# PW wifi error



## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I got my PW yesterday and set it up including wifi. This morning I switched it to airplane mode to conserve battery. Just now I switched it back to check something in the store. The first annoyance is it doesn't remember the password for my home network so I apparently have to enter it in every time which is a nuisance. Then it says it can't connect. The wifi is working fine though as I'm using it now with this computer and watching tv through it as well. So

1. How do you make it remember the password for your home network?

2. What do you do when it suddenly won't connect to a functioning wifi network?


----------



## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I normally leave my WiFi on all the time on my PW. But, on occasion, for testing here on the forum OR when the battery did get low, I turned Airplane Mode on.  I've never had to re-enter the password.  EDIT:  Just tested again...the PW reconnected with the network without prompting or entering a password.

Generally, if one of your devices is having trouble connecting to a network, even if others can access the network, try restarting the device.  (Hold the power button on the PW until the device shuts off.  Wait three seconds, press the power button.)  If that doesn't work, try restarting the router.  Yes, even though the other devices can connect.

Restarting the device/and or restarting the router might help with the PW forgetting the password, too.  Off to poke around on mine.

Betsy


----------



## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I tried turning it off for a few seconds before posting. I tried again, this time waiting 30 seconds or so before turning it back on. No joy either time. I'll try resetting the router in a little while when the DVR isn't recording through it. If there were two units out of an entire batch with a problem that would be one that's mine and one that would have been my dad's. Thanks.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

LDB said:


> I tried turning it off for a few seconds before posting. I tried again, this time waiting 30 seconds or so before turning it back on. No joy either time. I'll try resetting the router in a little while when the DVR isn't recording through it. If there were two units out of an entire batch with a problem that would be one that's mine and one that would have been my dad's. Thanks.


To be sure, Leo, I'm not talking about simply turning it off. I wasn't very clear ealrier. Press and hold the power button for thirty seconds. Count 'em off. When you release, the Kindle should flash and you should see the tree as it reboots. I misspoke, you shouldn't have to push the power button again, it should come back on.

Betsy


----------



## crebel (Jan 15, 2009)

I don't have a PW here to check with (DH stole mine and I have gone back to using KK), but isn't there some sort of parental control under the settings that will require you to enter the password every time to connect?  Maybe that is toggled on and would be the answer to your question #1.

If a restart of your PW and/or router doesn't solve the connectivity problem after your password is entered, I would call Kindle customer service.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Well, when you turn that on for the first time, you have to give it the password you want to use.  It sounds like he's having to enter the router password; unless he uses the same password everywhere, it would be unlikely that he set up his Kindle that way.

Betsy


----------



## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I'm sorry, I wasn't clear earlier. I thought I had reset it earlier, holding the power button for what seemed like a long time and then waiting a few seconds before restarting. I didn't get the tree so it wasn't as long as I thought. I just did a real reset, getting the tree this time. It still didn't reset the wifi though. And yes, it's the password for the router I'm having to enter every time I try to connect. When I set it up originally I don't remember anything about parental controls and I didn't activate the system password. I'll try resetting the router in a few minutes when it's idle.


----------



## Morf (Nov 18, 2010)

You shouldn't need to input your password more than once, so if you have to do there's something wrong. It may be prompting for the password because it's having problems connecting, rather than because it's forgotten it, so let's focus on getting it to connect first - I think the password problem might then go away.

As suggested above, start with a restart of the PW, and if that doesn't help reboot your router.

The best way to restart a PW (or any other Kindle) is via the menu...

Home, Menu, Settings, Menu, Restart (not Reset Device!).

If that still doesn't help, check the firmware version (Home, Menu, Settings, Menu, Device Info), and if it's not 5.3.1 then install this version which has some wifi fixes, see http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_left_cn?ie=UTF8&nodeId=201064850.


----------



## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

Resetting the router took care of it. Lessons learned so far include

1. always check for sub menus as touching restart is much easier than trying to hold the power button for 30 seconds

2. even though after a few hours of charging until the light turns green suggesting a fully charged battery when the battery meter drops what visually appears to be either 20 or 25 percent in one day do not switch to airplane mode and upset the very fragile wifi system

Thanks for all the help. I appreciate it.


----------



## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

FWIW, the few times I've had wifi connection problems, I would do a re-scan for the network.  If it showed it but didn't want to connect, I'd tell it to forget and then set it up again. . . .but that's not an everyday occurrence . . . .just now and then when it's showing as connected but books that I've sent aren't showing up.  More often simply toggling it off and then back on sorts it.

How old is your router -- some have reported that ones more than a few years old occasionally have problem seeing kindle. Or rather vice versa, I guess.  Even if all their other wireless devices were connecting happily. If you continue to have the problem you might want to splurge on something newer.   'Course, if it's already new. . .that's not going to help.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

LDB said:


> Resetting the router took care of it. Lessons learned so far include
> 
> 1. always check for sub menus as touching restart is much easier than trying to hold the power button for 30 seconds


Yeah, I should have told you about the menu thingy. That's more gentle on the system anyway. My bad.



> 2. even though after a few hours of charging until the light turns green suggesting a fully charged battery when the battery meter drops what visually appears to be either 20 or 25 percent in one day do not switch to airplane mode and upset the very fragile wifi system
> 
> Thanks for all the help. I appreciate it.


I really don't think the battery level had anything to do with the WiFi issue, though Morf will probably know more.

Glad you got it working, Leo!

Betsy


----------



## Morf (Nov 18, 2010)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> ...though Morf will probably know more.


Stitched up again! 

No, I don't think the battery had anything to do with it. The fast discharge on the first day of use is not uncommon, because (1) Lithium batteries discharge quicker for the first couple of charge cycles, (2) the Kindle has to index the books you copy onto it which uses the battery quicker (the indexing runs even when the Kindle is asleep).

Check that indexing is complete: search for a nonsense string of characters, you should get "not found", it will tell you if any books are unindexed. Don't worry unless this lasts for a couple of days.

Personally, I leave my PW in airplane mode all the time to save the battery and only turn wireless on when I need it. I know other people on here don't!

Check the firmware version, they haven't said exactly what they've fixed wifi-wise in 5.3.1 but you are always best to have the latest, it's very easy to do.


----------



## backslidr (Nov 23, 2012)

I used to have that problem with my Touch where it sometimes couldn't recognize my router. My Paperwhite though is fine. I do have to enter my router password whenever I switch back from 3G. It remembers it okay when I switch back and forth from WiFi and Airplane mode, but not after using 3G. I'm not sure if that's normal or not, but it's not that bad since I'm usually on WiFi.


----------



## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I have 93 items on the PW right now. I just did a search for gibberish and got no items found. I didn't think the battery had anything to do with it, just that it was going down rapidly and I thought I'd slow it down. Mine is a wifi only so I won't have any 3G conflicts. I'll probably just leave it alone and charge more frequently as needed rather than risk another "adventure" like this. Oh, and the router is a Uverse system router no more than a couple of years old, if that.


----------



## Morf (Nov 18, 2010)

If you put 93 items on it in the first day or so, indexing would take an hour or two and would therefore use your battery significantly (it uses the CPU a lot more than reading a book, so uses the battery a lot more).

If the gibberish test returns "no items found" then indexing is complete, and you should now find that battery usage is more as you would expect.

Don't let the battery usage over the past couple of days worry you, you should find it is a lot better from now on.

I read on my PW for at least 2 hours a day (sometimes a lot more), light is set at about 6 and wifi is off, and I charge it every couple of weeks or so.


----------



## KOHb (Jan 18, 2013)

LDB said:


> I got my PW yesterday and set it up including wifi. This morning I switched it to airplane mode to conserve battery. Just now I switched it back to check something in the store. The first annoyance is it doesn't remember the password for my home network so I apparently have to enter it in every time which is a nuisance. Then it says it can't connect. The wifi is working fine though as I'm using it now with this computer and watching tv through it as well. So
> 
> 1. How do you make it remember the password for your home network?
> 
> 2. What do you do when it suddenly won't connect to a functioning wifi network?


*Why kindle "loosing the password" and internet connection issue*

After having numbers of discussion with Kindle (eInk) tech-support, eventually I was able to get the truth about Kindle and it's wifi:
Please understand there is the difference between WiFi network and Internet (connection to WiFi network). Unfortunately not all people in Amazon tech-support know the difference.

When kindle is connecting to WiFi first it trying to connect to amazon's servers via internet. If connection was *not *successful, kindle misinform the user asking to enter the password again. This issue can be verified by connecting to WiFi while local network has internet access. After connection established disabling i-net access at WiFi LAN causing kindle disconnection from WiFi within 5-15 minutes with prompt to enter the password.

After you managed successfully connect to WiFi (when i-net was OK) later, in case of i-net disconnection (for example you i-net provider is down), kindle disconnects form the WiFi and will ask the password for WiFi connection.
Such Wi-Fi deficiency is not disclosed by Amazon.com and today tech support confirmed that this is the deliberately designed feature.

See http://wiki.mobileread.com/wiki/FAQ_Amazon_Kindle#WiFi_connection_issues

I did not investigated and I don't know what information kindle sending to Amazon.com


----------



## Morf (Nov 18, 2010)

OK, so the Kindle confirms a good wifi connection by trying to connect to the Amazon servers.

If it can't connect to the servers, this could be:

1) A wifi problem,
2) A router problem,
3) A broadband cable problem,
4) An ISP problem,
5) An Amazon problem.
6) Something else, maybe the data fairies are on strike!...

...but in all these cases, the Kindle simply asks for the wifi password again, leading you to think it's a wifi problem.

That's very interesting information, KOHb, thanks for sharing it with us!  

I'll remember it in future when people ask about this problem.


----------



## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

I have sometimes lost connection -- though the wifi still seems to be on. Sometimes I've been told it couldn't connect; sometimes it just hasn't d/l'd books that I know it should have. In those cases (after confirming my home network does see the internet) I just toggle wifi off and back on, it remembers the password, reconnects and all is well.

Occasionally that doesn't work but a full restart does.

If a restart doesn't work, I assume it's an Amazon problem; I just wait a bit and try again.

But I've never been asked to re-enter my password unless I'd just reset it to factory state for some reason, or had told the kindle to forget my network first. 

Of course, if MY router isn't getting out to the world, that's a different problem. I've not had Kindle prompt me for a password in that case, it just connects and nothing happens. 

If the modem shows signal I do the old "unplug it all and then plug it back in" thing. That usually works. 

If there's no signal at the modem, well _there's your problem!_  If temporarily unplugging the modem doesn't trigger anything I contact the ISP provider and usually hear a recorded message that there's an outage in my area.

I kind of feel like if your kindle keeps asking you for the router password then either you haven't entered it correctly or you have a problem with your Kindle or your router.

I also think it's possible that Kindle doesn't always play well with older routers. I know some android based devices have trouble staying connected to older ones, depending on the security it's using.

But, as I've never actually experienced that, maybe I'm mistaken. I admit I don't know nearly as much about this sort of thing as Morf. For me, if it works, I'm happy and I don't look further unless it STOPS working!  Then I try the steps above. If none of them work, I seek professional help.


----------



## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

The only time I had the problem was when I switched it to airplane mode to save some battery life. Mine is wifi only so there's never any 3G activity. When I take it with me places to read while I'm eating or waiting or whatever it obviously disconnects from the wifi since it's far away but it always connects back as soon as I come back to the wifi. I haven't tried switching to airplane mode again. I just plug it in more often.


----------



## KOHb (Jan 18, 2013)

Morf said:


> OK, so the Kindle confirms a good wifi connection by trying to connect to the Amazon servers.


I tried to get information from Amazon.com about the reason for this, the reply was something like we "we check if the device is working properly or any of books require conversion(?)" but I understood that Amazon's does not really know the reason.



Morf said:


> If it can't connect to the servers, this could be:
> .......
> ...but in all these cases, the Kindle simply asks for the wifi password again, leading you to think it's a wifi problem.


Correct. My kindle keyboard and new Kindle (s/w ver 4.1.0) behaved exactly like this. If I disconnect internet from internal network it ask to reenter the password. If I leave network open (no password require to connect it - it report about problem to connect to network. When I enable i-net provider connection - everything file in both cases. Network monitoring during kindle connection shows the following traffic between kindle and internet:
_207.171.185.201 TCP www 
23.23.189.26 UDP 33434 
23.23.189.26 UDP 49317 
23.23.189.26 UDP 40317 
72.21.203.199 TCP https 
23.23.189.5 UDP 33434 
205.251.228.4 UDP ntp 
72.21.192.213 UDP ntp
72.21.214.151 TCP https 
72.21.203.199 TCP https 
72.21.203.199 TCP https 
72.21.211.177 TCP https _

You may see that all above are amazon's servers



Morf said:


> That's very interesting information, KOHb, thanks for sharing it with us!
> 
> I'll remember it in future when people ask about this problem.


I search the internet for almost one year (since I bought my kindle 3) trying to find some fix for this problem (I want to connect kindle to network w/o net access to use it with the *local* web server), but I cannot for the reason which is described above.
Not many people are aware about it, everyone is blaming the encryption method or something else...

This is the answer I received from kindle support :

_Hello from ....,

I am sorry we were unable to come to a positive conclusion to our conversation. Unfortunately the kindle won't connect without the Internet connection.

We do appreciate your business and hope to see you again.

Thank you for your inquiry. ...._

I hope that somebody with kindle development kit and good programming skills will be able to make the patch to fix this deficiency.


----------



## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Ah!  So what you're wanting to do is connect to a network and see other machines ON that network.  Yeah, that's not going to work.  You may see the kindle on the network from another device, but you can't do anything with it.  ALL the kindle is designed to do is access the internet.  Originally that only happened via 3G and when the added wifi capability they didn't change it.  It's still not a 'real' network device.


----------



## KOHb (Jan 18, 2013)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Ah! So what you're wanting to do is connect to a network and see other machines ON that network.


Not really. I don't want to see another clients in the network and I do not want to access their drives or any another special activity. I have ordinary web server (the server which generate the web page) and I want to access it with the kindle browser as I can do with any other web pages when i-net is connected. BTW I can access my web server but ONLY if internet is connected to my LAN.



Ann in Arlington said:


> Yeah, that's not going to work. You may see the kindle on the network from another device, but you can't do anything with it.


Sorry, this is incorrect. As I mentioned kindle refuses to connect to WiFi. Therefore we will not see kindle in the list of connected to WiFi devices.
However LOG show that kindle has been assigned the IP address by DHTP, but it was disconnected very quickly after it realize that amason's servers are un-accessible


----------



## Morf (Nov 18, 2010)

Yes, this does all make sense.

I've got Calibre set up as a web server on my PC, and I use the browser on my Kindle to connect to it and download books.

If I disconnect the cable from my router to my cable modem, I won't have an internet connection but the wireless will still be OK.

The Kindle should still be able to connect to the Calibre web server.

However, it can't - instead I get the "select a wireless network to connect to" window, and I'm sure if I then selected my own wireless again I would be prompted for the password.

So, KOHb is entirely correct, the Kindle doesn't actually check for a wireless network, it checks for internet connection.

If you had a wireless network with a proxy server (eg at work), I suspect you'd get exactly the same thing happening since you can't specify a proxy for the Kindle.

TLR summary - Kindles will only connect to a wireless network that has internet connection.


----------



## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

That's interesting Morf. Is this connection protocol the reason why you can't sort of wirelessly transfer between the kindle and other devices on a home network but need to use a physical USB connection. Or is that something different?

Another thought:  Betsy has a WiDrive and I've used it.  It is a drive that broadcasts a sort of hotspot.  The Fire, at least, will see that as a viable network and let you connect and, if you have the right app on the Fire, you can access content on that device.  Now, the WiDrive, as far as I know, doesn't have an internet connection.  It's a storage device only.  One can't access any of the rest of the internet through it, just what is on the drive.  How does that behavior gel with your conclusions above?

Note: I am in no way trying to be argumentative. . . . . . just curious, is all.


----------



## Morf (Nov 18, 2010)

OK, an interesting set of questions...

Firstly, let me explain in a bit more detail what is going on here with a Kindle connecting to wifi (and can I emphasise here, we're talking Kindles, not Fires... Fires are basically Android tablets and a completely different beast!).

When a device connects to a wifi network, it does the authentication stuff, then when authenticated the router gives it an address on the network (an IP address, something like 192.168.1.22).

At this point, the connection is complete and all other client devices (PCs, linux, Android etc) are happy. However, the Kindle then tries to connect to an Amazon server. If it connects it's happy, if it doesn't it reports the wifi connection as faulty - though it may not be!

I suspect you're right in thinking this is a throwback to the Kindle starting off as 3G only, they probably put the check in there and never rewrote it.

-----------------

So, question 1:



> Is this connection protocol the reason why you can't sort of wirelessly transfer between the kindle and other devices on a home network but need to use a physical USB connection. Or is that something different?


No, this is something completely different. Computers use different protocols to talk to each other, depending upon what they are wanting to do. A protocol is a bit like a human language - it's only any good if both people speak it, if you speak French and I don't we won't get very far!

Web browsing uses a protocol called HTTP. The Kindle has an HTTP client, and web servers have an HTTP server.

File sharing - where you connect to another PC on your network and get files from it - uses a protocol called SMB (also known as SAMBA or CIFS). Your Windows PCs have an SMB client and server, so can share files. However, the Kindle doesn't have an SMB client so it can't do. (The Fire can because Android does).

Question 2:



> Betsy has a WiDrive and I've used it. It is a drive that broadcasts a sort of hotspot. The Fire, at least, will see that as a viable network and let you connect and, if you have the right app on the Fire, you can access content on that device. Now, the WiDrive, as far as I know, doesn't have an internet connection. It's a storage device only. One can't access any of the rest of the internet through it, just what is on the drive. How does that behavior gel with your conclusions above?


You're using a Fire. The Fire does wifi checking the correct way - if it get's an IP address it is happy - because Android works this way.

I very much doubt you could get a Kindle to connect to the WiDrive, because:

a) it wouldn't see an internet connection, therefore wouldn't connect,...
b) even if it did connect, it hasn't got an SMB client so it wouldn't be able to use the WiDrive (which I'm guessing uses SMB, it may be another file sharing protocol such as NFS but the Kindle hasn't got a client for that either.)

Hope that makes sense, got to go now, time for a cup of tea!


----------



## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

That makes perfect sense, Morf.  You are a genius at explaining this complicated stuff simply!  Thanks!   Enjoy your tea -- I'm having my elevenses.


----------



## KOHb (Jan 18, 2013)

Morf said:


> Yes, this does all make sense.
> 
> TLR summary - Kindles will only connect to a wireless network that has internet connection.


Hi Morf!

Everything is exactly as you described. 100% correct.

I just want to add: It means if one day amazon disappear or decide to switch the servers OFF, or decide not to support kindles any mode, all eInk kindles, which Amazon sold, will be unable to connect to any WiFi and to the internet.

KOHb


----------



## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

True enough, but you will still be able to connect to the PC via USB and transfer books to the Kindle that way.  Unless I'm missing something.  Which could be.  

Betsy


----------



## KOHb (Jan 18, 2013)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> True enough, but you will still be able to connect to the PC via USB and transfer books to the Kindle that way. Unless I'm missing something. Which could be.
> 
> Betsy


Yes. You will be able to.


----------



## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

An interesting discussion, KOHb!  I learn something every day on KindleBoards!

Betsy


----------



## NathanH (Jan 21, 2013)

I too had this problem   Thanks for clearing it up!


----------

