# The self-published authors I want to hear from.



## Hugh Howey

Are you paying some bills with your writing? Have you quit your day job altogether? I know this is happening, and I suspect the trend is growing, but we spend too much time paying attention to outliers to hear the real story behind indie publishing.

The problem is rounding everyone up in one place. I have a journalist getting in touch to discuss the viability of writing fiction for a living, and my response is that the outliers aren't as fascinating to me as the self-published version of mid-listers (a name that makes no sense, since we don't put out catalogs to be in the middle of).

I think a lot of the people I'd want to hear from are scarce these days (busy writing or promoting). Is there any way we can round up a list of people making, let's say, $500 a month on average for an entire year from their work? That's $6,000 a year. That pays a few bills.

My fear is that these journalists are burying the lead, which is that there is a greater chance of earning a respectable amount as a self-published author than there is by going the traditional route. That seems like the story to me.


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## swolf

I'm making more than $500 a month, but then again, I write erotica, so mine may be a story a journalist wouldn't want to tell.


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## Lisa Grace

My book sales are definitely mid-list level, well over the $6,000 for the year. I'm hoping I'll break out as an outlier in the next year or two, but it hasn't happened yet. Yes, I make enough to pay some of the bills on a monthly basis.


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## MegHarris

I am making a reasonable income from writing, considerably over the amount you listed, but I am still dependent on other income sources (it doesn't help that I am paying my own health insurance every month, and that I have a large mortgage and a kid in college). I pay some bills with my writing, though, and am making far more than I did writing for small presses. Most of my income is from erotic romance, and I do have a fairly substantial list of titles-- 34 of them right now.


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## M T McGuire

I think it's a bit Catch 22. If you have the time to market your books, you'll earn a living but in order to earn that living, you have to give up work. I'm a stay at home mum so it'll never be more than a hobby for me because I'll never have the time to make a go of it. That said, I make about $30 a month and I think off KB I'm slap bang average. You lot are all very good at this and I am regularly gobsmacked by the figures people on here earn! 

Cheers

MTM


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## JTCochrane

I make enough money to pay some bills.  I write YA and even have schools pay me to come present in front of the students.  Most of may sales still come from students at schools, but with the help of you wonderful people, I have made great strides in ebook sales.  My first book is on the Accelerated Readers list.  I still keep a day job   That darn money I make as a computer programmer keeps me shackled.


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## WilliamEsmont

I regularly make about $600-$1000/month after setting aside 40% for taxes. It pays the mortgage and funds editing, covers, and other writing-related activities.


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## valeriec80

I made (grossed) about $29K in 2012 self-publishing (my actual taxable income will be less, once I figure out my expenses and whatnot), and I'm living on that, but it's tight. 

I may have to get a job in the spring, but I'm really hoping to have another awesome post-Christmas year in 2013. Fingers crossed.


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## Satchya

PM'd you Hugh.


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## TessOliver

I've been at this since summer of 2010. My book Camille was a bestseller for a long time and my book A Little Less Girl was sitting at number 20 on BN last Christmas. Right now sales are terribly slow so it is not a steady income but it has been nice. I'm a teacher and I've been making half my teaching salary in book sales the past two years. I live in expensive California so I can't afford to quit the day job . . . yet, but I've been paying my kids' college tuitions and I no longer worry about no paychecks in summer. After bills are paid there is actually money for extra stuff which is really nice.


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## Hugh Howey

swolf said:


> I'm making more than $500 a month, but then again, I write erotica, so mine may be a story a journalist wouldn't want to tell.


I think these are the ones they WOULD want to write about! You don't give people hope by pointing at someone who won the lottery. You give them hope by showing them someone who just landed the job of their dreams. Think of all the people who wish they could have an artistic outlet that gave them a little back.


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## elsaxx

swolf said:


> I'm making more than $500 a month, but then again, I write erotica, so mine may be a story a journalist wouldn't want to tell.


Same boat...nearly full-time work/income for me but I do some part-time stuff on the side just in case.


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## Guest

Nope, just have 2 short stories put out this month so nowhere near, we'll see if the marketing plan works out in the next 6 months or so though so hopefully...


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## Cherise

Heck, even the $50 a month I make so far from self-publishing on Amazon, PubIt, and Smashwords is more than I would be making querying agents. 

I have a BA in English, so I self edit, but I do get friends to beta read and proofread. My highest expenditure is covers, and I make that back the first month.

The $50 a month I get pays some bills, and of course I hope that amount will grow over time. Hope is a nice thing to have in times like these.


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## Bilinda Ní Siodacaín

Making far and above the $500 a month and I've given up my job to do this full time, but my success is far too new to gauge anything by it.


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## JumpingShip

I grossed about 32k in the last year. In fact, I just took a big plunge and went part-time at my day job.  I'm completely terrified that I won't do as well next year even though I just published my fourth book last month so the majority of my income was from three books, not four. Last year, Select helped push sales, but I'm not sure it will have as big an impact in the upcoming year. Otoh, other outlets I used before going with Select produced next to no sales, so I don't think pulling out of Select and using them will be the answer either. I just need to keep writing, I guess.


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## Danielle Kazemi

If I added in what I make from Smashwords I'd be almost there. lol

But I do want to read about the people who are making around $500 a month. It's nice to hear what they do and if I can steal borrow any of their marketing guides. I'm assuming Dalya is probably one making around that and maybe even your minion too. Trying to think of names but I'm horrible with them. I can do avatars. Kay and Brian likely make high figures too - maybe too high.


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## Melisse

I make more than $500 a month but have only been doing so since May. I have been paying bills and getting our shattered savings rebuilt. Plus I've bought software etc for my writing business. Every month I try to put some money straight back into the writing and not use it all for the family budget!

I still work my day job and don't expect that to change at this point because I carry health insurance for the family. If my writing business continues to grow and a decent work around for employer health insurance becomes available, then in a couple years I may quit the day job, since hubby and I are thinking about a move around that time anyway.

I do think there are a lot of indie authors who make $6k--12k a year but I have no actual data, just from chit chat w/ other authors.


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## jnfr

Have you seen this web page, Hugh? It started out in this thread here in the Cafe. It's a list of self-published writers who have sold more than 50,000 books.

How that translates into cash is harder to say due to different book prices, and of course some of those folks have sold a LOT more than 50k books, but it's still a remarkably long list so it presents an argument that 50k books is not really an outlier any more.


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## Joe_Nobody

Sent a PM. I agree with your premise that there is a story concerning this topic.


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## Jan Strnad

PM'd you!


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## Hugh Howey

Man, this is awesome. Thanks for the PMs, people. I've XXXX'ed out the titles and your names in a few of these stories so there's no identification and passed them along to a journalist. I'm trying to see if he would be interested in writing about this. If so, I would put him in contact with people and see if any of you would be interested.

Now, absolutely nothing could come of this. He might say, "Yeah, fine, fine, but tell us about Ridley Scott. Is Harrison Ford going to reprise his role in Blade Runner?" or something like that.

But I'm trying.


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## H. S. St. Ours

Hugh Howey said:


> But I'm trying.


Which is why we not only respect you, Hugh, but even _like_ you (maybe just a little).


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## Maria Hooley

With all outlets put together, I usually make about 1500.00 in a slower month.  I just crossed the 50,000 novels sold point last month.


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## Hugh Howey

H.S. St.Ours said:


> Which is why we not only respect you, Hugh, but even _like_ you (maybe just a little).


Writers are known to be a little crazy. I suspect that's true of you people.


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## gljones

swolf said:


> I'm making more than $500 a month, but then again, I write erotica, so mine may be a story a journalist wouldn't want to tell.


Off topic I know but your Icon has been freaking me out for a while, I have to know, what the heck is that?


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## Mike McIntyre

I had a trad-pubbed title back in the '90s, and my indie sales now earn me more. In fact, my indie income for 2012 has already surpassed my best year in my former career as a full-time journalist for various metro daily newspapers. While I have one mystery, most of my income is derived from two non-fiction titles (travelogues). I charge $4.95 for these, so it doesn't take eye-popping volume for $ to add up. I have done zero marketing: no web site, no blogging, no Facebook. I don't have a list of readers I can contact, and I don't know how I would compile one. My "midlist" success is solely due to Amazon and Select. KOLL income by itself totals more that $500 per month. I don't know how long this will last, but it has been fun.


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## Rachel Schurig

jnfr said:


> Have you seen this web page, Hugh? It started out in this thread here in the Cafe. It's a list of self-published writers who have sold more than 50,000 books.
> 
> How that translates into cash is harder to say due to different book prices, and of course some of those folks have sold a LOT more than 50k books, but it's still a remarkably long list so it presents an argument that 50k books is not really an outlier any more.


Keep in mind that website hasn't been updated since May. I'm sure there's been even more indie successes since then!

Making above the $500 a month but sent you a PM anyhow


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## Amanda Brice

I'm earning anywhere from about $300-3000 per month, with the average being around $500. Of course, this doesn't come anywhere close to paying our bills since we live in such an expensive city, but it's a nice chunk of change to add to the kids' 529 plans.

I still work full-time and will do so even if I start to bring in significantly more.


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## Rick Gualtieri

For the past two months I've made more than my day job.  Have been making >$500 / month since early this year.  I use my oldest son's gymnastics lessons as a baseline.  If I can pay for them, I'm golden.


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## David Adams

Making about $300 a month at the moment. Fortunately it is increasing, on average, every month so hooray.


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## TexasGirl

I started making $1500 a month this year. I always make at least that, and some months spike to 3K.

I went full time early this year, although I have a few photography clients I will still shoot for, but I work at 25% of my old levels. I'm also shooting my own covers and just last week started putting the extra shots up as stock to supplement.

I'll consider myself making a living when $2.5k is the lowest month. It's my goal to hit that by summer.


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## Nicole M

I haven't self-published yet but I just wanted to thank you for starting this thread. It really gives me hope. And thank you all for being so open about your sales.


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## Kay Bratt

I can't comment on royalties from the Amazon pubbed titles, but with my Indie + AP titles combined, I make a very good full-time living from writing. I know without a doubt that my Amazon-Published titles help push my Indie books up in the rankings/sales. Ie: my Indie business side benefits from the power of Amazon marketing.

For example, my newest AP title, _A Thread Unbroken_, released just yesterday and this morning all my Indie books also got a huge boost, too.


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## the quiet one

PM sent with more detail but first two full months published have been >$500. Hoping nobody pinches me and wakes me up. Also, it might hurt.


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## Dean Murray

Hi, Hugh.  I just sent you a PM.


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## SRecht

Too early in the process for me to meet the criteria, but working hard to finish my next book and hope to join all of you one day.


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## martaszemik

Started making above $500 two months ago. This month will be more than $750. I'm not counting the paperbacks and other retailers.The last title just released so really, that's based on only first three (and first one of them is perma free). It's not a lot, but I'm working hard with hope to be able to support my family within the year. Next year I'm planning to release 5 more novels.

I lurk around WC every day and love hearing writers making income  

This is just under this pen name. I also write ER and first release was two weeks ago. It's getting some traction now


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## Michael R. Hicks

I started in May 2008 with three sales of my first book that month. Fast forward to August 2011, when I left my day job in the federal government as a GG-15 (executive grade) employee to write full time because my royalties were more than I was making in the government, and 2012 was even better. Hallelujah!


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## Hugh Howey

You all are awesome. I'm trying to respond to all the PMs, but there are dozens in just the last hour, so take this as a blanket thank-you. I sent a dozen of the emails (nothing identifying, just in case that wouldn't be okay with you), along to this journalist. If nothing else, compiling this in this thread (I know there have been others) seems to bear out what many of us have been hoping for: a sign that writing is a viable hobby or side job. One that can even lead to a full-time job.

My mother has a yarn shop in Charleston, SC. She's also a painter. She spends a LOT of time and a little bit of money painting. Her clients spend a LOT of time and quite a bit of money knitting. Millions of people do this, or garden. They put their veggies and paintings and sweaters up for sale in various places, do craft shows, sit at farmers markets with the tailgate down. All of them are hoping to make back a fraction of their costs with a hobby they enjoy. We celebrate all of these endeavors. "Oh, you sculpt? That's awesome! And you have some of your wares for sale at that co-opt off Main? How cool!"

Indie publishing, by my wild-ass estimation, is blowing the doors off these other hobbies-we-hope-can-turn-into-real-jobs. Look at food trucks. This is a new rage. I'm willing to bet many of them never turn a profit, but the owners have fun! And they make a little bit!

So why is writing seen differently? I think it has become, thanks largely to Amazon and the Kindle, the most viable of these creative endeavors. That's the story. It's not: *Get Rich Quick*. Or: *This Will Happen to You*. It's: *This is Possible*. And increasingly morso.


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## Saul Tanpepper

Writing self-sufficiency is a long-tail process. If given enough time, many more writers would become self-sufficient (read: "successful") than we have seen historically. That, in my mind, is the issue for the vast majority of (decent) writers. A typical writing career requires a lot of time and effort investment before publication, then a lot more afterward. Most writers are attempting it while holding down another job and juggling a family. It's just not feasible. We all know the key components of the "success" formula: more & fresh content, written well, meaningfully promoted (all of which, in my opinion, can mitigate the "outlier" phenomena governed by extenuating circumstances such as already having a built-in audience, and less quantifiable factors such as timing and luck). Most folks just can't commit to the pace and duration and so are forced to give up before realizing success. It takes a long time to build up sufficient momentum. Look at how many "one hit wonders" there are out there, not to mention the "one hit mid-listers."

My own sales are doubling about every six weeks, but I write full time and have only recently begun to push my books. Were it not for a hefty severance package when I left the biotech world five years ago and other financial circumstances (including the ability to pay for private health insurance), I wouldn't have been able to get to the level I have. Granted, I wasted the first four years ramming my head against the gates of the Big 6 houses. I fully plan/expect to be self-sufficient by the end of 2013. Will I ever reach the earning potential I once had? I doubt it; I dream about it, of course.

Give enough people enough time, more of us will be successful. I think we're witnessing the earliest stages of a new content paradigm, where wealth and "success" become more available to more writers than ever before.


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## tallulahgrace

Just sent you a pm, Hugh. No need to reply.


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## DRMarvello

Hugh Howey said:


> ...we spend too much time paying attention to outliers to hear the real story behind indie publishing.
> ...
> My fear is that these journalists are burying the lead, which is that there is a greater chance of earning a respectable amount as a self-published author than there is by going the traditional route. That seems like the story to me.


I've thought the same thing for a long time. It isn't necessary to write a bestseller in order to build valuable residual income streams. Not making enough money off your books? Publish another one.

I have had $500 - $1,000 months, but not consistently. Still, I'm thankful for every dollar that flows into my little publishing company from the various non-fiction and fiction books my wife and I have written. The money helps us pay a few bills and we both find it extremely satisfying to earn money from our writing. We may not be able to write full time, but publishing has still been "worth it" to us.

I dream of being able to write full time, but it will take a heck of a lot of book sales to replace the software development consulting income I earn. I don't expect that to ever happen, but I'm happy to keep writing and publishing just the same.


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## Kay Bratt

I'd like to add that I consider many of you who are making a lot less a month than I, much more successful. Why? Because it took me several years of hard core marketing and scraping for every reader to get where I am. Some of you are doing awesome for just the short amount of time you've been at this. If you're doing more than $500 a month just out of the gate, with a few years of sticking to it you'll be  pulling in some big bucks! 

Congrats!


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## miss_fletcher

This September marked a full year with my self published books as my sole source of income. I earned significantly more than my old day job (I earned £26k at that job). £300+ in royalties a month is more common now than it was 12 months ago. I think most who achieve this have been building a solid backlist and are up to their eyeballs at the moment preparing for 2013 (I know I am). I remember KDP throwing out quote earlier in the year along the lines of "over 1000 KDP authors sell over 1000 books a month." I'd guess that figure has ballooned.


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## yomamma

Between trad-pub and indie, I make enough to quit my day job.

Of course, I haven't quit my day job. I like security, health insurance, a steady paycheck that doesn't change month to month, and a 401k. But I could quit, if I really, really wanted to. 

I think if the writing continues to be a steady paycheck for a few years, I'll consider it. Until then...

(all those extremely risk averse, raise your hand!!)


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## KatieKlein

Not sure if you're still looking for people, but I qualify. I made more self-pubbing than I did at my day job this year. Monthly numbers are posted on the blog: http://katiekleinwrites.blogspot.com/2012/11/october-sales-numbers.html  (I write YA, btw)

*my fingers are perpetually crossed*

~Katie~


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## Kathleen Valentine

Hugh Howey said:


> I think a lot of the people I'd want to hear from are scarce these days (busy writing or promoting). Is there any way we can round up a list of people making, let's say, $500 a month on average for an entire year from their work? That's $6,000 a year. That pays a few bills.


I'm well over that, too. In July I paid cash for a new (to-me, it's a 2009) car paid for 100% by ONE .99 book (*The Crazy Old Lady in the Attic*) - one of the happiest days of my life!


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## A. Rosaria

I made about $30 last year for the full year. This year around the same, maybe more, I'm way below the benchline of $500 a month. Maybe I should write more novels instead of short stories or improve at my craft.


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## swolf

gljones said:


> Off topic I know but your Icon has been freaking me out for a while, I have to know, what the heck is that?


It's Will Ferrell from this SNL skit:






Fred's Slacks is a winner!


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## Guest

jillmyles said:


> (all those extremely risk averse, raise your hand!!)


This is me. I am partial to my health insurance and 401K and profit sharing plan. The stability of a regular income allows me to take risks with my publishing that I might not make otherwise if I knew that I HAD to make X number of dollars to pay the bills. I've spent the last year working on an RPG instead of my fiction, because the RPG was more fun to work on. If I needed the income, I would have worked on the fiction and knocked out the two sequels and other stuff sitting on the backburner instead because it would have been more instant money. But I have the luxury of not needing to make X, so I can play. 

We've also had a few major hits (we're still paying off bills from the flooding from Hurricane Irene last year, Mike needed a new vehicle because his car finally died, had to replace the furnace, etc) that have eaten up a lot of money. Thankfully, I make enough with the publishing that it kept us from going into serious debt when all of these surprise bills came up. We'd be in a bad way if I didn't have my publishing income coming in.

Hugh you bring up such a great point that gets lost. The current focus on indie publishing has honestly been more of a "gold rush" mentality instead of looking at it rationally as just another method of publication.


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## Consuelo Saah Baehr

This is a good endeavor.  I think what you mean is "let's hear from ordinary good writers who have set up shop with one or more books, expecting little, learning a lot and finally seeing notable sales trickle in.  That's me.

I began in August of 2010 with some backlist titles and some new books.  In the first few months, I took every interview available, posted on every legal self-promotion site, entered every available contest and bought two small ads. I also would comment in general media i.e. The Huffington Post and include a link to my blog.  Each month, sales doubled 10, 20, 40, etc. I began a blog "The Repurposed Writer."  In 2011 I had two lucky breaks:  Amazon accepted a monologue for their Kindle Single program and Fast Company Magazine "discovered" me and asked to do an interview.  Sales of the Kindle Single were in the high hundreds for several months.

When the Select program began, I had very good returns (initially in the U.K. and then in the U.S.) One month, I made $8,000 and for several months I made 2-4 thousand.  Beginning in August of this year sales slowed considerably.  I stopped marketing except for my blog and joined a couple of "indie" groups. My monthly income has settled into a respectable $1,000 to $1,200 range.  I still consider self-publishing a miracle for writers and my experience has given me the energy to continue writing.


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## swolf

Through self-publishing, I've made over half of what I made in my day job this year.   Around July, it looked like I was on an upward pace that would allow me to quit my day job eventually, perhaps even next year.

But then something happened - I'm still not sure what - and the numbers dropped.  They're still good, but they're no longer on that same upward trend I was enjoying earlier.  It was a reminder that in this business we're subject to things beyond our control, like filters and algorithms that can change from day to day.  

Considering that, it would be real tough to give up the day job and turn over my family's security to such a capricious business.  Currently, I'm trying to diversify in my writing, and eventually the media I publish in, hoping that will better buffer my income against the rising and lowering tides.


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## Marina Maddix

I'm looking at $500 for my first _month_ of publishing, mainly from one e-rom title. Needless to say, the sequel is in the works. Sorry to say I didn't get started a year ago!


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## jackz4000

The reporters and media usually look for that big success story, like the big lottery winner. You'll see the media fall all over themselves reporting on the $100 Million Dollar winner, but few will cover the people who won $1 or $3 Million in the same lottery. 

Personally, I think the idea that many SP writers can make an extra $6K to $20K per year much more interesting than the very few who sell millions.


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## BrianKittrell

Probably a little late, but I clear $500 every month. Several months this year doubled what I make at my day job. And I'm nobody.


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## B.A. Spangler

KayBratt said:


> I'd like to add that I consider many of you who are making a lot less a month than I, much more successful. Why? Because it took me several years of hard core marketing and scraping for every reader to get where I am. Some of you are doing awesome for just the short amount of time you've been at this. If you're doing more than $500 a month just out of the gate, with a few years of sticking to it you'll be pulling in some big bucks!
> 
> Congrats!


Love this - I don't think _if_ anymore, instead I think _when_!


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## Jonathan C. Gillespie

I'm mystified how some of you are doing so awesome right from launch. I'm happy for you, but I'm fighting the uphill exposure battle, and there are days that it just feels like nothing is working. Marketing is such a pain.


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## Hugh Howey

jackz4000 said:


> The reporters and media usually look for that big success story, like the big lottery winner. You'll see the media fall all over themselves reporting on the $100 Million Dollar winner, but few will cover the people who won $1 or $3 Million in the same lottery.
> 
> Personally, I think the idea that many SP writers can make an extra $6K to $20K per year much more interesting than the very few who sell millions.


Me too. It's a hidden but more attainable dream.

Of course, either way means you have to commit to writing every single day and getting the damn thing out there!


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## Not Here

I'm so glad to see this thread and wanted to say thanks for those who have shared. It's hard to ask someone how much they are bringing in and it's great to see so many people doing well. 

This is actually a discussion I had with an instructor of mine. He's a mystery author (John Galligan if anyone is a mystery fan) that has been publishing for years through small presses. I had written a paper about self publishing and how I felt indie publishing would opened up doors to mid-list authors. Not just the ability to make more money but the chance to publish at all. It has been really amazing to watch all of this unfold.


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## jackz4000

Hugh Howey said:


> Me too. It's a hidden but more attainable dream.
> 
> Of course, either way means you have to commit to writing every single day and getting the d*mn thing out there!


True Hugh or at least a productive writing schedule. What is really fascinating to me is that nearly anybody can write a story and have readers who may like it and they don't need 100,000 readers. In fact, many can do OK just selling 10,000 copies or 5000. It's a bit like each person who has a story to tell has their own printing press and means of distribution and each is a mini-micro-publisher who can fill niche markets where Big Pubs fear to tread. It gives readers much more variety and is a little renaissance itself. Maybe the best fiction is yet to come.


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## ToniD

Hugh, it's stuff like this that makes you a class act.

I'll add my congrats to all those who've posted their stories.

Late to the thread, but I qualify by the yearly criterion. Monthly income is up and down and sideways. PMing...


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## Vivi_Anna

I make about 3K a month, its more than I was making with 3 traditional publishing deals.


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## Dani Collins

Great thread. 

My additional question to those making the benchmark income and above is, when did you start to see it?

Don't laugh at me, I'm not expecting to have made back my investment yet, but in my first month & a half I've *just* passed the $100 mark to earn a royalty check. 

I've heard of another benchmark: minimum five titles out before you start to see a decent income and following.

Is anyone making a living on say, three titles or less?


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## AmberC

When Seth suggested we self publish in 2011 I actually laughed at him. Only in total desperation with a very sick newborn, mounting bills and no other options did we give it a try. Looking back, I feel like an idiot. Six months later we are paying our bills with self publication. Seth would say the lesson learned here is listen to your husband. Being able to support our family doing what we love is one of the greatest gifts.


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## Pnjw

Sweetapple said:


> When Seth suggested we self publish in 2011 I actually laughed at him. Only in total desperation with a very sick newborn, mounting bills and no other options did we give it a try. Looking back, I feel like an idiot. Six months later we are paying our bills with self publication. Seth would say the lesson learned here is listen to your husband. Being able to support our family doing what we love is one of the greatest gifts.


Well, you did come here for advice, so maybe the lesson here is to listen to KB members?  Congrats!


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## 16205

I make between $2200 and $5300 a month.  Last year in Sept, I made $95.  I had a good upswing last October that saved me from having to become a Taco Bell employee, so I'm very thankful.  

I'm also of Camp Paranoid: "How long will this last, must write more, must write more..."


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## AmberC

That too Deanna!


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## Vivi_Anna

Dani Collins said:


> Great thread.
> 
> My additional question to those making the benchmark income and above is, when did you start to see it?
> 
> Don't laugh at me, I'm not expecting to have made back my investment yet, but in my first month & a half I've *just* passed the $100 mark to earn a royalty check.
> 
> I've heard of another benchmark: minimum five titles out before you start to see a decent income and following.
> 
> Is anyone making a living on say, three titles or less?


It took me at least 6 mths to be making $500 a month, that was with 3 titles. Took me a year to make over $1000, with 6-7 titles. That was all from Amazon, it took over 14 mths to really be making money at B&N.


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## dalya

I don't think that regular folks working hard and eking out a few bucks here and there will ever be a story that sells newspapers makes linkbait.

There always has to be an angle.

Which is why I'm going to be setting up a live feed of myself barricaded inside a fancy hotel room, writing my next novel in 48 hours without sleeping.


----------



## Kay Bratt

Danielle Bourdon said:


> I'm also of Camp Paranoid: "How long will this last, must write more, must write more..."


Oh, I'm head camp counselor there! Hubby keeps telling me how proud he is of me, and I keep reminding him not to expect it to continue. He says he knows it will only get even better and that I'm his new retirement package. I hope for once he's right!


----------



## JumpingShip

Dani Collins said:


> Great thread.
> 
> My additional question to those making the benchmark income and above is, when did you start to see it?
> 
> Don't laugh at me, I'm not expecting to have made back my investment yet, but in my first month & a half I've *just* passed the $100 mark to earn a royalty check.
> 
> I've heard of another benchmark: minimum five titles out before you start to see a decent income and following.
> 
> Is anyone making a living on say, three titles or less?


I only uploaded my fourth title last month, and my third title came out in March. I'm currently working on writing my 5th book, but it's months away from completion. I started earning about $400-500 a month when I released my second title in January 2011. (so, about 6 months, as my first came out in June 2010.) In June of that year, things took off, but I still had/have some months that aren't great. However, the last time I earned under 1k/month was last November. That was a terrible month, but then Select came along. Not sure what will happen next year.


----------



## vrabinec

My sister said she wants to be the first to buy my book. So I have one advanced sale at $3.99 x 70%, that's $2.79. Whooot! Beat that suckers!


----------



## the quiet one

Dalya said:


> I don't think that regular folks working hard and eking out a few bucks here and there will ever be a story that sells newspapers makes linkbait.
> 
> There always has to be an angle.
> 
> Which is why I'm going to be setting up a live feed of myself barricaded inside a fancy hotel room, writing my next novel in 48 hours without sleeping.


Think there's a definite pay-per-view opportunity here.

Prop bets in Vegas would be interesting:

Cups of coffee consumed: over/under 15.5
Keyboards thrown against wall: over/under 2.5
etc


----------



## jnfr

vrabinec said:


> My sister said she wants to be the first to buy my book. So I have one advanced sale at $3.99 x 70%, that's $2.79. Whooot! Beat that suckers!


Now go sit down and finish that book, vrabinec!


----------



## 16205

KayBratt said:


> Oh, I'm head camp counselor there!


  

Have you been 'Panic Buying', too? I bought brand new furniture, a new washer/dryer, a new Mac, among other things. I tell hubs, "But what if I only make $50 next month? Hey, should we replace the 15 year old kitchen table while we're at it?"


----------



## theaatkinson

I know it's waaay too late to add my .02, but I read each one of these stories and found hope in every post.

I've now begun my 3rd year. I began in mid Oct of 2010. I think between then and the end of december that year, with 2 titles I'd made 20$, and was happy to make it.

I've been writing for years. I already had 10 novels on my hard drive and about 30 short stories. I had an agent. I'd published a good bit of the shorts in lit journals, etc. 

I'm a full time teacher at a community college. My husband was a lobster fisherman. The year I found out Amazon was allowing indie publishers for Kindle, I knew I had to give it a shot. NOt because I'd given up on the traditional deal, but because I'd run out of time. My husband had just been diagnosed with MS and he couldn't fish anymore. Seven months after that, I lost the job I'd held for nearly 15 years to budget cuts.

I figured I could put up a few of the novels I'd written. I really just hoped for enough to pay for a phone bill or a bit of groceries.

I did manage to get a new job and commuted an hour and a half each way for a bunch of months to teach. Hubbie is officially retired at 47. Daughter is in University. 

I am making an average of $500 over all the titles listed in my sig. Mostly litfic, so no great sellers. The fantasy series is the thing that drove my monthly sales of 100 to 500 in the last six months.

It's not a lot, but it helps. And I'm overjoyed to have the extra income.

I could make 4000 a month and still not quit my day job. I love my job. I love to write. One gives me the security to do the other, and the other allows me the freedom to pay a couple of months tuition for my daughter's education or send her some cash to spend. Mostly, though, it pays for a rent on a cottage closer to my new job so I can save 3 hours drive each day.


loving these success stories, Hugh. Thanks for asking.


----------



## JRTomlin

DRMarvello said:


> I've thought the same thing for a long time. It isn't necessary to write a bestseller in order to build valuable residual income streams. Not making enough money off your books? Publish another one.
> 
> I have had $500 - $1,000 months, but not consistently. Still, I'm thankful for every dollar that flows into my little publishing company from the various non-fiction and fiction books my wife and I have written. The money helps us pay a few bills and we both find it extremely satisfying to earn money from our writing. We may not be able to write full time, but publishing has still been "worth it" to us.
> 
> I dream of being able to write full time, but it will take a heck of a lot of book sales to replace the software development consulting income I earn. I don't expect that to ever happen, but I'm happy to keep writing and publishing just the same.


I agree with both you and Hugh, although I do write full time and make a living from it.

Hugh, I sent you a PM.


----------



## Maggie Dana

Thanks for launching this thread, Hugh, and for trying to get a journalist interested. It's a great idea and one I think would be of interest to lots of people who enjoy stories they can actually relate to rather than those they can only dream about.

I write for a small, but very focused, niche market: girls aged 9 to 13 who love horses! When I published the first book a year ago, I had no idea if kids even had Kindles and tablets. But it seems they do, and more are getting them every day. I now have four books in my series and am half-way through writing the fifth. This month, I will clear around $1100, my best one to date. The numbers get better with each book I release, so instead of killing myself with marketing, I'm killing myself with more writing.

I've also been super lucky in that my books consistently rank in Kindle's "Horse Books for Children" category and show up in other books' 'also bought' lists. This is without using Select, by the way.


----------



## George Berger

Dalya said:


> I don't think that regular folks working hard and eking out a few bucks here and there will ever be a story that sells newspapers makes linkbait.
> 
> There always has to be an angle.


Absolutely.



> Which is why I'm going to be setting up a live feed of myself barricaded inside a fancy hotel room, writing my next novel in 48 hours without sleeping.


Be careful that Harlan Ellison(TM) doesn't try to sue you - he pulled a slightly similar schtick back in the '70s. 



vrabinec said:


> My sister said she wants to be the first to buy my book. So I have one advanced sale at $3.99 x 70%, that's $2.79. Whooot! Beat that suckers!


$2.79 less a few cents in delivery fees, actually. 

Slightly more on-topic, my first royalty check took me, um, fourteen months to earn - and it was for _eleven dollars_. One romance novel and novella about a goat (and several other books, not that anyone ever reads _those_...) later, and I've made eleven bucks in royalties since I got up this morning.

I'm not paying the mortgage, but I can pay the utilities now, most months, and have a bit left over.


----------



## N. Gemini Sasson

Almost three years ago I peacefully parted ways with my agent and stepped off the submissions merry-go-round. I figured I'd give this self-publishing a whirl. What did I have to lose?

This time two years ago I was selling less than ten books a day. So I enrolled at the community college for 18 credit hours in order to renew my teaching certificate. Our oldest was in college and we had to take out a home equity loan to pay for what scholarships didn't cover. We had another kid heading to college the following year. We needed another full income to stay out of debt.

But in those few months while I sat there listening to lectures on plant physiology and climatology, my books began to sell a little more each week. By the time I'd finished my 18 credit hours, I was earning more than an entry level teacher - and with a fraction of the daily stress. I _still_ haven't gotten around to renewing my teaching certificate two years later.

Recently my agent contacted me and asked if I'd be interested in submitting some of my books again. I'm truly indifferent. I'm what you'd call one of those 'midlisters' and it's a good place to be.


----------



## Kathleen Valentine

In 2010, with 3 titles out, I averaged $16/month.
In 2011, with 9 titles out I averaged $833/month.
In 2012, with 14 titles out, I have averaged over $2,000/month.


----------



## harrisonbooth

Kathleen Valentine said:


> In 2010, with 3 titles out, I averaged $16/month.
> In 2011, with 9 titles out I averaged $833/month.
> In 2012, with 14 titles out, I have averaged over $2,000/month.


These are the type of figures that keep me going right now...


----------



## Kathleen Valentine

I'm really glad that Hugh started this thread because I didn't really realize how much progress I was making.


----------



## 56139

I have officially sent in my resignation.  Partly because they phased out my job and I didn't want the new on they offered, and partly because I'm just gonna give it a go.  I make the same amount from my self-published stuff as I did at that job, so I won't have that cushion anymore (bummer) but I won't starve either.

Since my fiction business is so new - that's only a few hundred dollars a month right now with 3 titles

But my non-fiction for November will be $4000+


----------



## TexasGirl

Go JanneCo Go!

We're rooting for you, and David Adams, and the others who have taken the plunge!

I thing being on the cutting edge of new ways to promote, like you can be here on the KBs, makes a big difference (before Amazon changes the game again!)


----------



## 56139

TexasGirl said:


> Go JanneCo Go!
> 
> We're rooting for you, and David Adams, and the others who have taken the plunge!
> 
> I thing being on the cutting edge of new ways to promote, like you can be here on the KBs, makes a big difference (before Amazon changes the game again!)


Thanks! I won't lie, I'm nervous. But I've been self-publishing for four years now and to be honest, I really thought I'd have done it like two years ago - but this job was too easy. Work-at-home, part time, and decent pay. But now that they want me to go full-time and drive into Denver everyday (which is an hour away) I just think this is the right time, all I can do is go all in and hope it's enough.


----------



## Margo Lerwill

PM'd you, Hugh, but I thought I'd make a quick comment for those who have said that reading through this is inspirational for them.  Just over a year ago, I started writing under a new pen name, high volume, attention to craft (30 years of it), no time wasted on social media spamming.  Came in just shy of six figures for the year, having hit the bestseller list for my genre four times.  Still, most of my income came from titles that did well but never hit any bestseller lists.


----------



## Al Dente

swolf said:


> I'm making more than $500 a month, but then again, I write erotica, so mine may be a story a journalist wouldn't want to tell.


Same. I'm getting close to making that much each month, but I also mostly write erotica.


----------



## Rick Gualtieri

Danielle Bourdon said:


> I'm also of Camp Paranoid: "How long will this last, must write more, must write more..."


Sign me up for a summer there. 

Definitely. One of the downsides of selling, even in moderate amounts, is the stress of waking up every morning wondering if this is 'the day' it all falls off a cliff. Tis the definition of madness.


----------



## David Adams

Hugh Howey said:


> Me too. It's a hidden but more attainable dream.
> 
> Of course, either way means you have to commit to writing every single day and getting the d*mn thing out there!


Yeah, see, I'm very realistic about my goals, hopes and dreams. If I can make, say, $2,000 or $3,000 a month, that's pretty much "living the dream" as far as I'm concerned.


----------



## Sarah Woodbury

I started indie pubbing in January 2011--and found KB with the help of Gemini upthread!

The day I uploaded my first book was one of the best days of my life 

Sent you a PM, Hugh.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn

Hugh Howey said:


> But I'm trying.


You are awesome! And I agree this is the REAL story that doesn't make it to the headlines. But I keep telling my friends, and that gets around.  I'm definitely a midlist - well above the $500/mo, and still hoping for my "Hugh Howey" moment. But then I haven't published as much as Hugh, and keeping up with that guy is tough! 

I'd be happy to talk to any reporters who wish to talk numbers. I'll PM you, in case you're still looking.


----------



## Kay Bratt

Danielle Bourdon said:


> Have you been 'Panic Buying', too? I bought brand new furniture, a new washer/dryer, a new Mac, among other things. I tell hubs, "But what if I only make $50 next month? Hey, should we replace the 15 year old kitchen table while we're at it?"


Well, four of us did take a 5-day cruise on my January royalties to celebrate hubby's milestone birthday. But since then we are squirreling it away to pay our 3rd round of college tuitions this upcoming fall. We'll then be an empty nest, and after she graduates maybe we can begin splurging on something for Mom & Dad finally! Like a tiki hut on an island somewhere...


----------



## Shalini Boland

Hi Hugh, 

I only started self-publishing last year and I was pretty amazed when my books started selling. I now earn a good living as a YA author. Still have to keep pinching myself  

I won't PM you as it sounds like you have PMs to last you a week, but feel free to contact me if you need more info.

Shalini x


----------



## vrabinec

David Adams said:


> Yeah, see, I'm very realistic about my goals, hopes and dreams. If I can make, say, $2,000 or $3,000 a month, that's pretty much "living the dream" as far as I'm concerned.


Ditto. Not sure the wife sees it that way, because that's a substantial pay cut. That's a talk I'm not looking forward to having with her.


----------



## Katy MN

I've been making $2000 per month consistently for about a year with a single novel, and more in the $3000+ range with two novels.  One month was at almost $6000, from the release of the second book though!


----------



## Rachel Schurig

There are so many awesome stories in this thread!



Kathleen Valentine said:


> In 2010, with 3 titles out, I averaged $16/month.
> In 2011, with 9 titles out I averaged $833/month.
> In 2012, with 14 titles out, I have averaged over $2,000/month.


Like this one. Totally impressive Kathleen!



 Sweetapple said:


> When Seth suggested we self publish in 2011 I actually laughed at him. Only in total desperation with a very sick newborn, mounting bills and no other options did we give it a try. Looking back, I feel like an idiot. Six months later we are paying our bills with self publication. Seth would say the lesson learned here is listen to your husband. Being able to support our family doing what we love is one of the greatest gifts.


And this. Team Sweetapple RULES!


----------



## Music &amp; Mayhem

Katy MN said:


> I've been making $2000 per month consistently for about a year with a single novel, and more in the $3000+ range with two novels. One month was at almost $6000, from the release of the second book though!


Congratulations!! I've been doing pretty well myself, but nowhere near those numbers. Your story is inspiring. Do you do Kindle Select promos? Just curious.
I'm in the midst of a freebee (last day today, Nov 2 for my second crime thriller, Diva. Last month I did one for Absolution, which went really well.


----------



## TJHudson

I'm no where near $500 a month, but this thread has been very encouraging. Good to see success stories do happen with time and effort. Both of which I'm putting in, so fingers crossed.
I needed this read.


----------



## Dee Ernst

Better Off Without Him launched October 2010.  Zero sales for the first 6 months, except for friends and family.  Then, I changed the cover, blurb, lowered the price and got a few reviews.  It sold between $250-$350 for the next 12 months. April of this year, I published my second book and put Better Off in Select.  By then it had 10 5-star reviews, so it got picked up by POI during my first promo. From April to Sept, I carefully timed my free promos and averaged 6K a month on that 1 title.  ADKOF averaged 100-300 copies a month on Better Off's shirttails. It was enough to get the Zon gods to notice me, and I hit the 'lottery' in Sept with their promo. And that led to the Option deal.  And there may be a publishing deal coming up as well.

I did it both ways, had a steady, respectable income, and got smacked upside the head with a lucky break. Yeah, I think I wrote a good book, and I was thrilled the way it was selling before it hit the bestseller list.  And now, for the first time in several months, Better Off is not the number 1 title in Comic fiction. Which is what I always knew would happen. I hope I'll settle into the same steady, respectable sales pattern, this time with both titles, which will make up for the fact that yes, I did quit my day job. So, until the next book comes out, I'm writing as fast as I can and making the usual sacrifices.


----------



## Virginia Wade

It's been an amazing year, although there was a huge drop in September. Something shifted over at Amazon and B&N. Hum...

However, this is my full-time job and it pays all the bills. (Including the kid in college) Hubby still works for health insurance, 401k, and retirement.


----------



## DelilahFawkes

This is such an inspirational thread!   Thank you for putting it together, Hugh, and for getting the midlist authors and those hoping to make a job out of this more data!

I started self publishing last summer, and was able to quit my day job this past February when I was making about $4500/month. I'm now consistently earning 5 figures a month and have made over 6 figures this year. Life is very, very good, and it's all thanks to Self Publishing .

When I queried my first novel a couple of years back, 50 queries and no bites. HA!   Just goes to show we really do know what readers want and can do this on our own!


----------



## Sapphire

vrabinec said:


> My sister said she wants to be the first to buy my book. So I have one advanced sale at $3.99 x 70%, that's $2.79. Whooot! Beat that suckers!


You're lucky. I have only one sibling, and she doesn't own a Kindle or any other e-reader. I guess I have to find more real buyers.


----------



## Hugh Howey

DelilahFawkes said:


> This is such an inspirational thread!  Thank you for putting it together, Hugh, and for getting the midlist authors and those hoping to make a job out of this more data!
> 
> I started self publishing last summer, and was able to quit my day job this past February when I was making about $4500/month. I'm now consistently earning 5 figures a month and have made over 6 figures this year. Life is very, very good, and it's all thanks to Self Publishing .
> 
> When I queried my first novel a couple of years back, 50 queries and no bites. HA!  Just goes to show we really do know what readers want and can do this on our own!


Your covers are hot, Delilah!


----------



## DelilahFawkes

Hugh Howey said:


> Your covers are hot, Delilah!


Haha!  Thanks, Hugh! I try.


----------



## Al Dente

Wow, Delilah. Six figures is nuts! Congrats on that. I would be happy making 20k or so a year. I'm getting there slowly but surely. I only have 9 pieces of erotica up and three bundles, and it looks like I'll probably make $250 - $300 this month, depending on what sales look like over the next few days. My first milestone is going to be hitting $1,000 in sales in a month. I'm thinking that will happen in February. I'm really hoping I can get going half as good as you are right now, because my freelance / SEO work is quickly drying up!


----------



## DelilahFawkes

Thanks, David, and I feel ya.   I just wanted to make something like $20,000-$30,000, too. Enough to call this my day job and survive, you know? 

BUT, you're on your way! Once you hit $1000/month, you're just that much closer to $20,000.  If you can make $300 why not $500? And if you can make $500, why not $1000? And if you can make $1000, why not $1666.67?

It's such an exciting time to be a writer . So many are seeing their sales grow with each new release, and getting closer to meeting (or exceeding) their dreams!


----------



## CJArcher

I love this thread! So many inspiring stories. And Hugh is so right - we don't have to be big name outliers to be happy little authors. I'm convinced I'm making more money doing this than if I'd gone the trad route from the beginning.

Adding my figures into the mix - I'm making above the $500 benchmark on my self-published titles and have since about April 2011, some months well above, other's not so much. (I'm not including my Montlake titles in these figures, of course). After my youngest started school this year, I was facing having to go back part-time to a job I hated doing (technical writing). I'm so glad I can work from home, my own hours, doing something I love.


----------



## Katy MN

Music & Mayhem said:


> Congratulations!! I've been doing pretty well myself, but nowhere near those numbers. Your story is inspiring. Do you do Kindle Select promos? Just curious.
> I'm in the midst of a freebee (last day today, Nov 2 for my second crime thriller, Diva. Last month I did one for Absolution, which went really well.


I did one Kindle Select promo with the first book, but I found it was actually a negative impact for me -- totally messed up my Also-Bought list and led to my lowest months of the year. Never again!


----------



## Katy MN

DelilahFawkes said:


> This is such an inspirational thread!  Thank you for putting it together, Hugh, and for getting the midlist authors and those hoping to make a job out of this more data!
> 
> I started self publishing last summer, and was able to quit my day job this past February when I was making about $4500/month. I'm now consistently earning 5 figures a month and have made over 6 figures this year. Life is very, very good, and it's all thanks to Self Publishing .
> 
> When I queried my first novel a couple of years back, 50 queries and no bites. HA!  Just goes to show we really do know what readers want and can do this on our own!


HOLY COW your covers are awesome! Do you mind if I ask who did them?!


----------



## DelilahFawkes

Katy MN said:


> HOLY COW your covers are awesome! Do you mind if I ask who did them?!


Oh, bless your heart . I did them myself with stock photos of those models. They were just great pictures, so I got very lucky! The font is "mom's typewriter," and is available for free over at dafont.com.


----------



## Shalini Boland

CJArcher said:


> After my youngest started school this year, I was facing having to go back part-time to a job I hated doing (technical writing). I'm so glad I can work from home, my own hours, doing something I love.


That's exactly how I feel about writing - lucky to be able to earn a living doing something I love, that's flexible around the kids.

The only downside is my own paranoia that it won't last, so I'm frantically scribbling more books!


----------



## Ali Cooper

I'm not making that much right now but my UK sales (my home market) are paying my council tax. Don't know what your equivalent is in US but it's our household tax that covers local amenities, services etc. It's 1/6 of my income.


----------



## NoCat

I'm only averaging about 400 a month this year, alas. I quit writing due to health and family issues for about 8 months, so I'm actually pretty happy with that number. I mean, how many people get to not work for 8 months and still make money at their job?


----------



## Al Dente

Thanks for the encouragement, Delilah.   I'm basically putting 1 or 2 shorts up a week and letting the sales come as they will. I'll probably continue to do that indefinitely. It seems like that's the best way to increase your earnings. I thought about a mailing list, but I'm just not able to make the time to manage it just yet. For now, I'm just going to keep chugging along until I get there.


----------



## Claudia Lefeve

Sent you a PM!


----------



## Gone 9/21/18

Thanks so much for this, Hugh. I often wish someone would give a nod toward the middle and not concentrate so much on trying to discourage with the "most indies will never sell more than 100 copies" or encourage with stories about the high-end outliers.

I first published in February 2010 and have fit the profile you're looking for since June 2010. Will send a PM with details.


----------



## Margo Lerwill

David Scroggins said:


> Thanks for the encouragement, Delilah.  I'm basically putting 1 or 2 shorts up a week and letting the sales come as they will. I'll probably continue to do that indefinitely. It seems like that's the best way to increase your earnings. I thought about a mailing list, but I'm just not able to make the time to manage it just yet. For now, I'm just going to keep chugging along until I get there.


Quick piece of advice (you didn't ask for), don't wait on the mailing list. Mail Chimp is fast and easy, once you spend an hour or so that first time getting the feel of putting a list and a campaign together. I resisted for a long time, and it cost me. The sales I get from my mailing list are amazing, but if I'd had it when I had a title that was moving 200 copies a day... I wasn't prepared at the time. _After_ you hit with a title is too late. The list subscribers always put my new titles in the top 5000 of all paid amazon ebooks on release day. Mail Chimp lets you track opens and clicks, so you can see exactly what your readers are doing when they get the email.


----------



## MosesSiregarIII

Not me yet. I've written one novel, most of the time it's been 99 cents at Amazon, and it's grossed about $5,700 on 7,500 lifetime sales in 19 months, but I've only put about $2,000 in my pocket after all expenses are considered.

I'm going to have a new preview novella out in December and I'm hoping for the next full novel to be out in May at $3.99, so hopefully the hobby will start to earn some decent money starting next year.


----------



## darrenpillsbury

Hey Hugh, PM'd you with details.

I published my first three books in my YA horror/comedy series PETER AND THE MONSTERS in May 2011. After seven months of virtually no sales, Amazon made the first volume in the series free in January 2012. That was the turning point. Since April I've been clearing over $1000 a month (knock on wood).


----------



## Emma Daniels

I guess I can add myself to this rather substantial list. From all the outlets I make about $1,000 a month. It used to be more, and I'm hoping that after Christams sales will pick up again. I gave up my 'day' job last year but I do have a spouse working full time. What I make on selling books definitely wouldn't pay all the bills or kep the kids in clothes or toys.


----------



## Cheryl Douglas

Vivi_Anna said:


> I make about 3K a month.


I'm in this 3-4k camp as well.


----------



## Kellie Sheridan

Wow!

I'm new around here and wont be self-publishing my first book until March or April of next year, but reading all of your stories and successes... wow.


----------



## 60911

Shalini Boland said:


> That's exactly how I feel about writing - lucky to be able to earn a living doing something I love, that's flexible around the kids.
> 
> The only downside is my own paranoia that it won't last, so I'm frantically scribbling more books!


This. Totally agree, when my wife had our second kid, both of us couldn't maintain high stress, high maintenance careers so I bowed out of mine (which involved more hours than hers, less pay and a falling income thanks to market changes which caused me to seriously hate it) to give us some flexibility with the kids and let me pursue a dream. Before June of this year my biggest month by far was $55. I sent this to Hugh this morning but hesitated to share it publicly because I feel like I'm bragging when I share numbers nowadays. Ultimately, though, I feel like the most ridiculous luck has rained down on me and that tons of you are way more talented than me, so maybe this can inspire someone who is struggling.

Jun: $110.29
Jul: $505.96
Aug: $940.59
Sep: $5755.44
Oct: $8426.46
Nov (so far): $13,000-ish

Every day I wonder if its going to last and hope it just keeps going for another day, another month until I can get the next book out.


----------



## Hugh Howey

KSheridan said:


> Wow!
> 
> I'm new around here and wont be self-publishing my first book until March or April of next year, but reading all of your stories and successes... wow.


It's both humbling and hopeful, eh?

On a bitter note, I met with my tax attorney today.


----------



## the quiet one

RobertJCrane said:


> This. Totally agree, when my wife had our second kid, both of us couldn't maintain high stress, high maintenance careers so I bowed out of mine (which involved more hours than hers, less pay and a falling income thanks to market changes which caused me to seriously hate it) to give us some flexibility with the kids and let me pursue a dream. Before June of this year my biggest month by far was $55. I sent this to Hugh this morning but hesitated to share it publicly because I feel like I'm bragging when I share numbers nowadays. Ultimately, though, I feel like the most ridiculous luck has rained down on me and that tons of you are way more talented than me, so maybe this can inspire someone who is struggling.
> 
> Jun: $110.29
> Jul: $505.96
> Aug: $940.59
> Sep: $5755.44
> Oct: $8426.46
> Nov (so far): $13,000-ish
> 
> Every day I wonder if its going to last and hope it just keeps going for another day, another month until I can get the next book out.


I want to be you when I grow up. Wow! That's incredible.

Any idea what happened in September?


----------



## Christian Price

Wow, thank you so much for sharing, it's encouraging to read.  I would consider success if I could eek out a modest living and work from home.  Have the flexibility to never miss my children's milestone.  Splurge on my wife from time to time to say, "Thank You for sharing your life with me.."  At this point, I make enough to buy a sandwich and on a good month I can upsize that... one day that will change and I can share in moments like this.  Thanks again all.


----------



## RHill

Hugh Howey said:


> Are you paying some bills with your writing? Have you quit your day job altogether? I know this is happening, and I suspect the trend is growing, but we spend too much time paying attention to outliers to hear the real story behind indie publishing.
> 
> The problem is rounding everyone up in one place. I have a journalist getting in touch to discuss the viability of writing fiction for a living, and my response is that the outliers aren't as fascinating to me as the self-published version of mid-listers (a name that makes no sense, since we don't put out catalogs to be in the middle of).
> 
> I think a lot of the people I'd want to hear from are scarce these days (busy writing or promoting). Is there any way we can round up a list of people making, let's say, $500 a month on average for an entire year from their work? That's $6,000 a year. That pays a few bills.
> 
> My fear is that these journalists are burying the lead, which is that there is a greater chance of earning a respectable amount as a self-published author than there is by going the traditional route. That seems like the story to me.


Hugh, I've gotta tell you. I'm living on less than $800 a month and I don't care. What is important to me is writing. I'd love to earn more. I hope I write something worthy of earning more. But screw your journalists. I don't care. I'll write until I die. I'm not trying the traditional route, but I might. That's all there is.


----------



## Dennis E. Yates

I love reading these threads, they really give me a nice lift. It seems like there's always somebody out there who is trying to be the first to break the news that self-publishing is dead. Not so! I've been working hard, with the goal of 10 titles by X-Mas. I've got 8 up now and 2 almost there. I'm trying not to think about the $$ so much right now, although I have almost enough to buy a new ipad.

Hugh, my wife and I have really enjoyed your work. I'm way behind with catching up to her, but hope this winter I can.


----------



## 60911

ajalbrinck said:


> I want to be you when I grow up. Wow! That's incredible.
> 
> _Any idea what happened in September?_


My novel Alone went to perma-free status and got picked up by E-Reader News Today, which sent a huge sales spike running through books 2 and 3 of that series that has continued to expand thanks to some timely exposure from Bookbub, Pixel of Ink and I-have-no-idea-what in the UK.

And actually I've been seeing your sales numbers, Alex, and thinking I wish I'd gotten off to as good a start with my first book as you have (bearing in mind I published my first book in June 2011). You should be proud, it's really a fantastic beginning.


----------



## MosesSiregarIII

RobertJCrane said:


> This. Totally agree, when my wife had our second kid, both of us couldn't maintain high stress, high maintenance careers so I bowed out of mine (which involved more hours than hers, less pay and a falling income thanks to market changes which caused me to seriously hate it) to give us some flexibility with the kids and let me pursue a dream. Before June of this year my biggest month by far was $55. I sent this to Hugh this morning but hesitated to share it publicly because I feel like I'm bragging when I share numbers nowadays. Ultimately, though, I feel like the most ridiculous luck has rained down on me and that tons of you are way more talented than me, so maybe this can inspire someone who is struggling.
> 
> Jun: $110.29
> Jul: $505.96
> Aug: $940.59
> Sep: $5755.44
> Oct: $8426.46
> Nov (so far): $13,000-ish
> 
> Every day I wonder if its going to last and hope it just keeps going for another day, another month until I can get the next book out.


Holy shiznit, dude. That's awesome. Congrats!

EDIT: Are you making that at Amazon with the books in your sig? I'm guessing you're selling a ton somewhere else.


----------



## 60911

MosesSiregarIII said:


> Holy shiznit, dude. That's awesome. Congrats!
> 
> EDIT: Are you making that at Amazon with the books in your sig? I'm guessing you're selling a ton somewhere else.


Yes, but check em out on Amazon.uk to get the full picture. Also about $1300 from Barnes and Noble and a combined $100-ish from SW, CS and Kobo.

Oh, and I released my 7th novel today, so that's about $200 so far and not in my sig yet. Thanks for reminding me.


----------



## H. S. St. Ours

Hugh Howey said:


> On a bitter note, I met with my tax attorney today.


Ha! Time to pay the piper, eh? We should all live so long as to have to face the worst fear of all. The ultimate foe: the tax man!


----------



## felicity

For someone just in the beginning of this journey, this is an awesome inspirational thread.  Thank you.


----------



## Laura Lond

I've been averaging $500 per month, too. I write mostly fantasy. I had started in Nov. 2010, made $0 my first month, then some peanuts had started trickling in. Then I could cover some of the bills with them. Then some more of the bills. 

Love this thread, your stories are so inspiring!


----------



## Christian Price

This discussion is so worth another trip on the first page.


----------



## Shayne Parkinson

I became a full-time writer earlier this year.

This seemed such an unlikely event that it only made it into the wildest of wild dreams. Even now, I check each month's sales figures upside down and sideways, and still don't really believe them until the royalties are safely in my bank account. I mean, what say it turned out to be in Italian lire after all?  

I'm definitely paying all my bills, and putting away some savings as well.


----------



## Shayne Parkinson

Dani Collins said:


> Great thread.
> 
> My additional question to those making the benchmark income and above is, when did you start to see it?
> 
> Don't laugh at me, I'm not expecting to have made back my investment yet, but in my first month & a half I've *just* passed the $100 mark to earn a royalty check.
> 
> I've heard of another benchmark: minimum five titles out before you start to see a decent income and following.
> 
> Is anyone making a living on say, three titles or less?


It took me two years, Dani. In my first year, I earned a total of $208.

Not so much a marathon as an ultra-distance run in my case.


----------



## sarracannon

Thanks for starting this thread Hugh. It's such an inspiration to see so many authors making good money from their writing. As a member of RWA for several years, I've seen first-hand how tough it can be for traditional authors to make more than $10,000 a year. Because of our ability to price lower and make more per sale, I think Indie authors truly have the best chance to make a living writing. Being able to have creative control over that work is icing on the cake!

In 2010, I submitted a zombie YA book to an agent for the first time (Kristin Nelson, btw, haha = Dream Agent). When she rejected me with a personal note saying she liked my writing style, but didn't love the story enough to represent it, I felt like I had come to a crossroads. I could either keep submitting to agents and praying for representation, knowing that a deal could be years in the making and might only bring 10k if I was lucky. OR I could self-publish and get myself in front of readers right away and see what happened. I chose the self-pub route. Funny enough, at the time, I didn't want to self-pub my zombie book because I felt it was "too good" to self-pub. An embarrassing statement know that I know what I know! Instead, I wrote a new book, Beautiful Demons, and got it up just 2 months later. 

In my first full year of self-publishing, I made about $45k (averaging that $3000-$4000 a month). In my second year, I made just under $80k (averaging $6000-$7000 a month). November is the start of my third year of self-publishing, and I pray I can continue to make a full-time income. I am a stay-at-home Mom now, so time is at a premium these days, but I plan to still release at least 3 or 4 books a year if possible. I'm going to work my butt off, because I feel like this is one of the very rare careers where you can do what you love and make good money. It's truly a dream job!! I might not be one of those making hundreds of thousands a year (or more!), but I'm extremely happy to be making what I am. It's a dream come true for me every single day.


----------



## Jeff Brackett

Sorta hesitated to respond to this, mainly because I'm still waiting for someone to kick sand in my face & tell me it's all been a big joke.  But I also want folks to know that if I can do this ANYONE can do it.  I'm pretty much a nobody.  I work an average of 10 hrs/day at the day job, and squeeze my writing in where I can.  I figure I average about an hour a day writing.  However, here's what you can do if you really love to write...

Published my first novel on December 11 of last year.  First month I made $145.  
Did a KDP free day in January and sales jumped to just over $2600
February - $2980
March - $1960
April - $1120
May - $1060
June - $1270
July - $1560
August - $1450
September - $1200
(In October, I released a novella - a companion piece to that initial novel) October - $1115
This is late November, and sales so far look like I will drop below $1000 for the first time this year (about $700 so far).  

But that's roughly $17k in one year, mostly on one title, from a new author that no one has ever heard of.  

Just please don't wake me up yet.  Please?


----------



## Steve Vernon

I don't quite fit here - being a hybrid writer - but here's my dirty laundry.

As a traditionally published writer I make about $10,000.00 a year from my published books. I've got a strong back catalogue and a solid regional market base and I subsidize it with a lot of paid public appearances as a storyteller/writer.

I've just finished my first year as a digital writer and have been making about fifty to a hundred dollars a month with my e-books.

I've just got into indie publishing over the last month or so and if I can keep up the progress I think I might FINALLY start pushing that digital income a little closer to my traditional profits.

I need to fast. I heard the word "downsizing" at the office the other day...


----------



## Shalini Boland

RobertJCrane said:


> Every day I wonder if its going to last and hope it just keeps going for another day, another month until I can get the next book out.


Those are fantastic figures, Robert!

My sales have been up and down, rather than a steady growth. I released my first novel, 'Hidden', in March 2011 and it went from $200 in the first two months to $12,000 in July 2011 due to a B&N promotion. Sales then dropped and levelled out after that. But it's my other series, 'Outside', which now has the bigger sales (on Amazon). Nothing like the initial spike of Hidden, but good and steady. I'm just about to release book 2 in the Outside Series and hope it will boost sales again.

It's an exciting time and I love reading everyone's stories on this thread.


----------



## Herc- The Reluctant Geek

I averaged about $600 per month from July 2011 to June 2012, but most of my stuff is non-fiction. 

There's been a drop on Amazon in the past 3 or 4 months, but all the other channels are steady. The paranoid part of me reckons it's because I pulled all my books off select in August. The rational part of me reckons it's because I've only released one study guide since May, and that was for specialised accounting knowledge that would have limited appeal.

Both parts of me avoid talking about my fiction numbers.


----------



## 56139

RobertJCrane said:


> This. Totally agree, when my wife had our second kid, both of us couldn't maintain high stress, high maintenance careers so I bowed out of mine (which involved more hours than hers, less pay and a falling income thanks to market changes which caused me to seriously hate it) to give us some flexibility with the kids and let me pursue a dream. Before June of this year my biggest month by far was $55. I sent this to Hugh this morning but hesitated to share it publicly because I feel like I'm bragging when I share numbers nowadays. Ultimately, though, I feel like the most ridiculous luck has rained down on me and that tons of you are way more talented than me, so maybe this can inspire someone who is struggling.
> 
> Jun: $110.29
> Jul: $505.96
> Aug: $940.59
> Sep: $5755.44
> Oct: $8426.46
> Nov (so far): $13,000-ish
> 
> Every day I wonder if its going to last and hope it just keeps going for another day, another month until I can get the next book out.


Holy crap - Robert! Way. To. Go!!!!!!


----------



## Karly Kirkpatrick

Hey Hugh,

I've been at this 2 years on Nov. 1, 2012. I regularly took in $100-500 a month for the first 18 months. I had sales increase in June 2012 when I published the 2nd book in my trilogy and now I've never made less than $1000 a month. I've made almost $20K this year and most of that has been since June. If sales keep up at this pace in December, I'll clear $20K easily. It's been quite fun to watch it take off a bit, although it's still not nearly the successes that some have had. But yeah, paying bills, taking vacations, saving money, it's been awesome! 

I work full time as a high school teacher and make almost $100K (I'm lucky, I know). I'd love to maybe go part-time someday soon. We'll just have to see if it keeps up! I'm also convinced that if I was working part-time, I could increase the amount of money I make on books by being able to produce more work. I published 3 novels this year already and I'm putting out a novella in December. My first year I made $2900. If I make $20K this year, and I keep putting more titles out, I'm interested to see what kind of numbers I can post in 2013. 

Great numbers everyone else! It's inspiring to see!


----------



## Hugh Howey

RobertJCrane said:


> Every day I wonder if its going to last and hope it just keeps going for another day, another month until I can get the next book out.


That's been me for the entire year.


----------



## 60911

Hugh Howey said:


> That's been me for the entire year.


Let's just say that when you posted your thread about not even enjoying hitting the publishing button anymore, I wrote about five different responses at different times and ended up deleting all of them because I was too embarrassed to say I understood just a fraction of it from an experience I had after September.

ETA: Thanks for the kind words JA and Shalini.


----------



## Emily Ryan-Davis

I've only been earning a living for about 6 months (quit my day job just before Memorial Day). I went from $3-5k/year with digital publishers to $40k+/year (before taxes and based on the past 6 months' as an average) when some rights reverted and I republished them myself. I consider myself midlist money-wise but not "household name"-wise.

Erotic romance and erotica, for the record.

I'm another in the "pray every day that it keeps going for one more month" camp.


----------



## Robert Bidinotto

This is a terrific thread. Thanks for doing this, Hugh.

I'm definitely one of those happy "outliers," with a first book that took off big after about five months. But even before it did, I was netting over $1000 per month, from the outset. And that's where I think the real focus ought to be: the fact that people can make decent supplementary income doing this, even from one or two good books.

No one book last forever. My sales have waned significantly over the past month or so, as I work on the sequel(s). I expect that each new release will boost sales of the previous ones, though, and allow me to continue what I've been doing for over a year now: be a full-time writer of fiction. That was my dream, as I know it's the dream of many here. It's encouraging to discover that so many of you are living that dream, too. And that even those who aren't are still adding income that allows them to improve their lives.

Congratulations to all of you for your talent and persistence, and again to Hugh for his example and encouragement.


----------



## Lefty

Back to work, Bidinotto.


----------



## Robert Bidinotto

It's 1:30 a.m. But that's EXACTLY where I'm headed, BTW.


----------



## NathanWrann

I bought a banjo with my earnings from July.  

With 3 books in a series (one permafree) it appears that I'm not doing as well as some of the others that have posted in this thread, but I'm happy with it. Keep on truckin.


----------



## OJ Connell

Man, reading through this thread is really something else. Some great stories. Hearing about the success of other writers makes me happy and hopeful. It also makes me a little sick to my stomach, because I can't help but wonder what I'm doing wrong, lol.

I've been at this since the end of March. I've got two series' going-- both of them horror. The installments aren't altogether long; a mix of novellas and short stories. My first month or two I made a few bucks. June I earned almost fifty. Things were looking up! Then my sales fell off a cliff for a few months. Late August and early September saw a slight revival, but things have died once again. I've made two sales this month-- one in the US and one in the UK. My profits from fiction for my first year are probably just shy of $100. It sucks!

The day job is awful and the family is expensive. I'd love to earn more through fiction and cut down on my hours-- or just straight-up quit, but at this rate, I'll be working my terrible day job till I'm dead.

I've got a fair number of titles out and I've gotten a few nice reviews. I can't help but think I'm doing something wrong, though. Am I simply writing in a bad genre? Are the stories weak? Are the covers or blurbs inadequate? Do I smell?

Alas. Maybe next year I'll be able to post in threads like these with something more substantial. Whatever the case, congratulations to everyone here!


----------



## NoCat

If it makes you feel better, OJ, I started self-publishing in July of 2010. I didn't make enough for Amazon to pay me until Feb of 2011. Cumulatively. From July to Jan, I didn't cross that 10 dollars.

It builds. Slow for some, quick for others. Keep writing.


----------



## RuthNestvold

I just did the math, and since I published Yseult in January, my average income on ebooks has been just under $500 a month. Unfortunately, not a slow steady climb like some here can report. My sales are up and down, with a huge plunge in May, which really screwed up my average. August and September were excellent (for me), and then October sales went down to just under $500 for the month again, no idea why. 

I don't seem to have figured out the trick of establishing a fan base, which seems to be where the regular sales are. Part of the problem, I think, is that my books are not all in the same genre, let alone all being in a series. From the stories I read here on KB, that's what leads to success.


----------



## Jan Hurst-Nicholson

I've been making an average of about $200 a month, but sales have dropped steadily all year and there is a big difference between January and November sales. However, I did increase the price of some of my books from 99c to $2.99. I also have to take into account the exchange rate, but I can say I am at least paying my grocery bills out of my earnings  and a little treat for myself now and again


----------



## FrankZubek

What an encouraging thread- thanks to everyone here who've been so open about their stories

And briefly-- here is mine since I kind of like to point out the side of the coin that rarely sees print in a paper

Although despite my not being in the $ 500 a month club ( yet!) I HAVE had a bit of success at this

This year, to date, with December still to be tallied, I have matched what I made last year- $ 24.00
You see most my stuff is 99 cents or $ 1.99 and also it's a rough genre to be trying to market ( so far) which is just adult literary fiction.

Although the one book is paranormal, most of my novellas and short stories are what I call, common people with common problems. No fantasy, no sex, no thriller and no mystery.

But I have settled into a rhythm of releasing my work under the Select program - waiting the 90 days and then looking toward branching out into Smashwords and Pubit as well as possibly doing Audio in 2013 s well as hard copy paperbacks

A lot depends on money from the day job to pay for the editing and book covers and since I just work at a grocery store with part time hours it makes it difficult to get all of my goals accomplished in the time frame I hope to pull off

And of course I'm lucky to have an understanding wife who can SEE the potential in the work and she allows me to pursue my short and long term goals with this stuff- which means very long hours at the old laptop

I'm losing sleep, burning the candle at both ends and adding a bunch of stress to the stress that the day job has already piled on but I hang in there. Because the writing and the creating and the magical few moments that come from a really good frigging few hours when everything clicks is my crack fix.

I'm a word addict and I never want to be normal!


----------



## Troy Jackson

Too early to tell for me, since my first was published in Oct. '12.  But it's nice to see fellow authors succeeding...


----------



## Alondo

Hugh Howey said:


> Are you paying some bills with your writing? Have you quit your day job altogether? I know this is happening, and I suspect the trend is growing, but we spend too much time paying attention to outliers to hear the real story behind indie publishing.
> 
> The problem is rounding everyone up in one place. I have a journalist getting in touch to discuss the viability of writing fiction for a living, and my response is that the outliers aren't as fascinating to me as the self-published version of mid-listers (a name that makes no sense, since we don't put out catalogs to be in the middle of).
> 
> I think a lot of the people I'd want to hear from are scarce these days (busy writing or promoting). Is there any way we can round up a list of people making, let's say, $500 a month on average for an entire year from their work? That's $6,000 a year. That pays a few bills.
> 
> My fear is that these journalists are burying the lead, which is that there is a greater chance of earning a respectable amount as a self-published author than there is by going the traditional route. That seems like the story to me.


I would easily make your list, although I haven't give up my day job yet. Amazon's policies are just too mercurial. Few people would take thay kind of a risk.


----------



## otterific

January 1st will mark my one-year jump into indie publishing (or any kind of publishing, for that matter). I had a story I was sitting on for over two years with no real intention of publishing, entered some writing contests just for the feedback, found a critique partner who finally pushed me to publish. (She wanted me to submit to publishers, but I was too scared to even try that). So I went and published the book myself. I had zero expectations. It's now a year later, I turned my stand alone into a series, and am currently writing two new series. 
I had zero experience with online marketing, do minimal facebook and twitter, but have a very small following of readers now, many of whom I have developed a great online friendship with. 
I still work a full time night job, have a family to take care of during the day, and try and find time to write every day. Several of my books have been on amazon's top 100 in their category throughout the year (I attribute that to the Select program and making a few of my books free every now and then), and since about June, I make as much and often more each month as I do at my full time job. 
This has been an incredible year for me, and I can only hope it will continue into the next year.


----------



## 54706

I make well more than this per month with my books.


----------



## Rusty Bigfoot

I've been doing this for almost 2 years and started right off the bat making over $500/month. That went to an average of about $1200/month pretty quickly and sometimes is in the 2k range, sometimes in the 1k range, but never below that (combined print and ebooks). I think it was primarily because I hit the gold rush days just right with books in a popular topic. I've done no marketing. I've become known as the world's greatest Bigfoot storyteller, which kind of both humbles me and cracks me up.

So far this month I've made $1200 just from my Bigfoot Campfire Stories print book alone from Createspace, and am looking at about $1200 from Azon for all my ebooks. Hoping it continues...

But I'm of the camp that one needs to continue writing, so am working on another book all day today, even though it's Christmas. 

Thanks for all the posts, everyone, because I want to focus on how much better I could be doing, as well as not take for granted how well I actually am doing.


----------



## Cherise

Rusty Bigfoot said:


> I've become known as the world's greatest Bigfoot storyteller...


That. Is. Awesome! LOL!


----------



## Music &amp; Mayhem

This thread is so inspirational!  Hope to do my part and add to it. First, I write a mystery series featuring Frank Renzi, an NOPD homicide detective. After much finagling, I finally got amazon to include all three of my series books in the Mystery > Series category. Not as easy as it sounds, but that's another story.

I put NATALIE'S REVENGE, #3 in the series, free from Dec 25-29 and got terrific results, almost 14,000 downloads on the various amazon sites, plus increased sales of the other two books in the series. Since then, NATALIE'S REVENGE has remained on the high on the US series list: #20-25 or so. Sales are brisk, borrows out of sight, 200 plus so far in January. 

The only downer to report: even though I got a lot of downloads in the UK, I've seen no sales of that title, a handful of sales for the other two. Now, I'm not complaining. I'm thrilled with my US sales numbers, but I really would like to figure a way to appeal to the UK (and other European) markets. Anyone have any ideas?


----------



## Nicole Ciacchella

Not sure if you're still looking for people for this, Hugh, but I'm in the $500/month club, though I've been at it for less than a year. Still, I'm thrilled to be making money doing what I love, particularly because it's going to help us pay for a trip for my husband to go visit family in Belgium--something we haven't been able to afford for the past three years. It probably goes without saying that it makes me feel very good to know that my books are making it possible for my in-laws to see their grandson again.


----------



## JETaylor

I'm in that list.  I made a little over 18k last year and right now it's helping pay my daughter's tuition so we don't have to take loans and she doesn't have to come out of school with a heap of debt.  

I also have a day job that I can't begin to think about quitting for another 8 years because we'd like to do the same for my son with respect to tuition.


----------



## ElHawk

I'll throw my happy story into this thread!  I self-published my first novel to Kindle just to see what would happen back in the fall of 2011.  After about nine months it was selling well enough that it was earning me more than I earn at my day job.  It sells around 1000 copies per month, typically.  I've recently released another and have a few more set to come out in the next couple of months.

I *could* justify quitting my job and writing full-time, but we're preparing for a wedding, so for now I'm keeping the day job and using the money from the books to pay for our wedding.  After the wedding I'll be writing full-time, assuming my books continue to sell this well or better.  

So...it does happen!  Not a lot of fanfare around me, no big deals or media attention, but readers like what I do and they keep buying.


----------



## scottnicholson

I just about had the Washington Post book editor sold on a story about the indie middle class a year or so back. But I think he just ended up as John Locke, much to what is now our mutual embarrassment, and I can't even remember if was even in the article now.

As a former reporter myself, I know it is just laziness. Always easier to write the lottery story than the one where people actually grind away and make a good living. The REAL story of what's happening.  And it is also one of the most amazing business/economic stories in America and it never gets reported (imagine if we were all handcrafting beer or shoes or something...we'd all be on Sixty Minutes.)

Good luck.


----------



## dalya

scottnicholson said:


> ... (imagine if we were all handcrafting beer or shoes or something...we'd all be on Sixty Minutes.)
> ...


We'd be on Portlandia, pickling things and putting a bird on it.

fWIW I'm typing this while walking on a treadmill. I've burned 97 calories. 98.


----------



## Hugh Howey

scottnicholson said:


> I just about had the Washington Post book editor sold on a story about the indie middle class a year or so back. But I think he just ended up as John Locke, much to what is now our mutual embarrassment, and I can't even remember if was even in the article now.
> 
> As a former reporter myself, I know it is just laziness. Always easier to write the lottery story than the one where people actually grind away and make a good living. The REAL story of what's happening. And it is also one of the most amazing business/economic stories in America and it never gets reported (imagine if we were all handcrafting beer or shoes or something...we'd all be on Sixty Minutes.)
> 
> Good luck.


I've had zero luck getting anyone interested in the story. The outpouring of PMs with personal and amazing stories warmed my heart, and I know they would have thrilled readers. My last recourse may be to write the story myself, which will mean almost no one reads the damn thing. And that would be a shame. The problem seems to me that the news-reporters are inured to what is news-worthy. Their nerves are numb. Readers would dig hearing this story. It gives far more hope than the story of outliers.


----------



## ellavines

Yes, with my name and pens, I made almost $9,000 last year. This year, I'll make 6K in the first two months just on Amazon, so I'm hoping/expecting to make closer to 20K in 2013 if all goes well. Last year's revenue is double what I made my first year publishing in 2011. And yes, I quit a part-time job I despised, and we're paying bills and doing other cool things with this money. Thanks for asking, Hugh! I agree. This would make a great story.


----------



## A. S. Warwick

M T McGuire said:


> I think it's a bit Catch 22. If you have the time to market your books, you'll earn a living but in order to earn that living, you have to give up work. I'm a stay at home mum so it'll never be more than a hobby for me because I'll never have the time to make a go of it. That said, I make about $30 a month and I think off KB I'm slap bang average. You lot are all very good at this and I am regularly gobsmacked by the figures people on here earn!


I know how you feel. Earing a living is what I've always wanted to do.

But then I got a job and it left little time for writing. After it bruned me out I took time out to see if I could make a go of it but it didnt really take, so I ended up going back to being a full time student retraining myself for a new job. And that also leaves little time for writing. Its a vicious cycle at times.


----------



## L.M. Gautreaux

Hugh, I think you're vastly underestimating how many people would read it simply because you wrote it.  You are an inspiration to so many of us that we are genuinely interested in not only your stories, but also your perspective on and analysis of what's occurring within the unsung block of self-publishers who are making enough money that writing has become a viable option for them.

I'm tired and hurting so I may not be picking the best words.  I'm sure you have multiple projects in the works demanding your time and energy. And perhaps such an article has no room in your production schedule. I certainly wouldn't be so bold as to say you should write it.

But many folks would read it, I think.  And the entire indie community would get a kick out of seeing the real  story out there, rather than only reading about the mega- successes. It's a window that hasn't been opened yet.  I know you're not a super hero, and your self- deprecating humility is one of the many qualities that draw both readers and writers to you. But you are a voice in the self- publishing industry now; with voice comes both power and reach.

Just some thoughts to ruminate upon...

LM (who is waiting anxiously for the next book)


----------



## ElHawk

I agree with Gautreaux, Hugh.  People are far more likely to read it because you wrote it than they would be if most of the rest of us wrote it!  You're one of the indies who has managed to achieve name recognition with genre readers, and that is not something to be underestimated!  And anyway, the news industry is grinding to a major slowdown, or at least a loss of prestige, in the same way the traditional publishing industry is.  So phooey on the news reporters.  Blog it!  Or pitch the story to a major blogger who gets a ton of readers.  What about Salon?  McSweeney's?  Escapist Magazine?  They probably have more reach to active readers than the Washington Post has, and getting a story covered in one of those locations first could springboard the story into a larger news outlet.

I am planning to start a regular feature on one of my blogs soon called "Indie Wednesday," where I'll feature a story of an indie artist or craftsperson of some stripe or other (writer, musician, brewer, whatever) whose work I have personally sampled and enjoy mightily.  I am especially looking forward to featuring the many brewers I know, ha ha.  I wish more people would do this...take the time to really put the spotlight on people who are doing great things on their own.  The more such features become "a thing" in social media, the harder it would be for bigger media to ignore such features when they're pitched to them!


----------



## Dawnchapel

Hugh Howey said:


> My last recourse may be to write the story myself, which will mean almost no one reads the d*mn thing. And that would be a shame.


I would really like to read your report, whether you get a reporter to pick it up or put it on a blog or publish it on the kindle as an essay or just e-mail it out to interested parties. My interest, she is so piqued.


----------



## ElHawk

Yay, Glynn!  Keep up the good work!


----------



## Mike Dennis

For 2012 (not counting December -- I don't have the actual totaled figures yet), I averaged just over $1000/mo. spread over 9 titles. _*BUT*_ the monthlies are all over the place, from $225 to over $3000.

The big months were clearly tied to KDP Select post-free days, but I just ran a free-day promo after Christmas and sold a grand post-free total of 17 copies of the one book so far, after nearly 5000 downloads. This contrasts sharply with last Christmas when a free promo got me 15,000 downloads and 600 post-free sales of the one book. I'm not very optimistic about the future.

FWIW, all my titles but one are in the crime/noir genre, including 5 novels, two novelettes, a short story collection, and two individual short stories.


----------



## _Sheila_

I didn't do all that much with my writing this year.  (I spent a lot of time with my dad, my grandkids and family.)  

Having said that - I more than qualify for the group you describe.

I think that's what is so exciting about this industry.  I haven't really done a lot of (any) marketing.  I certainly didn't stress over writing this year - but I was able to bring in some money.  Would it pay my current bills?  No.  Have I lived on a lot less.  Yep! 

This year I'm going to put more effort into writing and social media.  My goal is to publish a couple more in my series (fluff) and to write something completely different (a 'real' mystery/thriller).  If it works, great.  If it doesn't, I can try something else.

I love that freedom.

Sheila


----------



## Ruth Harris

Hi Hugh,

I don't have any contacts at the NYT these days but why don't you pitch this extremely interesting story to either David Carr or Brian Stelter at the Times? Both are excellent writers & on top of all things media. If they're not interested, they might be able to pass you along to someone at the Times who would be.

David Carr writes Monday's Media Equation story & also the Times's Media Decoder blog.

Media Equation column: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/07/business/media/for-legacy-media-companies-a-lucrative-year.html?ref=business&_r=0

decoder blog: http://mediadecoder.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/04/new-york-observer-hits-reset-again-names-ken-kurson-new-editor/

Brian Stelter writes about the media/entertainment & tweets as @BrianStelter https://twitter.com/brianstelter

today's Stelter story: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/07/business/media/cable-channels-like-current-and-ovation-feeling-heat.html?ref=brianstelter

Another possibility would be the WSJ but I don't know who covers books/media/entertainment there. Also Bloomberg BusinessWeek is doing a good job these days.

You're on to something very interesting here. I can't believe no one will want to report it. But, then again, what do I know?


----------



## Hugh Howey

The nearest I've had to success thus far has been this interview, which just came out today. It's the last few lines. Hey, it's a start.

http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/books/inspiration-of-life-on-the-ocean-wave-20130112-2clzq.html


----------



## Nicole Ciacchella

What an awesome article. Your life experiences are really fascinating, Hugh! And thanks for working that bit in about how other authors are making a living. I'm excited to see authors like you getting so much publicity because it's such a great sign of the growing influence of indies.


----------



## Ruth Harris

Hugh, I just love love love this! Especially as I've spent lots of time in the Caribbean, sailed the Grenadines, & set the beginning of Brainwashed on a sailboat moored in Becquia!  And live in Manhattan & was at the dentist on 57th Street when the WTC was struck. Up here (East Side) the grocery stores were mobbed & the winds were blowing in such a way we could smell the fuel & the fire & the death. Strange, ominous day indeed.


----------



## JETaylor

Very nice article Hugh.  I also really like the new cover of Wool highlighted in the piece.


----------



## Fredster

If anyone is looking for authors who make enough from their writing every month to pay for a meal for two from Applebee's (not including tip or drinks), I'm available for interviews.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn

Hugh Howey said:


> The nearest I've had to success thus far has been this interview, which just came out today. It's the last few lines. Hey, it's a start.
> 
> http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/books/inspiration-of-life-on-the-ocean-wave-20130112-2clzq.html


Love the article! And I'm sure an article by you on, say, HuffPo, about the midlist indies would get some serious traction. And for all that I would LOVE for the "real story" to get out there, I'm also happy to have me and my friends happily earning a living with our words, quietly upending the industry while no one is looking. #rebel


----------



## Becca Mills

Hugh Howey said:


> I've had zero luck getting anyone interested in the story. The outpouring of PMs with personal and amazing stories warmed my heart, and I know they would have thrilled readers. My last recourse may be to write the story myself, which will mean almost no one reads the d*mn thing. And that would be a shame. The problem seems to me that the news-reporters are inured to what is news-worthy. Their nerves are numb. Readers would dig hearing this story. It gives far more hope than the story of outliers.


Maybe Huffington Post would be interested. People would read it, Hugh. Many people.


----------



## Cherise

Maybe it would be better if this story did not get out. There are already too many miners in the camp. Too many more, and the riots might start.


----------



## vrabinec

Cool article. It would be intersting to hear about some of the people you ferried off Manhattan. My sister was working down there back then, and she couldn't get out of there for two days.


----------



## ElHawk

Wow...GREAT article, Hugh, and after reading about how your experiences shaped Wool, I am going to add one more person to my list of people I keep pushing this book on. (My sister is at the top...she loves post-apocalyptic fiction and she's a professional fiber artist! _She loves wool!!_) My fiance definitely must read your book now. He's in the Coast Guard and it seems his experiences on the water have dramatically shaped everything about him. I think there is something a little spooky about boats...they _do things_ to people.


----------



## Hugh Howey

vrabinec said:


> Cool article. It would be intersting to hear about some of the people you ferried off Manhattan. My sister was working down there back then, and she couldn't get out of there for two days.


I would LOVE to get in touch with them somehow. One of those guys moved the flag on my boat to half-mast. This was 15-20 minutes after the second plane hit the south tower. I'm almost certain he was the first person to think to do this that day. He was looking across the stern of the boat, watching people jump or fall to their deaths, and couldn't handle seeing the flag fly like that. So he lowered it.

The flag was a little tattered (boat flags tend to get this way, especially boats that move swiftly), and so I bought a new one for the yacht and gave that one to my father. Just this Christmas, I put it in a frame for him (he kept it rolled up on a pole) and affixed a note on the back explaining what happened that day.

Would really be something to talk to that guy. Any of those people.


----------



## JRTomlin

Hugh Howey said:


> I've had zero luck getting anyone interested in the story. The outpouring of PMs with personal and amazing stories warmed my heart, and I know they would have thrilled readers. My last recourse may be to write the story myself, which will mean almost no one reads the d*mn thing. And that would be a shame. The problem seems to me that the news-reporters are inured to what is news-worthy. Their nerves are numb. Readers would dig hearing this story. It gives far more hope than the story of outliers.


Fascinating article, Hugh. And who knows? Maybe someone, somewhere will pick up on that snippet at the end. 

Thanks for sharing the link.


----------



## Hugh Howey

I hate you people. I'm working on this damn story.


----------



## Becca Mills

Hugh Howey said:


> I hate you people. I'm working on this d*mn story.


Cool.


----------



## Ruth Harris

> I hate you people. I'm working on this d*mn story.


Tough. Besides, you never know where your next great idea is coming from.


----------



## balaspa

I still wish I was a full time author.  I make a few hundred bucks a month, generally, and I wish I made enough to quit my day job.  I still daydream about it.


----------



## Alondo

balaspa said:


> I still wish I was a full time author. I make a few hundred bucks a month, generally, and I wish I made enough to quit my day job. I still daydream about it.


I make enough to write full time, but most of it is through amazon, and they are so mercurial in their policies I don't trust them not to pull out the rug from under me.


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## Cherise

Hugh Howey said:


> I hate you people. I'm working on this d*mn story.


Please make the point that even those of us making $1 a year from self publishing are making more than we would be by querying agents or collecting rejection letters from publishers.


----------



## Bruce Blake

Hugh, we haven't bumped into each other here on the boards much, but I'm impressed by the amount of work you are thinking about putting in to helping others...but I get the impression that is kind of what you (and many here) are all about.
My sales have reached that $500+ mark in the last few months. I left my full time job in Oct. to pursue writing, and other endeavours, full time and I'm writing frantically to keep it that way.
If I can do anything to help put a story like this together, I'd be more than happy to pitch in. I don't know any big time reporters here on the west coast of Canada, but I may be able to track someone down from the National Post, one of our national papers, if that helps.


----------



## lynnfromthesouth

I will probably be there in the next couple of months.


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## Gertie Kindle

I tweeted the article, Hugh. Very interesting and it's great that you got that last line in.


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## Susan Kaye Quinn

Hugh Howey said:


> I hate you people. I'm working on this d*mn story.


*fistpump*

Also, Hugh, you really need to write something about that 9-11 story. That's some powerful stuff.


----------



## Madeline

Hugh, getting the media involved is not quite as difficult as it may seem. You just have to find ONE person in a reputable organization (WSJ, CNN, MSNBC, etc.) and convince them to listen to your cause.  I've done this twice in my short lifetime and ended up on the national news both times.  And I am a dirt poor community social worker with absolutely NO media relations training.   

About 5 years ago, I had the idea to "boycott" Ebay after they hired a new CEO and their policies changed, to the point of being horrific for people trying to sell and make a living.  I was a seller at the time and basically had to quit because I could not wrap my business around their new idiotic policies.   I told some fellow sellers about my idea and they told me I was an idiot, that a "boycott" would not amount to anything, and that I was wasting my time because Ebay was so big and I was so small.  Two weeks later, they were emailing me back saying, "Holy crap, I take it back!  You are brilliant! I just saw you on the news!"

CNN Money was the outlet that first noticed me.  One CNN reporter heard me and published one article on my cause.  In less that two days, my phone was BLOWING UP.  The scary thing at the time is that I was living a quite simple little life, pretty much off the grid so to speak, and my phone number was unlisted (us therapist types tend to do that so that our clients can not look us up and call us up randomly).   In less than a week, I did phone interviews for over 55 national media organizations.  We are talking WSJ, CNN, MSNBC, FOX, NPR....once ONE of them bit (CNN)....they all start circling like vultures wanting a cut of the story.   It's the most AMAZING feeling when you want to get your story out and all the sudden you find that people WANT to hear your story and reporter after reporter is clamoring to talk to you.  (I can also imagine it to be quite miserable for those folks who DONT want their story out, but are experiencing the whirlwind anyway...but that's another topic entirely).   In any case, I then started gettings calls and emails from foreign news organizations in Germany, France, Spain, etc.   It was crazy trying to communicate with those folks, but we made due.  And if that weren't crazy enough, people were setting up interviews, sending limos to pick me up, doing make-up, hair...just for my little opinion on the giant of e-commerce...Ebay.  My family was calling me flipping out and saying, "Crap, I was getting ready for work and turned on the news AND YOU WERE BEING INTERVIEWED AGAIN!"   

One person CAN create a movement.  I did.   It's alot easier than it looks.  Just find ONE.  One reporter.  You have a big enough name...you can do that with no problem whatsoever.


----------



## Hugh Howey

Cherise Kelley said:


> Please make the point that even those of us making $1 a year from self publishing are making more than we would be by querying agents or collecting rejection letters from publishers.


Excellent point!


----------



## Patty Jansen

I've started making about $500 a month from my fiction. NONE of it on Amazon.


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## BrianKittrell

All channels combined, I could see as much as $8-10,000 from January 2013. It won't keep up (judging by the slight decline I'm seeing before January is out), but it was fun.  Most importantly, it will pay for all publishing expenses and all of my remaining personal debt.

Oh, well. On to the next series.


----------



## Emma Daniels

I have been making over $500 a month over all outlets from Dec 2011 till now. Some months were over $1,000 but it's slowed somewhat now due to all the algo changes etc. Still doing well through B and N and itunes.


----------



## hardnutt

Hugh,

I certainly qualify. And I'm earning a damn sight more than $500 a month. Quadruple that. And then some (sorry, maths isn't my strong suit. Of course, being a Brit, I think in Sterling, not Dollars). I'm actually earning a living as a writer for the first time in my life. Never did when I was with a publisher and I had 18 novels published with them. I've been writing for over thirty years and only in the last eighteen months have I been in this position.

Take a look at my blog (accessed via my website) to see what I've been able to buy during that time. And I forgot to mention LOADS of stuff I've spent my ill-gotten gains on! 
Geraldine Evans
Author of the humorous Rafferty & Llewellyn (15 in series) and Casey & Catt (2 in series) procedurals.
http://www.geraldineevans.com


----------



## MJWare

Sounds like you have _more than enough_ names. But if you are looking for a kidlit writer, I'm making $1k-2k a month writing kidlit exclusively.

I've almost saved the down-payment for a small cabin just outside of Tahoe--not sure how the wife will fell about that, though =-)


----------



## BrianKittrell

MJAWare said:


> Sounds like you have _more than enough_ names. But if you are looking for a kidlit writer, I'm making $1k-2k a month writing kidlit exclusively.
> 
> I've almost saved the down-payment for a small cabin just outside of Tahoe--not sure how the wife will fell about that, though =-)


Very nice. No small achievement in such a tough category.


----------



## MJWare

BrianKittrell said:


> Very nice. No small achievement in such a tough category.


Thanks Brian,

Of course there are some doing _a lot_ better than me, but I do consider myself a midlister. And I think I'm making more than most of my traditionally published kid-lit friends.


----------



## BrianKittrell

MJAWare said:


> Thanks Brian,
> 
> Of course there are some doing _a lot_ better than me, but I do consider myself a midlister. And I think I'm making more than most of my traditionally published kid-lit friends.


By the numbers, mid list or better. In consideration to genre, outlier.


----------



## SteenaHolmes

I make around $5000 a month on average. Not only did I quit my day job, I have paid off 80% of our household debt and took my family on our first 'real' vacation this past christmas. All thanks to self publishing! I made in total for 2012 over $200,000 from indie sales. I'm now doing the 'hybrid' thing thanks to all this, but I will never stop indie publishing.


----------



## Hugh Howey

SteenaHolmes said:


> I make around $5000 a month on average. Not only did I quit my day job, I have paid off 80% of our household debt and took my family on our first 'real' vacation this past christmas. All thanks to self publishing! I made in total for 2012 over $200,000 from indie sales. I'm now doing the 'hybrid' thing thanks to all this, but I will never stop indie publishing.


Awesome. Congrats! I love hearing stories like this.


----------



## Mark E. Cooper

I'm going full time in July as I'm being made redundant from a job I've held for 31 years. Book sales currently pay all my bills including the mortgage, but not enough for luxuries. The redundancy money will take the mortgage out of the equation, so sales will be more than enough for a beer or two  I write in three genres: sci-fi, fantasy, and paranormal with the sci-fi doing most of the work.

Edit: my spelling still sucks


----------



## cblewgolf

I must've missed this thread when I took a hiatus from KB for a few months.  Thanks everyone for sharing.  Amazing how well pretty much everyone is doing.  From $50/month to $20K, it's still $$ you most likely would not have had if not for self-pubbing.  I had a 5-figure year in 2012 but had 2 good Select runs in there.  Expecting slightly less this year although I'll have more titles out.


----------



## lewaters

I've made more than $500 a month since December and last month was the first month I've made over $1000 (thanks to a new release). This month is already off and running and a lot of the increase in sales is due to my Kobo sales taking off. I'm almost done with making my first audio so I can't wait to see how that adds to the pot. I never expected these kinds of sales, but I'd still keep on writing if they ever went back to a sale a day. I'm so happy I decided to self-publish.


----------



## Ruth Harris

Lauren, Congratulations! Thrilled to hear how well you are doing. How do you promote on Kobo? I've just begun to upload my books there & need some visibility. Thanks, Ruth


----------



## indieBRAG

All self-published authors have a few harsh realities to face.  First if readers don't like your book enough to tell someone else, it is never going to be a best seller and no amount of promoting will change that.  Secondly, are you writing to make money or because you love it?  If it is to make money, consider writing romance novels and lots of them. All of the self-published books currently on the NY Times bestseller list are Romances. You build a fan base by writing more of the same and putting them out pretty quickly to keep their interest in your books.  Thrillers and Paranormal books do pretty well also but Historic Fiction better be a work of love because they rarely generate an audience large enough to make you rich!  

We consider ourselves at indieBRAG to be "word-of-mouth".  We have reading teams decide if a book is that book which they would recommend to their best friend, and if so, we honor it with our B.R.A.G.Medallion.  Readers recognize that books with our medallion are books that are worth their time and money - even those that are not romances!


----------



## zzzzzzz

I've been making $1000 a month (+/- a few hundred) since July of last year. It's a little frustrating, actually, because I feel like I've plateaued.

As to why I write? It's my job. Gotta earn a living, right? Well, my job has me working for myself, doing something that I enjoy and have some talent for, and making enough to get by on. I'd actually been unemployed and couch surfing when I started back in Dec 2011, without any temp jobs or freelancing gigs in months.

Now? Well, I make enough to pay the rent and for my utilities and food, but I still feel like I'm a single bad month away from living in the street. I'll feel secure once I've managed to double my income.

Despite that insecurity, I still feel like a success story. I'm living entirely on my writing, a dream of mine since I was a kid.


----------



## TiffanyTurner

You know, I usually just measure success right now by selling books. Since I got W-2 forms and claimed royalties on my income tax, it's made everything official. My income is more around $200 annually than a month. But I'm happy to sell 10 books average monthly. Hopefully with the new book releasing, it will go up. 

I've said it before, I just don't write fast enough. My last book took 3 years, but at least it's ready to go. Not giving up the day job of teaching, but it does help to teach writing when you've written a book. My students get that perspective, and teaching pays the mortgage. But maybe some day, the pay off will grow.  It's not like they are going anywhere, and the third book release is going to help sell the other books in the series.  
Plus, children's books are a strange market, esp. for ebooks.


----------



## Robert Bidinotto

Hugh, I sent you a private email about statistical specifics. Bottom line for here: Yes, for more than a year, I've able to support myself and my wife as a full-time self-published writer -- and that's after only one novel. I expect I'll be supporting us even better when novel #2 is released later this year.


----------



## legion

What an amazing thread--thanks so much for sharing your stories all! Unbelievably inspiring.

I'm a bit of a newbie (sort of started in Nov '12 but haven't had movement until Feb) so I've yet to be in this $500+ crew, but I've got lots of releases lined up for the next few months and hope to get there (and beyond) sooner than later!


----------



## Kathy Clark Author

We've been heading in the right direction since uploading the first of 21 back list books 14 months ago. November and December saw three new [First ever indie published books] released [jail break or escaped was more like it]. $500 to $1500 a month it has its ups and downs. Making adjustments for example tonight we stopped Smashwords and everyone else after a two 1/2 month trial that proved there was more lost getting off KDP Select than staying on SW + Sony + BN + etc.. combined. Time to focus.

So we have two series going. CUL8R, our YA time travel mystery series gets book #2 in about 10 days. Titled BRB [Be Right Back for some people] and we're also beginning to write book #2 to the Denver After Dark suspense series.

We're within reach of being ahead of where we were being traditionally published. Lots of great reviews just need exposure.


----------



## dalya

indieBRAG said:


> All self-published authors have a few harsh realities to face. First if readers don't like your book enough to tell someone else, it is never going to be a best seller and no amount of promoting will change that. Secondly, are you writing to make money or because you love it? If it is to make money, consider writing romance novels and lots of them. All of the self-published books currently on the NY Times bestseller list are Romances. You build a fan base by writing more of the same and putting them out pretty quickly to keep their interest in your books. Thrillers and Paranormal books do pretty well also but Historic Fiction better be a work of love because they rarely generate an audience large enough to make you rich!
> 
> We consider ourselves at indieBRAG to be "word-of-mouth". We have reading teams decide if a book is that book which they would recommend to their best friend, and if so, we honor it with our B.R.A.G.Medallion. Readers recognize that books with our medallion are books that are worth their time and money - even those that are not romances!


+ 1 million points


----------



## ChrisWard

I'm not in any way a big gun but I sold 115 copies in January 2013 compared to 6 copies in January 2012 (my first month). In 2012 total I sold 415 copies and made $700. So far in 2013 I've sold 460 and already made more than last year. Including short stories I now have 26 items available on Kindle and hope to have 40 by the end of the year. I write and promote every day and while I have yet to have any single title gain traction I have a realistic goal to be writing as my full time job within seven years, or before I turn 40 (I'm 34). Even without a breakout hit I feel this is possible provided I keep producing high quality material.

Yes, the amount of work I've put in isn't currently worth it for the hourly rate (I estimate less than $1/hour), but I'm building a base for the future. I think too many writers except to get immediate success but there is definitely success available for the persistent.


----------



## Carolyn J. Rose Mystery Writer

My first goal is to connect with readers. My second is to pay for health insurance. Met both goals last year and beyond - more than $1000 a month.


----------



## Emily Kimelman

I too love this thread. Thanks Hugh!

My husband kept saying he didn't believe there was a middle ground in publishing, that either I was going to make buckets of money or none at all. He, being a good husband, thought the buckets would arrive at any moment  But he has been very pleased with the well over $500 I've been making the last 6 months. It let us spend our winter in India and we're putting a deposit down on a house in Costa Rica for next years freezing months. 

The way things are going all my dreams of what it would be like to be an author (traveling the world, writing fun books while having a wonderful and fulfilling life) are coming true. And I had basically given up on this dream because I didn't ever think I could get a good advance. Ha! Hahahaha!


----------



## Steverino

I just had my first $500 month in February. It was a one-off, after a promotion... but it happened!


----------



## Rick Gualtieri

Steverino said:


> I just had my first $500 month in February. It was a one-off, after a promotion... but it happened!


Congrats! Here's to hoping it's not a one-off


----------



## ChrisRachael

I've made around $10,000 off _Dining With The Doctor_, which puts me nicely into that middle ground. I'm not rich, but that's not pocket change.

I was recently offered $5000 for the book (with dubious odds of ever seeing royalties). I pointed out I've made about double that in four months. However, I like the idea of higher quality paper and better distribution, so I'd be happy to entertain a more realistic offer.

They countered that I was being unrealistic and greedy. Lots of authors are happy to make $5000 for their book. Heck, award winning authors regularly accept $5000, and this is not award winning material. Be realistic.

I agree. The realistic thing for me to do is continue indie publishing. If I want to give away the profit from my book sales, my charity of choice wouldn't be a traditional publishing company.


----------



## BiancaDArc

I quit my day job. I was a lawyer, working on Wall Street. I was making about $90k with bonuses. I make more than that now.

My journey has been a strange one. I started in 2006 when Samhain Publishing first opened their doors. I was one of the first authors they signed. I write somewhat erotic romance, but it's all in the sub-genres of sci fi, fantasy and paranormal, which (except for that last one) isn't a huge audience among romance readers. In 2009, I got a chance to write for Kensington Brava with the proviso that the books "be about zombies". Hmm. Well, I wrote them and I like them, but zombies are a hard sell to romance fans. I was dropped by Kensington, but frankly, I wasn't too upset about it.

I started self-pubbing space opera last year. It didn't sell as well as my small press published stuff, but I earned about $10k last year on it. There were three novellas - a labor of love, since I'm a huge fan of space opera. Then, the last week of December last year, I self-pub'd a paranormal romance and things started happening that I never expected.

Deciding to strike while the iron was still hot, last month I put out a sequel to that book. Results have been really fantastic! I've already earned at least $20k from my self-pub'd books this year and am on track to make anywhere from about $60k and up this year on self-pub - depending on how much material I can get out between now and December.

I still have a few books with small press and I think that crossover helps. It definitely fills out my earnings for the year and brings me well over 6 figures. I don't see myself as particularly successful when compared to some of my friends who've hit the NYTBS list with their small press books and are making a lot more than me. They are better known. I have a small, but nice following. I'm not a big name. I consider myself a happy mid-lister and practically nobody outside of romance ebook circles has ever heard of me. But I'm okay with that. The important thing is I'm making a living. More than that, actually.

For the past three years, I've made well over 6 figures and have not had to work in my previous profession. I'm a full-time writer.

The one major thing I could never put a value on is that when my Mom (who was also my law partner) was diagnosed with cancer in late 2009, I was able to drop everything and be with her 24/7 until her passing. I didn't have to "work" except to proofread things, which I could do at her side while she slept.

Those months with her... I can't calculate a value for them. They mean more to me than anything. And I know they meant a lot to her. And during the years of grief after I lost her, I was able to work at my own pace and slowly get back on the horse. I'm pretty much back now and I just don't think I would've been able to handle that terrible grief and working full time. Writing gave me freedom. And that is priceless.

I hope the takeaway from this is that you don't have to be famous to make a REALLY good living as a writer. Sure, we'd all love to write a runaway bestseller and make a fortune, but I'm proof that slow and steady also can win the race. Even if it won't make you famous. ;-)


----------



## teashopgirl

BiancaDArc said:


> I quit my day job. I was a lawyer, working on Wall Street. I was making about $90k with bonuses. I make more than that now.
> 
> My journey has been a strange one. I started in 2006 when Samhain Publishing first opened their doors. I was one of the first authors they signed. I write somewhat erotic romance, but it's all in the sub-genres of sci fi, fantasy and paranormal, which (except for that last one) isn't a huge audience among romance readers. In 2009, I got a chance to write for Kensington Brava with the proviso that the books "be about zombies". Hmm. Well, I wrote them and I like them, but zombies are a hard sell to romance fans. I was dropped by Kensington, but frankly, I wasn't too upset about it.
> 
> I started self-pubbing space opera last year. It didn't sell as well as my small press published stuff, but I earned about $10k last year on it. There were three novellas - a labor of love, since I'm a huge fan of space opera. Then, the last week of December last year, I self-pub'd a paranormal romance and things started happening that I never expected.
> 
> Deciding to strike while the iron was still hot, last month I put out a sequel to that book. Results have been really fantastic! I've already earned at least $20k from my self-pub'd books this year and am on track to make anywhere from about $60k and up this year on self-pub - depending on how much material I can get out between now and December.
> 
> I still have a few books with small press and I think that crossover helps. It definitely fills out my earnings for the year and brings me well over 6 figures. I don't see myself as particularly successful when compared to some of my friends who've hit the NYTBS list with their small press books and are making a lot more than me. They are better known. I have a small, but nice following. I'm not a big name. I consider myself a happy mid-lister and practically nobody outside of romance ebook circles has ever heard of me. But I'm okay with that. The important thing is I'm making a living. More than that, actually.
> 
> For the past three years, I've made well over 6 figures and have not had to work in my previous profession. I'm a full-time writer.
> 
> The one major thing I could never put a value on is that when my Mom (who was also my law partner) was diagnosed with cancer in late 2009, I was able to drop everything and be with her 24/7 until her passing. I didn't have to "work" except to proofread things, which I could do at her side while she slept.
> 
> Those months with her... I can't calculate a value for them. They mean more to me than anything. And I know they meant a lot to her. And during the years of grief after I lost her, I was able to work at my own pace and slowly get back on the horse. I'm pretty much back now and I just don't think I would've been able to handle that terrible grief and working full time. Writing gave me freedom. And that is priceless.
> 
> I hope the takeaway from this is that you don't have to be famous to make a REALLY good living as a writer. Sure, we'd all love to write a runaway bestseller and make a fortune, but I'm proof that slow and steady also can win the race. Even if it won't make you famous. ;-)


This is just beautifully said. Thank you so much for sharing your story.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn

BiancaDArc said:


> The one major thing I could never put a value on is that when my Mom (who was also my law partner) was diagnosed with cancer in late 2009, I was able to drop everything and be with her 24/7 until her passing. I didn't have to "work" except to proofread things, which I could do at her side while she slept.
> 
> Those months with her... I can't calculate a value for them. They mean more to me than anything. And I know they meant a lot to her. And during the years of grief after I lost her, I was able to work at my own pace and slowly get back on the horse. I'm pretty much back now and I just don't think I would've been able to handle that terrible grief and working full time. Writing gave me freedom. And that is priceless.
> 
> I hope the takeaway from this is that you don't have to be famous to make a REALLY good living as a writer. Sure, we'd all love to write a runaway bestseller and make a fortune, but I'm proof that slow and steady also can win the race. Even if it won't make you famous. ;-)


Your whole story is awesome, but the part about your mom... that's priceless stuff indeed. Thank you for reminding me why I love the flexibility my writing career gives me!


----------



## Hugh Howey

ChrisRachael said:


> I've made around $10,000 off _Dining With The Doctor_, which puts me nicely into that middle ground. I'm not rich, but that's not pocket change.
> 
> I was recently offered $5000 for the book (with dubious odds of ever seeing royalties). I pointed out I've made about double that in four months. However, I like the idea of higher quality paper and better distribution, so I'd be happy to entertain a more realistic offer.
> 
> They countered that I was being unrealistic and greedy. Lots of authors are happy to make $5000 for their book. Heck, award winning authors regularly accept $5000, and this is not award winning material. Be realistic.
> 
> I agree. The realistic thing for me to do is continue indie publishing. If I want to give away the profit from my book sales, my charity of choice wouldn't be a traditional publishing company.


This is precisely the sort of story that I suspect will become more common and needs to be told.


----------



## lewaters

Ruth Harris said:


> Lauren, Congratulations! Thrilled to hear how well you are doing. How do you promote on Kobo? I've just begun to upload my books there & need some visibility. Thanks, Ruth


Thanks, Ruth! I didn't have any sales on Kobo until I signed up for a free promotion from epubdeals.com (unfortunately not available anymore, don't know what happened there). My sales went through the roof immediately after and have stayed strong ever since then even though I'm not running any promotions specifically for Kobo. Not really sure how it keeps up since I definitely have to keep promoting to keep my Amazon sales up. I would search around for any good Kobo promo sites. That may help.


----------



## Gone 9/21/18

ChrisRachael said:


> If I want to give away the profit from my book sales, my charity of choice wouldn't be a traditional publishing company.


Love it.


----------



## wilsonharp

I'm in the $150 to $200 a month range now. Doing it full time as my job went away last June and I honestly would rather work for myself than work at a company again. 18 years behind a desk was enough, especially if I can build my own business i.e. writing and self-publishing. The rise has been slow but steady. I know that more books, then more books after that, and then even more books will be the method needed to grow my base of readers which in turn will raise my profile, which in turn will grow my base, which in turn will raise my profle.

Long term is my approach, and while I won't turn down a month where my sales explode into the thousands of dollars, I won't become discouraged if I end up with $200 at the end of April. It's $200 more that I would have made on my writing in "the old days". Weird to think that the old days was five years ago.


----------



## Amyshojai

Hugh Howey said:


> Are you paying some bills with your writing? Have you quit your day job altogether? I know this is happening, and I suspect the trend is growing, but we spend too much time paying attention to outliers to hear the real story behind indie publishing.


I quit my day job in 1992 when I got my second book contract (traditional)...and yep, I was stoopid. But it got better, and I had a hey-honey who supported me while I built a following, found a great agent, and sold/published a boatload of nonfiction books for some major bucks. Then publishing changed and not even the great agent could sell the books. So I limped along, watching books go out of print and up in smoke (and my retirement dreams with them). Those were the days I asked for and got rights back...but hadn't a clue what to do with them. I even quit writing and took a "real job" for about six months...when I discovered KDP.

So as an experiment, Kindle gave a ninth life to the Complete Kitten Care book in April 2010 (that was the first--and it's still my best seller). The others I've brought back as I can, partnered with Bob Mayer's Cool Gus Publishing for POD and other Ebook versions. Thus far, I've used income from these books to fund writer conference registrations and airfare, promotions, and even audio recording equipment (in another life I'm a VO professional) to publish audio versions with audible.com. The first audio book came out in December, three are now available, and sales to date have nearly paid for that investment.

What's more, having the control and independence--and the $500-$1000/month income--gave me the confidence to finally write and have published my debut fiction (again with Cool Gus) to great reviews with sequels planned. None of my writing expense has come out of household accounts in two years. And the past few months, there's even been funds left over.

Would I go back to traditionally pub'd work? Well the 5-figure advances were peachy-keen but I'm making more now _per book_ than ever before, and the books won't ever be "remaindered" again. Backlist titles and new ones keep on earning virtually forever, and I can update nonfiction instantly when new info comes down the pike--not wait 18 months and it's old news--or never get revisions past editorial at all. My nonfiction once again represents my retirement fund. And the fiction is the new career. What's not to love?


----------



## Rhynedahll

For more than a year, I have lived entirely on income from my books.

My sales tend to be of the feast or famine variety.  Some months I barely scrape in $1000 but I have also made more than $6000 in a single month.

No one would accuse me of maintaining what most would consider to be a middle-class lifestyle, but writing has allowed me to abandon outside work and stay at home to care for my youngest son, who is completely disabled.

On that basis, I consider myself to be a massive success.


----------



## Carol (was Dara)

I know I'm too late for the article but this thread has been encouraging for me, so I'm weighing in belatedly with current earnings. It's fun to see people's numbers changing from one month to the next.

December - $500
January - $1,000
February - $1,050
March - $2,500

April looks like it'll be even better than March but I don't want to speak too soon since it's early in the month. In early-mid 2012 my average monthly earnings were around $300, so I'm seeing definite growth. I'm another one just praying for sales to hold steady. I don't even think about climbing higher. A $1K per month average all year long would thrill me.


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## Victoria Champion

Dara England said:


> I know I'm too late for the article but this thread has been encouraging for me, so I'm weighing in belatedly with current earnings. It's fun to see people's numbers changing from one month to the next.
> 
> December - $500
> January - $1,000
> February - $1,050
> March - $2,500
> 
> April looks like it'll be even better than March but I don't want to speak too soon since it's early in the month. In early-mid 2012 my average monthly earnings were around $300, so I'm seeing definite growth. I'm another one just praying for sales to hold steady. I don't even think about climbing higher. A $1K per month average all year long would thrill me.


That's fantastic, Dara.


----------



## burke_KB

Dara England said:


> I know I'm too late for the article but this thread has been encouraging for me, so I'm weighing in belatedly with current earnings. It's fun to see people's numbers changing from one month to the next.
> 
> December - $500
> January - $1,000
> February - $1,050
> March - $2,500
> 
> April looks like it'll be even better than March but I don't want to speak too soon since it's early in the month. In early-mid 2012 my average monthly earnings were around $300, so I'm seeing definite growth. I'm another one just praying for sales to hold steady. I don't even think about climbing higher. A $1K per month average all year long would thrill me.


That is awesome, and you're covers rock.


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## hardnutt

I make way over the $6,000 a year. In fact, self-publishing has enabled me to write full-time. I make a far more decent living than I ever made with traditional publishing, even including what I earned from a full-time day job.

But I have a backlist of twenty published novels (all but two traditionally published) and, so far, since Autumn 2010, I 've managed to e-publish twelve of these, with a thirteenth brought out as an ebook by my ex-publisher. As you can imagine, I've been incredibly busy trying to get the rest of my backlist out (I own the rights to all but two of  these), so have had little time to write anything new.

My books are almost all police procedurals and I have two series.


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## Imogen Rose

I am making around $80,000 a year from it... enough to feed my shopping habit.


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## horse_girl

I made $24,000 in 2011 and $73,000 last year. This year is bringing in lower numbers than last but I would project at least $50,000 this year, even with a few new books. Things have slowed down, but I haven't seen a big drop in ratings on Amazon, so I'd guess the whole ebook market is settling. I write SFF.


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## Carol (was Dara)

Victoria Champion said:


> That's fantastic, Dara.





burke_KB said:


> That is awesome, and you're covers rock.


Thanks guys. I hire someone for my fantasy covers (illustrations) and do my own for all the other genres (photo manipulation).


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## Hugh Howey

horse_girl said:


> I made $24,000 in 2011 and $73,000 last year. This year is bringing in lower numbers than last but I would project at least $50,000 this year, even with a few new books. Things have slowed down, but I haven't seen a big drop in ratings on Amazon, so I'd guess the whole ebook market is settling. I write SFF.





Imogen Rose said:


> I am making around $80,000 a year from it... enough to feed my shopping habit.


 

Okay, wow. This is the story of self-publishing right here.


----------



## Zackery Arbela

Right now, I'm lucky if I clear 5 bucks a month...but I only have one book out at the moment. I write fantasy, kind of old school in feel. Never had the knack for romance. Still, I'm hopeful...working on the second book now, so we'll see...


----------



## Imogen Rose

Hugh Howey said:


> Okay, wow. This is the story of self-publishing right here.


Like David Hasselhoff, I am hot in Germany right now.


----------



## Lo/Roxie

I'm a longtime lurker stepping out to say I'm yet another author who is making a living because of self-publishing. I sold my first novella to Ellora's Cave (the erotic romance powerhouse) back in 2007 as a wide-eyed 22-year-old. I made okay money on that story (about the same as a Harlequin advance to a first-timer) but I just couldn't seem to break out. I did what most erotica and steamy romance writers did. I wrote smexy novellas and novels for the erotic romance heavy hitters (EC, Samhain, Siren) and short stories for Cleis and Seal and various magazines. I was lucky to clear $10-15K a year. Not bad money for a stay-at-home wife but not what I wanted from my career. The erotic romance market in NY contracted big time in 2008/2009/2010 so the option of NYC/Big 6 sort of vanished for most of us.

In 2009 we had our first kiddo who was promptly (and shockingly!) diagnosed with multiple severe heart defects. In the last three years, she's had 2 major heart surgeries and two smaller outpatient surgeries as well as monthly (now bi-annual) cardiology workups. Even with health insurance, the costs were...staggering. (At one point, we were paying $6K a month out-of-pocket for a specific medication   ) Needless to say, mama needed to make some money.

Luckily, the romance community is one of the most supportive and open communities of writers. At places like Romance Divas, I learned about the experiences my peers were having taking their careers into their own hands. I was intrigued but uncertain. I dipped my toes into the water with some erotic short stories. Then I was sent here by some of those same romance writers. I stumbled upon a thread started by TattooedWriter and realized that all those smutty shorts I had sitting around were perfect for that kind of experiment.

A couple of pen names later, I'm earning solid money. In the first 3 months of this year, I've earned more than in 2012--and 2012 was double what I brought home in 2011. I've cleared the medical debt and I'm paying for DH's college tuition and fees while he advances his degree. I've built relationships with my readers by controlling what I write (I had scads of new adult books that no publisher would touch because it was a no-man's land of a genre,) and how often I release stories.  I can also offer free reads connected to my books without having to worry about option/first rights or  compete clauses. My self-pubbed stories have actually caused my traditionally published books to sell much better. (My latest book with EC came out a week ago and is hovering in the low 700s at Amazon and is nearing the top of the bestseller list ARe--and that's all because I've cultivated a new readership with my self-pubbed works.)

So...anywho. I'm another writer with pen names that aren't big names or mega successes but I'm making a d*mn good living--and loving every single minute of it.


----------



## MeiLinMiranda

Threads like these, I never know whether to be inspired or depressed...


----------



## JDHallowell

MeiLinMiranda said:


> Threads like these, I never know whether to be inspired or depressed...


Be inspired. The month before my second book released and both books really took off, I think I sold five whole copies.


----------



## RedDust

This is really inspiring. If We sell one copy, it will be a success


----------



## Nicole Ciacchella

These stories are amazing. It's so powerful what being able to take your earnings and work into your own hands has done for some of the authors here. I'm incredibly moved by so many of the stories I read.

My success has been more modest so far. The Eye of the Beholder, the one book I thought was niche, would never get a contract from a publishing company, and of which I thought I'd sell maybe 100 copies, has done far, far better than I could have expected. I've had several $500 months, mainly due to that one book. I've been a little discouraged by how some of my other books have failed to launch, but it's been incredible to hear from readers and to realize how generous and thoughtful and wonderful so many of them are. The reason I wanted to write in the first place was for them, and I feel incredibly lucky that self-publishing has afforded me the means to reach out to those people who've been so enthusiastic about my work.

The income I've earned has enabled us to take a trip to Europe this year, where my husband will see his parents, brother, and other family members for the first time in three years. The fact that I was able to help us do this means more to me than anything. It also means I have the flexibility to be there for my kids and husband when they need me, something that wouldn't have been possible if I were still working for corporate America or as a teacher, as I've done in the past. I still can't quite process the fact that I'm living what's been my lifelong dream.


----------



## FAD_fC

Hi all, I've just read several of your messages and all sounds good. I am a new author, having just written my first book 'A guide to positive mental health'.. However I am so confused and feel I may have jumped in with both feet as I don't know what to do next. The book is with a publisher but I don't know if this is classed as self publishing? They just do the editing, nothing else. Where and how do I market the book etc? Can anyone help me understand all this please?


----------



## Victoria Champion

FAD_fC said:


> Hi all, I've just read several of your messages and all sounds good. I am a new author, having just written my first book 'A guide to positive mental health'.. However I am so confused and feel I may have jumped in with both feet as I don't know what to do next. The book is with a publisher but I don't know if this is classed as self publishing? They just do the editing, nothing else. Where and how do I market the book etc? Can anyone help me understand all this please?


Your manuscript is with a publisher or an editing service? If it's an actual publisher, then they will publish it for you. You need to ask your publisher exactly what they are doing with your manuscript. Also, just browse through this forum, you will find plenty of threads about every aspect of the writing/publishing business. Also use the search box in the top right.


----------



## KerryT2012

I published my books after they had not finished their second round of editing - I know very bad girl!
Therefore, made around $500 for the first month in March 2013 - and by the end of this week will have nearly made the same amount in April - i.e. a lot more by the end of the month!
So, I will see, but I am looking through this list very inspirational - I must admit, I was reading your story in the Daily Mail and I was intrigued i.e.Hugh Howey.- How many short stories were you releasing each month?


----------



## Bree Roberts

FAD_fC said:


> However I am so confused and feel I may have jumped in with both feet as I don't know what to do next. Where and how do I market the book etc? Can anyone help me understand all this please?


This website has lots of info:
http://www.thecreativepenn.com/publishing/


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## Zackery Arbela

The thing I'm sensing from a lot of these threads is that a lot of folks experiences some form of success after they put their second or third book out there. Which makes sense, since the more books you have out there, the more likely you are to catch someones attention. But were those books stand-alone novels or part of a series? Or does not matter either way?


----------



## KerryT2012

At first only novels, I found them disheartening. Due to the fact that you spend months writing something and then when it is released, you are on the only one that likes it.  Whereas with short stories, they are so easy to write, so either way, they give you a real indication of whether people would like them or not.  Some have said - Do research what people like? No matter how much research you do it does not matter, because you will only find out when you publish the book.


----------



## Victoria Champion

Zackery Arbela said:


> The thing I'm sensing from a lot of these threads is that a lot of folks experiences some form of success after they put their second or third book out there. Which makes sense, since the more books you have out there, the more likely you are to catch someones attention. But were those books stand-alone novels or part of a series? Or does not matter either way?


The key is to have a link to your mailing list in the back of your ebook so readers can opt-in to be notified of new releases. Also, have a link to your website. This way, a reader can immediately go look for other works by you and buy them. Through these methods, new releases sell the rest of the catalogue. The first book in a series will probably sell the rest of the series if the reader likes it a lot, which is why a lot of authors make the first book in a series free once the rest of the series is released.


----------



## JackDAlbrecht

I am proud to say that our first book was earning your initial figure. That hadn't yet paid for marketing, editing, formatting, and cover design until book two came out.

Now, we have made back everything we invested, in the month since it came out, and we are looking at a 3K profit this month. This is all from a pair of people who are full time students with full time jobs and full time parents. Naturally, we spend more money on marketing than some authors just to save time with our busy lives. Two months of profit after a year and a half of spending is nice! I don't know about my co-author, but I'm going to Vegas to celebrate!


----------



## komazawa

This is a cool thread!  I self-published at the very end of December 2012, with two books in the same series that had sat lingering on my computer for a couple of years, then slowly started making some sales and published book 3.  I didn't genuinely ever expect to sell much - it was just a bit of a hobby so I've done very little in the way of promotion, although I signed up with a virtual book tour company (my tour isn't due to start until May).  

Now, I'm less than three and a half months in, and every week my sales are increasing.  I think the last seven days I'm averaging around $550 a day.  It sounds strange but I'm absolutely terrified.  I know very well that it could all stop tomorrow, but that's more than I make in my day job.  I'm starting to wonder whether I should see about taking on less responsibility at work and maybe a step down so that I spend more time concentrating on writing.  I feel like I'm about to jump off a cliff!


----------



## FictionalWriter

I quit my day job to write full-time. I'm a single mother so there's no other income but what I make writing. I make more than $500 a month and I write romance (historical, new adult and contemporary).


----------



## Dee Ernst

I made 6 figures last year from Better Off Without Him.  I realize it as a mixture of luck and timing and a hot pink cover.  Yes, it was also a funny book. I can't imagine repeating that success, but I'm really hoping.


----------



## D.L. Shutter

Beverly

Your presentation looks great and so does your writing!



> I quit my day job to write full-time. I'm a single mother so there's no other income but what I make writing. I make more than $500 a month and I write romance (historical, new adult and contemporary).


If I still had my own office I think I'd print this with fancy paper and font and frame it. Very inspring.

All the best.


----------



## KerryT2012

komazawa said:


> This is a cool thread! I self-published at the very end of December 2012, with two books in the same series that had sat lingering on my computer for a couple of years, then slowly started making some sales and published book 3. I didn't genuinely ever expect to sell much - it was just a bit of a hobby so I've done very little in the way of promotion, although I signed up with a virtual book tour company (my tour isn't due to start until May).
> 
> Now, I'm less than three and a half months in, and every week my sales are increasing. I think the last seven days I'm averaging around $550 a day. It sounds strange but I'm absolutely terrified. I know very well that it could all stop tomorrow, but that's more than I make in my day job. I'm starting to wonder whether I should see about taking on less responsibility at work and maybe a step down so that I spend more time concentrating on writing. I feel like I'm about to jump off a cliff!


That is fantastic, keep writing, readers are loving what you write and you do it well!


----------



## StrokerChase

This would be me. I'm making enough to live on, around $1,500 to $2,000 a month from this and now I'm doing it full time. Been writing a year. It's been a wild ride and I can't wait to see where it takes me!


----------



## KerryT2012

Glynn James said:


> Hugh, I don't know if you are still gathering info for your article, but since my last post things have changed dramatically. By the end of Jan I calculated $2000, roughly the same in Feb.
> Then things went crazy O_O
> March earnings were $6000 !!!!
> And April looks to heading to roughly the same - maybe slightly more.
> 
> So, my point is, there may have already been a larger number of indie writers earning a living from this than people realise, but it's still happening, even when suggestions are that the market is becoming glutted.
> 
> Today I hit #20 in the top 100 horror author ranks on amazon.com (that changes a lot I know)
> It's all a bit surreal.
> 
> No publishers knocking on the doors yet, though!
> I'm not even sure what I'd say to them if they did.


Excellent, well done - my first thought when I read this is what did you do marketing wise. Did you change your strategy? Keywords? Categories etc.


----------



## KerryT2012

Glynn James said:


> (estimated figures below)
> 
> Zero marketing changes.
> 
> My co-author and I (for the Arisen Series) released a new book. Not a lot more than that, really.
> 
> I'll try to break down the last few months, just in case any of it helps.
> 
> The only marketing I do is a few posts in e-book forums (about a dozen posts) and also I keep a mailing list. That is pretty much it. I've done a few freebies runs, and the first Arisen book gained popularity from one of those. A freebie run when you have a sequel to sell is awesome for boosting your profile a bit, but the mailing list is the most effective thing to nurture, I think.
> 
> The first two Arisen titles had been selling very well at around 1000 copies each per month over 6 months ish (hence the $2000 per month - which my co-author was also getting). By the time we released book 3 both had sold roughly 7000 copies.
> 
> It turned out that a LOT of people were waiting for book 3. It sold 1000 in the first week and then another 1000 over the rest of the month. My other books have been bringing in roughly $1000 per month, so the $5000 on top of that is actually half of the amount the books have sold (since we split the co-authored Arisen series 50/50)
> 
> A couple of weeks after book 3 took off (to top 20 in horror) the first in the series suddenly started selling better, followed by a rise in the second book, and then the third book rose yet again. I can only presume that the more we sold, the more the books were exposed and the more people were curious, so they bought book one.
> 
> We plan to release book 4 mid-May. When you have a series selling well the best thing you can do - by far - is to release the next one in the series (oh, and make sure it's good!).
> (points at Mr. Howey as an example of that)
> 
> For basic marketing, I put a link to my mailing listed directly after the novel ends that basically says "Did you like this book? If you want to know when the next in the series is release please join"...etc. and I put links to sequels after that. Links, links and more links at the end of the book, without taking up pages and pages so that people don't get upset thinking that they still have a lot to read and find the book ends with a load of crap to follow. I disagree with extracts from other novels unless the book description specifically states it.





Glynn James said:


> (estimated figures below)
> 
> Zero marketing changes.
> 
> My co-author and I (for the Arisen Series) released a new book. Not a lot more than that, really.
> 
> I'll try to break down the last few months, just in case any of it helps.
> 
> The only marketing I do is a few posts in e-book forums (about a dozen posts) and also I keep a mailing list. That is pretty much it. I've done a few freebies runs, and the first Arisen book gained popularity from one of those. A freebie run when you have a sequel to sell is awesome for boosting your profile a bit, but the mailing list is the most effective thing to nurture, I think.
> 
> The first two Arisen titles had been selling very well at around 1000 copies each per month over 6 months ish (hence the $2000 per month - which my co-author was also getting). By the time we released book 3 both had sold roughly 7000 copies.
> 
> It turned out that a LOT of people were waiting for book 3. It sold 1000 in the first week and then another 1000 over the rest of the month. My other books have been bringing in roughly $1000 per month, so the $5000 on top of that is actually half of the amount the books have sold (since we split the co-authored Arisen series 50/50)
> 
> A couple of weeks after book 3 took off (to top 20 in horror) the first in the series suddenly started selling better, followed by a rise in the second book, and then the third book rose yet again. I can only presume that the more we sold, the more the books were exposed and the more people were curious, so they bought book one.
> 
> We plan to release book 4 mid-May. When you have a series selling well the best thing you can do - by far - is to release the next one in the series (oh, and make sure it's good!).
> (points at Mr. Howey as an example of that)
> 
> For basic marketing, I put a link to my mailing listed directly after the novel ends that basically says "Did you like this book? If you want to know when the next in the series is release please join"...etc. and I put links to sequels after that. Links, links and more links at the end of the book, without taking up pages and pages so that people don't get upset thinking that they still have a lot to read and find the book ends with a load of crap to follow. I disagree with extracts from other novels unless the book description specifically states it.


All good to know and thank you for the breakdown.
Congrats!


----------



## Sophrosyne

How did I miss this thread? 

I think journalists have no idea how many indies are making their living as indies. I started putting together a list, and it's HUGE.

Hugh, are you still gathering this info?


----------



## Septemberlynngray

My rank goes up and down depending on how hard I'm promoting. Some months I can buy a cup of coffee, lol. I think a lot of my problem is that I write shorter pieces and while there is a readership out there willing to buy novelettes, they are hard to find. I am, however, working on a novel and hope to be a midlister someday soon.


----------



## PatriceFitz

Just want to make sure that folks reading this who fall into the "make a living writing" category (which is obviously self-defined) are wanted over on the thread started just a couple of days ago by Sophrosyne.  I believe it's at about 140 names and growing fast.

Hugh had mentioned his informal survey here in several articles, but I didn't read the initial question so I didn't know I qualified.  Even last year (my first full year as an indie) I made about double the $6,000 threshhold he suggested as the cutoff -- so I guess I'm in!  Definitely on target to beat that by a mile this year.  I project about $25,000 in 2013 with the addition of my 6 short new sci-fi stories published April through July.  

And Hugh, thanks for asking the question!


----------



## Error404

Glynn James said:


> The only marketing I do is a few posts in e-book forums (about a dozen posts) and also I keep a mailing list.


Now I desperately want to know the names of those forums


----------



## EC Richard

So impressed with all the authors who can "quit their day job"! I can't wait until I'm part of y'all!


----------



## Guest

Long way from quitting the day job, but had my first four figure month in April, waiting anxiously to see if that trend will continue. It's definitely nice to have some extra income each month with our first baby on the way!


----------



## CraigInOregon

Hugh Howey said:


> I think these are the ones they WOULD want to write about! You don't give people hope by pointing at someone who won the lottery. You give them hope by showing them someone who just landed the job of their dreams. Think of all the people who wish they could have an artistic outlet that gave them a little back.


I'm not there, quite yet.

About a year ago, I had several months where I was averaging $200-$300 a month. Most of that was from my pen name's work, not my own. (Well, it's all my work, but... you know what I mean.)

Anyway, I stopped for a while to begin writing EyeCU, my next big work under my own name. I thought, ehh, 100,000 words, no big deal, six months at most.

It's been over a year and I'm still polishing it up.

So, the net result of "taking a year off" from publishing anything new has been that I've lost a lot of momentum and I'm down to earning between $60-$80 a month instead of $200-$300.

I'm hoping to correct course on that once I get EyeCU out the door, but that's the problem with running a pen name in a popular genre... if people get used to you pumping out a lot of stories in a short amount of time under that name... and then you stop completely to write something longer under your own name (or even a different pen name, I imagine), your better-selling pen name can lose momentum and popularity because they assume you just stopped.

I'm going to have to figure out a better strategy when I launch into my next long work under my own name; somehow, I have to keep my pen name alive and publishing during that time, in order to not lose momentum while working on other projects.


----------



## bellabentley

How's everyone doin' on this thread? I can happily say that I've been happily earning what I used to make as a full time nanny when I was 22 & worked 40 hours a week. It's an awesome feeling! I still have my day job- freelance writing which I love. Right now using the extra $$ to pay a huge tax bill, then save save save and and then hopefully pay off our mortgage before babies come! Then ill quit day job  <3


----------



## KevinH

I don't think I've been at this long enough to have a reliable track record (roughly 2 months), but I feel blessed to have sold over 1400 books last month - along with a couple of hundred borrows - so I'm well in excess of the $500 threshold. I'm praying that things only get better in the future.


----------



## KMatthew

I'm currently making about 3 times what I ever made at a day job. I crossed the $500/month mark a while ago. I'm hoping the success keeps on chugging. I shed the day job and absolutely love writing for a living. This is my dream. How many people can say they're successful at their dream career?


----------



## 56139

I got laid off in January and I'm happy to say I've replaced that salary plus some.


----------



## Music &amp; Mayhem

This is shaping up to be a whiz-bang month for me. July 22-28 I did a giveaway of ABSOLUTION, Book 1 in my Frank Renzi crime thriller series. Halfway thru August I'm still reaping the benefits. 450 sales and 85 borrows so far. I'm rushing to finish the final edits of Book 4 in the series, hope to publish it mid-September.


----------



## hardnutt

For the past several months, I've been earning £2,500, which is just under $4,000 a month. For a couple of heady months' last year, I earned around £4,000. I started thinking I was rich! Not a good idea. I'm much more circumspect in my spending habits now.

But, hey, isn't it great? Absolutely love it. After, God knows how many years and twenty books, I'm finally able to write full-time. How good is that?! But it took going indie to do it. If I'd stuck with traditional publishers, I'd still be temping.
Geraldine


----------



## Marco Siena

Hi everybody. Let me introduce myself. My name is Marco (of course... ) and I'm a italian author. The next week I'll publish my first indipendent novel, after almost 4 years with a Publish House.
I'm here after I've found this forum, for talk about indipendent/self publish. 
This place is amazing!


----------



## Carolyn J. Rose Mystery Writer

I average more than $500/month - sometimes way more, sometimes just a little more - but it's all good, it's all gravy. Love being my own boss.


----------



## AngryGames

I'm about to find out all about this when I release two novels within a week or two of each other...the first 'books' I'm actually serious about charging money for.


----------



## Sapphire

Marco Siena said:


> Hi everybody. Let me introduce myself. My name is Marco (of course... ) and I'm a italian author. The next week I'll publish my first indipendent novel, after almost 4 years with a Publish House.
> I'm here after I've found this forum, for talk about indipendent/self publish.
> This place is amazing!


Welcome, Marco. Do you write in Italian?


----------



## Marco Siena

Thank you Sapphire!
Yes, I write in italian. Some weeks ago I start a Indiegogo Campaign to fund the translation of my new novel. I'm crossing the fingers


----------



## sarahdalton

I quit my job last week! Scared but excited for the future


----------



## alidawinter

Wow. As someone completely new to this, it's great to hear how others are doing. I've been trying to gauge what realistic expectations might be for the coming year. Thanks for this thread and all the people willing to share how things are going with earnings.


----------



## Marco Siena

sarahdalton said:


> I quit my job last week! Scared but excited for the future


My best wishes!


----------



## Lydniz

Glynn James said:


> You get roughly x6 the amount if you price at $2.99, and though it can affect your sales rank it doesn't always.


Yes, Dean, I'd definitely try putting your price up. You've got loads of good reviews and I reckon people would pay the $2.99. You can always drop it again if your rankings plummet.


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Did this story ever get written, Hugh?

I am just about to become a blogger for Huff Po (I'm awaiting my login while I type this!), I'd be happy to write about this.  I think it makes a great story and will be an interesting read for loads of people who still assume self-publsihers are sitting on piles of books in their garage which no one buys.


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Ah, I've just seen your fairly recent Huff Po piece: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hugh-howey/self-publish_b_3920534.html

All good points!


----------



## Ardin

When I first read this post I was no where near the $6,000.
Now, thanks to the good people on KBoards, I am!


----------



## Hugh Howey

Sarah Stimson said:


> Did this story ever get written, Hugh?
> 
> I am just about to become a blogger for Huff Po (I'm awaiting my login while I type this!), I'd be happy to write about this. I think it makes a great story and will be an interesting read for loads of people who still assume self-publsihers are sitting on piles of books in their garage which no one buys.


Yeah, I wrote a piece for Salon because of this thread.

http://www.salon.com/2013/04/04/hugh_howey_self_publishing_is_the_future_and_great_for_writers/

The story could use a refresh, though. I know of two different film crews working on a documentary about self-publishing. We need to keep hammering the point about mid-list SP authors who are paying some or all of their bills from their writing. It's a great story.


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Great piece.

I'm UK based.  I wonder if it's worth writing something on self-publishing that's UK focused. 

Off to hunt the internet to see what has already been written.


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Thanks Dean.

Huff Po have given me style guidance and in that it says 500 - 800 words per piece, which is actually not very many words, but may be enough to get the point across.  I'll have a think about this tonight when I have my "blogging head" on, rather than my "trying to stop my 18 month old from sticking his fingers in the plug points" head on.


----------



## sarahdalton

Sarah Stimson said:


> Great piece.
> 
> I'm UK based. I wonder if it's worth writing something on self-publishing that's UK focused.
> 
> Off to hunt the internet to see what has already been written.


I'd love to see something UK based. I think self-publishing needs some repping over here.


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Dean and Sarah - I am going to PM you both shortly.

I would also be interested in hearing from any UK based authors who either still work in anther job, but make enough £ from their book sales to pay a few bills, but not quite enough to live off full time AND/OR authors who have been able to give up their jobs and now writing is their only income.


I'm thinking this piece will be along the lines of "you hear about the huge successes and you assume everyone else is flopping, but there are thousands of writers quietly succeeding and making reasonable amounts of money/enough to live on and they are the true success stories of self-publishing:.... or something along those lines.

Probably not to be published until mid-December so there is plenty of time to pull something together.  I have another blog to go on Huff Po the first week of Dec (not about self-publsihing, about the importance of being a nice person if you want to get a job), then I think this will be piece number two a couple of weeks later.


----------



## 28612

Sorry I'm no help to you, Sarah ...

But can say, with October wrapping up, meaning I know what Dec. payments will be, and so have a fairly good idea of 2013's gross, my indie books will earn at more than 4x my ~best~ year in traditional publishing (24 titles in 17 years) and more than 6.5x my median in trad.


----------



## Amanda Brice

Hugh Howey said:


> I know of two different film crews working on a documentary about self-publishing. We need to keep hammering the point about mid-list SP authors who are paying some or all of their bills from their writing. It's a great story.


Thanks again for including me in the Salon article, Hugh. As a result, I've been contacted by at least one of the film crews you referred to and will be interviewed for a self-pub documentary. I'm excited!


----------



## 48306

Let us know if you refresh the story, Hugh. There are great stories out there. People are making a true living in self pubbing. It's been wonderful to make more than I did writing for small presses or for a NY pub, and even better than my prior job as a financial analyst. Back when I finally sold to NY (ahh, that golden ring!) my husband was floored when he learned the publisher got 80%+ of the income. He couldn't understand how the "product maker" was the one getting the smallest percentage of the "cut". Would I sell to NY again? If the right deal came along (I definitely think a Hybrid author has the best of both worlds), but for now, it's wonderful and freeing to finally be earning what I _should've been_ all along.


----------



## Susan Kaye Quinn

Hugh Howey said:


> Yeah, I wrote a piece for Salon because of this thread.
> 
> http://www.salon.com/2013/04/04/hugh_howey_self_publishing_is_the_future_and_great_for_writers/
> 
> The story could use a refresh, though. I know of two different film crews working on a documentary about self-publishing. We need to keep hammering the point about mid-list SP authors who are paying some or all of their bills from their writing. It's a great story.


+1

ETA: Congrats Amanda! Make sure to let us know when those come out!


----------



## Nell Gavin

I made around $30,000 in my best year. This was just before Amazon forced authors off its forums. I was having a ball, interacting with readers and other authors, some of whom are still my friends on Facebook. That really helped sales. I guess the whole "death to authors" movement on the Amazon forums kind of made me withdraw, so I stopped all promotion, with a few exceptions.

Anyway, I no longer make that kind of money and may never again, but one great thing it forced me to do was become an LLC for tax purposes. Taxes that year were brutal before the LLC. That would be my recommendation to any US author: Become an LLC.


----------



## David McAfee

Very, very late to the party, but I just found this thread today. I quit my day job in April 2011. Since then, my only source of income has been my writing, which has thus far exceeded the minimum of $500 a month (to be eligible for this thread) every month since May 2010.


----------



## hardnutt

Sarah Stimson said:


> Dean and Sarah - I am going to PM you both shortly.
> 
> I would also be interested in hearing from any UK based authors who either still work in anther job, but make enough £ from their book sales to pay a few bills, but not quite enough to live off full time AND/OR authors who have been able to give up their jobs and now writing is their only income.


Hi Sarah,

I'm a UK author and I've been working as a full-time author for getting on for two years now. I get down on my knees and thank God for Amazon every night.


----------



## Sarah Stimson

hardnutt said:


> Hi Sarah,
> 
> I'm a UK author and I've been working as a full-time author for getting on for two years now. I get down on my knees and thank God for Amazon every night.


Hurrah! Can you pm me your email address please?


----------



## Tony Bertauski

Writing started out as a hobby. As luck would have it, I learned the craft about the time indie publishing took hold. The fact that I'm making ANY money feels more like a fantasy. Nonetheless, I'll probably make $8,000 from writing fiction this year. That's a hell of lot cheaper than golfing. Interestingly, though, I doubt I'll ever make the move to FT writing. Despite the fact that I love my day job, I don't think I'll be any more productive since I'm a slow writer. Besides, it would become a job-job instead of a hobby that makes dollar bills.


----------



## Joseph Turkot

Just had my best month for income at just shy of $500. All I can say is the fact that you can pay some bills with writing makes you want to write all the more, even though like Hugh says, most of us would be doing this anyway, even if we made nothing. Now there's just a real avenue through which we can see our dreams materialize incrementally, as opposed to in a void we feel alone in (aka queries and submissions). I was writing my books long before I realized I could started self-publishing. What it's done is make me much more dedicated and committed to writing, revising and editing, all things the craft of writing. I love words. Love them...


----------



## Marco Siena

My first month: around 80 €.
It's a good result for Italy. Now I'm waiting for translate my novel in english (I've contact somebody who translate it), and I hope will be better in worldwide store.
Here in Italy, just 1 on 100 reads books...


----------



## 74439

Just to add another data point.  I'm writing in SFF.

In the last 15 months, I have published my first 3 novels, 5 stories, and a story collection in my first Fantasy series, The Hounds of Annwn.  Book 4 will be out soon.  I'm earning just barely $500/mo, but then I'm just starting and discoverability is an issue.  My reviews are quite good, so I expect it's just a matter of time.  Minimum goal is 3 novels (and a few short works) per year, 4 if possible.  Overall cashflow is still negative (covers, audiobook, startup) but should turn positive in 2014.  Without investing in audio, my novels generate positive contribution margin in just a few months.  If audio is successful (only book 1 is out) then I will invest in that for all novels.  I am starting a second Fantasy series in 2014.

I do everything myself except the cover paintings (I do cover design) and the audio studio (I'm narrating my own work).  I have worldwide distribution via ebookpartnership and LSI.  My background is Software & IT Consulting (building & running small companies, ex-programmer) and creative (semi-pro photographer, amateur musician).

I intend to live on this entirely in five years -- I define that as more than $6000/mo.

Author: Karen Myers.  Publisher (indie): Perkunas Press.


----------



## Paul Wornham

I made enough money from my first book to justify the cost of professional editing and a custom cover for my second.

What I make from writing is not a living wage, but I get checks from Amazon and CreateSpace regularly and I'm still amazed anyone would pay to read the words I wrote. So any cash that goes in the bank is gravy. I'm going to keep going, the more titles out there, the better chance I'll increase my earnings from writing.


----------



## Redacted1111

I had my first $100 in November last year. That shot up from $50 the month before. I now have permafrees in order and have two completed serials. Oddly, the first does much better than the second. My overhead is extremely low, and I plan to keep it that way for now. My sister who is an English professor has agreed to help with the editing for my future books. I do my own covers, which I feel are proficient for now. In the next twelve months, I plan to be making a living from my writing. Since I'm a housewife, "making a living" equals 2-5 grand a month. I write fast and with dedication. I have a writing degree and I'm always learning. I can't go a month without reading a craft book. I'm obsessed with writer's blogs and forums. I also plan to look more closely at the most popular book in my genre and emulate what is popular. My first two serials in paranormal romance were just what I felt like writing. While everything I have written sells, in all genres under all pen names, I think I could sell much better if I gave the audience exactly what they wanted. I've also learned the kind of voice that works best for me. Trying write in a voice that wasn't "me" was slightly disastrous.


----------



## TimWLong

After 5 years I am getting close to writing full time. Honestly, I've spent a lot of time studying what successful authors in my genre do and a lot of that study was done while lurking on Kboards. I write for a publisher but over the last 6 months I've embraced self-publishing and delivered a couple of books. I also dumped my agent who was doing nothing for my career. I've seen my income rise pretty steadily to last month when I made (to me) a staggering $5,000 from my books. This has NOT been the norm for me, not by a long shot. My biggest month to date, prior to last month, was about $1,000. 

If I can keep this up I hope to quit working in a year. I will need to have at least 6 months pay banked before I leave my job.

Edit: Meant to add this. I wish I'd been making $500 a month for all of last year. My average had been in the low hundreds.


----------



## Keith Soares

I'm a total noob here. 2 novellas out, working on a third to complete the series. My income is negligible, certainly less than I have spent in various costs, especially my time. But I realize I am building something.

I, like many, seek to emulate Hugh Howey, but I have to say this thread is an eye opener. Seems like there are a lot of folks making decent money. Not career money, maybe, but a good amount.

I come from a world of programming - websites, games, apps - and from that I know that a small product can produce decent income over time. I am particularly excited about writing because the PARAMETERS DON'T CHANGE. Wow. What a relief. In programming, one language goes, another comes, new frameworks pop up, servers get old and die, etc. In writing, it's just words. And those words last forever. I don't mind reformatting my work for some new e-book format. I am just excited I don't have to reinvent it each time, like I do in my normal work life. 

Very excited to see how many people are out there making it work! Best of luck continuing that trend, everyone!
K.


----------



## Alex Jace

I earn around $500 in royalties most months. This month has been a real surprise and I'm hoping I might crack $1000. But the delay in payment is a killer for me - my highest-selling retailer pays quarterly, so the royalties I'm accruing this month won't be paid until some time in May. It's only pocket money until I can make a steady monthly cheque. Fortunately I enjoy my day job.


----------



## RJ Kennett

Hugh Howey said:


> I think these are the ones they WOULD want to write about! You don't give people hope by pointing at someone who won the lottery. You give them hope by showing them someone who just landed the job of their dreams. Think of all the people who wish they could have an artistic outlet that gave them a little back.


Where's the "like" button?

I've made as much as $900 in a month and as little as $50 on one title. Valuable in supplementing a day job in retail, for which health insurance is the big compensation, not money. It makes enough to keep on as a fun hobby that generates a little money, and maybe, one day, I'll grow up to be D.J. Molles. Or that Hugh-something-or-other guy.


----------



## Jason Halstead

I'm late to this post (by a year and a half), but I also have spent most of my time writing and working, as opposed to wandering around the web or looking into things like KBoards (although I dabbled a while back, I lost interest quick).

Anyhow, in 2013 I made over $70k from writing. Livable income if it weren't for all the bills amassed from school and life and having a family of four. So I've got a dayjob too. I just released book #45 this week and I'm almost finished with #46. I've been average a novel a month for at last a year and a half now (I did two during last November to spite the NaNoWriMo).

I'd LOVE writing to be the one and only job, but it's not there yet. Everytime I get a break and one of my sci fi books hits it big and climbs up the charts it gets downrated by a bunch of rather obvious and skillfully hidden "accounts" that knock it out of the running. Even when Amazon removes the reviews it's too late - the damage has been done and the momentum lost.

Since I'm running out of ideas on things to try aside from the ever faithful "write more books", I'm coming here and poking around in hopes of finding an epiphany that snaps everything in place.


----------



## moirakatson

Also late to the party. However...

I made about $6000-$7000 last year, which was very much a surprise. On the assumption that I was not well-known enough to have my name remembered for future launches, I decided to release my last trilogy all at once. It took off surprisingly well, and I am probably going to try staggered (but close) launches for the next three, mid this year!

I would _love_ for writing to become my full-time job, but I keep reminding myself how lucky I am that I have the free time to write at all!


----------



## Rachel Aukes

I started writing thinking traditional publishing was the only way to be considered a pro. My sales numbers are a clear example of what I learned the hard way: 
2011: $144 (1 book published with a small house)
2012: $300 (2 additional books published with small houses)
2013: $11k (I gave self-publishing a shot, and released a title in August)

Self-publishing is a valid and viable means to success. 'Nuff said.


----------



## Hugh Howey

rachelaukes said:


> I started writing thinking traditional publishing was the only way to be considered a pro. My sales numbers are a clear example of what I learned the hard way:
> 2011: $144 (1 book published with a small house)
> 2012: $300 (2 additional books published with small houses)
> 2013: $11k (I tried self-publishing a shot, and released a title in August)
> 
> Self-publishing is a valid and viable means to success. 'Nuff said.


This is far, far more common than anyone thinks. This is the story of self-publishing.


----------



## Michael Kingswood

rachelaukes said:


> I started writing thinking traditional publishing was the only way to be considered a pro. My sales numbers are a clear example of what I learned the hard way:
> 2011: $144 (1 book published with a small house)
> 2012: $300 (2 additional books published with small houses)
> 2013: $11k (I tried self-publishing a shot, and released a title in August)
> 
> Self-publishing is a valid and viable means to success. 'Nuff said.


That's almost me, except mine goes like this:

2011 - $127.66
2012 - $182.86
2013 - $394.37

Going in the right direction!  Already made $35.47 so far this year, so looks like that total is going to continue to climb.  It's great fun.


----------



## redacted

I just published my first book mid-December 2013 and with a few days left before my first full month of self-publishing, I expect to have made enough to recoup the $2,500 I paid for a professional cover, two editors, and formatter. I started this fully expecting to lose a lot of money in the first few months as I establish myself and my series, but the fact that I'll recoup the $2,500 I spent on the first book in ONE MONTH has me flabbergasted. Whatever happens with the first book from now on is pure gravy. I don't know if this will continue when I release book 2 later this month and book 3 in a few months, but I'm loving the ride.


----------



## pauldude000

I PM'ed you Hugh.


----------



## trublue

I am late to this but I love this thread. I will pm you but was able to help mom buy her first house !


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Every time I see this thread I feel guilty that I haven't written the promised Huff Po piece yet.  I will, I just haven't got round to it.


----------



## Shalini Boland

Sarah Stimson said:


> Every time I see this thread I feel guilty that I haven't written the promised Huff Po piece yet. I will, I just haven't got round to it.


Looking forward to it, Sarah. But with a baby and a freshly-released book, you're totally forgiven


----------



## Sarah Stimson

Thanks! I owe a guest blog post to someone too.

I should stop hanging around on here and go write them.


----------



## Hanson

I've been lurking around for months but this thread finally pushed me over the edge to join. 

This place is full of gems!


----------



## Moist_Tissue

I would love to earn $500 a month. My goal is to earn enough to pay for kick-butt vacations for my mom and me then my dad and me.


----------



## Marco Siena

I really love this place, make feel better and give me strenght to carry on, although here in my country there's not enough audience for reach good number of selling and money too.

I would say thank you all for inspiring me everyday!


----------



## lazarusInfinity

Unfortunately, I haven't generated enough sales to get that first royalty check yet.  Still being new to this, I've already put out a novel while getting ready to release the second shortly.  Currently learning a lot about marketing/utilizing social media and paid advertising, so we'll see.


----------



## AbbyC

I suspect I will never even earn $500 a month since I write what I write and it doesn't seem it doesn't seem to fit a genre and I doubt I could stretch it into a series.

Is there a journalist interested in that? Probably not. But I don't care. Fame and $$ is not why I write. I write to help others. Every email I get thanking me for my stories is worth more than gold.

Thus I am content.

Thanks for shining some light on the unsung heroes Hugh.

Abby


----------



## RichardWolanski

I don't make much a month, but I just started doing this seriously. So, I'm hopeful and learning. 

I'd be happy to write a check to pay off all of my student loans. Oooh boy, if I could make a living at this? I would be living my dream. I'm treading now, but I'll be Phelps in a 200 meter freestyle within good time.


----------



## Carolyn J. Rose Mystery Writer

Last year my average was about $800 a month. The year before it was significantly higher. Who knows what this year will bring? 
But it pays the medical insurance and puts money in the kitty for vacations.


----------



## mrain4th

Hi, Hugh,  I didn't reply to this post earlier because it was pretty old and I figured old news.  But today I read your author earnings report so I figured you are still looking for data.  So, here's mine:
I published a small 'self-help' type of book in January 2012.  By April it was earning $300/month.  Since about October of 2012 it has earned an average of $500 monthly.  I don't advertise, market, promote or otherwise work to sell this book.  Most of my buyers are from the US, some from the UK and Canada, and an occasional sale in another country.  Thanks for all of the work you put into this on behalf of us all.  You rock!


----------



## Joebruno999

I have 17 books exclusively on Amazon KDP. They mostly sell for 99 cents. In early 2013, I was averaging $400 a month, but after I published "****** Bulger - The Biggest Rat," combined with a Six Volume set of my 99 cents books, that almost doubled ($770) in October and September. With the Christmas holidays, I went to over $1000 in December and to over $1100 in January.  I expect to go back to around $750 a month until the next Christmas Holidays. 

About $150 a month comes from borrows from Amazon Prime customers.

I can buy a lot of Chivas and Remy Martin on $750 a month


----------



## KeyBoardMine

I am! I published my second book in Dystopian. I never dreamed it would do so well. I only hoped to make back the expense of the cover and edits. I am definitely making more than $500 a month; actually many times more. My husband is thrilled. I'm working on the sequel right now and just can't get it out fast enough. This was a new career for me. I've been a stay-home mom for 22 years and always put off writing as a frivolous activity that I liked to engage in. Kids started to go off to college and now with this, I have the time to invest in my hobby and I'm making money to help send them to school too. Who knew?


----------



## Wanted Hero

I wish I could add a great success story as to financial gain, but I can't yet. However, I wanted to add some of my information if it can help (or encourage) others.

Started back in 2005 and made some good money for a couple years making my comic books self-publishing. Sole money earner and I had 8 kids at the time. It didn't last more than 14 months, when a car accident ended my drawing career. In 2010 my wife and oldest daughter told me to write the story in novel form. Even when we ended up homeless (literally, with 10 children and an aged father-in-law) my wife and children pushed and encouraged me to keep going! All my teens and I took every job available, we're now in a house and I get up at 3am every day to write until noon--then go to "work" to put food on the table.

I'm still at it and have sold hundreds of books, both eBook and print, but the money isn't consistent yet. Good reviews, 4.5 stars average on Goodreads (now owned by Amazon, correct?), but this hasn't worked out like the comic book industry--which I understood a bit better. So I keep going, writing and something in me says it's not a matter of 'if', but 'when' it will break. It did with the comic books and this is the same story, but better. Hope that helps the research here. I don't mind being a guinea pig--it's life as usual.

*Interesting Point:* I am starting to make money with games based ON my books. Fans have contacted me and asked permission to create games based on the story lines. In both cases I worked with them, themed it and did all the artwork. I was given all copyrights. Both have been released this month, plus I created my first game (solo) based on my second book. So three games already selling this year. Should be interesting.


----------



## Sapphire

To Wanted Hero:
I am in awe of your family after reading your post here. I agree 100% with your positive statement. It's not *if*, it's *when*! I hope it's very soon for you.


----------



## Wanted Hero

To Sapphire:
Thank you for your kind words. I am very blessed in the conviction and support/encouragement of my family. We have faced a great deal of trials and hardships together and have grown stronger and closer because of it. My hopes and desires are firmly fixed on making sure sacrifices made by them are not done so in vain.

There is something I try to remember daily and tell them when the walls seem a bit too close:

_We cannot guarantee our success in this. What we *can* do is remain consistent and diligent in our efforts, ever-increasing our chances *of* success. _

BTW, I have *11 children*. _Love_ saying that. 11 bright, brilliant, glorious children (and now grand-babies too ).


----------



## JamesOsiris

I'm only just starting out in self-publishing land (4 copies in 3 days since it was published!), but everyone's contribution here has been immensely inspiring. Thanks for sharing your info!

Now, to get cracking on that second book...


----------



## BlueGen

This is my first post here. I'm pleased to announce that I make a lot more than $500 a month. It's usually more than ten times that amount. However, I languished around the $1000/month mark for years before making it big with my latest two books. I'm still a bit flabbergasted by the success they have had.

I've self-published 5 books under different pen names. I have one book which sells barely ten copies a month, while another sells thousands. If I had written that poorly-performing book first, I may well have given up altogether! I think the point is never to give up - just keep on writing. Because you never know whether your next book could be the big seller which changes your financial life. That's the way it was for me  

I can't see myself ever wanting a traditional publishing contract.


----------



## thomaskcarpenter

I guess I never saw this thread the first time around.  

Right now I'm making an average of $800 a month (fluctuating between $500-1000) not including short fiction sales (since those are one time events).  Last year I only made an average of $200 a month, and the year before that only $150.  I'm expecting to push into the $1200 a month by the beginning of next year and continuing to grow from there.


----------



## Whiskey_Tango

Hi! I'm brand new here, and today is my two-year publishing anniversary. I ran the numbers yesterday and thought I would chime in:

Year one - exclusively erotica - $18,000
Year two - erotica and romance - $56,000

I don't have any big best sellers, but I do have a very steady output.

(And I love all the cool stories in this thread!)


----------



## jrlallo

I'm closing in on five years since I started self-publishing. Ever since May of 2011 I've been making more from the books than the day job. Working and writing has enabled me to bank enough money to put the down payment on a house, and I recently turned down a $20,000+ a year raise because the additional hours associated would have forced me to sideline my writing. Even now, in the midst of the biggest earnings slump since I first started getting traction, I'm set to make about as much this year as they were offering me with the raise. I'm currently working out the logistics of finally quitting my day job and giving full-time writing a go. (Hence my recent activity on KBoards and my discovery of this less than recent topic.)


----------



## C. Gockel

I just was reading a post about self-publishing getting tougher. I'm not finding that to be so. This month I did hardly any advertising and my permafree continued to be downloaded, and my sales--even with the KU slump--have been good (not HM Ward good, but for a series about Loki written in third person present tense that isn't a romance, or a swashbuckling epic--good). I don't make enough to quit my day job, but I make enough to drastically reduce my hours.

I'm very excited to see where I will be in a few years time.


----------



## Adrian P

Bilinda Ní Siodacaín said:


> Making far and above the $500 a month and I've given up my job to do this full time, but my success is far too new to gauge anything by it.


I'd be interested to know if that held up.


----------



## scribblydoodler

Well, I used to make well over $500 a month a while back!
Now I make about $200/$300 a month. 
Can't complain!


----------



## wilsonharp

wilsonharp said:


> Long term is my approach, and while I won't turn down a month where my sales explode into the thousands of dollars, I won't become discouraged if I end up with $200 at the end of April. It's $200 more that I would have made on my writing in "the old days". Weird to think that the old days was five years ago.


I wrote that 16 months ago and I have an update. I was quietly creeping up into the $300 to $400 a month range, when I released my 6th book in July. It was a hit, and I don't know exactly what caused it to spark. But in the last 11 days of July I made over $600 on sales of that book, and halfway through August, I have already made over $2000 on the strength of the new book. So, I did have a month where my sales exploded into the thousands of dollars. I am now working even harder than I was before as I want to keep fueling this flame.


----------



## C. Gockel

Congrats wilsonharp!

Dystopian survivalist novels ... who knew? Oh, Joe Nobody! All the best.


----------



## Deborahsmith author

"As a former reporter myself, I know it is just laziness. Always easier to write the lottery story than the one where people actually grind away and make a good living. The REAL story of what's happening.  And it is also one of the most amazing business/economic stories in America and it never gets reported (imagine if we were all handcrafting beer or shoes or something...we'd all be on Sixty Minutes.)"

A story about writers eking out a few thousand dollars a year self-publishing their books is not about them making a "good living," it's about hobby writers selling enough books to take the family on a small vacation. Sorry, but why should any major business media want to cover that? So far what this thread has demonstrated is that self-pubbing provides pocket change and will cover expenses for a small tier of the better semi-pro writers, and occasionally one will break from the pack to do much more. That jibes with surveys of the self-pub potential. Instead of trying to exaggerate the talent pool, why not focus on the cottage industry aspect?


----------



## Hugh Howey

poisonarrowpubs said:


> Wow--posted this in April 2013. Things sure changed quickly! Averaging four figures monthly since Dec 2013.


Unreal. Congratulations! This transition is in its infancy. So many uplifting stories yet to come.


----------



## Rick Gualtieri

Deborahsmith author said:


> A story about writers eking out a few thousand dollars a year self-publishing their books is not about them making a "good living," it's about hobby writers selling enough books to take the family on a small vacation.


No, it's about something being life changing. One doesn't need millions for that. A hobby that pays for a grocery trip, a child's soccer uniform, or car repair can be that. Many of us here aren't going to be driving solid gold Lamborghinis anytime soon (I might have to settle for silver-plated, d*mn my luck! , but self-publishing has made a difference nevertheless. That's really what the story is about. Sure, it's not quite Keeping Up With the Kardashians, but it's inspiring nevertheless and our numbers keep growing.


----------



## Hugh Howey

Rick Gualtieri said:


> No, it's about something being life changing. One doesn't need millions for that. A hobby that pays for a grocery trip, a child's soccer uniform, or car repair can be that. Many of us here aren't going to be driving solid gold Lamborghinis anytime soon (I might have to settle for silver-plated, d*mn my luck! , but self-publishing has made a difference nevertheless. That's really what the story is about. Sure, it's not quite Keeping Up With the Kardashians, but it's inspiring nevertheless and our numbers keep growing.


Huggers gonna hug!


----------



## legion

Hugh Howey said:


> Unreal. Congratulations! This transition is in its infancy. So many uplifting stories yet to come.


Thanks, Hugh. The existing uplifting/success stories (such as yours) let me know that it was possible to make a living at this, and gave me the drive.
There are definitely more uplifting stories to come, with various levels and forms of success!
So great to see so many people get a chance at this dream.


----------



## Joe Ducie

I haven't released an SP novel in ten months or so, which has seen a detriment to my overall sales. I've had to fulfill some traditional published commitments, a 3 book contract. Bricks to build the house, you know?

But when I am on schedule SP more than pays the bills. Five figure territory every two months, which is wonderful. I've got a rolling release schedule from October, which should see 4 new novels in my series, one every two months, as well as a bunch of novellas from the perspective of one of the other characters in the series. Coupled with the traditional releases in 2015 and I'm hoping to quit the day job and move to Dubrovnik, Westeros, around April, 2015!

About 250 hours in the fightin' and writin' chair should see to that.


----------



## Lionel&#039;s Mom

I remember when this post was new and I was so excited to have extra restaurant money from my book sales. I was seriously okay with being able to eat out more often! 
Then I began to be able to pay off my credit cards, then build a savings account and now I'm a full time writer, which I still can't really make myself accept, because it seems too wonderful to be real.

And I just had sushi this week.


----------



## Diane Patterson

Have to admit, it was fun to go back to the beginning of this thread and see how things have changed for the better for some of the early posters...I wish lots of people would post again about how things have changed since then, but I can definitely understand the reluctance to share good news...


----------



## Hugh Howey

Lionel's Mom said:


> I remember when this post was new and I was so excited to have extra restaurant money from my book sales. I was seriously okay with being able to eat out more often!
> Then I began to be able to pay off my credit cards, then build a savings account and now I'm a full time writer, which I still can't really make myself accept, because it seems too wonderful to be real.
> 
> And I just had sushi this week.


You know what's insane? I worked in bookstores for years, and I met authors with several NYT bestsellers to their credit who had day jobs. I can think of two authors I spoke to who managed to support themselves with their writing. Now, hundreds -- possibly thousands -- of writers are paying their bills while doing what they love.

Are the odds great that anyone who publishes will make it? Nope. But the number of open slots have probably gone up by a factor of 10. The analogy I use is that the NBA just formed 320 new basketball teams. That's nearly 5,000 new roster slots. Sure, there are still hundreds of thousands of people aiming for those slots, so the percentage odds still look poor, but the real count of the number of happy professionals has gone up a LOT.

For the Debbie Downers who want to focus on the percentage who make it rather than the absolute number increase, they sure have a sad way of looking at the world.


----------



## Keith Soares

My first month as a writer (last summer), I made $16. Last month, $345. That's not gonna let me quit my day job any time soon, but it's a progression. I hope it continues. I'm having fun with writing and want to do it more. Plus, my kids think one day I'll be rich and can buy the White House (their words, unsure where that came from)...
K.


----------



## Saul Tanpepper

You can add me to the 4-figure club. When I first posted here last year, I was treading water at just about $500/month. This year I'm keeping my head consistently over $1500/month. But the great thing is, last year I averaged about $2/sale. This year I'm averaging almost $4/sale.


----------



## suspensefulCJ

Lionel's Mom said:


> I remember when this post was new and I was so excited to have extra restaurant money from my book sales. I was seriously okay with being able to eat out more often!
> Then I began to be able to pay off my credit cards, then build a savings account and now I'm a full time writer, which I still can't really make myself accept, because it seems too wonderful to be real.
> 
> And I just had sushi this week.


It was definitely fun to reread!

I have been doing this full-time for three years. Today was a monumental day--my husband gave HIS resignation. He's coming home to take over the business side of things for me.

The writing more than pays the bills. It took a while (and 20 books), but we've achieved what we set out to do!


----------



## MPax

I'm not where I want to be yet, but I do pay two household bills a month - phone and trash (became a necessity because of real life plot twists) - and completely support my writing habit. I hope to leap beyond that in the near future. I'll keep writing all the same.


----------



## katrina46

It depends. I'm just now starting to sell, but I pay for book covers and promos. Are you talking strictly profit? A lot of people look at sales and don't realize it costs money to produce. Here's an example. I am likely to make 500 this month. I am also likely to pay 200 on covers and 50 on promos, which would be more if not for bknights and genre pulse being so reasonably priced.


----------



## anniejocoby

Working on my fifth five-figure month in a row!  

When I started, I think that I made around $200 a month the first three months or so. Permafree on my first series was the first breakthrough, and enabled me to start making four-figure months consistently. Permafree on the second series was what broke me into the monthly five-figure club. Hope to keep up the momentum with my new release!


----------



## Andrzej Tucholski

... and today I'm celebrating the 30 days anniversary of my debut book launch by hitting my 30$ all-time super-milestone! Not much, but I feel sooo good!


----------



## katrina46

Hugh Howey said:


> You know what's insane? I worked in bookstores for years, and I met authors with several NYT bestsellers to their credit who had day jobs. I can think of two authors I spoke to who managed to support themselves with their writing. Now, hundreds -- possibly thousands -- of writers are paying their bills while doing what they love.
> 
> Are the odds great that anyone who publishes will make it? Nope. But the number of open slots have probably gone up by a factor of 10. The analogy I use is that the NBA just formed 320 new basketball teams. That's nearly 5,000 new roster slots. Sure, there are still hundreds of thousands of people aiming for those slots, so the percentage odds still look poor, but the real count of the number of happy professionals has gone up a LOT.
> 
> For the Debbie Downers who want to focus on the percentage who make it rather than the absolute number increase, they sure have a sad way of looking at the world.


I think the success rate is going up do to the promotion opportunities that weren't there before. Like the new one genre pulse. I have a promo with them tomorrow and I'm excited to see how it goes. I saw a guy on another thread who sold 222 copies and said he expected a little more. For someone like me, selling that many in one day would make me call my best friend and tell her I made it. lol.


----------



## beccaprice

I'[d just like to break even - getting all my books illustrated and professionally laid out costs money that I only had thanks to an inheritance. Advertising usually pays for itself and not much more. I'm hoping that, now that everything  is illustrated, and I'm (more or less) concentrating on a novel, that the elusive break even point will be some time either next year or the year after that.


----------



## SunshineOnMe

This is a great thread.  Some days I feel like I am a teeny minnow in the sea, and others I feel incredibly blessed because I've sold so many books. It might only pay for a family vacation, but I'm going to get room service!  (And a personal thank you to my readers!)


----------



## Kathryn Meyer Griffith

After 2 years being self-pubbed, I was making really good money for over a year ($500-2,600 a month) on 6 eBooks...then KU came along and, no joke, my sales so far this month are only $70. I'm trying to pull out of KU/LOLL right now (because they never gave me the chance before it started; never received notice of it, either) but not sure if they'll let me. I can't describe how confused and disappointed I am. It was the best money I'd ever made in my 43 years of writing and I don't want to accept that it's over. Next year my publisher will give me the rights back to 15 more of my books and I hope I'll know where to place them, because right now, I don't.


----------



## wizard1231

Interesting thread. I'll have to take some time and go back through all these posts.

Yes, I make a living at this. I was able to quit the day job about 5 months ago. Summer has been a little tight but the bills are still getting paid.


----------



## deanblake

It motivates me to read about everyone who is making a decent income from their self-publishing. I wish I was making $500 a month from my work. 

In the meantime, I work as a copywriter and writer for a magazine.


----------



## wtvr

As of the release of KU figures for August, I am happy to say I'm a full time writer. Released my first title under a new name on June 23. Hopefully in a few months I'll be better paid... but as of right now, it's legit.


----------



## cahocking

Some months I reach and often well exceed the $500 (feet doing happy dance), some months I don't, but I've never had a month that doesn't deliver something. I worked full time until I was 55 and was making a small income from my books (and other paid writing), but quit my job and went full time writing six years ago. It's a roller coaster ride, for sure, but last year I did so well that my books were supporting me better than my job ever had. This year not quite so much, but I still pay taxes in the USA AND Australia, so not doing too badly. And I still eat well, dress well and live well, so no complaints here. BUT - I'm also not supporting a family (all grown and flown), a mortgage or a gambling habit. And I have a husband with an income, so every situation is different. Wouldn't like to be an Indie Author who is the sole breadwinner with a young family. That's a different story altogether. Pressure plus!


----------



## Heather Hamilton-Senter

90 days and I've made more than I've ever made in *one year total*. Now, mind you, I've always been in an artistic field - acting, singing, photography, jewelry making - so I've never made big bucks!  But if I had to support myself in a normal fashion (not my house and 2 acres of mortgage - that I leave to the computer programmer genius hubby ), I could.

*IF* it continues. At just 3 months, I can't predict what my eventual end story will be, but right now, I'm profoundly grateful for what - through some hard work and a* LOT* of luck - I've been able to achieve. I won't make the mistake of assuming it will continue, but this has been beyond my wildest dreams.

And it's paying for my daughter's first year studying music at university. If I never make another penny, that has been worth everything to me.


----------



## Andrei Cherascu

Hey guys, 

I'm new to the forum. I've just self-published my first novel a little over two weeks ago and have so far made a whopping 18 sales (around 30$ or so), most of which were family and friends. However, I haven't yet started a marketing strategy since I plan to first read all I can find on the topic. 

My story is a bit unusual in the sense that I became a stay-home writer well before I ever earned a dollar from writing. I quit my job in the IT department of a major corporation almost two years ago in order to exclusively focus on writing. In the meantime, I made some money here and there from translations and online articles but most of my time and energy went into crafting my first novel. I could only do this with the support of my wife, who pays the bills. 

Now, the reason I did things this way is connected with the other particularity of my "story": I live in Romania. I've never even traveled to an English-speaking country. Been speaking the language all my life, though. I even majored in English, so my sci-fi story is written entirely in the English language (living in Romania is basically its own sci-fi story). 

Now, back when I was working in IT, I earned a little over 700$ a month (in my best month). In Romania, that's a pretty decent salary. 

I thought that this is interesting to note, because, reading the discussion, I got a sense of how important the country of residence is in the way one might measure "success" (or what it would mean for me, personally, compared to some of the other self-published authors who live in the U.S). If I ever manage to make 379$ off my writing it will basically be my starting salary in IT support. If I work my way up to 800$ that will be more than any salary I've ever earned and I would be able to live a very comfortable life. I wonder how many self-published writers, writing in English and publishing internationally, are in my situation.

I basically had no choice but to make writing a full-time occupation in order to even be able to write my novel. That's because of various reasons. First, it's a very complex story, with many narrative threads, which needed a lot of focus and energy to get right. Second, since I'm not a native speaker, I tend to write slower than native speakers and probably spend five times as much time editing and just generally making sure that everything sounds good (to the point where a native speaker would hopefully not pick up any difference). Third, because marketing the work does take up a lot of time, I would never have had the energy to do this after eight hours of absolutely exhausting service-desk IT support.  

It's basically because of Hugh Howey that I even looked into self-publishing. So, thank you for being an inspiration, my friend! Even though I haven't yet sold much, I now know that there are people out there reading my story, and I get feedback from them, which is the greatest feeling in the world.


----------



## Andrei Cherascu

Andrzej Tucholski said:


> ... and today I'm celebrating the 30 days anniversary of my debut book launch by hitting my 30$ all-time super-milestone! Not much, but I feel sooo good!


30$...same as me  Congratulations! Good luck and let's start focusing on the next milestone...300$


----------



## jenminkman

Andrei Cherascu said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I'm new to the forum. I've just self-published my first novel a little over two weeks ago and have so far made a whopping 18 sales (around 30$ or so), most of which were family and friends. However, I haven't yet started a marketing strategy since I plan to first read all I can find on the topic.
> 
> My story is a bit unusual in the sense that I became a stay-home writer well before I ever earned a dollar from writing. I quit my job in the IT department of a major corporation almost two years ago in order to exclusively focus on writing. In the meantime, I made some money here and there from translations and online articles but most of my time and energy went into crafting my first novel. I could only do this with the support of my wife, who pays the bills.
> 
> Now, the reason I did things this way is connected with the other particularity of my "story": I live in Romania. I've never even traveled to an English-speaking country. Been speaking the language all my life, though. I even majored in English, so my sci-fi story is written entirely in the English language (living in Romania is basically its own sci-fi story).
> 
> Now, back when I was working in IT, I earned a little over 700$ a month (in my best month). In Romania, that's a pretty decent salary.
> 
> I thought that this is interesting to note, because, reading the discussion, I got a sense of how important the country of residence is in the way one might measure "success" (or what it would mean for me, personally, compared to some of the other self-published authors who live in the U.S). If I ever manage to make 379$ off my writing it will basically be my starting salary in IT support. If I work my way up to 800$ that will be more than any salary I've ever earned and I would be able to live a very comfortable life. I wonder how many self-published writers, writing in English and publishing internationally, are in my situation.
> 
> I basically had no choice but to make writing a full-time occupation in order to even be able to write my novel. That's because of various reasons. First, it's a very complex story, with many narrative threads, which needed a lot of focus and energy to get right. Second, since I'm not a native speaker, I tend to write slower than native speakers and probably spend five times as much time editing and just generally making sure that everything sounds good (to the point where a native speaker would hopefully not pick up any difference). Third, because marketing the work does take up a lot of time, I would never have had the energy to do this after eight hours of absolutely exhausting service-desk IT support.
> 
> It's basically because of Hugh Howey that I even looked into self-publishing. So, thank you for being an inspiration, my friend! Even though I haven't yet sold much, I now know that there are people out there reading my story, and I get feedback from them, which is the greatest feeling in the world.


What an inspiring story, Andrei! It's true that $800 could be a royal salary in some countries. I live in Holland, but my husband is from the Philippines and if we ever moved there (it's not entirely unlikely) I could probably live off my book royalties without doing anything else. Right now, the extra money I make with my books is used to pay off my debts way faster than I thought I'd be able to. Instead of a 15-year plan, I am now looking at a 4-year plan if this continues. And that is worth everything to me. If debts tie you down, it really sucks. I am grateful for everything that's happened in the past two years. I worked really hard to get to where I am now. Right now my life is exactly where I want it to be. I have a steady day job in education 3 days a week and I spend 3 other days writing and doing marketing for my books. And oh, I also have one day off, just for bumming around


----------



## Ed Robinson

I've  made 30k over the past 12 months on book sales. It's my sole source of income. Living simply (cheaply).


----------



## Andrei Cherascu

jenminkman said:


> What an inspiring story, Andrei! It's true that $800 could be a royal salary in some countries. I live in Holland, but my husband is from the Philippines and if we ever moved there (it's not entirely unlikely) I could probably live off my book royalties without doing anything else. Right now, the extra money I make with my books is used to pay off my debts way faster than I thought I'd be able to. Instead of a 15-year plan, I am now looking at a 4-year plan if this continues. And that is worth everything to me. If debts tie you down, it really sucks. I am grateful for everything that's happened in the past two years. I worked really hard to get to where I am now. Right now my life is exactly where I want it to be. I have a steady day job in education 3 days a week and I spend 3 other days writing and doing marketing for my books. And oh, I also have one day off, just for bumming around


Thank you, Jen!  It's great to hear from a fellow European self-published writer. Ahh...Holland, one of my favorite countries in the world. It's been a goal of mine to one day travel there ever since my father kept forcing me to watch BZN videos  (he is a huge fan). Since the videos were often shot in gorgeous locations in Holland I've developed a great love for your country.

I think situations such as our are very relevant to the topic that Hugh is so interested in, because of the different economies. I know Holland is a very well-developed country but in places such as Romania or The Philippines, sales of a few hundred dollars a month can actually replace a full-time job. I figure there's probably not very many non-native speakers publishing in English but it would be very interesting to find out.

I'm very happy that you are where you want to be in life  That's the most important thing. Take it from a guy who felt very out-of-place working in a corporate environment for two and a half years. It sounds like you have a great situation, being able to dedicate half the time to your job and half to writing. If I wouldn't be able to do this full-time anymore it would definitely be my next-favorite option. Maybe teach English at a private school part-time and then write the rest of the time.

P.S: You're definitely right about debts. If my royalties could at least cover the monthly loan and credit card payments I'd already be a very happy guy.


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## Andrei Cherascu

Ed Robinson said:


> I've made 30k over the past 12 months on book sales. It's my sole source of income. Living simply (cheaply).


See...30k would be what I would have made at my old job in about 4 years. If I ever manage to make 30k in a year I will already be earning more than my old boss without living cheaply. That's definitely a full-time salary for my country. As they say in real-estate: location, location, location.


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## horrordude1973

I write extreme horror, after my 4th or 5th book, I began to sell enough that it was paying more than a full time job would have been. I'm not rich by any stretch, but its more than I'd be making doing most other jobs. I have 10 books out now and have 2 more down the pipe.


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## susan_illene

I love seeing how many people are managing to make some kind of income from their work.  This thread should be a great motivator for all writers.

For me, I made about $25k last year from the first two books I published.  It was enough to pay off debts, keep the husband from having to work extra hours, cover my publishing expenses, and have a little extra for things we'd been going without for a long time (We hadn't bought any new clothes in a few years, taken a vacation, or gone to nice restaurants).  This year with a couple more books and novellas out I'll break into six digit figures, if you don't count the large chunk going to taxes.  My husband just put in his two week notice at his job and he is now back in college full-time.  Our quality of life has become much better and I'm able to focus on writing more.  I wouldn't call myself a bestseller, but I've definitely built up an enthusiastic fan base and hope to continue expanding my audience.


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## Andrei Cherascu

horrordude1973 said:


> I write extreme horror, after my 4th or 5th book, I began to sell enough that it was paying more than a full time job would have been. I'm not rich by any stretch, but its more than I'd be making doing most other jobs. I have 10 books out now and have 2 more down the pipe.


Where are you based? U.S or outside? I'm really curious to know.


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## Andrei Cherascu

susan_illene said:


> I love seeing how many people are managing to make some kind of income from their work. This thread should be a great motivator for all writers.
> 
> For me, I made about $25k last year from the first two books I published. It was enough to pay off debts, keep the husband from having to work extra hours, cover my publishing expenses, and have a little extra for things we'd been going without for a long time (We hadn't bought any new clothes in a few years, taken a vacation, or gone to nice restaurants). This year with a couple more books and novellas out I'll break into six digit figures, if you don't count the large chunk going to taxes. My husband just put in his two week notice at his job and he is now back in college full-time. Our quality of life has become much better and I'm able to focus on writing more. I wouldn't call myself a bestseller, but I've definitely built up an enthusiastic fan base and hope to continue expanding my audience.


Susan, that's a really inspiring story  I plan to have my second book (a novella) out by December. If I could make 25000 by next December I will have more than covered the money I've lost in the last two years by staying home and not getting the salary from my old job.


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## horrordude1973

Andrei, I'm in Texas.

I get good sales in the UK, the bulk are in US. But recently a German publisher signed 5 of my titles for publication in German and overseas distribution.


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## susan_illene

Andrei Cherascu said:


> Susan, that's a really inspiring story  I plan to have my second book (a novella) out by December. If I could make 25000 by next December I will have more than covered the money I've lost in the last two years by staying home and not getting the salary from my old job.


Keep working at it, Andrei. I didn't make a lot with the first book in my series, but when the second came out I really started to see sales take off. A very small percentage of people become successful right out the gate. Many more have to work at it for a couple years and put many more books out. For each author it is different, but if you stick with it and work hard (as it appears you're doing) I'm sure you'll get there. I hope I'll see your story down the line when you tell us how well you've done!


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## Andrei Cherascu

horrordude1973 said:


> Andrei, I'm in Texas.
> 
> I get good sales in the UK, the bulk are in US. But recently a German publisher signed 5 of my titles for publication in German and overseas distribution.


Ok, so you reside in the U.S. The reason I asked was because I wrote a post where I explained that, since I live in Romania, I could match my full-time salary at my former job by earning only 700$ a month. (as opposed to the U.S where you would have to earn a lot more from your self-published books in order to match an actual 9 to 5 income). So now I'm curious about how many people are in my situation, meaning living in a country where the salaries are so low that you could (more or less) easily make a living just from self-publishing.


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## Andrei Cherascu

susan_illene said:


> Keep working at it, Andrei. I didn't make a lot with the first book in my series, but when the second came out I really started to see sales take off. A very small percentage of people become successful right out the gate. Many more have to work at it for a couple years and put many more books out. For each author it is different, but if you stick with it and work hard (as it appears you're doing) I'm sure you'll get there. I hope I'll see your story down the line when you tell us how well you've done!


Susan, thank you for the encouragement.  It was a bit scary and confusing right after I published the novel and I saw that practically no one was buying it (not even most of my friends) but it helps being here on this forum and reading everyone's experiences. Makes me feel like I'm part of a big group of people, and not as isolated as I had felt so far.


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## Heather Hamilton-Senter

susan_illene said:


> I love seeing how many people are managing to make some kind of income from their work. This thread should be a great motivator for all writers.
> 
> For me, I made about $25k last year from the first two books I published. It was enough to pay off debts, keep the husband from having to work extra hours, cover my publishing expenses, and have a little extra for things we'd been going without for a long time (We hadn't bought any new clothes in a few years, taken a vacation, or gone to nice restaurants). This year with a couple more books and novellas out I'll break into six digit figures, if you don't count the large chunk going to taxes. My husband just put in his two week notice at his job and he is now back in college full-time. Our quality of life has become much better and I'm able to focus on writing more. I wouldn't call myself a bestseller, but I've definitely built up an enthusiastic fan base and hope to continue expanding my audience.


I love your story Susan. I've been feeling low for the past few days and your post really gets me encouraged and excited again about indie publishing and the possibilities. Thanks!


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## Drake

Thanks for taking this topic on Hugh.  I've been doing this for just over a year, and am so far more than doubling your benchmark amount.  My wife was flabbergasted by the first $2K plus month, although it's been a bit hit or miss since then.  Your frequent advice to just keep writing is spot-on.


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## Amber Rose

Andrei Cherascu said:


> I've just self-published my first novel a little over two weeks ago ....


I *love* your cover!


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## sunnywriter

Such inspiring stories in this thread. As a newcomer to the self-publishing scene, I am thankful for everyone who has shared their experiences.


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## Andrei Cherascu

Amber Rose said:


> I *love* your cover!


Thank you, Amber Rose! This feedback means the world to me  I made it myself (with the help of my wife), so I'm always nervous about what people might think of it. I'm glad you like it.


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## Rue Hirsch

I haven't hit publish either, but this thread is inspiring and fascinating. I recently quit a promising career to pursue my writing, so all of your stories give me more than hope. And this is about happiness just as much as money. I'm excited about where publishing and fiction writing is headed, can't wait to be part of it! But I'm still getting my darlings all puckered up. Awesome work everyone!


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## horrordude1973

I will say the first few times around were so frustrating. Maybe its because I write horror and not romance or erotica. I saw friends who wrote those writing their first book and selling hundreds of books per month while I sold 2-3  a month.

It took my 4th book or so before I locked into the more extreme genre, found my audience and got comfortable with my own writing


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## Guest

susan_illene said:


> Keep working at it, Andrei. I didn't make a lot with the first book in my series, but when the second came out I really started to see sales take off. A very small percentage of people become successful right out the gate. Many more have to work at it for a couple years and put many more books out. For each author it is different, but if you stick with it and work hard (as it appears you're doing) I'm sure you'll get there. I hope I'll see your story down the line when you tell us how well you've done!


This is absolutely my thought. I'm pleased with the results for my first series, but there will be many more series down the road, and I expect to do better and better as the years go on.

I'm used to working hard, and this is no different.


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## Wayne Stinnett

Hugh Howey said:


> Is there any way we can round up a list of people making, let's say, $500 a month on average for an entire year from their work? That's $6,000 a year.


While it hasn't been for an entire year (I only published my first book 50 weeks ago), so far this year my income is nearing $75K, most of it since 6/1. I quit my job on 5/14 and haven't looked back.


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## Guest

Oh, by the way Hugh, I'm bookmarking this thread.  I started May 2014, and I hit over $1,000 for August for my two short zombie books.  Today is September 22, 2014.  Next year, on this date, I want to see where I'm at.    (I'm also marking down in my 2015 calendar to come back to this thread on September 22, 2015.)


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## Sharon Eros

I've been at this seriously since March this year, and am averaging around $5,000 per month at this point. September is set to be quite a bit more thanks to the excellent marketing advice I've received here.

I'm already making quite a bit more than I do at my day job, but I'm nervous about quitting because the health insurance is fantastic and we have a new baby to think about. I'm also nervous that there's something or someone lurking in every corner of the internet with the sole purpose of destroying this amazing business that I've built for myself. This is all paranoia, I guess, but it certainly keeps me from going "all in" with self-publishing.


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## jackiegp

I would love to know of these excellent marketing tips you speak of. Been at this since December 2013, and well...no where near paying bills. Again, would love to know of these excellent marketing tips you speak.


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## susan_illene

Heather Hamilton-Senter said:


> I love your story Susan. I've been feeling low for the past few days and your post really gets me encouraged and excited again about indie publishing and the possibilities. Thanks!


From what I've seen on the forums, Heather, you're doing well (I do love your covers, btw). Just keep up the good work and you'll reach your goals


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## hpeteralesso

I was disappointed with the sales of my first fiction book in 2013, but I found that the sequel in 2014, multiplied sales dramatically. It's the pyramid effect of a series. Everyone who was intrigued by the promotion for my second book seemed to decide to start with the first in the series. I hadn't expected such a strong a correlation, but about 96% of those who purchased the first book, also bought the second. With several hundred supportive reviews, I am motivated to work harder on number three.


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## Alexis Adaire

Awesome optimism-generating thread!

My story: For the last 20 years I've owned an online business that published every day, with my role being more editor than writer. The first dozen or so years were great, then revenue started tailing off to where it was a mere trickle the last few years. A random post on Facebook by a friend of mine lead me to Kboards. I'd written several screenplays over the years and had been considering writing a novel for a while. The idea of completing a full-fledged novel was daunting at the time, but by taking the Erotica route, I could publish shorter stories. That seemed less risky, both to my creative self and in terms of generating an income.

Next thing you know, It's 8 months later and I've got 21 distinct titles up, plus another 7 collections. The coding, marketing and Photoshop skills I carried over from my previous job have helped immensely, as I don't have to pay for covers, formatting, etc. Revenue has been slowly climbing. Earnings have grown at least 125% every month and I will start earning four figures a month this month or next. The old job is history, thanks to my partner's mostly enthusiastic support, and I now have a new career.

And best of all: Writing a full-length novel has now become a very realistic challenge.


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## David VanDyke

I started with one book in summer of 2012 and now have 20-ish (depending on what you consider a book) and am making $100K-ish a year (gross), probably half then net after taxes and business expenses. I'm a big believer in spending money to make money, so I promote and advertise heavily on anything I find that gets me an ROE, long or short term. I quit my day job this year and now do this exclusively.


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## Sophrosyne

David, that's fantastic!

Hugh, are you still collecting this info?

I obviously need more seat in chair time!


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## David VanDyke

Sophrosyne said:


> David, that's fantastic!
> 
> Hugh, are you still collecting this info?
> 
> I obviously need more seat in chair time!


Yes, as always, one has to produce lots of good-quality content in this new world of ebooks. My long-term average exceeds 1000 words a day, though it tends to actually work out to 2-3000 words on the days I am actively writing a book and 0 on other days that I am doing all that "notwriting" stuff, including editing.

I just realized what I just said (wrote) and that means I spend a lot of my energy marketing. I'd say maybe 1/3 marketing (which includes social media, answering emails, etc), 1/3 writing, and 1/3 dealing directly with the content (editing, getting covers, beta reading, revising, etc.) I say energy rather than time because I always run out of energy before I run out of time in the day...


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## C. Gockel

> actually work out to 2-3000 words on the days I am actively writing a book and 0 on other days that I am doing all that "notwriting" stuff, including editing


It's nice to hear this! I am about the same. I'll only have released 3 times this year, but hoping for four releases this year.

Oh, hey, and Hugh- I'm at the point where my husband has stopped getting grumpy when he sees me writing and is now considerate. Whew!


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