# Thoughts on ReadingDeals.com organic reviews service



## Lars Blurnstad (Sep 29, 2015)

Has anyone used ReadingDeals.com organic reviews service (http://readingdeals.com/reviews)? Can you tell me a little about your results? I'm tempted, but I'm thinking I should wait for a few of my book blogger reviews to come back prior to seeking a service like this. Your thoughts and opinions matter to me!


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## Guest (Oct 15, 2015)

I've looked at it a few times and have it bookmarked. Seemed similar to StoryCartel (which was $20 and only netted 2 reviews out of 13 downloads; but I think they don't have a large YA reader base). Right now I'm trying Hungry Author's review service ($25) since they are an active member here and also run the awesome Kindle Giveaway site.


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## Kessie Carroll (Jan 15, 2014)

I paid the $20 for 10 reviews and so far have only netted 4. They've begun sending email links to the landing page for my book, so I can promote it on social media. Since I already promote my books/run promos and things, it kind of ... I don't know ... discouraged me? I don't think I'd use a service like this again.


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

Hi Kessie, 

Shawn here from Reading Deals.  So, that is REALLY good feedback on how creating a landing page for your book was received.  

Our aim was to give author a page that easily displayed their book if they wanted to promote it.  I'm sorry to hear that is made you feel discouraged  

At the same time, we use that page specifically now promote your book on our Twitter feed and Facebook page.  We are seeing good results because of that.

Lastly, we are starting to experiment using that landing page for FB ad promotions.

Hope that helps to clarify the "why" around that page being sent


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

coreyjpopp, I'll be the first to say that the results of the review program are much SLOWER than expected.  We are getting reviews completed, but it was pretty weak.  

As a result of this we've made many of the above changes and the impact is really starting to take shape.

For example, before we made those changes I mentioned, we were averaging 7 readers reviews completed each day, now we are at 21.. That 300% change has happened just in the last 30 days, so I am happy to see how this is improving overall book review orders being completed.


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## Patty Jansen (Apr 5, 2011)

I'm always a little bit confused about how this differs from "paying for reviews". If you don't pay for the reviews (i.e. they're not guaranteed), then what are you actually paying for? And also, do the readers know that authors pay for this? What actually is the service? The question applies not just to this site, but others like it.


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## Victoria Wright (Oct 9, 2015)

Patty Jansen said:


> I'm always a little bit confused about how this differs from "paying for reviews". If you don't pay for the reviews (i.e. they're not guaranteed), then what are you actually paying for? And also, do the readers know that authors pay for this? What actually is the service? The question applies not just to this site, but others like it.


I think the general idea is that you're paying to have your work advertised to a specific list -- in this case, a list of readers who can request a free ARC copy and are likely (preferably _highly likely_) to leave a review. So the author is paying the company for taking the time to curate, manage, and maintain the subscriber list and for handling the distribution of ARCs to interested readers.

I think.

ETA: And I don't think the sites offering these services can really guarantee anything. I don't see any guarantees on the two sites mentioned in this thread, they just offer a range of how many reviews you will potentially get.


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## Patty Jansen (Apr 5, 2011)

V.W. said:


> I think the general idea is that you're paying to have your work advertised to a specific list -- in this case, a list of readers who can request a free ARC copy and are likely (preferably _highly likely_) to leave a review. So the author is paying the company for taking the time to curate, manage, and maintain the subscriber list and for handling the distribution of ARCs to interested readers.
> 
> I think.


Yeahbut what these sites often lack is evidence that they have a strong reader list.


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## Victoria Wright (Oct 9, 2015)

Patty Jansen said:


> Yeahbut what these sites often lack is evidence that they have a strong reader list.


*shrug* I don't know, I'd have to say that proving the worth of their service is their prerogative. If they follow a standard business model, they'll offer free or discounted service to an initial sampling of authors and then allow user testimonial to do the rest.


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

Great question Patty! V.W. has it about right.  

We are facilitating the connection and process between authors & readers, whereby the readers obtain a free review copy, in exchange for writing an honest review on Amazon / GoodReads.  What we guarantee is that we will place your book in the hands of enough readers until you get 10 reviews.  What we can't guarantee is the angle and rating someone will leave about your book.

Additionally, Amazon has reviewed our service to ensure it is in compliance and from their last email we are in good standing with how we are doing things (whew!)


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

I can't say how large other companies are, but presently Reading Deals has 5,208 readers in our review program.  When we sent out an email today 1,100+ people opened the email to then read and click on books they might like to read.

Let me say this... Any review program, including Reading Deals Review Program should not replace the work you do to connect with readers on your own list... 

Our program should supplement what you are already doing.  It is another audience.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

Patty Jansen said:


> I'm always a little bit confused about how this differs from "paying for reviews". If you don't pay for the reviews (i.e. they're not guaranteed), then what are you actually paying for? And also, do the readers know that authors pay for this? What actually is the service? The question applies not just to this site, but others like it.


Much like with NetGalley, you aren't paying for reviews, but to put your book in a list of books available for free to reviewers. The service facilitates distributing the book to interested reviewers. So really you're paying for access to a narrowed list of people who have indicated they will review. Better services presumably cull out readers who are not doing reviews.

Broadly, using a service like would presumably result in a higher percent of reviewers for essentially giveaways versus just giving out copies on LibraryThing or Goodreads. Some "guarantee" reviews not by forcing but basically keeping your listing active for reviewers until you get the number promised (so if not too many people want to review it, it may be there awhile) vs NetGalley where you pay for time listed regardless of number of reviews.

I think in most cases the readers do know the author paid for it unless they just don't look around the site much as most have readers and authors using the same site.

I do notice that ReadingDeals has upped their price from $19.99 for 10 a few days ago, to now $39. I would be curious to know what changed to make it worth an extra $20 for the same number of reviews. Has the process been modified that results in a higher rate of reviewers doing the reviews and therefore a faster turn around?


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

Anma, we are experimenting with pricing right now and are not locked into anything just yet, but are seeing what works and doesn't work for everyone.  

Free would be the most ideal price for authors, but that doesn't always make sense business-wise. 

We are trying to strike the balance of reasonable and effective at the same time.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

A few quick thoughts

Note: This is about review sites in general. Today is the first time I've heard about ReadingDeals. I don't know anything about them and am neither endoring them nor attacking them.

1) Getting reviews for a new book is a really hard problem to solve. At times it seems people miss that point. It's very hard to find readers who are willing to be the guinea pigs.

2) Any company helping authors get reviews is basically, fundamentally, on the same team as authors and readers.

3) There's not really ANY way any service can guarantee reviews.

4) It's fundamentally a numbers game. Any site that wants to get lots of reviews for authors needs to have lots of readers. That's not going to happen if authors start off with a starting point of - Why aren't there 50 reviews for my book? How can a site grow big if the first question asked is - why aren't you already big?

5) Eventually, someone is going to crack the 'getting reviews for new books' problem. If every new site (Reading Deals, Choosy Bookworm, etc.) is held to some gold standard that's impossible for an upcoming site to achieve, then that makes it LESS LIKELY for that to happen.

Think of these sites as sites that are trying to solve a problem for everyone in the ecosystem. It's a problem that no one has effectively solved yet. 

***********************************

Basically, what I'm trying to say is

A) IN an ideal world we need 10-20 review sites that each have 10 to 20 million daily active readers and help authors get reviews.

That's very unlikely to happen if the starting point all of us use is

Why are you not already getting results like a site that has 10 million daily active readers?


B) It's a problem that needs to be solved and the ONLY way to solve it is to provide some incentive for readers to review the book while not making it an incentive to give a fake positive review.

So the whole question of 'How is it different from pay to review? Should it be OK to offer an incentive to review?' is easily answered

a) Pay to review is 'We pay money and you post a fake positive review'. THAT is what is illegal. There's no ethical or legal issue in providing an incentive to review a book.

b) Any author who thinks that readers are going to take their new untested book and review it for zero incentive or for the miniscule incentive of a free ebook, are making a giant and perhaps invalid assumption

There are thousands of new books each day. There are thousands of books being made free each day. Number of books available is growing faster than number of readers. So sooner or later the market is going to have to catch up with the reality and then we'll see a model that really works i.e.

Get some definite concrete incentive in return for an HONEST review.

The whole rule that people assume is valid i.e. not being able to incentivize reviews is unrealistic.

1) Why exactly would a reader take a chance on a new unproven book?
2) Is a free copy of that book enough incentive? What about the time investment the reader makes?
3) What is the market value of a review? If there was the option (legal and ethical) to pay for getting honest reviews, how much would authors be willing to pay?

These are all questions that have answers that are in violent disagreement with the expectations that are in place regarding to what review sites are able to do to get reviews and what sort of results are expected.

***************************************

At times it seems authors don't want anyone to crack the problem.


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## SasgoraBooks (Aug 27, 2015)

ireaderreview said:


> 1) Why exactly would a reader take a chance on a new unproven book?
> 2) Is a free copy of that book enough incentive? What about the time investment the reader makes?
> 3) What is the market value of a review? If there was the option (legal and ethical) to pay for getting honest reviews, how much would authors be willing to pay?


You make a lot of interesting points. However the great almighty 'Zon has determined in their TOS that a free copy shall be the only incentive allowed, regardless of what the rest of the world thinks about the value of a reader's time. Until Amazon decides different (not holding my breath), it's a mute subject and the only solution available is free ARCs.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

1) Yes, this is a good point

You make a lot of interesting points. However the great almighty 'Zon has determined in their TOS that a free copy shall be the only incentive allowed, regardless of what the rest of the world thinks about the value of a reader's time. Until Amazon decides different (not holding my breath), it's a mute subject and the only solution available is free ARCs.

2) Taking this as a given is not ideal. This is a situation where

Honest authors have no means left to get honest reviews.
Dishonest authors continue to pay for reviews and get a huge advantage.

3) Amazon just started a case against people selling fake reviews. After basically letting this go on for a decade.

*****

So authors need to force the ebook stores to allow some legitimate means.


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## Indecisive (Jun 17, 2013)

I signed up for ReadingDeals in the spring, maybe about 6 months ago. So far, I'm at 3 reviews out of 10, and I'm not holding my breath about getting more.

It is really hard to get reviews. I have a decent number for my first-in-series now (13 on Amazon.com and 24 on Goodreads), but it was a lot of work getting to that number. I did NetGalley, Goodreads giveaways, emailed bloggers, messaged Goodreads users, etc., in addition to trying Reading Deals. I think that the more established authors with big mailing lists and/or good sales don't realize how hard it is to get any reviews these days, especially by relying on sales or even free books alone.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

ireaderreview said:


> a) Pay to review is 'We pay money and you post a fake positive review'. THAT is what is illegal. There's no ethical or legal issue in providing an incentive to review a book.


Incorrect.

What is illegal is the _failure to disclose the relationship between the endorser and the endorsee_. ANY incentive to review a book beyond a comp copy of said book is payment, and must be disclosed. The FTC guidelines are painfully clear on this. If you are given a comp copy, you have to disclose that you were provided with a comp copy. If you were entered in a drawing for a gift card in exchange for a review, that is considered a paid endorsement and you must disclose. ANY incentive, other than a copy of the product to be reviewed, is payment. And if it is not disclosed, it is a violation of the law.

I don't see this as a "review service." I see this as a "Pay us to give your book away to random people who, if you are lucky, will leave a review." THAT is not a review service. A review service is something like NetGalley, where they do some type of vetting of reviewers and publishers can accept or refuse review requests based on the reviewer's credentials. A legitimate review service simply serves the administrative function of identifying potential reviewers and sending the comp copies.

If there is no vetting involved, it is not a review service. It is a giveaway service.


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## dianapersaud (Sep 26, 2013)

ireaderreview said:


> *
> Honest authors have no means left to get honest reviews.*
> Dishonest authors continue to pay for reviews and get a huge advantage.


?? Of course Honest Authors have means left to get honest reviews. My perma free gets honest reviews whenever I do a promo. My paid books- few and far in between.

Amazon moved my erom into erotica last week- someone read it and gave it a 5 star review.

I have more reviews on Google Play than I do on Amazon. Have no idea why, but Google Play users seem to be more likely (in my case) to leave a review than an Amazon customer.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

ireaderreview said:


> 3) What is the market value of a review? If there was the option (legal and ethical) to pay for getting honest reviews, how much would authors be willing to pay?


To me it is an interesting quandry. We can legally and ethically buy presumably honest reviews from Publisher's Weekly, Kirkus, Self-Publishing Review, and BlueInk Reviews, which charge in the hundreds of dollars for their reviews. It's only when it's someone charging sane rates for that honest review that it is consider illegal and unethical. I don't mean the fake ones Amazon is going after, but just "for $20, I'll read and post an honest review" type systems. The argument is usually "well it can't be honest if you paid for it" and yet the presumption is that the hundreds spent on the others is somehow more honest? In some ways indie reviewers have the same stigma we indie authors have - that because it's cheaper it must not be as good or valuable.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

ireaderreview said:


> Honest authors have no means left to get honest reviews.
> Dishonest authors continue to pay for reviews and get a huge advantage.


I'd disagree there. My novel has only honest reviews. It took a ton of work, yes, including approaching some 30-40 book bloggers, using services like StoryCartel to do giveaways for reviews, and doing a LibraryThing giveaway. Honest authors have means to get honest reviews - if they are willing to put in hours upon hours of effort for small returns. I do agree, we need better. As noted in my last post, I don't understand the idea that paying for reviews, unless you paid hundreds of dollars for them, is inherently wrong if they are honest reviews, but like others, I live within those bounds because those are the rules.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2015)

Anma Natsu said:


> To me it is an interesting quandry. We can legally and ethically buy presumably honest reviews from Publisher's Weekly, Kirkus, Self-Publishing Review, and BlueInk Reviews, which charge in the hundreds of dollars for their reviews. It's only when it's someone charging sane rates for that honest review that it is consider illegal and unethical. I don't mean the fake ones Amazon is going after, but just "for $20, I'll read and post an honest review" type systems. The argument is usually "well it can't be honest if you paid for it" and yet the presumption is that the hundreds spent on the others is somehow more honest? In some ways indie reviewers have the same stigma we indie authors have - that because it's cheaper it must not be as good or valuable.


Again, the issue is not payment. _The issue is disclosure._ What is crummy about Kirkus is not that they charge for reviews per se, but that they only charge indies and still provide their "traditional" reviews to trade publishers. But in the case of PW, Kirkus, etc, NONE of those reviews are ever posted as "Customer Reviews." They are never posted in a way to imply that the review was from an organic reader. They don't play games to get reviews to appear with the "verified purchase" badge. In fact, they don't even post the reviews themselves anywhere except their own publications. It is up to the authors/publishers to add those reviews to their listings and then only under the "Editorial Reviews" section.

The issue is not that money changes hands. The issue is disclosure. THAT has always been the FTC's concern; that paid endorsements are disguised as organic endorsements. That is why the FTC went after bloggers who accepted money in exchange for promoting products. That is why the FTC goes after review sellers who pretend to be regular customers. It has nothing to do with the amount and everything to do with disclosure.


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## Not any more (Mar 19, 2012)

Patty Jansen said:


> I'm always a little bit confused about how this differs from "paying for reviews". If you don't pay for the reviews (i.e. they're not guaranteed), then what are you actually paying for? And also, do the readers know that authors pay for this? What actually is the service? The question applies not just to this site, but others like it.


I've used a couple of blog tour companies for this type of service. Rather than a blog tour, they actively promote your book to their blogger list as available for review. Sort of a poor man's Netgalley. I didn't get massive numbers of reviews, but got some really good ones and some bloggers who have become followers.


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

coreyjpopp said:


> Shawn,
> 
> Did you create a "squeeze page" for Kessie? Is that what she means by landing page? Can I see a sample of one of your squeeze pages?


Here is an example page: http://readingdeals.com/free-review-books/mystery-and-misadventure-by-md-hall


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

smanaher said:


> Anma, we are experimenting with pricing right now and are not locked into anything just yet, but are seeing what works and doesn't work for everyone.
> 
> Free would be the most ideal price for authors, but that doesn't always make sense business-wise.
> 
> We are trying to strike the balance of reasonable and effective at the same time.


How about a coupon for KBoarders?


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## 555aaa (Jan 28, 2014)

My non-expert suggestion:

Review guys (and gals): why don't you change your business model so that (a) you reward reviewers who can predict how well a book will sell (and cull out reviewers who don't know what they are doing), and (b) become editorial review services. Focus and market your business on what a good job your reviewers do at discovering new talent. That means having keeping track of what your reviewers said and then how well the book did, and being open and public about it. Randomly giving away books to random people I don't think is going to cut it any more, because the average Kindle book review is over 4.5 stars, and as books go UP in sales rank, the review averages tend to go down.

As much as people hate Kirkus, the reason they still are in business is that they have (some) credibility. When a book sucks, they say so.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

I just pulled the trigger on the HungryAuthors service ($25) for _The Antiterrorist_. They are pretty technologically backward. For example, you can't fill out a form, you just have someone email you.

ReadingDeals looks like a more polished operation. The $39 seems high, but only because the former price of $19 set an "anchor point" in my mind.

I'm hoping this will work well for that book, since it's only 15K words.


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## BWFoster78 (Jun 18, 2015)

I paid the $39 for this service last week, and thus far, I'm unimpressed.  As of Friday's report, a grand total of one reader is working on my book.  Maybe they'll eventually get me the promised 10 reviews, but I think that doing it in 4 to 6 months (their estimate) isn't worth the price point to me.

I'd gladly pay that much (or even more) if they delivered in 4 to 6 weeks with at least a few coming in the first couple of weeks, but 4 to 6 months just isn't timely enough to provide what I personally need.

Update: About a week in, and that one reader has come through with a review.  That's good, at least, but unless there is a huge uptick in downloads this week, I still feel the service isn't worth what I paid.


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## SasgoraBooks (Aug 27, 2015)

The $39 price tag is pretty steep in my opinion. Honestly I'd try the service at $19, but I'm very hesitant to spend more than that on something that might very well serve up zero results. The service is too new and untested to justify the doubling of the price point, especially looking at who your target clients are. Indies who are struggling for reviews are pinching pennies and making sure everthing they spend has a potential ROI.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

DarkarNights said:


> The $39 price tag is pretty steep in my opinion. Honestly I'd try the service at $19, but I'm very hesitant to spend more than that on something that might very well serve up zero results. The service is too new and untested to justify the doubling of the price point, especially looking at who your target clients are. Indies who are struggling for reviews are pinching pennies and making sure everthing they spend has a potential ROI.


Mr. Manaher, tear down this wall (between you and your potential customers).


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## Maria Romana (Jun 7, 2010)

I've used "review-finding" services in the past and been very satisfied with them. A couple are no longer effective or no longer in business, which shows that it's not an easy business to operate, probably because of Amazon's heavy-handed rules. At least one service used to offer a sweepstakes-type prize for their reviewers as an incentive, and apparently, Amazon threatened to pull all their reviews for doing this, so they stopped. Then they went out of business. I just don't see a problem with it, as others mentioned upthread. Reviewing books is hard, time-consuming work and why shouldn't people be compensated for it? That's why traditional newspaper-type reviewers always got paid for what they did. While that's clearly a slippery slope, the idea of paying a service to do all the leg work for you, shouldn't be. To me, paying somebody to go out and get honest reviews for you is no different than paying somebody to proofread or do a cover for you.


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## Guest (Nov 3, 2015)

Maria Romana said:


> I've used "review-finding" services in the past and been very satisfied with them. A couple are no longer effective or no longer in business, which shows that it's not an easy business to operate, probably because of Amazon's heavy-handed rules. At least one service used to offer a sweepstakes-type prize for their reviewers as an incentive, and apparently, Amazon threatened to pull all their reviews for doing this, so they stopped. Then they went out of business. I just don't see a problem with it, as others mentioned upthread. Reviewing books is hard, time-consuming work and why shouldn't people be compensated for it? That's why traditional newspaper-type reviewers always got paid for what they did. While that's clearly a slippery slope, the idea of paying a service to do all the leg work for you, shouldn't be. To me, paying somebody to go out and get honest reviews for you is no different than paying somebody to proofread or do a cover for you.


Again, the issue is not that a reviewer is compensated per se. The issue is when said compensation is not disclosed or is not clear. And if I am remembering correctly, the service you described that offered the raffle was problematic because the AUTHOR was paying for the raffle and the raffles were book specific (review book X and win a prize). This was essentially the author paying the reviewer. If, on the other hand, the service had just held a weekly or monthly raffle independent of specific books (for example, everyone who wrote a review in May is entered in the drawing) there probably wouldn't have been a problem. And yes, the service should have been paying for the prize (and calculating that expense into their cost structure) to avoid any appearance of impropriety.

I don't disagree with you that paying a service to identify reviewers is a legitimate business expense. But one of the issues is that too many review services are either A. Just selling fake reviews from fake accounts or B. have no check system in place to vet qualified reviews and are simply free book distribution services that play a numbers game.


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

BWFoster78, thanks for the feedback on your experience so far and I truly appreciate your honest assessment of what you feel you are / are not getting.  

While it probably doesn't help right now, I can say that we are continually working to improve the service to specifically reduce the time it takes for a book to be read and reviewed.

In short as we continue to invest in bringing in new readers this is having the direct impact on # of reviews completed each day = faster results.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

smanaher said:


> While it probably doesn't help right now, I can say that we are continually working to improve the service to specifically reduce the time it takes for a book to be read and reviewed.


Free cocaine with each book request.


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## BWFoster78 (Jun 18, 2015)

> BWFoster78, thanks for the feedback on your experience so far and I truly appreciate your honest assessment of what you feel you are / are not getting.


Shawn,

First of all, thank you very much for responding. From a customer service perspective, the fact that you are responsive to feedback is very welcome.



> While it probably doesn't help right now, I can say that we are continually working to improve the service to specifically reduce the time it takes for a book to be read and reviewed.


My problem here is that you seem to be understanding of the fact that the service you're offering isn't quite up to the standards that your customers are expecting. If you're not willing to discount your price for the service, maybe you should at least be more upfront about the services limitations prior to your potential customers submitting payment.



> In short as we continue to invest in bringing in new readers this is having the direct impact on # of reviews completed each day = faster results.


This makes it sound like you're only pursuing one possible course of correcting the deficiency. It seems to me like there are three solutions you could be considering:

1. The one you're working on - increase the number of reviewers.

2. Increase the quantity/speed that each reviewer is providing. Can you incentivize reviewing without violating Amazon's TOS? If not, can you do anything to encourage more reviewing?

3. Decrease the number of books up for review. If you've got a backlog of books running 4 to 6 months, perhaps you should stop accepting new books until some of the backlog clears?

Just some thoughts.

Thanks.

Brian


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## cwashburn (May 20, 2013)

What if a company offering a review service had employees on staff whose job duties involved reading and reviewing books.  The connection between any particular author and the reviewer is more tenuous, if it exists at all.


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

BWFoster78 said:


> 2. Increase the quantity/speed that each reviewer is providing. Can you incentivize reviewing without violating Amazon's TOS? If not, can you do anything to encourage more reviewing?
> 
> 3. Decrease the number of books up for review. If you've got a backlog of books running 4 to 6 months, perhaps you should stop accepting new books until some of the backlog clears?


Thanks Brian, really great ideas!

2. This is something we are working towards and see that as a great way to improve results... I like the idea of gamification for readers where they earn awards, badges, swag, etc. without it being a direct incentive and again amazon TOS...

3. We've considered this and for a few reasons have determined it's not an we'll pursue... One reason is the recent uptick in readers for the club should reduce times for complete so we won't have to curb new books coming in.

Thanks for taking the time to give your feedback on all this!


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

cwashburn said:


> What if a company offering a review service had employees on staff whose job duties involved reading and reviewing books. The connection between any particular author and the reviewer is more tenuous, if it exists at all.


I've given this as a consideration, but like the more organic approach in having no compensation associated with reviews being completed.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

Trying a promo with them, any other experiences on the review side?  I'd hope to get more than 1 review for nearly 40 bucks.  If there was a 'golden' review service, it wouldn't be hard to book us authors LOL. Organically I have no idea why some folks review and some don't.  Both of my books that have well over 1k copies out there have 5 reviews and 14 reviews.  The 5 reviews are over five months and the 14 are over a month and a half.  Go figure.


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## Saul Tanpepper (Feb 16, 2012)

I subbed CONTAIN to ReadingDeals this past spring. Reviews have been slow coming in, but they have come in. I'm up to 8 out of 11 requests for the book. It's hard being patient, but I'd use the service again.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

Saul Tanpepper said:


> I'm up to 8 out of 11 requests for the book.


Do you mean that you've gotten 11 requests for a free copy of the book, and you've had 8 reviews from those people?


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## Saul Tanpepper (Feb 16, 2012)

TromboneAl said:


> Do you mean that you've gotten 11 requests for a free copy of the book, and you've had 8 reviews from those people?


That's correct


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## CourtneyHunt71 (Sep 3, 2015)

Hi,

I used reading deals for my first contemporary romance novel, Forever a Bridesmaid. I received 13 reviews fairly quickly (within about 4 weeks). 

Though I liked the service much better when it was $19 (as it was for Forever), I did just sign up my second release for another round of reviews at the $39 price. 

Just my experience as a happy customer. No affiliation and YMMV.

Courtney


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

I signed up yesterday--couldn't wait for a sale. Nice setup, Shawn. Nice landing page:










It's a slight misrepresentation, since the image makes the book look like a hardcover book although it is only available as an ebook.

I'm using it for Antiterrorist, which is a 15K word book. Perhaps I'll get more reviewers since it's so short.

When I mailed out books for GoodReads giveaways, I was essentially spending $20/review, and Goodreads Reviews = Amazon Reviews - 1 star. I won't do that again.

LibraryThing giveaways are working well, however.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

Geez Al, 92 reviews!  My book out a bit longer than yours is sitting at 16  

What did you do to get to 92?  Most of them are good too, you have a 4.5 rating, not bad!  Share your secret!!


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

What do you all think of a more streamlined landing page design such as this?


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## Kessie Carroll (Jan 15, 2014)

Can a person who has signed up to receive reviews also sign up for the newsletter, and look for books to read and review? Another service I tried didn't allow authors to both post books and review books. I didn't know this until the system locked me out and demanded that I pay money to unlock my account. I don't want to do that with ReadingDeals.


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## smanaher (Dec 2, 2013)

Kessie Carroll said:


> Can a person who has signed up to receive reviews also sign up for the newsletter, and look for books to read and review? Another service I tried didn't allow authors to both post books and review books. I didn't know this until the system locked me out and demanded that I pay money to unlock my account. I don't want to do that with ReadingDeals.


Go for it! I don't see an issue with that. Authors are readers and have an equally veracious appetite for books.


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## SA_Soule (Sep 8, 2011)

Anma Natsu said:


> To me it is an interesting quandry. We can legally and ethically buy presumably honest reviews from Publisher's Weekly, Kirkus, Self-Publishing Review, and BlueInk Reviews, which charge in the hundreds of dollars for their reviews. It's only when it's someone charging sane rates for that honest review that it is consider illegal and unethical. I don't mean the fake ones Amazon is going after, but just "for $20, I'll read and post an honest review" type systems. The argument is usually "well it can't be honest if you paid for it" and yet the presumption is that the hundreds spent on the others is somehow more honest? In some ways indie reviewers have the same stigma we indie authors have - that because it's cheaper it must not be as good or valuable.


All very good and valid points! If you buy a review from someone, like on Fiverr, and the person does actually read the book and post an honest review, is that illegal? I wouldn't think so if sites such as Kirkus Reviews are doing it.

Where does the line get drawn?


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2015)

Sherry_Soule said:


> All very good and valid points! If you buy a review from someone, like on Fiverr, and the person does actually read the book and post an honest review, is that illegal? I wouldn't think so if sites such as Kirkus Reviews are doing it. Where does the line get drawn?


AGAIN, the issue is not payment per se. The issue is FAILURE to disclose. People keep glossing over this very obvious part of the law. If the relationship between the endorser and endorsee is not obvious or apparent, it must be disclosed. Kirkus discloses the fact they charge a fee for their reviews and does not make an effort to hide that fact. In addition, Kirkus does not post their reviews to Amazon as "customer reviews." They only post them on their own publications. People who read Kirkus publications know that they charge for some of their reviews, and thus there is full disclosure.

I guy on Fiverr is not disclosing the fact that he was paid. In fact, those sellers often go to great efforts to HIDE the fact that they were paid. They use fake accounts. They require you reimburse them for the cost of the book in order to make it a "verified purchase." They go to great lengths to pretend that they are organic customers. THAT falsehood is the crime. Not the payment itself.

This is not a gray area. It is actually crystal clear. People are just ignoring the prime issue of disclosure.


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## Nancy_G (Jun 22, 2015)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> AGAIN, the issue is not payment per se. The issue is FAILURE to disclose. People keep glossing over this very obvious part of the law. If the relationship between the endorser and endorsee is not obvious or apparent, it must be disclosed. Kirkus discloses the fact they charge a fee for their reviews and does not make an effort to hide that fact. In addition, Kirkus does not post their reviews to Amazon as "customer reviews." They only post them on their own publications. People who read Kirkus publications know that they charge for some of their reviews, and thus there is full disclosure.
> 
> I guy on Fiverr is not disclosing the fact that he was paid. In fact, those sellers often go to great efforts to HIDE the fact that they were paid. They use fake accounts. They require you reimburse them for the cost of the book in order to make it a "verified purchase." They go to great lengths to pretend that they are organic customers. THAT falsehood is the crime. Not the payment itself.
> 
> This is not a gray area. It is actually crystal clear. People are just ignoring the prime issue of disclosure.


I definitely agree with this, because I used a review service that was free, but if you wanted it expedited, as most authors do, then to pay $6.00 and it will be done faster. Of course you want it done faster, so pay the measly 6.00 and bam, there ya go. Now, the interesting part is this reviewer did both of my books, got the review up there, and then a couple of weeks later, they were gone. I'm thinking Amazon took them down because no disclosure of anything was put in there, and I'm sure Amazon know his service by now. They must disclose.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

Salvador Mercer said:


> Geez Al, 92 reviews! My book out a bit longer than yours is sitting at 16
> 
> What did you do to get to 92? Most of them are good too, you have a 4.5 rating, not bad! Share your secret!!


You know something, I'm not completely sure.

I've given away 8,170 copies over the course of thirteen one-day promos.

I've frequently discounted it to 99 cents.

I had a goodreads giveaway, something I no longer recommend.

I had one LibraryThing giveaway (ten winners).

I contacted Amazon reviewers, but I think I only got a few reviews that way.

I've been generous with my newsletter subscribers.

I have a fun ending. I think that helps with reviews.

-------------

It's funny, it's been stuck at 92 for quite a while, but I'm not complaining.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

smanaher said:


> What do you all think of a more streamlined landing page design such as this?


I think that's good. Here's one reason. On the current page it says.

"You can read this book for free, in exchange for an honest review."

That's okay, and it fits within Amazon's guidelines, but it _sounds like_ buying a review. That is, the club really works like this: you get free books, and you are encouraged to write a review. The current version implies that you must write a review.

So, I like the streamlined version because that whole issue is avoided.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

TromboneAl said:


> You know something, I'm not completely sure.
> 
> I've given away 8,170 copies over the course of thirteen one-day promos.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the effort. The 8k giveaways has to help. I think I'm at around 1.2k.

Now, why not recommend the Goodread Giveaways? I got one starting on the 11th and now you got me worried


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## Patty Jansen (Apr 5, 2011)

Salvador Mercer said:


> Thanks for the effort. The 8k giveaways has to help. I think I'm at around 1.2k.
> 
> Now, why not recommend the Goodread Giveaways? I got one starting on the 11th and now you got me worried


Because you've got two different principles working here at once.

With the goodreads giveaway you're applying the principle of scarcity, which only works as a method of publicity if you're a big name or you're giving away something that a lot of people want. What people are actually doing is randomly entering every single giveaway in the hope of getting free books. Say someone won your book, and happened to actually like it, this person might write a review. This is a terribly inefficient way of garnering reviews.

Seeing as freebie giveaways garner about 1 review for every 1000 copies given away, you're got to put out as many as you possibly can, and apply the principle of abundance, until every single damn reader has a copy of this one damn book.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

Patty Jansen said:


> Seeing as freebie giveaways garner about 1 review for every 1000 copies given away, you're got to put out as many as you possibly can, and apply the principle of abundance, until every single damn reader has a copy of this one damn book.


I like your damn attitude 

So for review gathering, not so good, but to get eyes on the prize and to populate the to be reads and other stuff, I think the GR giveaway would be fine then, unless we are both not understanding Al.

Btw Patty, I got 387 downloads and another 2 sales (14 total) from your promo. When you sent your email update with the tallys I think your high was below mine which makes me wonder how my book will do on its upcoming free promo if it was either the #1 downloaded book on your promo day or pretty close to it?


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## Guest (Nov 8, 2015)

Salvador Mercer said:


> Thanks for the effort. The 8k giveaways has to help. I think I'm at around 1.2k.
> 
> Now, why not recommend the Goodread Giveaways? I got one starting on the 11th and now you got me worried


For me, it was just not worth it. The cost/expensive of the giveaway for what will likely be 0 reviews just leaves it an expensive way to give some people your book. When I did one, giving away 5 copies, it cost me $100 for the copies + shipping. For that much, might as well just do a NetGalley coop for a month or two  LibraryThing giveaways are at least eBooks, so no cost to you other than time, and might at least pull in a few reviews.


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## Monique (Jul 31, 2010)

Bards and Sages (Julie) said:


> AGAIN, the issue is not payment per se. The issue is FAILURE to disclose.


Disclosure is important and often glossed over, but payment in any form other than a free product is not allowed on Amazon. So payment is a rather important factor.


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## Nancy_G (Jun 22, 2015)

I'm currently in a GR giveaway ending on the 18th. What it has done for me is get it onto reader's to-read lists, giving me 5 pages' worth of people spreading the word for my book. I only have one copy, so total will be around $10 cost with shipping. Not bad. I also have one in LibraryThing for one copy of Black 21 that's doing pretty well and ending about the same time GR is, so will just mail off two copies and be done with it. I've also used LibraryThing for my ebook copies and have gotten a few reviews, hoping to get a couple of more. I really like using them.

A few bloggers are getting ready to interview me; one will be doing a Woman Crush Wednesday, Indie Style and has me lined up. I have the questions, just need to get to them. She has reviewed my first book. I have a few others that want to read my sequel coming out this month and want to interview me. There's so many ways. I love using my website to attract bloggers by interacting with them on their blogs.

So, anyway, definitely use Goodreads and LibraryThing for giveaways! I will definitely be using them for my next book.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

Salvador Mercer said:


> Now, why not recommend the Goodread Giveaways? I got one starting on the 11th and now you got me worried


I gave away a total of forty-three books via GoodReads (_Contact Us_). Whether I printed the books and shipped them myself, or shipped via CreateSpace, the cost was about $8 per book. Based on the percentage of people who wrote a review, the cost came out to $20 / review.

But worse, the reviews resulting from GoodReads were more critical. I'd been warned about that.

True, I generated interest and got the books onto TBR piles, but I have no way of knowing if that made a difference.

The LibraryThing eBook giveaways, OTOH, cost nothing, and I've gotten good reviews from them (_The Antiterrorist_).


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

Thanks for sharing Al, I'll have to look into this Library Thing.


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## TromboneAl (Mar 20, 2015)

So far I've had one person request the book via ReadingDeals, and no reviews yet. Just reporting the status, no judgement yet.


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## Indecisive (Jun 17, 2013)

I've had a few new reviews come in lately, all on the short side, but reviews are reviews (two were good, one was bad due partly (mostly?) to technical issues that no one else seems to have had with it). I think I'm up to 6/10, many months after signing up.


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## Guest (Nov 23, 2015)

Monique said:


> Disclosure is important and often glossed over, but payment in any form other than a free product is not allowed on Amazon. So payment is a rather important factor.


It is not allowed under Customer Reviews. The Amazon TOS is specific to customer reviews. It does not apply to Editorial Reviews, which are entered as part of the book metadata and description. This is why I keep stressing the difference. A Kirkus review is not the same thing as a customer review, and thus comparing the two in a "How come I can do X but not Y?" argument is not relevant. I LOATHE Kirkus, because they charge ridiculous fees to indies for a service they give trade pubs for free, and they treat indies like second-class citizens. I don't want anyone to think I condone the behaviour. But my point is that claiming "Kirkus reviews don't get taken down" has no real bearing on the discussion because those reviews don't get disguised as consumer reviews and they don't go to great efforts to hide the fact that the reviews are paid. They aren't creating fake accounts, "buying" the book to get the 'verified purchase" badge, etc.


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## AliceS (Dec 28, 2014)

Thanks to everyone for their opinions and experiences. This has been very helpful. My last Goodreads giveaway garnered no reviews. Last year I tried Story Cartel and that didn't work for my mystery. Maybe because it was a book 2, but written as a standalone. Or maybe that group just didn't like cozies

Since I am so low on reviews, all the good promotion sites won't take me. So I've decided to try the ReadingDeals thing to try to build it up a little. My marketing budget is practically non-existent so I have to make sure my ROI is high. 

I'm going to submit the first book in a scifi series. Fingers crossed!


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## scifi365 (Sep 12, 2014)

OK, look. They make you jump through a few hoops to be a reviewer and get access to 'free' books. I've no problem with how they are approaching this. I have a PDF on my Kindle app with a code that would finalise my acceptance into the review program. I'm not going to do it. I just don't have time to actually review the books in a fair way.

That being said, it's not against Amazon's TOS. They're trying to add value to their offer for authors. I like 'em for both of those things. They are doing some smart stuff to differentiate themselves for their competitors (including myself) and if you get a few extra reviews, that's fantastic.  The disclosure issue is a matter of wording ('I received this in exchange for an honest review') and they've been pretty solid with making that clear.

As I said previously, I chose not to jump the final hurdle because I, being honest, just don't have the time to fulfill my part of the bargain: reviewing the book (good or bad) I've got free. 

I'm not sure of their core audience (I'm subscribed as a reader, but rarely click the books they've chosen) but ReadingDeals are trying to provide some extra value. That's to be applauded, not criticised. I think if you write to their main audience, then you'll do well with this. I'd very much like a ReadingDeals.com rep to say - "yeah, we're really strong with YA paranormal but rubbish with hard SF (these are just examples) and if you're writing in genres X, Y and Z, we've got some extra value for you."

As a competitor, I like what they're doing. My understanding is that they've spoken with Amazon and their review thing doesn't breach TOS. I suspect, like all of the eBook deals sites out there (not ours, we're just S.F), they have strengths and weaknesses in terms of their audience and the books they buy. I suggest you email them and say 'hey, my book is in such and such a genre, can you really help' and see whether they've got something to help. 

Over the next two years, there's going to be a lot of consolidation (for consolidation read: giving up/going out of business) in the eBook deals mailing list market. ReadingDeals, BookBub, BookBarbarian and ourselves are going to be among the survivors because we all have a different value proposition from the norm.


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## Not any more (Mar 19, 2012)

For those spending money and thinking it's worth it to land on GR readers' TBR, I suggest you take a good look at the people on GR. Having a couple of thousand books on a TBR list is nothing. More than 2000 GR members have my books on their TBR lists. Many add a couple of hundred books a week.


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## AliceS (Dec 28, 2014)

brkingsolver said:


> For those spending money and thinking it's worth it to land on GR readers' TBR, I suggest you take a good look at the people on GR. Having a couple of thousand books on a TBR list is nothing. More than 2000 GR members have my books on their TBR lists. Many add a couple of hundred books a week.


I have to agree. I tried to work thru the system on GR but I don't think I've ever gotten a bump from it. In fact I posted a free-for-review and got attacked for daring to want anything in return for a gift. I was stumped and tried to have a polite discussion, but they felt no obligation to review a free book. On a site that is all about reviews  And my last giveaway, 10 books, resulted in 0 reviews so far. One person that received it has my book in her TBR. So I've given up on GR as a promotion site. I still use it for my personal database of books read and want to read, however.


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## Decon (Feb 16, 2011)

I haven't used them because I think that $39 is on the steep side from some of the results I've read. The reason I say that is that authors are pretty desperate to get reviews as without them they are precluded from many of the free sites because of a lack of reviews, me included and it is tapping in on that desperation as a price point. I could understand it if authors quickly garnered the 10 reviews, but I just would not pay that kind of money on a kiss and a promise. Saying that, I accept it is a legitimate business and they are free to charge what they will. Also, for some, it will work far quicker than some have reported.

For the UK, I have used bookhippo which is FREE to participate. So far I have five ARCs out with their readers for review and I've had one back already and posted on Amazon. I also get the email to send the ARCs myself, so I can build a list of possible future reviewers. The site will get the benefit when I garner sufficient reviews to pay them for a free promotion, which makes more sense, because the requests seem to be automated anyway when the reader ticks their box for a copy.


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## Indecisive (Jun 17, 2013)

Just to report in, I have now gotten my 10 reviews. They were mostly on the short side and were all over the place in terms of ratings (2 or 3-star to 5 star, most at 4-star like the other reviews on this book, though). I guess I think that it was worth it, but it did take a long time, over 6 months.


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## AliceS (Dec 28, 2014)

EF5 said:


> ... To me, paying for reviews to show up as verified purchases in the customer review section of a book's page (no matter how it's dressed up in the language) is usually an indication that some or all of the above aspects need improvement because if none of those needed improvement you wouldn't need to pay anyone to review your book, you'd already have a customer base you'd built organically.
> 
> There are no shortcuts to success.


I agree with much of what you say, but sales don't always turn into reviews. Apparently a lot of people who read my books don't like to review them. I've got KENPS every day on my book that only has 2 reviews. So I am unable to get the better advertising. This is a solution to find a few more eyes on my books, but specifically eyes that will review.


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## AliceS (Dec 28, 2014)

coreyjpopp said:


> Has anyone used ReadingDeals.com organic reviews service (http://readingdeals.com/reviews)? Can you tell me a little about your results? I'm tempted, but I'm thinking I should wait for a few of my book blogger reviews to come back prior to seeking a service like this. Your thoughts and opinions matter to me!


I used them for my apocalyptic scifi and got nada. On the upside, since no one even requested my book, I got a full refund. Since then, I've done a little better and I now have 15 reviews, mostly 5 star. I think most of them came from a free promo I ran.


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