# Air Travel



## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

I haven't flown for almost ten years.  In the '70s, I went to Europe seven times and Mexico twice.  Flew occasionally for years.  Then in mid '90s, I "discovered" Florida!  Good number of trips there.  But last time was May '04.  

Seems air travel has changed -- probably due mostly to 9/11 and the economy.  A friend told me yesterday that you can no longer lock your luggage?  If that's true, what about theft by baggage handlers or whomever?  So more carry-on which airlines are now putting kibosh on?  Then I hear fees for this and fees for that by airlines.  What else don't I know?  I would like to travel distances but I'm losing the desire.  All too much of a hassle.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

There are locks that you can put on your suitcases that are TSA approved--TSA can open them but the baggage handlers (supposedly) can't.  I've heard of bags being checked with locks and arriving at the destination without them.

I don't put locks on my checked baggage (trips to California and Europe in the last year) but I don't put ANYTHING in my checked baggage that I care about getting stolen.  If someone wants to steal my undies, that's their fetish.

All valuables, and anything that I can't live without on the trip, are in my carry-on.  You can find the size of the carry-on allowed by looking on the airline's website.  In the US, it's usually one personal item, like a purse, and one small suitcase-sized item.  When we traveled to England, it was one carry-on, period, so your purse had to fit inside your carry-on. 

Different airlines have different fees. We mostly fly Southwest in the US, and SW does not charge for two checked bags or carry-on items.

Betsy


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

I was looking at pictures from the 70s yesterday, of the upper deck bar on the 747 or the piano bar in coach class on Continental! Boy, those days are long gone...LOL.

Yes, you pay $25/bag to check a bag on certain airlines (United, US Airways, Delta--probably others). You can still get free soda or juice but you pay for food (on flights where food is available). 

On international flights you can check one bag, they feed you, and serve free drinks. 

One good thing that has developed is that you can check in online up to 24 hours before a flight which saves time at the airport. And now you can read your Kindle during take-off and landing.

L


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## balaspa (Dec 27, 2009)

There are lots of fees and fewer amenities. Lots of planes don't even have meal service anymore.


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

i started traveling in 1994, and i've never really felt a lock on baggage would deter a determined thief, so as betsy says, i don't put anything in my checked bag that i would be massively upset to lose.


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## Maria Romana (Jun 7, 2010)

It's definitely way less pleasant than it once was. I was flying a lot (for business) during the time when most of the changes took place. I went from not really minding air travel to absolutely hating it. We fly as little as possible now, because it's just a day of misery, from the long lines and hassle at security to the super-crowded seating to the nickel-and-diming for a three ounce apple juice. Maybe it's all necessary, maybe it's not, but either way, when you fly commercial airlines in the U.S. today, it no longer feels like you are the company's honored guest, but rather that you are darn lucky they let you on board their aircraft.


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

I'd allow more time for passing through security then you are used to. Though I am always uptight about going through security, then afterwords tell myself it was foolish to be so worked up over something so trivial. They are very strict about liquids, including most creams and gels. I've been caught once with a kit from my dentist that had mouthwash and toothpaste in it, and another time when I absentmindedly stuck a can of Coca-Cola in my carry-on at the last second. I would pack liquids or creams in your checked luggage if possible. There are exceptions for medications, but they need to be in individual baggies the TSA website has details. You will have to take off your shoes, so take shoes that are easy to slip on and off and have socks you are  willing to walk on trafficked tile in for a few minutes. It is highly likely that you have to take off any belt. Laptop computers and some high-end video cameras have to be taken out of carry-on bags and sent through the x-ray in their own tray. There are some special bags that can get you out of this, but you won't have one since you haven't traveled in a while! This requirement does not apply to iPads and Kindles. Despite the complaints about them I have almost without exception found the TSA staff to be as polite and reasonable as you can expect someone dealing with enforcing rules on masses of whiny people to be.

As mentioned, on the flight you will not get any food outside of first-class except on an extremely long flight. You will probably get drinks and peanuts or cookies. Probably the worst thing about it in my opinion, is that you almost always will be sharing an armrest with someone. The airlines have gotten really good at managing their loads so the flights are almost all full. If you have a carry-on with something expensive, especially if it is large, getting overhead bin space can be a drama.

If you are flying overseas, and on some very long domestic flights, you will have a personal video screen in the back of the seat in front of you. My experiences is that those really help, sorry Kindle! I always take my iPad with some videos I can watch on it, or a lengthy strategy game as well as my Kindle. I am sufficiently entertained that the flight itself isn't really that bad. I flew from Rome back to the US last fall and watched three movies on the way and really wasn't terribly inconvenienced or uncomfortable!

I look at flying as part of the cost that has to be paid to do the trip. Get it done with and move on so you can enjoy your trip!


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

One more thing, if you are taking a long flight the noise canceling headphones are so worth it! Bose are well-advertised, but very pricey. I finally bought a set of them, but for years got very good service out of a $40 set. Just make sure the earpieces are physically comfortable for you.


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

Thanks for the info and advice, everyone.  TG I got over the travel bug I had in the '70s.  It had bit hard back then.  I'm thinking about Florida -- either Panhandle gulf coast or Disney World -- in May.  Maybe.  Or maybe something else.  I don't know. 

I went to Florida a month after 9/11.  Flew American.  They booted me up to first class going there.      I wonder why?!


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

Sandpiper said:


> Thanks for the info and advice, everyone. TG I got over the travel bug I had in the '70s. It had bit hard back then. I'm thinking about Florida -- either Panhandle gulf coast or Disney World -- in May. Maybe. Or maybe something else. I don't know.
> 
> I went to Florida a month after 9/11. Flew American. They booted me up to first class going there.    I wonder why?!


Because they were worried that the airlines were about to go out of business? Don't expect any free upgrades nowadays. Everything costs money.

Going from Chicago to Florida shouldn't be *too* painful. I am sure there are plenty of direct flights and the flight should be pretty quick (3-4 hours I am guessing?).

My rules to myself for traveling in this day and age: 1) take advantage of online check-in--confirm your seat and pay for your checked bag 24 hrs in advance; 2) print a paper boarding pass and also have it on your phone (if possible). Redundancy is good!; 3) Yes, I pay to check a bag if the trip is going to be more than one night. I can pack liquids in the bag and not worry about being harassed at security; 4) For carry on bags, make sure that the bag is the right size and that you can lift it over your head. I am amazed at how many tiny people come on the plane dragging these gargantuan bags that they cannot lift, then stand there in the aisle expecting someone larger and stronger to put it in the overhead bin for them; 5) Make sure to have plenty of books on your Kindle, and other materials (movies or whatever) on other devices. Plan to entertain yourself; 6) I try really hard to be nice to the TSA agents, gate attendants, and flight attendants. I always say thank you to the pilot as I get off the plane. I figure all these people are working under less than ideal conditions, dealing with the public, and dealing with grouchy people. Anything I can do to make their day a tiny bit nicer is probably appreciated!

As someone else said, on a plane, it is *not* about the journey. It is the step you must take to get to the place you want to be. Figure out what you can do to make it better for yourself and better for the people around you. 99% of the time, this works.

L


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

My first flight was in 1974...and I've flown bunches since.  Most of my flights within the US since 2000 have been on Southwest, which has never had meals, so I don't miss meals on flights.  International flights still have meals, at least the ones I've flown on.

I actually don't really mind travel much more than I ever did.  Security is just another step to go through, and if you allow plenty of time, and are aware of what you can do and can't, it's really not a big deal. (Wait for border control at Heathrow a couple of times, and the security lines here are nothing. ) There is a lot of information on the airline websites. If you are over 75 you don't have to take your shoes off (know this because hubby is MUCH older than I am ).

Like Leslie, I'm nice to everyone involved.  I know too many airline people and how hard it is to deal with angry travellers...  We flew back from California on March 5.  A family had to be removed from the plane before we took off because they argued about complying with FAA seating regulations regarding emergency exit seating.

Betsy


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## busywoman (Feb 22, 2014)

Sandpiper said:


> I haven't flown for almost ten years. In the '70s, I went to Europe seven times and Mexico twice. Flew occasionally for years. Then in mid '90s, I "discovered" Florida! Good number of trips there. But last time was May '04.
> 
> Seems air travel has changed -- probably due mostly to 9/11 and the economy. A friend told me yesterday that you can no longer lock your luggage? If that's true, what about theft by baggage handlers or whomever? So more carry-on which airlines are now putting kibosh on? Then I hear fees for this and fees for that by airlines. What else don't I know? I would like to travel distances but I'm losing the desire. All too much of a hassle.


I travel a lot and the biggest thing I see is that most people seem to think it's preferable to shlepp heavy bags all over creation versus paying a few bucks. Me, I've never desired a second career as a skycap. These are my guidelines when I travel:

- Check your main bag. You won't be as exhausted at the end of your trip. You won't have back/shoulder pain from pulling a heavy bag (trust me that bag will feel 10 times heavier by the time you get on the plane). You won't have as many hassles going through security because you have less to worry about. You won't have the anxiety of worrying whether all the overhead bins will be filled by the time you board - forcing you to check it at the airplane door anyway or cramp your legs by having to put it under the seat. You can pack large size liquids, such as a full size toothpaste. You can also check things such as scissors or even a multitool or small pocket knife, that you can't get through security checkpoints. The small fee is worth all of that.

- Never put anything in a checked bag that you'd be upset to lose. Theft is common, and making a claim next to impossible to successfully pursue, not to mention a hassle. I've known people to have checked firearms, expensive jewelry and fancy electronics stolen.

- Carry a much smaller bag on the plane, with camera, computer, tablet, kindle, wallet, passport, prescription meds, reading glasses, phone, bluetooth headset, jewelry, etc. This is the stuff you never want to let out of your sight. A backpack, roomy soft briefcase, or roomy tote bag is good for this. Don't carry a separate purse - pack your purse until you get to your destination. Purses are easy to leave behind when you are carrying multiple things, especially at security when you're putting shoes and jackets back on and rushing to catch a plane, or when returning a rental car. Keep your bag zipped or snapped closed at all times because things fall out. I never lose ANYTHING in my life ... except at airports and rental cars.

- Wear slip-on shoes that are easy to get on and off. You'll have to remove them at security unless you're approved for TSA Precheck (which if you haven't flown in a decade I'm pretty sure you won't be).

- Visit the restroom about 15 minutes before your flight is expected to start boarding. Using restrooms on a plane is a major hassle for you and everyone around you, especially on short flights. Plan ahead to avoid it if you can.

- In hotels never leave anything expensive in your room. If there's a room safe use it. If not I've been known to carry my laptop, all my jewelry etc in my briefcase with me out to expensive dinners or business entertainment, rather than leave it in the hotel room. A roomy tote bag just looks like a large handbag if it is black leather or a classy fabric.

Hope this helps, and enjoy yourself!!


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

My first flight was in 1960--I was five and flying by myself from NYC to Boston! I remember being all dressed up (pink dress, petticoat, white socks, and black patent Mary Janes). I had a glass of milk and spilled on the man sitting next to me (who was also dressed up in a suit, tie, etc).

Here is the link to the pictures of the bars, etc., in the 1970s. Everyone looks like they are having a groovy time and they also wore groovy clothes!

http://www.messynessychic.com/2014/03/13/lets-reminisce-airplanes-piano-bars-cocktail-lounges-pubs-restaurants/

L


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

IF I go to Florida, probably would be on Southwest which I've never flown before. Actually I'm not too worried about it all. A little anxious. I have always had just a small carry-on on the plane plus my purse. Never seen the need to have any bag of much size on the plane. What I carried on could always go under a seat.

In all the flying I've done, I've never had a problem with long delays or cancelled flights. Pretty much all took off on time. So never have been trapped on a plane for hours. I worry about that a little. I would not fly in winter months.










This was September 6, 1970. Eventually all the planes were burned. No one was hurt. One of those planes is a Swissair Zurich-NY flight. I was on that same flight exactly one week earlier, August 30. Swissair must have known something was in the offing -- passengers were frisked in the Zurich airport before we boarded.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I highly recommend Southwest, which I fly a lot.  They are strong committed to on-time departures and their employee morale is extremely high, which means they are pleasant to deal with.

Seating is open, but you get a boarding order:  A1-60, B1-60, C1-60.  If you go to check in and print your boarding pass online exactly 24 hours before your flight, you'll probably be able to board in the B section, which usually means you'll be able to get your choice of an aisle or window seat though towards the back of the plane and there will still be room in the overhead bin near your seat. My stepson says C means "Center seat only." If you're concerned, or know you won't be able to check in exactly 24 hours before, for $15 (I think--or is it $12.50?) you can get early-bird check in, which means you are assigned a check-in order when you pay for the early-bird.  (It can be added after your ticket purchase, or bought at the time of the purchase.)

Bags fly free.  You can sign up for sales alerts, they have lots of good sales.  Hubby and I flew back from San Diego for $100 each, as I recall....or was that a previous trip?  Maybe $149 each this year?  Going out was free as we had Southwest points....

Betsy


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## Annalog (Dec 28, 2008)

Two things I do that I have not seen already listed above:

While I have TSA approved locks, I do not usually use them. Instead, I use twist ties to tie the zipper pulls together. This is just to prevent the zippers from opening accidentally. These have always been in place when I pick up my checked luggage. (When the lock issue was first implemented, I used the plastic snap-off locks and taped new plastic locks on the luggage. The times my bag was opened to be checked, the new plastic locks had been placed on my luggage.  )

I pack my handbag with what I want to access on the plane (Kindle, phone, origami paper, etc.). Then I pack my handbag in my carry on bag where it is easy to get out and replace.  When I get to my seat, I quickly remove my handbag, put the carry on in the overhead compartment, and then my handbag under the seat in front of me. If there is no overhead space, then both the carry on and my handbag fit under the seat in front of me. I started this when I had to travel with a laptop (personal bag).


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

All good advice.  Thanks.    Maybe I will go to Florida this year.  'Bout time.


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## JETaylor (Jan 25, 2011)

The only advice I'll give on this is to not wear jeans with bedazzled pockets.   

The machines don't like it and you'll get frisked and then they'll scan you with a wand.  I had that happen last Thursday when I went through for my flight - and I totally forgot about the laptop in a separate bin from the bag - it had to be rescanned.  It was quite amusing and I got laughing - but made me a little flustered.  

On the flight back - I got chosen for the TSA Precheck and didn't have to do anything - not even take the computer or liquids out of my bag.  And I made sure not to wear the jeans with the fancy pockets.


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## skyblue (Dec 23, 2009)

Yes, it's changed dramatically, but it won't stop me from traveling.


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## sstroble (Dec 16, 2013)

Sandpiper said:


> I haven't flown for almost ten years. In the '70s, I went to Europe seven times and Mexico twice. Flew occasionally for years. Then in mid '90s, I "discovered" Florida! Good number of trips there. But last time was May '04.
> 
> Seems air travel has changed -- probably due mostly to 9/11 and the economy. A friend told me yesterday that you can no longer lock your luggage? If that's true, what about theft by baggage handlers or whomever? So more carry-on which airlines are now putting kibosh on? Then I hear fees for this and fees for that by airlines. What else don't I know? I would like to travel distances but I'm losing the desire. All too much of a hassle.


Last time I flew had to go through Phoenix and Minn./St. Paul both ways. Could not believe how crowded the airports and planes were. A fellow traveler who flies a lot for business told me that the airlines have cut the number of flights way down and that every plane he flies is packed.


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

I flew 16 times last year, between DFW & SFO. I cannot recommend Southwest at all, and can't recommend Virgin Airlines *ENOUGH*! The difference between the two airlines is amazing.


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## 31842 (Jan 11, 2011)

Virgin America is wonderful!  They have individual televisions (free games and shows!) in the seats, and whenever you want a beverage or a snack, you just punch it into the television (it is a touch screen) and it will be brought to your seat.  Outlets in all the seats, too, if you need to recharge.  WiFi.  It's great.  The seats are a little narrower than normal if that is a concern, though.  JetBlue also has the free television and their seats are some of the widest in the industry, but as a tall person, I found the seats shallow.  The cushion hit the middle of my thigh which was a little uncomfortable after awhile.  But if you are petite, it would be perfect.  Southwest used to be wonderful, but they were recently bought out and now have one of the worst on-time records, the tickets have gotten expensive, and there are no amenities other than that they don't charge you for a bag.  Of the major carriers, American has always treated me well (comfy seats, good leg room, nice crew).  No bells and whistles, but they get the job done.  But avoid United and Delta like the plague.  Late.  Lost luggage.  Diverted to other airports so you end up 60 miles from where you were supposed to be.  Unhelpful staff.  Those two are just a nightmare.


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

and oddly enough, i've never had issues on Delta, but have had major cancellations with American.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

BTackitt said:


> I flew 16 times last year, between DFW & SFO. I cannot recommend Southwest at all, and can't recommend Virgin Airlines *ENOUGH*! The difference between the two airlines is amazing.


Different strokes. I love Southwest. Simple, quick, efficient, on time. I love their flight attendants. We typically only fly once or twice a year in the US, though. Haven't flown Virgin America. But last time I checked, the fares were higher than what I could get from Southwest, and I think I couldn't get a direct flight to San Diego. I'll note that Southwest has WiFi on most of their flights now, and I think the last plane I flew in had a recharger thing in the armrest, though I might be confusing that with our flight to London on Virgin Atlantic. I do love Virgin Atlantic, so I'm not surprised that Virgin America is a good airline.

Betsy


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

Because of schedule convenience, Delta is actually the airline I try to fly on. I usually have good experiences but right now I'm annoyed at them because of a schedule change they imposed on an upcoming trip where they diddled me out of an Economy Plus seat. Despite this, I am aligned with them enough that I actually shell out an annual fee for their credit card each year to get early boarding privileges and free checked bags. I fly several times a year, so I'm a frequent but not all the time flyer. My experience is that the airlines seem to be pretty much the same, and the major airlines are not better or worse than each other.

I do try to deliberately avoid Southwest when I can. I often fly with a bag of camera equipment. the unassigned seats boarding scheme Southwest uses raises my stress level when I'm trying to get a overhead bin for a bag with a couple of thousand dollars worth of camera equipment.


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## Tripp (May 28, 2009)

I fly a few times a year, mostly between Seattle and Minneapolis.  I like Sun Country Airlines.  Usually the lowest price and I love that it flies into and out of the smaller of the two MPLS terminals.  For me, it is worth it for that alone.  Their services are usually on par with the other airlines, but their upgrade to first class fares on the day of travel can be nice and affordable...I have done it a couple of times just to indulge myself.  But it is a 3 hour flight and I really can't complain, coach is comfortable enough for that amount of time.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

The Hooded Claw said:


> I do try to deliberately avoid Southwest when I can. I often fly with a bag of camera equipment. the unassigned seats boarding scheme Southwest uses raises my stress level when I'm trying to get a overhead bin for a bag with a couple of thousand dollars worth of camera equipment.


When we go to San Diego, I would guess I probably have a couple grand in my carry-on because of birding optics (scope, binoculars, digiscoping attachments and cameras, not to mention the miscellaneous electronics). My experience with Southwest is that if you get an A or B boarding pass, you can almost always get an overhead bin above your seat, and if you check in immediately after the 24 hour window opens, you will get the A or B. To eliminate the "almost" when I'm carrying the birding equipment, I get the early bird add-on for $15, I think. Which means you don't have to worry about checking in at 23:59 before the flight; you can do it any time before the flight and you board in the first 50 passengers, in my experience, so it's no problem. Different strokes!

(And actually, when I've flown other airlines, I haven't always found that having a seat assignment guaranteed me access to the nearest overhead bin....depends a lot on when you board, even then, though now that they're getting stricter about carry-ons, it's better.)

As an aside, Hubby's personal item is a bag of groceries for the flight, so we eat quite well on Southwest.  Better than on any other airline we fly on. But we still take the chips and cookies they hand out. 

Betsy


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## mlewis78 (Apr 19, 2009)

I have not been on a jet in 7 years, but I'm going to fly on Delta to Atlanta for my nephew's wedding in May.  I suppose that it is standard procedure now to charge for checking in a bag?  The first bag is $25.  Does all carry-on stuff go in overhead bin, or do they allow putting under seat in front of you (if it fits)?


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

i never put stuff in the overhead.  everything goes under the seat.


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

mlewis78 said:


> I have not been on a jet in 7 years, but I'm going to fly on Delta to Atlanta for my nephew's wedding in May. I suppose that it is standard procedure now to charge for checking in a bag? The first bag is $25. Does all carry-on stuff go in overhead bin, or do they allow putting under seat in front of you (if it fits)?


They want you to put stuff under the seat, if at all possible, so there is enough room in the overhead bins for all the people who bring their roll-aboard suitcases.

L


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

Their evil plan is working....airlines are doing worse, yet flyers are complaining less.
http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/news/article.asp?docKey=600-201404070901KRTRIB__BUSNEWS_49507_64306-1&params=timestamp%7C%7C04/07/2014%209:01%20AM%20ET%7C%7Cheadline%7C%7CAir%20passenger%20complaints%20drop%20in%202013%2C%20annual%20report%20shows%20%5BThe%20Wichita%20Eagle%20%3A%3A%20%5D%7C%7CdocSource%7C%7CMcClatchy-Tribune%7C%7Cprovider%7C%7CACQUIREMEDIA%7C%7Cbridgesymbol%7C%7CUSAL&ticker=DAL


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

mlewis78 said:


> I have not been on a jet in 7 years, but I'm going to fly on Delta to Atlanta for my nephew's wedding in May. I suppose that it is standard procedure now to charge for checking in a bag? The first bag is $25. Does all carry-on stuff go in overhead bin, or do they allow putting under seat in front of you (if it fits)?


Most airlines do charge. Southwest doesn't, but I think they're almost alone.

Betsy


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## RobertGebhardt (Apr 28, 2014)

I agree with the comments saying to be nice to the TSA agents and other workers. They actually have quite a bit of power (from kicking you off the flight to getting you upgraded), so I try to be nice and in a good mood with them. I tend to ask for emergency exit seats (for the extra leg room), and I've been upgraded twice to business class when those seats weren't available. I think it's purely from being nice and dressing semi-decently, but who knows?


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