# How J.A. Konrath made $1.6 million in 3 years



## Sophrosyne (Mar 27, 2011)

I don't know if anyone's already posted this, but WOW.

Scroll down to see a breakdown of the book titles, numbers sold, amount made, etc.

He writes under pseudonyms other than J.A. Konrath, which is why you don't see all of these books popping up on his Amazon page.

http://jakonrath.blogspot.com/2013/10/guest-post-by-tom-keller-and-konrath.html

He is prolific in a way that I can't even imagine. It really drives home the point that there is no better marketing than writing another book.


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## blakebooks (Mar 10, 2012)

Um, not to be a schoolmarm, but that would be $1.6 million in three years.

He shifted 2.6 million books, including free.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

$1.6 million ain't too [crappy] though. I don't know too many authors who can say they made that much. (I do know a few though which is amazing in itself)


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## blakebooks (Mar 10, 2012)

I wasn't dissing the value of $1.6 mil. I was simply trying to be accurate, or within 60% of the actual number.


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## Vivi_Anna (Feb 12, 2011)

I love that he broke it out by book and years, and you can see that some of his books didn't do all that well considering.

To me it just shows that readers don't necessarily gobble up all of an author's backlist just because they liked one book or two.  It is all about THE BOOK.


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## cinisajoy (Mar 10, 2013)

I think the OP accidently read books sold for amount made.
He sold 2.6 million books for 1.6 million dollars give or take 10 grand.


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## EC Sheedy (Feb 24, 2011)

Vivi_Anna said:


> I love that he broke it out by book and years, and you can see that some of his books didn't do all that well considering.
> 
> To me it just shows that readers don't necessarily gobble up all of an author's backlist just because they liked one book or two. It is all about THE BOOK.


Agree with this. I haven't seen any of the highly successful authors (financially or otherwise) sell a zillion poorly written, badly edited, boring books. THE BOOK always comes first. One can only hope and strive to write dozens of THE BOOKS as so many writers now do. 

Konrath's numbers are amazing, and I'm grateful for what he chooses to share. All the big sellers are amazing. As one who is piddling along, doing good some months, not good others, I always feel indebted to the breakout successful authors. I see them as beacons who attract readers to independent publishing in general. And that is a very good thing for all of us.


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## Kay Bratt (Dec 28, 2011)

What makes it even more cool that he is such a success is that he is so transparent. 
He continually shares information, tips, and hard advice to help everyone in the community. 
He truly doesn't have to do that. 
But he does. 
And he works like a maniac. 

Well deserved. Congrats, Joe.


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## Sophrosyne (Mar 27, 2011)

blakebooks said:


> Um, not to be a schoolmarm, but that would be $1.6 million in three years.
> 
> He shifted 2.6 million books, including free.


ROFL! What's a million or so between friends? 

This is what you get when the dyslexic person posts. Thanks for catching it!


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## Cheryl Douglas (Dec 7, 2011)

KayBratt said:


> What makes it even more cool that he is such a success is that he is so transparent.
> He continually shares information, tips, and hard advice to help everyone in the community.
> He truly doesn't have to do that.
> But he does.
> ...


Couldn't agree more. Joe may be controversial, but it's authors like him who give me hope that with as many titles as he has I could be earning as much in a couple of years.


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## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

The three-year time frame is misleading, though. I've read Joe's entire blog. He's been at this ten years, not three. His work only took off in the last three years, but who's to know if the prior seven years contributed to that or not?


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## Jan Thompson (May 25, 2013)

What I got out of the article:

"2. Write when you can, finish what you write, edit what you finish, self-publish what you edit, and repeat. And make sure everything you release is as good as you can make it." - JA Konrath


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## Christa Wick (Nov 1, 2012)

Cherise Kelley said:


> The three-year time frame is misleading, though. I've read Joe's entire blog. He's been at this ten years, not three. His work only took off in the last three years, but who's to know if the prior seven years contributed to that or not?


It is 3 years of self-pubbed earnings only. It does not count any traditionally published income, whether within the 3 years or before.


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## ElisaBlaisdell (Jun 3, 2012)

Christa Wick said:


> It is 3 years of self-pubbed earnings only. It does not count any traditionally published income, whether within the 3 years or before.


But as I understand it, it's another seven years of backlist--so, instead of 10 books a year, it's 'only' three books a year, on the average. Note the quotes around 'only'.


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## Hugh Howey (Feb 11, 2012)

Joe is my hero.

And Joe is picking up the mothereffing check when we finally get that beer together.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

mothereffing?
    

Glad to see a KB member having that kind of success...

Betsy


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## Hugh Howey (Feb 11, 2012)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> mothereffing?
> 
> 
> Betsy


I was shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, that this wasn't on your censor list.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Hugh Howey said:


> I was shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, that this wasn't on your censor list.


*off to fix THAT.*


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## Christa Wick (Nov 1, 2012)

ElisaBlaisdell said:


> But as I understand it, it's another seven years of backlist--so, instead of 10 books a year, it's 'only' three books a year, on the average. Note the quotes around 'only'.


Ah, yes, I thought you were questioning earnings, not contributing books. Backlist that he received rights back on are part of the books that earned the 1.6m.


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## Duane Gundrum (Apr 5, 2011)

I often find these kinds of articles both enlightening and massively frustrating because for me they always leave out the one piece that I need the most, and that's how they got from completely unknown to starting to sell well. In this article, he talks about how in his first year with his one book he sold 27,222 copies of one of his books and then shows us the success from that point forward. I got the same thing when I used to read about Amanda Hockings and her successes. It was always along the lines of "get famous and then use this process to sell more books". It's like the old Steve Martin book where he tells you "How to become a millionaire and not pay taxes. First step, get a million dollars."

As one of those many struggling writers, I'd kill to sell 27,222 copies of one of my books in a year. And this isn't meant to be a complaint or even a criticis of the article because it's great information. It's just a frustration that I came away with having read a lot of articles like these that seem to hint at telling the inside story and it's still a story after the fact.


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

I know he rubs some people the wrong way, but I thi k he's too cool for shades.


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## Hugh Howey (Feb 11, 2012)

sarbonn said:


> I often find these kinds of articles both enlightening and massively frustrating because for me they always leave out the one piece that I need the most, and that's how they got from completely unknown to starting to sell well. In this article, he talks about how in his first year with his one book he sold 27,222 copies of one of his books and then shows us the success from that point forward. I got the same thing when I used to read about Amanda Hockings and her successes. It was always along the lines of "get famous and then use this process to sell more books". It's like the old Steve Martin book where he tells you "How to become a millionaire and not pay taxes. First step, get a million dollars."
> 
> As one of those many struggling writers, I'd kill to sell 27,222 copies of one of my books in a year. And this isn't meant to be a complaint or even a criticis of the article because it's great information. It's just a frustration that I came away with having read a lot of articles like these that seem to hint at telling the inside story and it's still a story after the fact.


I'm afraid the truth is that most of us just don't know. We can tell you the sequence of events that took us from selling nothing to selling lots, but every sequence is unique, and it doesn't explain the fact that great books languish while some mediocre books go gangbusters.

If any of us had the secret, I can promise you this: we'd be falling over ourselves to spill it. I think we are just as curious and dumbfounded as anyone else. Except for the authors (and I'm not one of them) who chalk it up to how awesome their writing is and can't believe it took this long for the universe to bow down before their greatness. But surely those authors are rare. More common has to be the generally confused or those who post-hoc reason that what they did was the answer. But lots of people are doing those things. And if all it took was a great book, that doesn't explain the killer books I read all the time that never hit any lists.

Another theory is that it takes writing a lot of books, but THE MILL HOUSE RECLUSE and a few others did great as indie debuts. There's the theory of pricing, but then there's Joe Nobody, who sells for $9.99 and kicks butt doing it. Some say it's only the previously-trad-published who have success as indies (like Konrath, Eisler, and Bella Andre), but that argument is bunk for two reasons: Some of the previously-trad (not saying those mentioned above; I don't know) were dropped from their publishers for underperforming before doing great indie. And many indies like Hocking were straight-indie. Others like myself were with small presses that didn't provide any boost at all to our readership. No one set of answers works. Which leaves us wondering what in the world does.

I think Joe comes as close as anyone to sorting it all out. Like me, he includes luck in his secret recipe, and he qualifies that with the hard work that magnifies luck. Let's say luck, as an ingredient, accounts for 30% of the Breakout-Sauce. That's enough to explain how some authors go nuts with a single book, or expensive books, or books with crappy cover art (like mine), or books with technical faults. It would also explain how someone with a dozen excellent titles isn't taking off. How someone who does everything "right" doesn't have success.

Which leads to my point of this long-winded nonsense: Time has to be an ingredient. An important one. This revolution has barely gotten started. Good luck and bad luck require time to even them out. If you've done everything right, your works might take off in ten years. Who knows? We haven't been at this long enough. I think it's too early for any of us to say something isn't working or that it won't work. I just have to remember back to writing seven novels over three years and watching them sit between #335,204 and #1,302,490 in the Amazon store. I didn't care. I just kept writing. I read about Amanda Hocking, and I thought: "Hellz yeah!" And I kept writing. I gave myself until I was 40 and I had twenty titles published before I worried about whether I sold enough to pay a bill. And even if that never happened, it was an excuse to publish twenty titles. I could always say that. No one could take it away from me. And anyway, I'd sold a handful of books and heard from people that they loved them. I remembered when that was just an idle dream.


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

blakebooks said:


> I wasn't dissing the value of $1.6 mil. I was simply trying to be accurate, or within 60% of the actual number.


And I was being a smart ass. LOL


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## JRTomlin (Jan 18, 2011)

Hugh Howey said:


> I was shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, that this wasn't on your censor list.


Stop giving her ideas.


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## Duane Gundrum (Apr 5, 2011)

Thank you, Hugh. That was actually a lot of good information. I think the frustration has come from the fact that so few "successful" ones actually are modest enough to point it out like you just did, yet still manage to relay a lot of good information at the same time.

I do appreciate the response.


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## Guest (Oct 11, 2013)

For all of us struggling each month and posting our comments here, there are hundreds who've given up.  Think about it; you often hear success stories, but you don't often hear people announce they're throwing in the towel.  If you've been posting on this site all month then you're still here, you haven't given up like countless others, and that means you still have a chance.  And even 1% of a chance is better than nothing.


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## Hugh Howey (Feb 11, 2012)

Greg Strandberg said:


> Think about it; you often hear success stories, but you don't often hear people announce they're throwing in the towel.


www.salon.com


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

JRTomlin said:


> Stop giving her ideas.


 

You're all banned.
*looks for banstick.*

Or you would be if I could find the damn thing. The cabana boys are always using it to get rid of cobwebs....

Betsy


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## MGalloway (Jun 21, 2011)

Hugh Howey said:


> I think Joe comes as close as anyone to sorting it all out. Like me, he includes luck in his secret recipe, and he qualifies that with the hard work that magnifies luck. Let's say luck, as an ingredient, accounts for 30% of the Breakout-Sauce. That's enough to explain how some authors go nuts with a single book, or expensive books, or books with crappy cover art (like mine), or books with technical faults. It would also explain how someone with a dozen excellent titles isn't taking off. How someone who does everything "right" doesn't have success.


There's a formula in there...somewhere. I think the components to it include ads, promotion, blog mentions, word-of-mouth, media mentions, timing, genre, cover art, blurb, sample quality, retailer algorithms, promotional opportunities, writing style, etc. Then there are all sorts of subfactors in each of those components, such as the quality of those blog mentions (for example), which complicates it even further.

Depending on the book(s), current reading trends and even local/world events could add to the mix in a negative or a positive way. The gathering of all that data (along with the crucial component of timing) and the subsequent analysis would be the difficult part. Doing it in real time in order to gauge future trends would probably involve some type of fractal analysis...a field which is still only just getting going.


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## Sophrosyne (Mar 27, 2011)

As far as I can figure out, the components to success are:

Book Quality
Eye-Catching Cover
Interesting Product Summary
Popular Genre
Publicity/Marketing
More Books

Rinse and repeat. It's a marriage of quality plus quantity plus publicity. At least, that's all you can control. After that, it's just... a dollop of magic, a pinch of hope and a vial of dragon's blood.


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## Shalini Boland (Nov 29, 2010)

Sophrosyne said:


> and a vial of dragon's blood.


That's what I'm missing!


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## 68564 (Mar 17, 2013)

I forget who said it, but someone once said something like "I have noticed it is the people who work hard that get lucky" or something like that. I think there is probably a lot more elbow grease in this then real chance.


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## Lloyd MacRae (Nov 18, 2012)

Press every morning.

Rinse and repeat.


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## LilianaHart (Jun 20, 2011)

Hugh Howey said:


> I was shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, that this wasn't on your censor list.


Hugh likes to push the boundries 

Also, Joe is a pioneer in this business. He says what he thinks and has always been transparent with his numbers and sales. As are most of the self-published authors I've met over the last couple of years. I think if you look on the KB list of books sold at the top sellers, you'll find that the writing, the pace, the next book etc. is what has made the success. It's not special marketing tips and techniques. It's always going to be writing the next book and getting it out.


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## valeriec80 (Feb 24, 2011)

Greg Strandberg said:


> For all of us struggling each month and posting our comments here, there are hundreds who've given up. Think about it; you often hear success stories, but you don't often hear people announce they're throwing in the towel. If you've been posting on this site all month then you're still here, you haven't given up like countless others, and that means you still have a chance. And even 1% of a chance is better than nothing.


Man, this is so true. I first started hanging out here in early 2011, right after Amanda Hocking made it big. there aren't a lot of regulars from those days who are still around. ('Course some of those people are still writing but not hanging here. And they're doing well.) There are a lot of people--people with four or five titles even--who never got traction and just threw in the towel. And there are also people who were selling gangbusters back then who hit a snag, lost sales, and have slowly faded into obscurity. Sometimes I think about them and go look them up on Amazon and see that they haven't put anything out in a year and a half. I wonder what happened to them. 

Never give up. Never surrender. Never tell me the odds.


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## MGalloway (Jun 21, 2011)

Sophrosyne said:


> As far as I can figure out, the components to success are:
> 
> Book Quality
> Eye-Catching Cover
> ...


I agree...to some extent. But some of those factors can have a high degree of latitude built into them. For example, I've seen several traditionally published non-fiction books as of late with some pretty uncreative covers. I can see where they would sell well if marketed to the right audience...and in some cases there is already a built-in audience because the author has a massive platform in other media. I suppose one could say a lot of ready-made (hard earned?) trust has been built up ahead of time.

Likewise, someone can write a book in not-so-popular genre, and, if done right, the book can be a breakout hit. In rare cases, it can create a subgenre of it's own. But in order to do that, the writing usually has to be top-notch, and I would think publicity plays a role, too.

Yet I've also seen examples where a book met all of the important criteria you've mentioned above...but the market was oversaturated (which is why I mentioned timing above). Certain fiction topics/trends seem to come and go in waves and I think there is a bit of an art in recognizing those waves.

All that said, I think a bigger gamechanger is being a bit "out of the box" when it comes to the components you've mentioned above. I could go on, but I don't want to take this thread too far off topic.


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## AmberDa1 (Jul 23, 2012)

I am thankful for Joe's blog. It was one of my top go to blogs when I first started a year ago.


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## DavidGil (May 16, 2013)

I honestly believe much of it comes down to luck. You can write a good book, and have barely any sales, if any. Likewise, you can have a bad book and sell. So, I really do think it comes down to the roll of the dice. Putting out a bigger backlist, having good covers etc. just increases the chance that luck will find you.

As an aside, when it comes to covers, I don't want to come out and claim that everyone's wrong when it comes to saying that covers are important. I don't believe that for one minute anyway, but I do want to say that I don't think they're as important as people make out at times. Why? Because I have no explanation for a book with a simple colored background and black text on it (the author's name and book title) selling. Anyone could do that in two minutes. Granted, it is likely an exception to the rule, but it's still worth examining.


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## unkownwriter (Jun 22, 2011)

Joe's blog was one of the first things I found when I was researching news about publishing, and I was impressed with his success, so I always listen to what he says. May not always agree with him, but I listen. Same thing with DWS.



> Book Quality
> Eye-Catching Cover
> Interesting Product Summary
> Popular Genre
> ...


I'd add luck, and I think it's closer to 50% of the mix. And timing: being closer to the crest of a trend -- or rising with it -- is better than hitting it on the downside.


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## JeanneM (Mar 21, 2011)

Hugh Howey said:


> www.salon.com


? The link didn't bring me to any stories about authors giving up.

Anyway, I think people forget sometimes that the power of word of mouth is amazing. You and Amanda wrote wonderful books that struck a chord with those who read them. Then they told two people, and they told two people...etc.  I think word of mouth is more powerful than any other kind or promotion.

There's my 2 cents for the week.


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## lazarusInfinity (Oct 2, 2012)

I love how his gives a lot of great tips and shares numbers that everyone can benefit from.  Information like this makes me want to keep writing.


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## Sophrosyne (Mar 27, 2011)

I think if you have a good cover, you have a leg up. If you have a bad cover, then you need to overcome the cover. It's just an added layer of effort to get to the reader.


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## JA Konrath (Apr 2, 2009)

Thanks for the kind words, all. 

And Hugh, beer is on me. But steaks are on you, you successful mother flubber!


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Jack Kilborn said:


> Thanks for the kind words, all.
> 
> And Hugh, beer is on me. But steaks are on you, you successful mother flubber!


*adds mother flubber to ban list*

Betsy


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## Sophrosyne (Mar 27, 2011)

Thanks for inspiring so many of us to go the DIY route. It's certainly changed my life for the better!


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## ACboy (Oct 10, 2013)

Joe works hard. From reading his blog, he always worked hard. This is his full time job. He's got great covers. And he's in a popular genre.


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## Gertie Kindle (Nov 6, 2008)

valeriec80 said:


> Man, this is so true. I first started hanging out here in early 2011, right after Amanda Hocking made it big. there aren't a lot of regulars from those days who are still around. ('Course some of those people are still writing but not hanging here. And they're doing well.) There are a lot of people--people with four or five titles even--who never got traction and just threw in the towel. And there are also people who were selling gangbusters back then who hit a snag, lost sales, and have slowly faded into obscurity. Sometimes I think about them and go look them up on Amazon and see that they haven't put anything out in a year and a half. I wonder what happened to them.
> 
> Never give up. Never surrender. Never tell me the odds.


"Never give up. Never surrender." The Commander (just watched the GQ 20th anniversary special yesterday)

"Never tell me the odds." Han Solo

I've been here since 2008 and I'm still hanging out and hanging in and having fun.


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## Michael J. Scott (Sep 2, 2010)

DavidGil said:


> I honestly believe much of it comes down to luck. You can write a good book, and have barely any sales, if any. Likewise, you can have a bad book and sell. So, I really do think it comes down to the roll of the dice. Putting out a bigger backlist, having good covers etc. just increases the chance that luck will find you.


Ugh. I hate luck. I'd rather have a secret ingredient that works every time it's tried. Sigh.


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## Jay Allan (Aug 20, 2012)

Konrath's blog was one of the first things I found when I started researching.  I was stunned how forthcoming with info he was.  I suspect a lot of people doing very well owe a lot to his willingness to share his data.


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## P.C. (Peter) Anders (Feb 6, 2013)

Amazing story.

Incidentally, there's an Indian IT guy, now in the Bay Area, who has written a few how-to books about how to make millions with the help of Kindle books, and how to write nonfiction books super-fast. Color me skeptical.

[Sorry, deleted the comment I posted earlier, that belonged to a different thread, accidentally posted in this one.]


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## Suzan Butler (Apr 6, 2013)

I remember coming across Konrath when I first started writing. i don't remember how I found him. It might have been a writing article. Not sure. I want to say this was 2008, 2009ish? Maybe?

But I do remember that he was giving away many of the stories he's got out there now. He put a bunch of stories on his website at the time for free, and most of them were shorts connected to his Jack Daniels series, and then he loaded them onto KDP just to make it easy for people who wanted them for their Kindle. (Kindle was brand spanking new back then. I think they only had the one model.) But they didn't allow him to set the price to free, so that's why they were $0.99. He had no intention of making money off those stories at the time. This was all stuff he had put on his website, which has since been redesigned, obviously.

Oh, I remember what it was now. I found an article by him on marketing books through relationships with bookstores and signings.


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## Alain Gomez (Nov 12, 2010)

valeriec80 said:


> Man, this is so true. I first started hanging out here in early 2011, right after Amanda Hocking made it big. there aren't a lot of regulars from those days who are still around. ('Course some of those people are still writing but not hanging here. And they're doing well.) There are a lot of people--people with four or five titles even--who never got traction and just threw in the towel. And there are also people who were selling gangbusters back then who hit a snag, lost sales, and have slowly faded into obscurity. Sometimes I think about them and go look them up on Amazon and see that they haven't put anything out in a year and a half. I wonder what happened to them.
> 
> Never give up. Never surrender. Never tell me the odds.


I was just thinking about this the other day since October is my publishing birthday (3 years, w00t!). I've seen the crowd regulars change many times.

Consistency is really the key, I think. Compared to a random fluke like JK Rowling, Joe barely sells anything at all. And yet he's making a healthy living just from being consistent. I think any of us have that kind of potential, break out or no.


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## Jd488 (Oct 8, 2012)

The one thing Konrath said that keeps me plugging away is that this is a marathon, not a sprint. I published _The Acts of 1_ a year ago this month, so my marathon is still in the early stages. 

Surprisingly, _The Acts of 1_ is my best selling book to date.


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## Stephen M Holak (May 15, 2012)

Joe's writing inspired me a few years ago to stop wallowing in self pity and just write--and publish. I put out two novellas to get my feet wet last year, published a 165k-word novel last month, and am deep into the second book of the series. Sales are slow but steady on the novel, and I can't beat the feeling I got from two or three people telling me they got pulled into the book and couldn't put it down. I'm in for the long run--but who know? I might have given up if I hadn't stumbled across JAK. He continues to pull us all up by our . . . (thinks of Betsy and her censorship wand) bootstraps.


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## LynPerry (Apr 8, 2013)

Joe and Hugh (and others, of course) have brought up the issue of luck. Good discussion.

But here's the cool thing. Both of them (and others!) have recently provided opportunities for new writers to take advantage of the "luck" (success, surge, fan interest, etc.) that they've been fortunate enough to experience.

For example, Hugh opened up his Silo world to others, then it got picked up by Kindle Worlds. I was able to publish a story ("The Last Prayer") in that universe because the author offered me a chance at luck. 

Joe is opening up his Jack Daniels series to new writers using a franchise model. I've written "Drinking Games" as a stand alone sequel to a couple of stories I've submitted to Joe for consideration. 

Have I been successful? In that I've written stories I'd never have otherwise written, so yes. It's a lucky thing for me (and others!) to take advantage of the luck/success of writers like Hugh and Joe. Thanks guys! ... And others.


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## Taking my troll a$$ outta here (Apr 8, 2013)

Inspiring. Thanks for the link.


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## Desmond X. Torres (Mar 16, 2013)

sarbonn said:


> I often find these kinds of articles both enlightening and massively frustrating because for me they always leave out the one piece that I need the most, and that's how they got from completely unknown to starting to sell well. In this article, he talks about how in his first year with his one book he sold 27,222 copies of one of his books and then shows us the success from that point forward. .........
> 
> As one of those many struggling writers, I'd kill to sell 27,222 copies of one of my books in a year. And this isn't meant to be a complaint or even a criticis of the article because it's great information. It's just a frustration that I came away with having read a lot of articles like these that seem to hint at telling the inside story and it's still a story after the fact.


If you read his archives, you can see regular posts on how he went about doing it. They make for a fascinating read as he went from being trad pubbed and made his decision on going indie. I read all his posts over a year ago. One thing that comes through from Konrath is an incredible work ethic on all fronts- on the writing, and on the marketing (in that order). He spent over five years trying to get his first publishing deal after all.

He's the last person to say his success came suddenly.


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## 28612 (Dec 7, 2010)

Michael J. Scott said:


> Ugh. I hate luck. I'd rather have a secret ingredient that works every time it's tried. Sigh.


I've found recognizing luck in this to be tremendously liberating.

Backstory: I had 24 books print published in 16 years, the majority with Harlequin/Silhouette. I didn't sell well enough for them to leave me be. I sold too well for them to dump me. I spent all those years being told I was pushing the envelope, and if I'd just stay inside it everything would be fine. Of course, each of the 31 editors I had for those 24 books had a different envelope in mind, and very few of them could (or at least did) articulate where the edges of the envelope were. Any book that didn't sell well was my fault, no matter what cover art, title, scheduling or other mayhem they had indulged in. Any book that sold well was because of their marketing prowess.

All during those 16 years, I kept thinking there ~had~ to be a way to succeed at this. There had to be that secret ingredient, and I was going to find it, dammit. I tried like the dickens to fit inside that morphing envelope while still writing what I needed to write, I tried ads, I tried tours, I tried entering contests, I tried hiring a pr person, I tried other things I've apparently blocked from memory. Out of all that ... I got some nice contest plaques and awards. No secret ingredient. A lot of frustration.

I reached the No Mas point. Decided to write for myself and shred envelopes to a fare-thee-well. Not particularly easy to do with those editorial voices still in my head. (That was my responsibility, not theirs -- as was sticking too long with trying to succeed in their envelope. I'm just a teensy bit stubborn.)

Then came ebooks. I put most of the books whose rights had reverted to me up starting in Sept.2010. They sold verrrrrrry slow at first, and I was thinking the long tail ~might~ be long, but it sure was skinny.

Then family situation arose and I ignored them from Jan. to late April 2011. When i looked up again, they'd gone from making enough money to pay my monthly water bill to paying my mortgage. And the book that was doing the best was one an editor had said Hq/Sil would never reprint because it was "a loser."

Since the spring of 2011, my monthly average income has increased about 10-fold. I'm not a big hitter like Hugh or Joe or Lilliana or Bella or Barbara Freethy or a lot of others. But I'm making a lot more than I ever did in print (which never supported me) or in print + part-time profession combined.

And I came to the conclusion that beyond the commonsense basics, essentially nobody knows why or how. And that's GREAT news. Because what it means is we are freed from pursuing that draining quest to find a secret ingredient, from feeling that if we don't have it, it's because we aren't trying hard enough, that it's Our Fault. It means that we cover the commonsense basics (which is, indeed, a hefty amount of work), and then we get our heads back into the writing.

Hallelujah!


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## MGalloway (Jun 21, 2011)

Michael J. Scott said:


> Ugh. I hate luck. I'd rather have a secret ingredient that works every time it's tried. Sigh.


How about writing the best, slightly out-of-the-box books that you can, and then marketing them in slightly unconventional ways?


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## Desmond X. Torres (Mar 16, 2013)

Patricia McLinn said:


> I've found recognizing luck in this to be tremendously liberating.
> 
> And I came to the conclusion that beyond the commonsense basics, essentially nobody knows why or how. And that's GREAT news. *Because what it means is we are freed from pursuing that draining quest to find a secret ingredient, from feeling that if we don't have it, it's because we aren't trying hard enough, that it's Our Fault. It means that we cover the commonsense basics (which is, indeed, a hefty amount of work), and then we get our heads back into the writing.
> *
> Hallelujah!


I've read on Konrath's blog just how tough it can be writing for Harlequin. Your success with them and your success here is in inspiration. Look's good on you, kid. (Yeah, IRL I do a killer Bogie imitation). Congratulations!


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## Michael J. Scott (Sep 2, 2010)

Patricia McLinn said:


> I've found recognizing luck in this to be tremendously liberating.
> ...
> Then came ebooks. I put most of the books whose rights had reverted to me up starting in Sept.2010. They sold verrrrrrry slow at first, and I was thinking the long tail ~might~ be long, but it sure was skinny.
> ...
> ...


I do get it. It's the long tail, the long wait even as I do what I ought to be doing, which is write a whole helluva lot more books than I have available right now. What I like about the "blame" thing is that if I can point to something that I'm _not _doing, then I can _start _doing it. And if I can point to something I _should be_ doing but ain't, I can _stop _doing that. Blame equals responsibility, which equals an ability to respond to my circumstances and change them.

Luck leaves me at the mercy of circumstances beyond my control. And that may well be the case, but it's damn frustrating.

I love writing. And I love the hope of doing this as a means of making a living. It's not why I write, but it does motivate.



MGalloway said:


> How about writing the best, slightly out-of-the-box books that you can, and then marketing them in slightly unconventional ways?


Well, I have been working on my Jefferson's Road series, which is certainly out-of-the-box and damn scary, but it's the "slightly unconventional ways" that I haven't quite figured out. Any suggestions?


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## Joe_Nobody (Oct 23, 2012)

I think I'm close to that number. I haven't added it up in a bit, but I know I passed $1 million last month, (23 months of writing full-time). Around here, I didn't think that was any big deal given the numbers I see posted on some of the sales threads. 
Is there a million dollar club like in real estate?  

I respect the heck out of Mr. Konrath, and wish him nothing but the best.

As far as luck goes, I have to agree with 99% of the above posts.

I was very, very fortunate on the timing, genera and placement of my first book.

After that though, I feel like I've earned every single dime. My stuff isn't as high-quality of writing as many of you good folks, but the stories are solid. As far as the non-fiction goes, I'll put my stuff up there with anyone's.

So the bottom line, from my POV, is a mixture of luck and hard work. I look at it like the luck is optional, but it sure helps speed things up.


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## N. Gemini Sasson (Jul 5, 2010)

Patricia McLinn said:


> Since the spring of 2011, my monthly average income has increased about 10-fold. I'm not a big hitter like Hugh or Joe or Lilliana or Bella or Barbara Freethy or a lot of others. But I'm making a lot more than I ever did in print (which never supported me) or in print + part-time profession combined.


Patricia, I love hearing stories like this. I'm so happy to hear that after all the frustration for you there is a sunny side. Congratulations!


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## MGalloway (Jun 21, 2011)

Michael J. Scott said:


> Well, I have been working on my Jefferson's Road series, which is certainly out-of-the-box and d*mn scary, but it's the "slightly unconventional ways" that I haven't quite figured out. Any suggestions?


I don't know. I'd have to read the book first.  I guess the first question would be...have you found your audience yet?

I'm probably not going to be of much help...at least not right now. That may change soon because today, I finally got around to finishing the first part of _Wool_. (Yes, I'm way behind on my reading.) It made me realize what I've been doing wrong.


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## Michael J. Scott (Sep 2, 2010)

MGalloway said:


> I don't know. I'd have to read the book first.  I guess the first question would be...have you found your audience yet?
> 
> I'm probably not going to be of much help...at least not right now. That may change soon because today, I finally got around to finishing the first part of _Wool_. (Yes, I'm way behind on my reading.) It made me realize what I've been doing wrong.


Interesting... if it's not too much trouble or too revealing, what did you learn? If so, that's fine, too.


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## Andrew Ashling (Nov 15, 2010)

Patricia McLinn said:


> I've found recognizing luck in this to be tremendously liberating.
> 
> And I came to the conclusion that beyond the commonsense basics, essentially nobody knows why or how. And that's GREAT news. Because what it means is we are freed from pursuing that draining quest to find a secret ingredient, from feeling that if we don't have it, it's because we aren't trying hard enough, that it's Our Fault. It means that we cover the commonsense basics (which is, indeed, a hefty amount of work), and then we get our heads back into the writing.
> 
> Hallelujah!


Thanks for sharing your inspiring story, and good for you.


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## MGalloway (Jun 21, 2011)

Michael J. Scott said:


> Interesting... if it's not too much trouble or too revealing, what did you learn? If so, that's fine, too.


I need to make some adjustments in terms of visibility.


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## A. S. Warwick (Jan 14, 2011)

Impressive numbers, and something to aspire too.  Now to just get a hold of a piece of that luck that everyone talks about


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## 28612 (Dec 7, 2010)

> What I like about the "blame" thing is that if I can point to something that I'm not doing, then I can start doing it.


I understand, Michael. I really, really wanted that control, too. And I hope you find the secret ingredient. I just know I didn't and letting go of the expectation that I would helped me.

Thank you for your great words, Desmond. Gemini and Andrew, I truly appreciate your responses. Your msgs mean a lot.


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## christianem (Sep 15, 2013)

@Patricia, thank you for sharing! I grew up reading HQN books but it was because of the authors. So as a reader, if my fave HQN author self-pubs, I'll still buy her books. Hope that gives you added motivation to keep writing.

@Joe_Nobody, thanks for sharing your numbers, too. You made me value my work more and not just price everything at .99 to be competitive. It's also great to see that even those who aren't as popular as JA Konrath earn seven figures. Definitely gives us hope!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


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## MQ (Jan 5, 2011)

I have been an Indie for almost 3 years now with minimum sales (I have actually been traditionally published so I’ve gone through the ups and down there).  Anyways, I have tried all the common sense techniques but nothing has worked thus far.  I was so stressed about writing that I went on a vacation for a couple of weeks and during this time I refused to check my e-mails or even sales.  I actually found I was happier.  I LOVE writing but this made me think whether I should continue or not, or whether I had it in me to keep going.  But when I returned from my vacation I saw Konrath’s blog about quitting.   

I guess I’ll have to do some serious thinking now… hmm...


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## Guest (Oct 15, 2013)

If you read his comment in the thread, he explains how he did it, he credits BOOKBUB with driving a free title to many thousands of new fans, who then are able to buy his catalog of titles. So another author with nice success that gave away a title on BOOKBUB. Anyone know of any other sites similar to BOOKBUB that can deliver 10K to 100K free downloads? 

That is how unknown or indie authors are being found, outside of a major mention in major media.


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## hyh (Jul 21, 2013)

Wow - what an inspirational thread! Thank you all those who shared their stories (& to Joe for his blog, which was also one of the first things I started following when I decided to go indie) - and Hugh, for your great comment breaking down the reason for success. Especially loved to hear Patricia's story - so encouraging.  

I'm ashamed to say that as a newbie who has only been at this 6 weeks, I was already becoming disheartened and so I really needed to read this thread (and am off to read Joe's article next!). It wasn't so much that I was thinking of giving up already but more that I was wondering whether I'm just naive / arrogant / delusional  to think I might ever succeed at this (by succeed, I mean make enough to earn a living).

I think it doesn't help that I am SO NOT a gambler - taking risks makes me break out in hives and I'm a huge control freak - and really, this whole self-publishing thing is one massive gamble. I really admire the people who have enough self-belief to keep at it, keep believing that it will happen sooner or later - as a non-gambler, I just keep thinking of the odds and so much depending on *luck* and thinking what if I do spend decades putting out multiple titles and it STILL doesn't happen?? I thnk it hasn't helped that I have started in one of the LEAST popular & toughest genres (children's MG)...

But anyway, it's wonderful to have threads like these to give people like me a boost to keep going!  

Hsin-Yi


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## scribblr (Aug 20, 2010)

Joe_Nobody said:


> I haven't added it up in a bit, but I know I passed $1 million last month...Is there a million dollar club like in real estate?


Congrats, Joe. Your green blazer with the dollar sign on the pocket will be sent to you as soon as you complete the application and submit the required fee.


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## Desmond X. Torres (Mar 16, 2013)

H.Y. Hanna (Big Honey Dog Mysteries) said:


> I'm ashamed to say that as a newbie who has only been at this 6 weeks, I was already becoming disheartened and so I really needed to read this thread (and am off to read Joe's article next!). It wasn't so much that I was thinking of giving up already but more that I was wondering whether I'm just naive / arrogant / delusional to think I might ever succeed at this (by succeed, I mean make enough to earn a living).
> 
> I think it doesn't help that I am SO NOT a gambler - taking risks makes me break out in hives and I'm a huge control freak - and really, this whole self-publishing thing is one massive gamble. I really admire the people who have enough self-belief to keep at it, keep believing that it will happen sooner or later - as a non-gambler, I just keep thinking of the odds and so much depending on *luck* and thinking what if I do spend decades putting out multiple titles and it STILL doesn't happen?? I thnk it hasn't helped that I have started in one of the LEAST popular & toughest genres (children's MG)...
> 
> ...


You don't have a problem with your writing- I just looked at your book's sample. 
Patience you must have young Jedi! You got 30 or so reviews, all 5*, your cover looks fine to me, and you write well.

As far as being a control freak and hives... mmmm.... maybe that could change over time in this game, I dunno. I do think publishing independently is by far the lesser of two evils as far as that's concerned. In this milieu, at least you're not dealing with all the pitfalls TP's can toss authors in, right?


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## hyh (Jul 21, 2013)

Desmond X. Torres said:


> You don't have a problem with your writing- I just looked at your book's sample.
> Patience you must have young Jedi! You got 30 or so reviews, all 5*, your cover looks fine to me, and you write well.
> 
> As far as being a control freak and hives... mmmm.... maybe that could change over time in this game, I dunno. I do think publishing independently is by far the lesser of two evils as far as that's concerned. In this milieu, at least you're not dealing with all the pitfalls TP's can toss authors in, right?


Aw, Desmond, thanks for giving me a big smile with that Jedi quote! And thanks for the nice words about my writing/book. Yes, I'm really grateful that everybody who has read it has loved it, including teachers & parents - I do feel fairly confident that my book can stand on its own once its target group reads it - it's just GETTING the book to them that is the huge challenge!  I know I need patience...but I just worry that what if time alone isn't enough - what if I'm one of those authors who does all the right things and still fails?? (See, told you I'm not a gambler!  )

But I know I shouldn't complain. Just get on and write the next book!! 

And oh no - I totally agree with you - I don't regret self-publishing at all and am not really interested in the traditional route (unless it's some amazing print-only deal!  ) - it's not TP that's the alternative but the constant thought that I could/should be doing a "normal" job which pays a regular income, instead of gambling on something that could all come to nothing, even with a lot of hard work. I feel that family & friends are looking at me askance and rolling their eyes disapprovingly behind my back, thinking I'm just a silly dreamer who should just "get real"...and I'm scared that they're right!

Hsin-Yi


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## Desmond X. Torres (Mar 16, 2013)

H.Y. Hanna (Big Honey Dog Mysteries) said:


> looking at me askance and rolling their eyes disapprovingly behind my back, thinking I'm just a silly dreamer who should just "get real"...and I'm scared that they're right!
> 
> Hsin-Yi


Yeah, silly a**ed dreamers. You know the type- some clowns think they can just walk in and get admitted to Oxford University, the most competitive university on the planet, the one where Harvard grads want to go. Those people ought to give their heads a shake.

As far as writing more books is concerned, if you have a LOT of time, spend it on this thread> 
http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,165320.0.html
Especially pay attention to the contributor who wrote the novel 'First Activation' and Google his name, he did a 1 hr interview online at a site called 'Rocking Self Publishing' that's a treasure of promotional info. The thread I'm pointing you to is sort of scary (so bring your anti histamines) but it's also extremely hopeful!


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