# Customer banned from Amazon? Claims he can no longer order Kindle books...



## CS (Nov 3, 2008)

This is so weird, so off-the-wall, so inherently suspicious that I don't know whether it's a troll or the real deal. It just boggles my mind that Amazon would act this way, so I'm not sure if I can even buy into this customer's story. If there is any merit to it, it sounds like a giant error of some sort.

Edit: I don't want to automatically doubt or discount the customer's side though. I really don't know WHAT to make of this, honestly. It's so bizarre.



Ian Klein (Amazon board) said:


> Hi all-
> 
> I have been a loyal Amazon.com customer for many years, but today, I received an email stating that I have been banned from the site and my account has been closed, because I apparently have an extraordinary rate of requesting refunds due to a variety of factors.
> 
> ...


http://www.amazon.com/tag/kindle/forum/ref=cm_cd_ef_tft_tp?_encoding=UTF8&cdForum=Fx1D7SY3BVSESG&cdThread=Tx3A2WIX5ULRD7H&displayType=tagsDetail


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## pomlover2586 (Feb 14, 2009)

Wow......I'm hoping thats a troll 'cuz otherwise Amazon has some serious explaining to do........or at the VERY least return the guys Kindle for a FULL refund.


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## Neversleepsawink;) (Dec 16, 2008)

I think he may being telling the truth.  If you visit his profile...he has been a long time customer...and well his purchases are electronics.  This is horrible...maybe he is leaving something out.  Amazon has sent me a broken T.V. they corrected the problem with a instant refund...yikes, hope it doesn't do the same thing to me.  I've returned melted candy too....hmmmm...now I'm concerned.  Lol!!!


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I don't know. I tend not to trust him, but that's because hanging out on the Amazon boards exposes you to a lot of people who feel picked on and who only dropped their Kindle from a height of 4 inches and... So, it could be just me being cynical.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Although he says he only returned items for cause, here is one of his reviews granted, it's from 7 years ago, but...who knows how many other items he returned):



> Rio Riot MP3 player (_note: this retailed at $350--Betsy_)
> 
> 3.0 out of 5 stars Great sound, but battery problems, May 11, 2002
> Although the Rio Riot is quite a piece of equipment, I'm returning it today.
> ...


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## Nix Cadavre (Apr 3, 2009)

Smells funny to me.

I mean, even if he did get banned, it's not as if he couldn't log in a different account and re-register his Kindle to that one. If both my wife and I can have separate Amazon accounts, then he can surely make another one for himself. If the IP is a problem he can visit via proxy. If the snail mail address is the problem, he can get a PO Box. If the credit card is a problem, he can get a prepaid card in any Rite-Aid, Walgreens, or Wal-Mart (among others).

All I'm saying is that "banned" doesn't mean "can't get books for your Kindle from Amazon." -- It just means "can't get books for your Kindle from Amazon _with your old account_"

If he did get banned, I have to wonder how many items he has returned to earn such a punishment. Whether or not he keeps "thousands of dollars" worth, if he's sending back half (or more!) of the things he purchases, then I can understand Amazon's actions.

We don't know the whole story and frankly, from my experience with Amazon, I can't picture them doing this without some serious provocation. Cutting off future sales is a harsh response no retailer will take unless they determine that they're spending more money supporting RMA returns than they're getting in legitimate, permanent purchases.

Personally, I think it sounds like he's a con artist or nitpicker, and he abused the system. Now he's trying to seem like he was just minding his own business and Amazon nailed him for no reason; However, we don't know Amazon's side of the story, so any speculation would be pointless.

And of course, even if he can't use Amazon, he could use the USB cable and get books from other sources, or he could sell the Kindle and pick up an alternative e-reader that isn't as dependent on Amazon's system. He's not exactly stuck.


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

There are two sides to every story.


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

I agree, judging from his profile he is legit but this just sounds so wacky and the kind of thing a "Kindle Hater" might just dream up.
Most suspicious is his comment about "your buying a service" this just wreaks of those naysayers that worry about "what if" Amazon suddenly went out of business or started cutting off customers... hmmm :/

If it is true, I think it is a very extreme action on Amazon's part and there must be more to the story. Assuming for the moment it is true and he is not leaving out some key info. He claims one  CS person he spoke too said he had "returned everything he had ever bought", he clearly has not and that is pretty easy to prove. I would go to the top of the CS food chain and have my list of purchases and a dollar figure at the ready. If this failed, I would call my local new's Consumer reporter. Those guys would love something like this.


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

Nix Cadavre said:


> Smells funny to me.
> 
> I mean, even if he did get banned, it's not as if he couldn't log in a different account and re-register his Kindle to that one.


But if he can not even log on to "Manage his Kindle" he can not "de-register" it, so he is not able to _register_ it. Which also means he can not even sell it.

That is, assuming it is all true...


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I've heard of other companies cutting off people who complained a lot (cell phone companies in particular).  And with Amazon's return policy, a customer could end up costing Amazon a bit of money if he or she returns a lot of items.  

Betsy


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## Neversleepsawink;) (Dec 16, 2008)

I'm sure there is more to his story.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I've returned very few things and usually it worked out well. The only frustrating experience is that they sent me a wrong book, I went through the procedure to return it, and they sent me _another copy of the wrong book._ As I recall, I tried again and asked that they please <insert specific description of book, price, ISBN> Guess what I got back. This was at the start of finding out my mom was sick and so I gave up fiddling with it. People have always been courteous though.


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## koolmnbv (Mar 25, 2009)

i think he seems to be truthful, and honestly even if he ordered and returned stuff everyday if it is within their return policy and guidelines then that is the case. If for some reason his returns were not proper then they should speak up at the time of the actual return not wait and let it build up and completely terminate his account.


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## Anita (Jan 3, 2009)

As has been noted there are two sides of the story and we only see a brief version of his.  I love Ian's comment that "I'm a nice person and don't deserve any of this". Um....yeah, right.  Even in a misunderstanding both parties have some responsibility for the conflict.

After decades of dealing with the public I know that most people are reasonable, even delightful.  But a few people are never happy, can not be pleased and often walk around with a persecution complex because they can never see outside of the narrow focus of their own needs and desires.  I truly believe that not all customers are worth keeping.  After awhile repeated attempts to please a perpetually unhappy customer can cost more than the profit you might be able to make from them....and then it's a good time to cut the cord and let them go.  

Some people try to use retailers as a modified 'rent to own' venture that costs them very little but costs the retailer a lot over time.  You know the people - buy a product and use it for awhile and then invent a pretext to return it and get something else.  The Amazon return policy isn't all that strict and I would rather see them cut loose a customer that may be abusing the policy than see them restrict the policy for everyone else in order to deal with a few abusers.

Amazon is not the only retailer in the universe.  In fact, if I had to return multiple items to the same retailer I'd stop purchasing from them!

But then I *hate* doing returns, it seems like a waste of my time no matter how 'easy' they make it....I'm kind of lazy about things like that


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## Steph H (Oct 28, 2008)

I've heard of instances where a company will no longer let a customer do returns due to an abuse of the return policy, but I've never heard of one that won't let the customer purchase from them at all. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but that would seem a bit extreme.


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## Linda Cannon-Mott (Oct 28, 2008)

I've never had any problem with Amazon and there CS has always been great. I would like to hear their side of the story. If they took such drastic measures I think there must be more to it.


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## chynared21 (Oct 28, 2008)

*I agree that it does sound a bit drastic. I've returned/exchanged a cell phone that was clearly not new...haven't had a problem and CS was very accommodating.*


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## stevene9 (Nov 9, 2008)

Since this is the first I have ever heard of anything like this, Amazon gets the benefit of the doubt with me until I either get much better verification of his story, or this starts happening to other people. 

Steve


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## meljackson (Nov 19, 2008)

Ut oh, there are several people that tell others to buy the Kindle and try it for  30 days and if they don't like it they can return it. If the above is true, that may not be such a good idea anymore.

Melissa


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

By Mr. Klein's own admission, he has returned several "big ticket" items, TVs and cameras.  The MP3 player noted below was $350 retail, though he may have paid less for it.  If he's sent those items back in opened boxes, as he presumably has, Amazon can't sell them as new and they're taking a hit with every return.  Just from what he has said, I can understand Amazon taking a firm stance, especially in this economic environment.  It does surprise and disappoint me, if true, that there was no warning.

He has responded on the A Boards to some of the comments in a way that doesn't seem too troll like...I'd love to hear a response from Amazon....

Betsy


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## jmeaders (Jan 8, 2009)

pidgeon92 said:


> There are two sides to every story.


Exactly. We aren't hearing Amazon's side. I'm suspicious of this individual (yes, I'm cynical).


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

What I find interesting is a lot of complaints or problems people have from electronics, could be solved if they read the MANUAL! I was reading a review of the TV I bought (from Target but through my Amazon account) and one guy said he was sending it back because despite all the good qualities, the picture cut off a part of the image. Had he read the manual he would have seen there are FOUR different picture settings and you can pick the one you want with the remote! 

I do think you need to do your research before you buy and it sounds like there are some that think nothing of using Amazon's liberal return policy to just test out products. Still, I think a warning is in order here, esp since he has invested in an expensive product that is dependent on access to the site. Or he should be allowed to return it or de-register it so he can sell it.


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## Esther (Dec 21, 2008)

I just want to add here, that I can deregister my K1 from the settings menu.  Can one not do that on the K2?


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## crebel (Jan 15, 2009)

I just went over to the A board to read for myself.  Another poster asked the interesting question - if he has been banned from Amazon and can't access the main site, how is he continuing to post (there wasn't any reply after this question)?


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## Forster (Mar 9, 2009)

I'm completely cynical about this guy.  He admits he has returned some big ticket items, but we really get no indication as to the true scope of his returns.

Bottom line he is the type of customer that is losing money for Amazon or there is no way they would cut him off.  It sucks for him. The only downside to Amazon is it might deter other customers from dropping money on a really big ticket item such as a flat screen TV.  I know it makes me hesitate to buy one and I've bought stuff from Amazon since 1998 and I've only returned one item in that time.


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

crebel said:


> I just went over to the A board to read for myself. Another poster asked the interesting question - if he has been banned from Amazon and can't access the main site, how is he continuing to post (there wasn't any reply after this question)?


Very good point. You have to be logged in to post, which means you have to have an account.

L


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

Perhaps he had one account for reviews and the board?  A good question to ask at the A Boards

Betsy


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

MaineWriter said:


> Very good point. You have to be logged in to post, which means you have to have an account.
> 
> L


I had thought of that too but, when I go onto Amazon it recognizes me, I can post on the board but if I try to access my account at all or anything then I need to enter my password. He stated, he could not access "the main site" and his account.

I am not sure about registering or de-registering from the Kindle itself, you have to have whispernet on and log into your account I would assume?


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## rho (Feb 12, 2009)

crebel said:


> I just went over to the A board to read for myself. Another poster asked the interesting question - if he has been banned from Amazon and can't access the main site, how is he continuing to post (there wasn't any reply after this question)?


that was my thought too --


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## carrie (Feb 16, 2009)

I found this link on the Amazon boards -- it's a news story out of Omaha about a guy shut out of Amazon. I'm not sure of the date of the story, but if you look closely at the emails they seem to indicate "2008." Does anyone know more about this if it is an older story? I never thought Amazon could -- or would -- do this, but it makes me worry. I have a K1 and a K2, and over $2000 invested in books that are sitting on my bookshelf "cloud." In the past 5 or so years I've also returned several -- probably about 10 -- products I purchased from them. Now, I'm taking time off work to make sure all books are copied to my local hard drive -- just in case!

http://www.ketv.com/video/17405717/index.html


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

I read a post from the same guy back in December, that he got a warning about too many returns. He said he returns something like 18 items a year, but he buys over 80 (something like this, I don't remember the exact numbers). The problem was that he was returning items that weren't damaged or had something wrong with them, but perfectly good items that he just didn't want to keep. He seems to like to "try it out" a lot. He went into more detail last time and listed numbers. This guy is a troll...he should be ignored.


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## Kindle Convert (Nov 8, 2008)

crebel said:


> I just went over to the A board to read for myself. Another poster asked the interesting question - if he has been banned from Amazon and can't access the main site, how is he continuing to post (there wasn't any reply after this question)?


You read my mind!! LOL!!!


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## tessa (Nov 1, 2008)

He could be like the woman who buys a expansive black dress on Saturday afternoon and returns it Monday morning after she wore it or the man who buys a wood chipper and returns it after he cleans his yard.

A lot of stores ask for I.D. when you return things and keep a list of the amount of times you return.  

Tessa


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

tessa said:


> He could be like the woman who buys a expansive black dress on Saturday afternoon and returns it Monday morning after she wore it or the man who buys a wood chipper and returns it after he cleans his yard.
> 
> A lot of stores ask for I.D. when you return things and keep a list of the amount of times you return.
> 
> Tessa


Exactly!!!


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

carrie said:


> I found this link on the Amazon boards -- it's a news story out of Omaha about a guy shut out of Amazon. I'm not sure of the date of the story, but if you look closely at the emails they seem to indicate "2008." Does anyone know more about this if it is an older story? I never thought Amazon could -- or would -- do this, but it makes me worry. I have a K1 and a K2, and over $2000 invested in books that are sitting on my bookshelf "cloud." In the past 5 or so years I've also returned several -- probably about 10 -- products I purchased from them. Now, I'm taking time off work to make sure all books are copied to my local hard drive -- just in case!
> 
> http://www.ketv.com/video/17405717/index.html


Well, that certainly sheds some new light on it all. Carrie, were these expensive items and how does that compare to the ratio you keep? I think it shows it is not a good idea to rely on one online retailer too much, esp one that holds all the cards, since 
they have no brick and mortar store, your web access is it! I have often looked on Amazon to see if something I found somewhere else is available there, mostly because I really _trust_ them.

I have only ever returned two items though, (Kindle covers both) and am not really concerned personally. I do think there has to be a better way to deal with this kind of thing though, both for the consumer and Amazon?


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## Atunah (Nov 20, 2008)

This brings up a few points for me. First I don't recall reading anywhere on the return section that one can only return things that are broken. The dangers of having a very relaxed return policy is that people are going to change their minds. If retail places don't want that to happen, they need to clarify that. That's the whole point of it, you don't like it, you can return it. I don't personally return any stuff, actually very rarely and it has to be defect. I super analyze before I even order so that is why. 

I have seen that phenom on the shopping network sites before like QVC. They always tout you can return for any reason no questions asked, then when the return percentage goes to a point they don't like, they send out letters. No care of how much a customer actually spends. Some have been banned from buying from QVC too for the same reason. 

In the case of amazon and Kindle that does bring up the point of do we actually own the books, I say no. I still say we are renting them. If your account for any reason is not accessable to you anymore, you have no access to the books. If you need a new kindle or it breaks, you are out of luck and all the money is gone. 

So I do think that guy has a point. If they don't like people returning a lot of stuff, they need to put that on the return policy. This isn't a question if it is "morally" right to return. We have become a want it now impulse buying society and the retailers make it easy.


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## drenee (Nov 11, 2008)

I dated a guy who would buy things he "thought" he needed.  All small items.  Instead of figuring out exactly what he needed before going to the store, he would guess, and then return the item later.  He was constantly asking me to return things for him.  I refused.  I am not an impulse buyer.  I try very hard to do my research.  And I do not like to return things.  And like someone posted earlier, they take ID, and I did not want to be tagged as a habitual returner.  
I'm sure stores take a loss each time something is returned.  They have to stop the abuse somehow.


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## Cowgirl (Nov 1, 2008)

I think it was on Dataline last year when they had a segment about a TJX or Marshall's customer who returned too much stuff and they were banned from their stores.  At first I thought it was crazy until a company representative came to tell their side of the story explaining the cost of doing all these returns which in turn are reflected back in what the average customer pays.  There are definitely 2 sides to every story.  If the customer keeps buying and returning items from a particiular store why do they continue to shop there anyway.


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

drenee said:


> I dated a guy who would buy things he "thought" he needed. All small items. Instead of figuring out exactly what he needed before going to the store, he would guess, and then return the item later. He was constantly asking me to return things for him. I refused. I am not an impulse buyer. I try very hard to do my research. And I do not like to return things. And like someone posted earlier, they take ID, and I did not want to be tagged as a habitual returner.
> I'm sure stores take a loss each time something is returned. They have to stop the abuse somehow.


My mother does a variation on this. She hates trying on clothes in stores and so she'll buy a bunch of stuff, hoping that it will fit, and if it doesn't she returns it. She will try things on that are on sale, knowing she can't return those. But she's never been banned from any store.

L


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## vsch (Mar 5, 2009)

You would think that before you buy electronics online you would find one at a brick and mortar store and check it out there first. Just seems like a no brainer to me.


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## chynared21 (Oct 28, 2008)

*I've noticed that some brick and mortar stores have tightened up their return policies. Macy's used to have an open policy and has since put a time restriction, etc. on returns. I remember a while back when Macy's sold Gucci. I was looking at wallets and another woman was making a small purchase. She asked the sales lady about repairs and was told that Macy's would take it back being that Gucci was a leased vendor. Smack myself surprised when the woman emptied out her current Gucci purse that looked pretty ragged...and she got some sort of $$ towards another purchase. I would say, "only in NY" but I'm sure that it used to happen elsewhere. *


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

vsch said:


> You would think that before you buy electronics online you would find one at a brick and mortar store and check it out there first. Just seems like a no brainer to me.


Well, except for the Kindle, that is. No brick and mortar stores that sell the Kindle, as we all know.

L


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

Because they don't have a storefront where you can look at and hold an item before you buy it there is going to be a high rate of returns from people who didn't do their homework. However, when a customer becomes reliant on this and begins to order things just to "check them out" and then returns them, it is an abuse of the company and forces them to no longer accept returns. It's often to help keep the prices down for everyone.


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

A freind of mine worked at Nordstroms, and had someone return tires...Nordstroms doesn't sell tires, but the customer insisted they had bought them there and a manager made it happen.


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

I  have no problem with Amazon limiting abuse by outliers to keep our costs down. Obviously they are not doing it for regular customers or we would be seeing more cases


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## chynared21 (Oct 28, 2008)

MAGreen said:


> A freind of mine worked at Nordstroms, and had someone return tires...Nordstroms doesn't sell tires, but the customer insisted they had bought them there and a manager made it happen.


*Now that is a horse of a different color...I have never heard of anything like that.*


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## VictoriaP (Mar 1, 2009)

MAGreen said:


> Because they don't have a storefront where you can look at and hold an item before you buy it there is going to be a high rate of returns from people who didn't do their homework. However, when a customer becomes reliant on this and begins to order things just to "check them out" and then returns them, it is an abuse of the company and forces them to no longer accept returns. It's often to help keep the prices down for everyone.


And because an online only company is likely to have a higher rate of returns, I'd bet they're actually even less inclined to put a foot down until the situation becomes very obvious. There's no way Amazon did this spur of the moment or on a whim; the publicity wouldn't be worth it. I think that as long as you aren't a habitual returner, this just simply isn't going to affect you.

But like any other electronic devices, backups are smart, and shouldn't be limited to one location, in this case, the Amazon cloud.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I worked at a store that sold music boxes. I looked up to see a woman approaching the counter with a stack of clothes. She wished to purchase them and figured the whole mall was just one big store. I have no idea why security didn't nab her. 

People would steal water globes and then return them -- you could see where they were missing from the display. They would buy really expensive music boxes, wait for their reward certificates, return the box, and essentially have free money. Pass a bad check at one of our stores -- return to another one. If they stole a several thousand dollar box at store A and returned to store B, they could literally get all the money in the register, making it impossible to make change and causing that particular store to be in the negative.


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## Anju  (Nov 8, 2008)

MAGreen said:


> I read a post from the same guy back in December, that he got a warning about too many returns. He said he returns something like 18 items a year, but he buys over 80 (something like this, I don't remember the exact numbers). The problem was that he was returning items that weren't damaged or had something wrong with them, but perfectly good items that he just didn't want to keep. He seems to like to "try it out" a lot. He went into more detail last time and listed numbers. This guy is a troll...he should be ignored.


I am inclined to believe this poster since they remember the warning and the earlier post. There are returns and there are returns, this Ian probably returned 2 - 3 times more items than he has said. Again 2 sides to every story and a grain of salt with each.


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## webhill (Feb 12, 2009)

tessa said:


> He could be like the woman who buys a expansive black dress on Saturday afternoon and returns it Monday morning after she wore it or the man who buys a wood chipper and returns it after he cleans his yard.


Or, he could just be a picky guy with a penchant for perfection in his consumer electronics. I mean, I think there has to be more to the story than he's offered, but I can totally see how someone could end up in the situation he's described. For example - my husband bought an iMac a while back, and the display had a bad pixel. One bad pixel is actually within spec, but he returned the thing twice until he got one that didn't have any problems (he's on excellent terms with Apple, however ). Similarly he bought a camera once that had some kind of problem I can't explain because I never did understand it - something about the metadata - and he returned it and bought a different camera that didn't do whatever it was. And we had a flat-screen TV that had some kind of color calibration issue that he returned too, because of some problem that only showed up when you ran some third-party calibration software on it, and it couldn't be fixed. These were all apparently valid complaints, because there were actual issues with the products, but the average consumer wouldn't ever have even noticed. I mean, I would never have noticed, that's for sure! It seems to me that most if not all high-end consumer electronics promise more than they actually deliver and/or come with built-in failures to meet their own specifications, and further that it's impossible to actually tell if they meet your standards until you've tried them out for a couple of days.


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## Dangerosa (Dec 5, 2008)

Update - Amazon reviewed and reinstated Ian's account. (He posts on a non-Kindle board that I belong to.)


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## peritusONE (Mar 10, 2009)

Dangerosa said:


> Update - Amazon reviewed and reinstated Ian's account. (He posts on a non-Kindle board that I belong to.)


That's kind of unfortunate if he really was abusing the return system. Hell, they could at least ban him from buying merchandise and limit him to just Kindle e-books.


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## Dangerosa (Dec 5, 2008)

Well, I have no idea if he was abusing the return policy but he said Amazon did note that excessive returns in the future would result in him losing his account.


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

My guess is that Amazon reviewed accounts and sent notices to all the folks with a track record of expensive returns. The people who actually contacted Amazon and made an effort to be re-instated are being re-instated with a warning. The people who don't fight the policy are probably folks who will shop somewhere else, people who didn't think they could fight the ban, or people who might have been defrauding Amazon.


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## marianneg (Nov 4, 2008)

Octochick said:


> I had thought of that too but, when I go onto Amazon it recognizes me, I can post on the board but if I try to access my account at all or anything then I need to enter my password. He stated, he could not access "the main site" and his account.


You don't need to login to one-click Kindle books (or anything else, for that matter), either, though. I call BS.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

MAGreen said:


> A freind of mine worked at Nordstroms, and had someone return tires...Nordstroms doesn't sell tires, but the customer insisted they had bought them there and a manager made it happen.


At a quality management workshop I was at, years ago when I was working full time for the guvmint, Nordstrom's return policy was discussed. Their policy was that if a customer brought something into return, even if they didn't carry that brand, they would accept it. Obviously, the manager in the case cited decided to extend that to products they don't carry. 

I wonder if their policy has changed at all these days?

Betsy

Betsy


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## Toby (Nov 25, 2008)

That same thing happened to someone I know online. He was very insulted. He got the warning. I do know that he does do alot of returns, but he has bought alot of things that he kept. It was at shopnbc. Even though shopnbc does encourages you to return, etc...I think everyone is hurting during this current economy & the stores are just cracking down now to stay in business. I also knew a lady that constantly returned food at the supermarket. They banned her from the stores.


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## LADennis (Apr 5, 2009)

Gosh, I would DIE if I got banned from Amazon! I will wager that I buy at least one thing a week from them at minimum. If I need or want something I go to Amazon first.  Nine times out of ten I can find it on there. I have been a customer for quite a few years. I don't think I've ever had to return anything.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I've been a customer of Amazon's since the days when they would send you a travel coffee mug if you ordered from them that year.  Still have it.  I'm sure I returned something during that time but can't remember what, for sure.  I think it was something they sent me two of.

It does sound like this issue is resolved for the moment.  It sounds like a fair resolution to me, Amazon is giving Mr. Klein another chance, and he certainly has fair warning now.

Betsy


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## Linda Cannon-Mott (Oct 28, 2008)

Dangerosa said:


> Update - Amazon reviewed and reinstated Ian's account. (He posts on a non-Kindle board that I belong to.)


Glad to hear that.


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

Betsy the Quilter said:


> I've been a customer of Amazon's since the days when they would send you a travel coffee mug if you ordered from them that year. Still have it. I'm sure I returned something during that time but can't remember what, for sure. I think it was something they sent me two of.
> 
> It does sound like this issue is resolved for the moment. It sounds like a fair resolution to me, Amazon is giving Mr. Klein another chance, and he certainly has fair warning now.
> 
> Betsy


Remember when they had ads on TV? My favorite was the one where they sang, "Two minutes! Two whole minutes! I spent two minutes shopping for your gift..."

I just looked on YouTube and found a bunch of other ads but I couldn't find that one. I think it was one of the very first ones.

L


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

peritusONE said:


> That's kind of unfortunate if he really was abusing the return system. Hell, they could at least ban him from buying merchandise and limit him to just Kindle e-books.


The key word there is "if" and what "if" he was not? This is why we have due process and "innocent until proven guilty". None of us really knows how much of a percentage of returns it would take to have this happen. IMO, unless the person actually commits fraud or returns 100% of what they buy, this is flat out wrong. Amazon uses their CS and liberal return policy as a selling tool. Because of this, customers feel they can purchase even a high ticket items at little or no risk. Trust is the foundation of their business and a big key to their huge online success. 
Of course, some will abuse this trust but I think even the guilty deserve an opportunity to defend themselves and from other threads I have read, the choice to cut some one off is far too arbitrary.


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## zeferjen (Feb 24, 2009)

The issue for me is this: Prior to the Kindle, anyone that was banned by Amazon was not really impacted at all. I can't buy books from Amazon, I'll shop at B&N. I can't buy electronics from Amazon, I'll shop at Buy.com, etc. 

Now, we are locked into Amazon because they are serving as storage space for our books. If they can ban people from accessing what is essentially their property, they need to explain this clearly. Also, I would think that they would give whomever they banned the opportunity to download whatever is only stored on their servers before blocking out the account.


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## mom133d (aka Liz) (Nov 25, 2008)

Betsy the Quilter said:
 

> I've been a customer of Amazon's since the days when they would send you a travel coffee mug if you ordered from them that year. Still have it.


I've got 2. When re-arranging the kitchen I found them. I had forgotten all about them.


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## Betsy the Quilter (Oct 27, 2008)

I actually have two, too.  But I'm not quite sure how I got the second one....

Betsy


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## Maxx (Feb 24, 2009)

To me, the whole problem is the fact that there is not a stated policy about what exactly can get you banned.  It should be clearly spelled out on their site.  

If their policy of accepting returns for almost any reason is not working for them financially, then change it and be honest about it and put it out there for all of their customers to see.

Maxx


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