# The middle grade ebook market



## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

I've been sitting on the finished first book of a middle-grade series that I wrote with a collaborator a few years ago. Realizing the ebook market for middle grade wasn't really there yet, I held off on publishing it to focus on my YA work. Anyone have opinions/publishing experience with this genre? Do you think MG ebooks have finally come into their own? I see them out there. But at the same time, I've noticed a lot of that age group (including my daughter) suddenly reading less on their ereader devices and more physical books. It might just be my little corner of the universe, though. Although, last week, I ran across a 16 year old who used to use her Nook feverishly, but has decided, "I'm done with my Nook. I want to hold real books in my hand." Needless to say, I found that a bit worrisome!    She is by no means your average teen, though!

So are more kids and/or their parents buying MG ebooks now than, say, two years ago?


----------



## BelindaPepper (May 19, 2013)

Apparently kids are reading more books now than they used to (thanks to reading almost becoming "cool" again). I'm not sure how the stats break up with kids in particular, but print books still account for about 80% of the market. 

Why don't you release your book as a paperback through Createspace? Doesn't cost anything, and it'll cover the bookworms who prefer paper.


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

I think it would help if there were a way to promote MG titles as effectively as other types of ebooks.  At the moment, we have very few options for reaching parents or teachers.


----------



## cblewgolf (Jan 3, 2011)

BelindaPepper said:


> Why don't you release your book as a paperback through Createspace? Doesn't cost anything, and it'll cover the bookworms who prefer paper.


That's what I did. Cover both ends. I'm sure others will chime in but I've had a MG/YA book out for a few months now and have not seen much traction.


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

Is it really the case that MG readers have replaced every other human function in their lives with their phones (including face-to-face conversation even if the other person is in the same room and sitting next to them) but insist on paper books? 

Really?


----------



## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

From what I hear, middle graders actually _want_ others to see their book cover and know what they are reading.


----------



## cheriereich (Feb 12, 2011)

heavycat said:


> Is it really the case that MG readers have replaced every other human function in their lives with their phones (including face-to-face conversation even if the other person is in the same room and sitting next to them) but insist on paper books?
> 
> Really?


I can't say for all Middle Graders or teens, but I have noticed it seems like that age group shuns ebooks. I can't get my eighteen-year-old sister to read an ebook to save her life. It's odd.


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

> I can't say for all Middle Graders or teens, but I have noticed it seems like that age group shuns ebooks.


You know what? You can't win. You just can't win. I just flat picked the wrong genre.

Before I give up altogether, and/or before I start to believe this is some kind of bizarre conspiracy designed to prevent our books from selling, is there any way we can run some kind of survey to find out why MG and teen readers who are otherwise obsessed with their phones to the point of complete real-world dysfunction, insist on reading only paper books?


----------



## Maggie Dana (Oct 26, 2011)

I think it's much easier to sell MG e-books in a highly defined niche market. My series is upper MG/tween and aimed at horse-crazy girls. It wasn't until the books stared to appear on other horse series' 'alsobots' last summmer/fall that they started to sell reasonably well. 

My first book came out in November, 2011; there are now 6 books (plus a boxed set) in the series, and I'm part-way through writing book #7. Since the beginning of this year, they've been selling around 1400 copies a month (total, for all 7 titles) on all e-book platforms, including about 100 print books that I produce with CS.

I've kept my prices steady at $2.99 for e-books and $6.99 for print (avg. 180 pages and in keeping with my competition). I've never done Select or permafree. For the first few books I asked grown-up horsey people for reviews ... then the spontaneous kids' reviews kicked in and book #1 now has 54!

I haven't tried advertising the books and apart from a couple of guest posts on horsey blogs (I don't have my own) I've done little to no PR. I seriously doubt MG kids are reading Bookbub or POI which is why I haven't gone that route. But I could be wrong. I'd love if it anyone with experience in that area would chime in.

Mostly, I credit Amazon's 'also bought' lists for the bulk of my sales. It's a mighty powerful tool. Without it, I don't think my readers would've found me.

I'm not comfortable sharing hard numbers, and have done it in the hopes of helping other MG writers.


----------



## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

heavycat said:


> You know what? You can't win. You just can't win. I just flat picked the wrong genre.
> 
> Before I give up altogether, and/or before I start to believe this is some kind of bizarre conspiracy designed to prevent our books from selling, is there any way we can run some kind of survey to find out why MG and teen readers who are otherwise obsessed with their phones to the point of complete real-world dysfunction, insist on reading only paper books?


I'm sitting here laughing (in a very sad way). Yes, kids do everything on their smartphones. Except for mine because they only have texting. I figure they spend enough time on the computer at home and one of them on her kindle fire.... which she uses 20 percent for reading and the other 80 for games and such. But I'm at a loss, too. My YA books can't break through the market saturation. I've gotten good reviews, and I have a few rabid fans, but I can't hit my true market ... teenage girls who lean toward less main stream stuff. I'm talking the geeky fangirl type, the type that hover on the outside of the cliques. I know they're out there. I have found a few, and many older ones in their twenties and thirties. But I've probably stuck myself into a smaller niche of the already smaller YA category. Still it's the series I've always wanted to write. I'm hoping they catch on to book two, which has a huge romance element to it, and then wonder about book one? Either way, I've been outlining a so-called "new adult" novel to see what happens with that. I'm about ready to try erotica, since so many have great sales with that. I'll be the writer in Starbuck's tapping away at her laptop, blindfold on, cheeks bright red.

As far as a survey for MG/teen readers goes? Could we get them to take notice of such a survey in the first place? 

I so have to get my optimism back.


----------



## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

cblewgolf said:


> That's what I did. Cover both ends. I'm sure others will chime in but I've had a MG/YA book out for a few months now and have not seen much traction.


Ditto. I have my "upper MG" books available in print as well, but.... I pretty much have to dust off the cobwebs off my Amazon pages. 

If anyone gets any answers or has suggestions... I'm all virtual ears!


----------



## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

Maggie Dana said:


> I think it's much easier to sell MG e-books in a highly defined niche market. My series is upper MG/tween and aimed at horse-crazy girls. It wasn't until the books stared to appear on other horse series' 'alsobots' last summmer/fall that they started to sell reasonably well.
> 
> My first book came out in November, 2011; there are now 6 books (plus a boxed set) in the series, and I'm part-way through writing book #7. Since the beginning of this year, they've been selling around 1400 copies a month (total, for all 7 titles) on all e-book platforms, including about 100 print books that I produce with CS.
> 
> ...


Thanks so much, Maggie! I guess I really do have to be working harder at getting my niche to notice my work. I have been doing a ton of PR ... but like you said, many tweens/teens are not checking out Bookbub, etc. It seems that the harder I work at promoting, the more frustrated I'll get. There I am, trying to get on book review blogs, hitting YA facebook pages, and then ... bam! I get a five star review from a man in his 40s or a woman in her late twenties.

You have a peaked my optimism a bit, though.


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

I think we're headed back to the web comic and web fiction world. I've found a way to produce comics much less expensively than before, and I have absolute proof I can draw an audience of thousands with regular updates and minimal promotion. Might even be able to tie the comics in with the ebooks.

Read the comics for free. Buy the ebooks.



> According to the Association of American Publishers' annual report, sales of young adult and children's books in 2012 were up 13.1 percent over the previous year. And the category outpaced all others among e-book sales, increasing 117 percent, compared with a 41.8 increase in sales of adult fiction.


How does this square with the "kids only want paper books" trend?


----------



## Steven Stickler (Feb 1, 2012)

Maggie Dana said:


> I think it's much easier to sell MG e-books in a highly defined niche market.


This observation is spot-on, IMO.

Plenty of MG readers are buying ebooks. Check out Rick Riordan's ebooks. Or this indie author's:
Diary of a 6th Grade Ninja (a hilarious adventure for children ages 9-12)
He/they have a bunch of titles that seem aimed at boys, reluctant readers.

Obviously Riordan has some things going for him that are tough for indies to duplicate right out of the gate. But my point is that MG ebooks are selling. The folks who are able to do well in that market have probably done so by identifying a niche/audience (as Maggie mentions). Also: they have a lot of titles out.


----------



## ruecole (Jun 13, 2012)

My son still reads mostly paper, but he reads the occasional ebook, too. My niece reads almost exclusively on her iPod. My youngest sister (12) still reads exclusively print. (All three love reading and always have a book on the go.)

In my experience, unless the parents are avid readers and purchasers of ebooks, kids get most of their book recommendations from their teachers and librarians, who still (mostly) recommend traditionally published print books. It's tough to compete with the scholastic book fair.  

I suck at marketing, so I could be way wrong, but I think at this stage of the game, getting the word out about your book to schools and libraries is still the best way to get kids to find it. Of course, Maggie's experience also shows how important the also bought lists are. I've noticed a lot of the self-pubbed MG books tend to have books geared towards adults in their also boughts. Free Select days, I think, are also really bad for messing up MG also boughts.

JMVHO

Hope that helps!

Rue


----------



## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

justsomewriterwhowrites said:


> My 13 year old YA reader tells me ebooks aren't real books. *Then she wants me to buy $11-16 books for her ALL THE TIME.* It's her money, so I let her. I can't object too strenuously because I used to buy $25 hardcovers all the time. She refuses to read on my nook or kindle or her computer, but she does read Wattpad on her iPod. She still says those aren't real books, so I'm here to say sorry to the authors using Wattpad as a promotional tool. Apparently your books aren't real.  Shocking, isn't it?


This is why libraries (and used bookstores) are so helpful.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

I've only been doing this for 2 months, but I've sold 300 copies of my first book, GLIMPSE (upper MG-- MG/YA crossover), and 60% of them were print ($9.95). Book two comes out in a couple weeks, and book 3 in a couple months. I didn't expect to sell any books at all until I had all the books out. I assumed I might sell 20 copies or so, since that's about how many people are in my extended family  I think the eBook market for MG is a small percentage, but "a small percentage" doesn't *necessarily* mean a small market.


----------



## cblewgolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Mind letting us in on your secret, Steve??  300 in 60 days is pretty darn good, especially for YA/MG.


----------



## Lisa Scott (Apr 4, 2011)

My daughter has a kindle fire but doesn't like to read on it. (she's 9) However, she reads books in bed every night. When I ask her why she doesn't like to read books on the kindle, she just says, I don't know.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

I don't think we can make huge conclusions from a few anecdotes. Some kids love ereaders (mine ADORE their Nooks -- 11 and 14). Some kids would like to love them but they aren't allowed at school, so they haven't really adopted them.

A BIG problem with MG adopting eReaders is the price of eBooks from the trads. Emily LOVES so many great trad series, but the eBooks are $13 and the paperbacks are $7. No brainer there for her allowance and gift cards.

Indies can't muscle in on the trads as easily because our market has gatekeepers -- teachers, librarians, and parents. Few kids are able to buy on their own and we can't reach them through adult ways like Goodreads give aways or promo sites or blog tours.

I write MG because I like to but they are my lowest sellers. I managed to somehow get Hot New Release status on the Nook for my first MG, but ever since, they are low performers.

My next tactic is to put the MGs through NetGalley to see if I can get librarians to recommend it for the AR testing system. Then kids can read my books for school credit. Right now I sell okay during the summers (sales are up right now) but as soon as school starts and they have to read AR books, I drop down to 10 a month.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

cblewgolf said:


> Mind letting us in on your secret, Steve?? 300 in 60 days is pretty darn good, especially for YA/MG.


I don't have ANY idea. All I can say is that 90% of the print came from LSI, and most of the eBooks came from Amazon.ca (I am Canadian mind you so word of mouth among family and friends is here in Canada) and Amazon.co.uk. I've directed nearly everyone who wants to buy the print book to bookdepository.com just b/c of the free shipping. My take on those books isn't much as I give 45% discounts to wholesale orders. Best guess is I have more family than I thought, or my mom bought a bunch of copies


----------



## Maggie Dana (Oct 26, 2011)

Steve W. said:


> I've only been doing this for 2 months, but I've sold 300 copies of my first book, GLIMPSE (upper MG-- MG/YA crossover), and 60% of them were print ($9.95). Book two comes out in a couple weeks, and book 3 in a couple months. I didn't expect to sell any books at all until I had all the books out. I assumed I might sell 20 copies or so, since that's about how many people are in my extended family  I think the eBook market for MG is a small percentage, but "a small percentage" doesn't *necessarily* mean a small market.


Way to go, Steve. That's an impressive number!


----------



## TiffanyTurner (Jun 8, 2009)

TexasGirl said:


> I don't think we can make huge conclusions from a few anecdotes. Some kids love ereaders (mine ADORE their Nooks -- 11 and 14). Some kids would like to love them but they aren't allowed at school, so they haven't really adopted them.
> 
> A BIG problem with MG adopting eReaders is the price of eBooks from the trads. Emily LOVES so many great trad series, but the eBooks are $13 and the paperbacks are $7. No brainer there for her allowance and gift cards.
> 
> ...


I understand on how getting your book out there is difficult. I think Word of Mouth is especially important for MG. I'm still trying to crack how to reach librarians, parents, and grandparents. Mostly you are marketing to them. But ebooks are slowly catching on with children. I saw this around 2009-2010 when adults were wary. It took awhile for the 20% market for Indies to grow on ebooks. Eventually, the market will grow for MG on ebooks.

Plus, children are learning to read on their own at this point. Choosing from a library is equally as important as looking through a book store. Buying online is almost nil for a 9 year old. Most review sites say you have to be 13 years old. So, if someone buys an ebook for an 8-12 year old, it will be a parent or grandparent through their account. The buying power is with the adult.

I hear you about the Scholastic book store. I usually donate a few books to help kids have this available at my school. But the distribution belongs to Scholastic. And AR books, really, as a teacher, I have my students read one book only since it limits them to learn HOW to choose a book. Most will look at the number and say, "Is this OK?" You can enter the book in your local school system, or send it out so the schools might add your book. Or just post the AR level of your book onto your website. There are programs online that will check the vocabulary and give you the number. Mine are 4.6 AR. Really, the number matters. You could make up a quiz of 5-10 questions and put that on your website too.

I did do a local bookstore signing. This helped get the word out to schools and parents in the area. I sold 22 books at last count. I've also got an Honorable Mention for the third book in my MG series. It just released, but I've noticed when kids or parents hear, they want to know if the first book is available. I'm thinking of bundling the 3 books together as a set. It might help when I'm done with book 4 and people want to start at the beginning. They'll have them all together.

But then, I've also been trying to find a way to write a YA or New Adult book. I think I've stumbled on a story idea, and I've been writing the first few chapters. Now that I know how to write a book, it's good to try something that might sell better in an adult market.

Really, I love writing for children. But then, it's good to try something else and see what happens. More books always will equal more sales.


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

In the future when parents and teachers complain there are no good alternatives to violent video games and unacceptable television shows we can kindly direct them to this thread where they will find out why.

Hard enough to be an independent author.  Writing for the MG (and to a certain extent, the YA) market is like kicking whales down the beach.   A lot of good writers are going to give up and the e-book market for younger readers will become just like the web for younger people:  closed.


----------



## JB Rowley (Jan 29, 2012)

Steve W. said:


> I don't have ANY idea. All I can say is that 90% of the print came from LSI, and most of the eBooks came from Amazon.ca (I am Canadian mind you so word of mouth among family and friends is here in Canada) and Amazon.co.uk. I've directed nearly everyone who wants to buy the print book to bookdepository.com just b/c of the free shipping. My take on those books isn't much as I give 45% discounts to wholesale orders. Best guess is I have more family than I thought, or my mom bought a bunch of copies


LSI ??


----------



## JB Rowley (Jan 29, 2012)

Sales of my children’s books are almost stagnant despite good reviews while the two books aimed at the adult market are doing very well.

In my day job, I teach English to children of all ages. Several of them have expressed a desire to read my books but want them as paper editions (which I have not got around to doing yet).  Only a couple have ever read a book on an electronic device and not one of them uses an ereader on a regular basis.

Some of the reasons given for paper book preferences:
I like to see how far through the book I have got.
I like to hug my book in bed at night.
I like to hold the book.

One of my observations is that children are interested in the whole book - not just the story. They love to explore the back of the book to see what other books are available; they like to read about the author on the back or on the inside back cover; they are very tactile when reading and love to touch the book, a sort of caressing.

As someone has already noted, they tend to make their reading choices based on what they learn about through school where they are influenced by their peers, their teachers and sometimes the class experience of reading a book.  Programs run through the schools aimed at encouraging children to read, such as The Premier’s Reading Challenge, are based around paper books.


----------



## Nick Endi Webb (Mar 25, 2012)

cblewgolf said:


> Mind letting us in on your secret, Steve??


It's his covers. They're perfect. If my daughter were on here, she'd point to his covers and say "I want that one!"


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

Well, maybe some enterprising author will discover the key to this market in 2041.   But I think its clear at this point if you have any delusions about turning the 3000-4000 hours of work required to build an independent book business into compensation beyond what one of your readers could earn serving frozen yogurt cups on weekends, this ain't the market for it.

At least with a different genre I can have a web site and a mailing list without having to contend with six hundred government lawyers.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

JB Rowley said:


> LSI ??


Lightening Source / Ingram

Just like Createspace only harder to set up accounts, costs a bit for setup and annual fee. Books are slightly better quality (imo) but not drastically so. I have my own ISBNs and Createspace told me that if I used my own ISBNs I didn't qualify for their expanded distribution. My ISBNs are supplied by the Canadian Government, so maybe there's something about that that precludes them from that expanded distribution... not sure. Anyway, that's why I sought out LSI. I'm pretty sure Createspace has about the same reach as LSI... not sure though. I also registered my titles with Library Archives Canada, which is a free service, and adds your titles to library ordering catalogs in Canada.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

JB Rowley said:


> One of my observations is that children are interested in the whole book - not just the story. They love to explore the back of the book to see what other books are available; they like to read about the author on the back or on the inside back cover; they are very tactile when reading and love to touch the book, a sort of caressing.


This is something I totally agree with. I think layout and print design is an often overlooked component. I put a lot of thought into the layout of my books - if you 'look inside' my PRINT book on Amazon, you'll see that chapter headings, font, and even scene breaks are elements that were designed. Additionally, there are a few pages at the back that talk about the books, and how I came up with the stories.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Steve, are you going to leave Select eventually and be on the Nook? I was just about to go make Emily buy yours when I saw the Prime logo.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> Steve, are you going to leave Select eventually and be on the Nook? I was just about to go make Emily buy yours when I saw the Prime logo.


Argh, I would have left Select the second day I was on there. I didn't realize nook had such a huge market share in Canada. I bet I got two dozen emails from friends who would have bought the book had it been available elsewhere! So yes, July 08th, is the end of my time on Select. None of my new titles will go on there.

eta: meant Select


----------



## Simon Haynes (Mar 14, 2011)

I have a MG series (Hal Junior) which was one the of the most enjoyable things I've ever written. Finding a trad pub wasn't of interest to me, not after already being traditionally published with my other books, so I went self-pub pretty much straight away. (AFTER I self-pubbed the first in the series I heard back from a major publisher, but I told them they were too late ...)

Anyway, I released the first in ebook and print, the latter via both CreateSpace and LSI. Then I wrote and published two more books in the same series. The reach was a little better than I expected locally, with a distributor picking them up and getting them into public libraries and the occasional school, but outside Western Australia it's been very slow going. I have French and Italian translations of the first book under way, which might get things moving a little, and I still have plans for five more books in the series.

To be honest, I'm happy to write and publish these for the pure fun of it. I'm organising a refresh of the covers later this year, to coincide with publication of the translated editions, and it'll be interesting to see whether that boosts the reach. The first in the series is now perma-free as well, something which took me about 6 months to organise. My theory was that parents might download and read it, then pick up the paperback editions for their kids.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

heavycat said:


> Well, maybe some enterprising author will discover the key to this market in 2041.


You know, I've given this a lot of thought. I keep thinking about some of the MG books out there that are selling gangbusters as eBooks and I try to think of what it is that sets them apart. I've decided (and this is just my, possibly flawed, opinion) it's the fact that traditional publishing is involved. Don't get me wrong, I don't think you can't be successful as a self publisher with MG books (I'm counting on the fact that you CAN be successful actually). But I think you need to get at least one of your books in bookstores/schools/libraries. For that reason, I think the hybrid approach for a children's book author is the way to go. I'm not there yet, but that is my goal. It might not work, but I think the two models could be very complementary.

And yes, I know, easier said than done.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

Simon Haynes said:


> I have a MG series (Hal Junior) which was one the of the most enjoyable things I've ever written. Finding a trad pub wasn't of interest to me, not after already being traditionally published with my other books, so I went self-pub pretty much straight away. (AFTER I self-pubbed the first in the series I heard back from a major publisher, but I told them they were too late ...)
> 
> Anyway, I released the first in ebook and print, the latter via both CreateSpace and LSI. Then I wrote and published two more books in the same series. The reach was a little better than I expected locally, with a distributor picking them up and getting them into public libraries and the occasional school, but outside Western Australia it's been very slow going. I have French and Italian translations of the first book under way, which might get things moving a little, and I still have plans for five more books in the series.
> 
> To be honest, I'm happy to write and publish these for the pure fun of it. I'm organising a refresh of the covers later this year, to coincide with publication of the translated editions, and it'll be interesting to see whether that boosts the reach. The first in the series is now perma-free as well, something which took me about 6 months to organise. My theory was that parents might download and read it, then pick up the paperback editions for their kids.


I was just going to suggest someone track down that "Hal Junior Space book guy" and see if he come and tell us about his experience. LOL.

Were you approached by foreign publishers? (the French and Italian editions?) Or was this something you arranged on your own?


----------



## Simon Haynes (Mar 14, 2011)

Hi Steve

What happened is that I offered the Hal Junior series to the publisher who put out the first four Hal Spacejock novels, but they passed. Their advice was for me to approach bigger publishers, and they suggested a couple. I approached three, and after three months passed my circumstances changed, so I emailed all three to say I was withdrawing my submission. One of them obviously didn't get that message, because eight weeks later I got an email saying the series was of interest to them, and could I submit the full manuscript? I apologised, said they were too late, and that was that.

The changed circumstances? I got the ebook rights back for my first four novels, and was keen to re-issue them myself. It seemed crazy to chase a trad publisher for my new series when I'd be indie-publishing everything else.


----------



## Simon Haynes (Mar 14, 2011)

Steve W. said:


> Were you approached by foreign publishers? (the French and Italian editions?) Or was this something you arranged on your own?


Sorry, I forgot to answer that bit.

The French & Italian editions were organised by me, directly with the translators. Both of them approached me, but I can't say much about it because the contracts don't allow me to discuss the precise details.

I'm just hoping that Spanish and German translators contact me too - and any other languages, for that matter. (Spanish because I grew up there, and I could read the result myself. German because a major publisher is releasing my first adult novel in that language come November.)


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

Simon Haynes said:


> Sorry, I forgot to answer that bit.
> 
> The French & Italian editions were organised by me, directly with the translators. Both of them approached me, but I can't say much about it because the contracts don't allow me to discuss the precise details.
> 
> I'm just hoping that Spanish and German translators contact me too - and any other languages, for that matter. (Spanish because I grew up there, and I could read the result myself. German because a major publisher is releasing my first adult novel in that language come November.)


My secret dream is to have my books translated into Japanese because I lived there for a while.

Congratulations on all that success. I really hope it continues for you! We need more SP middle grade novelists making it.


----------



## cdvsmx5 (May 23, 2012)

http://www.digitalbookworld.com/2013/report-childrens-digital-reading-growing-kobo-offers-discounts-to-capitalize/


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

They can keep saying it, but that don't make it true. I think 50% of kids reading eBooks is a lot of hooey. Where did they pull that data out of their (I'll just self censor here.)


----------



## cdvsmx5 (May 23, 2012)

TexasGirl said:


> They can keep saying it, but that don't make it true. I think 50% of kids reading eBooks is a lot of hooey. Where did they pull that data out of their (I'll just self censor here.)


The full report is available: 
https://media.kobobooks.com/sites/media.kobobooks.com/files/documents/childrens_digital_book_market_-_kobo_white_paper_spring_2013.pdf

As is traditional, they do include YA in the Children's category. This makes the numbers reasonable to me.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

cdvsmx5 said:


> The full report is available:
> https://media.kobobooks.com/sites/media.kobobooks.com/files/documents/childrens_digital_book_market_-_kobo_white_paper_spring_2013.pdf
> 
> As is traditional, they do include YA in the Children's category. This makes the numbers reasonable to me.


Well yeah. I can believe that. Most YA is bought by older women. Everyone knows that. I think all that's cool. I do not buy for a minute that "more than half of U.S. children are now reading ebooks." I CAN believe YA sales inflate the number of ebooks sold to children.


----------



## TiffanyTurner (Jun 8, 2009)

cdvsmx5 said:


> The full report is available:
> https://media.kobobooks.com/sites/media.kobobooks.com/files/documents/childrens_digital_book_market_-_kobo_white_paper_spring_2013.pdf
> 
> As is traditional, they do include YA in the Children's category. This makes the numbers reasonable to me.


Very interesting report. I like how it shows all of the genre sales for children's books, fantasy and magic are the highest. Followed by general fiction and then romance. Plus, the steady increase of sales is promising. Maybe we should just wait and write what we know. And still keep a hard copy available with the ebook edition.

Plus, it was interesting to read about pricing. People still associate more money with a good book, and will pay that for an author they know. What if they don't know the author? Does permafree work better to build an audience and following?

Filled with more questions. But the report answered a few that I had. Thanks for posting.


----------



## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

Steve W. said:


> You know, I've given this a lot of thought. I keep thinking about some of the MG books out there that are selling gangbusters as eBooks and I try to think of what it is that sets them apart. I've decided (and this is just my, possibly flawed, opinion) it's the fact that traditional publishing is involved. Don't get me wrong, I don't think you can't be successful as a self publisher with MG books (I'm counting on the fact that you CAN be successful actually). But I think you need to get at least one of your books in bookstores/schools/libraries. For that reason, I think the hybrid approach for a children's book author is the way to go. I'm not there yet, but that is my goal. It might not work, but I think the two models could be very complementary.
> 
> And yes, I know, easier said than done.


With the second book in my series out, I'm planning to make the independent book store rounds. Many want to work with indie authors these days to find a way to compete with ebooks in the way of consignment and signings.The school libraries are another part of my plan. They're already in my public library. But I think I have to figure out why I'm constantly surprised over how people I think will enjoy my work either never bite in the first place, or get the book and then I hear nothing (by way of review from a giveaway or sale). BUT then I get people who found it in random ways gushing over it. I've gotten email and 4 and 5 star reviews. Most of the time, those people are adult women who wish they had the book when they were teens. So....maybe my market is FORMER female teens? LOL. I keep thinking that if I could get into the "Also boughts," it would help. I finally put the first book, Treehugger, into Select and I'm doing a three-day free promo in July. I've spent so much time notifying sites ahead of time that I really hope it does something.


----------



## Katherine Roberts (Apr 4, 2013)

First of all, thanks to heavycat for directing me to this thread from the YA one. My children's books are published for 8-12 over here in the UK (though some are really younger-end YA, and one has proved itself a crossover, but they all go on the same shelf). I've reverted rights in the out of print titles and republished them as ebooks so they're officially backlist now, but I don't think that necessarily matters for children's books, since there is a new generation of 9 year olds who would have been too young for them the first time around.

Anyway, I find my best-selling ebook is the one that's read by adults too, especially since I changed its categories at Amazon and put it into an adult category as well as a children's category. That was sort of what I expected, so it's probably no surprise to anyone here.

A bit of a surprise is that one of my younger ebooks sells better at Apple than Amazon - though I'm talking v. small figures and it hasn't been in the Apple store long, so that might be a fluke rather than a trend.

This might be interesting for people considering a paper edition... My new series is traditionally published on a children's list in the UK in hardcover, paperback, and ebook. The ebook sales for the final 3 months of last year were only around 1.6% of its combined paper sales (yes, there IS meant to be a decimal point in there!) This would seem to suggest having paper copies available is a very good idea, at least for the UK market, although price might come into it. My hardcovers are cheaper discounted on amazon than a POD paperback would be, and in general I think people expect children's books to be cheaper than adult books?

My experience with children's ebooks so far has been that they sell in much smaller numbers than my paper books, but Steve and Maggie have obviously proved that it's possible to sell middle grade in ebook form - I find that very encouraging


----------



## Laura Lond (Nov 6, 2010)

I have my MG/YA available as ebook, paperback, and audiobook. The ebook version outsells them all, although paperback also sells, especially before holidays. I guess it shows that you just never know: some books sell better electronically, others in paper. We just need to make sure we have it all covered - and then let Word of Mouth do its work.


----------



## @Suzanna (Mar 14, 2011)

Steve W. said:


> Argh, I would have left Select the second day I was on there. I didn't realize nook had such a huge market share in Canada.


I think you meant Kobo. We can't buy the Nook here.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn (Aug 8, 2011)

My YA novel sells, but primarily to adults.

My 2 cents: the reason indie MG doesn't sell isn't because kids aren't reading ebooks. They are - Lightning Thief is a great example (HP too) of the ability to move LOTS of ebooks (both cross over to adults as well, but the kids aren't just reading those in paper). The reason indie MG doesn't sell is the _discovery_ of MG books and the _vetting_ of MG books for kids is still heavily tied to the gatekeeper system of libraries/parents/bookstores, which revolves around print. Once kids "hear" of a book, they're happy to consume it in ebook. But they have to discover it first, and most discoveries come through gatekeepers - and most of the gatekeepers discover through library reviews journals and other traditional reviewing systems.

However.

I recently started a NetGalley author co-op, which means that our indie titles now have access to _all kinds _of librarians and booksellers! Finally, a possible way around the gatekeeping system for MG titles! I've solicited a couple author friends with MG books out to try out NetGalley with their MG books and see if they get any traction there. And I'm considering finally publishing that MG title I've been holding onto (revising as we speak in preparation for that). Although I also have some publisher interest in that MG title, and I _still_ think that trad-pub is the way to go for MG, so I lean towards taking that deal if it comes. But at least there may be a possibility for breaking in with indie MG now (with NetGalley).


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Susan, that's EXACTLY why I joined a NetGalley coop, for my MGs.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn (Aug 8, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> Susan, that's EXACTLY why I joined a NetGalley coop, for my MGs.


What's your experience been? Has it helped? I'd love any insights you have!


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

I'd be highly appreciative, for those of us who don't have the experience, if we could get a description of what a NetGalley is and how it works.


----------



## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

heavycat said:


> I'd be highly appreciative, for those of us who don't have the experience, if we could get a description of what a NetGalley is and how it works.


https://www.netgalley.com/


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

Four hundred bucks.  Well, sounds great!


----------



## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

That's why 20 authors get together and form a NetGalley co-operative. Then, it is 300 bucks each and lasts a year instead of six months. We can each have one book up at a time, and we can swap out that book weekly if we want, but most of us swap monthly. Our co-operative is full, but others can form.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn (Aug 8, 2011)

NetGalley for Indie Authors


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Susan Kaye Quinn said:


> What's your experience been? Has it helped? I'd love any insights you have!


Right now I have an NA in, but my first MG will go up in July. I'll let you all know. I'm releasing the third of my trilogy in my signature this holiday season, and leading up to that, I wanted to see if I could get librarian interest in the series by putting it in NetGally. Jinnie goes in July. Marcus in August. Elektra should go up in October or November. I have another NA book to release before I do my last MG.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn (Aug 8, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> Right now I have an NA in, but my first MG will go up in July. I'll let you all know. I'm releasing the third of my trilogy in my signature this holiday season, and leading up to that, I wanted to see if I could get librarian interest in the series by putting it in NetGally. Jinnie goes in July. Marcus in August. Elektra should go up in October or November. I have another NA book to release before I do my last MG.


Sounds like a great plan! I look forward to hearing your results. My MG would be going up in the fall at the very earliest; possibly 2014, depending on several factors (including finishing the revisions!). So this data would be extremely useful! Thanks!


----------



## Michael Murray (Oct 31, 2011)

Katherine Roberts said:


> A bit of a surprise is that one of my younger ebooks sells better at Apple than Amazon - though I'm talking v. small figures and it hasn't been in the Apple store long, so that might be a fluke rather than a trend.


That is a great point - many many kids in the US have iPads (in my day job we sell educational software), and even more have Touchs, and even iPhones. I think for most parents it's more likely the kid's first device will be a general purpose tablet/smartphone rather than an e-reader.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Our schools now issue an ipad to every student starting in 6th grade through high school graduation. They do this instead of textbooks.

My fifth grader got issued one for the end of the year to play with so she'd be ready for using it for academic work next year. They can check them out over the summer as well.

We signed an agreement and paid a $25 insurance policy for it.


----------



## TiffanyTurner (Jun 8, 2009)

TexasGirl said:


> Our schools now issue an ipad to every student starting in 6th grade through high school graduation. They do this instead of textbooks.
> 
> My fifth grader got issued one for the end of the year to play with so she'd be ready for using it for academic work next year. They can check them out over the summer as well.
> 
> We signed an agreement and paid a $25 insurance policy for it.


As a teacher, I applaud your district. This is awesome, because I know it's coming.

Two: as a children's writer, yes! *Fist bump* Finally, kids are getting their tablets, Ipads, etc. I think ebooks will take off when more of this starts to happen.

I've got my first book permafree right now. It's up to 400 downloads. Again, trying to build an audience, and I'm noticing sales of the next books in the series. Just a few, but it is getting the word out. This will only be for the summer though. I'm planning to go back to the $0.99 when school gets going again in August.

But hopefully lots of kids will download it and be introduced to the series during the summer, and will tell their friends. 

The NetGalley idea sounds really great, esp. if we can launch it as a Back to School angle. Lots of bloggers, librarians and teachers will be looking for books at the beginning of the school year. Deals of any sort will get their attention.


----------



## Katherine Roberts (Apr 4, 2013)

TexasGirl said:


> Our schools now issue an ipad to every student starting in 6th grade through high school graduation. They do this instead of textbooks.


This sounds excellent! 

In the UK we have a Book Start scheme that gives a book to all new babies, but that's "real" books... http://www.bookstart.org.uk/ (and I suppose they'd be a bit young for ipads!)


----------



## David Alastair Hayden (Mar 19, 2011)

justsomewriterwhowrites said:


> My 13 year old YA reader tells me ebooks aren't real books. Then she wants me to buy $11-16 books for her ALL THE TIME. It's her money, so I let her. I can't object too strenuously because I used to buy $25 hardcovers all the time. She refuses to read on my nook or kindle or her computer, but she does read Wattpad on her iPod. She still says those aren't real books, so I'm here to say sorry to the authors using Wattpad as a promotional tool. Apparently your books aren't real.  Shocking, isn't it?


She might want to mention that to the hundreds of Wattpadders who've bought my books. Apparently they didn't get the memo. ;-)

I wouldn't consider a lot of books on Wattpad to be real books. There's such a wide range from established authors to fan fic (still wondering who One Direction is) to beginning authors to "look I wrote my first story ever." So it sort of depends on what your kid is reading.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Our time will come! I keep releasing one MG a year, thinking, THIS will be the holiday season, or maybe THIS one.


----------



## David Alastair Hayden (Mar 19, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> Our time will come! I keep releasing one MG a year, thinking, THIS will be the holiday season, or maybe THIS one.


Last publishing data I saw said MG was the fastest growing ebook segment but is still small. That means it's starting to catch up though.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

David Alastair Hayden said:


> Last publishing data I saw said MG was the fastest growing ebook segment but is still small. That means it's starting to catch up though.


Interesting. I've seen reports that it's the fastest growing segment, but not "eBook" specific. That's good news, but I suppose it could mean it went from 1% to 4% (Up a whopping 400%!) 

I'm really liking this thread. Great to see so many MG authors putting out books on their own. Plus, I love looking at all the covers in the sigs!


----------



## jbilman (Sep 23, 2012)

I'm interested to know how many MG authors are also writing (or considering writing) for an adult audience. eg. thrillers, mystery, etc (not just YA). And if so, whether you have (or would) use the same author name for both. I think Simon Haynes (from an earlier post) might be one. 

I'm curious to know whether you think using the same name is advantageous, confusing to readers, etc.

Thanks

Jeff


----------



## DavidRM (Sep 21, 2010)

I have an MG series underway. 2nd book just came out (see sig). 3rd book will be published in September.

I also have another series that is "general adult" alternate history fantasy/flintlock fantasy. I'm writing the 3rd book in that series now.

I use the same name on both series (mine). I figure readers will self-sort. The two series have very different looks and descriptions, as do my other standalone novels, collections and shorts.

-David


----------



## Scott Pixello (May 4, 2013)

Hi,
I've just published _Rainbow_, my first overtly MG novel (my first three were really YA with quite a strong A element). I plan several more, including a series based on the Roman occupation of Britain (such obvious comic material) and at the moment I've used the same author name for all of them. My thinking is that the MG market is so embryonic, why split/confuse it even more with different identities and also the possibility that if you can 'hook' readers at a younger age, they might become longer-term fans of your more mature (not much, in my case) work.
With parents/librarians as the dominant gatekeepers, it's a difficult market to break into, a bit like marketing toys to the 8-12 range. Issues surrounding suitability, price and dare I say it, FUN, are all filtered through an adult perspective, making decisions like cover design particularly tricky.


----------



## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

David Alastair Hayden said:


> She might want to mention that to the hundreds of Wattpadders who've bought my books. Apparently they didn't get the memo. ;-)
> 
> I wouldn't consider a lot of books on Wattpad to be real books. There's such a wide range from established authors to fan fic (still wondering who One Direction is) to beginning authors to "look I wrote my first story ever." So it sort of depends on what your kid is reading.


I've been thinking of posting the prologue and first couple of chapters of Treehugger on Wattpad. That's all I can do since I'm in Select. But I figured then I can promote the days the book goes free on Amazon on Wattpad. I went to go do that and .... what a pain to cut and paste! I have to reformat it all. That's a tonight project, I guess.



jbilman said:


> I'm interested to know how many MG authors are also writing (or considering writing) for an adult audience. eg. thrillers, mystery, etc (not just YA). And if so, whether you have (or would) use the same author name for both. I think Simon Haynes (from an earlier post) might be one.
> 
> I'm curious to know whether you think using the same name is advantageous, confusing to readers, etc.
> 
> ...


I started playing with a New Adult novel and I wondered the same thing. That one will be far racier than my YA. But I think I will stick with the same name.


----------



## Katherine Roberts (Apr 4, 2013)

jbilman said:


> I'm curious to know whether you think using the same name is advantageous, confusing to readers, etc.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Jeff


Maybe it would work for YA/adult, but I think it might be confusing to use the same name for adult fiction and middle grade.

I think I'd use a different name because I'd be worried younger readers would get hold of the adult book by accident. Also, adult readers might not be too keen to be seen reading a book by a children's author? (Though JK Rowling used the same name on her adult book with no problems!)


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

Katherine Roberts said:


> Maybe it would work for YA/adult, but I think it might be confusing to use the same name for adult fiction and middle grade.
> 
> I think I'd use a different name because I'd be worried younger readers would get hold of the adult book by accident. Also, adult readers might not be too keen to be seen reading a book by a children's author? (Though *JK Rowling used the same name on her adult book with no problems*!)


And Neil Gaiman, John Grisham, and about 100 others. I don't know if I think you need a different name, but you DO I think, need to establish a different brand so that the people who read your stuff aren't confused.


----------



## Katherine Roberts (Apr 4, 2013)

Steve W. said:


> And Neil Gaiman, John Grisham, and about 100 others. I don't know if I think you need a different name, but you DO I think, need to establish a different brand so that the people who read your stuff aren't confused.


Agreed - it's okay if readers know exactly what they're buying. And there doesn't seem to be a problem with adult authors who decide to write a children's book, just the other way around.

I still think I'd use a different one for adult fiction, though - probably a variation of my own name so it's obviously me but not me... if you see what I mean!


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

Katherine Roberts said:


> Agreed - it's okay if readers know exactly what they're buying. And there doesn't seem to be a problem with adult authors who decide to write a children's book, just the other way around.
> 
> I still think I'd use a different one for adult fiction, though - probably a variation of my own name so it's obviously me but not me... if you see what I mean!


That's an interesting idea. I kind of like it. I cringe at the idea of writing under a pen name... and not b/c I want the recognition, it's just the idea of establishing two profiles online just makes me want to puke. I barely keep up with facebook and blog with my real name. I am contemplating putting out a few adult titles and I've been trying to figure out a good way to do it. I'd be curious to hear how people here have done it and what kind of success they've had. (or trouble they've had).


----------



## jbilman (Sep 23, 2012)

I'm in the same boat Steve. As a middle grade author I use "Jeff" as my first name. I've been thinking about using "Jeffrey S." for any adult titles. It's still obviously me and hopefully people will understand the distinction. I won't know until I try it though and the first adult title isn't quite ready yet.


----------



## Simon Haynes (Mar 14, 2011)

My 'adult' books don't have sex or violence in them, and very little swearing. I know 10-12 year olds read them, so I'm not really fussed if kids read my MG books and then move on to Hal Spacejock.  If my adult books were packed with sex and violence, I'd probably have used a pen name for the MG stuff.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

My names are very similar for MG and for adult, and they share Facebook, Twitter, Google Plus, Pinterest, and LinkedIn.

Where they diverge are the blogs and Goodreads and Author Central.

This is not a "hidden" pen name, but I make them different enough that searching for one won't get you the other.

My adult bio mentions that I write for kids, but my kid bio does not mention I write for adults.


----------



## Lisa Scott (Apr 4, 2011)

jbilman said:


> I'm interested to know how many MG authors are also writing (or considering writing) for an adult audience. eg. thrillers, mystery, etc (not just YA). And if so, whether you have (or would) use the same author name for both. I think Simon Haynes (from an earlier post) might be one.
> 
> I'm curious to know whether you think using the same name is advantageous, confusing to readers, etc.
> 
> ...


I write romance but I have an MG book coming out with a traditional publisher Feb 2014. For romance, I've been using my name, Lisa Scott. For the MG, the agent, publisher and I decided a slight differentiation might be a good idea, so I'm going with Lisa Ann Scott for the kids books.

I had also been considering having a landing page on my website with two links to go to either lisa scott or lisa ann scott, but then decided it might be too tempting for kids to check out Lisa Scott, so I'm creating a separate page for Lisa Ann Scott.

The only problem, whenever I hear "Lisa Ann Scott" I'm suddenly 10 again and in trouble with my mom...


----------



## heavycat (Feb 14, 2011)

If someone out there wants to make a zillion dollars, create a platform where MG authors can reach their market without having to negotiate with 600 government lawyers.  I will buy the product you create for all eighteen of my books right now.


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Lisa Scott said:


> The only problem, whenever I hear "Lisa Ann Scott" I'm suddenly 10 again and in trouble with my mom...


LISA ANN SCOTT! Come here this instant!

Sorry, I couldn't resist.


----------



## Lisa Scott (Apr 4, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> LISA ANN SCOTT! Come here this instant!
> 
> Sorry, I couldn't resist.


 Actually, I was a boring kid who didn't get in trouble often enough...


----------



## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

Lisa Scott said:


> The only problem, whenever I hear "Lisa Ann Scott" I'm suddenly 10 again and in trouble with my mom...


When I was a kid, at least half the girls I knew had Ann as a middle name. Carol Ann, Laurie Ann, Barbara Ann... I was an outlier in the middle-name department. (BTW, where in upstate NY are you? Those are my old stomping grounds.)


----------



## Katherine Roberts (Apr 4, 2013)

My middle name is Anne, too! (with an 'e', just to be different).

An interesting thing about pseudonyms is that with the traditional method of getting books into shops, some authors are advised to change their name if they write something a bit different, or a book their publisher hopes might break out... I think this might be to get around the ordering system, which I understand is based upon sales of an author's last book, at least it is in the UK.

I know that fiction factories such as Working Partners create a new author name for each new series - often something that goes with the series itself. Then if the series sells, they keep that author alive. If it bombs, they kill off the fictional author and create another one for the next idea. (The books are written by real authors hired to turn WP's plots into stories, and I know someone who has children's books published with them under about 5 different names!)


----------



## Lisa Scott (Apr 4, 2011)

Jena H said:


> (BTW, where in upstate NY are you? Those are my old stomping grounds.)


I grew up outside buffalo, and live in Batavia now. How about you?


----------



## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

Lisa Scott said:


> I grew up outside buffalo, and live in Batavia now. How about you?


I grew up in a small town not far from Syracuse. Now, I have a brother in Rochester, a sister in Syracuse, and another brother just outside Utica. (I still miss the Finger Lakes area, but I think my blood has thinned so that I'd have to totally re-adjust to the winters!  )


----------



## kea (Jun 13, 2011)

Lisa Scott said:


> Actually, I was a boring kid who didn't get in trouble often enough...


Ah, Lisa...me too. My worst acts were a series of "almosts." I _almost_ help steal a street sign. I _almost_ broke into a jacuzzi. I _almost_ cheated on my 8th grade history final, etc, etc, etc. Maybe you and I should hang out one day and raise a little hell.....then turn it into a collaborated novel. Ha!


----------



## Lisa Scott (Apr 4, 2011)

kea said:


> Ah, Lisa...me too. My worst acts were a series of "almosts." I _almost_ help steal a street sign. I _almost_ broke into a jacuzzi. I _almost_ cheated on my 8th grade history final, etc, etc, etc. Maybe you and I should hang out one day and raise a little hell.....then turn it into a collaborated novel. Ha!


Ha, so funny. Yeah, we could get in a lot of trouble and no one would ever believe it was us! That could be a fun kids book, a kid who tries to get in trouble--but it just never works out!


----------



## MarcyB (Feb 10, 2013)

My YA short stories series far outsell my MG novel. I think the person that said the vetting for MG books by known publishers make indie MG a very hard sell.  For those that haven't stopped by my blog (and many of you have, so hello!), I feature MG books available on Kindle in a feature called Middle Grade Mondays:  Kindle for Kids. (www.marcyblesy.com).  I just added new books today. If you are interested, follow the link for info. on how to submit. It's free. I don't know how well it works but networking and exposure is good. Sometimes on twitter I'll get tagged in a tweet where people have picked up the blog and added it to a "news of the day" for children's books type feature.  

I have stopped writing the sequel to my novel simply because the sales don't warrant the time. I know that sounds terrible, but I want to make money at this, too, and right now the YA sells better.


----------



## jbilman (Sep 23, 2012)

MarcyBlesy said:


> My YA short stories series far outsell my MG novel. I think the person that said the vetting for MG books by known publishers make indie MG a very hard sell.
> 
> I have stopped writing the sequel to my novel simply because the sales don't warrant the time. I know that sounds terrible, but I want to make money at this, too, and right now the YA sells better.


MG is my favorite market to write in because of the satisfaction I get seeing the kids enjoying the stories, but I've come to a similar conclusion in terms of making some sort of a living from writing. I have a new MG series coming out soon, so I won't stop writing MG, but I'll certainly be spending more time on YA or general fiction.


----------



## Maggie Dana (Oct 26, 2011)

MarcyBlesy said:


> I have stopped writing the sequel to my novel simply because the sales don't warrant the time. I know that sounds terrible, but I want to make money at this, too, and right now the YA sells better.


Love your Lexie cover, Marcy.


----------



## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

Hi, and welcome to the sometimes-lonely MG writer's world.   

I have my Timekeepers books available via CreateSpace, as there's really no reason NOT to, and it can only help.  Regarding page count...  I'm not positive at the moment as it's been months since I set up my last book there, but IIRC if you format your book to CS's specifications, you'll get an idea how many pages it will be.  I think you should go ahead and start the CreateSpace process for your book (if you haven't already) and see what you come up with.  (Edit:  I see you realize you can gauge the number of pages, but I'm not sure why you think you need to know it now, ahead of time.)

As for the price to charge...   you have to balance a 'reasonable' price for buyers with a 'reasonable' profit for you.  For example, if CS tells you the least you can charge is $7.00, you can set your price at $8.99 and make $1.99 profit per book.  I understand you want to keep your price below the "big" names (so do I) but at the same time, it really is based on page count.  If you want to make your price lower, you pretty much have to reduce the page count as much as possible.  To some degree you can do that by the font you use and maybe the trim size. (?)  But other than that, you just have to grit your teeth and choose a price.  (Keeping in mind you can always raise or lower your price at any time.)

Don't feel panicky.  I'm very much a "casual" computer user and I admit I too was a bit intimidated by trying to use CreateSpace by myself.  But I did it successfully-- twice.  Not that anyone is buying the paperback books, but....  still, I did it.  And so can you.


----------



## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

A quick look at my two MG books show that one is 51,700 words, which in CreateSpace (based on trim size, font, etc.) is 182 pages.  The second book is 41,000 words, and 141 pages.  I set them at $8.99 and $7.99.  (Again, nobody seems to be buying the paperback versions, so at this point it's academic.    )


----------



## TexasGirl (Dec 21, 2011)

Marcus Mender is 150 pages at 37,000 words.

You are not going to be able to compete on pricing with traditional houses. They publish thousands of copies at about 80 cents per copy (or less for big big runs). It's just not possible to compete with that price wise.

Know that if your paper book does start selling, Amazon will pay attention and discount the book and the discount comes from their cut not yours.

Having a paper copy that is in your control has no impact on traditional deals, because you can take it down at any time. If you talk to the hybrids here, they all had paper copies that got bought out by the publishers.

Price it where you need to price it. Only retail clients pay full price anyway. Libraries, etc. get discounts via the distributor.


----------



## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

TexasGirl said:


> Marcus Mender is 150 pages at 37,000 words.
> 
> You are not going to be able to compete on pricing with traditional houses. They publish thousands of copies at about 80 cents per copy (or less for big big runs). It's just not possible to compete with that price wise.
> 
> ...


This is exactly what I was going to say. I can't see any of my books on any site being listed for what I price them at ($9.95 - 236pgs, and $11.95 - 256 pages). They are both at least a dollar off on amazon, and on other sites they're two or three dollars off. I price it with narrow margins, and account for whatever discount I want to provide.


----------



## TiffanyTurner (Jun 8, 2009)

sibelhodge said:


> If you write children's books you can submit them to a new book blog by The Independent! http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2013/06/06/introducing-the-children%E2%80%99s-book-blog/


Thank you Sibel for posting. Emailed information to them. Looks like they posted it end of June, but hopefully their list isn't too full yet.  Good to find Indie/self publishing friendly review sites. That it is for children's book is an extra bonus. These are hard to find.


----------



## Wansit (Sep 27, 2012)

Just read an interview with a literary agent who listed the sale percentages of her client's MG novel in 2012.










Stefan Bachmann's THE PECULIAR sold 94% print books to 6% ebooks in 2012 and he wouldn't have been an international bestseller in print if he'd self-published.

http://fantasy-faction.com/2013/sara-megibow-interview-part-two


----------



## Katherine Roberts (Apr 4, 2013)

Interesting interview, thank you. Yes, that agrees with my own experience of print vs. ebook sales for traditionally published MG fiction - although the percentages in the UK seem even more heavily weighted towards print at present.


----------



## hyh (Jul 21, 2013)

Wansit said:


> Just read an interview with a literary agent who listed the sale percentages of her client's MG novel in 2012.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh, that's disheartening news for an indie MG author!  Everyone says the main way to be commercially successful is via ebooks and even if we have print versions, since we can get print copies into a book store, it's really hard to reach the target audience...

...is being an indie MG author just a suicide mission?? 

Hsin-Yi


----------

