# So....what's with all the stepbrother books?



## britnidanielle (Oct 13, 2013)

It's been months since I published anything  , but I'm trying to get my mojo back. My last few books have been in the New Adult genre, so I was poking around tonight to see what's hot, apparently it's stepbrothers.

I haven't read any of the books (yet), but I can almost figure out how it goes. Billionaire bad boy with an arm full of tats (this is also still a thing) and some kinda dark personality, who also happens to be the protag's stepbrother? Twisted love story like whoa. 

But...stepbrothers? I didn't see this coming. Anybody write in this niche? What's been your experience?


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## James_T (May 15, 2012)

A couple shot up the charts and the floodgates opened... what a joke on the readers.


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## NoCat (Aug 5, 2010)

Pretty sure readers know what they like...


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## 555aaa (Jan 28, 2014)

I thought the hot thing now was books about tidying up.  The life changing magic of tidying up with the hot stepbrother.

That and coloring books for grown-ups. If only there  was a way to do that on your kindle.


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## britnidanielle (Oct 13, 2013)

James_T said:


> A couple shot up the charts and the floodgates opened... what a joke on the readers.


I'm don't think it's a joke on readers if they love it and keep buying it. I just don't understand it.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

I don't read or write romance, but I'm pretty damn close to writing a book about a Billionaire Step Brother who can shape shift into a wolf and keep his tattoos on his fur in the process.  I dream about where I'll spend that money next year...


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## kathrynoh (Oct 17, 2012)

While some of it is definitely PI/taboo stuff, from what I've seen there's a lot that isn't.

The arranged marriage trope has always been popular in romance and I'd guess, since arranged marriages in a contemporary Western setting are not going to fly nowadays, it's a way of forcing the girl into close quarters with a guy she hates. She comes home from college for the holidays and finds the guy she's always fought with is living in the same house. Sparks fly... etc.


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## britnidanielle (Oct 13, 2013)

kathrynoh said:


> While some of it is definitely PI/taboo stuff, from what I've seen there's a lot that isn't.
> 
> The arranged marriage trope has always been popular in romance and I'd guess, since arranged marriages in a contemporary Western setting are not going to fly nowadays, it's a way of forcing the girl into close quarters with a guy she hates. She comes home from college for the holidays and finds the guy she's always fought with is living in the same house. Sparks fly... etc.


Yeah. I mean...people like what they like, I don't judge. I read the preview of a best-selling stepbrother book and was a little thrown off the narrator was in high school. It creeps ME out to read about minors having sex, but then again, that's just a personal thing. Maybe if I was 17 or 18 I'd be all into it, but I don't think these books are written with teens in mind? Maybe I'm wrong, though.

It's interesting to see what suddenly catches on. Billionaires. BBWs. Shape shifters. Stepbrothers. Alphas. I can't keep up.

If you can write fast and interesting stories, though, I can see how folks can make a killing. I actually WISH I had that skill to just jump into a niche and write my buns off, because people who read niche erotic romances read A LOT.


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## britnidanielle (Oct 13, 2013)

Because I was curious, I decided to count the number of Stepbrother books in the top 100. At the moment there are 7. Not bad at all.


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## Crime fighters (Nov 27, 2013)

Because I'm keen on sabotaging my own career, I shelved my step-brother idea after Stepbrother Dearest hit it big. I love writing stories that aren't being told right now, and when I see most of the authors with Step Brother books, it looks to me like they're cashing in. I don't want my readers to think that about me. 

I'll probably still publish it later this year. Maybe sooner if I can get over this mind-block.


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## britnidanielle (Oct 13, 2013)

K.B. said:


> Because I'm keen on sabotaging my own career, I shelved my step-brother idea after Stepbrother Dearest hit it big. I love writing stories that aren't being told right now, and when I see most of the authors with Step Brother books, it looks to me like they're cashing in. I don't want my readers to think that about me.
> 
> I'll probably still publish it later this year. Maybe sooner if I can get over this mind-block.


Good luck!


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## kathrynoh (Oct 17, 2012)

Salvador Mercer said:


> I don't read or write romance, but I'm pretty damn close to writing a book about a Billionaire Step Brother who can shape shift into a wolf and keep his tattoos on his fur in the process. I dream about where I'll spend that money next year...


Yeah, I'm thinking about writing a fantasy novel. I've never read the genre and know nothing about it but I'm sure if I throw a few orcs and elves in it, I'll make a ton of money.


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## LifesHumor (Feb 5, 2014)

I didn't know it was a trend until someone joked about it here and linked Stepbrother billionaire story.


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## Guest (Jun 6, 2015)

I honestly don`t think it matters. Taste is subjective and if people enjoy them, enjoy the fantasy, then great. Of course I wouldn't read them myself but I think we have to consider what people are turned on to, especially from a business point of view. It comes back to that old cliche of the starving artist. Do we suffer for our art and stick to our morals in creating, or do we sell out occasionally and go for broke. I`m guessing that's the point of pen names, to experiment in trends. If you can make a nice bit of change with it, you can fund the art projects, that magnum opus that you really believe in.
Just my two cents on the subject.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

kathrynoh said:


> Yeah, I'm thinking about writing a fantasy novel. I've never read the genre and know nothing about it but I'm sure if I throw a few orcs and elves in it, I'll make a ton of money.


Only if the female elf falls in love with the male orc


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## Lisa Blackwood (Feb 1, 2015)

Salvador Mercer said:


> Only if the female elf falls in love with the male orc


...and that would actually fit into just about any of my novels, no problem.  New story idea. 

Though, orcs are about the only creatures I don't have running around in my stories.


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## geronl (May 7, 2015)

Screams out for satire, doesn't it?


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## Roby (May 14, 2015)

There has to be something titillating and magnetic about the overtone of not-quite-incest, while still being legitimate. I mean, real incest (Jaime and Cersei Lannister) is a little too risque for mainstream, even now, and this is as close to it as someone gets, while not being squicky (which stepfather-daughter could bring on). Romance tropes may toy with the truly forbidden, but I'll bet Amazon doesn't like to.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

A KBoards author just had one in the I think top 5 of all of kindle book store. Its 18 now. 
I noticed the name and thought it was familiar and sure enough. I am only sad that us historical romance readers seemed to have lost another good one to contempo romance. Sniff  . She has some older historicals out that were re-released a while back. I think the reason it works in that case its that its a full length romance, the characters are adults, hook up and then find out their parents are getting married, making them step siblings. Its been at the top of the charts for a while now, total charts, not just romance. Its selling like hotcakes, like the earlier one did, stepbrother dearest. 

I think it might actually be the SEAL part that is the bigger draw in that case than the stepbrother thing. SEAL's are still quite popular as a trope. 

Which reminds me that I have read the theme of step siblings in historical romances over the years. All old is new again I guess.  

We readers know what we like. And especially us romance readers are pretty hardened at this point at all the sneers, stereotypes, highschool giggles. Who cares. I am sure romance writers have to grow that skin too same way. 

I just read. What I want. Thank you suppliers of my wants.


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## Rebecca Norinne Caudill (Feb 6, 2015)

Salvador Mercer said:


> I don't read or write romance, but I'm pretty damn close to writing a book about a Billionaire Step Brother who can shape shift into a wolf and keep his tattoos on his fur in the process. I dream about where I'll spend that money next year...


My friend and I joke about doing this all the time. At some point maybe we should just start writing instead of mocking. I can already see the dollar signs.


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## Salvador Mercer (Jan 1, 2015)

beckycaudill said:


> My friend and I joke about doing this all the time. At some point maybe we should just start writing instead of mocking. I can already see the dollar signs.


That is the key, to write and to try to do it every day even if it's a small amount. Over the course of a year it will add up.


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## katrina46 (May 23, 2014)

Salvador Mercer said:


> I don't read or write romance, but I'm pretty damn close to writing a book about a Billionaire Step Brother who can shape shift into a wolf and keep his tattoos on his fur in the process. I dream about where I'll spend that money next year...


You should consider it. It only has to be 5-10k long. If you'd rather do a novel release it in one 5k chapter at a time and you'll have a great Christmas this year.


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## geronl (May 7, 2015)

katrina46 said:


> You should consider it. It only has to be 5-10k long. If you'd rather do a novel release it in one 5k chapter at a time and you'll have a great Christmas this year.


Which is another point of amazement, people are paying $2.99 for these really short ones.


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## katrina46 (May 23, 2014)

James_T said:


> A couple shot up the charts and the floodgates opened... what a joke on the readers.


Or the jokes on us. While were on Kboards talking about these books the writers are to busy getting filthy stinking rotten rich.


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## geronl (May 7, 2015)

katrina46 said:


> Or the jokes on us. While were on Kboards talking about these books the writers are to busy getting filthy stinking rotten rich.


That's true


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## Ebook Itch (Mar 3, 2015)

From what the Ebook Itch editorial team has been able to figure out, the trend probably started in late 2013 as an offshoot of the New Adult craze that was going on that year. We published a blog post about the whole stepbrother romance books trend this weekend.

http://ebookitch.com/blog/on-the-stepbrother-romance-books-trend/


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## geronl (May 7, 2015)

I was skimming through Also Boughts and I swear I saw one that actually was called "Seducing My Billionaire Step-Brother"

Your step brother is a billionaire and you aren't hitting him up for an island or something, its just wrong.


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## ccruz (Oct 11, 2014)

I write stepdaughter/stepfather taboo stuff, but stepbrother is currently doing better. I've also been editing lots of stepbrother shorts.


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## geronl (May 7, 2015)

That is just something you should never to do your sister... of course if its a community property state, she might get over it. lol


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

Roby said:


> There has to be something titillating and magnetic about the overtone of not-quite-incest, while still being legitimate. I mean, real incest (Jaime and Cersei Lannister) is a little too risque for mainstream, even now, and this is as close to it as someone gets, while not being squicky (which stepfather-daughter could bring on). Romance tropes may toy with the truly forbidden, but I'll bet Amazon doesn't like to.


I've read a few blog posts and this seems to be the best explanation I've read.

I know all about the book _stepbrother dearest_ but that does not explain why there is a flood of stepbrother stories tearing up the bestsellers lists today. It does not explain why there are seven authors writing stepbrother books in the top 100 contemporary romance Amazon author ranks. 
It seems like it started with one stepbrother & stepsister getting together, now it's getting more creative with twin stepbrothers, triple stepbrothers, military stepbrothers, paranormal stepbrother & gay stepbrothers.


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## D. Zollicoffer (May 14, 2014)

Has anyone tried "Brother in Law" that could work. As long as the guy is widow/divorced from the heroine's sister lol. I'm joking, but I'n sure someone has done it. 

I may do one as a parody just to see if it sells.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

D. Zollicoffer said:


> Has anyone tried "Brother in Law" that could work. As long as the guy is widow/divorced from the heroine's sister lol. I'm joking, but I'n sure someone has done it.
> 
> I may do one as a parody just to see if it sells.


Yep Colleen Masters has written a brother in law book, after she wrote two successful stepbrother books.

http://www.amazon.com/Damaged--Law-Colleen-Masters-ebook/dp/B00UT0FNYE/ref=sr_1_5?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1435589584&sr=1-5&keywords=colleen+masters


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## Jessica R (Nov 11, 2012)

Hey, I like Clueless.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

When I wrote a series of stepbrother/sister stories back in 2012 I was selling hundreds of copies of each every month at $2.99 - until Amazon decided to slap the adult filter on anything PI. Incest has been a common theme in romance and erotica going back to ancient times. The only reason you're seeing stepbrother/stepsister stepfather/stepdaughter books is because Amazon, Apple, Google, and Kobo won't allow "real" incest stories to be published. Take a look at B&N sometime, since they basically have an "anything goes" policy.


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

D. Zollicoffer said:


> Has anyone tried "Brother in Law" that could work. As long as the guy is widow/divorced from the heroine's sister lol. I'm joking, but I'n sure someone has done it.
> 
> I may do one as a parody just to see if it sells.


I know of several in-law books. 
Just can't think of the pen names at the moment.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

i understand that real incest has been written about even in YA fiction. Incest has been talked about in historical documentaries but why is PI romance so incredibly popular at this very moment on Amazon, B&N, Smashwords or anywhere.


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

mica said:


> i understand that real incest has been written about even in YA fiction. Incest has been talked about in historical documentaries but why is PI romance so incredibly popular at this very moment on Amazon, B&N, Smashwords or anywhere.


Incest or PI is not allowed in Erotica. So the authors are turning their PI into romances to satisfy a need. It is my understanding from talking to some readers that it is very, very popular.

PI so aunt Sally doesn't throw too many tantrums.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

cinisajoy said:


> Incest or PI is not allowed in Erotica. So the authors are turning their PI into romances to satisfy a need. It is my understanding from talking to some readers that it is very, very popular.
> 
> PI so aunt Sally doesn't throw too many tantrums.


Ok but erotica readers are quite different from romance readers. Are all these readers erotica readers who are now buying PI romance? The PI romance I've read so far is more romance than erotica.

I'm just scratching my head trying to work out why PI romance became so popular in the last few months and why it is tearing up the lists. 
Some of these authors must be smiling all the way to the bank. I've just downloaded Krista Lakes stepbrother books. Looking forward to reading them.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

PI has always been allowed in erotica on Amazon. It was one of the first niches I got into and has always been one of the most profitable. They just don't want you using family/stepfamily words like stepbrother in the title if it's PI erotica.


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

mica said:


> Ok but erotica readers are quite different from romance readers. Are all these readers erotica readers who are now buying PI romance? The PI romance I've read so far is more romance than erotica.
> 
> I'm just scratching my head trying to work out why PI romance became so popular in the last few months and is tearing up the lists.
> Some of these authors must be smiling all the way to the bank. I've just downloaded Krista Lakes stepbrother books. Looking forward to reading them.


It is my understanding that romance readers love PI romances. They are also screaming about the PI erotica in their romance.


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## LifesHumor (Feb 5, 2014)

D. Zollicoffer said:


> Has anyone tried "Brother in Law" that could work. As long as the guy is widow/divorced from the heroine's sister lol. I'm joking, but I'n sure someone has done it.
> 
> I may do one as a parody just to see if it sells.


LOL, I wrote something that involves cousins by marriage. His aunt married her father.


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## RubyMadden (Jun 11, 2014)

Salvador Mercer said:


> I don't read or write romance, but I'm pretty damn close to writing a book about a Billionaire Step Brother who can shape shift into a wolf and keep his tattoos on his fur in the process. I dream about where I'll spend that money next year...


Ditto!


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

cinisajoy said:


> It is my understanding that romance readers love PI romances. They are also screaming about the PI erotica in their romance.


This doesn't answer my question but reading around I can see that no one seems to know exactly why this PI romance trend has become so big. I can't see a bunch of erotica authors coming over to buy PI romance and sending these books to the top of the bestsellers lists, especially the readers who like short erotica.

I like Roby's explanation on this thread.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

D. Zollicoffer said:



> Has anyone tried "Brother in Law" that could work. As long as the guy is widow/divorced from the heroine's sister lol. I'm joking, but I'n sure someone has done it.
> 
> I may do one as a parody just to see if it sells.


I have an entire line of 'In-law' books. They sell well. And no, they're not widowed or divorced.

They were blocked by Amazon during the PI crackdown, because they contained family relationships in the blurb and title. Once I got rid of that, they were allowed back up.


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## Briteka (Mar 5, 2012)

For the last four months, I have been writing stepbrother romance (actual romance) serials for KU, and it has been very profitable. Still, I think the stepbrother craze is over, and I will move on once this current series is over.

PI has always been popular. Amazon got rid of it for awhile because of outside bad press. Once that bad press vanished, they allowed it again, so now you're seeing it creep back up to the top of the lists. PI, especially stepbrother (I actually have a lot of gay readers, so I think its popularity is due to it being read by both straight females and gay males), has a lot of fans.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

Kayla. said:


> It's got to do with people trying to pay the bills. As someone who has briefly attempted to write erotica, I respect that.
> Nobody gets hurt, so it's good in my book.
> I wish a lot of success to anyone who writes... well, pretty much anything, except for these books ripped off other people or the internet.


I wish success to anyone who writes these books too but I was just wondering why these stepbrother books have made such a big impact in the last few months and they are tearing up the bestseller lists. 
i doubt erotica readers are buying thousands of PI romance books


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## Kenzi (Jul 28, 2014)

I think it's pretty simple: readers like them. Romance readers have a tendency to "glom" books. They read one trope (or series, author, etc.) and if they like it, they look for more in the same vein.  

A few stepbrother romances did well, and the readers who liked them looked for more of the same type of story to read. Savvy writers realized there was potential and began writing stepbrother roms to fill the need.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

Kenzi said:


> I think it's pretty simple: readers like them. Romance readers have a tendency to "glom" books. They read one trope (or series, author, etc.) and if they like it, they look for more in the same vein.
> 
> A few stepbrother romances did well, and the readers who liked them looked for more of the same type of story to read. Savvy writers realized there was potential and began writing stepbrother roms to fill the need.


Your answer is simple and makes perfect sense. I think I've been looking too hard at this and not realising that a lot of romance readers do look for one type of book (Alpha billionaires or second chance love) and buy lots of these books.

Along with Roby's explanation, I think I get it now. Thanks.


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## N.D. Taylor (Jun 17, 2014)

I wrote urban fantasy before, but I saw the shifter craze was through the roof. We were already writing shifters but without the raunchy sex (it was toned down a lot). It made sense to try to isolate the shifters from the heavy plots we were doing, and to step the hot stuff up a few notches. It sold. I was amazed. I remain amazed every time I see it's selling LOL.

Recently cashed in on BBW Shifter stuff. It's the current craze, but I'm a BBW myself. For me, getting a lot of $$$ was a NICE bonus on top of writing about a woman I could relate to for once too. Half of my stories are personal wish fulfillment, but they're selling. It was a great relief to see BBW books selling well because it convinced me that I wouldn't be writing this title no one would give a dang about. 

Stepbrothers though? Tried to read one the other day. It was poorly written trash trying to cash in on it. I reviewed it as such. Ugh. I really disliked it, and they clearly didn't edit it.

Maybe I'll try another one day. There's something fun about the whole taboo thing.

I am in the future planning to release a classic fantasy erotic romance, using... yes, mages and sorcerers, and I will be using the arranged marriage trope. It's really one of my favorites from my teen years of sneaking books in the library.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

N.D. Taylor said:


> Stepbrothers though? Tried to read one the other day. It was poorly written trash trying to cash in on it. I reviewed it as such. Ugh. I really disliked it, and they clearly didn't edit it.
> 
> Maybe I'll try another one day. There's something fun about the whole taboo thing.


Yeah that's some poorly written and edited books out there in every subgenre of romance right now but especially in the current trends. It seems like some authors have created their own factory and are pumping out stepbrother stories and mmf, ffm books that clearly need some editing but I suppose these current trends won't be around for long and so some of these authors feel they have to pump out several books a month.

I've just downloaded a couple twin stepbrother romances, i was curious to see what the books are about.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

This is a good article on why stepbrother romances are so popular right now. Thanks Vicky Foxx for pointing this article out to me.

http://jezebel.com/what-do-women-want-to-have-sex-with-their-stepbrothers-1714291638


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## WordNinja (Jun 26, 2014)

I think a better question would be, why _wouldn't_ stepbrother romances be popular right now? Romance is cyclical, and when a trend hits, it tends to hit big.

Personally, I only like romance if there's a forbidden aspect to it (as opposed to taboo - totally different thing!). I like characters who defy social conventions to be together.


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## doolittle03 (Feb 13, 2015)

Young 'uns won't have heard of this movie: A Summer Place starring Sandra Dee and Troy Donahue (I think) step-brother-sister who fall in love on summer vacation with their (newly-married) parents and he knocks her up. Truly hot and romantic back in the day. Plus a great theme song.
The more things change...


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## Julianna (Jun 28, 2015)

Atunah said:


> A KBoards author just had one in the I think top 5 of all of kindle book store. Its 18 now.
> I noticed the name and thought it was familiar and sure enough. I am only sad that us historical romance readers seemed to have lost another good one to contempo romance. Sniff . She has some older historicals out that were re-released a while back. I think the reason it works in that case its that its a full length romance, the characters are adults, hook up and then find out their parents are getting married, making them step siblings. Its been at the top of the charts for a while now, total charts, not just romance. Its selling like hotcakes, like the earlier one did, stepbrother dearest.
> 
> I think it might actually be the SEAL part that is the bigger draw in that case than the stepbrother thing. SEAL's are still quite popular as a trope.
> ...


What's a SEAL?


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

Julianna said:


> What's a SEAL?


Sea, Air Land/ Navy SEAL. Military hero types are popular in romance novels.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

Julianna said:


> What's a SEAL?


In this case, not the animal, but the elite soldier...
That book is phenomenally well written for the genre, one must say. I mean stylewise.
That's why it's so successful, I believe. I looked at the "Look inside" the other day. Far better language wise than most out there.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

Atunah said:


> Sea, Air Land/ Navy SEAL. Military hero types are popular in romance novels.


Oh, I've had a nice military romance up my brain like forever. I should totally do it, although I would have to place it into an imaginary country. Very forbidden trope too... I wish I didn't have so many other books to write (oh yes, I wish I had..)


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

DashaGLogan said:


> In this case, not the animal, but the elite soldier...
> That book is phenomenally well written for the genre, one must say. I mean stylewise.
> That's why it's so successful, I believe. I looked at the "Look inside" the other day. Far better language wise than most out there.


Yeah, great back list titles, experienced romance author. Personally if I am going to read one of the step brother romance books, that would be the kind of author I would go with. I added it to my KU wishlist so it will come up soon in my tbr. 
I don't really trust a totally new author these days anymore to deliver me actual romance. Too many thinly veiled erotica titles and just not so good books in that band wagon now.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

LOL, I've just been trying to find it again, but all I could remember was that it had a naked torso on the title.
One reason to reconsider such covers.. I can't tell one from the other.
I really like those covers by R.S. Grey btw, (don't know if she's here), I think she gets it right these days.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

DashaGLogan said:


> LOL, I've just been trying to find it again, but all I could remember was that it had a naked torso on the title.
> One reason to reconsider such covers.. I can't tell one from the other.
> I really like those covers by R.S. Grey btw, (don't know if she's here), I think she gets it right these days.


I am sorry 
naked torso does not narrow it down in that trope right now. 
Linda Barlow is the author I was talking about. I don't know if the title violates KB rules for language


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## Julianna (Jun 28, 2015)

swolf said:


> I have an entire line of 'In-law' books. They sell well. And no, they're not widowed or divorced.
> 
> They were blocked by Amazon during the PI crackdown, because they contained family relationships in the blurb and title. Once I got rid of that, they were allowed back up.


Then how do readers know what the book is about?


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

Yeah, I found her now... thanks anyway. 
Chest hair (rare) and tattoos on this one. I should have remembered such unique details.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

DashaGLogan said:


> Yeah, I found her now... thanks anyway.
> Chest hair (rare) and tattoos on this one. I should have remembered such unique details.


Yes, I noticed the chest hair. Must more manly that a baby butt smooth one, especially if it comes with a baby face guy. 



Julianna said:


> Then how do readers know what the book is about?


Runes?


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## Briteka (Mar 5, 2012)

*Adds wereseals to the To Be Written list


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

The slippery kind?


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

floss me


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

How about a shape-shifter romance where a SEAL changes into a seal?


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

*groans


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Atunah said:


> *groans


You'd love it.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

Whiskers tickle, in all the wrong places.


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## Lisa Blackwood (Feb 1, 2015)

Okay. I admit I was curious and only read the last page of posts....so, let me get this straight--in three or four months I'm going to see a bunch of seal-shifting SEALS stepbrother romance books.

k.

yep.

got it.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Atunah said:


> Whiskers tickle, in all the wrong places.


Christian Grey Seal can teach you to enjoy what you find uncomfortable.


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## Guest (Jul 14, 2015)

1) This: I'm don't think it's a joke on readers if they love it and keep buying it. I just don't understand it.

2) It's a gradual slope.

First, it's a millionaire.

But that's not quite as exciting.

So it's multi-millionaire.

Then that gets boring too.

So a Billionaire.

3) Similarly

First it's a motorcycle club outlaw.

But that's not quite as exciting. 

So the motorcycle club outlaw is also a werewolf.

But werewolves are cliche

so it's a werebear. Bigger, more dangerous, don't need a blanket at night.

4) So the edge keeps getting pushed.

Stepbrother is at the very precipice of descending into illegal.

So Stepfather is going to be next. And perhaps WereDinosaurs or WereTRex.

Only half joking.

It's how much you can push things while still keeping the romance and danger.


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## WordNinja (Jun 26, 2014)

ireaderreview said:


> Stepbrother is at the very precipice of descending into illegal.


I can't agree with this. There's nothing illegal or even taboo about a romantic relationship between stepsiblings who have no blood relationship, especially if they didn't become stepsiblings until they were both sexually mature.

The current stepbrother romance trend is completely separate from whatever is going on with PI. Romance and erotica are unrelated genres.

The appeal of a stepsibling relationship in romance is that it raises the stakes. Imagine your worst hookup ever. Now, imagine that your dad is marrying his mom, and he's going to be sitting across from you at the table on every holiday. The fact that he's a stepbrother is an obstacle, not an attraction.


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## Guest (Jul 14, 2015)

Consider what you wrote:

I can't agree with this. There's nothing illegal or even taboo about a romantic relationship between stepsiblings who have no blood relationship, especially if they didn't become stepsiblings until they were both sexually mature. 

It's on the precipice because your step brother is still your 'brother'.

Things move gradually and steadily. What is exciting today will be boring in 10 years. Then something new will have to take its place.

The fact that you have to put conditions on it, already means it's a bit problematic i.e.

a romantic relationship between stepsiblings who have no blood relationship, 
especially if they didn't become stepsiblings until they were both sexually mature.


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## Guest (Jul 14, 2015)

ireaderreview said:


> So Stepfather is going to be next. And perhaps WereDinosaurs or WereTRex.


Stepfather is already popular in erotica as well with "barely legal" teens mostly. Having skimmed some (for research purposes only!), they were mostly transcribed porn movies 

As for weredinosaurs...why would they bother when we already have dino erotica like Taken by the T-Rex as well as a bunch of others in the same series.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

ireaderreview said:


> So Stepfather is going to be next. And perhaps WereDinosaurs or WereTRex.
> 
> Only half joking.
> 
> It's how much you can push things while still keeping the romance and danger.


As Anma said, Stepfather erotica is already popular. It has been big for a while now. Check out B&N and smashwords, you'll find tons of these stories with obvious titles like 'spreading for daddy' and 'seduced by my stepdad'. On Amazon look for any books with 'Brat', 'man of the house' 'older man' in the title and you'll find a stepfather stepdaughter erotica or some are erotic romance.

Dino erotica has been around for a while too.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

Andrea @ ArtWellPub said:


> I can't agree with this. There's nothing illegal or even taboo about a romantic relationship between stepsiblings who have no blood relationship, especially if they didn't become stepsiblings until they were both sexually mature.
> 
> The current stepbrother romance trend is completely separate from whatever is going on with PI. Romance and erotica are unrelated genres.
> 
> The appeal of a stepsibling relationship in romance is that it raises the stakes. Imagine your worst hookup ever. Now, imagine that your dad is marrying his mom, and he's going to be sitting across from you at the table on every holiday. The fact that he's a stepbrother is an obstacle, not an attraction.


I agree that there is nothing illegal about stepsibling romance but there is something taboo about it. Wanting someone you shouldn't really want. This boy/man girl/woman is now your family by marriage and you shouldn't be having thoughts of sleeping with them.

I think people would more understand where two people have a one night stand and then a few weeks later they find out that their single parents are now getting married. Oops I just slept with my new stepbrother/stepsister.

In a lot of these books the relationship is kept a secret from family, friends and neighbours. For some people it would be seen as disgusting, wrong, weird. It is taboo. More so if the stepsiblings grew up together and lived like a family and then became attracted to each other.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

Oh dear. Peeps, i believe you have not yet dived deeper into the bowl of amazon or you'd know all about diaper wearing 18-year olds impregnanted by their stepdads encouraged by their mothers.
I thought I could bot be shocked, but I was!


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Anma Natsu said:


> Having skimmed some (for research purposes only!), they were mostly transcribed porn movies


I know a lot of erotica authors who work hard at creating original stories, and don't just 'transcribe porn movies'.

Let's try not to be condescending.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

I agree. I don't mean to diminish their effort - I'm only surprised at what actually sells judged by ranking.
But of course it is about kicks hence to each their own.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

But I actually think ist is about the " I want you but I should not have you" that can be easily accomplished in historicals.
But in modern western settings there is so little "dangerous".

Romeo and Juliet forever


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

DashaGLogan said:


> I agree. I don't mean to diminish their effort - I'm only surprised at what actually sells judged by ranking.
> But of course it is about kicks hence to each their own.


The thing is there's something out there for every type of reader. I've read a few of these stepbrother romances and some erotica too. Some are very romantic and some are very erotic and kinky. If a reader likes short reads, there's lots of stepbrother romances to choose from. If another reader likes stepbrother novels, there's also a few to choose from.

I think if you look at any genre, you'd be surprised at some of the books which hit the top 100. There's so many different ways to tell a story and not every style is going to suit every reader out there. I say 'different strokes for different folks.'


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

Boyd said:


> I know of a couple peeps who write in-law erom


The only two that come to mind are Jean Luc Cheri and Lee Moore.
I also recommend Jean Luc for your PI needs too.


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## Julianna (Jun 28, 2015)

Andrea @ ArtWellPub said:


> I can't agree with this. There's nothing illegal or even taboo about a romantic relationship between stepsiblings who have no blood relationship, especially if they didn't become stepsiblings until they were both sexually mature.


The Hell it isn't. It's disgusting. Not sure what kind of family you were raised in.


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## Desert Rose (Jun 2, 2015)

DashaGLogan said:


> Oh dear. Peeps, i believe you have not yet dived deeper into the bowl of amazon or you'd know all about diaper wearing 18-year olds impregnanted by their stepdads encouraged by their mothers.
> I thought I could bot be shocked, but I was!


Hmm, you know, I don't think I've ever found age-play that involved impregnation. Must dig deeper!


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

Julianna said:


> The Hell it isn't. It's disgusting. Not sure what kind of family you were raised in.


It may be disgusting to you but that does not make it illegal. 
I personally find bathroom erotica disgusting but some people like it.
I find Adult babies strange but again some people like it.
Pony play anyone? I just don't understand the appeal of that one.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

cinisajoy said:


> It may be disgusting to you but that does not make it illegal.
> I personally find bathroom erotica disgusting but some people like it.
> I find Adult babies strange but again some people like it.
> Pony play anyone? I just don't understand the appeal of that one.


pony play? *googles*


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

DashaGLogan said:


> pony play? *googles*


DON'T. What is seen can't be unseen.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

cinisajoy said:


> DON'T. What is seen can't be unseen.


*whinnies*


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## C. Gockel (Jan 28, 2014)

> Pretty sure readers know what they like...


Yes.


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## WordNinja (Jun 26, 2014)

What readers consider taboo will largely vary depending on the age at which the characters became stepsiblings, and whether they were raised in the same household. If they become stepsiblings prior to sexual maturity and were raised in the same household as siblings, most readers are going to consider that taboo. That scenario might work well in PI, but not at all in romance. 

If they were both over eighteen when they met, most readers probably won't consider that to be taboo. Maybe forbidden, but these characters would not have developed a sibling bond. That scenario would work well in romance. 

Gray areas occur when the characters become stepsiblings as teens, or if they become stepsiblings at an even younger age but aren't raised in the same household. If stepsiblings only see each other at holidays and on school breaks, they might not develop a sibling bond. (That's why the move "Clueless" works.) Both these scenarios have a strong forbidden love component. Some readers might consider the relationships taboo, while others won't. These scenarios could potentially work in both PI and romance, depending on how they're written.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Andrea @ ArtWellPub said:


> What readers consider taboo will largely vary depending on the age at which the characters became stepsiblings, and whether they were raised in the same household. If they become stepsiblings prior to sexual maturity and were raised in the same household as siblings, most readers are going to consider that taboo. That scenario might work well in PI, but not at all in romance.


I began writing PI with that assumption, but discovered that readers ready do enjoy the romantic aspects, even if the relationship goes back to early childhood.


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## WordNinja (Jun 26, 2014)

swolf said:


> I began writing PI with that assumption, but discovered that readers ready do enjoy the romantic aspects, even if the relationship goes back to early childhood.


I think we're talking about two different things. I'm not saying you can't include romance in PI. I'm saying if you're writing genre romance (not PI), you probably don't want to show a romantic/sexual relationship between two characters who formed a sibling bond as young children and maintained it through adulthood. Not unless you're marketing it as taboo.

Romance and erotica are distinct genres. Their different readerships are looking for different things.


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## DGS (Sep 25, 2013)

Can people who read these books please explain how they typically end?  Since the relationship is taboo, do these books end with "ah, who cares we're in love?" or is it something else?


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## Scottish Lass (Oct 10, 2013)

DGS said:


> Can people who read these books please explain how they typically end? Since the relationship is taboo, do these books end with "ah, who cares we're in love?" or is it something else?


That's what I've been trying to work out. How do they get their HEA?


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## DGS (Sep 25, 2013)

Roz Marshall said:


> That's what I've been trying to work out. How do they get their HEA?


So I just read two very popular books by the same author..well the ending parts. They sucked. I mean there was no resolution besides "some things were bad, but overall it was fine!" - I'm not summarizing, that's the line. The other one is "wouldn't your father care? - Nah he's cool." This author then skips a few months/years to some happy moment, and finishes with some cheese line akin to "i know everything is going to be ok"

The other thing that got me is how flat these books seemed - the sex scenes in particular. Like, 15% of effort that I would expect from a 'gold label' romance author if that makes sense. Both books were like reading something after 3 drinks and not really even attempting to go to any depth emotionally or intellectually stimulating.

Which is very promising on one hand, on the other I might have to knock characters in one of the planned books with a bat over the head a couple of times to get those introspections/real life things dulled.


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## Julianna (Jun 28, 2015)

They probably gloss over the ending because in real life, step sibling relationships don't often end well. They're taboo so it's hard to buy into the HEA.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

swolf said:


> I began writing PI with that assumption, but discovered that readers ready do enjoy the romantic aspects, even if the relationship goes back to early childhood.


Same here. In fact, the romance element tends to be stronger the further back the relationship goes. A lot of them are a variant on the "best friends to lovers" trope. Others are the "couple can't stand each other but find themselves attracted anyway and fight it every step of the way." The taboo element just adds a bit of spice to the story. Generally I tell them where there's a deep emotional bond between them that over time becomes something else - usually blindsiding both of them. Then they flounder around trying to deal with their new feelings and usually fighting them for a good part of the story while the chemistry builds and the sexual tension ratchets up.

It's not like this is a new thing, either. There were quite a few mainstream stepbrother/stepsister romances (not erotica) long before they started becoming popular in erotica shorts. Anne Mather, Charlotte Lamb, and a group of others wrote a whole bunch of them for Harlequin back in the 70s and 80s.


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## Briteka (Mar 5, 2012)

Are they really THAT taboo?

Most of my step romances end the same way as my normal romances do. The conflict is the stigma, and the HEA is simply getting over it.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

DGS said:


> So I just read two very popular books by the same author..well the ending parts. They sucked. I mean there was no resolution besides "some things were bad, but overall it was fine!" - I'm not summarizing, that's the line. The other one is "wouldn't your father care? - Nah he's cool." This author then skips a few months/years to some happy moment, and finishes with some cheese line akin to "i know everything is going to be ok"
> 
> The other thing that got me is how flat these books seemed - the sex scenes in particular. Like, 15% of effort that I would expect from a 'gold label' romance author if that makes sense. Both books were like reading something after 3 drinks and not really even attempting to go to any depth emotionally or intellectually stimulating.
> 
> Which is very promising on one hand, on the other I might have to knock characters in one of the planned books with a bat over the head a couple of times to get those introspections/real life things dulled.


I imagine a lot of people are rushing to hit the trend while it's hot and not taking as much time to edit as they usually would.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

Andrea @ ArtWellPub said:


> I think we're talking about two different things. I'm not saying you can't include romance in PI. I'm saying if you're writing genre romance (not PI), you probably don't want to show a romantic/sexual relationship between two characters who formed a sibling bond as young children and maintained it through adulthood. Not unless you're marketing it as taboo.
> 
> Romance and erotica are distinct genres. Their different readerships are looking for different things.


These used to be a staple of Harlequin in the 70s and 80s. It's just coming around again. Like millionaires were super hot in the 90s and then died down for a while until 50 Shades made billionaires a big thing.


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## Briteka (Mar 5, 2012)

KelliWolfe said:


> Same here. In fact, the romance element tends to be stronger the further back the relationship goes. A lot of them are a variant on the "best friends to lovers" trope. Others are the "couple can't stand each other but find themselves attracted anyway and fight it every step of the way." The taboo element just adds a bit of spice to the story. Generally I tell them where there's a deep emotional bond between them that over time becomes something else - usually blindsiding both of them. Then they flounder around trying to deal with their new feelings and usually fighting them for a good part of the story while the chemistry builds and the sexual tension ratchets up.
> 
> It's not like this is a new thing, either. There were quite a few mainstream stepbrother/stepsister romances (not erotica) long before they started becoming popular in erotica shorts. Anne Mather, Charlotte Lamb, and a group of others wrote a whole bunch of them for Harlequin back in the 70s and 80s.


This is all very true. I think people may be overthinking this whole step thing.  I don't actually know why they're so popular. Perhaps a lot of people have had crushes on a step sibling, perhaps they are using it to fulfill an actual incest fetish. I have no real idea. I don't see anything taboo about step books, so I don't really understand the forbidden nature. My step books are just normal romances.


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## DGS (Sep 25, 2013)

Briteka said:


> Are they really THAT taboo?
> 
> Most of my step romances end the same way as my normal romances do. The conflict is the stigma, and the HEA is simply getting over it.


Great point. The whole extra tension provides more drama, so to finally come to a decision to air it out is the whole resolution. Although I'd lol if someone put out a book where MC's hooked up and said "so, let's just not tell anyone and walk away."


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## Julianna (Jun 28, 2015)

DGS said:


> Great point. The whole extra tension provides more drama, so to finally come to a decision to air it out is the whole resolution. Although I'd lol if someone put out a book where MC's booked up and said "so, let's just not tell anyone and walk away."


Actually, that would be more interesting.


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## Gibson Morales (May 24, 2015)

What a curious sense of morality some readers have...I guess if a woman has a lot of free time on her hands though boredom can ensue.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

Gibson Morales said:


> What a curious sense of morality some readers have...I guess if a woman has a lot of free time on her hands though boredom can ensue.


How delightfully patronizing of you.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Briteka said:


> This is all very true. I think people may be overthinking this whole step thing.  I don't actually know why they're so popular. Perhaps a lot of people have had crushes on a step sibling, perhaps they are using it to fulfill an actual incest fetish. I have no real idea. I don't see anything taboo about step books, so I don't really understand the forbidden nature. My step books are just normal romances.


It's my belief that most people who are into incest or step-incest erotica are not attracted to their siblings, step or otherwise. They like to read about other people being involved in it, but don't secretly hold crushes on their own siblings. In fact, if they're like me, they find the thought of doing anything with their own siblings quite disturbing. But other people with their siblings? Yeah, that's cool.

And stories about step-siblings can range from very taboo, to mildly taboo. It all has to do with how long the siblings have been together, and how close they've become. If you take a step brother and sister who have been raised together since they were both two or three years old, the bond between them is the same as normal siblings, and overcoming that bond would be just as difficult.

Then there are stories where two random adult strangers run into each other and have sex, and find out afterward that their parents have secretly married each other. While still fitting into the PI erotica genre, stories like that probably wouldn't satisfy someone who's really into the kink. Something like that might make a PI romance more palatable for normal romance readers.

The same is true for step-parent stories. You have the ones ranging from where the step-parent has raised the child from an early age, to ones like, 'Stealing Mom's New Husband.'


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Gibson Morales said:


> What a curious sense of morality some readers have.


I thought we were past the point of judging someone's morality based on their sexual tastes?


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

swolf said:


> It's my belief that most people who are into incest or step-incest erotica are not attracted to their siblings, step or otherwise. They like to read about other people being involved in it, but don't secretly hold crushes on their own siblings. In fact, if they're like me, they find the thought of doing anything with their own siblings quite disturbing. But other people with their siblings? Yeah, that's cool.


I think it's that way with most of the fetishes. People enjoy reading about them, but very, very few would ever actually want to do them in real life.


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## Usedtoposthere (Nov 19, 2013)

swolf said:


> I thought we were past the point of judging someone's morality based on their sexual tastes?


I liked it before you edited it.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

KelliWolfe said:


> I think it's that way with most of the fetishes. People enjoy reading about them, but very, very few would ever actually want to do them in real life.


I'm not sure. I'd think someone who liked to read about something like foot stuff would be into that in real life, but I could be wrong. Interesting to think about.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

Rosalind James said:


> I liked it before you edited it.


I try to stay away from that on here, and my cooler head prevailed.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

swolf said:


> I'm not sure. I'd think someone who liked to read about something like foot stuff would be into that in real life, but I could be wrong. Interesting to think about.


Think about how popular dubcon is. It's huge. But most of our readers are women. There's a fantasy there, yes; but I really don't think most of us are secretly into rape. Same with BDSM. There's a huge readership for that, largely thanks to EL James. But how many actually do more than maybe dip their toes in the water with a riding crop and pair of handcuffs? Threesomes are incredibly popular, especially MFM. But how often does that happen in real life? Most men are far too possessive and insecure to do that. And while men might go for FMF (or at least they might think they would), women are every bit as possessive and disinclined to share.

It's massively fantasy - people living out the things that they'd never really do or even necessarily want to do in real life.


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## delly_xo (Oct 29, 2014)

KelliWolfe said:


> Think about how popular dubcon is. It's huge. But most of our readers are women. There's a fantasy there, yes; but I really don't think most of us are secretly into rape. Same with BDSM. There's a huge readership for that, largely thanks to EL James. But how many actually do more than maybe dip their toes in the water with a riding crop and pair of handcuffs? Threesomes are incredibly popular, especially MFM. But how often does that happen in real life? Most men are far too possessive and insecure to do that. And while men might go for FMF (or at least they might think they would), women are every bit as possessive and disinclined to share.
> 
> It's massively fantasy - people living out the things that they'd never really do or even necessarily want to do in real life.


I completely agree. I like reading the Maya Banks and Shayla Black books about menage relationships, but there is no way I would ever sign myself up for a relationship like that in real life even if all three of them looked like Henry Cavill.


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## Gennita Low (Dec 13, 2012)

delly_xo said:


> I completely agree. I like reading the Maya Banks and Shayla Black books about menage relationships, but there is no way I would ever sign myself up for a relationship like that in real life even if all three of them looked like Henry Cavill.


I would take fifty shades of Cavill any time. And they can all be my stepbrothers. Just sayin'.

I used to love stepbrother romances when I read them in the 70s. It never bothered me even though I have several stepbrothers. In fact, I don't think my young mind even connected those two facts together. Also, even more squicky (but not then when I was reading them), those stepbrothers in the old Mills & Boons romances were always controlling millionaires, who wielded quite a bit of power over the heroine's fortunes.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

KelliWolfe said:


> Think about how popular dubcon is. It's huge. But most of our readers are women. There's a fantasy there, yes; but I really don't think most of us are secretly into rape. Same with BDSM. There's a huge readership for that, largely thanks to EL James. But how many actually do more than maybe dip their toes in the water with a riding crop and pair of handcuffs? Threesomes are incredibly popular, especially MFM. But how often does that happen in real life? Most men are far too possessive and insecure to do that. And while men might go for FMF (or at least they might think they would), women are every bit as possessive and disinclined to share.
> 
> It's massively fantasy - people living out the things that they'd never really do or even necessarily want to do in real life.


Can't argue with that. I doubt any woman who's into rape fantasy actually wants to be raped.

But I still think the incest fantasy is slightly different than the others. With the other genres, everyone understands that people may fantasize about it while never having any intention of actually doing it. But with incest, even fantasizing about it is considered wrong, unless you point out that you're not actually fantasizing about your own siblings.

And for the record, I would have sex with a babysitter*. 

* Provided she's cute, of legal age, and my wife gives me permission (which ain't gonna happen).


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

swolf said:


> Can't argue with that. I doubt any woman who's into rape fantasy actually wants to be raped.
> 
> But I still think the incest fantasy is slightly different than the others. With the other genres, everyone understands that people may fantasize about it while never having any intention of actually doing it. But with incest, even fantasizing about it is considered wrong, unless you point out that you're not actually fantasizing about your own siblings.
> 
> ...


See, I'm not really convinced that's the case with the stepbrother thing. I mean sure, some people do get squicked out by it. But some people get squicked out by menage or dubcon, too. I don't think Harlequin would have been publishing stepbrother romances in bulk in the 70s and 80s if it was really considered more taboo than their blackmail/reluctant books, and I don't think they'd be as popular as they now are as mainstream romances if they were *that* taboo. I think the pushback on them is almost totally manufactured by the distributors.

I do find it absolutely hilarious that in the "sexually enlightened" year of 2015 you can get your books blocked and potentially have your account banned on every single major distributor for publishing stories about topics that our mothers and grandmothers wouldn't have batted an eyelash at.

Babysitter stories are usually safe, though. At least if your wife doesn't find out.


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## dianapersaud (Sep 26, 2013)

KelliWolfe said:


> See, I'm not really convinced that's the case with the stepbrother thing. I mean sure, some people do get squicked out by it. But some people get squicked out by menage or dubcon, too. I don't think Harlequin would have been publishing stepbrother romances in bulk in the 70s and 80s if it was really considered more taboo than their blackmail/reluctant books, and I don't think they'd be as popular as they now are as mainstream romances if they were *that* taboo. I think the pushback on them is almost totally manufactured by the distributors.
> 
> I do find it absolutely hilarious that in the "sexually enlightened" year of 2015 you can get your books blocked and potentially have your account banned on every single major distributor for publishing stories about topics that our mothers and grandmothers wouldn't have batted an eyelash at.
> 
> Babysitter stories are usually safe, though. At least if your wife doesn't find out.


I think it has to do with the ease of finding these books and the ease of complaining about them.

My grandmother read Mills and Boons. I never saw a copy- so who knows what she read. My mother and her sisters/cousins/sister in laws had tons of Harlequin that they shared. Stacks of books. I don't recall any stepbrother books but I remember sneaking plenty of "tycoon" books and "blackmail" books.

Back then, what would people do? Send a letter?

Now they can email, get on FB/twitter, get on national TV, get newspaper coverage etc. It's easier now for some loud voices to be heard.

Our society still doesn't seem comfortable with women enjoying sex. They want women to be passive sexual creatures, not actively engaging and seeking it out.

It cracks me up when I read ignorant posts about what kind of woman reads romance/erotica. And the assumptions that only perverts write it.

Women are empowered and exercising control over their sexuality.

The loss of control over women is scary for some people, and those are the voices we hear. That makes me deliriously happy.


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## Anya Monroe (Dec 3, 2014)

I kept seeing all the stepbrother romances as well, and started reading some because I try and read popular books in genres I am interested in writing because, well, for obvious reasons.

Anyways, I write YA and was like, hmmm how can I do the stepbrother thing here without being _too much_ because honestly there is so much conflict from the get go with this set-up so it wouldn't be overly complicated to come up with a fun plot. And readers like them. And I want to write things people like because it is more fun when people actually enjoy my books.

Then I was like, Duh! Clueless did this 20 years ago and it is my favorite movie ever. So now I am writing a YA step-bro-mance and just having fun with it. I can't wait to see how it does.


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## Briteka (Mar 5, 2012)

Anya Monroe said:


> I kept seeing all the stepbrother romances as well, and started reading some because I try and read popular books in genres I am interested in writing because, well, for obvious reasons.
> 
> Anyways, I write YA and was like, hmmm how can I do the stepbrother thing here without being _too much_ because honestly there is so much conflict from the get go with this set-up so it wouldn't be overly complicated to come up with a fun plot. And readers like them. And I want to write things people like because it is more fun when people actually enjoy my books.
> 
> Then I was like, Duh! Clueless did this 20 years ago and it is my favorite movie ever. So now I am writing a YA step-bro-mance and just having fun with it. I can't wait to see how it does.


I'm writing an m/m young adult stebrother romance as well. It's interesting. I'm not sure where I'm going to put it, category-wise, but it's just a contemporary romance between two stepbrothers. There's no sex (though it happens off-page), and it will be interesting to see how it sells because I think the audience is somewhat different than a stepbrother erotic romance.

ETA: Step relationships also play out in real life with Catelynn and Tyler from Teen Mom. They were step brother and sister when they first got together, though they no longer are since their parents divorced. They have a huge fanbase, and the fact that they were step siblings rarely, if ever, got brought up by the fans, which I find interesting.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

Now stepbrother romances are being places under Religion & Spirituality > New Age & Spirituality > Divination > Palmistry.



Briteka said:


> I'm writing an m/m young adult stebrother romance as well. It's interesting. I'm not sure where I'm going to put it, category-wise, but it's just a contemporary romance between two stepbrothers. There's no sex (though it happens off-page), and it will be interesting to see how it sells because I think the audience is somewhat different than a stepbrother erotic romance.


I'm starting to see more m/m stepbrother romances now.


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## kcmorgan (Jan 9, 2013)

mica said:


> Now stepbrother romances are being places under Religion & Spirituality > New Age & Spirituality > Divination > Palmistry.


I understand they are trying to avoid the dungeon, but Palmistry? Seriously? You'd think putting it there would increase the chance of getting reported for being miscategorized.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

kcmorgan said:


> I understand they are trying to avoid the dungeon, but Palmistry? Seriously? You'd think putting it there would increase the chance of getting reported for being miscategorized.


 I like reading some new age and spirituality. I was shaking my head when i saw the stepbrother book is number 1 in palmistry.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

mica said:


> Now stepbrother romances are being places under Religion & Spirituality > New Age & Spirituality > Divination > Palmistry.


Keep in mind that you can get placed in those categories based upon the keywords you choose. I'm not seeing anything mapped to palmistry, but it's possible KDP is doing something behind the scenes.

Scanned through the book (it's surprisingly short) and didn't see anything remotely associated with palmistry.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

swolf said:


> Keep in mind that you can get placed in those categories based upon the keywords you choose. I'm not seeing anything mapped to palmistry, but it's possible KDP is doing something behind the scenes.
> 
> Scanned through the book (it's surprisingly short) and didn't see anything remotely associated with palmistry.


I did not think for one minute this book had anything to do with new age & spirituality or palmistry. Just another misplaced book.


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## cherryhips (Jul 18, 2015)

mica said:


> Now stepbrother romances are being places under Religion & Spirituality > New Age & Spirituality > Divination > Palmistry.
> 
> I'm starting to see more m/m stepbrother romances now.


Why doesn't Amazon recategorize it into the right section? They could easily stop it before its published and put it somewhere it belongs.


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## Briteka (Mar 5, 2012)

I've ended


cherryhips said:


> Why doesn't Amazon recategorize it into the right section? They could easily stop it before its published and put it somewhere it belongs.


Because Amazon doesn't have live people working with each book as it gets published. The only way they would know the book is miscategorized is if a bunch of people reported it.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

cherryhips said:


> Why doesn't Amazon recategorize it into the right section? They could easily stop it before its published and put it somewhere it belongs.


yeah i agree with what Briteka said below. Amazon could do with a clean up. There's too many miscategorized books and scammy books.

It's like when i go to the library or bookstore (on the odd occasion) and i see books on the wrong shelf/wrong section i want to put them in the right place. I do sometimes. It annoys me.


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## Anya Monroe (Dec 3, 2014)

Briteka said:


> I'm writing an m/m young adult stebrother romance as well. It's interesting. I'm not sure where I'm going to put it, category-wise, but it's just a contemporary romance between two stepbrothers. There's no sex (though it happens off-page), and it will be interesting to see how it sells because I think the audience is somewhat different than a stepbrother erotic romance.
> 
> ETA: Step relationships also play out in real life with Catelynn and Tyler from Teen Mom. They were step brother and sister when they first got together, though they no longer are since their parents divorced. They have a huge fanbase, and the fact that they were step siblings rarely, if ever, got brought up by the fans, which I find interesting.


Good luck with your WIP! And great point about Teen Mom, I hadn't thought of that, but now totally remember their story line.


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## Nic (Nov 17, 2013)

KelliWolfe said:


> It's massively fantasy - people living out the things that they'd never really do or even necessarily want to do in real life.


I'm not so sure about that.


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## bobfrost (Sep 29, 2013)

LOVE LINE: A STEPBROTHER ROMANCE (insert tattooed muscular man chest cover with glow-font against a dark background)

I'm so f*****... Everybody knows palm reading is a bunch of baloney, right? I thought so too, until the crazy old lady told me I'd already met the eternal love of my life. He's the one man I could never be with. The cocky jerk who taunted me since we were kids. My deepest and darkest little fantasy... Jack Renson. My stepbrother.


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## dianapersaud (Sep 26, 2013)

Nic said:


> I'm not so sure about that.


So...people who have read Jeff Lindsey's Dexter novels really want to go out and murder bad people?

People read fiction to escape, to live vicariously through the other characters, to experience something they wouldn't otherwise. Romance is no different from any other genre in that regard.

Although... I wouldn't mind running into Legolas from LOTR....

Some people like anchovies on a pizza. Some don't. If you don't like it, don't eat it. Problem solved.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

I personally love the "older man younger woman/may december" trope. Love love love it. I've got stacks of novels about it, and a huge chunk of the stories I write are about it. But while it's beautiful to read about, it's not something I'd really want to do in real life.


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## SusanCht (Oct 24, 2014)

The thing that makes most Stepbrother books work is that the formula has its cake and eats it too (all the way to the bank). Usually the step-siblings met and made love/had a relationship BEFORE finding out about their parents sudden marriage or meet as adults. Even when it starts with the girl in her teens, the stepparents usually have just married recently while the kids have known each other forever. In any case, the steps almost never have grown up together in the same household. The closest always involves a four to six year age difference and the two only living in the household together for 1-2 years. 

Sometimes it's pretty much ridiculous, especially when the "step-siblings" have had some sort of relationship almost as long as the "parents" have and never even knew the parents were involved (especially since the parents usually have a whirlwind romance and there's no time to tell anyone anything."


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## cherryhips (Jul 18, 2015)

What do you mean amazon reviewers don't look at the categories? I might be new to this but that doesn't sound true. Don't reviewers actually review the books before they're published? Why wouldn't they be able to see the categories and change it to the right ones?

It sounds to me like there is a lot of erotica shaming here...

I don't see stepbrother as all that taboo. It's not against the law. I have a hot stepbrother and I will admit I have had hot fantasies about him before. So what if I want to bang him? NO it didn't happen, but as far as I can tell, by all these people buying the books, they fantasize about it too. It's not against the law. Some people are just prudes.


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## lilywhite (Sep 25, 2010)

cherryhips said:


> What do you mean amazon reviewers don't look at the categories? I might be new to this but that doesn't sound true. Don't reviewers actually review the books before they're published? Why wouldn't they be able to see the categories and change it to the right ones?


Uploading your book is an automated process. There isn't a live person checking everything that gets uploaded.


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## Nic (Nov 17, 2013)

dianapersaud said:


> So...people who have read Jeff Lindsey's Dexter novels really want to go out and murder bad people?
> 
> People read fiction to escape, to live vicariously through the other characters, to experience something they wouldn't otherwise. Romance is no different from any other genre in that regard.
> 
> ...


I don't have a problem with anchovies or pizza. I write erotica, and I get fan mail, I also talk to people. What I referred to is that I do not believe the predilection for certain scenarios and tropes is groundless for all people.

Sure, some people read taboo erotica simply because it has the taste of being forbidden. Everything forbidden has to be extra-good, right? At least they can state they read it. Or so it goes. But a lot of people read these scenarios because they are actively turned on by them. Someone who isn't into some of the heftier kinks won't get turned on by them.

A lot of the mails I get are directly speaking of these things. Yes, they do live vicariously through these stories. But not as someone who never experienced it. Nor as someone who doesn't want it in some way, either. More like someone who can satisfy this need or want through these books without putting their body on the line. At least for now.

So I would definitely not say that someone who reads certain taboo erotica is just indulging a meaningless fancy.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

cherryhips said:


> What do you mean amazon reviewers don't look at the categories? I might be new to this but that doesn't sound true. Don't reviewers actually review the books before they're published? Why wouldn't they be able to see the categories and change it to the right ones?
> 
> It sounds to me like there is a lot of erotica shaming here...
> 
> I don't see stepbrother as all that taboo. It's not against the law. I have a hot stepbrother and I will admit I have had hot fantasies about him before. So what if I want to bang him? NO it didn't happen, but as far as I can tell, by all these people buying the books, they fantasize about it too. It's not against the law. Some people are just prudes.


i don't think people are buying these books and fantasizing about banging their stepbrother or their stepfather. It is a form of entertainment just like a movie.
I don't watch The vampire diaries and fantasize about growing fangs and drinking peoples blood.

You might see nothing wrong with sleeping with your stepbrother but some people do. Everyone has the right to believe what they want, that does not make them a prude.

Briteka answered your question above.



Briteka said:


> I've ended
> Because Amazon doesn't have live people working with each book as it gets published. The only way they would know the book is miscategorized is if a bunch of people reported it.


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

*I'll edit this to make it clear*

I've read quite a few of these stepbrother stories, I've enjoyed a few of them. I even recommended Sabrina Paige as an author who writes good stepbrother books in another thread.

I was wondering if the stepbrother trend was slowing down, i am now thinking of writing a series myself. Now there's alien stepbrother stories and i think these authors are getting more imaginative. My book might not be that exciting.


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## cherryhips (Jul 18, 2015)

What happened to my post? Did it get deleted?


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Folks, let's keep it civil. Cherryhips, I removed your post because it attacked a fellow member. I'm reviewing the latest posts of the thread now to see what else has been going on.

Catching up with this thread. Let's leave out the judgments if you want to keep this thread open. If you're not interested in WHY stepbrother books are appealing to some/many, this isn't the right thread for you. That's the topic of this thread.

Also, miscategorization of books is a separate issue...no need to post here every time you find a misplaced book, mica. The appropriate thing to do is report the book to Amazon on Amazon.

Betsy
KB Mod


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Folks, let's keep it civil. Cherryhips, I removed your post because it attacked a fellow member. I'm reviewing the latest posts of the thread now to see what else has been going on.
> 
> Catching up with this thread. Let's leave out the judgments if you want to keep this thread open. If you're not interested in WHY stepbrother books are appealing to some/many, this isn't the right thread for you. That's the topic of this thread.
> 
> ...


Betsy, i didnt say the book was miscategorized.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Second warning.

Keep it civil.  Posts about your fellow members have and will be removed and members who continue despite this warning risk being placed on post moderation.  This thread is to discuss stepbrother books, not each other.

If you think a post is inappropriate, report it and move on.

Betsy
KB Mod


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

Palmistry might be the new fancy word for hand job


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## Not any more (Mar 19, 2012)

Let's face it. The reason for the stepbrother trope to do so well is that it has a whiff of the forbidden. Amazon won't allow incest (flowers in the attic not withstanding - anything can get sold if a large trad publisher says it's ok, just not self pub), so step siblings is the closest you can get.


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## KelliWolfe (Oct 14, 2014)

brkingsolver said:


> Let's face it. The reason for the stepbrother trope to do so well is that it has a whiff of the forbidden. Amazon won't allow incest (flowers in the attic not withstanding - anything can get sold if a large trad publisher says it's ok, just not self pub), so step siblings is the closest you can get.


Anais Nin's erotica (available on Amazon and other fine digital resellers) includes full-on incest, underage sex, and bestiality. But that's A-OK because it's "artistic". *wink* *wink*


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## wtvr (Jun 18, 2014)

brkingsolver said:


> Let's face it. The reason for the stepbrother trope to do so well is that it has a whiff of the forbidden. Amazon won't allow incest (flowers in the attic not withstanding - anything can get sold if a large trad publisher says it's ok, just not self pub), so step siblings is the closest you can get.


I don't think that's true. If romance readers wanted full-blood sibling relationships, we'd have a boatload of those no matter what Amazon supposedly wants. There's incest in lots of other categories. Despite the media continuing to present romance as something that could or should be policed by the Upright Citizen's Brigade, it doesn't work that way.

The reason we have so many stepbrothers is because that's exactly what romance readers want right now, and they literally control most of the market for books.


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

wtvr said:


> I don't think that's true. If romance readers wanted full-blood sibling relationships, we'd have a boatload of those no matter what Amazon supposedly wants. There's incest in lots of other categories. Despite the media continuing to present romance as something that could or should be policed by the Upright Citizen's Brigade, it doesn't work that way.
> 
> The reason we have so many stepbrothers is because that's exactly what romance readers want right now, and they literally control most of the market for books.


From my sales numbers on B&N, erotica readers prefer full-blood incest to step-incest, where I give (gave) them the choice of the same story both ways with mirrors. The pure incest outsold the step incest by a mile.

I can only assume the same thing would happen on Amazon if they allowed pure-incest in erotica. It's not about what Amazon supposedly wants. It's about what they allow. They'll ban any pure-incest erotica (and eventually delete your account) if you try to publish it.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

wtvr said:


> I don't think that's true. If romance readers wanted full-blood sibling relationships, we'd have a boatload of those no matter what Amazon supposedly wants. There's incest in lots of other categories. Despite the media continuing to present romance as something that could or should be policed by the Upright Citizen's Brigade, it doesn't work that way.
> 
> The reason we have so many stepbrothers is because that's exactly what romance readers want right now, and they literally control most of the market for books.


Isn't this circular logic? I mean, how do we know step books aren't popular just because a dozen authors happened to write step romances at the same time? I see this kind of logic a lot where writers will claim a certain writer is just giving the readers what they want. There's something off about that thread of reasoning.


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## Not any more (Mar 19, 2012)

KelliWolfe said:


> Anais Nin's erotica (available on Amazon and other fine digital resellers) includes full-on incest, underage sex, and bestiality. But that's A-OK because it's "artistic". *wink* *wink*


And it's hot!


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## wtvr (Jun 18, 2014)

swolf said:


> From my sales numbers on B&N, erotica readers prefer full-blood incest to step-incest, where I give (gave) them the choice of the same story both ways with mirrors. The pure incest outsold the step incest by a mile.
> 
> I can only assume the same thing would happen on Amazon if they allowed pure-incest in erotica. It's not about what Amazon supposedly wants. It's about what they allow. They'll ban any pure-incest erotica (and eventually delete your account) if you try to publish it.


I wasn't talking about erotica, though. I'm sure you're correct about the market.


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## wtvr (Jun 18, 2014)

Crystal_ said:


> Isn't this circular logic? I mean, how do we know step books aren't popular just because a dozen authors happened to write step romances at the same time? I see this kind of logic a lot where writers will claim a certain writer is just giving the readers what they want. There's something off about that thread of reasoning.


There are a million vampire books and YA novels that aren't at the top of the charts right now. The thing is that most books sold are romance, more than half of all books. Romance readers drive the book economy, not the other way around.


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## delly_xo (Oct 29, 2014)

Crystal_ said:


> Isn't this circular logic? I mean, how do we know step books aren't popular just because a dozen authors happened to write step romances at the same time? I see this kind of logic a lot where writers will claim a certain writer is just giving the readers what they want. There's something off about that thread of reasoning.


As much as I love to write, I love to read and at certain points in time, I'm more of a reader than a writer. 
There is something dark and a little thrilling about a relationship that SHOULD be a particular way, but it takes on a completely different set of characteristics. It's that same sense of forbidden that accompanies the May/December romances, the teacher/student, boss/intern -- step romance is really no different. It's about crossing boundaries.

And I think they've always been around. In Abbi Glines, Fallen Too Far, Rush was Blaire's stepbrother. Tons of Harlequin romances I read when I was younger had similar set-ups. I attribute the attention and the flood into the market to Penelope Ward though. She actually USED the word stepbrother in the title. It got people to pick up the book and the same tactic has worked for tons of others including Krista Lakes, Olivia Hawthorne, Sabrina Paige, etc.


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

I have read a few and never was I bothered by the relationsship between the protagonists, what freaked me out was that their parents were at it. I'd find that somehow gross.


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## Nic (Nov 17, 2013)

DashaGLogan said:


> I have read a few and never was I bothered by the relationsship between the protagonists, what freaked me out was that their parents were at it. I'd find that somehow gross.


immaculate conception for everyone?


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

Nic said:


> immaculate conception for everyone?


Well... "It's like my mom and your dad are doing it and we are doing it. Turn you on?" *nooooo*
I would prefer the adopted orphan of someone else."


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## Nic (Nov 17, 2013)

DashaGLogan said:


> Well... "It's like my mom and your dad are doing it and we are doing it. Turn you on?" *nooooo*
> I would prefer the adopted orphan of someone else."


My parents still do it, and my grandparents also did it right into old age. They don't stop after having had children. I'm certainly not turned on by this in family, but it doesn't squick me either. Book characters' parents? Can be hot. Why not?


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## swolf (Jun 21, 2010)

DashaGLogan said:


> I have read a few and never was I bothered by the relationsship between the protagonists, what freaked me out was that their parents were at it. I'd find that somehow gross.


The protagonists wouldn't be step-siblings unless their parents were already married. Does sex between parents of non-sexually-involved stepsiblings freak you out? Or do the step-siblings have to have sex and then you're freaked out by the parents having sex?


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## DashaGLogan (Jan 30, 2014)

swolf said:


> The protagonists wouldn't be step-siblings unless their parents were already married. Does sex between parents of non-sexually-involved stepsiblings freak you out? Or do the step-siblings have to have sex and then you're freaked out by the parents having sex?


Yes, the sex of the parents in itself does not freak me out. Only the parallel.

Subjective, personal gusto. Did not know until I tried one of those.
Not saying it should generally be found so.


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## Marseille France or Bust (Sep 25, 2012)

After following this thread I decided to postpone my daily marketing of my traditional novel and write a series of stepbrother romance short stories.

I downloaded and read a few. One really sucked, and the other was actually well-written. I looked at the top sellers in the genre; what they wrote in the description, etc and wrote.

In one day I have completed a 4000 word story. I'll be able to knock out 3 more in a series within a month.

I have also created a pen name for the series. It will be interesting to see how well they sell without a full marketing push.

I've added the most popular keywords to the description in hopes they will be found easily.

Question:

Should these types of books be listed in general romance or erotica? I'm listed in general romance/short story for now. Didn't know the pros and cons of selecting that category. Anyone?


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## mica (Jun 19, 2015)

PatriceWilliamsMarks said:


> After following this thread I decided to postpone my daily marketing of my traditional novel and write a series of stepbrother romance short stories.
> 
> I downloaded and read a few. One really sucked, and the other was actually well-written. I looked at the top sellers in the genre; what they wrote in the description, etc and wrote.
> 
> ...


If your characters develop a relationship and have a HEA or HFN then it is a romance. The relationship/love story should be the main plot. There doesn't have to be graphic sex in the book. Sex does not drive the story.

If your characters just get together and have sex, your story is erotica. The story is all about the sexual connection. It is there to turn readers on.

That's my basic answer.

I'm also writing a stepbrother series (novellas). I was thinking about it for so long and I was wondering if the stepbrother trend was slowing down. I thought even if it is I'll be able to get my series out by mid to late August at least, I'm sure I'll sell a few copies.


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## DGS (Sep 25, 2013)

Maybe step books are so popular because the reader know the desire HAS to be authentic for this to happen. In (US) the lines are so blurred, people so narcissistic and hook up culture so promiscuous that this could be where they find authenticity.


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