# $12.99



## CS (Nov 3, 2008)

I'm sure this has been discussed in the past, but is anyone else infuriated by the new $12.99 standard that some publishers seem to be enforcing for their newer books/bestsellers? I guess the days of Amazon promising that most bestsellers would be $9.99 are long over. $12.99 just seems like too much for a digital book IMO. 

I know I can wait for the price to go down, and I'm choosing to do exactly that. However, in the majority of cases, my interest has waned in a particular book by the time that magical price drop does occur (assuming it ever does).

Another annoyance: Kindle books priced the same as physical copies or only a few cents apart. Come on! 

And of course, even worse: Kindle books that are more expensive than their physical counterparts. Smart one, publishers!

I guess the E-Book Honeymoon Period truly is over.  

Sorry for the rant, but this has been bugging me for a while.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

The pubs are the ones setting the prices and I think they'll figure out eventually that they're screwing up. If I want something, I'll pay more, but if my interest is borderline, those couple dollars make me move it to wishlist.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

The tension between "it's the content that matters" and "but it's only an intangible collection of bits" creates some interesting emotional conflicts.

If reading the ebook version on a KIndle is a better experience, as many here, claim there should be no hesitation in paying more.  You are receiving a better experience.

Also intriguing is how many question the business model once the product is digital; "copies are cheap," "they are greedy," etc..  

It's rare to see such complaints regarding a physical product.  For example, I don't recall seeing comments about $25.00 Kandles that apparently can be sold for $5.00 each.

Buy the ebook if its asking price is worth the experience of reading it on your Kindle.  If it isn't, don't buy.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Yes, it has been discussed. . . . .some might say _ad nauseum_. . . . . I buy a book if it seems worth the price, and don't if it doesn't. I am not "infuriated" because that seems like too much work.


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## whiterab (May 29, 2009)

I've got a big backlog of books to read anyway, so I just throw the expensive e-books onto a price tracking website that notifies my email when the price drops to something I'm willing to pay for. The one I use is...

http://www.ereaderiq.com/pricewatch/

I am tracking about 40 books now and the prices are coming down fast enough to keep my Kindle full. This probably won't work for that "must have" book.


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

I won't pay more than paperback prize for a drm'd ebook and I won't pay the same price as the hardback either. It might be easier for lots of us to read the books on the Kindle, but fact is, ebooks have limitations. 

They have DRM, you can't resell, you can't loan (not counting the proposed once in a lifetime 2 week thats coming), you can't put them in a shelf and you can't read them on all ereaders (e-ink or equivalent, not computer screen) no matter the brand. 
I guess technically we are buying a license to read a book on specific devices. 

If the publishers want more money as a paperbook for it, they'll have to not only take the restrictions (DRM) off, but treat the ebook customers with more respect. 

For me, a ebook should be at, or below paperback issue price. Even keeping all the usual costs attached to them, cover art, marketing, royalties, etc, the one cost ebooks do not have is distribution, shipping. So for that alone they should be cheaper than PP.


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## ZankerH (Oct 8, 2010)

Agreed. As it is, when buying an ebook you're basically paying the publishers to treat you like a criminal. As long as that's the case, I don't have any qualms about using "criminal" methods to get around their preposterous pricing system.


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## MLPMom (Nov 27, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Yes, it has been discussed. . . . .some might say _ad nauseum_. . . . . I buy a book if it seems worth the price, and don't if it doesn't. I am not "infuriated" because that seems like too much work.


Agreed and sometimes for me, that is the $12.99 price.


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

CS said:


> I'm sure this has been discussed in the past, but is anyone else infuriated by the new $12.99 standard that some publishers seem to be enforcing for their newer books/bestsellers?


I'm not infuriated, just disappointed. I can wait for the price to come down.



CS said:


> $12.99 just seems like too much for a digital book IMO.


Depends on the book. If the author has spent five years doing research on something that will sell maybe a thousand copies, then is $12.99 too much? Would $12.99 be too much for a book that sells for $75.00 in hardcover?

Mike


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## amafan (Aug 11, 2010)

I've got so much to read on my K3 right now I can't imagine paying more for a new ebook.  I set my limit at $9.99 at that's only if for some reason I "gotta have it".  That's rare.  good news I'm discovering some of the classics and many of them are "free".


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

jmiked said:


> I'm not infuriated, just disappointed. I can wait for the price to come down.


Agreed. Publishers, authors etc. can set the prices where ever they like. They should have full freedom to do so. As a consumer I have full freedom to pass on books I think are priced too high, and go buy and read something I think is priced reasonably and vote with my wallet.


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## Minolta91 (Oct 7, 2010)

maybe I'm terribly naive but cant all of this be construed as Price Fixing? Every book I look at while surfing on the kindle store is either 9.99 or some minuscule variation of that.


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## CS (Nov 3, 2008)

Elk said:


> If reading the ebook version on a KIndle is a better experience, as many here, claim there should be no hesitation in paying more. You are receiving a better experience.


It is and it isn't.

It's a better experience because the Kindle is more comfortable to hold and read, you can control the font size, it's more convenient, less shelf space, etc.

It isn't because of DRM (as someone else pointed out), errors not in the print edition (almost every Kindle book has something, which is ridiculous), the inability to sell the book or lend it out (unless you illegally strip the DRM), text-to-voice often disabled (granted, a paper book disables this feature 100% of the time ), etc.

Yes, the words and content are valuable, but there are inherent limits with the e-book format that necessitate lower prices IMO.


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## Cardinal (Feb 24, 2010)

amafan said:


> I set my limit at $9.99 at that's only if for some reason I "gotta have it". That's rare.


Same here, I never buy fiction at more than $9.99 and at that price it is very rare.

I checked a book out of the library because I didn't want to pay the high eBook price, and I have been going back. The last dozen books I've read are library books and I've picked the next two book series I am going to read, and I will get those from the library as well. The publisher lost a lot of book sales from me.


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Minolta91 said:


> maybe I'm terribly naive but cant all of this be construed as Price Fixing? Every book I look at while surfing on the kindle store is either 9.99 or some minuscule variation of that.


I believe that several governmental agencies (dunno if state or federal, or perhaps both) are looking into the agency model pricing.

Mike


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## Trophywife007 (Aug 31, 2009)

Minolta91 said:


> maybe I'm terribly naive but cant all of this be construed as Price Fixing? Every book I look at while surfing on the kindle store is either 9.99 or some minuscule variation of that.


I'm curious about this, too... What is price fixing vs. does someone have the right to control what price their product sells for?


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## amafan (Aug 11, 2010)

Price fixing refers to collusion between competitors to set prices, not for a manufacturer to set prices for their own products.  There are other mechanisms such as 'minimum advertised price" which is contractual agreement between manufacturer and distributor not to advertise for sale below a given price.  That's why oftentimes Best Buy or Radio Shack will advertise an iPod bundle (iPod, case, earphones, etc.) to gain a pricing advantage, because in the bundle the price for the iPod is not revealed.


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## auge_28 (Oct 3, 2010)

EBook reading has really started to take off but it is still a new market, I think publishers are still getting a feel for this market. For example in the article titled "Is the ebook the new hardback?" (http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2010/nov/04/ebook-web-first-hardback-kindle)
The author of the article suggests that publishers are speculating that they might amplify pre-paperback word of mouth by giving away digital editions. 
At some point they will, in agreement with us the consumers, settle on a system that works.
We are all aware that publishers will charge the maximum that we will pay for . . . I detest consumer whining about how they are being over charged by villainous producers of products.
Each and every one of you would charge the most you could get for something you produced, these publishers are no different and they are running companies with employees, writers, artists and various other expenses that I don't know of. 
We should absolutely control our costs as consumers by setting personal limits, and we should also stop whining and blaming the ambiguous publisher for trying to make a buck.


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

CS said:


> Yes, the words and content are valuable, but there are inherent limits with the e-book format that necessitate lower prices IMO.


I agree, but remain surprised that so many on this board claim that ebooks are superior to physical books.

If ebooks are superior the higher price is reasonable and justified.

(I am surprised that ebooks have typos that physical books do not. Physical books are in electronic format before printing.)


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## CS (Nov 3, 2008)

auge_28 said:


> EBook reading has really started to take off but it is still a new market, I think publishers are still getting a feel for this market. For example in the article titled "Is the ebook the new hardback?" (http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2010/nov/04/ebook-web-first-hardback-kindle)
> The author of the article suggests that publishers are speculating that they might amplify pre-paperback word of mouth by giving away digital editions.
> At some point they will, in agreement with us the consumers, settle on a system that works.
> We are all aware that publishers will charge the maximum that we will pay for . . . I detest consumer whining about how they are being over charged by villainous producers of products.
> ...


I'm sorry you "detest" someone giving their opinion. If you want to consider it "whining," so be it. You are entitled to that belief. I just wish you'd respect opinions that aren't your own.


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## kb7uen Gene (Mar 13, 2009)

Once a price is set on an ebook, I don't see it going down because overstock isn't an issue for online retailers when dealing with electronic content.  Costco and other retailers reduce prices on books to free up retail space for new books once consumers loose interest in existing titles.

Gene


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## GBear (Apr 23, 2009)

I am one who votes with my wallet and is perfectly willing to wait for the price of a book to come down to buy it. If the price doesn't drop (well below $10 for mass-market fiction), then I probably won't buy it. I also don't often go see first-run movies or rush to buy the DVD.

I take the cost of producing a product into account when I consider what "fair profit" I'm willing to allow the publisher. Yes, I prefer to read on Kindle, but that "better experience" to me shouldn't more than offset the lower costs related electronic delivery.

Still, it's nothing new for publishers to try to use the opportunity of a new format to increase profits. I was similarly "outraged" when music publishers managed to double or triple the price of albums in the shift from LPs to CDs. But I seemed to be in the minority there, and eventually got over it as I moved farther away from starving student status.

So I understand why Penguin is trying to maximize their profits, but they've certainly soiled their brand with me by appearing to value greed more than offering a premium array of literature at a fair price.


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## auge_28 (Oct 3, 2010)

CS said:


> I'm sorry you "detest" someone giving their opinion. If you want to consider it "whining," so be it. You are entitled to that belief. I just wish you'd respect opinions that aren't your own.


Um, after rereading my post I am seeing that it was harsher than I intended. Sorry to ruffle feathers.
"Detest" was too strong of a word . . . but I do stick with the "whining". I just think people forget what they taught us in high school about perceived value and the consumer's power in the market place.
We have the ability to control prices, but the mass majority of us do not practice it . . . its far simpler to moan about how money grubbing others are.
All that said, I agree that the value of an eBook is substantially lowered due to the absence of a secondary market. If I buy a stack of paper books and read them I have the option of trading them or selling them to offset the price of a new book.
It would be nice if they allowed us to order eBooks and then "trade" them in (no longer attached to our accounts) for a couple dollar's off of a new unread title.

Once again, I did not mean to say anything inflammatory . . . sorry.


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## CS (Nov 3, 2008)

auge_28 said:


> Um, after rereading my post I am seeing that it was harsher than I intended. Sorry to ruffle feathers.
> "Detest" was too strong of a word . . . but I do stick with the "whining". I just think people forget what they taught us in high school about perceived value and the consumer's power in the market place.
> We have the ability to control prices, but the mass majority of us do not practice it . . . its far simpler to moan about how money grubbing others are.
> All that said, I agree that the value of an eBook is substantially lowered due to the absence of a secondary market. If I buy a stack of paper books and read them I have the option of trading them or selling them to offset the price of a new book.
> ...


Thank you, Auge. I appreciate that. No hard feelings, my friend.

I agree that we have the ability to control prices by voting with our wallets, and I certainly do my part in that regard.

I love your idea of a "trade-in" program for e-books, but I can't see it ever happening.  Amazon and other e-book sellers don't *have* to do that, so they won't. I'd love to be proven wrong one day though.


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## r1chard (Oct 25, 2010)

I guess it's lucky 13 (dollars) then


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Elk said:


> (I am surprised that ebooks have typos that physical books do not. Physical books are in electronic format before printing.)


"Recent" books, yes. The vast majority of books are not in any electronic format, such as pretty much anything before 1985 or so.

The typos seem to be mainly from the scanning/OCR process where nobody does any checking on the conversion. I've even purchased a book that turned out to have all the strike-outs from the editing process included in the text. It's just carelessness and a lack of concern with making a quality product, combined with not checking the result on an actual reading device before publishing.

Mike


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## Elk (Oct 4, 2010)

This makes sense for older books, but I have seen many errors in new ebooks that I would not expect to see in hardcopy.

Perhaps I should start comparing. The problems could be in the physical books also, but this seems unlikely.


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

Elk said:


> This makes sense for older books, but I have seen many errors in new ebooks that I would not expect to see in hardcopy.
> 
> Perhaps I should start comparing. The problems could be in the physical books also, but this seems unlikely.


I would say that when I was reading DTBs, I would find typos,/errors in 4/5 books I read.


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

Elk said:


> This makes sense for older books, but I have seen many errors in new ebooks that I would not expect to see in hardcopy.


I have seen this also. I can't explain it. I have converted quite a few books from word processor format to MOBI/ePub, and haven't seen any problems when using a "clean" source.

Mike


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

kb7uen Gene said:


> Once a price is set on an ebook, I don't see it going down because overstock isn't an issue for online retailers when dealing with electronic content. Costco and other retailers reduce prices on books to free up retail space for new books once consumers loose interest in existing titles.


Prices on ebooks in the Kindle store go down all the time. I just saw one drop from $14.99 (I think maybe it was $12.99) to $9.99 over the past couple of weeks on one I was thinking of buying. And that's one that still only available in hardcover. A lot of others are priced higher and then drop to $6-8 when the cheap mass market paper back comes out. Some drop just because sales are lagging.

There's no stock to clear out, but publishers still want to price books at the optimal range to sell the most copies in the long run. So lots that are above $9.99 drop to that or lower once the print paper back is out etc. I have no problem with that. I never bought hard covers and waited for cheap paperbacks in the past, so I can wait for the e-book price to drop when the paperback comes out now for ebooks that are above $10. Anything that stays above $10 I generally just don't bother reading or just check the paper book out from the library.

Now if you mean we won't see e-book "bargain" sections with books from big name authors for $2-3 like you see in clearance/bargain book sections in book stores then I agree. Pressure to sell physical stock isn't an issue as you note, so we won't see clearance sales. But it seems like most mainstream fiction on the Kindle eventually falls to $9.99 or below at least with some exceptions. Non-fiction seems to have a lot more books above $10.


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## Jan Strnad (May 27, 2010)

I won't pay $12.99. In fact, I'll seldom pay $9.99. There's too much good stuff out there *legally* for free or three bucks or five bucks for me to pay that kind of money. My job pays me a crappy salary (school district) so I'm cheap. I have a Kindle and also a Kobo. The Kobo gets me epubs which can be checked out from the library, so that's another avenue for legal, free ebooks.


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

jmiked said:


> "Recent" books, yes. The vast majority of books are not in any electronic format, such as pretty much anything before 1985 or so.
> 
> The typos seem to be mainly from the scanning/OCR process where nobody does any checking on the conversion. I've even purchased a book that turned out to have all the strike-outs from the editing process included in the text. It's just carelessness and a lack of concern with making a quality product, combined with not checking the result on an actual reading device before publishing.
> 
> Mike


Even recent books can have OCR errors, though I'm not sure why. The Borgia Bride by Jeanne Kalogridis was riddled with them and it was first published in print in 2001 and re-released in 2005 with the Kindle edition made available in 2007. It was definitely OCR errors, not just usual typos because it had things like a "1" instead of a capital "I". Or sometimes the quote symbol would merge with the first letter of the sentence and form a completely different letter. It was pretty ridiculous.


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## tiggeerrific (Jan 22, 2010)

I pay the $12.99 put never go over that price I also get many free books.I really dont mind paying it because I will always have the book where before when buying the book I would read it and give them away. I never went to the library to get books I always brought my books.I am the type of person who dosent like reading from a book that others have read from and who I have no idea what germs are on that book. That is why I love my kindle


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## r1chard (Oct 25, 2010)




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## cyclefreaksix (Sep 4, 2010)

r1chard said:


> I guess it's lucky 13 (dollars) then


Yeah, but lucky for who??


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## Fireheart223 (Oct 3, 2010)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Yes, it has been discussed. . . . .some might say _ad nauseum_. . . . . I buy a book if it seems worth the price, and don't if it doesn't. I am not "infuriated" because that seems like too much work.


Same for me. If its one I really want to read, I'll pony up the $12.99, or more even if necessary (I did pay the $19.99 for Fall of Giants, but loved it so much that it was worth every penny to me, I must say.) But if there are some that I'm not all that excited about, I'll hold off and see if the price drops. Of course, I wish that in general the ebook prices were cheaper, but I'm not going to stop buying them, since otherwise what's even the point of having a Kindle. There are enough free and bargain priced books out there to even out the score, in my opinion.


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## mikev (Feb 11, 2010)

There's a lot of stuff going on here that will need to be resolved before we can begin to see some standard pricing that consumers are willing to pay.

Part of the problem is that book prices have been way to low for years and now they're butting heads with ebook prices that appear to be to high.  Who pays cover price on a new hardback?  The book industry is going through it's own transformation just like the music industry did in recent years, only it's a lot more complicated.  What we need is the "ebook mp3" standard with no DRM combined with generic readers.  This is what will really bring change, until then all you can do as a consumer is speak with your wallet and not pay.

The publishing industry is a big ugly monster, it has been ripping off consumers and authors for years, and hopefully it's days are numbered.  Remember those $100+ college textbooks?  A no DRM ebook standard would blow that crap right out of the water, I can't wait.


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

mikev said:


> There's a lot of stuff going on here that will need to be resolved before we can begin to see some standard pricing that consumers are willing to pay.
> 
> Part of the problem is that book prices have been way to low for years and now they're butting heads with ebook prices that appear to be to high. Who pays cover price on a new hardback? The book industry is going through it's own transformation just like the music industry did in recent years, only it's a lot more complicated. What we need is the "ebook mp3" standard with no DRM combined with generic readers. This is what will really bring change, until then all you can do as a consumer is speak with your wallet and not pay.
> 
> The publishing industry is a big ugly monster, it has been ripping off consumers and authors for years, and hopefully it's days are numbered. Remember those $100+ college textbooks? A no DRM ebook standard would blow that crap right out of the water, I can't wait.


I totally 100% agree. But the publishers aren't going to give up that easy, I think we still have a long way to go before we see DRM-free ebook standards. ePub is considered the open ebook standard and I do wish Kindle would use it but it still supports DRM.


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## amafan (Aug 11, 2010)

Demand for content is going digital faster than the publishers can cope with it.  It happened with multi-media and it will happen with books as well.  The publishers are dealing with a changing market and they don't understand how it works and how to make money when their entire business model is centered around manufacturing and physical distribution, two things that are unneeded when digital content is delivered OTA.  When they realize they are not going to save their bacon by applying the same principles that governed the old business to the new business they will change, not before.  

Put books you want but think are too expensive in your wishlist and wait until they reach a comfortable price before you buy.  The publishers see all this data and eventually will come around and play ball.

Go Giants!


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## AmberLi (Sep 15, 2010)

amafan said:


> Demand for content is going digital faster than the publishers can cope with it. It happened with multi-media and it will happen with books as well. The publishers are dealing with a changing market and they don't understand how it works and how to make money when their entire business model is centered around manufacturing and physical distribution, two things that are unneeded when digital content is delivered OTA. When they realize they are not going to save their bacon by applying the same principles that governed the old business to the new business they will change, not before.
> 
> Put books you want but think are too expensive in your wishlist and wait until they reach a comfortable price before you buy. The publishers see all this data and eventually will come around and play ball.
> 
> Go Giants!


Now I'm pretty much an ebook newbie, but in the 2 months I've had my kindle, I haven't really seen any prices change on books I'm interested in... how often does a 12.99 book drop to 9.99 or 9.99 to something below? And I don't mean 9.78 either


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

Book prices drop and raise for weird reasons.. Sometimes it feels like there is no reason. Publisher thinks, "Oh I'm having a good hair day, all book prices can be dropped $2." "Crum, no coffee in the pot, all prices go up $3 because I'm in a pissy mood."
Honestly for new releases, sometimes they are prelisted @ $15, and drop to $9.99 by the date they are delivered, sometimes they stay above $12 for a month or 2 after publication, sometimes 3-4 months after. Some publishers don't drop the e-book price until the paperback becomes available because they want sales to go to the HB copies.


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## JenniferBecton (Oct 21, 2010)

IMO, publishers are making a lot of mistakes right now wrt to ebooks. Most buyers take into account what they think it costs to make a product, and they know that a bunch of 0's and 1's is cheaper than paper, ink, and shipping. I believe publishers are afraid of losing their grip on the traditional book market--paperbacks and hardbacks--and are raising prices to keep readers buying paper.

Having said that, I am still researching the market price of ebooks, so even though I know paying the same for paper is inflated pricing, I have no idea where the ebook price will level out.


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## LUW (Oct 30, 2010)

Let me give you guys a different perspective. I was just over at Amazon's and bought 3 books, and though my K3 is not with me right now, when I get home in about 3 to 5 minutes those three books will be in my hands. Before the K3 it would take 3 weeks for me to get them, and I would pay around $20 for S&H.

So, is it abusive that publishers are charging almost the same for the e-book and paperback versions? Sure is, there's no way to justify that. But to me, personally, is it a problem? No, I honestly can't say it is. I was doing the math and basically my K3 will pay for itself after I bought around 25 to 30 books. I'm fully aware that for North Americans this math will not apply, but for people out of NA (specially) and Europe, the Kindle is the best thing since rock & roll if you like to read a lot. Even with prices of an e-book being basically the same as the price of a pocketbook.


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## J.R. Chase (Jun 22, 2010)

I may be wrong, but $12.99 seems like a cash grab...


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## Mike D. aka jmiked (Oct 28, 2008)

J.R. Chase said:


> I may be wrong, but $12.99 seems like a cash grab...


I think it's called the free market.  

Mike


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## auge_28 (Oct 3, 2010)

Here is a book I want: 
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003YUC3YE/ref=s9_simh_gw_p351_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=1H1ERB10WRBCAGFEV37M&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470938631&pf_rd_i=507846

If I am reading this correctly the Kindle version is nearly 90 cents more than the hardback.
This is not a problem for me as I have plenty to read until it goes down to a price I am comfortable with (about $10) , and I am sure there are plenty of fans out there that think $15 is a great price for a new Stephen King book.

Also these are amazon prices, the price tag is $27.99, so for a lot of people who buy their books at brick & motor stores will be saving $13 if they order it from Kindle store.

So maybe this is a matter of perspective.


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