# Updated: Quitting the Day Job?



## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

This is a hard one.

I have a nice day job. I put in a lot of hours but I have significant downtime (some might have noticed me on here a lot during Australian work hours) and I get paid reasonably well. I own a house, with mortgage at about 2/3 its value, and my housemates help subsidize the cost. I don't have many expenses since I live like Gollum in his lightless cave live simply and don't crave expensive things.

Anyway.

Writing has really gripped me since I started self-publishing. I've written a modest amount, part time, in the seven months that I've been in the game... but I can do more. I want to do more. I have a huge document full of ideas that are dying for more time to pour into them. I'm in a position where I could, assuming any and all books bring in exactly $0 for the next year, "pay myself" the same pay I'm getting now for a full year to write full time. I'd give myself the same conditions -- the same pay, the same "leave", the same work hours minus transit time, etc etc. For a year, with ample reserves left over in-case something bad happens.

As one can imagine I'm giving this prospect some serious thought.

I'd be holding myself to quite a vicious schedule since this would be a "work" endeavour. It'd be a full year of some serious butt-in-chair time, but it also means a lot more *free* time too, since I won't have my current daily grind; a 10 hour work day including commute and overtime, then getting home and writing till I have to rest for work again.

I know I have a lot to learn, still, about every aspect of self-publishing, including the writing bit. If I did this, I plan to focus on broadening myself out; I want to write some fantasy, some paranormal, some sci-fi outside of the Lacuna series, some romance, some erotica scratch that I suck at it, some comedy and humour, everything really. I want to go through my WIP pile and start pruning it down. I'm basically going to throw as much mud as possible and see what sticks.

I'm just concerned that, well frankly, I don't think I'm good enough to take that step yet. That's just a simple statement of fact; I'm not "total garbage" and I know how to avoid the basic mistakes so I'm okay, I suppose, and I have editors to wipe up the worst of my drool, but there are a lot of writers on these forums alone whose ability far outstrips my own. It is what it is, there's nothing wrong with that. Don't take that to mean that I don't think I can make a living with writing, it's just that I'm not sure I can do it within a year. I'd need some serious volume, and I'd need to be better. Nothing I've written has that sense about it that it's a breakaway novel just waiting for exposure to a big enough audience, because there are those around on Kindleboards -- I know because I've read some of them -- and I can't quite do what they do. What you all do.

I guess I just -- I don't know. I don't know if this is the chance to really live the dream, as they say, or just a great way to lose a bunch of money and a year on my employment history (looks bad on a resume). The main thing motivating me is mainly that... well, I'm 27 and I am dead sexy. I don't want to be the guy that worked a safe government job for the rest of my life, always dreaming about what could have been, you know? Worst case -- I still have my qualifications, I still have some experience, and I'll still have my books (and hopefully a lot more).

I almost went through with it earlier in the weak and chickened out (_bwak bwak bwak_).

Everything is all set up. All it would take is an email to my boss and four week's notice to wrap things up; since I'm not even in a management position I could probably wiggle my way out even earlier if I wanted.

What the hell should I do?


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

What does 50-year-old you wish you had done when you were the age you are now? Probably take a risk.

Edit: There's nothing quite like an upcoming mortgage payment to motivate one to action. I can see you doing some contract or part-time work to pad the budget as needed, and if you're confident about being able to pick up a job again in a year, go for it.

I quit my crap job (and it was a true crap job, earning less than 30k/year) in 1998 and I've been self-employed in a number of careers ever since. I had a couple of broke months, but I saved when times were good and have been lucky (knock wood).

I'm a night owl, so staying up late and getting up when I want is awesome. I appreciate it every morning.

It would be irresponsible to encourage you to quit if you didn't have savings and skills, or if somebody else was going to have to support your unshaven, housecoat wearing self. But if it's just you who has to eat noodles ... go for it.


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## 41352 (Apr 4, 2011)

Do you earn enough from writing to pay all your expenses and set something aside? Then it's fine.
If not, wait. If your current job lets you write, then maybe stay put. 

My experience: I left my job because it was hell and I couldn't write. At all. I do work apart from writing - I am freelancer translator and I do get quite a lot of jobs, and my earnings from writing complement that so that I have enough to live on - though not much. I couldn't take on a loan right now, for instance.

How about you?


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## Carol (was Dara) (Feb 19, 2011)

This is the kind of thing that's hard to advise on because so much is dependent on your unique situation, you know? There are so many variables, like, can you count on your book sales to stay the same or (hopefully) go up as you put out more work over the next year? Do you have a cushion in savings to fall back on in case of, say, a medical emergency? Is the job you have now one you like? One that might be hard to get back if writing full-time doesn't work out like you want? 

This is stuff only you know the answer to. I've seen several indie authors announce recently that they've quit their day jobs but I think that step takes a lot of confidence and (usually) a pretty steady income from their writing. Then there's the question of follow-through. I thought when I quit my job I'd be writing all day. But I've since found out I don't have the discipline to write seven or eight hours per day like I expected. Instead I write 2-4, which is more or less what I did when I was working out of the house.


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## JGray (Mar 7, 2012)

I can't tell you what to do because I'm not yo mama (I think), but I can tell you what _I_ would do in your situation.

I would continue working during the day, writing at night. I would keep trying to put out good work, keep promoting, keep trying to expand my writing horizons.

I wouldn't quit my job until I start to make some serious cash, maybe enough to replace my work salary. The economy might be better in Australia, but in the U.S. it's pretty damn hard to find a job nowadays.

I'm sorry if I'm a debbie downer.


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## 41352 (Apr 4, 2011)

Another idea: can you take like 3 months off, see how it works for you? Would they keep your post for you/give you a similar post easily if you went back?


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## RikNieu (Jun 2, 2012)

As someone who's been struggling to buy something as simple as food for more than a year now, I'd advise you to keep your day job. Until your sales can feed, house and heal you, that is.


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## DevonMark (Jan 28, 2011)

Can you cut down the hours of the day job? Go part time, maybe a two to three days a week? It would free up a whole lot of time for writing, but importantly would still mean an income. The difference between no income and even a modest wage is important, even if only psychologically. I'm lucky enough to work from home as a programmer so it has been easy for me to gradually cut back my work to make space for writing, but without some income I couldn't have done it. The other thing to consider is the labor market. Here in the UK current circumstances mean if you give up a job you are not going to be able to walk back into another one a week or a year later. Maybe things are different in the US. If you think you CAN do so then I'd say you've nothing to lose. On the other hand you are twenty-seven. While it might seem old to you and that your life is flashing by, there are plenty of people reading your post thinking "young pup, what is he fretting about, he's got years yet..."


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

David,


All joking aside (as we all know I tend to do too much of that at times)...

I was downsized out of my day job. I was forced to "go full-time."

Fortunately, I landed steady contract work (at almost the same time) to keep some money coming in, I have a spouse who strangely believes in me, and I've been in that situation for about 15 months.

The reality of it is this: I average between $175 - $300 (it was near $300 for a three-month period during the winter months of the northern hemisphere) from my writing alone, and have from November 2011 to present. That means from March 2011 to October 2011, I made much less... close to nothing. But I started with no books published.

The humiliating part is of that $175-$300, about 90 percent of that is earned by a pen-name for some throw-away stuff I wrote just for kicks. My real name hasn't taken off yet, though I have a good feeling about EyeCU.

And the upside is, my contract work is steady enough to make up a chunk of the difference!  So I'm not homeless yet. But it's like working 2/3rds time at a day job. Sometimes 1/2-time. So I cut out the time and expense of commuting, with the contract work... but it's not all writing time for me. Not yet.

In the US, $175-$300 USD is still not enough to be contributing what I used to, to my family's budget, when I had a day job. I'd need to up that by a factor of 10 to get back to where I was when I had a day job.

I think it'll take two to five years of really hard writing work to get to that point, for me.

Now here's the thing:

You're not starting from scratch, so you're further along than I am. Or was, at least.

So look at the "extra income" you're bringing in now from your writing alone. If you're bringing in more than $175-$300/month, you're better off than I am now after 15 months full-time.

If your nest egg only extends you for a year... you need to be about halfway to your goal income from writing alone to be ready to take a shot.

If your goal income is $1,500/mo., you should take the leap when you're averaging $750/mo.

Unless, like me, you can find a "work-at-home" second income source. And, no, I'm not talking about those late-night get-rich-quick schemes. I just mean some sort of secondary income that allows you to work at home and devote around half your day to writing.

If you can do that, you can start sooner, and at a lower monthly writer income.

If you're willing to do side-work of some sort, and can find a steady supply of that work... stuff you can do out of the home... you can take the leap now, probably.

Then you could do something similar to me: Devote the first half of your work day to the contract work, then write during the second half of your day.

It's a gradual first step, but would allow you to lose the commute and the full-time day job a bit sooner.


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## Simon Haynes (Mar 14, 2011)

At least in Oz we have very good public healthcare - that's something a LOT of my US author contacts specified as the number one reason they still had jobs.

Speaking from my own point of view, I'm 44 and I've been working from home since 2005. I posted about this in another thread so I won't go over it again, but suffice it to say that if you took away all my writing income from the past 8 years our situation wouldn't be a whole lot different. In other words, I've never relied on my writing income to survive, it was always the computer programming which paid the way.

This year it's started to tip the other way, and if it continues like this programming will become the hobby and writing will become the job. (Except the beauty of ebook income is that you write once and earn forever ... there's no customer support and no rewriting all your code for the latest version of windows.)


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## Patty Jansen (Apr 5, 2011)

As long as you have a mortgage, don't.


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## Rin (Apr 25, 2011)

Are you able to take a long leave without pay?

I don't know what level of government you work at, but I know the Brisbane City Council lets their FT staff take decent amounts of time off (shuffle secondment staff or temp pool people around), so if things don't work out, you'll have a job to go back to.


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## That one girl (Apr 12, 2011)

Speaking as a 34-year-old single mother who took a risk and decided not to go back to the grind when I was laid off 19 months ago: best decision of my life. It will take major dedication, lots of time, and superhuman ability to focus, but you can totally do it.


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## David Wisehart (Mar 2, 2010)

I quit my day job, and highly recommend it. Not everyone is cut out for a life of self-employment, but too many people cling to dead-end day jobs when they should strike out on their own.

Here's an article worth reading, "10 Reasons You Should Never Get A Job":

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2006/07/10-reasons-you-should-never-get-a-job/

David


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## That one girl (Apr 12, 2011)

David Wisehart said:


> I quit my day job, and highly recommend it. Not everyone is cut out for a life of self-employment, but too many people cling to dead-end day jobs when they should strike out on their own.
> 
> Here's an article worth reading, "10 Reasons You Should Never Get A Job":
> 
> ...


Wow... I actually read that article shortly before I was laid off (I could sense it coming) and it was a major inspiration for my decision to not go back into the same field. Thanks for reminding me of this great post.


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## B.A. Spangler (Jan 25, 2012)

It sounds like you are in a reasonably nice position to take the risk - your mortgage is covered and other expenses can be picked up by sales.

Your young, your in IT, take the risk for a year and re-evaluate later. If I had a same opportunity, I'd be all over it.


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## thesmallprint (May 25, 2012)

David, there are far too many sensible responses on this thread. 

You're a young man with ideas, talent and enthusiasm and, I presume, good health. You have no mouths to feed other than the one below your nose.

Do it.

Good luck

Joe


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## A.A (Mar 30, 2012)

Can't stand Steve Pavlina personally, but I did like his thinking in that article.

I left work in 2009 for family reasons (to homeschool one of my children) but I had already built up passive income sources online - which I kept working on like a demon (during the nights) and I did end with a great income stream.
I would be over the moon (several times!) if I made the money from books that I do from my the content I write for my websites. Considering that I only have one book at the moment - that's highly unlikely lol.

But - I do believe that with hard work, you can absolutely get there - you're already a good way down the road. And it's the best feeling to know that you created this income out of nothing, out of something you pulled out of your head (along with any necessary research of course!)

Sounds like IT isn't where you want to be. If you have the cash to cover it, a Dave Gap Year sounds very cool!


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## Maya Cross (May 28, 2012)

I'm going to buck the trend and say go for it. 

I'm in a very similar position at this moment. I have a good sized nest egg saved from what I've been doing over the last few years. That income has now dried up (it was always going to eventually) so my choices are to try and find employment again in some kind of "proper job" (*she shudders violently*) or burn some of that nest egg pursuing writing full time. 

Like you, I'm 27, and that was a pretty big factor in making the decision. The older you get, the more consistent demands you have on your money. It's true right now you have a mortgage, which is certainly a factor, but you have no wife or child depending on your paycheck. If this does blow up in your face, nobody is going to suffer for it but you, and that really sells it for me. You only get a few chances to be young and stupid.

Even if it doesn't work out I'd rather be able to say I gave it a legitimate shot, that I gave it 100% of my focus, than to say I failed because I never really tried.

Perhaps we should gather a group of Australian dreamers and make a pact that we all give it a shot, and those that fail get free room and board in the mansion of the one who succeeds =)


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## Zelah Meyer (Jun 15, 2011)

Chrystalla said:


> Another idea: can you take like 3 months off, see how it works for you? Would they keep your post for you/give you a similar post easily if you went back?


This is a really good idea. Several companies will offer unpaid 'career breaks' to people who have been with them for more than a set period of time (usually a year or two.) Worth scouring your contract/office HR manual to see whether this option is open to you.

It can be a lot harder to get back into a job than it is to leave one.

I'm a cautious soul (all but two of my post-Uni working years have been working in temporary or contract positions. I've only had one permanent job!) and it's good to have the money saved up. It sounds as if this is the case for you - but it's still a big step and a big chunk of cash on the line that you could spend paying off some of your mortgage.

If the day job made it impossible for you to write, then it might be worth considering if you have (a) savings & (b) skills and experience that make you someone who is in demand in the workplace. If you are able to do both, then I'd personally advise doing so until you are earning enough from the writing on a regular basis to justify quitting your job (and, being cautious, I'd give it a year so that I could average out the highs & the lows of the book-selling year.)

At the end of the day though, it's your life, so it's your call. If you are the only person affected by your decision, then you are the only one who matters. Good luck.


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## AshMP (Dec 30, 2009)

I can only tell you what I've told you before ... do it.

Then again, I've been where you are. For different reasons when I was 25 I left a job that others would chew off their left arm for. It wasn't that I didn't enjoy what I was doing -- like I told you before as well -- I did, it was that it didn't feel like what I should do for the rest of my life.

I think that, being that your so young and have this opportunity, you'll look back in twenty-five years and if you _didn't_ do it feel regret.

My point is, you're so young ... you DO have talent, I've read your books can have attest to that. It's not about who has MORE talent than you ... that's not always what makes success come knocking. Success favors the brave. It favors the person who is will to work hardest for it.


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## arvel (Jun 23, 2012)

It sounds to me like you're thinking of doing a year off not quitting to live off your writing. If you're taking a year off, then I say go for it. I've done it in order to improve my writing and just focusing on moving my life in the direction I wanted to go. It was the best decision of my life. I was happier and when I returned to the workforce I knew what direction I wanted to move towards and how to do it. 

I've also had several friends take a year off for several different reasons. None have ever regretted it. So as long as you can afford it, I suggest going for it.


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## NathanWrann (May 5, 2011)

When I was 27 I "struck out on my own" and opened a coffee shop. We made less than $0 profit for the first few years and probably could have kept going (stretching the mostly-cash business here and there to pay for personal bills, feeding ourselves from the food that we sold) but health costs came into the picture so I left the business and went into the corporate world, where I've been for the past 7 years. 

In the past 7 years I've made 2 independent movies and written 4 books (3 published). I'm building a collection of available content and hope to retire before I turn 41 (in 2 years and a few months) and live off of books while giving myself time to continue writing and go back into independent film and theater.

The point of this story is that even if you don't "make it" it's not the end of the world. You just pick yourself up again, get another day job for a few years and try it all over again. 

What I would highly suggest is that you make a business plan and stick to it (look online for "how to write a business plan"). Make sure that it has where you want to be in six months, 12 months, 24 months, 36 months and the contingency plans to follow if you aren't hitting your levels. The hardest part will be when you're making 75% of what you should be at the 12 month point and you have to decide "I'm so close, do I keep going or do I go back to the day job". Your business plan will guide you. 

Good luck!


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## Hugh Howey (Feb 11, 2012)

Do it. You can get another day job. You only get a few chances to chase your dreams. Worst case scenario is that you go back to work a year or two from now, but you have a handful of completed titles to promote.

You know what your current situation is like. Try something different. It's not like you can't undo this decision. I have never, even when the economy here was in the pits, not been able to go out and find some crap job that paid the bills.


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## AmsterdamAssassin (Oct 21, 2011)

dalya said:


> It would be irresponsible to encourage you to quit if you didn't have savings and skills, or *if somebody else was going to have to support your unshaven, housecoat wearing self.* But if it's just you who has to eat noodles ... go for it.


That's it, David. Get yourself some rich woman and become the parasite you've always wanted to be.

I feel like a pimp sometimes when my wife leaves for her full-time job, while I take care of the children and work on my books, but that feeling rarely lingers after my first cappuccino... I supported my wife, now it's her turn to support me.


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

I'm way too gutless to take a plunge like that, so I'll recuse myself. Just wanna wish you luck on making the decision.


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## AmberC (Mar 28, 2012)

We took that leap as well. We have a year of money saved until Seth would have to get a job if this isn't bringing in at least a few grand a month. We have five kids and a mortgage so it was a very difficult decision. We don't have any regrets. I think we will look back in a year and high five our bravery. You only live once. Good luck with your decision David!


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## Jana DeLeon (Jan 20, 2011)

I struggle with this every single day. I am making great money indie-publishing. The last two months, I've made almost half my annual salary each month. All my debt is paid besides house and rental property and my husband has a good job. 

BUT - and there's always a but. 

My day job pays very well, requires zero overtime, provides no stress, has flexible hours (including two work from home days a week), has great benefits for very cheap and I actually enjoy the work. With the economy the way it is right now in the US, I know I'd never be able to recreate the same situation again, so I keep trudging along. 

If I hated the job or made crap money, etc. I would have already been long gone, but when you're in a good employment situation, it's a lot harder to make that call. Especially if you're REALLY risk-averse, like me.


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## RikNieu (Jun 2, 2012)

Jana DeLeon said:


> I struggle with this every single day. I am making great money indie-publishing. The last two months, I've made almost half my annual salary each month. All my debt is paid besides house and rental property and my husband has a good job.
> 
> BUT - and there's always a but.
> 
> ...


Oh wow. That sounds incredible. Well, keep doing what you're doing I guess.


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## Amy Corwin (Jan 3, 2011)

vrabinec said:


> I'm way too gutless to take a plunge like that, so I'll recuse myself. Just wanna wish you luck on making the decision.


Me, too. And especially since, I went from making good money on my ebooks to making next-to-nothing the last few months. So I'm glad I didn't decide to quit my day job. Amazon changed their algorithms and my previous success vanished like an overcharged electron. Now it's a matter of essentially starting all over again to make a success of it.

You just never know what the future will bring.

But I really applaud anyone with the guts to take that chance. For many people, it really pays off!


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Apart from the fact I do anything Hugh Howey tells me -- _aaaanything_ -- ... yeah. There's a lot, a _lot_, of really good feedback in this thread and... the overall consensus is that I may be stupid forever, but I'll only be young and stupid once.

A ship is safe in the harbour... but that's not what ships are for.

Let's do it.

Leeeeeeeeeeeroyyy...!


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

Awsome. Good luck, man.


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## RikNieu (Jun 2, 2012)

David Adams said:


> Apart from the fact I do anything Hugh Howey tells me -- _aaaanything_ -- ... yeah. There's a lot, a _lot_, of really good feedback in this thread and... the overall consensus is that I may be stupid forever, but I'll only be young and stupid once.
> 
> A ship is safe in the harbour... but that's not what ships are for.
> 
> ...


Well, mate, take notes then. And then write a book about it later either way! 
Good luck!


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## JohnHindmarsh (Jun 3, 2011)

David,

I usually perch on the edge here, and do not comment all that much. However, your posting strikes a strong chord. I freelance in software, and have done so for nn years. [Yes, I am that old!].

I first wrote science fiction when I was about 12 years old. However, Australia was not the place for a budding writer when I was working out what I wanted to be when I grew up. [I still have not worked that out - and not sure I grew up]. I regret not following my creative muse, to the extent that this is my last year of IT, and as of January 2013 I will be following my muse full time - the die has been well and truly cast.

I dipped my toes in the water last year; I re-wrote a space opera that had been rejected by NY publishers and left to languish on a shelf, hidden away until I came across the old mss, read it and thought it had promise. Thus Broken Glass. And I kept on working in IT - so no new writing. And I am kicking myself for deferring again.

We write in a similar genre. I just purchased your book [Lacuna: Demons of the World] because I thought I could not comment if I had not read your book, at least in part.

So let me be a critic for a moment - something I really do not like doing and generally avoid. Blunt comment - you need far stronger editing. There are very obvious contradictions, jarring details, loose writing, etc. in the first few pages.

On page 1 your protagonist is in the People's Liberation Army and on page 3 she is in the People's Navy. Now you could tell me the Navy is a part of the Army - but that needs to be in the story.

On page 1 again - 'as her consciousness returned to her' - um - well, it is not likely to return to someone else - OK, a trite observation but I am trying to get a point across.

Page 1 again - 'Overcome by a spasm of coughing, the dust made ...' - The dust was overcome by a spasm of coughing?

OK, I won't drill down further in a public environment. And some of the forum posters might like to weigh in with their comments. [Now don't flame me, I am trying to be helpful here].

So - my recommendations -

Grab your muse, go with it - take a year out and write like there is no tomorrow. At the same time, make sure your work is professional - find alpha readers and a good story editor. Work your axse off.

At the end of 12 months, review where you are and what you have done. Reflect on your muse - and on the work you have produced. Take a vote - continue or head back into IT.

I was given some advice years ago - associate with people who are the people you want as peers - so keep involved in this and other forums, read some of the good writing blogs - understand the business.

Get a damned good editor.

Cheers,

John


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## JumpingShip (Jun 3, 2010)

I'm not sure what your profession is, but if you can go part-time or become a 'consultant' so you can still bring in something while you're writing, it might be a good idea to do that first. If that's not possible, but you think you can your job back or one similar to it if things don't work out, then go for it!  

I'm going part-time just as soon as my job lets me. Instead of working two 12 hour shifts and two 8 hour ones every week, I'll go to just two 8hrs one week, and three the next. I can't wait! When I work my 8 hour one, I'm home by 3pm, so that gives me so much more time to be with my family, make dinner and still have time to write on those days. I'm fortunate that I also will have the option to pick up extra days either at the hospital I work at now, or a couple of others that are in the same system and are less than 30 minutes from my home. One nice thing about our book royalties is we know two months in advance what we're going to get so if my April sales suck, for example, I can request to pick up more days in June to make up the difference. (of course, I hope I won't have to!)


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Dude, thank you so much for doing that! I devour feedback like a hungry beast so yeah.



JohnHindmarsh said:


> On page 1 your protagonist is in the People's Liberation Army and on page 3 she is in the People's Navy. Now you could tell me the Navy is a part of the Army - but that needs to be in the story.


I should mention that, you're right. Technically the correct name is the "People's Liberation Army Navy" -- but to English speakers, that's unwieldy and looks like a typo. In the second book, actually, I point it out but... well, yes. In common usage it's just often just the Chinese Navy, or sometimes the People's Navy. It's something I guess I never really considered and nobody's pointed out before. I'll have to take a look at this and I'll probably issue a minor revision to address it. Nice catch, thanks! 

The other stuff... yeah. Basically, going to freely admit, Demons is my first novel. It's a bit rough around the edges despite attempts to fix it up. Eventually, though, I guess I have to move on -- I'm happy to fix any lingering typos or whatnot, and while I'd love to just spend more time editing... I can't. Eventually you have to move on.

Edit: Also, the naval air component of China is technically called the "People's Liberation Army Naval Air Force". o_o


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## jackz4000 (May 15, 2011)

I'm not going to give you much advice David. If you're 27, what do you really have to lose by writing full time? Probably not too much? Since you can afford to spend a year, live frugally and write and learn this ever changing business the worst that can happen is you'll run out of money and need to get another job. Right now in the US that could be difficult, but you are downunder.

That's the worst if it doesn't work out. Not a huge risk. If you had kids and all that it would be a bigger risk.

The worst thing that will hit you in 20 years is--the things you should have done. And the regrets you didn't do them.

If you keep learning and do just Ok, you might be able to make $30K writing after a year FT. If you continue to get better each year your sales will probably increase each year. The more you write, the better you can get and you will make more sales. Good luck.


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## LinaG (Jun 18, 2012)

My thoughts--

I hear you on leaving the job to write.  I think you should do it... eventually.  When I read your financial position, you strike me as a cautious (not in a bad way) careful person.  You are a planner.

Your approach to leaving your full time job should speak to that part of you.  Yes, it is tantalizing to think about chucking it all in one fell swoop.  But I wonder if you will be comfortable with that approach in the long run.  Because you are going to be spending your hours creating and writing, your level of psychological comfort is important. The wrong kind of pressure can hurt your ability to be creative.

You've made a list of the negatives of your job.  Make a list of the positives.  I don't mean money.  What will you miss?  Is there a social component you like?  Getting out daily?  Etc.  You may miss none of these, but you should consider them. 

1. I like the idea of taking as long a break as possible while still not quitting.  If you can get a couple of months, perfect.  This will give you the chance to "live the writer life" and see if it is what you want.  The day after day in the chair, the seclusion. Can you produce as much as you thought you could?  If it turns out that you'd be better off with some kind of part time gig and writing, you can adjust your approach and work something out with your current employer.

2. While you are on this extended break, take a creative writing class.  Not a beginning one, but one suited to your needs.  One of your goals is to improve your writing.  Improving your writing takes more than butt in chair time.  You trained to do whatever job you currently have, so a bit of training for your dream job only makes sense.  You could spend years learning on your own what you could pick up in a good class. It will save you time and aid your production.

3. This:

"What I would highly suggest is that you make a business plan and stick to it (look online for "how to write a business plan"). Make sure that it has where you want to be in six months, 12 months, 24 months, 36 months and the contingency plans to follow if you aren't hitting your levels. The hardest part will be when you're making 75% of what you should be at the 12 month point and you have to decide "I'm so close, do I keep going or do I go back to the day job". Your business plan will guide you." 

I have a feeling that would be a good approach for you, keep you focused once the initial euphoria wears off!

Oh, an if you get a part time job, I suggest one in a university business or law library. All the better to land yourself a sugar mama!

Good luck!
Lina


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Sounds like you've made up your mind. Have fun. 

I'm Real Job-free for three months now, and it is the best thing I've ever done. Ever.

I'm not a bestseller, but I'm a someseller, and I do about as well now as I did at my old job. You can be successful without ending up like Bella Andre. I suspect you're somewhat like me in production capability, discipline, and whatnot, so here's my advice (like I actually know what I'm talking about, pfft):

1. Focus on the novels. They're typically the money makers. That's what your readers want. Get them out, and do it as fast as you can without sacrificing quality.
2. Focus on the series. Finish this one before starting another. Bouncing between series spreads out releases and gives readers time to lose interest. (Getting readers to jump between series is harder than you would think.)
3. Focus on the writing. This is a little tougher to say if you're not profiting yet, but you are the only one who can write what's in your head; everything else can be hired out. Collect smart people to be your production team. Get them working on the various levels of editing, get a smart and inexpensive cover designer, and get your butt in the chair for the next book.
4. Don't focus on traditional marketing. It's tempting, but ineffective, to sweat over pushing the old stuff. The best marketing is a new release. Backlist only needs a few gentle pokes a year.
5. Only write the fun stuff.


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

Do it!

At age 29 my husband and I quit our full-time "great" jobs, sold the house, bought an RV and hit the road. We had two years of income to live on and almost no personal possessions. We sold them all and our house. We had the giant RV, a tow car, and whatever we could fit inside the mobile headquarters. Our plan? To pick a place we wanted to visit, find a campground job for the season, and explore to our hearts content.

Best Decision I We Ever Made!

Seriously, I thought my husband was Crazy (capital C) when he brought me this plan. So did our family and friends. Eventually I came around though. We always got one of two reactions: You did what or Oh my God, that's incredible!

David, those five years are something I will forever cherish. We did end up working at campgrounds, for a few years anyway (and never had to touch our two years of savings). Then we decided we didn't want to do that anymore and started our online art business. It's been almost ten years, and I have never once regretted quitting the "safe" job. When the economy went to crap in the US, guess who was the most financially stable out of all my family (I have a big family, too). That's right me and my artist husband. Everyone else was losing jobs and homes and in general stressed to the point of getting ulcers.

Not us. We'd already retired the RV and bought a house (using our two year savings as a down payment). It's a modest one in a small town, so the mortgage is low. There was no one to fire us. We just worked harder in the lean months (and we've had plenty of those, let me tell you). But we've had really good months too...and freedom to do whatever we want, when we want, and to just take a Tuesday off if the fancy strikes us.

As Hugh says, you can always get a crap job to cover the bills if you have to. Life is too short to play by someone else's rules. Besides, if you're writing everyday, as a full time occupation, imagine how your skills will grow!

Good luck! I hope all your dreams come true.


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## The world would be prettier with more zebra strip (Apr 20, 2011)

One Question:

Can you still provide the same level of editing/cover/promotion, etc without a job?

If you can provide the same amount of professionalism with your books, I say that's fine. If you are asking yourself 'do I get this cover?' or 'do I eat this week?' then you need to stop and think.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Dam_Good said:


> Can you still provide the same level of editing/cover/promotion, etc without a job?


Important question and yes, I'd be "paying myself" up to the same wage I was getting before.


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## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

David, you've made a great and wondrous decision. I wish you well and even if you end up the year sort of broke and only modestly successful on the books,  you are not going to regret taking a year of your life to follow your dream.

And the chance that you will succeed is very real.

I can't wait to see how it goes for you.


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## Thomas Watson (Mar 8, 2012)

Hmmm... First I need to _find_ a day job...


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## 31842 (Jan 11, 2011)

It sounds like you have already made your decision, but I just wanted to join the mob of cheerleaders saying "RAH RAH! QUIT THAT JOB! TELL THE BOSS TO SHOVE IT!" *high kick* *human pyramid*



David Adams said:


> I'm in a position where I could, assuming any and all books bring in exactly $0 for the next year, "pay myself" the same pay I'm getting now for a full year to write full time.


If this is the case, you have absolutely no risk. Doooooo eeeeet! Live your dream! You only get one shot on this planet and I don't think pushing papers is where it is at. NOW is the time! Seize the diem!


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## Jan Strnad (May 27, 2010)

Thomas Watson said:


> Hmmm... First I need to _find_ a day job...


I know of a job that's coming open in Australia...

David, I could tell from your post that you were doing this no matter what anyone said, and that's how it should be.

Best of luck to you!


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

I quit a great corporate job to just "go for it" when I was in my mid twenties, and I've been self-employed ever since. The wonderfully freeing thing about being self-employed is-you are in charge of your income. Want more? Work smarter and/or harder.

It's very liberating, especially if you can plan, follow the plan, and save a cushion for rainy days. Most of my daily happiness comes from counting my blessings first thing in the morning, followed by a good cup of coffee, and then getting down to my chosen worklove.

If you're truly doing something you enjoy, the excitement of being able to do it, is wonderful.

I've never regretted doing what I "love", (my husband is the same way) we live in house that's paid for (on the water i. e. Gulf of Mexico), own another we rent out for some minor income, budget for our expenses, and pay for our own health insurance (can't ever lose it, since it's not tied to a job). 
Do what you want. Life is too short not to.


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

It sounds like you're taking the jump, David, and I'm SO excited for you! I absolutely think you should go for it! My advice might be different if you had kids to support or no money saved. But you're young and it sounds like this is the perfect time to take this risk.

I came to the same decision last month. I was very lucky because my job is basically giving me a year off to try this; if it doesn't work out or I miss the security of working, I can go back. But even with that safety net I faced a lot of resistance from certain friends and family when making my decision. One good thing about that resistance: it proved to me the strength of my conviction. No matter what argument or advice anyone gave me, I began to see that it didn't matter. _I wanted this_. So, so bad. It sounds like you're in the same place.

I say go for it. Have fun, be scared, be excited, get overwhelmed, be willing to fail. I highly doubt you'll ever look back and regret it.


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

Presuming you have only yourself to take care of...

Get a junker to drive. Drive it to an area of the country with cheap housing. Rent a pit. Eliminate all monthly payments. Forget about maintaining a dollar dependent life style. Establish a fitness program you can do for free. Take a big step down. Then just do it. It's easy. I've done it each time I've gone broke.

While you are doing the above, keep an eye open for whatever other opportunities might arise. They might be better than writing. Who knows?


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## Nicole Ciacchella (May 21, 2012)

I'm never really comfortable with telling people what I think they should do, but I am comfortable using my own life as an example.  As a married 35-year-old who has two children, I now realize that when you are young, unmarried, and have no children, it's the best time in life to take risks.  I'm very happy with my life, but I had some opportunities that I didn't take in the past because I chose the path of caution, and I regret them very, very deeply.  If I could tell my younger self only one thing, it would be: Take that leap, girl!

I'm now determined to seize the "crazy" opportunities whenever I can.  It's why I decided to self-publish.  I'm a stay-at-home mom, and my three-year-old son will be starting preschool in the fall.  I'd been thinking for some time about what I'd need to do once he's in school, because I knew I'd need to look at reentering the workforce for the sake of bringing in some more income.  Now, to say I don't want to go back to an office job is a *gross* understatement, so I decided to take these next two years, self-publish everything I can, and see if I can make enough to prevent having to go back to a regular day job.

So, yeah, I'm pulling for you.  I hope everyone here who wants to do so will eventually be able to quit their regular jobs and write full time.  At any rate, you can count on me cheering you on!


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## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

I started making preparations to quit the cubicles about 16 years ago when I discovered the kind of people I would be working for in just about every job that required technical skill or problem solving.  I think I can sum it all up in one phrase:  "do it wrong or you're not being a team player."  I had one good boss in my entire working career.

Turns out I was right and the timing was excellent.  I decided I actually wanted to produce something in my career, so I stopped pursuing salaried jobs.  It took quite a while to learn how to do it, but now I am building a good foundation for future earnings regardless of the economy or job market.

I'm what you would call "unemployable."  I have way too much experience running the show to ever work as an employee now.  At the same time, I have a lot of hard-won business skills too.  The pay hasn't always been great, and I do spend a lot of time on non-creative work, but there is no dollar greener than the one you make yourself, and there is nothing better than taking a product to market and seeing it sell and make people happy.


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## GUTMAN (Dec 22, 2011)

Good luck David.

The healthcare in Oz should help your decision, since that's a huge sword that hangs over us in America.

One last thing to consider: you don't _have to _go cold turkey. You could talk with the boss and explore part time; working part time whilst writing part time would extend the $ x 2.

Whatever you do--I wish you the best


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

For all of you who work from home, what kind of job(s) do you do? I'm just curious. I would love to work from home. I have so much programming and IT skills and I feel like it's going to waste with the current part-time day job I have. I make about $10k a year. My dream is to work in the videogame industry as a career, but after about 8+ years of rejections from resumes, I feel so discouraged. I would love to work from home and be able to balance programming with my writing, but I have no idea what to do or how to do it and still manage a steady income. 

I really don't write to make money. I just do it as a hobby, but it seems lately my writing has been opening more doors for me than trying to apply at a game company. But it seems like the writing can be so unpredictable when it comes to income. One month you might be great, the next, you may not see a single sale. I can't live like that. I really need something steady, and I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket. 

So what do you all do to make steady income from home


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

I think those of us telling David to go for it, are looking at his _specific_ situation. He has some books out, knows he can produce more of equal quality, has roommates to help out, has a cushion (savings wise), is young, unattached, in good health, etc.

Now if he had a mortgage on a $400,000 home, two kids getting ready to go into college, and his ebook income was only enough to make one of his two car payments, *the advice would not be the same.*


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## sbaum4853 (May 3, 2010)

Good luck to you! I think you're going to have a blast.


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## Rachel Schurig (Apr 9, 2011)

Deanna Chase said:


> Do it!
> 
> *At age 29 my husband and I quit our full-time "great" jobs, sold the house, bought an RV and hit the road. We had two years of income to live on and almost no personal possessions. We sold them all and our house. We had the giant RV, a tow car, and whatever we could fit inside the mobile headquarters. Our plan? To pick a place we wanted to visit, find a campground job for the season, and explore to our hearts content.
> 
> ...


This is so awesome! Seriously, you're kind of my hero right now


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> I think those of us telling David to go for it, are looking at his _specific_ situation. He has some books out, knows he can produce more of equal quality, has roommates to help out, has a cushion (savings wise), is young, unattached, in good health, etc.
> 
> Now if he had a mortgage on a $400,000 home, two kids getting ready to go into college, and his ebook income was only enough to make one of his two car payments, *the advice would not be the same.*


Absolutely. Context matters.


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## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

> So what do you all do to make steady income from home


The most important thing is to get help. No matter how intelligent you are, or how cool your idea is, one person can only do so much. If you can learn to delegate and learn to limit your vision to small projects that are easily completed, at least initially, you'll find things are much easier. You have to ship products.

For the first few years I did the exact opposite, and I didn't get much accomplished. Now that I have help, we've shipped something like 18-20 games in the last six months, and we're not really overworking anyone.

If you have programming skills and you want to do games, look into doing really simple casual games for mobile or the web. There's a very large and growing market for those kinds of games: far larger than for console or big PC games.


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> I think those of us telling David to go for it, are looking at his _specific_ situation. He has some books out, knows he can produce more of equal quality, has roommates to help out, has a cushion (savings wise), is young, unattached, in good health, etc.
> 
> Now if he had a mortgage on a $400,000 home, two kids getting ready to go into college, and his ebook income was only enough to make one of his two car payments, *the advice would not be the same.*


I'm pretty much in the same situation David is in, only I live with my parents instead of roomates. I'll be 30 next month x_x


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

RM Prioleau said:


> For all of you who work from home, what kind of job(s) do you do? I'm just curious. I would love to work from home. I have so much programming and IT skills and I feel like it's going to waste with the current part-time day job I have. I make about $10k a year. My dream is to work in the videogame industry as a career, but after about 8+ years of rejections from resumes, I feel so discouraged. I would love to work from home and be able to balance programming with my writing, but I have no idea what to do or how to do it and still manage a steady income.
> 
> I really don't write to make money. I just do it as a hobby, but it seems lately my writing has been opening more doors for me than trying to apply at a game company. But it seems like the writing can be so unpredictable when it comes to income. One month you might be great, the next, you may not see a single sale. I can't live like that. I really need something steady, and I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket.
> 
> So what do you all do to make steady income from home


I don't know anything about the gaming industry, but can you write apps and do that as a side job? Like Words with Friends? Or FB apps? Seems like since the traditional doors aren't opening for you, you should try to figure out a way to open your own. Good luck to you.

I am a glass bead artist. I sell beads to jewelry designers and my husband makes collector marbles and glass supplies called murrine that we sell to other hot glass workers. It's a decidedly specialized market. I have friends who make rubber stamps, one who is a candle maker, others who make metal jewelry components, another is a book designer, one who sells model trains on eBay (he does very well by the way).


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## Pnjw (Apr 24, 2011)

Rachel Schurig said:


> This is so awesome! Seriously, you're kind of my hero right now


 I feel like I should be wearing Betsy's cape.


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

heavycat said:


> The most important thing is to get help. No matter how intelligent you are, or how cool your idea is, one person can only do so much. If you can learn to delegate and learn to limit your vision to small projects that are easily completed, at least initially, you'll find things are much easier. You have to ship products.
> 
> For the first few years I did the exact opposite, and I didn't get much accomplished. Now that I have help, we've shipped something like 18-20 games in the last six months, and we're not really overworking anyone.
> 
> If you have programming skills and you want to do games, look into doing really simple casual games for mobile or the web. There's a very large and growing market for those kinds of games: far larger than for console or big PC games.


I've released three games (one commercial game) for the PC which was done pretty much by myself. I had to hire an extra scripter and a music composer out of pocket which had me ending up taking out a loan, which I've just now finished paying off. It took about a year to about to years to release each one. The thing about hiring people is that it costs money, and if you don't have it, how do you get it without going deeper in debt? it defeats the purpose of having a steady income if you don't have the money to start in the first place. I understand where you're coming from. I guess I'm just in a weird situation. I've been told I was 'overqualified' when I applied at some of the game companies. Others said I didn't have enough experience for certain entry-level positions I applied for. Unfortunately, where I live, there is little in the way of game industry here. I've just been looking for a foot-in-the-door job, but it seems they only want people who are fresh out of high school or college for that. So, I actually went back to college and got a degree in game design and immediately tried to apply/intern, and I still had no luck 

For now, I am doing Flash programming on the side, in addition to writing, but neither are currently paying the bills. I would love to try and learn from those who are currently working from home and how they got to do what they're doing now with little finances to start with/depend on.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

ok, I'll stick my neck out here.

Three or six months isn't enough time. If you're going to go for it, go for it, and you are in a position to do so. (As others have mentioned, no kids dependent on you and health care not an issue with savings in the bank)

_If that is what you want_, then you should do it.


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## Rykymus (Dec 3, 2011)

If I were in your shoes, I'd go for it. At your age you've got plenty of time to "re-invent" yourself should it not work out. Just be sure to set a minimum goal (financial wise) that you must achieve by a certain date, and be prepared to return to the labor force should that goal not be met.

But I honestly don't think you're going to have any problems. Besides, the "Hugh" hath spoken.


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## phil1861 (Dec 22, 2011)

Look for a book by John Acuff called Quitter, it's all about his own pursuit of quitting what he didn't like to do what he did like, but he outlines how he did it without the risk of having to force a living from something that didn't exist yet, his dream career. 

Some cliff notes: 
a:reduce the risk by getting out of debt
b:bank what you need for the next few book production costs by staying with the old job until you've achieved a:
c:don't exchange one boss for 10; mortgage, food, debt, car, ... each obligation can become a new boss that applies pressure to write and sell to produce a certain outcome and the finances do not match up
d:can you live comfortably on the income produced by the dream job? If not, you might not want to put that kind of pressure on the dream job until you can

My own plans are to evaluate in seven to eight years after I no longer have a mortgage (my wife and I already live on one income and we both work) to see can we live and shift to just my book earning income.


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## James Bruno (Mar 15, 2011)

I gave up a good-paying career with good future prospects in order to devote myself to my writing. But I planned it out years in advance, sort of like a business plan: Learn the craft. Write books, get agent(s), get published. I did this while holding down a full-time career requiring frequent moves. And then came a wife and two kids. But I stuck to my plan. When the time came to cut the shackles, my wife also gave up her lucrative job and we just settled down and struggled for several years. Friends and family were convinced we were nuts. But my books have sold well and I'm crashing on others. The feel of doing what you love is very liberating. So, given your sitution, I'd probably go for it.


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## phil1861 (Dec 22, 2011)

RM Prioleau said:


> For all of you who work from home, what kind of job(s) do you do?.
> 
> So what do you all do to make steady income from home


I'm in IT and an Active Directory Architect; just so happened that my company split into three and I joined one of the commercial companies that didn't have an office in my city (I didn't really need to be co-located in a local office to do my job anyway). That said, I found it hard to even find IT jobs where they would countinence someone working from home, but it's been a boon for my writing life.


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## Edward W. Robertson (May 18, 2010)

Congrats on taking the plunge, David. Being self-employed is scary but awesome.

A lot of great advice already. My only addition would be to keep one eye out for freelancing opportunities, be they one-offs or regular gigs. The two variables are obviously time and money; depending on how badly you need the latter, that's going to inform how much you're willing spend of the former. Sounds like you've got enough saved that you might never need to freelance, but if you start to get into a tight spot, even a crummy-paying gig that doesn't eat up too much of your time can really stem the bleeding.

Oh yeah: and pants are optional.


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

Edward W. Robertson said:


> Oh yeah: and pants are optional.


That is the coolest line...It should be the writer's motto.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

It's a tough question to answer, David, because almost every person here probably has a slightly (or very) different attitude toward risk than you do. Also, many people answering may not have read your work and therefore may not have a clear sense of whether it's likely to be able to support you, long-term (and we all know it's a crap-shoot, too ... "good" does not equal "bought"). I'd be very leery of following advice from someone who says, "I quit my day job, and it was the best decision I ever made!" May be be true for them, but you're not them. Same with people who tell you they really wish they'd stuck with stable employment ten years back. Lastly, only people familiar with Australia's social safety-net will have a good sense of exactly what risks you'll be running (lower risks then you'd be running in the U.S., I imagine, where quitting your job means quitting your health insurance).

Maybe what you should do is take a piece of paper and make some columns: "best-case scenario if I quit my day job" vs. "worst-case." Things like "I actually make more money" and "I'm no longer stuck in a job I don't like" could go in column A, and things like "I lose my house and ruin my credit" and "I don't get a government pension when I retire" could go in the other. You could also make "best-case scenario if I keep my day job" vs. "worst-case" columns.

Does the "worst-case" column for quitting make you feel sort of ill, or do you look at it and think, "Yeah, that would suck, but I could handle it"? Is one "worst-case" column much worse than the other?

Then you can take other factors into account that might be relevant: do you have 6 months of living expenses in the bank? How replaceable is your job? Is there anyone you can fall back on for help if you need it? Would it be possible to take a leave from your job without losing it, or to go down to part-time? Are there things you can do to mitigate the risks, such as aggressively paying down your mortgage for a couple years? How unhappy are you in your current situation, and how is that affecting you?

I totally don't envy having to make this decision ... best of luck, whichever way you go!


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Becca Mills said:


> I'd be very leery of following advice from someone who says, "I quit my day job, and it was the best decision I ever made!" May be be true for them, but you're not them.


Just pointing out--there's a significant difference between someone saying "It was the best thing _I _did" and someone saying, "It's the best thing _you _will do."  Folks are just sharing their experiences.


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## Genesis Blue (Jun 27, 2012)

My advice is to take the leap. After 6 months, evaluate your progress and decide if you need to figure something else out for money. If you push hard though, you will likely be surprised at where you are in half a year.

I quit my job 4 months ago after my last baby was born and while I worked from home before that, I was done with having bosses and deadlines. I'd built up some decent passive income and I also live in Guatemala, so our expenses are low. My husband is a musician, so his work is spotty and definitely not enough to live on. We've done just fine so far and I feel it was the best decision I have made in my life. I can now focus on my own projects, not deal with bosses and I have no real deadlines. Once in a while, if we need a quick cash infusion, (like buying a new laptop or something), I will take on some freelance jobs, but that's about it.


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## MJWare (Jun 25, 2010)

I only read the first page of the replies, so forgive me if any of this has already been said, but I have two thing I think you should consider:

1. Don't take advice from total strangers on a message board (yes, that includes me) about the future direction of your life. Talk to family and friends, people who know you and your situation.

2.* If you do decide to quit your job, open a couple credit cards first*. I know you don't want to live off of credit, but they can really help in a pinch. Plus, you'll sleep better at night knowing they are there.

Once you quit your day job, you won't be able to get any credit for a good while (unless you get lucky and strike it big). I did this when I quit my job to start my own company and believe me it was nice to have them.


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## 39179 (Mar 16, 2011)

David, you've already got a ton of fantastic advice from so many of the kind people here, so the only thing I'll add is good luck to you and keep believing in yourself. And let me just say that again - keep believing in yourself.


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## lacycamey (Apr 25, 2011)

I seriously love this thread! David, I say to totally go for it! Life is too short not to follow your dreams. And as Einstein said it best—"Creativity is more important than knowledge." You may not always "know what to do", but you have creativity and creativity combined with action will always bring you to where you need to be. 

I second what Andrew said below, "to believe in yourself." Keep seeing yourself how you want to be...even if you don't "feel like it" at times because you become what you think about most of the time.

So, my 28-year old advice to you is —do it! Believe in yourself. And then surround yourself daily with positivity. Cut out visual images and see them everywhere and never let yourself sit down and entertain with fear and doubt for too long. We all face fear and doubt...but how many of us shut the door when they come knocking? Imagine away…you have everything to gain and nothing to lose. Very happy for you and for everyone else in this thread who are pursuing writing full time! So cool! Hope to join you all very soon! CHEERS!


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## R M Rowan (Jul 13, 2011)

RikNieu said:


> As someone who's been struggling to buy something as simple as food for more than a year now, I'd advise you to keep your day job. Until your sales can feed, house and heal you, that is.


 Sending good vibes your way! 

And, David? If you feel the itch, and you can reach it without help, then by all means, scratch it.


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## MBlack (Mar 12, 2012)

I'm rooting for you, too, David. Whether you do it now or later, good luck!


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## A.A (Mar 30, 2012)

Dave, have you come across David Estes? He's young man from Sydney who recently made the big decision to become a full-time fiction writer (he writes YA & dystopia)
I see him all the time around the Goodreads forums 

http://davidestesbooks.blogspot.com.au/2012/05/life-changing-news.html



> Don't take advice from total strangers on a message board (yes, that includes me) about the future direction of your life. Talk to family and friends, people who know you and your situation.


MJAware, that's usually the best advice - though, hey, we're all writers here, and that changes things somewhat


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## pamclaughton (Feb 21, 2011)

David,

I started my own business about 8 years ago and my only regret is that I didn't do it sooner. You're in a perfect position to dive in and give this your all. A few tips...

Be disciplined and put in more time than your normally would, at least until you establish a level of productivity that you are comfortable with.  Because you are basically starting your own business. The first year, I was up very early and worked in the evening as well (not writing, but the message is the same). I was determined to start things off well. I was also working out of my house, and just the time you save from not commuting every day is a huge help, let's you put that energy into the writing.

I'm not sure what kind of work you do now, but you can always consider picking up an occasional contract/project every now and then to keep yourself 'in the game' and to bring a little money in. That way, if you do decide to reenter the workforce at some point, it doesn't look like you took a year off, you can truthfully say you were 'consulting'. I've seen that make a huge difference when people are looking to go back full-time, as it explains the gap in a way that doesn't scare people off because you're still doing some related work.  

Good luck!
Pam


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## ChrisWard (Mar 10, 2012)

David, I think that if you can afford it and if its what you want, then you should go for it.

It was always my dream to be a full time writer.  The older I've got the more I've realised that I wouldn't to be cooped up all day, every day.  The romance of it is great, sitting in some high-ceiling attic room somewhere with a nice countryside view churning out masterpieces, but the reality, a few hours here and there hunched over a laptop in sweltering summer heat, for me is quite different.  Plus, I love my job.

I'm an assistant language teacher in a Japanese high school.  I have hardly any responsibilities, the kids love me because I do fun stuff and give them candy, and I get huge chunks of downtime which allows me to write or market.  And because I'm teaching English I'm also learning about words while I work.  The downside is that I have a five year contract and I'm just starting my final year.  This time next year I'll be getting kicked out of my job and home.  I'll probably end up working somewhere with a grueling teaching schedule and living somewhere with an astronomical rent.  Pretty much like I was doing before this job.

My feeling these days is to spread yourself out as much as possible.  I'm thinking to take some kind of editing/proofreading qualification so that I could offer that as a sideline.  In an idea situation, I'd teach three days a week, and have the rest of the time for writing/writing related work.  At the moment, though, its impossible as I'm making any money.  My Japanese wife isn't interested in art, only in hard coin, so unless I sell as far as she's concerned what I do is about as useful as the hours she wastes on Facebook.  My friends mock and laugh when I mention the books.  Proving people wrong is a massive motivator for me.

Anyway, before I got into that massive digression, what I was trying to say was go for it if you can, but keep your options open, and don't put all your beers into the same fridge, so to speak.

Good luck!


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## GUTMAN (Dec 22, 2011)

headofwords said:


> My friends mock and laugh when I mention the books.


In the words of the great Ray Bradbury, you need to fire them and get some friends who believe in you.


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## House Divided (Oct 14, 2011)

Hey Dave,
It sounds like you've already made up your mind! But it sure is scary, isn't it? I've been there myself and had a child to support. I'd been working for a number of years as a Respiratory Therapy Tech but I wanted to be a Registered Nurse. Nursing has a lot more flexibility and I wanted to travel. So, I had to make a choice - could I hang on through four years of school on what I had saved? One thing I knew for sure - in four years I was going to be 40 years old whether I went to school or not. Did I want to be 40 and an RN or 40 and wondering why I didn't try. I am a Registered Nurse and it was the hardest four years of my life, but I have enjoyed every minute of it since  Dave, in a year you'll be 28 years old whether you try or not. Do you want to be 28 and wonder why you didn't try or 28 and know you are a successful writer! I always read your posts because you have such great enthusiasm for your writing. Perhaps a year of channeling that enthusiasm into your writing will make you believe in yourself and your abilities.
Wishing you the best of good fortune$$$$$


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## Alain Gomez (Nov 12, 2010)

RM Prioleau said:


> For all of you who work from home, what kind of job(s) do you do? I'm just curious. I would love to work from home. I have so much programming and IT skills and I feel like it's going to waste with the current part-time day job I have. I make about $10k a year. My dream is to work in the videogame industry as a career, but after about 8+ years of rejections from resumes, I feel so discouraged. I would love to work from home and be able to balance programming with my writing, but I have no idea what to do or how to do it and still manage a steady income.
> 
> I really don't write to make money. I just do it as a hobby, but it seems lately my writing has been opening more doors for me than trying to apply at a game company. But it seems like the writing can be so unpredictable when it comes to income. One month you might be great, the next, you may not see a single sale. I can't live like that. I really need something steady, and I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket.
> 
> So what do you all do to make steady income from home


Like Deanna said, have you tried looking into apps? I really think that's where the gaming money is these days. Personally, I make a steady income from home by teaching the violin privately. Gives me plenty of time to write when I choose


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## Alain Gomez (Nov 12, 2010)

To David,

I'm 26 and I've been self-employed for almost 4 years now.  I highly recommend the experience if it's at all possible for you.  I would recommend two things if you decide to take the plunge:

1) Establish a work schedule for yourself now while you're still in "productive mode" and stick to it the day you quit.  Don't give yourself any down time or you'll find that the whole week has slipped by with nothing accomplished.

2)  Don't bank on a single source of income like a regular salaried job.  I think this is where a lot of newly self-employed people get into trouble.  There's no boss to guarantee you'll make XX dollars every month.  So you have to be pulling in money from various sources that may not be writing or could just be various forms of writing.  For example, do freelance magazine work while writing ebooks.  That way if one source runs a little dry you have the means to make up for it with other areas.


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## pamclaughton (Feb 21, 2011)

RM Prioleau said:


> For all of you who work from home, what kind of job(s) do you do? I'm just curious. I would love to work from home. I have so much programming and IT skills and I feel like it's going to waste with the current part-time day job I have. I make about $10k a year. My dream is to work in the videogame industry as a career, but after about 8+ years of rejections from resumes, I feel so discouraged. I would love to work from home and be able to balance programming with my writing, but I have no idea what to do or how to do it and still manage a steady income.
> 
> I really don't write to make money. I just do it as a hobby, but it seems lately my writing has been opening more doors for me than trying to apply at a game company. But it seems like the writing can be so unpredictable when it comes to income. One month you might be great, the next, you may not see a single sale. I can't live like that. I really need something steady, and I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket.
> 
> So what do you all do to make steady income from home


I don't work from home anymore, now have an office and actually prefer going there everyday. Helps that it's right around the corner from where I live, so commute isn't too awful.

But, what I do is placement, staffing. And what I'm thinking you might want to try is to sign on with a contract staffing agency. Let them know you have an interest in gaming. They may not be able to immediately place you into a gaming company, but if you have good, current skills, they should be able to use you for other projects and that will give you steadier income, and help build your resume.

Plus, as someone else mentioned, you can focus on programming apps on your own. Once you have an app or two, add that to your resume. That could open doors to work with gaming companies as they are always looking for good talent. A lot of those tech companies are open to people working from home as well.....maybe not initially, but once you've proven yourself you may have chance to work from home one or more days a week.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

I'm a crazy busy bee on Friday nights but I was reading all the comments on the way home on my phone -- crazy stuff. There's a HEAP of good advice here! Thanks everyone!


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## B.A. Spangler (Jan 25, 2012)

So when do you announce what the decision is?


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## sunnycoast (Sep 10, 2010)

Been there, done that.

Highly recommend it. 

I think I even chose to do it on the same latitude as you ... except I was about 1000ks east of Darwin.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

bxs122 said:


> So when do you announce what the decision is?


About a page back.

Doing it. 

Trip to the US next year. If I'm making enough from writing to keep my head above water, I'll dance in Times Square like the Almighty Hugh.


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## Rin (Apr 25, 2011)

David Adams said:


> Trip to the US next year. If I'm making enough from writing to keep my head above water, I'll dance in Times Square like the Almighty Hugh.


..are you sure you don't mean "*to* the Almighty Hugh"? Cause I'm imagining...a bonfire and probably some human sacrifice.


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## Christine Murray (Oct 4, 2011)

Best of luck! Both myself and my husband gave up other jobs for self-employment and full-time writing and it's the best decision we ever made.

So when do you hand in your notice?


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)




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## Rich Walls (Feb 4, 2012)

Congrats David and good luck ---

To keep the discussion going, this was a great TED speech from a couple years back. The artist has scheduled for his lifetime career a one year sabbatical every seven years. Working on two premises, this allows him to take a step back from his work and come back with new focus, and also, it allows him to take five of the retirement years he had planned in his 50's and use them instead in the prime of his life.

http://www.ted.com/talks/stefan_sagmeister_the_power_of_time_off.html

For you David, this hopefully will give you a little added confidence. Your worst case is pushing retirement back a year or two, and even in that scenario, you'll have given yourself a year to remember. Enjoy!


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## Thomas Watson (Mar 8, 2012)

David Adams said:


> About a page back.
> 
> Doing it.
> 
> Trip to the US next year. If I'm making enough from writing to keep my head above water, I'll dance in Times Square like the Almighty Hugh.


Someone needs to be there with a video camera...


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## Emily Ryan-Davis (Jun 8, 2012)

David,

You don't know me from anybody, but for years I posted in every random "do you want to quit the day job?" thread that I'd NEVER quit the day job. I enjoyed the work (more or less), I liked the reliable income, I needed to be out of the house with other people (that's actually a lie to talk myself into the day job - I'm a natural hermit and perfectly content to only go outside for exercise and grocery shopping). So on, so forth, all the sensible reasons to keep the day job.

Right now I'm 6 weeks into "full-time writer" (and stay-at-home/work-at-home mother) and all those reasons I used to list? I was fooling myself.

I did it sooner than planned, because my full-time job downgraded to a part-time job after I had my son in December and my employers were making me miserable with their efforts to cram full-time job work into part-time hours, but I had a modest savings left over from maternity leave, I had books in queue just languishing waiting for me to have the time (around an infant and a job...yeah, there was no time) and I had a willingness to go back to a day job before the end of the year if writing wasn't paying off. Right now, only 6 weeks in, the writing is paying off to the tune of nearly double my day-job pay (your results may vary depending on sales and income needs) so I say one of the best life decisions I've ever made.

I second the pp who pointed out you're young with nobody else dependent upon you for food and shelter, you have savings in the bank and in-demand job skills in the event you have to go back. All signs point to "do it".


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## BrianKittrell (Jan 8, 2011)

David Adams said:


> Trip to the US next year. If I'm making enough from writing to keep my head above water, I'll dance in Times Square like the Almighty Hugh.


Do ring if you travel around the southeast at all.

I've avoided this thread. It's one of the few by David that I have dodged because I know what I would do, and I would be afraid to recommend that or the alternative to someone considering such a huge decision. I'm not saying those who have are bad, not at all. I would be devastated if I said, 'Do it!' and it didn't go well or 'Don't! No!' and we're both left wondering what could have been. The only thing I can say is congratulations.

(Sometimes I post the pro's and con's, but those might be totally different in Australia. I'm only qualified to speak of how screwed up the US is. lol)


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## Sophrosyne (Mar 27, 2011)

Good luck! I started e-publishing when I was already out of work, after my unemployment had run out, and my only regret was that I didn't do it sooner. I had thought about it. I don't know what stopped me.

I'm now making more as a full-time writer than I did as a full-time employee. And you can't beat it for flexible hours. The hard thing is to make sure you keep yourself on a writing schedule. It's too easy to get sucked into marketing stuff and forget to keep writing.


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## D/W (Dec 29, 2010)

David, I wish you much happiness and great success!


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

I hope it works out for you, David. And I hope the sharing of my experiences and insight helped you gauge how ready you were to make the leap.


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## B.A. Spangler (Jan 25, 2012)

David Adams said:


> About a page back.
> 
> Doing it.
> 
> Trip to the US next year. If I'm making enough from writing to keep my head above water, I'll dance in Times Square like the Almighty Hugh.


Awesome!!


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Rin said:


> ..are you sure you don't mean "*to* the Almighty Hugh"? Cause I'm imagining...a bonfire and probably some human sacrifice.


Woolies do not practice human sacrifice any more.



Christine Murray said:


> So when do you hand in your notice?


Probably Monday, if my nerves hold out.



dalya said:


> Posting Metalocalypse


I love you and I want to hold your hand.



BrianKittrell said:


> I've avoided this thread. It's one of the few by David that I have dodged because I know what I would do, and I would be afraid to recommend that or the alternative to someone considering such a huge decision. I'm not saying those who have are bad, not at all. I would be devastated if I said, 'Do it!' and it didn't go well or 'Don't! No!' and we're both left wondering what could have been. The only thing I can say is congratulations.


It's my decision and I'd never blame anyone else if it went pear shaped. 

Lots of support in this thread. Make me all <3 over everything.

Okay time to have nerves of steel and make it happen!


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

I've learned a lot in this thread, too. Thanks, everyone.


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## Jan Strnad (May 27, 2010)

I never would have given up freelancing for a day job but for one thing: *health care*. At over $1000/month for a sucky plan that didn't pay anything until I'd already spent another $5000 a year, I simply couldn't afford to freelance any longer.

Now I'm stuck until the Medicare kicks in at age 66. Unless I hit it _really_ big.

*Big* congrats to all those who've made it work, and best wishes again to you, David!


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## crcowden (Apr 26, 2012)

JUMP David JUMP. A well lived life should be an adventure. You're young. You have few commitments. Don't be boring....or a chicken. 
CR


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

crcowden said:


> JUMP David JUMP. A well lived life should be an adventure. You're young. You have few commitments. Don't be boring....or a chicken.
> CR


Unless ... deep down ... you really want to be a sexy chicken.


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## MonkeyScribe (Jan 27, 2011)

David Adams said:


> Woolies do not practice human sacrifice any more.


No, you have to go to the more conservative sect to see that, the Hughgonauts.


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## Christine Murray (Oct 4, 2011)

Jan Strnad said:


> At over $1000/month for a sucky plan that didn't pay anything until I'd already spent another $5000 a year, I simply couldn't afford to freelance any longer.


Sorry to derail the thread, but is that usually how much healthcare costs in the US? I have one of the most comprehensive plans in Ireland and it's €91 p/m per adult. Kids are €200 per year. I can't get my head around that spending that much on insurance.

Mind you, Ireland is one of the most expensive countries in Europe to live in, even despite the recession. So I guess it's swings and roundabouts.


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## RikNieu (Jun 2, 2012)

Christine Murray said:


> Sorry to derail the thread, but is that usually how much healthcare costs in the US? I have one of the most comprehensive plans in Ireland and it's €91 p/m per adult. Kids are €200 per year. I can't get my head around that spending that much on insurance.


I dunno about the States but I'm in South Africa and that's ridiculously cheap for a healthcare plan. €91 p/m wouldn't even cover the cheapest hospital plan here, never mind anything near a comprehensive one. I'm thinking the US would be more expensive?


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## maritafowler (Nov 27, 2011)

Rich Walls said:


> To keep the discussion going, this was a great TED speech from a couple years back. The artist has scheduled for his lifetime career a one year sabbatical every seven years. Working on two premises, this allows him to take a step back from his work and come back with new focus, and also, it allows him to take five of the retirement years he had planned in his 50's and use them instead in the prime of his life.
> http://www.ted.com/talks/stefan_sagmeister_the_power_of_time_off.html


Rich - interesting video. Thanks for the share.


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## Christine Murray (Oct 4, 2011)

RikNieu said:


> I dunno about the States but I'm in South Africa and that's ridiculously cheap for a healthcare plan. €91 p/m wouldn't even cover the cheapest hospital plan here, never mind anything near a comprehensive one. I'm thinking the US would be more expensive?


I didn't realise it was that expensive. I can totally understand how that would be a block to giving up the day job, especially if you have dependents.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Christine Murray said:


> Sorry to derail the thread, but is that usually how much healthcare costs in the US? I have one of the most comprehensive plans in Ireland and it's €91 p/m per adult. Kids are €200 per year. I can't get my head around that spending that much on insurance.
> 
> Mind you, Ireland is one of the most expensive countries in Europe to live in, even despite the recession. So I guess it's swings and roundabouts.


Individual policies for my family would have cost $1000+ a month if I wanted to cover pregnancy, and that's with pretty high deductibles (which is how much you have to pay out of pocket before the insurance actually starts doing anything). Healthcare is indeed that expensive.

Options for bridging the gap are becoming available. Local healthcare providers in my area have banded together to sell reduced cost services directly to patients, and that's only about $500 biannually per family. It's not insurance, but you get a much lower rate, so it's more affordable. That's what my husband and son have. I'm under twenty-six, so I've gone on my parent's government insurance for two years. It's the only way I was able to quit my job with benefits full-time. (Pregnancy would still wipe out our savings, though. Good thing I am soooo done with diapers.)


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Jan Strnad said:


> I never would have given up freelancing for a day job but for one thing: *health care*. At over $1000/month for a sucky plan that didn't pay anything until I'd already spent another $5000 a year, I simply couldn't afford to freelance any longer.
> 
> Now I'm stuck until the Medicare kicks in at age 66. Unless I hit it _really_ big.
> 
> *Big* congrats to all those who've made it work, and best wishes again to you, David!


What... you mean 1980s-era Marvel and DC page-rates didn't make you a billionaire?  LOL


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

dalya said:


> Unless ... deep down ... you really want to be a sexy chicken.


Ahh, there you go, promoting the Sexy Chicken agenda again! This is a family board!

I mean, really, before you know it, Bill, Eric and Alcide will have to compete for Sookie's affections against a Sexy Chicken! Where will it end?

  

Actual Robert DeNiro - Charles Grodin quote from MIDNIGHT RUN:



> *Jonathan Mardukas:* You ever had s-x with an animal Jack? Remember those chickens on the Indian reservation? There were some good looking chickens there Jack. You know, between us...
> 
> *Jack Walsh:* Yeah, there were a couple there I wouldn't mind taking a shot at.


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## maritafowler (Nov 27, 2011)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> Ahh, there you go, promoting the Sexy Chicken agenda again! This is a family board!
> 
> I mean, really, before you know it, Bill, Eric and Alcide will have to compete for Sookie's affections against a Sexy Chicken! Where will it end?


ROFL. A love quadrangle with a were-chicken.


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## JFHilborne (Jan 22, 2011)

David: The best of luck to you. Sometimes you have to take the risk. I just took the leap myself and resigned from my full-time job to go full-time as a writer. 4 weeks of notice to go and I'll be out on my own. It's daunting and thrilling, and worth the risk. I'd rather regret what I do than what I don't.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

I am so thankful I live in Canada. When I quit my job and lost my insurance, I was disappointed that I'd have to pay for my dental care, Rx, and massages. I can't imagine living somewhere that getting sick (or, hell, pregnant), would wipe out my savings. Here, I get sick, I go to the doctor, I pay my taxes.


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

Krista D. Ball said:


> I am so thankful I live in Canada. When I quit my job and lost my insurance, I was disappointed that I'd have to pay for my dental care, Rx, and massages. I can't imagine living somewhere that getting sick (or, hell, pregnant), would wipe out my savings. Here, I get sick, I go to the doctor, I pay my taxes.


Yeah, AND you have Mounties. Friggin Canada. What's that aboot?

Wait wait wait. Massages are covered too?


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Not as part of universal health care, no. 

However, when you get "health insurance" at your job, they cover things like massages, physical therapy, Rx, ambulance rides, etc. Since hospital stays are already covered for us by universal health care, the "health insurance" at a company would cover a private room, for example.


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## jackz4000 (May 15, 2011)

Health insurance in the US is a sad story.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Which is why asking these kinds of questions on an international forum can be rather tricky. For me, quitting my job to freelance and contract wasn't a huge deal. Sure, paying for medications is costly without a prescription plan, but it isn't going to kill me. However, I can't imagine quitting my job and not being to afford to get sick. 

So, yes, I quit my full-time, high-stress job with homeless people two years ago. No, I don't regret it. Not for a moment. I freelanced, I contracted. I now have a part-time job at a place I contracted. I write. I clean my house. I love my life.

But I also don't need to worry if I'm hit by a car.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

So you need substantial savings to ensure that you can cover all of the small stuff then? Ouch.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Come to Canuckistan. You can work on the rigs.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Van's too expensive (and too wet). Try Halifax.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Come to Canuckistan. You can work on the rigs.


Yeah but then you have to live around... you know... Canadians. They're scary. 

Edit: Anyway, I like nationalists so... if I were going to move up to Canuckistan I'd hie myself over to Quebec. They make the rest of Canadians mad and I like that about them.  And I could work on my French. Hey, win/win!


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## RikNieu (Jun 2, 2012)

I've eye'd Canada many a time. I'd love the opportunity to live there. But alas, it cannot be.


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## pamclaughton (Feb 21, 2011)

Christine Murray said:


> Sorry to derail the thread, but is that usually how much healthcare costs in the US? I have one of the most comprehensive plans in Ireland and it's €91 p/m per adult. Kids are €200 per year. I can't get my head around that spending that much on insurance.
> 
> Mind you, Ireland is one of the most expensive countries in Europe to live in, even despite the recession. So I guess it's swings and roundabouts.


$5,000 a year is actually on the inexpensive side. I pay $700/month or almost $9000 a year and that's for a single plan. My office colleague pays $1300 a month for family and my sister pays over $1500 a month. A friend of mine gets his through his union, but it comes out of paycheck and his 'cadillac' plan runs over $25,000 a year.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

T.L. Haddix said:


> I'd have to give up my guns if we moved to Canada, wouldn't I? Sigh, I'll pass.


Ah, but you don't need them up here


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

JRTomlin said:


> Yeah but then you have to live around... you know... Canadians. They're scary.
> 
> Edit: Anyway, I like nationalists so... if I were going to move up to Canuckistan I'd hie myself over to Quebec. They make the rest of Canadians mad and I like that about them.  And I could work on my French. Hey, win/win!


Plenty of history in Quebec. You'd have a blast in Montreal as an anglo.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

One of my best life-experiences I had was taking off in a car the summer I was sixteen along with a friend of mine (who received a gas credit card from her dad as a graduation gift). 
I worked in a carnival in a dunk tank, learned what a go to hell hat was, went muddin in the mountains, spent the night on peoples' land by pitching a tarp over a rope (for a tent). I met the most interesting people and had a blast. I wouldn't trade that six weeks for anything.





P. S. We (my husband and I) pay almost $600 a month with a 5k deductible for health insurance here in the US, which isn't relevant to the discussion, but I thought I 'd throw it in here anyway.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

T.L. Haddix said:


> Have you ever been shooting? It's FUN! You get to blow stuff up - stuffed toys from yard sales and refilled-with-water two-liter bottles are the best.


You can do that on your own property if you have a farm.


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## GUTMAN (Dec 22, 2011)

Friends in Canada:

It may be hard to believe, but folks go BANKRUPT in America if they get sick and are uninsured.  (They can also be insured and go bankrupt, depending upon coverage.)

It would be marvelous to have the option to move to Canada for healthcare as a writer.  Alas, the Canadian government is very cranky about letting us slackers come in and become citizens.  I understand it's very difficult--you have to marry a citizen or have a career they need.  I'm pretty sure my bride would object to the first option, and I'm quite sure Canada does not need more writers.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Gutman said:


> Friends in Canada:
> 
> It may be hard to believe, but folks go BANKRUPT in America if they get sick and are uninsured. (They can also be insured and go bankrupt, depending upon coverage.)
> 
> It would be marvelous to have the option to move to Canada for healthcare as a writer. Alas, the Canadian government is very cranky about letting us slackers come in and become citizens. I understand it's very difficult--you have to marry a citizen or have a career they need. I'm pretty sure my bride would object to the first option, and I'm quite sure Canada does not need more writers.


Lord, no, we have enough writers up here 

However, it's easy as pie to get a job up on the rigs in Fort Mac (it's less easy than it used to be, though). Of course, you'd be in Fort McMurray, but we all make sacrifices  

I can't wrap my head around the concept of bankruptcy for being sick. Does anyone know how much this would have cost, because I'm curious. My mother lost her leg a couple years ago. She spent 10 months in the hospital because the amputation continued to become infected and therefore they would not let her go home. While in the hospital, she also underwent 6 months of extensive rehabilitation to learn to walk again.

We paid about a third of her artificial leg, but the rest was covered. I can't remember if we paid separately for the wheelchair or not, but if we did it wasn't a lot. The renovations to her bathroom were not covered by the government, but they were covered by the Red Cross, since she was a senior living in poverty. That's all we paid.

How much would that have cost my mother in the US as a senior citizen? Or, would she not have had to pay because she was a senior?


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## GUTMAN (Dec 22, 2011)

Medicare is a different animal (for seniors.) I can be pretty certain that if your mom had not been 65 or over (Medicare age) that could have easily cost a million dollars, or more, here!


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Ah, but you don't need them up here


The very existence of the "Quebec cannibal" begs to differ. 

http://abcnews.go.com/meta/search/imageDetail?format=plain&source=http://abcnews.go.com/images/International/ap_luka_magnotta_dm_120619


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Gutman said:


> Medicare is a different animal (for seniors.) I can be pretty certain that if your mom had not been 65 or over (Medicare age) that could have easily cost a million dollars, or more, here!


...wow.

I think I'll stay here, thanks, and pay my taxes.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Here in Florida we get Canadians flying down to get their healthcare and surgeries done here. My parent's neighbor's daughter died in Canada after she was diagnosed with stage four Ovarian cancer. She needed surgery right away, but they couldn't get it scheduled for another two months.

My mother was a nurse (working in surgery) and it was an astounding number coming here for lifesaving surgeries (and MRI's) that couldn't be done in a timely fashion up there. I'll take US healthcare any day.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Well Australian health care works pretty well. We have both private and public hospitals, and private health cover is cheap. I have the biggest, deluxe package for my age and that's $200 a month. I've had urgent visits and non urgent visits to public and private hospitals, the urgent matters were attended to immediately and the non-urgent ones i never really had to wait very long. An hour or two in the lobby for non-urgent, with surgeries and the like sometimes with three or four days wait.

My sister was injured traveling to Canada (a barricade collapsed at an Alexis On Fire concert). Her leg got torn up pretty good. She wasn't a citizen (obviously) but she had traveler's insurance, so everything was covered. The treatment was first class, the response prompt and the outcome good. I'd be treated in Canada any day, based on her experience.

I'm with Krista. I can't understand a system where people go bankrupt for want of medical treatment, especially since even having insurance doesn't garantee it'll be covered.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

Uhh... not to be a party-pooper, but can we get off health care and it's attendant political slants (in either direction) and back onto relevant topics (like Sexy Chickens)?


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

LisaGraceBooks said:


> Here in Florida we get Canandians flying down to get their healthcare and surgeries done here. My parent's neighbor's daughter died in Canada after she was diagnosied with stage four Ovarian cancer. She needed surgery right away, but they couldn't get it scheduled for another two months.
> 
> My mother was a nurse (working in surgery) and it was an astounding number coming here for lifesaving surgeries (and MRI's) that couldn't be done in a timely fashion up there. I'll take US healthcare any day.


Your parent's neighbour's daughter, huh? I am sure I can give several parent's neighbour's daughter's stories about US medicine, too. Or, I could just tell you direct stories about friends and family and having to wait in the US health care system, being denied treatment, and having services denied to them 

Yes, rich Canadians do go to the US to pay for surgeries when they do not want to wait or have to travel out of province for special procedures. We have a 10th of the population of the US, spread across more territory. Obviously there are going to be major issues in rural areas. As I understand it, many American states have the same issues.

I was treated once in the US health care system - in Albany, NY. It was heart-wrenching and offensive (while I was in the ER in the little "room" made with curtains, I had an insurance rep come back and try to sell me insurance). My company paid for my ER visit, since I was there for work.

I have been treated in the Canadian system many times, as has my family. I've never had to wait long in the ER. Then again, I'm usually in bad shape when I show up


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> Uhh... not to be a party-pooper, but can we get off health care and it's attendant political slants (in either direction) and back onto relevant topics (like Sexy Chickens)?


Sorry Craig. We cross posted


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I haven't read this thread recently, so I'm not sure where the wandering that typically happens with WC threads has gone, but while availability of health insurance would surely be one of the elements to be considered here in the US if someone decided to be self-employed, the politics of health care are not an appropriate topic here.

Thanks!

Betsy
KB Moderator


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Your parent's neighbour's daughter, huh? I am sure I can give several parent's neighbour's daughter's stories about US medicine, too. Or, I could just tell you direct stories about friends and family and having to wait in the US health care system, being denied treatment, and having services denied to them
> 
> Yes, rich Canadians do go to the US to pay for surgeries when they do not want to wait or have to travel out of province for special procedures. We have a 10th of the population of the US, spread across more territory. Obviously there are going to be major issues in rural areas. As I understand it, many American states have the same issues.
> 
> ...


Lol, I never get my honesty questioned the way I do here. The neighbors names were (are) Mabel and Floyd Stryker. Their daughter was married and lived in Thunder Bay, CN. It was very upsetting for their family and mine. The parents would talk to my mother to ask her about options for their daughter. It was frustrating watching her try to get referrals and the surgery. Their son Cam still lives next door to my parents, and Cam's daughter has helped me at my book signings. This is not some hypothetical case, but one that touched me and my family personally.


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

So someone with stage 4 cancer died? Yeah. That doesn't happen in other countries


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Lisa, I didn't read Krista's comment as questioning your honesty, but questioning the univerality of an anecdotal case, and offering others in counterpoint.

At any rate, the discussion of the merits of the US health care system vs that of other countries is for another forum, not here. 

Subsequent posts that are not on topic are subject to removal.

Don't make me lock this thread; we may never find out what David decides.  Or has he already?  Off to read middle part of thread....

Betsy


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Betsy I didn't see your post when I posted. I'll be good.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Betsy I didn't see your post when I posted. I'll be good.


Hah! That'll be the day... 

No, I know you didn't Krista. Since I hadn't posted yet. 

Having now read through the thread, congrats on your decision, David!

I think we're pretty much done here....

Betsy


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## Krista D. Ball (Mar 8, 2011)

Just to add a small point, it's easier to make the freelance decision when younger without children, seven cats, a dog, a house, a jeep, and $40,000 of renovations needed on your house   Do it when you can!


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> Having now read through the thread, congrats on your decision, David!


Thanks Betsy. I haven't given my notice yet because I'm waiting for one small thing to come through finance wise -- but I'll post when I have!


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Just to add a small point, it's easier to make the freelance decision when younger without children, seven cats, a dog, a house, a jeep, and $40,000 of renovations needed on your house  Do it when you can!


I have a house and a car, and three cats who are greedy greedy little mongrels who are terribly spoiled and fat and never thankful for the roof I put over their heads! 

Real nervous, actually. Chasing up this last thing then I'm going to have a meeting with the boss to tell him.


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## Rich Walls (Feb 4, 2012)

Good luck David - will have a cold one for you


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## 41413 (Apr 4, 2011)

David Adams said:


> I have a house and a car, and three cats who are greedy greedy little mongrels who are terribly spoiled and fat and never thankful for the roof I put over their heads!
> 
> Real nervous, actually. Chasing up this last thing then I'm going to have a meeting with the boss to tell him.


Good luck. Keep us updated.


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## AshMP (Dec 30, 2009)

On a happier note ... congratulations David!


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## BrianKittrell (Jan 8, 2011)

Krista D. Ball said:


> Just to add a small point, it's easier to make the freelance decision when younger without children, seven cats, a dog, a house, a jeep, and $40,000 of renovations needed on your house  Do it when you can!


.... yes............. it is. Some of us are forced to wait until after the kids move out, the house is paid off, the renovations are done, the retirement starts, or whatever else. In my situation, we'd probably be okay, but I don't want to make a move like that until we have a strong savings back end. And "strong" to me is probably two or three years worth of savings. And that's if the wife would allow it. 

I look at it like some of my Indian or Pakistani friends who've moved here (and plenty of other immigrants do this). Start a business, run it well, but work another job to bring in even more money. Work hard, save, expand. That way, when you get older, you will have built your empire and can actually enjoy it.



Krista D. Ball said:


> So someone with stage 4 cancer died? Yeah. That doesn't happen in other countries


Agreed. Stage 4 is when it gets nasty, and survival probability drops nearly to zero. (something like 10%, and some of those are "miracles" (or, religion-neutral: "spectacularly against the odds")



Betsy the Quilter said:


> I haven't read this thread recently, so I'm not sure where the wandering that typically happens with WC threads has gone, but while availability of health insurance would surely be one of the elements to be considered here in the US if someone decided to be self-employed, the politics of health care are not an appropriate topic here.


And it's still not really a part of the equation for David since he's an Australian. Some might say, "Well, I would if it weren't for the health care thing," for those in the US, but I have no idea what the health care situation is in Australia. Seems to be ticking along; we haven't heard of mass extinction of Australians from E. Coli or something. lol

Ah, well. In before lock, it seems.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

BrianKittrell said:


> I have no idea what the health care situation is in Australia. Seems to be ticking along; we haven't heard of mass extinction of Australians from E. Coli or something. lol


We have a public health care system that is free, and also a private hospital. Health insurance with the private system is affordable ($200 a month for me for the fairly deluxe package) but for most people it's unnecessary. I have insurance though because the private system has better rooms and with my hedonistic lifestyle I could drop dead any moment!


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

David Adams said:


> ...and with my hedonistic lifestyle I could drop dead any moment!


*thunk*

David?

....David?


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> *thunk*
> 
> David?
> 
> ....David?


*The Dead Collector:* Bring out yer dead writers. 
[a man puts a body on the cart] 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Here's one.
*The Dead Collector:* That'll be ninepence. 
*David Adams:* I'm not dead. 
*The Dead Collector:* What? 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Nothing. There's your ninepence. 
*David Adams:* I'm not dead. 
*The Dead Collector:* 'Ere, he says he's not dead. 
*Large Man with Dead Body*: Yes he is. 
*David Adams:* I'm not. 
*The Dead Collector: *He isn't. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Well, he will be soon, he's very ill. 
*David Adams:* I'm getting better. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* No you're not, you'll be stone dead in a moment. 
*The Dead Collector:* Well, I can't take him like that. It's against regulations. 
*David Adams:* I don't want to go on the cart. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Oh, don't be such a baby. 
*The Dead Collector:* I can't take him. 
*David Adams:* I feel fine. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Oh, do me a favor. 
*The Dead Collector: *I can't. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Well, can you hang around for a couple of minutes? He won't be long. 
*The Dead Collector:* I promised I'd be at the Robinsons'. They've lost nine today. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Well, when's your next round? 
*The Dead Collector:* Thursday. 
*David Adams:* I think I'll go for a walk. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* You're not fooling anyone, you know. Isn't there anything you could do? 
*David Adams:* I feel happy. I feel happy. 
[the Dead Collector glances up and down the street furtively, then silences Dave with his a whack of his club] 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Ah, thank you very much. 
*The Dead Collector:* Not at all. See you on Thursday. 
*Large Man with Dead Body:* Right.


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## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

David,
I'm late to this thread, but just wanted to say congrats on your decision and I wish you the best of luck!


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## DidEverythingButThink (Jun 25, 2012)

David Adams said:


> About a page back.
> 
> Doing it.
> 
> Trip to the US next year. If I'm making enough from writing to keep my head above water, I'll dance in Times Square like the Almighty Hugh.


Way to go David and well wishes.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

One of many favorite passages from the Monty Python Canon of Most Holy Comedy.

Thanks, David!


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> One of many favorite passages from the Monty Python Canon of Most Holy Comedy.
> 
> Thanks, David!


I pay tribute to Monty Python, known for their ability to create comedy from sheer randomness, by repeating what they said predictably and verbatim.

Uhh...


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> One of many favorite passages from the Monty Python Canon of Most Holy Comedy.
> 
> Thanks, David!


My absolutely favorite much quoted passage....still giggling...

Betsy


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## BrianKittrell (Jan 8, 2011)

David Adams said:


> We have a public health care system that is free, and also a private hospital. Health insurance with the private system is affordable ($200 a month for me for the fairly deluxe package) but for most people it's unnecessary. I have insurance though because the private system has better rooms and with my hedonistic lifestyle I could drop dead any moment!


Wow. I'm sure there are problems with it (any system has some problems somewhere), but it sounds like a right and proper system for the most part.

_Edited to conform with prior moderator's comment. --Betsy_


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Well, I did it. After umming and ahhing and screwing around and procrastinating and setting up various safety nets and procrastinating and burying myself in Magnet: Special Mission... I gave my notice today. In four weeks, I'm a free man.

Was nervous as all hell. Stumbled a bit; tried to explain what was happening. The boss wasn't exactly happy... I'm leaving at a time when we're shortstaffed and we're already having trouble finding a replacement for a guy who left earlier... but he was very supportive. He said he supported his team no matter what, and that I had to do what I had to do. 

I nearly -- very nearly -- backed out right as we were walking out the door. The overpowering urge to just go "HAHAHAHAHA APRIL FOOLS RIGHT?!" was strong, and for about five minutes I had this "OH GOD WHAT HAVE I DONE, WHAT HAVE I DONE, WHAT HAVE I DOOOOOOOONE..." kind of feeling going on...

But it passed. Been on a really euphoric high all day, and feeling very productive. Been cleaning since I got home and I'm ridiculously cheery and energetic.

Here's hoping for blue skies ahead!


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Congrats, David!  I admire anyone who can take that kind of leap to follow a dream!

Betsy


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## RikNieu (Jun 2, 2012)

David Adams said:


> Well, I did it. After umming and ahhing and screwing around and procrastinating and setting up various safety nets and procrastinating and burying myself in Magnet: Special Mission... I gave my notice today. In four weeks, I'm a free man.
> 
> Was nervous as all hell. Stumbled a bit; tried to explain what was happening. The boss wasn't exactly happy... I'm leaving at a time when we're shortstaffed and we're already having trouble finding a replacement for a guy who left earlier... but he was very supportive. He said he supported his team no matter what, and that I had to do what I had to do.
> 
> ...


Congrats!


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## That one girl (Apr 12, 2011)

Brave man. Congrats, David. Four weeks and then you'll be one of us....


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## David Roys (Feb 25, 2012)

David Adams said:


> Well, I did it...I gave my notice today. In four weeks, I'm a free man.


Yay! Good on ya David! I really hope this works out for you.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Thanks everyone! And, yeah. Time to write like the wiiiiiind...


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## 41352 (Apr 4, 2011)

Good luck, David! Welcome to the club.   (well, I'm still not 100% only writing, but one day...)


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## David Wisehart (Mar 2, 2010)

Congrats!

David


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

David Adams said:


> ...In four weeks, I'm a free man...


Free man? FREE MAN?? FREE MAN?

No.

No, that won't do at all.

Between David Dalglish and Hugh Howey and, well, everyone here at KB, there's no way that's not changing.

Every Dalglish needs his kobold minion.

Every Batman needs an Alfred.

Every Dracula needs a Renfro, and, well... you get the idea.

So, in exactly 24 hours, I am opening up an eBay auction on acquiring the lifetime servitude rights to you... David Adams!

The auction will last 30 days, concluding August 14.

Whoever bids highest, Mr. Adams must serve for the remainder of his natural life, as a bondsman, servant, and all-around gopher.

All proceeds from the auction will be split 50-50.... with half going to the charity, Make An Evil Wish Foundation; and the other half going... in the left front pocket of my khakis.

As the Alfred to someone's Batman, Mr. Adams will of course receive... nothing. And all proceeds of all his novels past, present, and future, go into the Swiss Bank Account of the auction winner.

To open the bidding and guarantee that every bidder following me overpays, I'l start off with an opening bid of... tuppence. 

So start your bidding, folks! Forget MS Word, forget Serenity Software Editor, forget the iPad 4... you're about to acquire the best writing tool any author could own.... David Adams!

(As a side-bet, we can all lay odds on who wins the auction on Mr. Adams' servitude. Hugh Howey is even money. Dalglish pays 1.25 to 1. Adams winning the bid for his own services? Illegal and banned, cuz, "I don't want your freedom, I don't want to play around, I don't want nobody's baby, Part-time love just brings me down, I don't need your freedom, Girl all I want right now is you." Everyone else is a longshot.)


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## thesmallprint (May 25, 2012)

Well done David. Good luck on your freedom flight. May your sales always catch the thermals.

Joe


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

CraigInTwinCities said:


> Free man? FREE MAN?? FREE MAN?
> 
> No.
> 
> ...


Wow. I get nothing?

You mean... I get no more beatings?!

Oh God this is the best day of my life!


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## AshMP (Dec 30, 2009)

Yay!  Congratulations!


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## kcochran (Apr 30, 2012)

Congrats David. Yes it can be scary, but don't second guess yourself...it is jut a waste of energy and all that energy should be harnessed for the future, not wasted on the past.

Now, with that said...shut up, sit down, and write!


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## Zelah Meyer (Jun 15, 2011)

Congratulations David.

That's a determined step towards your goal.  Now you get to walk the rest of the way there!

Good luck!


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## jackz4000 (May 15, 2011)

David Adams said:


> Thanks everyone! And, yeah. Time to write like the wiiiiiind...


Congratulations David! I wish you the best on your new path. Month after month you'll only get better.


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## CJArcher (Jan 22, 2011)

Congratulations on taking the plunge, David! Fun times ahead.


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## Julie Morrigan (Jun 29, 2011)

Many congratulations! Here's to a fantastic year ahead!


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## Sara Fawkes (Apr 22, 2012)

Congratulations David!! I've been following/lurking on this thread since you first posted as I'm in a similar situation and it's so cool to see your progression!! Freedom certainly is a daunting prospect but I hope you'll end up doing very well!! Congrats!!!!!


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## James_T (May 15, 2012)

Congratulations David!

It was eight months ago that I resigned my job of 7+ years, though not with the intent to be an author, just to find something I love to do, rather than hating going to work each day.  It was scary to walk away from a pretty good salary, but my wife went back to work full-time and I've been home with my two daughters, the youngest to be starting school full-time in September.  I value these past eight months many more times than if I had continued working where I was.

After finding these boards and others, I'm getting back into reading and writing, with a plan to work on being an author and do some woodworking in my garage.  I have a couple works in progress, though until school is back in I don't get much time for them.

I look forward to working to live, not living to work, for the remainder of my life.  Sometimes things just fall into place.  Have no regrets and do what you love!


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## Michael_J_Sullivan (Aug 3, 2011)

The great thing about my self-publsihing success is it funded my nest egg for my shift to traditional.  I'm in negotiations with my next series and so far I've not had to dip into my self-publishing savings because of foreign language sales. I'm still not "earned" out on my first series, but it's only been 6 -8 months since they have been released.  I decided to "stash" away 1 - 2 years worth of "bill paying" money before quiting my day job - conservative? Yeah, but it's a tough job market these days.


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## 39179 (Mar 16, 2011)

Joining in the congratulations, David! A brave move, and I'm sure you must have been a nervous wreck at the time, but now you're transitioning out of there and into an exciting and challenging new life!


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## Thomas Watson (Mar 8, 2012)

All kidding aside, sir, sincerely wish you the best of luck and success!


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## D/W (Dec 29, 2010)

I'm _so_ happy for you, David! Congratulations on taking this bold step into a world brimming with infinite possibilities. Just think...now that you're not tied down to a full-time job, you can spend your time as you please and live wherever you want. You're _free!_ Think big, plan well, and make your dreams come true!



T.L. Haddix said:


> Do you do dishes and laundry? If so, I may have to drive to Missouri and tie up David D. so that he can't bid.


If he does dishes and laundry, I may bid too!


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## notreallyhere (Oct 8, 2011)

I'm going to add my congratulations to the rest. You are taking that first scary step - always the hardest. And I know it will be a memorable year. Good on you, David, and keep us updated! 

~Cate


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## FictionalWriter (Aug 4, 2010)

Congrats on the HUGE step! My last day was June 1, 2012 and I have to say I don't miss it one little bit. I absolutely LOVE LOVE the world of full-time writing.  Too many many many books written and lots of wild successes.


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## shadowfox (Jun 22, 2012)

One thing they don't tell you is that very often people find that going from a job to full time writing they actually produce less work.

You can counteract that by monitoring and recording production every day, by having set working times, and having production goals. Even so it takes time to learn what works for you.

Good luck.


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## Cheryl Douglas (Dec 7, 2011)

Can't wait to hear about your journey as a f/t writer! Congrats!


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## Victorine (Apr 23, 2010)

Congratulations, David.


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## JETaylor (Jan 25, 2011)

Congrats David and I hope you exceed your goals.  

I have 4 years at minimum before I can hand in my walking papers - But then major college costs will be done and the house will be almost paid and I'll re-assess.  

Unless of course - my games series goes throught the stratosphere like 50 shades did.


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## CraigInOregon (Aug 6, 2010)

*DAVIS ADAMS' FULL-TIME WRITER'S JOURNAL*

_Day 1_

Wow! I did it! The day has finally arrived! I can write ALL DAY if I want to.

_Day 1, Hour 2_

Huh. I wonder if Hugh Howey's doing anything over at KB... I'm full-time now, I can afford a few minutes over there....

_Day 1, Hour 5_

Back, finally! Whew, that was fun. Now for some serious writin'!

_Day 1, Hour 5, plus 15 minutes_

Hmmm. What's this email I just got about the next version of Android being called Key Lime Pie? I know! I'll go BUY some key lime pie. I'm a growing writer! I need calories!

_Day 1, Hour 8_

Ugh. Too much key lime pie. Where was I? Golly, I need a nap...

_Day 1, Hour 15_

Wow, that was a long nap. At least now I'm fresh! Back to writing!

_Day 1, Hour 15 plus 15 minutes_

Dang, I slept so long I'm hungry again. Time for a Vegemite sandwich!

_Day 1, Hour 16_

Pronounced deceased from Vegemite poisoning. Total word production: 250 words

*RIP, David Adams, from all of us who loved you so well... *


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