# Page Numbers?



## bsabiston (Sep 16, 2010)

I read that the new update was going to show page numbers.  Where are they?  I haven't seen any on any books yet.  Are they only on brand-new published books or what?  That is lame -- surely someone could hack up an algorithm to at least guess at the number of pages in there. 

Bob


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

It takes a while for them to download.  Do a synch/check for new items may make them download faster.

Also, it will only be for books bought from Amazon--though programs like Calibre can apparently add them to non-DRM'd books (public domain freebies etc.).


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

It took quite awhile for mine to download, and I think my books (440) had to be re-indexed. Something ran my battery down before I realized it, and there were suggestions that the download/re-indexing might have caused it. As for seeing the page numbers, you have to press the "Menu" key in order to see page numbers (if available) and/or locations. The rest of the time, you'll see the progress status bar and the % indicator. (I hope I'm right on all of that. My Kindle is in another room, so I'm remembering how it works.)


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## alexisleno (Mar 4, 2011)

Hi!

I've only noticed this so far on the Kindle App for my iPhone and only with one book I am currently reading. My roommate purchased my book for his iPad, but I haven't noticed page numbers on it...

Not sure if this is going through for all books or what...


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

When I did the update, I didn't think that many of my books had page numbers. A couple of days later, I checked and many have the page numbers available. I just had to be patient enough to wait for the downloading to take place.


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## ff2 (Oct 20, 2010)

The books with Page Numbers are NOT new books, there is a complementary file with the same name as the book but an "APNX" file extension.  That's what contains the numbering info.  On the Amazon site for the book, they will tell you to which paper version the numbering is keyed, if that info is not there (with the isbn) then the book does not (yet) have page numbering.  There is a Calibre plugin that can generate that file for NON-Amazon books and it is an approximation of the number of pages and there is are a more and less accurate estimation equation.


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

There are still a lot of books with no page numbers because they simply haven't been attributed. As ff2 mentioned, if you go to the Amazon page of a book and it doesn't say "Page Numbers Source ISBN" under the product details, it won't have page numbers, period. It's not a matter of waiting for the download to take place, it's a matter of waiting for the page numbers to be added to begin with. I don't know whether this is in the hands of Amazon or the publishers but there are still a LOT of books with no page numbers (and apparently I happen to have a lot of those). Even brand new releases like the one I'm reading now:
http://www.amazon.com/Royal-Pains-Rogues-Gallery-ebook/dp/B004BDP084/ref=sr_1_1_title_1_ke?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1299515575&sr=1-1


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## bsabiston (Sep 16, 2010)

When you say you have to wait a long time for the download to happen, what do you mean?  Do you mean it will just do it at some point in the future, or can I turn it on and tell it to download whatever it's got to download now?

I also tried using calibre -- went in and double clicked the plugin, it looked enabled already.  I checked that box 'slow and more accurate page number generation' though, hit apply.  I transferred a handful of books to the Kindle again, but I still don't see any page numbers any where.  What's the deal.  I know I have the recent Kindle update because it does that thing at the end of the book, asking you to rate it I think?

Thanks
Bob


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## daveconifer (Oct 20, 2009)

I'm confused about whether I want page numbers or not.  A lot of smart people seem to want them, which always sways a dumb person like me.  On the other hand, I don't get what they would mean unless they are static and appear in the content exactly where they appear in a printed version.  Is that how they work?  But if that's the case, a complementary file probably wouldn't be needed.

I'm glad this isn't important to me


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

bsabiston said:


> When you say you have to wait a long time for the download to happen, what do you mean? Do you mean it will just do it at some point in the future, or can I turn it on and tell it to download whatever it's got to download now?
> 
> I also tried using calibre -- went in and double clicked the plugin, it looked enabled already. I checked that box 'slow and more accurate page number generation' though, hit apply. I transferred a handful of books to the Kindle again, but I still don't see any page numbers any where. What's the deal. I know I have the recent Kindle update because it does that thing at the end of the book, asking you to rate it I think?
> 
> ...


By a long time, I meant that it took apparently took awhile for the information to be downloaded independent of any action by me, other than my having turned on my wireless (which is usually off). I wasn't aware that the page number information was being downloaded, but I don't know if you can actually do it manually or not. I always click on the link that allows for syncing and checking for downloads when I turn on my wireless. The reason I think it took awhile was that my battery ran down far enough that I couldn't get my Kindle to respond until I plugged it into the charger. Shortly after that, my Kindle was responding as usual. Not realizing that I needed to do a full charge, my Kindle failed to respond again later in the day. After doing a full charge, I've had no more issues. Since I've never run into a battery problem like that before, and I usually keep my battery at or above the 60% or so mark, it's hard to figure out what else might have run it down. (As I said earlier, I think re-indexing must take place, too, after the files with the page numbers have been downloaded.)



daveconifer said:


> I'm confused about whether I want page numbers or not. A lot of smart people seem to want them, which always sways a dumb person like me. On the other hand, I don't get what they would mean unless they are static and appear in the content exactly where they appear in a printed version. Is that how they work? But if that's the case, a complementary file probably wouldn't be needed.
> 
> I'm glad this isn't important to me


I, for one, really like the percentage and the progress status bar, but the page numbers are a nice adjunct to those. As for whether the pages appear in the content exactly where they appear in a printed version, I've read enough about them to think that's the case. For instance, someone was talking about how weird it seemed, when using a fairly large font, to find the same page number being displayed over a span of several Kindle page turns.


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## bsabiston (Sep 16, 2010)

Well, I know I want page numbers.  I just don't know HOW to get them!
Bob


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

bsabiston said:


> Well, I know I want page numbers. I just don't know HOW to get them!
> Bob


Have you gone to one of the book pages on Amazon and checked to see if it shows "Page Numbers Source ISBN" under the "Product Details"? Because again, if it doesn't list this, the book simply does not have pages and you can't "get" them until they are added - whether by Amazon or the publisher, I don't know. If it does list the ISBN number but you're still not getting the page numbers, I don't know what to tell you - all mine which have sourced a ISBN number downloaded the page numbers straight away.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

daveconifer said:


> I'm confused about whether I want page numbers or not. A lot of smart people seem to want them, which always sways a dumb person like me. On the other hand, I don't get what they would mean unless they are static and appear in the content exactly where they appear in a printed version. Is that how they work?


That is how they work. You'll stay on the same print page number for several kindle screen pages (amount depends on your font size). You look up the ISBN in the kindle book description on Amazon.com and you can see exactly which print version the page number is from.

I like them as I can better estimate how long it will take me to read 100 pages than some number of locations. Also, I need print page numbers for academic citations if I ever get any research type books on Kindle that I need to reference in scholarly journal articles. Though that's kind of moot as I'm getting an iPad 2 and would do all work related reading on their for the bigger screen and easier annotation options in the various PDF programs like Goodreader etc.

But would be handy for say literature students/profs who need to cite pages in novels they're writing about.


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## bsabiston (Sep 16, 2010)

Maybe this is not the right forum but what about caliber?  I thought that plugin was supposed to generate page number files and put them on the Kindle?  How do you get that to work?  

Thanks
Bob


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## ff2 (Oct 20, 2010)

First, Page Numbers only show if the book (either from Amazon or converted by newer versions of Calibre) has page numbers.  For Amazon, see some of the postings above about how to find out.

Then they only show (if present) when you press the MENU KEY.  It will show both location and Page number.

The Amazon Page Number corresponds with a real paper book and is NOT influenced by your font size.  So if you have 3 large lines of text you might be on Page 6 or a number of Kindle-page-turns.  Just like locations are not affected by font size.

The Calibre generated ones are based on some mathematical calcs (choice of faster/less accurate or slower/more accurate).

I guess for Calibre to work, you need to use usb cable and "send to device" and the page-number-file will be generated and copied over to your kindle.  I used it this morning with some free mobi's from Smashwords and two B&N epubs converted to Mobi.  Both the mobi and the APNX files were on the Kindle.  APNX is the file with the page number info.  It has the same filename as the book.


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## Lisa J. Yarde (Jul 15, 2010)

I'm not able to update the software to whatever is the lastest version that let's you supposedly get page numbers. My WiFi is typically always on. According to Amazon, the update should be happening behind the scenes and automatically load. Not happening on my kindle.


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

lyarde11751 said:


> I'm not able to update the software to whatever is the lastest version that let's you supposedly get page numbers. My WiFi is typically always on. According to Amazon, the update should be happening behind the scenes and automatically load. Not happening on my kindle.


It hasn't happened on my younger daughter's Kindle, either. My older daughter and I both downloaded the update and manually installed it.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

lyarde11751 said:


> I'm not able to update the software to whatever is the lastest version that let's you supposedly get page numbers. My WiFi is typically always on. According to Amazon, the update should be happening behind the scenes and automatically load. Not happening on my kindle.


You can find it on the Kindle support page: http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_200127470_ksupport_softwareupdatek3?nodeId=200529700 and download it manually yourself. Basically d/l to your computer, copy and paste to your Kindle, and then do the update from the menu. It's not hard.


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## Lisa J. Yarde (Jul 15, 2010)

Ann in Arlington said:


> You can find it on the Kindle support page: http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_200127470_ksupport_softwareupdatek3?nodeId=200529700 and download it manually yourself. Basically d/l to your computer, copy and paste to your Kindle, and then do the update from the menu. It's not hard.


Thanks, go the version installed.


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## Phil75070 (Dec 30, 2009)

Since using a larger font can cause several Kindle screens to show the same page number,  then I would assume that there could be also an overlap on a screen where one DTB page ends and another starts. Same with smaller fonts. However, all I see referenced when I hit menu and look at page numbers is page x of xx (one page number is referenced...never seen more than one). 

Does anyone know if the page number shown, for example, refers only to what page you are on as of the first word on the screen or how it actually works? The only way I see page numbers truly being of any more value than locations is in the "Go to..." functionality as I also would have to assume that functionality takes you to the very beginning of the page number you insert.


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## Cindy416 (May 2, 2009)

Phil75070 said:


> Since using a larger font can cause several Kindle screens to show the same page number, then I would assume that there could be also an overlap on a screen where one DTB page ends and another starts. Same with smaller fonts. However, all I see referenced when I hit menu and look at page numbers is page x of xx (one page number is referenced...never seen more than one).
> 
> Does anyone know if the page number shown, for example, refers only to what page you are on as of the first word on the screen or how it actually works? The only way I see page numbers truly being of any more value than locations is in the "Go to..." functionality as I also would have to assume that functionality takes you to the very beginning of the page number you insert.


My guess would be that you will only see the page number of the first word on the page, but I don't know. It would be worth a try to see what happens. Honestly, though, I can't see that it would make a difference unless the reader happened to be using the Kindle book as a resource for a research paper or some other form of writing that would require footnotes, in which case accuracy would be required. If I'm reading, it doesn't matter to me whether I'm on page 112 or 113, for example. Just my 2 cents.


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