your thread title is misleading. The reviewer didn't bash you. I read the review, she never says anything about you. She is reviewing the book. I don't see any bashing either. She read the book you gave her. She even went through and named specific things she either found silly or didn't like.
> Reviewers really can't win. If she had left a 1 star with no text, she would be called a drive by and who knows what. This reviewer puts in a extended long review in detail and that isn't good either.
> 
> I guess since you said you hoped was going to be "mild" with you, you expected a good review?
> ...


I have to agree with you, I've noticed authors doing this (getting mad at reviewers) and it's silly. Nobody has a perfect book, you'll always get negative reviews. Why avoid them? Why call the reviewer names or punish them because they don't like your book. It's silly. They're the ones buying/receiving your product and taking their time to read/review them.


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## KellyHarper (Jul 29, 2012)

David Adams said:


> Remember guys: Write drunk, edit sober!


There should be a meme with a huge beer stein labeled "Writer" and a coffee mug next to it labeled "Editor".

I'd enjoy that.


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## ER Pierce (Jun 4, 2013)

Drink a glass of wine, call your best friend, have a cry if you need to, and then move on. Do not engage with reviewers. Nothing good can ever come from it.


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## Ashy (Jul 2, 2013)

ER Pierce said:


> Do not engage with reviewers. Nothing good can ever come from it.


Unless you engage them on a formal field of battle...

...in armor...

...and upload the video for us.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

David Adams said:


> What do I do?
> 
> I learn whatever I can from what they wrote. If they provided lots of detail, I am usually very happy. I see if I can fix what they said in either a revision or address it in the sequel, learn whatever I can and take those lessons onboard, I thank them for their time, I apologize, and I wish them well.
> 
> ...


Ahh, David. I love your posts....

For quilters it would be "Design drunk, quilt sober..."


My first thought when someone complains about a review is, "Well, was she/he right?" When I get a critique on a quilt, after bursting into tears (not really), I try to see if there's anything I agree with. Sometimes there is, sometimes there isn't. Sometimes I see what the reviewer sees, but I don't agree with it. If I think there's something to be learned, I internalize it and move on to the next quilt. I've had stuff I was really proud of torn apart, so I know what it feels like.

Betsy


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## BEAST (Mar 31, 2012)

Just read the review. Ouch.

Sure, most authors will say ignore it and you probably should do just that. Once again, do what you think is best. If you are worried about the backlash from this public forum or on Goodreads, keep it moving.

Let me tell you about my experience with a reviewer on Amazon named <deleted by mod>. He is a prolific reviewer of mm romance and erotica. He reviewed my first erotica title, Trade Banging. It was my first one-star. He made a few valid points and I challenged on points I had issues with. In the end, I looked critically at the title and decided to take it down. It was five short stories. One of the five has been rewritten and republished as a 9,000 word short, Basketball Jones. Another was rewritten and used at the first of five in Dope Boy Magic.

Long story short, I pressed to be a better writer. I write urban erotica, whatever that means. <deleted> was not my "target reader." I utilize conventions of urban, street lit and mm erotica. He had issues with my using s#!t in reference to the male appendage too much. He was right. I've since created a list of term for that male part... there are only so many. But his critique of usage of AAVE aka ebonics was out of line for me. As far as I am concerned, if you don't want to read a book with characters who use AAVE then you shouldn't read my work. There is enough "mainstream" work out there for you to pass up my work. So, for me, anyone who critiques certain aspects of my work that are normal conventions of street lit or mm erotica I will pounce. That's my truth. What is yours?

Try to look at the review dispassionately. Are there any points they made that warrant review and self reflection? Maybe it is time to immerse yourself in some erotica to better your own voice. I had to do that and have gotten better since. I look at some of my older work from just a year ago and ask myself, "How could anyone give that a five-star review?"

_name of reviewer removed -- you're not picking on him at all, it's just safer, and the point is still made. . .thanks for understanding.  --Ann_


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

ClarissaWild said:


> So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild, but when I received back the review that was posted on goodreads it was quite a shock. She'd literally bashed the hell out of my work, pointing out all the things she was laughing at, making it look like a truckload of [crap] on paper.
> I know there are always people who don't like your book, but what do you do when they don't even provide honest, constructive opinions/feedback and just blatantly skip to belittling and mocking the writer/book? Online? For everyone to see?
> This person got 30 likes on the review ... and a hell of a lot of comments.
> I'm so afraid it might damage my sales ...





> So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild


Sorry, but this is your first mistake.

I don't ask for reviews and I don't send out review copies. I leave it completely to the reader to review or not. If they ask me for a free copy to review, I first go to their website. If I decide to send them a copy I always tell them they can keep or trash the book, read or not read it, review or not review it&#8230; that it's up to them. No strings attached. No expectations.

You took your chances and the whole thing blew up in your face. I feel for you. The review was pretty harsh. On the other hand, she didn't attack you. She had some criticisms on the writing and backed up her statements with examples. That's more than most negative reviews do.
I had it done to some of my books too. I stripped the comments of all emotional context and tried to reduce them to their useful content. Then I decided whether there was something to them or not (for me).

FWIW:

* If you feel the need to vent, do it off-line to friends who know and like you. (Yes, those two last qualifications were necessary.)
* Don't engage the reviewer in any way, shape or form. Nothing good ever came from it.
* You have 6 five and four star reviews, and only two one and two star reviews. Count your blessings.
* Chalk it up to experience. They're war wounds and we've all got them.
* Be nice to yourself and treat yourself to something special.


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## RockyGrede (Apr 19, 2013)

You need to be professional. 

If you do reply to the comment, keep it clean, professional, and to the point. And put your side/points through in a polite manner 

You will be judged on how you respond/react to the comment. That is how it is for authors. Reputation is key.


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## Andrea Harding (Feb 27, 2013)

Andrew Ashling said:


> * Be nice to yourself and treat yourself to something special.


I like this one. Do this one and let it go


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## BEAST (Mar 31, 2012)

ClarissaWild said:


> Yeah, think I'm going to get some new writing going. That's how I treat myself. Disappearing into my own little world for a while


Good for you. Hope you enjoy every minute of it!


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## Amanda Brice (Feb 16, 2011)

Rick Gualtieri said:


> Here's the thing, you're an author - a public figure. When you send out a book for review (or put it up for sale) there are no promises, guarantees etc that someone is going to be nice, nor should there be. If there is, that means someone is gaming the system.
> 
> My blunt advice is deal with it. If you're going to be in this business, you're going to get harsh reviews no matter how beloved your writing is to the majority.
> 
> Read it, see if there's anything useful you can gleen from it, and then move on.


This.


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## Andrea Harding (Feb 27, 2013)

ClarissaWild said:


> Yeah, think I'm going to get some new writing going. That's how I treat myself. Disappearing into my own little world for a while


I can see why documenting the exploits of some people having saucy romps in your imagination would be enjoyable


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2013)

ClarissaWild said:


> Indeed. Funny thing is, she started 'quoting' stuff to laugh at that wasn't even in the book. She just made it up, typing out whatever she thought was in there. I checked with a CTRL+F and found her text nowhere...
> God I hate that.


I'm confused. You wrote the book, right? You actually had to go check to see if the quotes were in the book? I don't memorize my books, but I recognize my own writing.

I am not someone who comments on reviews. My primary response is no response. Reviews are not for my benefit. They are for the benefit of other readers.

However, if a reviewer _created fake quotes_ in a review, I would point out that those lines do not exist in the book. I would very clearly state that those lines do not appear in the book that I provided to the reader, and request clarification on where in the book she allegedly found them. But let's be clear, I would only do this if the quotes were, as you allege, complete fabrications. Because complete fabrications are not a review. Creating fake quotes is an affront to the purpose of reviews, which is to provide information to the reader.

I don't read erotica. Perhaps someone here who does has a copy of the book and can confirm whether or not those lines actually appear? I'm curious now.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

I agree with Julie, if those quoted passages absolutely do not appear in the book then you have every right to address the review in a professional manner and ask for a correction.


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2013)

Clarissa,

You may want to check to make sure you uploaded the final version of your book to Amazon. I don't know what version you gifted to the reviewer, but a friend of mine just told me she did in fact buy your book on Amazon and those quoted lines are in her version.

I know that I personally have made the mistake in the past of uploading the wrong version of a book to Amazon. I can't even count the number of times I've accidentally uploaded my "Smashwords Edition" to Amazon and had to go back and fix it. So it may be a case of the reviewer accidentally being given an unproofed copy instead of your final copy (which would explain why you didn't see the quotes when you searched for them in your version.)


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## Nathan Lowell (Dec 11, 2010)

What I do is go read the reviews for Nora Roberts and G. R. R. Martin and anybody else who's famous. 

It's a nice pick-me-up when I feel bad about my reviews.


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2013)

DDark said:


> Just on a side note, do you create sub-folders for each edition? I do this with my books to prevent that, and I know some authors have admitted to keeping all the files in one folder. I have STERLING-KINDLE, STERLING-NOOK, etc. I also keep all old versions (and drags) in a sub-folder within that book title I label "archives".


I generally have a single folder for each project and they are named agameofbloodamazon or a gameofbloodsmashwords etc. But at 1 am in the morning when I tend to be uploading files, I'm not always the most careful.


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## KerryT2012 (Dec 18, 2012)

ClarissaWild said:


> So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild, but when I received back the review that was posted on goodreads it was quite a shock. She'd literally bashed the hell out of my work, pointing out all the things she was laughing at, making it look like a truckload of [crap] on paper.
> I know there are always people who don't like your book, but what do you do when they don't even provide honest, constructive opinions/feedback and just blatantly skip to belittling and mocking the writer/book? Online? For everyone to see?
> This person got 30 likes on the review ... and a hell of a lot of comments.
> I'm so afraid it might damage my sales ...


I'm practically crying reading this review. Why are people so cruel? OK she didn't like it why could she just not PM you. You gave it to her for free. She has no idea how hard it is to write a book. Can see she is not an author. I really feel for you. I've had some bad ones but this one was low. If you fancy a critique partner let me know - send me a PM


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## scottmarlowe (Apr 22, 2010)

This, unfortunately, is a part of life on the internet. I would strongly resist the urge to respond, though if the comments are of the personal attack variety, I would at least report it to the retailer or site where the review was left. You never know, they might actually remove it.


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## Vaalingrade (Feb 19, 2013)

The only thing you need to watch after the internet is pointlessly nasty to you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsXKAtpLm4I

[Not embedded because the title has a word the site censors.]


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2013)

When I have a really crappy week, I've found that watching Taken with Liam Neeson really helps to burn off some steam.

Other than that, find a way to laugh about it, or channel that negativity into the next book ("My writing sucks??  I'll show them!").


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## KMatthew (Mar 21, 2012)

ClarissaWild said:


> So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild, but when I received back the review that was posted on goodreads it was quite a shock. She'd literally bashed the hell out of my work, pointing out all the things she was laughing at, making it look like a truckload of [crap] on paper.
> I know there are always people who don't like your book, but what do you do when they don't even provide honest, constructive opinions/feedback and just blatantly skip to belittling and mocking the writer/book? Online? For everyone to see?
> This person got 30 likes on the review ... and a hell of a lot of comments.
> I'm so afraid it might damage my sales ...


I had a similar experience during a LibraryThing giveaway. Solution, stop giving away copies in exchange for reviews. I'm of the opinion at this point that reviews should come naturally.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Sarwah2012 said:


> I'm practically crying reading this review. Why are people so cruel? OK she didn't like it why could she just not PM you. You gave it to her for free. She has no idea how hard it is to write a book. Can see she is not an author. I really feel for you. I've had some bad ones but this one was low. If you fancy a critique partner let me know - send me a PM


Why should the reviewer respond privately? The author submitted a manuscript for review to a person who, apparently reviews a lot of stuff on GoodReads. It sounds to me like she knew there was a strong possibility that the review would, ultimately, be posted and she was hoping it would be at least neutral. But the reviewer didn't like it and posted her review, as was completely her right. How 'hard it is to write a book' doesn't enter into it. The fact that she herself is not an author doesn't enter into it. She. Didn't. Like. It. And has a right to say so.

Please understand: I get completely that a less than positive review can be painful for an author, but it's something you have to learn to deal with.

I also get that there are nice and not so nice ways to say a book is bad. But the author can't control which way the reviewer does it so just has to be prepared for the worst and treat it as a lesson learned. As I said before -- don't send that person any more free copies for review.

As a reader/consumer of LOTS of books. . . . I generally am left with a bad impression when an author posts one of these "oh, poor me, I got a bad review" threads. That means it's way way less likely I'll give your book a try if it comes up on my radar via Amazon or whatever. Maybe not so much if the review was the worst of the lot with bad language and personal, actionable attacks; but that's not what they usually are. They're usually just less than 5 star reviews that people, frankly, whine about. I just don't think it's a smart way to deal with it. And it seems like there's a thread like this every few days.


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## Al Dente (Sep 3, 2012)

You can never expect a reviewer to write about your book in a certain way. Always be prepared for anything, because you never know how your book is going to resonate with someone. As I learned recently, the best thing you can do is see if there's any useful information in the review to learn from and begin writing your next book. I never send out review copies of my books. I always figure someone will come along and review it eventually. I'm also a huge wimp.  

I made the mistake of checking my reviews on GR a while back, and what I saw actually didn't bother me. My first book was rated 2.5 over there. I had a 1-star that said "Not my thing, but written well enough." It happens. If you're selling well, worry about the paycheck instead. That's much more fun!


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## bhazelgrove (Jul 16, 2013)

I usually get very good reviews but I have been bashed and The Washington Post torched my First Novel. My third novel was roasted in Chicago Sun Times and I remember a woman walking up to me in the grocery store. So sorry about your review in the Times. Very disengenuous. But here is my point. You are writer. If you wrote to the best of your ability then you have nothing to worry about. Take a deep breath and keep writing. And I have to tell you reviews dont sell a lot of books. I can attest.


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

I'm sorry this happened to you, but it is part of the risk you take when you ask reviewers to review your book. I don't necessarily agree with those who said not to ask reviewers for reviews, BUT (and this is a big but) when you do that you have to understand that they can love your book to death or they can rip it to pieces. Nowhere does it say they have to be fair or nice. Most of us try to be fair and nice, but it isn't a rule for reviewers. Now, if they lie about what's in the book, that's a different issue. But, as harsh as this sounds, you gave her permission when you gave her the book to review. That's the chance all of us take when we ask reviewers to review our book.  

I agree that you should do something nice for yourself. Most of us have had hurtful reviews. I had one from a writer on here. Didn't mind that they disliked my book, but they felt it important to be snarky about it. A negative review shouldn't be an opportunity to show how clever a reviewer thinks they are. It should give the reasons for the bad review without that drama. But we CANNOT control that.I just considered it more of a reflection of who they are than of what my book is. You should do the same, and DO NOT REPLY TO THEM. NOTHING GOOD WILL HAPPEN. 

I have to say that the majority of reviewers I have had contact with have been fair and decent people. Don't let this experience make you feel that it isn't worth it to let reviewers review your books.


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## dianasg (Jan 8, 2010)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Why should the reviewer respond privately? The author submitted a manuscript for review to a person who, apparently reviews a lot of stuff on GoodReads. It sounds to me like she knew there was a strong possibility that the review would, ultimately, be posted and she was hoping it would be at least neutral. But the reviewer didn't like it and posted her review, as was completely her right. How 'hard it is to write a book' doesn't enter into it. The fact that she herself is not an author doesn't enter into it. She. Didn't. Like. It. And has a right to say so.
> 
> Please understand: I get completely that a less than positive review can be painful for an author, but it's something you have to learn to deal with.
> 
> ...


This. Just out of curiosity, have the mods ever discussed getting rid of these types of threads? Or even consolidating them? They are almost never productive and almost always counterproductive (people flock to down-vote or whatever). Except in special cases, the advice given is always: don't respond, move on, one review won't sink you, etc. I'd guess that I'm not the only one tired of these threads - not to mention they tend to alienate readers. These types of things seem better suited for a private forum, so that neither reviewer nor author are harmed, and the author can still vent if necessary.

My $.02 -- If you put your work out there, then you have to accept that people are going to say whatever they're going to say -- however they're going to say it. This review had no personal attacks. It didn't falsely quote the book. Sure, it stings. But IMO, if someone can't handle the possibility of a bad review, however harsh, then they shouldn't publish. Reviews aren't for authors.


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## Joshua Dalzelle (Jun 12, 2013)

Take the weekend to get some perspective. A bad review on a book that is new in the market can be a gut-punch, but as someone much wiser said: reviews don't sell books. You're not sunk from this and the best thing to do is take a deep breath and push on with your writing.

I just got torched in a review by someone who didn't even bother to read past the first 5% of the book. It's just how it goes in this business, and you have to treat is as such. That's the scary part of indie publishing... no safety net. If you only want to be adored, genuinely or not, simply distribute to friends and family.


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## Guest (Aug 1, 2013)

Joshua Dalzelle said:


> If you only want to be adored, genuinely or not, simply distribute to friends and family.


Unfortunately, this path doesn't always work either


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## KerryT2012 (Dec 18, 2012)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Why should the reviewer respond privately? The author submitted a manuscript for review to a person who, apparently reviews a lot of stuff on GoodReads. It sounds to me like she knew there was a strong possibility that the review would, ultimately, be posted and she was hoping it would be at least neutral. But the reviewer didn't like it and posted her review, as was completely her right. How 'hard it is to write a book' doesn't enter into it. The fact that she herself is not an author doesn't enter into it. She. Didn't. Like. It. And has a right to say so.
> 
> Please understand: I get completely that a less than positive review can be painful for an author, but it's something you have to learn to deal with.
> 
> ...


She gave the book for free for a review - the person didn't like it and gave a one star review - then sends her a PM saying - Look didn't like your book because of blah, blah to me personally I find that more ethical then writing a one star review and using words such as 'was this written by a boy in 5th grade' cruel. Also, saying I was laughing about how badly it was written also is is not nice.
Personally - I have contacted others on Goodreads - the same way she did - some of them wrote they didn't like the book - gave me a one or two star. No problems - but the wording in that review was bad in my eyes.
If the person bought the book and left such a review then that is fine - sure, they spent money and they did not like her type of writing or the book in general sure.


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## David J Normoyle (Jun 22, 2012)

Sarwah2012 said:


> She gave the book for free for a review - the person didn't like it and gave a one star review - then sends her a PM saying - Look didn't like your book because of blah, blah to me personally I find that more ethical then writing a one star review and using words such as 'was this written by a boy in 5th grade' cruel. Also, saying I was laughing about how badly it was written also is is not nice.
> Personally - I have contacted others on Goodreads - the same way she did - some of them wrote they didn't like the book - gave me a one or two star. No problems - but the wording in that review was bad in my eyes.
> If the person bought the book and left such a review then that is fine - sure, they spent money and they did not like her type of writing or the book in general sure.


So, you're saying that people who receive free review copies have an obligation to be nice and not write what they really think about the book? That only people who buy the book have a right to give a negative review?

If that was the case, then the whole reviewing system would be be flawed and every movie would have 100% on rotten tomatoes because all the critics saw the movie for free so should only say nice things about the movie.


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## Amanda Brice (Feb 16, 2011)

Look, you published a book. At that point, whether you send it out for reviews or the reviews come in organically through verified purchases, you can't control what they will say. That's just a fact of life. If you write and publish a book, you must expect reviews. If you can't stomach the idea of unfavorable reviews (and believe me, it's extremely unlikely to sell at any volume and have ONLY good reviews), then do not publish. 

Period.


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## Joshua Dalzelle (Jun 12, 2013)

David J Normoyle said:


> So, you're saying that people who receive free review copies have an obligation to be nice and not write what they really think about the book? That only people who buy the book have a right to give a negative review?


That raises an interesting point on etiquette. I still firmly believe in a no-response policy on reviews, but if a person get a free copy with the agreement of writing a review, I'd say decorum would dictate they take it a little more seriously than playground insults about the author. I would think a more clinical approach to WHY the book wasn't good would be more useful to both readers and the author.

I don't think anyone is arguing that a reviewer should only write positive reviews or not at all, but even negative reviews should be presented in a way that is useful. I'm not talking about this review in particular (though it applies) as these posts tend to come up from time to time.


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## Midnight Whimsy (Jun 25, 2013)

As others have said, bad reviews happen and we just have to live with them. On the other hand, that review was needlessly cruel. But on the other _other _hand, a reviewer like that has an audience to entertain. Most of the review comments were obviously by people who follow her reviews; in the media, especially online media, the entertainment factor far outweighs polite, respectful, or tactful.

A small consolation is the harsh, overly critical nature of the review is immediately obvious and will make many readers discount that review. When looking for reviews in the future, consider sticking to reviewers with a "3-or-up" policy, where if they can't honestly give a book 3 stars or higher, they don't post the review.

M.W


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## Amanda Brice (Feb 16, 2011)

Joshua Dalzelle said:


> That raises an interesting point on etiquette. I still firmly believe in a no-response policy on reviews, but if a person get a free copy with the agreement of writing a review, I'd say decorum would dictate they take it a little more seriously than playground insults about the author. I would think a more clinical approach to WHY the book wasn't good would be more useful to both readers and the author.


Except that I think that the onus is on the author to thoroughly research the person requesting a free copy. I handle approvals for a NetGalley co-op, and one of the things I do is check and see how that reviewer has handled reviews in the past. I'm much more apt to check out their 1-star reviews than their 5-star reviews, just because I don't want to give a free book to someone who could possibly attack the author. I also check to see that the genre is one this reviewer likes.

For example, I had a Goodreads reviewer who was requesting an NA book. This reviewer does a lot of reviews and has a lot of followers, so at face value she looked like a good reviewer, except that the last 10 reviews she did were of self-published (or previously self-published, but recently sold to NY) New Adult books. And without exception, she gave them 1-stars.

No books for her! Obviously I can't keep her from buying it on her own and reviewing it (and giving a 1-star review), but I can keep her from getting it for free.


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## 31842 (Jan 11, 2011)

There is a great new tweet stream which will remind you once a day: Don't read the comments. https://twitter.com/AvoidComments I'm Day 3 of not checking my rankings or looking at reviews. *hands shaking in full DTs* But people here have said it over and over and it finally just hit me viscerally: The only reason to check your reviews is for an ego boost or an ego bash, neither of which accurately reflects reality. It sucks to get a bad review, even worse if it is personal. It sucks that the bad reviews stick out in the brain more than the good ones. But if you can, just put a note on your computer to remember why you're writing in the first place. Because it makes you happy. Because you have stories to tell. Because you need to. Whatever the reason, give _that_ the space in your thoughts. How many pages didn't you write today because you were so hurt by this review? Don't give it that power over you. Write. Get better. Don't let the reviewers get you down. Let this fuel your fire.


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## David J Normoyle (Jun 22, 2012)

Joshua Dalzelle said:


> That raises an interesting point on etiquette. I still firmly believe in a no-response policy on reviews, but if a person get a free copy with the agreement of writing a review, I'd say decorum would dictate they take it a little more seriously than playground insults about the author. I would think a more clinical approach to WHY the book wasn't good would be more useful to both readers and *the author*.


Well, I don't think reviews should approached so they are useful to the author. Reviews are aimed at readers. As for etiquette, I know from personal experience that most free review copies result in no review, so I don't think there is a huge obligation felt by those who receive free ebooks.

As for the actual review, it seems to give a lot more help to the author than the average review, pointing out passages that could be read as ridiculous by readers. As for the tone, all reviewers have different styles and it's not up to the author to dictate the style that a reviewer chooses. In terms of playground insults, if the reviewer sees entertaining their readers while being truthful as more important than not hurting the author's feelings (which is probably a good way to go about it), then they are perhaps called for. Consider Simon Cowell on American Idol.

Just to give an example, I went to rotten tomatoes, looked up the first negative review on Pacific Rim and got this. "It's as if Del Toro neuro-linked with a robot and then couldn't figure out how to work the controls" i.e. reviewer insulting the director of the movie. Although reviewers who write for national presses will generally try to disguise their insults in clever ways rather than using those of the playground variety, nevertheless it's within a reviewers remit to insult the creator of the art they are reviewing.


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## KerryT2012 (Dec 18, 2012)

David J Normoyle said:


> That only people who buy the book have a right to give a negative review?


If that was what I meant then I would not have continued to say - personally - I have contacted others on Goodreads - the same way she did - some of them wrote they didn't like the book - gave me a one or two star. No problem!


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

KellyHarper said:


> What to do? Write your next book and make it even better than everything else you've written.
> 
> And after you do that?....
> 
> ...


Yep to all of this.

If someone hates your work, the greatest revenge you can take is to keep writing more stuff for them to hate.


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

> Unfortunately, this path doesn't always work either Tongue Tongue


Good God, family Hell, I gave my first book to family. Some of them couldn't bother to open the cover. Believe me, that hurts worse than a 1 star from a stranger.


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## 56139 (Jan 21, 2012)

Some people are just unhappy and need to bring others down with them.  Success is always the best revenge.


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## thesmallprint (May 25, 2012)

The reviewer is a dentist. Everybody knows that dealing with dentists can be painful and expensive.


BTW, in my 9 days, 6 hours and 6 minutes on Kboards, I have never seen one of these 'bad review' threads reach a satisfactory conclusion from the OP's viewpoint


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

Joshua Dalzelle said:


> If you only want to be adored, genuinely or not, simply distribute to friends and family.


I'd rather give Poland to Hitler than one of my books to friends and family.


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## SEAN H. ROBERTSON (Mar 14, 2011)

I grin and appreciate the free publicity, then wish them Godspeed!  $$$


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

> I'd rather give Poland to Hitler than one of my books to friends and family.


Oh, if only I had known you when I gave my family my first book...

To be fair, some did read it and loved it. Those that couldn't be bothered, well, they probably would have gotten all worked up anyway. They already consider me strange enough. The arty one, you know.


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## danielpatrick (Jul 28, 2013)

I always liked this quote when rationalising a reviewer's response:

"Any reviewer who expresses rage and loathing for a novel is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae."


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

danielpatrick said:


> I always liked this quote when rationalising a reviewer's response:
> 
> "Any reviewer who expresses rage and loathing for a novel is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae."


Let's all repeat!

I am a hot fudge sundae.
I am a hot fudge sundae.
I am a hot fudge sundae.

I feel better!!


I typed that instead of copy-paste. I should be working on my WIP. I'm in denial that this is work.


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## Mandy (Dec 27, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Why should the reviewer respond privately? The author submitted a manuscript for review to a person who, apparently reviews a lot of stuff on GoodReads. It sounds to me like she knew there was a strong possibility that the review would, ultimately, be posted and she was hoping it would be at least neutral. But the reviewer didn't like it and posted her review, as was completely her right. How 'hard it is to write a book' doesn't enter into it. The fact that she herself is not an author doesn't enter into it. She. Didn't. Like. It. And has a right to say so.
> 
> Please understand: I get completely that a less than positive review can be painful for an author, but it's something you have to learn to deal with.
> 
> ...


Well said.

I'm personally grateful for the descriptive 1-star reviews. We have _all_ read books we've hated, and the 1-star reviews often give me clues on whether I'd enjoy the book in question. Heck, I've even bought a book or two based on a 1-star review. We're smart enough to know the difference between a well-thought out review and a review written out of spite.


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

ClarissaWild said:


> So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild, but when I received back the review that was posted on goodreads it was quite a shock. She'd literally bashed the hell out of my work, pointing out all the things she was laughing at, making it look like a truckload of [crap] on paper.
> I know there are always people who don't like your book, but what do you do when they don't even provide honest, constructive opinions/feedback and just blatantly skip to belittling and mocking the writer/book? Online? For everyone to see?
> This person got 30 likes on the review ... and a hell of a lot of comments.
> I'm so afraid it might damage my sales ...


I picked up your book today. I can review it if you would like.


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## MsTee (Jul 30, 2012)

Ann in Arlington said:


> As a reader/consumer of LOTS of books. . . . I generally am left with a bad impression when an author posts one of these "oh, poor me, I got a bad review" threads. That means it's way way less likely I'll give your book a try if it comes up on my radar via Amazon or whatever. Maybe not so much if the review was the worst of the lot with bad language and personal, actionable attacks; but that's not what they usually are. They're usually just less than 5 star reviews that people, frankly, whine about. I just don't think it's a smart way to deal with it. And it seems like there's a thread like this every few days.


^ This.



DianaGabriel said:


> [...] Just out of curiosity, have the mods ever discussed getting rid of these types of threads? Or even consolidating them? They are almost never productive and almost always counterproductive (people flock to down-vote or whatever). Except in special cases, the advice given is always: don't respond, move on, one review won't sink you, etc. I'd guess that I'm not the only one tired of these threads - not to mention they tend to alienate readers. These types of things seem better suited for a private forum, so that neither reviewer nor author are harmed, and the author can still vent if necessary.


^ This, too. So much of this.

Years of fanfic writing and some of the nastiest comments (waaaay nastier than the reviews I see folks complaining about here - we're talking about commenters actually going to town on YOU and ridiculing YOU, no constructive criticism whatsoever) have sort of hardened me to negative reviews. Yes, bad reviews sting like hell, but if you think you're gonna post content on the 'net and have everybody love it - think again. The more exposure your work gets, the greater the likelihood it's going to receive unpleasant (TO YOU) feedback.

Additionally, just adding to the chorus that I read the review and that, no, the reviewer is not attacking you. Yeah, it's snarky, but it seems to have some validity to it. I'd cool down and lick my wounds for a bit. After that, I'd reread the review, then reread my own work with as clear a gaze as possible to see if there are areas that truly need improvement.

Best of luck to you, anyhow.


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

I wonder if there are still people who read a book for its own merits, for the promise of entertainment, education, edification, and possibly more, instead of for how the author behaves or what he says on some forum?


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

Andrew Ashling said:


> I wonder if there are still people who read a book for its own merits, for the promise of entertainment, education, edification, and possibly more, instead of for how the author behaves or what he says on some forum?


Yes. I usually read for pleasure but I have read a few books because of something the author said on this forum. Most of those books have been enjoyable too. Though if I have a problem with the book, I will message the author rather than posting a bad review.


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## MsTee (Jul 30, 2012)

Andrew Ashling said:


> I wonder if there are still people who read a book for its own merits, for the promise of entertainment, education, edification, and possibly more, instead of for how the author behaves or what he says on some forum?


Yep, I go searching for books in the genres I like. But, yeah, I also click on a lot of covers here if the author has said something interesting/very funny. If the sample's good, I'll buy it. I don't review as often as I should, though. 

I admit, I have a mental list of a few folks I've decided to avoid. But I don't hold on to bad feelings long, and if I happen to click their book and I like the sample, I'll buy it anyway.


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## L. (Jul 25, 2013)

danielpatrick said:


> I always liked this quote when rationalising a reviewer's response:
> 
> "Any reviewer who expresses rage and loathing for a novel is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae."


Love the quote.

I pretty much avoid taking vitriolic "reviews" into consideration, as well, these days. More and more the "reviewers" themselves come off like they're mentally unstable or trolls seeking attention at someone else's expense.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

ClarissaWild said:


> Indeed. Funny thing is, she started 'quoting' stuff to laugh at that wasn't even in the book. She just made it up, typing out whatever she thought was in there. I checked with a CTRL+F and found her text nowhere...
> God I hate that.


It's really a shame that nobody has called ClarissaWild out on this.

I looked at the quotes that the reviewer included in her review, and I started reading through the book.

16% in (not 10 minutes of reading) and the first quote is there, in the book. 
18% in comes the next quote. 
35% in comes the next quote 
58%
63%
79%
and the last quote at 83% (this one isn't actually exact. A couple of words are different)

It didn't take a CTRL+F, it took about 25 minutes. 
Sure the reviewer's tone may have been snarky and uncalled for (in actuality, on Goodreads there is far worse. It's a form of entertainment) but the fact that the author came on here and blatantly lied in an attempt to get the contributors of this forum to vote down or shout down the review is unethical and a much worse offense than any the reviewer may have committed. For many of us this is a good place to frequent for advice and support. There's a lot of nice, well-meaning people here. So it kinda sucks when someone comes in and tries to exploit the good-natured folks here.

Interesting to note that the author hasn't been back here since Julie pointed out (back on page 2) that the quotes do exist in the book.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Nathan,

I think it has been pointed out that the quotes were in the book (and, you yourself say Julie pointed it out).

There's no evidence that the poster was trying to get members of this forum to act against the reviewer--let's not attribute motives.  There was no request by the OP to do anything of the kind.

Betsy


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## Gennita Low (Dec 13, 2012)

Mimi said:


> Let's all repeat!
> 
> I am a hot fudge sundae.
> I am a hot fudge sundae.
> ...


But...but...I'm a Haagen Daaz pineapple coconut!


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## kisala9906 (Sep 4, 2011)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Why should the reviewer respond privately? The author submitted a manuscript for review to a person who, apparently reviews a lot of stuff on GoodReads. It sounds to me like she knew there was a strong possibility that the review would, ultimately, be posted and she was hoping it would be at least neutral. But the reviewer didn't like it and posted her review, as was completely her right. How 'hard it is to write a book' doesn't enter into it. The fact that she herself is not an author doesn't enter into it. She. Didn't. Like. It. And has a right to say so.
> 
> Please understand: I get completely that a less than positive review can be painful for an author, but it's something you have to learn to deal with.
> 
> ...


This said how I feel! Thank you! I come here often to find a new book to read and these threads make me never buy a book from that author, ever. I don't read erotica so you didn't lose a sale from me, but I do recommend them a lot to my sister who loves erotica so who knows on that one.

I read the review, and if the quotes were true, and they probably were, I can see why she gave the book one star. Those are really horrible lines and descriptions I can't even imagine how they would only be bad taken out of context, they are just bad. The one about putting her head between her legs, yeah, gotta agree who does that? The written by a boy comment I think she was trying to point out that women should know how women act and from what she read clearly in her opinion the author (the OP) did not.


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## TiffanyTurner (Jun 8, 2009)

Of some of the 1 star/bash review threads I've seen, this is the most with readers. Usually, it is writers trying to say, hey, it happens. Go have a drink, relax, do some yoga. So, it is good to see some readers putting in their two cents. I think that the reactions to 1 or 5 star threads should continue on the boards. If readers really follow these threads, it really gives insight to the world of being an author. I've seen the ups and downs. The pain and thrill of writers sharing their experiences. It's keeping it all real. This is a writer's life exposed with all the wounds and blood flowing. 

So, Clarissa, *hands cyber band aid*, you patch yourself up, put on those big girl panties, and go write some more.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Ashy said:


> There are sad, petty people everywhere.
> 
> Do not let them determine your outcome and who you are.
> 
> Keep on keepin' on.


This. Can't reply... just smile and remind yourself, any review is only one opinion.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3 using Tapatalk HD


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## 1131 (Dec 18, 2008)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Why should the reviewer respond privately? The author submitted a manuscript for review to a person who, apparently reviews a lot of stuff on GoodReads. It sounds to me like she knew there was a strong possibility that the review would, ultimately, be posted and she was hoping it would be at least neutral. But the reviewer didn't like it and posted her review, as was completely her right. How 'hard it is to write a book' doesn't enter into it. The fact that she herself is not an author doesn't enter into it. She. Didn't. Like. It. And has a right to say so.
> 
> Please understand: I get completely that a less than positive review can be painful for an author, but it's something you have to learn to deal with.
> 
> ...


I've read all of the posts here and this one pretty much sums up my feelings on the whole thing. The reviewer may not have said things in a nice way but that was her right. She didn't like the book, she gets to say so, however she wants. She got a lot of positive feedback for the way she said it. It may not be my style but it worked for her. 
As a non-author I don't give a crap what goes into writing a book. I read for my entertainment, education or whatever. I don't get free books so I invest money and TIME reading these books. People who get free books still invest TIME. Reviews of books (not personal attacks and I acknowledge those exist) are NOT about the author. They are about the reader's experience. They get to say what they want, how they want, where they want and when they want. You do to. That's why threads like this exist, in great quantity. When I have a bad day I whine in private. Not at the office or on a public forum where my professional reputation is on the line. I don't think public whining has a positive impact on anyone's career. That's just me, you may feel different.


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## Andrea Harding (Feb 27, 2013)

kisala9906 said:


> The one about putting her head between her legs, yeah, gotta agree who does that?


Seriously, you've never sat on the bathroom floor after being sick and pulled your knees up to your chest and rested your forhead between your knees? It's not worded as well as it could have been, but I have done that _many_ a time and recognised this for that as soon as I read it?


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

DDark said:


> Sigh. I miss the days when I was more flexible...


And see, my thought was the only time I did that was after a hard drinking night in college, and I don't really miss those days.

Betsy


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## Lynn McNamee (Jan 8, 2009)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Nathan,
> 
> I think it has been pointed out that the quotes were in the book (and, you yourself say Julie pointed it out).
> 
> ...


Perhaps not, but I did feel she was attempting to get false sympathy.

Other authors (and perhaps even readers) would be far more likely to rally around her if the reviewer had posted quotes that weren't in the book.

I am firmly in the camp that thinks reviewers/readers have the right to say what they wish about a book, but that got my attention.

Now, finding out the author blatantly lied made me angry at _her_ instead of at the reviewer.


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## Andrea Harding (Feb 27, 2013)

DDark said:


> Sigh. I miss the days when I was more flexible...


With me it has more to do with despondency than flexibility, I'm quite fat, but it's a relatively comforting position lol!


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## Fredster (Apr 11, 2011)

DDark said:


> And this time time, in band camp...


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## Quiss (Aug 21, 2012)

So I had me a thought.
Just expressing an observation, mind you. I'm on neither side of the "should authors respond to reviews" fence. I don't respond to bad reviews but I've met some really cool people by contacting, or being contacted by, readers.

Anyhoo, I noticed that authors here will discuss their sales, income, state of health and marital status, body size, personal problems, location, and the occasional fetish. Our beloved porn writers really put it all out there, albeit under a pen name. 
Yet somehow it's the crime of the century when writers express their hurt feelings over something someone said in a public forum. No one understands that more than another writer. 

It is often said her that readers don't know or care what the authors feel. 
I like to think more highly of readers, who are as human as we are. When I read a vicious review that goes beyond "I don't like this because..." it's a reflection on the reviewer's personality, not the writer. I think other readers understand that. Goodread's current trend of tearing a book/author apart for entertainment is shameful but I doubt it applies to even the majority of readers.
(This isn't in reference to the OP, which has a whole other sub-set of issues. Like I said, just an observation on this type of thread)


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## Guest (Aug 2, 2013)

Quiss said:


> Anyhoo, I noticed that authors here will discuss their sales, income, state of health and marital status, body size, personal problems, location, and the occasional fetish. Our beloved porn writers really put it all out there, albeit under a pen name.
> Yet somehow it's the crime of the century when writers express their hurt feelings over something someone said in a public forum. No one understands that more than another writer.


What a person wants to discuss about THEMSELVES or their own actions is their business. But when you start talking about the actions of others it is a different issues.

Publishing is a business. Reviews are customers or potential customers. Don't talk trash about your customers in public. I don't understand why this is a hard concept for people. If you want to talk about yourself (your income, your marital status, your fetishes) that is all about you. But the moment you open your mouth in public regarding the behavior of someone else (i.e. a reviewer) then it's a different thing. But this is not a private forum. We aren't in a back room of a building drinking beer and playing cards. We're out in the middle of the street at rush hour, with thousands of non-writers walking by and listening to what we are saying.

Its one thing to speak in general terms. But these threads are ALWAYS personal. The author calls out a specific reviewer and drags that person into this forum for ridicule. Because these threads are never just about sympathy. They get ugly and personal and insulting. They call the reviewers stupid, idiots, liars, lazy. They go researching the reviewer to find things to make fun of. They accuse the reviewer have being a sad person with no life. These threads never end well. They devolve into the petty and spiteful, and all because some author was too thin-skinned to accept the fact that not everyone will like every book.

Sometimes the reviewer doesn't know they are being talked about. Sometimes they find the thread and all hell breaks loose. But this is a business. You don't call your customer liars in public like Clarissa did in this thread (particularly since she was wrong about the facts!). You don't accuse your customers of being stupid. You don't accuse your customers of being petty and sad little people who are too lazy to write a book.

I understand that a bad review stings. But you suck it up and move on. You don't walk out into the parking lot where other customers can hear you and complain about the customer who said the steak was undercooked or the customer who said the soda was flat.


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## Quiss (Aug 21, 2012)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> Its one thing to speak in general terms. But these threads are ALWAYS personal. The author calls out a specific reviewer and drags that person into this forum for ridicule.


Well, that is true and should really be common sense, no?


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## Guest (Aug 2, 2013)

Quiss said:


> Well, that is true and should really be common sense, no?


You have been around this forum HOW long and you just typed that?


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## Amanda Brice (Feb 16, 2011)

Sarwah2012 said:


> I'm practically crying reading this review. Why are people so cruel? OK she didn't like it why could she just not PM you. You gave it to her for free. *She has no idea how hard it is to write a book.* Can see she is not an author.


Why should this matter? Why should the fact that it's hard to write a book mean that the book shouldn't be subject to criticism?

It's hard to do brain surgery. Does that mean nobody has the right to critique the surgeon? It's hard to cook. Does that mean that diners in a restaurant shouldn't have the right to leave a review if they didn't like their meal? Waitressing is hard work. Does that mean that if I have a lousy experience at a restaurant, I don't have the right to complain about it?

When you put a book up for sale -- whether through the traditional avenues or through self-publishing -- you are holding yourself out there to the public as a professional. And as a professional, one of the things you have to expect is that you will be criticized. Your performance is held up for public scrutiny. Just because it's HARD doesn't mean that you get a free pass.

Writing should be hard. If it wasn't, everyone would do it. As a reader, I don't care if it's hard. All I care about is whether I enjoyed it. And it doesn't matter whether I got the book for free or paid for it, my time is valuable. If I didn't enjoy the experience, I have the right to say so. (Personally, I don't write reviews anymore now that I'm a writer, but that's besides the point.)


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

JK Rowling, Stephen King, and George R.R. Martin among many others get far worse reviews than this. None of us have the right to be complaining because we are not invincible.
I read the review, as well. I agree, it's snarky, but I did not see anywhere that the reviewer was bashing you personally. All of her comments were related to the book. At least this review was detailed and not a general one-liner 'it sux' comment. I've gotten plenty of bad reviews on my stuff that makes me want to cringe. I realize I can't please everyone. Neither will you. Just keep writing and move on.

Please be grateful that you got a (detailed) review at all. Many of us are struggling just to get one review.


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

Lynn McNamee said:


> I am firmly in the camp that thinks reviewers/readers have the right to say what they wish about a book, but that got my attention.


Of course they have that right. Everybody has that right about every subject under the sun. Including reviews.

That doesn't mean that all opinions/reviews are created equal. Some comments don't even merit the name review.

I am firmly in the camp that thinks you have a right to your own opinions but that you don't have a right to your own facts.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Let me say again that's there's nothing wrong with venting here in general terms.  It's when people get specific that problems occur.

Folks, the OP has apparently moved on, perhaps having taken the advice to get back to writing to heart.  I suggest the rest of us do, too...

Betsy


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## Guest (Aug 2, 2013)

Andrew Ashling said:


> I am firmly in the camp that thinks you have a right to your own opinions but that you don't have a right to your own facts.


Lynn was referring to the fact that Clarissa accused the reviewer of *making up quotes*, but in truth the quotes were *actually in the book*.


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## Gennita Low (Dec 13, 2012)

Because of the nature of the Internet, we always forget some posters are a lot younger/naive than they seem. It's like those Twilight Forums where 50 year-old women are sighing to 13 year-olds about having what'sHisSparklyFace's baby. They forget they are talking to kids.

I cut most of these threads some slack if they're first timers. We'd gone through the shock of reading a painful review at least once and had done some crazy things. If you're as old as I am, then you'd remember how shocked the older, more Internet inexperienced authors who thought they were the cat's whiskers to EVERY reader were, when online forums first came on. They would reply and argue about every point of a review, as if the sale of their books depend on it.

It's just one of those writer growing pain things.

Heck, some adults never learn how public forums and social media are. Ladies and gent, meet Carlos Danger, NY's mayor wannabe.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Quiss said:


> So I had me a thought.
> Just expressing an observation, mind you. I'm on neither side of the "should authors respond to reviews" fence. I don't respond to bad reviews but I've met some really cool people by contacting, or being contacted by, readers.
> 
> Anyhoo, I noticed that authors here will discuss their sales, income, state of health and marital status, body size, personal problems, location, and the occasional fetish. Our beloved porn writers really put it all out there, albeit under a pen name.
> Yet somehow it's the crime of the century when writers express their hurt feelings over something someone said in a public forum. No one understands that more than another writer.


FWiW. . . .some of the . . . . concepts. . . .expressed in those sorts of threads are also the sort of things that might give readers pause. But at least all they're commenting on is themselves and each other. So, if a reader wanders in and doesn't like something they read, well, they did after all, wander into an area called "Writer's Cafe". So they shouldn't find it surprising there are discussions about sales and how to write erotica and such. And I don't think we have members here who care much about that sort of thing -- they get that some of this discussion is 'insider info', and may even be passionate, and enjoy it as such, or ignore it as not of interest.

What they _don't_ like is when the commentary seems to be critical of exactly the folks you, presumably, want to buy your stuff.

STILL -- I think it does behoove authors to realize that it is still PUBLIC, even if it is called "Writer's Cafe" and to moderate their comments according to how they feel about that. Some won't care and will not moderate their comments at all. But some may decide it's smarter not to make nasty comments even to or about fellow writers. I, actually have a few people on my Do Not Read list, solely because of how mean and nasty they have come across here toward their fellow authors. I just don't want to support someone I think is not a nice person.



> It is often said her that readers don't know or care what the authors feel.
> I like to think more highly of readers, who are as human as we are. When I read a vicious review that goes beyond "I don't like this because..." it's a reflection on the reviewer's personality, not the writer. I think other readers understand that. Goodread's current trend of tearing a book/author apart for entertainment is shameful but I doubt it applies to even the majority of readers.
> (This isn't in reference to the OP, which has a whole other sub-set of issues. Like I said, just an observation on this type of thread)


No argument there. . . it IS definitely as much -- or more -- a reflection of the reviewer as anything. But. . . an awful lot of readers who see that sort of thing, _may_ come away with a negative response. So I totally GET an author's concern about about it. On the other hand, in most cases, discerning readers (the best kind, right?  ) are going to be able to go beyond that and look at the big picture -- rather than basing their decision on one outrageously negative review. But at bottom, I don't think there are many at all who consciously think, "oh, that mean reviewer probably made the author feel bad, I should buy their book." 

On the flip side. . . . . when the author comes to a public forum and complains -- even mildly! -- discerning readers factor THAT into their decision as well.

And. . . I agree with Betsy. . .it's probably time to move on:


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> Publishing is a business. Reviews are customers or potential customers. Don't talk trash about your customers in public. I don't understand why this is a hard concept for people.


As usual Julie makes so much freaking sense that I am surprised it needed to be said.


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> Publishing is a business. Reviews are customers or potential customers. Don't talk trash about your customers in public. I don't understand why this is a hard concept for people.


I'm always glad to help you when you don't understand things, Julie.

Your conclusion is wrong because your premise is wrong, or rather incomplete. Publishing may be a business, but we are not *just* publishers. We are also artists. We have to find a balance between our natural instinct to protect our creation and a detached business attitude. Some find this easier than others. Some are naturally more level headed, some are content to paint by numbers and hence don't invest much emotional capital in their creations&#8230;

Two other things you have to understand.
One, this is the age of the internet. If you call someone a liar in your local bar or pub, chances are you'll get a punch in the nose for your trouble. There is a delay between crime and punishment now, if there ever is punishment at all. Hence more name calling.
Two, indies are for the majority (educated guess, no guarantees) _writers_ - more artists than businesspersons - who then go the extra mile to publish. Most of us are exhausted by the time we have formatted and uploaded a file. Even fewer suspect that this wasn't the final extra mile, but that there is still another mile, and another&#8230; Few among us are born with the innate business acumen you seem to think of as a prerequisite to publish.

So, we have to learn. Now, let's see, how do we do that? Mostly by trial an error. A great help is this forum where we can compare the results of our endeavors. Again, we have to find a balance.

The tone of these "Woe is me, I got one starred" threads has changed considerably in the last two years.
There is sort of a swinging movement. It will never reach perfect equilibrium but the amplitude of the movement will decrease.
Just a few years ago, when a new author, devastated by his first one-star review came to complain here, he was mercilessly destroyed. Readers descended out of lurkdom as avenging angels upon the poor guy and verbally humiliated and lambasted him in the most cruel way imaginable, soon aided and abetted by other authors. The guy was torn to pieces by a pack off vicious, rabid wolves. Then the pendulum swung the other way (I simplify for brevity's sake). Whenever an author complained about a one-star review, he got our automatic sympathy and dozens of us went to downvote that review - automatically, as a matter of (misunderstood) solidarity.

But look at this thread. Some hard questions were asked of OP. By other authors. Down voting? Not so much anymore.

Why is that, you ask?
Not because we listened to you. We didn't. We discussed. We thought. We pondered. We ventured some theories, arguments and counter-arguments. The amplitude of the pendulum became smaller, nearer to the equilibrium.

That's how we learn. Thanks to threads like these.


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## 1131 (Dec 18, 2008)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> Publishing is a business. Reviews are customers or potential customers. Don't talk trash about your customers in public. I don't understand why this is a hard concept for people. If you want to talk about yourself (your income, your marital status, your fetishes) that is all about you. But the moment you open your mouth in public regarding the behavior of someone else (i.e. a reviewer) then it's a different thing. But this is not a private forum. We aren't in a back room of a building drinking beer and playing cards. We're out in the middle of the street at rush hour, with thousands of non-writers walking by and listening to what we are saying.


This. When I get complaints at work, which I do on a daily basis, I don't go into the hall, the lobby, the parking lot, the restaurant at across the street, the local cafe and so on and complain. I talk to family and friends in private. I have an excellent reputation in my working community. I'm not going to destroy that by complaining in public. That is what is being done here. This is a public forum. It may not seem like it but it is. And it is not a good policy to complain about your customers in public if you want to keep and gain customers. No business allows that. They fire people for it because it hurts their bottom line. Publishing is a business. Some people have difficulty treating it as such.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Andrew Ashling said:


> But look at this thread. Some hard questions were asked of OP. By other authors. Down voting? Not so much anymore.


I'm not so sure I agree that the down voting doesn't happen so much anymore. We removed the link here pretty quickly, and most people won't work very hard. But the last thread like this that blew up did so because a bunch of people rushed to Amazon and downvoted the review.

But otherwise, I agree that these discussions, without specifics, are useful to the members of the Writers' Cafe.

Betsy


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## Beatriz (Feb 22, 2011)

ClarissaWild said:


> So I gave this copy to a reviewer in the hopes of her being mild, but when I received back the review that was posted on goodreads it was quite a shock. She'd literally bashed the hell out of my work, pointing out all the things she was laughing at, making it look like a truckload of [crap] on paper.
> I know there are always people who don't like your book, but what do you do when they don't even provide honest, constructive opinions/feedback and just blatantly skip to belittling and mocking the writer/book? Online? For everyone to see?
> This person got 30 likes on the review ... and a hell of a lot of comments.
> I'm so afraid it might damage my sales ...


Don't let it bother you. She obviously hated your work but one man's poison is another man's delight so there will be others who'll love your work. That said, see if her comments have any merits, try to look at your work objectively (not easy because that's your baby) but that's how we ultimately grow as writers.


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## jackz4000 (May 15, 2011)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> What a person wants to discuss about THEMSELVES or their own actions is their business. But when you start talking about the actions of others it is a different issues.
> 
> Publishing is a business. Reviews are customers or potential customers. Don't talk trash about your customers in public. I don't understand why this is a hard concept for people. If you want to talk about yourself (your income, your marital status, your fetishes) that is all about you. But the moment you open your mouth in public regarding the behavior of someone else (i.e. a reviewer) then it's a different thing. But this is not a private forum. We aren't in a back room of a building drinking beer and playing cards. We're out in the middle of the street at rush hour, with thousands of non-writers walking by and listening to what we are saying.
> 
> ...


This should be framed here. People don't have to love or even like your book or product. Some will and some won't--for whatever reason. Whether it is right or wrong or insane. There are some very good products including books out there that will get some bad reviews. It's tough. That's life.

What do all the top bestselling books all have in common? They all get some bad reviews. Got a bad review? You are in good company. Write another.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

I agree that, as writers, we should all have thicker skins and not take criticism of our work personally.  No good comes from responding to criticism, other than thanking the critic for their time.  Especially in a public forum like this.

That said...

I wasn't aware that people could respond to reviews on Goodreads, and when it was mentioned in this thread I went to check it out.  What I saw concerning this review was ugly.  Bunch of people trying to impress their friends with hurtful, snarky comments.  What makes it worse is the reviewer had personal contact with the writer, so it had to be clear to her that she was dealing with an actual human with feelings.

Yes, readers have a right to express their opinions about books they've read.  But when it crosses the line into cruelty, then it should be pointed out.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

Andrew Ashling said:


> Just a few years ago, when a new author, devastated by his first one-star review came to complain here, he was mercilessly destroyed. Readers descended out of lurkdom as avenging angels upon the poor guy and verbally humiliated and lambasted him in the most cruel way imaginable, soon aided and abetted by other authors. The guy was torn to pieces by a pack off vicious, rabid wolves.


I am sorry, but this is just not true. I been here since 2008 and nothing like this is happening here. The mods wouldn't ever let it get to this point. We readers don't descend like avenging angels. Its this attitude that makes it not a friendly place sometimes for readers. Many don't even come to this section anymore. Every thought about why? 
Those of us that do still partake, try to get our opinions heard once in a while. 
There is no lock on the door after all, but the tone sometimes that is used to describe readers here, makes even me think about if I should bother at times.


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

swolf said:


> I agree that, as writers, we should all have thicker skins and not take criticism of our work personally. No good comes from responding to criticism, other than thanking the critic for their time. Especially in a public forum like this.
> 
> That said...
> 
> ...


You must be new to Goodreads.

There are groups there who try to provoke naive authors to react to their vile comments - and I mean vile as in they would make _you_ blush, unless you like being called the gutter-word for the female sexual organ every second sentence. They operate in packs, so the poor victim gets urinated upon by at least a dozen of those "readers." Invariably the comments are highly personal and most of the time unsubstantiated. Whenever an equally naive honest reader tries to come to the rescue by calling for some moderation of tone, they wave their reader-entitlement cards in her face and she gets the same treatment as the author.



> No good comes from responding to criticism, other than thanking the critic for their time.


You are partly right. No good comes from responding to criticism. Some readers think thanking them is an intolerable presumptuous invasion of their sacred privileges.
(TBH, they're partly right as well: if you thank some, but not others, you're showing your bias and that in itself could be looked upon as trying to influence reviewers.)


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## Zenferno (May 29, 2013)

On the positive side, the reviewer:

1) Felt passionate enough to post a detailed review
2) Laid out many points of interest
3) Quoted the authors work
4) Had a laugh while reading the book (albeit at the authors expense)
5) Suggested areas for improvement
6) Received the book free so no love lost
7) Highlighted the value of conducting research on potential reviewers before giving them your work

It seems the mean-spirited tone of the review is more to do with the reviewer using the book as a vehicle to ingratiate herself with other members of the site, than trying to needle the author.  Having said that, it appears that at least some of the points have merit.    

As a reader and customer for other products on Amazon, I read the 1 star reviews to have a good laugh more than anything, at what the haters post.  Some of the comments in reply are hilarious.  

Onwards and upwards!


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## unkownwriter (Jun 22, 2011)

Atunah said:


> I am sorry, but this is just not true. I been here since 2008 and nothing like this is happening here. The mods wouldn't ever let it get to this point. We readers don't descend like avenging angels. Its this attitude that makes it not a friendly place sometimes for readers. Many don't even come to this section anymore. Every thought about why?
> Those of us that do still partake, try to get our opinions heard once in a while.
> There is no lock on the door after all, but the tone sometimes that is used to describe readers here, makes even me think about if I should bother at times.


Actually, I remember when this would happen. I lurked on these forums for months back in early 2011, and posts like that almost made me not join up here. They got _nasty_ before they ended up locked.

There have been quite a few threads that went on for far too long before getting modded, as I recall, and I too have a list of people I will never buy a book from based on their attitudes here, and on other boards.

I have no opinion about the OP, because I'm not going to read the review, and while I agree the reviewer has a right to their opinion, without obligations to the author, I wish people in general could be nicer to each other.



> I almost bought the book, BTW, but the only thing stopping me was there was only 1 review on Amazon. With a few more reviews I probably would have bought it, because it really does sound like a good book


Now see, out of all five pages on this thread, this got me. How is the writer to get more reviews, if no one will buy the book because it has no reviews, or not enough?  It's a Catch-22 for an author.


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## Joshua Dalzelle (Jun 12, 2013)

Soooo.... is Clarissa even participating in this thread anymore or are we all in here just shouting at each other?


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## Guest (Aug 2, 2013)

Joshua Dalzelle said:


> Soooo.... is Clarissa even participating in this thread anymore or are we all in here just shouting at each other?


We're on page five. I'm just surprised we are still sort of on topic.


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## Joshua Dalzelle (Jun 12, 2013)

DDark said:


> When someone walks into a room and starts up a conversation, then leaves the room, I think people are within their right to continue discussing.
> 
> We may be beating a dead horse, but authors have opinions.
> 
> Kind of like those reviewers...


That was meant as a joke...


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## lukemallory (May 13, 2013)

As someone mentioned above, I think this is the reviewer just being funny with her group. Certainly by the comments there, this doesn't sound like an unusual review for her. I suspect many authors have been destroyed by her.

I read a book a few months back (by someone here - not me!) which I thought was quite good. When I went to goodreads, I noticed that it had been savaged by a girl a bit like this one and a couple of others seemed to join in with a mob mentality - like a piranha attack. The stuff they were quoting as being wrong or flawed was subjective to the say the least, and I didn't see any problems with it. I sent an email to the author trying to encourage them, but they never replied.

That episode definitely left a mark on me and since day one of my writing adventures, I have been waiting to get savaged in reviews, be it on Amazon or Goodreads. It's just a matter of time!

I hope Clarissa doesn't take it personally. If nothing else, she has a lot of people talking about her - and, as they say, there's no such thing as bad press.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> We're on page five. I'm just surprised we are still sort of on topic.


HUGH HOWEY IS SO FREAKING HOT.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Down, David...

You'll scare the new folk....



Betsy


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

Atunah said:


> I am sorry, but this is just not true. I been here since 2008 and nothing like this is happening here. The mods wouldn't ever let it get to this point. We readers don't descend like avenging angels. Its this attitude that makes it not a friendly place sometimes for readers. Many don't even come to this section anymore. Every thought about why?
> Those of us that do still partake, try to get our opinions heard once in a while.
> There is no lock on the door after all, but the tone sometimes that is used to describe readers here, makes even me think about if I should bother at times.


You have a selective memory then.

It *was* that attitude by some and the way they spoke about authors as monkeys who should dance for their shiny dollar - and I guess it was just a very few individuals - that made authors think twice before posting the most innocent question or remark, for fear of being lambasted to hell.
By the way, the author I spoke of left this forum the same day&#8230; after deleting the thread, IRRC.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Andrew Ashling said:


> You have a selective memory then.
> 
> It *was* that attitude by some and the way they spoke about authors as monkeys who should dance for their shiny dollar - and I guess it was just a very few individuals - that made authors think twice before posting the most innocent question or remark, for fear of being lambasted to hell.
> By the way, the author I spoke of left this forum the same day&#8230; after deleting the thread, IRRC.


Hmmmm...the author of a thread here can not delete the thread. Though the content of the initial post could have been deleted, the post itself would remain. Subsequent posts by the author could have been deleted but all the responses to it by others would have remained. Only a moderator can remove a thread.

Betsy


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## The Peanut Gallery (Aug 2, 2013)

Quiss said:


> Our beloved porn writers really put it all out there, albeit under a pen name....


Porn writers? I've never heard of such a thing.

I'm assuming your referring to writers of 'evocative sensual human relations'.


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Hmmmm...the author of a thread here can not delete the thread. Though the content of the initial post could have been deleted, the post itself would remain. Subsequent posts by the author could have been deleted but all the responses to it by others would have remained. Only a moderator can remove a thread.
> 
> Betsy


Aha. 'Fess up. 

Seriously, maybe he asked&#8230;


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

I didn't read the review but I did pick up the book.    I also reviewed it.  I would say it was a 3 star once you got into it. But I won't be picking up that series again because I personally did not like the main character.

Now I come to the writer's cafe to find new authors and have been pleasantly surprised most of the time.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Look, authors are people. No, we probably shouldn't respond to be reviews but it's hard not to at least occasionally. As long as the reviewer isn't attacked personally, it is pretty minor in the larger scheme of things. They hurt so we sometimes say "Ouch!"

Out of 90 or so reviews A Kingdom's Cost has one 1-star review and it still kind of makes me grind my teeth.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Andrew Ashling said:


> Aha. 'Fess up.
> 
> Seriously, maybe he asked&#8230;


We very seldom remove entire threads that others have posted to in good faith based on the request of the the thread starter. Individual posts, yes...in an effort to keep the thread open, but generally threads are locked, not removed.

Betsy


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## Christopher Bunn (Oct 26, 2010)

I kind of view the whole review thing like the hotdog market. Ever since Hans Gruber invented the hotdog in honor of the defeat of the Huns, everybody and their grandmother have been making their own versions of hotdogs (though, I'm conflicted about calling modern meat substitute products hotdogs). Everyone has their favorite and everyone has different tastes and opinions on the matter. One person's favorite is another person's repellent wiener, and vice versa. It's a highly competitive market with lots of interesting niches and modifications (ie., corn dogs, Hungarian dogs, camel, etc).

It's the same thing with books and book reviews. I kind of like the idea that some people aren't going to like my books. That means there's a whole landscape of taste out there, with room for all different sorts of creators (books and/or hotdogs). I don't need to make everyone happy. There's a lot of potential stress removed due to that.


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## Nathalie Hamidi (Jul 9, 2011)

David Adams said:


> HUGH HOWEY IS SO FREAKING HOT.


DAVID ADAMS IS HOTTER THAN HUGH HOWEY!
*licks David's right nostril*


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## MsTee (Jul 30, 2012)

lukemallory said:


> As someone mentioned above, I think this is the reviewer just being funny with her group. Certainly by the comments there, this doesn't sound like an unusual review for her. I suspect many authors have been destroyed by her.
> 
> I read a book a few months back (by someone here - not me!) which I thought was quite good. When I went to goodreads, I noticed that it had been savaged by a girl a bit like this one and a couple of others seemed to join in with a mob mentality - like a piranha attack. The stuff they were quoting as being wrong or flawed was subjective to the say the least, and I didn't see any problems with it. I sent an email to the author trying to encourage them, but they never replied.
> 
> ...


Lol *'savaged', 'destroyed'*? Those are pretty strong verbs for a bit of snark. The reviewer has not 'savaged' or 'destroyed' anyone. They have expressed their _opinion_ (everyone's got a right to one, don't they?) on the BOOK. I'm sure every one of us have a read book that has pushed our buttons negatively, but this reviewer just took that extra step to publicly express her feelings about it. Sure, she could have done so without as much snark, but her tone is inconsequential since she DOES state some relevant points the author ought to consider. She did not ridicule or insult the author, she talked only about the book and her experience while reading it.

In any case, this:



Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> Reviews are customers or potential customers. Don't talk trash about your customers in public. I don't understand why this is a hard concept for people.


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## lukemallory (May 13, 2013)

MsTee said:


> Lol *'savaged', 'destroyed'*? Those are pretty strong verbs for a bit of snark. The reviewer has not 'savaged' or 'destroyed' anyone. They have expressed their _opinion_ (everyone's got a right to one, don't they?) on the BOOK. I'm sure every one of us have a read book that has pushed our buttons negatively, but this reviewer just took that extra step to publicly express her feelings about it. Sure, she could have done so without as much snark, but her tone is inconsequential since she DOES state some relevant points the author ought to consider. She did not ridicule or insult the author, she talked only about the book and her experience while reading it.


Is 'Lol' really the way to start a response? Also, thanks for highlighting the words '*savaged*' and '*destroyed*' - I felt they hadn't been highlighted enough.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

MsTee said:


> She did not ridicule or insult the author,


I disagree. I could post three direct quotes from her review where she ridicules and insults the author, but doing that would probably be in violation of Kboard's rules.


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## kisala9906 (Sep 4, 2011)

Andrea Harding said:


> Seriously, you've never sat on the bathroom floor after being sick and pulled your knees up to your chest and rested your forhead between your knees? It's not worded as well as it could have been, but I have done that _many_ a time and recognised this for that as soon as I read it?


Oh yes, BUT the context of the quote was that she put her head between her knees so a hot guy she was staring at would not notice her staring at him. What adult does that when you are trying to check out a guy? It does not look sexy, just makes you look stupid.


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

kisala9906 said:


> Oh yes, BUT the context of the quote was that she put her head between her knees so a hot guy she was staring at would not notice her staring at him. What adult does that when you are trying to check out a guy? It does not look sexy, just makes you look stupid.


And if you are outside, draws more attention to yourself.


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## kisala9906 (Sep 4, 2011)

cinisajoy said:


> And if you are outside, draws more attention to yourself.


Also my point! These are the types of things I hate, hate in books. If I ever seen someone doing that I would think they belong more on a playground because only a young kid would do this.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Let me say again that's there's nothing wrong with venting here in general terms. It's when people get specific that problems occur.
> 
> Folks, the OP has apparently moved on, perhaps having taken the advice to get back to writing to heart. I suggest the rest of us do, too...
> 
> Betsy


Apparently your suggestion is being successfully ignored.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

JRTomlin said:


> Apparently your suggestion is being successfully ignored.


The "successful" part is only because I took a nap....

*Glares at everyone.*

*Charges cattle prod.*

Betsy


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## MsTee (Jul 30, 2012)

lukemallory said:


> Is 'Lol' really the way to start a response? Also, thanks for highlighting the words '*savaged*' and '*destroyed*' - I felt they hadn't been highlighted enough.


'Lol' (to me) has become as regular as the word 'the.' Additionally, I mostly use it when, in speech, I would say something like 'Ha' or 'Heh.' If you think I am laughing at/ridiculing you, that is not the case.



swolf said:


> I disagree. I could post three direct quotes from her review where she ridicules and insults the author, but doing that would probably be in violation of Kboard's rules.


I reread the review and while I can see one instance (and it's only something where they are drawing a comparison), I don't see any others.


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## MsTee (Jul 30, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> The "successful" part is only because I took a nap....
> 
> *Glares at everyone.*
> 
> ...


OUCH!  Alright! Alright! I'm leaving!


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

Ut oh I think we are all in trouble.

Oh wait cattle prod that could be fun.  (Oops wrong thread for that idea.)


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## Krystel (Jul 6, 2013)

> I have worked with cattle my whole life and I have never in my life see this thing.
> it is kind of awesome
> 
> 
> ...


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## kisala9906 (Sep 4, 2011)

cinisajoy said:


> Ut oh I think we are all in trouble.
> 
> Oh wait cattle prod that could be fun. (Oops wrong thread for that idea.)


LOL, yup we are all in trouble now.
Can I point out that the reviewer and the blog seen and read this post here also another reason to start behaving I guess.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

MsTee said:


> I reread the review and while I can see one instance (and it's only something where they are drawing a comparison), I don't see any others.


Let's see, if I told you your book looked like it was written by a boy in middle school, and that it makes no sense and you should know this, and then asked if a 13 year old wrote it, are you seriously claiming I wouldn't be trying to ridicule and insult you?

Then again, I'm not seeing any books in your signature, so maybe it's difficult for you to see the author's perspective here.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> The "successful" part is only because I took a nap....
> 
> *Glares at everyone.*
> 
> ...


Maybe the right phrase was "enthusiastically ignored". 

I didn't mean to say that you had retired your trusty cattle prod.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

OK, folks, this has come back full circle to a WHOA situation.  Threadlock has been imposed.

If you have a problem with the reviewer, the place to comment is on Goodreads.

Thanks for understanding.  


Lots of other threads here...

Betsy
KB Moderator


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