# Did you know the mods insult you behind your back?



## ........ (May 4, 2013)

If you've ever received a mod warning or anything like that, go to conversations and click on it. It seems with the site software update all the private mod conversations they had about you are now available for you to see.

They called me a bitch. Betsy did, actually. I also got called a bunch of other insulting things.

So yeah, go check out your conversations if you ever got a message from the mods.

And as a note - really disgusting behaviour Betsy. 

In particular that I'd written to them saying I was deleting my posts because I had a stalker. They mocked that, implied I was lying and called me a bitch.

Great, hey? 



> Her post that was edited to remove the stuff about Mark is at the end. It may not read all that bad, but she's always been a bit of a bitch,


It's so bad and just gets worse....


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## Rick Gualtieri (Oct 31, 2011)

I'm not going to comment on anything that was said, nor go looking for it. Nor am I going to tell anyone how to feel about it.

All I'll say is being a moderator of _any_ large group is stressful. This is why so many forums have "mod caves" or secret mod groups, where they can comment on things among themselves. It also gives them a safe place to blow off steam. It's either that or lose their minds. Also, never discount that many of these things are probably "said" in the heat of the moment.


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## Paranormal Kitty (Jun 13, 2017)

They don't seem to be moderating anymore anyway since the forum change. Some of the threads have got crazy and it's crickets.


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## Douglas Milewski (Jul 4, 2014)

People get warnings? I've never had that happen.


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## A past poster (Oct 23, 2013)

........ said:


> It seems with the site software update all the private mod conversations they had about you are now available for you to see.


Thanks for letting us know.


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## cest la vie (Feb 4, 2021)

This is so messy. I love it.


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## NikOK (Jun 27, 2020)

Paranormal Kitty said:


> They don't seem to be moderating anymore anyway since the forum change. Some of the threads have got crazy and it's crickets.


Yep, that's the impression I've been getting. It's a little irking to hear that a mod said something that by all means would not be allowed on the forum, but is it surprising? Meh. People say ridiculous things all the time. If the same thing is happening to me right now, I'll just write my next book, and they will be the ones wasting their time thinking about their insults to some random internet person.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

Shayne was not stalking you. There's no such thing as post stalking. All posts can be read by all people on a message board. That's the whole idea.

Mods shouldn't call names. I agree there. I've been in communities where mods had agendas and it's no fun. I don't get that vibe here, but, as said, there hasn't been a lot of moderating going on.

Don't be a jerk if you don't want people to call you a jerk behind your back. But also don't use gendered insults maybe, Mods. That's not cool.


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

Crystal_ said:


> Shayne was not stalking you. There's no such thing as post stalking. All posts can be read by all people on a message board. That's the whole idea.
> 
> Mods shouldn't call names. I agree there. I've been in communities where mods had agendas and it's no fun. I don't get that vibe here, but, as said, there hasn't been a lot of moderating going on.
> 
> Don't be a jerk if you don't want people to call you a jerk behind your back. But also don't use gendered insults maybe, Mods. That's not cool.


You have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not talking about any poster here and stop dragging your upset from one thread to another.

I'm literally talking about something that happened years ago and due to a software update I can suddenly see what Betsy, Ann, and Becca were saying about me.

See, I wrote erotica and got a really sick stalker. It was terrifying actually. They kept using disposable email services to send me all kinds of horrific rape fantasy stuff. This person is the reason why I don't follow the law on having your actual address in Mailchimp newsletters.

Way back in the day I started scrubbing my post histories anywhere I had them. This upset those three mods, although there was no rule about it, and they decided to harass me about it.

It felt so bad at the time and now I've discovered they were saying I was lying about the stalker, called me a bitch, made a bunch of other derogatory comments.

This stalker was so bad that I, in the end, abandoned the pen name entirely. It was making about $60K a year many years ago.

It's no joke that I did quite literally lose easily $200,000 from abandoning this name. I abandoned the website and let the registration lapse. The books are still sitting there earning money, about $6000 a year now, which is amazing for a dead name from seven years ago.

To find out that three women who were mods were talking about me the way they were, apparently targeting me outside any kind of published forum rule and then saying the stalker was a lie?

It's so utterly disgusting.

Maybe Becca or Ann or Betsy can arrive and explain themselves.

I doubt it though. They're probably frantically deleting conversation histories as fast as they can.

All those authors who were banned or felt harassed - guess what! You probably were targeted! Go check those conversation histories to see.


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## cest la vie (Feb 4, 2021)

Be serious. People talk shit. It's not a big deal, unless they have a point.

For someone who was literally stalked, it's interesting how cavalierly you throw that word around when a poster you're arguing with stands their ground, but that's another thread so I shouldn't drag it here. Right? You're the new mod telling us what we can say and where we can say it. Right?

I'm not saying the mods were right to talk about you like they did, but you might want to take a breath and look in the mirror between your criticisms of everyone else.


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

cest la vie said:


> Be serious. People talk shit. It's not a big deal, unless they have a point.
> 
> For someone who was literally stalked, it's interesting how cavalierly you throw that word around when a poster you're arguing with stands their ground, but that's another thread so I shouldn't drag it here. Right? You're the new mod telling us what we can say and where we can say it. Right?
> 
> I'm not saying the mods were right to talk about you like they did, but you might want to take a breath and look in the mirror between your criticisms of everyone else.


Yeah, there is a type of forum harassment that happens when someone gets really angry and they decide that no matter what someone writes, or even if they're not writing to that person directly, they'll jump down their throat over and over and over. Like multiple replies to the same post. Like I talk to someone else and this harassing person comes back with their shouty reply.

It's a very effective way to shove someone off a forum. Imagine you wrote to someone else in a thread and every time you did, the same person came to shout the same things again?

It's as old as forums itself, which is why I called it out. I repeatedly asked the person to stop, they refused. They even refused to the point of saying I had to block them because they wouldn't stop.

If you're cool with that then perhaps you should examine how women are bullied off forums by thugs who act like this.

I'm here for discussion and yeah it can go back and forth but once you get someone jumping on all the posts you write, even when it's not talking to them - it crosses the line into harassment. 

And please, don't drag problems from one thread to another. It's not good.


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

A while back, erotica authors got shoved hard on this forum. The overt excuse given was Amazon and having erotic content (which meant links to our books) might kill the affiliate cash cow. 

Now seeing the mod comments and the way they were talking about me, an former erotica author, it certainly seems there was a bit of an agenda happening.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

You did accuse Shayne of post stalking you in the other thread. You can't throw around words and then claim you really take them seriously all the time.

I am sorry you had to deal with a stalker and I hope you find a way to improve that situation. You don't need to have your home address on your mailing list. You can get a PO Box or a mailbox. You can register it to an LLC. It's not perfect privacy, but there are options for any authors reading this who are concerned.

Of course, most authors who use a made up address don't have issues, but there are work arounds. I have a mailbox. I would recommend that to everyone. There are weird people out there.

I don't know what your intention with this thread is, but it isn't painting you in a positive light. I am very sorry you had to abandon your pen name and deal with this experience, but that is irrelevant to the way you behaved in other threads. It's not dragging drama from thread to thread to make conclusions about people based on how the behave themselves. If I'm a jerk in one thread, people will think I'm a jerk, even if I'm in a situation where I need help and understanding.


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

Crystal_ said:


> You did accuse Shayne of post stalking you in the other thread. You can't throw around words and then claim you really take them seriously all the time.


I don't care about that person. You know that there is a way to harass someone online by just repeatedly jumping on anything they write. It's as old as forums. Just because you don't like me doesn't mean it's not happening.

Just like how you were cool with me being called entitled over and over and didn't say a word. I get it - we disagree on something but seriously, stop with the garbage threadjacking.

I put this thread up because I discovered the mods here were writing horrible things about me. I have no doubt others who were on here long ago had this happen to them too. Some will log in and see what was written about them.

The mods, who were apparently so good and unbiased, were saying some misogynistic things.

Cool, you don't know what the thread is for - then why come here? What's the point, except as a push to get me to stop writing something.


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## Crayola (Dec 22, 2012)

........ said:


> The mods, who were apparently so good and unbiased, were saying some misogynistic things.


^^snip
So a lady saying something about a lady is misogynistic?


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

Crayola said:


> ^^snip
> So a lady saying something about a lady is misogynistic?


Yes. Misogyny can come from anyone. For example, three women who are the key mods of a site calling an erotica author a bitch, amongst other things, because they never thought their private conversation would become public.


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

hmm.... a poster who isn't even willing to give a screen name is complaining about something that happened years ago from a moderator who is no longer involved with the board at all.

i'll pass. 

and if you go reading private conversations and get offended, it should remind you to not read private conversations.

oh, and to the OP, i'll bet you NEVER said anything bad about anyone else in the heat of the moment and have NEVER regretted anything you said in private that someone else decided to make public.


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

telracs said:


> hmm.... a poster who isn't even willing to give a screen name is complaining about something that happened years ago from a moderator who is no longer involved with the board at all.
> 
> i'll pass.
> 
> ...


It's three mods actually, one of whom at least is still here. 

And my screen name is right there? You can see it. I changed it to full stops because stalker. 

I see this as a public service announcement actually. Because I know plenty of people banned, modded, felt like they were being directly targeted... and I'll bet if they log in and check their messages they'll find out they were targeted.


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

a "full stop" screen name because you're afraid of a stalker, but you're going to call out other people's private conversations? 
double standard much?

this will be my last comment here, because it seems to me that you just want people to agree with you, and anyone who doesn't must be wrong and you just want to stand on your soapbox and yell into the air.

have fun.

i'm reminded of a quote in one of Randall Garrett's Lord Darcy books: "people who listen at keyholes often here things that upset them."

be well....


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

telracs said:


> a "full stop" screen name because you're afraid of a stalker, but you're going to call out other people's private conversations?
> double standard much?
> 
> this will be my last comment here, because it seems to me that you just want people to agree with you, and anyone who doesn't must be wrong and you just want to stand on your soapbox and yell into the air.
> ...


Yeah, I think finding the three main mods were calling you names and doing other bad things isn't the same as being stalked by someone, but nice false equivalence there. 

And really I'm thinking of all the people I saw forced off this forum over the years. It has been a lot. Discovering a software update revealed bad mod conversations they had about you, I think is worthy of publication. I already know some people who have checked and found other things. 

Always kinda crap to get insulted too, which you're doing now. Really can't help making it personal, can you?


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## SaltObelisk (May 24, 2017)

I'm a mod at a big reddit sub. It's... a _lot_ to deal with. Let them blow off steam, we all do.


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## Clay (Apr 17, 2020)

So we can't call a poster a "T" when it's blatantly obvious what they're doing but they can call a female poster a bitch when she's distressed over being stalked by an obsessed and possibly dangerous "fan"?

I've been a moderator on different forums, there is always a private area and the regular users are sometimes criticized or flat-out insulted behind their backs when they do something perceived as wrong. No shocks there. The only reason I'm surprised it happens here is because the mods make such a huge deal about the so-called forum culture.

Not cool.


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## Decon (Feb 16, 2011)

Sorry this happened to you.

At least they're allowing you to respond on this public forum, assuming they are still active mods. I wouldn't blame them if they locked the thread to let it die a death, or deleted it entirely after allowing you to vent your anger, because this forum is not about you and them, its about the members, exchanging ideas, writing and publishing. If you have a problem, take it to the site owners, because it's of little interest to those participating and adhering to the site rules.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

I’m sorry that happened to you OP.

All my warnings were done publicly (very professional of the mods) so sadly I don’t have any secret conversations to look into, but I can only imagine. 😂


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

Clay said:


> So we can't call a poster a "T" when it's blatantly obvious what they're doing but they can call a female poster a bitch when she's distressed over being stalked by an obsessed and possibly dangerous "fan"?


I’ve been called a tr0ll and worse by the members here and the mods did absolutely nothing about it until it was pointed out to them. I guess all those who love reporting posts didn’t have a problem with those. lol

You can see by the responses the OP is getting to this absolutely disgusting behavior by the mods that the mods were just one part of the problem. They helped protect the toxic environment, but more than a few members here helped create and sustain it. And they’re still here years later doing the same. I guess they have nothing better to do with their time.


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## cest la vie (Feb 4, 2021)

Some of you are too much.


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## NikOK (Jun 27, 2020)

........ said:


> See, I wrote erotica and got a really sick stalker. It was terrifying actually.


I'm sorry to hear that this happened. For a lot of this thread, I don't really know what to say, but this part, well, that's just terrible.


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## markpauloleksiw (Jan 15, 2019)

The mods have a thankless job. I referred to someone as a troll and had my knuckles tapped. Not my boards so I'll play by the rules.

I have a question...who actually owns this domain and the boards?..It really isn't "public" because someone is behind the scenes....

Mark


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## ShayneRutherford (Mar 24, 2014)

markpauloleksiw said:


> I have a question...who actually owns this domain and the boards?..It really isn't "public" because someone is behind the scenes....


A company called Vertical Scope owns it now.


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## markpauloleksiw (Jan 15, 2019)

I wondered who owned it because certain "promoters" get away with a lot more promotion than others. End of the day...there is a business objective to these boards and it is not a "utopia".


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## Rick Partlow (Sep 6, 2016)

They wouldn't be the first people to call me names, either behind my back or to my face. I honestly couldn't care less. To me, unless I know you IRL or have at least had a one-on-one chat with someone, everyone else I see on message boards is just a collection of pixels, and everything they say is as relevant to my self-image as the writing on a bathroom wall.


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## David VanDyke (Jan 3, 2014)

Yes, it's quite interesting to see what they say to each other (or have said even years ago) behind our backs. Ann in Arlington was 99% sure I'm a liar, apparently, when I said I missed seeing a post of hers and explained why.

Power corrupts. This board is no different. There was a period where the mods had no oversight other than themselves--and they didn't self-police very well. They were accountable to nobody and they selected new mods for being similar to themselves, it seemed. They suppressed viewpoints they didn't like while allowing those they did like to run free (selective enforcement). They even had a rule that you could not criticize the mods. That is a telling point in any organization: not being allowed to criticize the power structure.

Unexpectedly, the new corporate ownership has resulted in a benefit: the over-moderation and biased abuses by mods seem to have subsided. The boards have become more free. Sometimes that results in more nastiness than what was formerly allowed, but it's a tradeoff.


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## A past poster (Oct 23, 2013)

David VanDyke said:


> Yes, it's quite interesting to see (or have said even years ago) what they say to each other behind our backs. Ann in Arlington was 99% sure I'm a liar, apparently, when I said I missed seeing a post of hers and explained why.
> 
> Power corrupts. This board is no different. There was a period where the mods had no oversight other than themselves--and they didn't self-police very well. They were accountable to nobody and they selected new mods for being similar to themselves, it seemed. They suppressed viewpoints they didn't like while allowing those they did like to run free (selective enforcement). They even had a rule that you could not criticize the mods. That is a telling point in any organization: not being allowed to criticize the power structure.


Yes, power corrupts. It can also bring out the worst traits in people, like judging others without asking for facts, as it certainly did here. Ann in Arlington and Betsy the Quilter have been outed and the picture isn't pretty.


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## Paranormal Kitty (Jun 13, 2017)

David VanDyke said:


> Yes, it's quite interesting to see (or have said even years ago) what they say to each other behind our backs. Ann in Arlington was 99% sure I'm a liar, apparently, when I said I missed seeing a post of hers and explained why.


She also couldn't see the problem with someone calling gay people a "phenomenon that degenerate western society invented" and Becca had to convince her.



> Here's the thing: for someone to say (for example), "I think gay people are the scum of the earth," isn't any more not-allowed than for someone to say, "I think gay people are the saviors of the human race." It's when they add on something like "and ought to be shot" to the first one, or any similarly negative opinion, that I think we need to step in. Otherwise, the opinion may be hateful (in OUR opinion) but it's still just their opinion.


Doesn't really stack up with their usual policy of shutting down any discussion that trends even slightly "political" in nature, which is why I reported it in the first place instead of replying to it and getting slapped with the ruler, so I was surprised at this take.


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## ........ (May 4, 2013)

Given this thread is still open it looks like the mods were let go. Maybe the new owners don't moderate. 

There was a lot of bad stuff that used to happen. People were anointed and then couldn't be criticized. Others got put on a secret list and harassed until they left. 

You'd see this stuff and only the result and feel like someone was wrong but never could prove it. Now you might be able to see their conversations if they were warning you or harassing you. 

Seeing those messages was like a lot of things falling into place all of a sudden. It was upsetting when it happened and honestly ripped open a few wounds. 

But if those mods are gone or have been told to stop, maybe it'll be better.


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## Brian D. Anderson (Nov 4, 2019)

So they're not allowed to have a private conversation? Personally, I couldn't give a tinker's damn what someone I don't know says about me. Even less when I can't hear or read it. Though in truth I wouldn't care even if they did know me.


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## CJSNOW (Sep 8, 2019)

Is this forum unmoderated now?


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## ShayneRutherford (Mar 24, 2014)

CJSNOW said:


> Is this forum unmoderated now?


I don't think it's entirely unmoderated. Stuff that should have been put in the Book Bazaar has been moved over, but they seem to be staying out of the threads. I'm wondering if Vertical Scope told them to back off in order to get more people to post in here. Because back when VS bought it, it was a much more active forum, and they were probably counting on that activity to make money. But then it died off because they changed the terms, which probably wasn't very good for their investment. And I suspect the moderating style, which rankled a lot of people, wasn't good for their investment, either.


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## Bite the Dusty (Aug 9, 2020)

Weren't they volunteers?


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## ShayneRutherford (Mar 24, 2014)

Bite the Dusty said:


> Weren't they volunteers?


I believe they were volunteers, but they were very invested in keeping the forum the way it was back when the founder still owned it. I suspect VS is invested in something very different.


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## CJSNOW (Sep 8, 2019)

ShayneRutherford said:


> I don't think it's entirely unmoderated. Stuff that should have been put in the Book Bazaar has been moved over, but they seem to be staying out of the threads. I'm wondering if Vertical Scope told them to back off in order to get more people to post in here. Because back when VS bought it, it was a much more active forum, and they were probably counting on that activity to make money. But then it died off because they changed the terms, which probably wasn't very good for their investment. And I suspect the moderating style, which rankled a lot of people, wasn't good for their investment, either.



I remember this forum in the glory days of Hugh Howey and Amanda M. Lee

It's become a graveyard compared to then


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## Bite the Dusty (Aug 9, 2020)

It's much less of a distraction from writing these days, that's for sure.


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## ShayneRutherford (Mar 24, 2014)

CJSNOW said:


> I remember this forum in the glory days of Hugh Howey and Amanda M. Lee
> 
> It's become a graveyard compared to then


Amanda is still here. But yeah, we've lost tons over the years. It's sad to see it change so much.


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## Jena H (Oct 2, 2011)

Hey, I know what some people think about me (at least on other forums), but I honestly don't care. As others have said: we don't know these people in real life, and they don't know us, and their opinion is not crucial to our existence, much less self-esteem. Not to mention, people _are_ allowed to express their opinions, especially in "private" conversations.


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## Speaker-To-Animals (Feb 21, 2012)

markpauloleksiw said:


> I have a question...who actually owns this domain and the boards?..It really isn't "public" because someone is behind the scenes....


The board was started by an individual not for writers, but for people who owned kindles. He passed on and his heir sold it to a company that basically runs boards into the ground so they can sell advertising. They recently did a forum upgrade and probably the private conversations were a botch in the upgrade.

I've moderated a board actually bigger than this. There isn't a single board anywhere where mods don't vent to each other. (I've been on con staff and we vented about attendees and obnoxious guests of horror too.) Don't take it personally. It's a frustrating job.


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## Brian D. Anderson (Nov 4, 2019)

CJSNOW said:


> I remember this forum in the glory days of Hugh Howey and Amanda M. Lee
> 
> It's become a graveyard compared to then


There was a mass exodus as many writers who were advanced in their careers were getting shouted down for giving honest answers, often to stupid questions. After a time, "Do I need an editor?" makes you want to pull your hair out. Or if someone whose writing is simply not very good asks directly for an opinion on their writing, and you give them what they ask for. A big- no-no. Then there is this old classic of defining success with sales numbers. "If you want to be successful - " "Hey, I am successful! You're just an a$$hole for saying sales and making a living with my writing has anything to do with success." Bunch of hurts feelings there. 
When you try to explain that a writer is making fundamental mistakes that will almost certainly lead them nowhere, and you get told you're a d&%k for telling them, over time you get tired of the argument and move on. 
If a writer wants good advice from professionals they should be prepared for honesty. This profession doesn't suffer the thin skinned.


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## Dpock (Oct 31, 2016)

It's a useful board when you're starting out and, later, for keeping up with Amazon and other platforms. Most of the bickering I've witnessed over the several years I've been following centered around genre vs. literature debates. To lesser degrees, money and roads-to-success threads lit things up occasionally.

This is more a "Book Marketing Forum" than a writer's salon. A name change might be a good way to keep it focused and reduce the occasional flare-ups. As to the mods, I don't mind them venting to each other.


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## NikOK (Jun 27, 2020)

Brian D. Anderson said:


> There was a mass exodus as many writers who were advanced in their careers were getting shouted down for giving honest answers, often to stupid questions. After a time, "Do I need an editor?" makes you want to pull your hair out. Or if someone whose writing is simply not very good asks directly for an opinion on their writing, and you give them what they ask for. A big- no-no. Then there is this old classic of defining success with sales numbers. "If you want to be successful - " "Hey, I am successful! You're just an a$$hole for saying sales and making a living with my writing has anything to do with success." Bunch of hurts feelings there.
> When you try to explain that a writer is making fundamental mistakes that will almost certainly lead them nowhere, and you get told you're a d&%k for telling them, over time you get tired of the argument and move on.
> If a writer wants good advice from professionals they should be prepared for honesty. This profession doesn't suffer the thin skinned.


I mean, maybe, but a thick skin can go both ways. If you are reading "stupid" questions, then why respond? Plus, I haven't been here that long, but I have seen 0 stupid questions. Every question is important to the person asking it, even if you've heard it before. I'm just saying, if you know you've read the last "Do I need an editor?" thread that you can take, why read another one? It sucks to get in an argument that's going no where fast, but if it's one you can avoid and not lose sleep over, the cause is everyone involved. And, as for writers and professionals, everyone is a writer. If you are starting your conversation with someone thinking that you are the better, then yeah, it might go off the rails fast.

To be clear, I'm not saying you are or aren't anything here. I have no personal problem. What I'm trying to say is, it usually takes two to tango, and if you expect a thick skin when someone writes, then have a thick skin when you read.


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## Decon (Feb 16, 2011)

*To be honest with ourselves, this entire site has passed its sell by date.*

It was already only a shadow of its former self before the site was taken over when compared with the heady days of self-publishing. The new site only addresses the needs of the owners and not any benefit to authors participation for the long haul.

That takeover led to an exodus with onerous terms and conditions put forward. The recent changes made it even more of a pain with the loss of valuable bookmarks, in my case built up over 10 years, and only one book in your signature at the prospect of losing your existing signature if you wanted to update with a new release, which in turn has caused a loss in the site's value to stick around.

And now with this thread about the moderators sticking around on here and the revelations, I can't see it coming back even with new moderators. All you have to do is check out how many members are online here at one time to see its finished .Visitors are no benefit to us as they don't participate. In any event, this thread will likely put visitors off from joining. God help everyone if there are no mods and the site degenerates into free for all with trolls of the like that Athonomy sank into before its demise.

Goodness knows I've tried to create interest with threads and replies since the change and so have others, but apart from a few newbies, it just a few of us answering each other. I know I'll be stepping back and I will drop down the monthly list of numbers of posts to oblivion.

The only way I can see it coming back is with new forums. Say one on Amazon and Facebook ads. One on craft and grammar queries. And one to answer queries on how to for self-publishing for newbies. Maybe one to post blurbs and covers for crit. I won't hold my breath, but there has to be a benefit to participating, and right now I don't see it other than filling in times of boredom.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

Eh, I generally agree there are no "stupid" questions. But there are many questions that have already been answered many times. People should really search, read answers, see if their question is specific enough they need a new thread. Not all threads need to be deep and meaningful. And sometimes a person needs a place to vent, a thread just for them. Or there aren't recent posts (let's say six months) and it's worth checking the temperature.

But "do I need an editor" is a stupid question and there are way too many people who argue they don't need to put effort into their books. Or they don't need to treat their work like a business to make money. That's just... not the case. But it's not a Kboards specific problem. It's true in all the author spaces.


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## ShayneRutherford (Mar 24, 2014)

NikOK said:


> Plus, I haven't been here that long, but I have seen 0 stupid questions. Every question is important to the person asking it, even if you've heard it before.


As Crystal said, we used to see a lot of 'do I need an editor' type questions from people who, if you read between the lines of their post, clearly just wanted to be told to go ahead and publish their stuff unedited because they couldn't be bothered putting in the work. But the ones that used to really cause issues were the 'why isn't my book selling?' posts. We used to get one every month or so - or at least, that's the way it seemed - and people would chime in on the post in an effort to help, which was fine as long as the comments weren't directed at the writing. As soon as anyone suggested that the writing was what was preventing the book from selling, the poster would usually fly off the handle and dump all over the people who were trying to help, and then hard feelings would ensue.


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## NikOK (Jun 27, 2020)

Crystal_ said:


> Eh, I generally agree there are no "stupid" questions. But there are many questions that have already been answered many times.


That's fair. I get that it might be irking, but I just find it hard to actually be mad or dismissive of someone for not searching. There's a huge difference between being peeved in your head and responding to someone. Maybe it's just me, I don't know. I've definitely asked tons of questions that were probably answered somewhere else, and I have a terrible memory, so I may even ask them again sometime  Honestly, there are things that someone might say that are good to get mad at, but minor flubs are just the human condition.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

I don't generally get mad at individual people for not searching, but the small annoyance of "why did this person not bother to search this query" adds up across groups and questions. I had to unfollow all my author FB groups partially because of this. And partially because a lot of people would give bad answers and I'd feel compelled to give the correct information and I don't want to be on Facebook all day.

I don't think it's an error so much as an unwillingness to make an effort. Asking questions is a natural part of conversation. But asking a very well-tread question, instead of reading a forum for awhile, suggests a certain laziness of entitlement on the part of the question asker.

Granted, it goes both ways. Plenty of people reply to questions that weren't asked or with unnecessary rudeness. Sometimes people come for A and people jump on B. Once upon a time (long, long ago), I posted looking for moral support and people jumped in to tell me why my book wasn't selling. I didn't ask and I didn't want opinions. Not about sales. I'm sure most people who replied meant well, and some really went out of their way to help me, but some were incredibly rude. I still remember one bigger author who was a jerk. I'm sure she hasn't thought twice about me, but it's not something I forgot. Who knows if it will ever come up? We aren't in the same circles, but there could easily be an opportunity where we might work together, and I would think twice based on her attitude, even if it was many, many years ago.

Forums end up being the sum of the people who stick around. They tend to push out people who don't like the consensus. I've left many forums because they trended in directions I didn't like & I'm up there in the top( tier of opiniated loudmouths. (That is, most opinionated and loudmouthed... Well, maybe the second highest tier). Most people will leave rather than pushing back. Most people on forums are lurkers, not posters.

A few years ago, a popular erotica/erom forum trended very pro-scammer (people were defending those who stole engagement photos for their FB ads, amongst other things) and a lot of more upstanding people left. I know many people who left a certain FB group run by an author who... shall we say, is unwilling to let opinions that oppose theirs stand. I left another big (in my community) group/space because there was an unwillingness to say anything critical.

In indie authoring in general and in romance specifically there's a big culture of silence. It's not considered okay to point out bad behavior or problematic book content. So I appreciate that Kboards isn't really that way. Even if sometimes it's too far in the other direction.

This is the only place where I will not hesitate to call out David Guaughran for his bullying. Even without making general statements, he's attacked me personally (on these boards), just for disagreeing with his assessment of the ToS. (Remember arguments about bonus books? Feels like that was so long ago...) TBH this is a totally unnecessary call out, but I'm in a mood. Anyone who wants to see his behavior for themselves can search and see how he treats people.


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## NikOK (Jun 27, 2020)

Crystal_ said:


> I've left many forums because they trended in directions I didn't like & I'm up there in the top( tier of opiniated loudmouths. (That is, most opinionated and loudmouthed... Well, maybe the second highest tier). =


Well, I don't know what it's worth, but I always appreciate whatever tier of loudmouth you are  Your opinions are well thought out and I always come away with a lot more to think about. So, thanks!

I feel like maybe I came onto this board after it calmed down a bit. When you say things like, " I posted looking for moral support and people jumped in to tell me why my book wasn't selling." and "he's attacked me personally (on these boards), just for disagreeing with his assessment of the ToS" it makes me think that I wouldn't have lasted 10 minutes in the old forum. Maybe it's slow now, but at least we can chat about random things and do it with a smile. Maybe it's not how it was, and I get that that's a bummer to people who have been here, but for my vote, I really enjoy getting a chance to talk to you all about book things.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

Crystal_ said:


> This is the only place where I will not hesitate to call out [Redacted] for his bullying. Even without making general statements, he's attacked me personally (on these boards), just for disagreeing with his assessment of the ToS. (Remember arguments about bonus books? Feels like that was so long ago...) TBH this is a totally unnecessary call out, but I'm in a mood. Anyone who wants to see his behavior for themselves can search and see how he treats people.


I’ve been attacked for far less on this very forum. It also involved a much beloved self-publishing guru. I’ve still got some pretty disturbing PMs from this individual for just daring to call out some double standards that this board likes to traffic in.

Even though things got very nasty in those PMs (I don’t think it actually had anything to do with me; the guru was obviously doing a lot of projecting) I don’t blame that individual. I blame the toxic members of this forum who couldn’t handle any criticism, no matter how slight, of their cult of personality. And I blame the mods for obviously playing favorites.

(Edited quote because I don’t think this discussion should be about specific individuals. It’s about the mods and their many shortcomings.)


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## Paranormal Kitty (Jun 13, 2017)

Those of y'all who hate stupid questions stay off the Reddit writing sub. Literally every day someone asks some variation of "how do I describe non-white people?"


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## Some Random Guy (Jan 16, 2016)

This forum has, for all intents and purposes, become useless since the predators (i.e. new owners) took over. Too much noise (read idiots), too little signal.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

I love r/Writing. It's hilarious. Every other post is "is it okay if I do this." I want to make a bot that replies to these threads with "no, it's forbidden," but I don't know how to program, so that's not happening.

Kboards has had issues with people worshiping certain indie authors who are heavy posters. In most cases, the authors did a lot to try to advise people, but they're still one person with one opinion and one experience. One person can't give anyone the full picture of publishing, especially when they started many years in the past.


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## Brian D. Anderson (Nov 4, 2019)

NikOK said:


> I mean, maybe, but a thick skin can go both ways. If you are reading "stupid" questions, then why respond? Plus, I haven't been here that long, but I have seen 0 stupid questions. Every question is important to the person asking it, even if you've heard it before. I'm just saying, if you know you've read the last "Do I need an editor?" thread that you can take, why read another one? It sucks to get in an argument that's going no where fast, but if it's one you can avoid and not lose sleep over, the cause is everyone involved. And, as for writers and professionals, everyone is a writer. If you are starting your conversation with someone thinking that you are the better, then yeah, it might go off the rails fast.
> 
> To be clear, I'm not saying you are or aren't anything here. I have no personal problem. What I'm trying to say is, it usually takes two to tango, and if you expect a thick skin when someone writes, then have a thick skin when you read.


But _is _every question important? Really? I was 100% certain the use of the word "stupid" would set people off. Just like "success" usually does. Because no one asks stupid questions, no one is a bad writer, and everyone deserves a trophy. The most tragic loss to this forum was Russell Blake. His no-nonsense way of telling people what it takes to make a living as a writer hurt more feelings than I can count. But at the same time it helped hundreds of writers shed their delusions and put them on the track where they might just make a go of it. And many of them did.
The "we're all equals" attitude is part of what chased the experienced writers away. We're not. If we were, no one would need advice. This isn't a court of law. I'm not Brandon Sanderson's equal when it comes to being a writer. Thinking that having the ability to turn on your computer and type what's in your head makes you a writer devalues the profession. Having a story to tell and being a writer is not the same thing. For a professional writer it's like saying I own a guitar, therefore I'm a guitarist. I may play. But unless I'm making a living doing it, the claim is both a lie and insulting to guitarists who have put the time and effort into developing their skills and career. At some point likely I'll get the predictable, "What if you play at a pro level but don't do it for a living?" But that's off topic. Still I thought I'd cut it off before it happened.
The most common questions have the simplest answers.
Do I need an editor? Yes.
Why hasn't my ranking updated? It just hasn't. Stop clicking refresh.
How do I get more reviews? Sell more books. Reviews are the result of sales not the cause.
Should I respond to a bad review? No.
Why isn't my book selling? Wrong question. You'll never find the answer until you ask the right one which is: Why did other books in my genre sell and mine didn't?
How is my blurb? If you need to ask, probably not great. It's teaser, not a synopsis.
Why did I get a bad review? Because they didn't like the book. It happens. Get over it.
Should I release my book before it's edited? Only if you don't care about your work.

Not to say there aren't valid question about marketing, writer resources, etc. But there _are _stupid questions. And as before, I am 100% certain this post will trigger people. Just know that, as the great Rick Sanchez said: Your boos mean nothing. I've seen what you cheer for.


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## jb1111 (Apr 6, 2018)

Crystal_ said:


> Eh, I generally agree there are no "stupid" questions. But there are many questions that have already been answered many times. People should really search, read answers, see if their question is specific enough they need a new thread. Not all threads need to be deep and meaningful. And sometimes a person needs a place to vent, a thread just for them. Or there aren't recent posts (let's say six months) and it's worth checking the temperature.
> 
> But "do I need an editor" is a stupid question and there are way too many people who argue they don't need to put effort into their books. Or they don't need to treat their work like a business to make money. That's just... not the case. But it's not a Kboards specific problem. It's true in all the author spaces.


There are no stupid questions. That was my mantra in college, and it's still my mantra now. I remember what it was like to be a newbie indie author, where nearly every question is probably "stupid".

RE: "Do I need an editor?" Maybe, maybe not. That's why there are threads about them. Some need them more than others. Not all starting authors can afford one.

That is why the "stupid question" and "do I need an editor" threads appear. As for searching for older threads to get your answers, great. Then you have a question about what you've just read, and you bring up the old thread with the question, and you get throttled for reviving a five year old thread (the figurative "you", not you personally, Crystal). For a newbie in that situation, there's no way to win.

Look, it's a forum. A lot of back and forth happens. It's the nature of forums. If the big guns all left, they did it for whatever reason. If perhaps some of them want to blame newbies asking dumb questions, or some newbies maybe being a bit cantankerous, it's on them, not the newbies. Most veterans were probably cantankerous at some time during their career.

As NikOK mentions, if one doesn't like the subject of the thread, because it's a stupid question (or other reason), why not just move on? Instead, maybe some have moved onto other forums, or away from forums altogether. That also happens. I've seen forums come and go (in other subject matters). Some forums I used to frequent that were hyper active in 2009 are deadsville now. It happens.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

No, you need an editor. Everyone needs an editor. Or I should say... It's always the smart strategic choice to hire an editor.

I really don't think many would get annoyed with the newbie in that situation, who is really here to learn and receptive to advice, and only replies to threads when they really need to ask. If the only info is in a five year old thread, heck yeah, make a new thread. But if someone posted a generic question last week... No excuse for reposting.

I gotta say why does my book not sell and why do other books sell when mine doesn't sound like the same question to me. This isn't even really the right place to ask though. You need a more genre targeted space. I actually find most people who ask are receptive to feedback, though sometimes people do get touchy about writing quality.

I don't think quality is a big factor in individual books selling, especially for new authors. How can anyone know if a book is good before they read/buy it? And who's to say what's good or bad? I've read bad bestsellers and great books that barely sold.

I do think people can be quick to answer questions no one asked. People sometimes need that, but sometimes it's just mean. I haven't seen that recently. Like I said. It goes both ways. But overall this board is still one of the better places to talk indie business IMO.


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## NikOK (Jun 27, 2020)

Brian D. Anderson said:


> But _is _every question important? Really? I was 100% certain the use of the word "stupid" would set people off. Just like "success" usually does. Because no one asks stupid questions, no one is a bad writer, and everyone deserves a trophy. The most tragic loss to this forum was Russell Blake. His no-nonsense way of telling people what it takes to make a living as a writer hurt more feelings than I can count. But at the same time it helped hundreds of writers shed their delusions and put them on the track where they might just make a go of it. And many of them did.
> The "we're all equals" attitude is part of what chased the experienced writers away. We're not. If we were, no one would need advice. This isn't a court of law. I'm not Brandon Sanderson's equal when it comes to being a writer. Thinking that having the ability to turn on your computer and type what's in your head makes you a writer devalues the profession. Having a story to tell and being a writer is not the same thing. For a professional writer it's like saying I own a guitar, therefore I'm a guitarist. I may play. But unless I'm making a living doing it, the claim is both a lie and insulting to guitarists who have put the time and effort into developing their skills and career. At some point likely I'll get the predictable, "What if you play at a pro level but don't do it for a living?" But that's off topic. Still I thought I'd cut it off before it happened.
> The most common questions have the simplest answers.
> Do I need an editor? Yes.
> ...


Bwhaha....yeah, I'm out of this conversation. We have no middle ground, so there is no point in arguing it. Best of luck with your professionalism, and best of luck with spending your time quoting "great" people, and best of luck with just knowing oh so many things.


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## Brian D. Anderson (Nov 4, 2019)

NikOK said:


> Bwhaha....yeah, I'm out of this conversation. We have no middle ground, so there is no point in arguing it. Best of luck with your professionalism, and best of luck with spending your time quoting "great" people, and best of luck with just knowing oh so many things.


"Every breath I take without your consent raises my self-esteem." Rick Sanchez


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## Gareth K Pengelly (Aug 25, 2012)

Brian D. Anderson said:


> "Every breath I take without your consent raises my self-esteem." Rick Sanchez


"Use the force, Harry." - Gandalf.


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## Some Random Guy (Jan 16, 2016)

Beam me up, Scotty. There's no intelligent life down here.
-J.T. Kirk


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## Brian D. Anderson (Nov 4, 2019)

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">via GIPHY</a></p>][/ICODE]


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## jb1111 (Apr 6, 2018)

This thread seems to have gone downhill rather quickly.


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## Some Random Guy (Jan 16, 2016)

It started at the bottom of a rut - there was no hill to go down in the first place.


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## Joe Vasicek (Mar 18, 2021)

........ said:


> If you've ever received a mod warning or anything like that, go to conversations and click on it. It seems with the site software update all the private mod conversations they had about you are now available for you to see.
> 
> They called me a bitch. Betsy did, actually. I also got called a bunch of other insulting things.
> 
> ...


Apparently, if you've been permanently banned from KBoards, your account did not migrate with everything else, and all of your old posts are now attributed to "Guest." But on the plus side, they aren't blocking my IP anymore either.

I'm sure the mods said many choice words about me when I was perma-banned for standing up to a SJW mob. It's a pity all of that was lost, since it sure would have been amusing to look back on. A few months after that incident, the intended victim of the mob introduced herself to me at a convention and thanked me for standing up for her. I'm a lot more careful about the battles I pick now, but I will never, never apologize to a mob. The final straw was probably when I posted this quote:

“He who takes offense when no offense is intended is a fool, and he who takes offense when offense is intended is a greater fool.” —Brigham Young


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

I gotta be honest. Posting that quote strikes me as an extremely passive aggressive move.


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## Joe Vasicek (Mar 18, 2021)

Crystal_ said:


> I gotta be honest. Posting that quote strikes me as an extremely passive aggressive move.


You're probably right about that. I wasn't as good at picking battles back then. As for posting it now, you're probably right about that too!

I do think it's a valid point, though: offense can never be given, only taken. A lot of drama could be avoided if more people took that to heart.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

Oh dear lords, now we have banned posters coming back.

Just what this cesspool needs.

(Can we get the mods back, please? Lol 😂)


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

Joe Vasicek said:


> You're probably right about that. I wasn't as good at picking battles back then. As for posting it now, you're probably right about that too!
> 
> I do think it's a valid point, though: offense can never be given, only taken. A lot of drama could be avoided if more people took that to heart.


I don't know if I agree with that thesis. I get the overarching point. Sometimes people take offense when it isn't intended, but, often, people do very much intend offense. Sure, it can't be given, but it can be a goal. People often try to hurt other people. Maybe not as often as we assume but often enough. Especially online. There are plenty of posters who stir the pot for shits and giggles.

It's frustrating when people take offense to what you thought was an innocent point. And we'd probably all be better off not assuming the worst. But telling someone they're a fool for taking offense is really not productive, if you genuinely want to have a thoughtful conversation. It's only going to offend them further.


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## Corvid (May 15, 2014)

............


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## zioxus (Mar 17, 2021)

Has it been determined that the moderators are really gone? Has anyone contacted the owners to volunteer their services?


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## Brian D. Anderson (Nov 4, 2019)

zioxus said:


> Has it been determined that the moderators are really gone? Has anyone contacted the owners to volunteer their services?


I think you should. Contact them and raise their awareness Though in all honesty I only just checked back on this site while drunk and bored. So following my lead might not be the best idea.


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## zioxus (Mar 17, 2021)

*"I only just checked back on this site while drunk and bored."* 

It must be Friday already somewhere.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

zioxus said:


> *"I only just checked back on this site while drunk and bored."*
> 
> It must be Friday already somewhere.


Oh look, cest la vie/Bite the Dusty has a new account and now they want to be a mod.

Must be a day that ends in y.

😂😂😂


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## Joe Vasicek (Mar 18, 2021)

Crystal_ said:


> I don't know if I agree with that thesis. I get the overarching point. Sometimes people take offense when it isn't intended, but, often, people do very much intend offense. Sure, it can't be given, but it can be a goal. People often try to hurt other people. Maybe not as often as we assume but often enough. Especially online. There are plenty of posters who stir the pot for shits and giggles.
> 
> It's frustrating when people take offense to what you thought was an innocent point. And we'd probably all be better off not assuming the worst. But telling someone they're a fool for taking offense is really not productive, if you genuinely want to have a thoughtful conversation. It's only going to offend them further.


There is a difference between being hurt and being offended, just like there's a difference between being a victim and being a survivor.

When somebody hurts you, that is entirely on them, not you. You can't choose not to be hurt—it is something that just happens, whether you choose it or not. And it doesn't really matter whether the people who hurt you didn't intend it. It still hurts.

But when you become offended, that is a response. A choice. Somebody hurt you, and you chose to respond to that hurt by becoming offended. And that's on you. Otherwise, you have no individual agency at all. You are not someone who acts, but someone who is acted upon. You have given up all power over your emotional well-being to the people who have offended you.

When you realize that you can choose not to be offended when other people hurt you, it empowers you. It liberates you. It gives you the power to take back control of your own life from the people who have hurt you. You stop being a victim, and instead become a survivor.

This is what Victor Frankl learned in the Nazi concentration camps. It's what Jesus meant when he taught his followers to turn the other cheek, and walk the extra mile. Unfortunately, because of how our culture treats victimhood as some sort of virtue, it is something that we have lost.

When somebody hurts you, you don't have to be offended by it—even if they intended to offend you. Likewise, when somebody wants to be offended at you, it doesn't actually matter whether you've hurt them or not—they can always find something that offends them.

The world would be a better place if everyone tried not to hurt each other, but it would be an even better place if everyone tried not to be offended.


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## zioxus (Mar 17, 2021)

*"...now they want to be a mod."*

Me? Not by a long shot.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

Joe Vasicek said:


> The world would be a better place if everyone tried not to hurt each other, but it would be an even better place if everyone tried not to be offended.


I assume you mean in addition to people trying not to hurt each other. Because if the world would improve by 1% by people trying not to be offended, it would improve by 50% by people trying not to hurt each other.

I don't think you're going to be effective with this argument, because it still comes across as blaming people for being hurt* even when someone was trying to hurt them. *

You can't control your feelings, just as you can't control the physical sensations in your body. I really can't control how I initially react to something a person has said, whether that person is my husband or a stranger on the internet. What I can do, is control what I do next. I'm upset by many things. It depends on my mood of course, but these days, with quarantine and genre trends and author attitudes in my genre... I've got a short fuse a lot of the time. I'll admit that. I'm often upset by something I see on the net (since that's my main way of interacting these days). I rarely act on it right away. Usually, I let it fade. I forget it even happened. But sometimes it sticks around, and I get more upset, and I see it really was an issue.

Even if someone didn't mean to hurt me, even if they tried to help me, that doesn't mean I should accept their supposed good intentions and say nothing. I should still address the issue, if I want to put effort into our relationship.

If they're a rando on the internet... probably not. I'll probably shrug ugh, what a jackhole!

But your whole position strikes me as very much a position of a straight, white dude. I've heard this argument so many times, from so many straight, white dudes, about how I shouldn't be offended by the treatment of some female character on some TV show for... some reason. And it just doesn't fly. I don't want to be offended, but the solution is not me being less sensitive. It's other people not writing sexist shit.

Like I said, I understand your point... you're in control of your actions. Sometimes, it's best to let it go, and not dignify someone with your time and energy. But your argument is very close to "be less sensitive" and that's BS. I'm really not that sensitive. Ask my friends. They'll say I'm a ruthless B. (Hopefully as a compliment). But I am pretty effin' tuned to story, so I pick up on all the undertones and themes there.


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## Joe Vasicek (Mar 18, 2021)

Crystal_ said:


> I assume you mean in addition to people trying not to hurt each other. Because if the world would improve by 1% by people trying not to be offended, it would improve by 50% by people trying not to hurt each other.
> 
> I don't think you're going to be effective with this argument, because it still comes across as blaming people for being hurt* even when someone was trying to hurt them. *
> 
> ...


I am a practicing, faithful member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (aka the "Mormons"). If I were to take the approach you propose toward everything that offends my moral sensibilities—"the solution is not me being less sensitive. It's other people not writing [things that offend me]"—then between 60% to 80% of entertainment media would be cancelled, including Amazon's entire erotica section. But I don't become offended at those things, and I don't call for that media to be cancelled. I simply choose not to consume that media.

What makes your moral sensibilities superior to my moral sensibilities? Why should we force our society to stop producing media that offends you, but not to stop producing media that offends me? If we do adopt your proposed solution, how do you know that it won't blow back on you when our society's moral standards change?


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## cest la vie (Feb 4, 2021)

zioxus said:


> *"...now they want to be a mod."*
> 
> Me? Not by a long shot.


@......~...... thinks everyone who doesn't agree with them is the same person.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

cest la vie said:


> @......~...... thinks everyone who doesn't agree with them is the same person.


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## David VanDyke (Jan 3, 2014)

Most of the time people don't need mods. What they need is self-control.

And that includes the self-control to find the "ignore all posts from user" function and use it, to ignore people you absolutely can't stand, and not give in to the temptation to see what they say and engage with their douchebaggery. 

I have several people on ignore and I am far happier for it.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

The ignore feature sounds great in theory, but not in practice.

1. I browse this forum when I’m logged out, so I’d see their posts anyway.

2. I can’t ignore problematic posts and posters. If I see bullying and ganging up of any kind, I _will_ call it out. By ignoring it, you’re silently supporting it.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

Hi, folks. Apologies for not responding sooner -- I've been absent with a health issue for a while.

I'm not sure exactly what became visible during the changeover. Private messages, somehow? If so, I'm sure they're full of inappropriate remarks. Moderating here is (_was_, in the case of Betsy and Ann, who have retired) stressful. Our own annoyances, dislikes, and fits of pique could never see the light of day; sounding off to one another was the only available release. I'm sure I've said stuff privately to Ann and Betsy that I never would've said publicly. If I said something hurtful about you in anger, I apologize for it. I definitely have my fits of temper, and moderating here has given me to more of them than just about anything else.


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## Crystal_ (Aug 13, 2014)

......~...... said:


> 2. I can’t ignore problematic posts and posters. If I see bullying and ganging up of any kind, I _will_ call it out. By ignoring it, you’re silently supporting it.


I think this is sometimes true. But it's sometimes true that engaging with posters is supporting them. A lot of people feed on attention and ignoring them really is the best way to starve them out. It depends on the situation. And sometimes it's hard to tell at first.


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## ......~...... (Jul 4, 2015)

Crystal_ said:


> I think this is sometimes true. But it's sometimes true that engaging with posters is supporting them. A lot of people feed on attention and ignoring them really is the best way to starve them out. It depends on the situation. And sometimes it's hard to tell at first.


My main trigger for engaging is when I see people ganging up on someone who’s well and truly already on the ground. If I see someone spewing misinformation is also another trigger.

But yeah, there are some posters that can and should be ignored. There’s a certain poster that I’m not engaging with because we already had prior interactions on another forum. I know for a fact that this person will never change and loves the opportunity to share their problematic views, so if you simply ignore them, they won’t be able to spout off.


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## zioxus (Mar 17, 2021)

Becca, my post you deleted was not continuing a locked-thread discussion. I was commenting on threads in general and letting them run their course.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

zioxus said:


> Becca, my post you deleted was not continuing a locked-thread discussion. I was commenting on threads in general and letting them run their course.


You can begin a new thread on that general topic if you would like, but it does not belong in this thread, and a new thread must not continue discussion from a locked thread.


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