# Upset about inaccurate Amazon book reviews...



## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

I checked out the latet David Baldacci book, "First Family" for Kindle on Amazon.com this morning.



I was surprised to see only a 2 1/2 star rating. There are 47 customer reviews so far. Reading all of the reviews revealed that there were many 1 star reviews dragging down the rating and EVERY ONE of these low reviews (27 out of 47 to be exact!) was because of the higher than $9.99 release price for the Kindle version! Not one of these 1 star complainers had actually read the book! The book is now $9.99 as most of them do settle down to this price quite soon, but this author is stuck with the 2 1/2 star false rating. Most of the ratings by people who had actually read the book were 4 & 5 stars. This book would have had a great rating if it were not for these bogus reviewers.

I think this is so unfair to an author. One should not review a book unless he has actually read it and then should review it based on the story, the plot , the characters, and the quality of the writing.

So, people, if you browse Kindle books and look at the star ratings as I do, when you see a low rating actually read the reviews and judge their quality before making a judgement on the book. I will certainly be buying this book for my Kindle, now that I have dug for the true rating.

I just had to say something. I'm interested in your thoughts on this subject.


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## Kathy (Nov 5, 2008)

I agree completely. If you think the price is to high, don't buy it. Thanks for bringing this up.


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## Laurie (Jan 9, 2009)

DD said:


> I checked out the latet David Baldacci book, "First Family" for Kindle on Amazon.com this morning.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I always look through the reviews to see why a book got the ratings it did. If I see a book that catches my eye, I'll read a sampling of the good reviews and the bad reviews. Usually the bad reviews aren't necessarily based on the book itself. If it's a political book, it will be sabatoged by people with differing views even though they haven't read it. Other times, like in this instance, it's based on the book price. There are other things too, I can't come up with specific examples off the top of my head but I know I've seen various reasons for negative reviews that have nothing to do with the story. It would be nice if books were rated ONLY by people who ACTUALLY READ THEM. - but that's often not the case.


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

Kathy said:


> I agree completely. If you think the price is to high, don't buy it. Thanks for bringing this up.


I just had to, Kathy. I did comment on a few of the "too pricey" reviews at Amazon but those comments probably fell on dear ears since only the disgruntled reviewer reads them (maybe). I knew I couldn't be alone in my sense of the injustice of this.


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## intinst (Dec 23, 2008)

I agree that people who don't read a book or try out a ptoduct should not post reviews. I don't think they should be allowed to post.


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

Laurie said:


> I always look through the reviews to see why a book got the ratings it did. If I see a book that catches my eye, I'll read a sampling of the good reviews and the bad reviews. Usually the bad reviews aren't necessarily based on the book itself. If it's a political book, it will be sabatoged by people with differing views even though they haven't read it. Other times, like in this instance, it's based on the book price. There are other things too, I can't come up with specific examples off the top of my head but I know I've seen various reasons for negative reviews that have nothing to do with the story. It would be nice if books were rated ONLY by people who ACTUALLY READ THEM. - but that's often not the case.


You're right, Laurie. I've seen other products given bad reviews also. For instance, there was a bad review of a cover for Kindle because it didn't fit the Kindle 2, when the product description clearly said it was for the Kindle 1 only! Go figure!

Bottom line: always sort through the reviews of a product you're interested in, as you do.


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

intinst said:


> I agree that people who don't read a book or try out a ptoduct should not post reviews. I don't think they should be allowed to post.


I wish Amazon had a way of controlling this.


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## LADennis (Apr 5, 2009)

I learned a while back that you actually have to go to the reviews and READ them for that very reason. It is a shame that this book has such a poor star rating because of people ranting about the price and price only! UGH!


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## WalterK (Mar 2, 2009)

In complete agreement with the OP. I really dislike the "soap box" reviews that use the review infrastructure as a way of commenting upon factors external to the product such as pricing, release policies, the dreaded DRM, etc. etc.

It isn't restricted to books by any means (not that anyone was suggesting such a thing). Go look at all the one star reviews for



where everyone is whining because the extended cuts aren't included. I go through the one star reviews and mark them as not helpful when I'm in the mood.

- Walter.


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## Forster (Mar 9, 2009)

I'm of the opinion, if you don't like the price, don't buy it and leave it at that......period.  IMO these types of antics are childish at best.

The only thing these people are going to accomplish is getting kindle versions pulled by the publishers when a new book is released and pissing off those who don't have problem paying full price upon initial release.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

These are probably the same people who rant about people who review a kindle and don't own one.  I do disagree with the poster who says he just negs 1 star reviews.  Sometimes a product deserves a one star review.  Not often, but it does occur.  I hope you read the one star reviews before you just mark them not helpful.  I don't, personally do boycotts, but I think the 9 99 boycott tag seems more appropriate on the book in this thread then the one star reviews (espicially if they mention the price as a reason.)


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## mlewis78 (Apr 19, 2009)

I don't judge a book by the number of stars it gets on Amazon.  There are always detractors of the books, and it's not so much about kindle prices as by people who don't like the concept of a book, even though they haven't read it.  Sometimes the content of reader reviews do help, and I can judge the reviews individually.

Marti


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

I agree with DD. I think it's wrong to rate a book poorly because of the price. That only hurts the author and the author had nothing to do with it (given that this isn't an indie published book where the author sets the price). If the price is too high, don't buy the book. It's as simple as that.

L


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## Steph H (Oct 28, 2008)

I haven't done this in awhile (partly because I haven't run across it in awhile), but I used to report those low star ratings done solely because of Kindle price to Amazon (using the "report this" button). On the few books where I monitored it after-the-fact, usually because it was a book I was waiting on the price to go down myself, Amazon would usually remove those low star ratings.

27 is a lot of ratings to report in this particular case, but generally speaking, if it really bothers you, by all means click on the Report button and Amazon will do something about it! (Not to say that I'm so special they did it just because of me, I'm sure I wasn't the only one. )

Oh yeah, and I'd rate those reviews as "not helpful" (or whatever the verbiage is), too.


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## David J. Guyton (Jan 6, 2009)

Actually, it is Amazon's policy to remove reviews such as the ones described. If you see these reviews, mark them as inappropriate...otherwise Amazon will not know about them.

And I agree with everyone totally.


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## geoffthomas (Feb 27, 2009)

Yeah, I think you have to be real subjective about this issue.
Sometimes I feel inclined to give a 1 or 2 star to a really good book because the spelling, grammar and punctuation are so bad (and that is in the DTB copies).  But I don't do it if the book is a good read and I enjoyed reading it anyway.  Once in a while I read a marginal book that has these problems and I am tempted to not finish it.  
But tempted though I may sometimes be, I have never actually given 1 or 2 stars to a good book.
And I don't think others should either.
Just sayin.......


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## VictoriaP (Mar 1, 2009)

David J. Guyton said:


> Actually, it is Amazon's policy to remove reviews such as the ones described. If you see these reviews, mark them as inappropriate...otherwise Amazon will not know about them.
> 
> And I agree with everyone totally.


This is good to know; while this particular book isn't one I'd likely read, the price only reviews are completely out of line. I've gone through & marked them all "not helpful"--guess I'll start reporting them next.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

I don't think it is a problem to rate them as "not helpful" if the only reason they state for a one star is the price.  I was just meaning to go through and mark all 1 star as not helpful may not be the right thing either.  Especially if they listed other reasons for the low ratings.


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

The biggest problem with the unfair 1 star reviews, is that sometimes I am looking for something "good" to read and I sort by ratings. I miss out on some good stuff that way when they have low ratings just because of the price!


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## Shizu (Oct 27, 2008)

So if enough of people click on the Report button, Amazon will correct this?


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## Steph H (Oct 28, 2008)

Red said:


> I don't, personally do boycotts, but I think the 9 99 boycott tag seems more appropriate on the book in this thread then the one star reviews (espicially if they mention the price as a reason.)


I've never tried searching for anything on Amazon using tags so have no idea whether tags really do any good. But one thing I dislike about all those boycott and pricing tags is this -- what happens when the price goes down? Do the tags get taken off? Or is it forever a black mark against the book (like the bad reviews would be, if no one marked them to be reported)? I don't know if there's a way to remove/report tags or not. Otherwise, using tags in this manner is just as irresponsible and unfair as leaving a one-star review, IMO.


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## David J. Guyton (Jan 6, 2009)

Shizu said:


> So if enough of people click on the Report button, Amazon will correct this?


Yes, eventually, but don't hold your breath. They have a lot to manage over there at amazon and can't get things done fast. I THINK I read on another forum about a Baldacci book having this done once already, but I am not positive if it was one of his books.


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

Red said:


> I don't think it is a problem to rate them as "not helpful" if the only reason they state for a one star is the price. I was just meaning to go through and mark all 1 star as not helpful may not be the right thing either. Especially if they listed other reasons for the low ratings.


No other reasons were given in the one star ratings for this particular book. In fact, not one of the one star reviewers had read the book.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Steph H said:


> I've never tried searching for anything on Amazon using tags so have no idea whether tags really do any good. But one thing I dislike about all those boycott and pricing tags is this -- what happens when the price goes down? Do the tags get taken off? Or is it forever a black mark against the book (like the bad reviews would be, if no one marked them to be reported)? I don't know if there's a way to remove/report tags or not. Otherwise, using tags in this manner is just as irresponsible and unfair as leaving a one-star review, IMO.


With the tags, if someone reading the review sees the tag, and you click on it, you will get a "do you agree with this tag". As people click yes and no, the count changes, if it gets to zero it goes away. So, in theory, unlike the review, the 9 99 boycot tag would go away if people clicked the don't agree after the price went down. Even if people didn't go click the "no" to tags, the reader could see the price and know if it is relevant or not, which is harder to do with the average star review unless you read the reviews.


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## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I have no problem telling how the cow ate the cabbage so here it is.

The people giving a low review based only on the price of the book are *SCUM*. At the very least they should be locked out of ever being allowed to post another review and in my opinion should be completely locked out of Amazon permanently. Hopefully that wasn't too unclear to be understood.


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

LDB said:


> I have no problem telling how the cow ate the cabbage so here it is.
> 
> The people giving a low review based only on the price of the book are *SCUM*. At the very least they should be locked out of ever being allowed to post another review and in my opinion should be completely locked out of Amazon permanently. Hopefully that wasn't too unclear to be understood.


Crystal clear and well said! ha-ha


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## VictoriaP (Mar 1, 2009)

LDB said:


> I have no problem telling how the cow ate the cabbage so here it is.
> 
> The people giving a low review based only on the price of the book are *SCUM*. At the very least they should be locked out of ever being allowed to post another review and in my opinion should be completely locked out of Amazon permanently. Hopefully that wasn't too unclear to be understood.


Well said. 

I went through & reported every "price based" review on that particular book. Took about five minutes, but at least now Amazon should be aware of their names. I only wish it was practical to do with all the others that are probably out there.

And the idiots are bragging on the Amazon forums that they're responsible for bringing the price down. Never mind that oh, most new releases that come out start above $9.99 and drop about a week or two later.


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## danfan (Apr 17, 2009)

A few days ago, I read that Amazon had removed all these false reviews to level up the stars, so I was surprised to see them all there. Have they been put back?? Or are these new ones, I wonder?  

I *do* use stars to decide whether to even bother delving into book reviews, so all these false 1 stars will be turning a lot of people like me away. I don't mind a comment within a review that it was too expensive, but I read reviews solely to determine if the book is worth my time. *I* can decide whether or not it's too expensive for my wallet.


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## Forster (Mar 9, 2009)

I'm not quite sure why all the whining about the price over at the amazon forums either.  These people act surprised when not all books are $9.99?  Did they not read and understand that this was just for books on the NYT's bestsellers?


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## marianneg (Nov 4, 2008)

Some people just don't understand the free market system.


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## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I use star reviews for a few different things. In the case of Amazon, due to the *MORONS* who are so petty and give a 1 without reading the book and based on price only, I add up all the 3, 4 and 5 ratings, subtract 1 point if there's any 2's plus 1 point if there's any 1's and then calculate my own average. I figure that's much closer to the accurate number.


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## RJ Keller (Mar 9, 2009)

THANK you for this thread! So far I've been fortunate with Amazon reviews (although I'm not holding my breath), but I've had Goodreads reviewers give me a "I haven't read this, but..." one / two star reviews. How frustrating!!

But it definitely gives me pause when doing my own book shopping, to not take the ratings at face value.


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

VictoriaP said:


> Well said.
> 
> I went through & reported every "price based" review on that particular book. Took about five minutes, but at least now Amazon should be aware of their names. I only wish it was practical to do with all the others that are probably out there.
> 
> And the idiots are bragging on the Amazon forums that they're responsible for bringing the price down. Never mind that oh, most new releases that come out start above $9.99 and drop about a week or two later.


Yeah, I went through and did the same thing, Victoria. Can't believe they think they brought the price down. LOL


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## Kilgore Trout (Dec 28, 2008)

Please allow me to speak for a moment on the subject of Amazon reviews. As the founder of PODBRAM, I have developed a keen sense for the smell of horse puckey from the Amazon reviews. There are several different categories of Amazon reviewers. 

The most common are the ones who just slap five stars up there and add a few blase comments because the reviewer is either a friend of the author or an addict of the subject matter. The one-star reviews from the same group can also be the opinions of self-proclaimed experts in the genre, or, as mentioned in the opening of this post, someone who is complaining about something irrelevant to the content of the book!

The second most common type are the volume reviewers and Amazon addicts. Most of these will compose a review of most anything, whether they have read the whole book or not, although I suspect they are more likely to have completed the book than those in the first group. Most of their reviews are of the five-star type.

The third category is closely related to the second one, except these reviewers have been paid by the authors. The ringleader of this club is Reader Views, a very high volume review for hire business located very close to me. I find this operation particularly despicable because the people running the operation get the cash, not the actual reviewers, many of whom are kids. This is far from the only one of these review for hire operations, but it is the largest.

The fourth category of reviews are the only ones composed as most readers would actually expect. A customer buys the book, reads it, and writes an honest review. An unfortunate percentage of the total Amazon reviews are actually of this type.

The fifth category is the home of PODBRAM and many other free review sites. We are organized and honest in our opinions, and we are not in it for the money. As with most of these sites, most of our reviewers are also authors, so we are in the been-there-done-that category.

The final category are the Amazon Vine Reviewers. I am also officially one of these, although I think I have actually reviewed only one book under this system. The reason is that I am simply covered up in PODBRAM activity, with books always waiting to be read. When you see the Amazon Vine logo, this means the reviewer probably had a pre-release review copy, so the Vine review might seem to appear before anyone has had time to read the book, but that is not the case.

You can learn a lot more about these categories of Amazon reviewers simply by doing a little research. Anytime you question what is being said by a particular reviewer, just track him down from the links and see what else the person or group has reviewed. You will be surprised how much you will learn! Thank you.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Kilgore, I'm a vine reviewer as well. And I do think there is a lot of confusion with the vine reviews because they do come up on release day, or shortly after.  I'm reading Road Dogs, by Elmore Leonard for vine now.  I don't recall the pending release date, but it is soon. I try to give reviews that will help the potential buyer, not the author or Amazon. I feel like that is what Amazon wants from Vine reviewers.  If it helps all three I think that is great, but my 1st sense of responsibility it to the person who may be getting ready to spend their money.  That is why I made the comment about not automatically hitting the non-helpful on 1 star reviews.  I've only actually given one 1 star review for anything, and it was a book, and I was very detailed to what it was about the book that lead to the 1 star. It immediately got 3 non-helpful votes.  But, I'm ok with that because my review was honest.  What is PODBRAM?


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## Kilgore Trout (Dec 28, 2008)

I'm sorry, Red, I have yet to get the hang of how to make outside links for these posts. PODBRAM is a book review blog. Al Past (The Distant Cousin Series) and Dianne Salerni (High Spirits) are also involved in the project. Celia Hayes has four books available in the Kindle format, too, but I don't think she is a member of the Kindle Boards. Thank you for your comments. I remember writing a review for a Vine book and the first discussion that broke out on the book's Amazon page was a discussion about how I could not have possibly read the book so fast!

Here is the link to it: http://podbram.blogspot.com/


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## VictoriaP (Mar 1, 2009)

Forster said:


> I'm not quite sure why all the whining about the price over at the amazon forums either. These people act surprised when not all books are $9.99? Did they not read and understand that this was just for books on the NYT's bestsellers?


I don't necessarily agree or disagree with those fixated on the pricing issue. They're welcome to hold any opinion at all. I just see absolutely no need to trash a book through reviews like this when your issue is over price. Call Amazon & complain. Write to the publisher and complain. Do something productive with that anguish and make your voice heard in a smart way. But giving ANY product a negative review strictly on the basis of price, when you've neither used nor read it, is childish and pathetic.

Now if you READ the book & then said it wasn't worth the price & here's why, I'll cut you some slack.  Or for the 1 star Kindle reviews that were also based on price alone, if you bought a Kindle, used it for a week, returned it & detailed why it wasn't worth your $300+ functionality-wise, that at least is a legitimate review.

Red & Kilgore, it sounds like you're doing your best to be exactly the kind of reviewer Amazon needs more of--smart people who want to do an honest job of reporting their actual experience with a given product. Thank you.


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## Forster (Mar 9, 2009)

VictoriaP said:


> I don't necessarily agree or disagree with those fixated on the pricing issue. They're welcome to hold any opinion at all. I just see absolutely no need to trash a book through reviews like this when your issue is over price. Call Amazon & complain. Write to the publisher and complain. Do something productive with that anguish and make your voice heard in a smart way. But giving ANY product a negative review strictly on the basis of price, when you've neither used nor read it, is childish and pathetic.
> 
> Now if you READ the book & then said it wasn't worth the price & here's why, I'll cut you some slack.  Or for the 1 star Kindle reviews that were also based on price alone, if you bought a Kindle, used it for a week, returned it & detailed why it wasn't worth your $300+ functionality-wise, that at least is a legitimate review.
> 
> Red & Kilgore, it sounds like you're doing your best to be exactly the kind of reviewer Amazon needs more of--smart people who want to do an honest job of reporting their actual experience with a given product. Thank you.


It's not that one has to like the price or not and if they don't fine, but what I have a problem with are those that are acting surprised after they bought the kindle. Did they not do their homework? It seems more like they get a kick on jumping on the lets bash Amazon bandwagon.

Never hear any of these cheapskates talking about the plethora of downright bargains available for the kindle. If they are that adverse to price I doubt they ever bought an initial release hardback either.


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## VictoriaP (Mar 1, 2009)

Forster said:


> It's not that one has to like the price or not and if they don't fine, but what I have a problem with are those that are acting surprised after they bought the kindle. Did they not do their homework? It seems more like they get a kick on jumping on the lets bash Amazon bandwagon.
> 
> Never hear any of these cheapskates talking about the plethora of downright bargains available for the kindle. If they are that adverse to price I doubt they ever bought an initial release hardback either.


LOL--100% right. I can't say I get it.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Here's the problem:  Amazon said they'd sell NYT bestsellers at 9.99.  And you know, they pretty much do.  But not all books are on the bestseller list the day they're released, and some never make it.  In fact, there are a LOT of books that never make NYT bestseller that are still only 9.99.  Or. . .Even Less. . . .But what the whiners heard is 'no book more than 9.99' which is patently false so they get bent out of shape because it's Amazon's fault that they can't understand plain English.

Here's my rule:  if I want a book, and feel it's worth the price, I buy it.  If I'm not sure, I sample it.  And, if I know I want to read it but the price is higher than I want to pay, well, I'll wait.  I've got so many books on my Kindle now -- not to mention paper books -- that I wouldn't get to it for a year anyway. 

BTW, there was someone who had posted a site where you can sign up and they'll watch book prices and notify you when it gets to your "I'll pay this level". . . does anyone remember where that is?  (I should probably go look under '"booklovers' links")

Ann


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Here's the problem: Amazon said they'd sell NYT bestsellers at 9.99. And you know, they pretty much do. But not all books are on the bestseller list the day they're released, and some never make it. In fact, there are a LOT of books that never make NYT bestseller that are still only 9.99. Or. . .Even Less. . . .But what the whiners heard is 'no book more than 9.99' which is patently false so they get bent out of shape because it's Amazon's fault that they can't understand plain English.
> 
> Here's my rule: if I want a book, and feel it's worth the price, I buy it. If I'm not sure, I sample it. And, if I know I want to read it but the price is higher than I want to pay, well, I'll wait. I've got so many books on my Kindle now -- not to mention paper books -- that I wouldn't get to it for a year anyway.
> 
> ...


Good analysis of the situation, Ann.


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## Michael R. Hicks (Oct 29, 2008)

Well, and some of the prices are starting to go well beyond $9.99. 

But the bottom line, as a number of others has pointed out, is that price shouldn't be a rating factor. If somebody thinks it's too much, then keep on going! But to sit and spend the time (even if it's a minute or two) to write a bad review just because of the price? Obviously some people just have waaay too much time on their hands!


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

kreelanwarrior said:


> But to sit and spend the time (even if it's a minute or two) to write a bad review just because of the price? Obviously some people just have waaay too much time on their hands!


On the other hand, maybe it's best to just let them have their fun. (I guess they think it's fun?) It's easily ignored by the sane folks and isn't likely to cause society as we know it to implode. 

Ann


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## Michael R. Hicks (Oct 29, 2008)

Ann in Arlington said:


> It's easily ignored by the sane folks and isn't likely to cause society as we know it to implode.


True, but it still seems like a good cause for a beating!


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## Panjo (Dec 21, 2008)

Interesting. I hope they fix it! 

I do see a difference with the people giving a low rating for price and the Lord of the Rings DVD pack. Finding something lacking in the set would be a valid reason to give it less than a great review/rating. You're reviewing the SET, the DVD, what's on them, what's lacking, the quality, etc. not just the movie itsself.


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## julietw (Jan 26, 2009)

Kilgore, is that who I think it is? Oh PODBRAM founder?  What an interesting screen name--are you a fan of "Venus on the Halfshell"? (A wonderful bit of homage S/F...)

It's difficult to know on Amazon just who is reviewing what for what reason...could be best friends, enemies, etc. There is only one good thing I can think of about being a total hermit, and that is the reviews my books receive are pretty much the real deal. I do think it's fair to discuss the actual package you've received in your review i. e. a shoddy slip cover that falls apart when you open it or a terrible color transfer from the original (film) but it probably shouldn't be part of the star rating. I've always seen the star rating as a content measurement--good film/good story, or bad film/story. When I review, I try not to tear someone a new .... but at the same time, I do try to be honest, and say what I think.



Kilgore Trout said:


> Please allow me to speak for a moment on the subject of Amazon reviews. As the founder of PODBRAM, I have developed a keen sense for the smell of horse puckey from the Amazon reviews. There are several different categories of Amazon reviewers.
> 
> The most common are the ones who just slap five stars up there and add a few blase comments because the reviewer is either a friend of the author or an addict of the subject matter. The one-star reviews from the same group can also be the opinions of self-proclaimed experts in the genre, or, as mentioned in the opening of this post, someone who is complaining about something irrelevant to the content of the book!
> 
> ...


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## Meemo (Oct 27, 2008)

It tempts me to give the book a 5-star rating just for the balance - and put in the "review" that that's the reason I gave it 5 stars.  Of course then I'm doing exactly what I dislike.  

What's even sillier is that most of the time (like in this instance with this particular book) the price DOES come down once it hits the bestseller list.  And of course there are the people who fixated on 9.99 - never bothering to look at the actual policy.  Just all-around annoying.


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## Kilgore Trout (Dec 28, 2008)

I'm glad to see that you have joined us, Juliet! Yes, ladies and gentlemen, this is the Juliet Waldron who has written the highly acclaimed historical fiction novel, Mozart's Wife! You can learn a lot more about Juliet over at PODBRAM, where she is one of our newest team reviewers. Al past loved her book, too. You can read his reviews at PODBRAM and at Amazon. Kilgore Trout and icenine are from my favorite of Kurt Vonnegut's books, Cat's Cradle.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

I went ahead and sampled Mozart's wife, because I find the subject interesting.  But, really, I sampled against my "better judgement".  I don't know who does the product descriptions, but I hope it isn't a reflection on the book. The first sentence of the description makes me think of some college age cat fight.


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## Leslie (Apr 7, 2008)

Red said:


> I went ahead and sampled Mozart's wife, because I find the subject interesting. But, really, I sampled against my "better judgement". I don't know who does the product descriptions, but I hope it isn't a reflection on the book. The first sentence of the description makes me think of some college age cat fight.


I read it a few months ago and enjoyed it very much. Right after I finished it, I re-watched Amadeus. Interesting to compare the two.

L


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

kreelanwarrior said:


> Well, and some of the prices are starting to go well beyond $9.99.
> 
> But the bottom line, as a number of others has pointed out, is that price shouldn't be a rating factor. If somebody thinks it's too much, then keep on going! But to sit and spend the time (even if it's a minute or two) to write a bad review just because of the price? Obviously some people just have waaay too much time on their hands!


Yes, I read an interesting article (have to go find the link...) about how some of the big publishers are gaming the system. They are setting their "Digital List Price" higher than the print list price. Amazon then gives its customary discount which gets books below 25.00 to 9.99 but not books higher than 25.00. Amazon gives the publisher 35% of the Digital List Price, not the discounted so on the higher priced books the publishers take can be higher than the price Amazon sells it for. Hopefully it does not become a huge trend, as it could be a way for anti-digital publishers to slow down the ebook growth.


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## RJ Keller (Mar 9, 2009)

It could be a big boon to indies, though, as readers gravitate towards lower priced e-books. (Sorry to sound so mercenary...)


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

Chad Winters (#102) said:


> Yes, I read an interesting article (have to go find the link...) about how some of the big publishers are gaming the system. They are setting their "Digital List Price" higher than the print list price. Amazon then gives its customary discount which gets books below 25.00 to 9.99 but not books higher than 25.00. Amazon gives the publisher 35% of the Digital List Price, not the discounted so on the higher priced books the publishers take can be higher than the price Amazon sells it for. Hopefully it does not become a huge trend, as it could be a way for anti-digital publishers to slow down the ebook growth.


I found the link: http://ireaderreview.com/2009/05/01/kindle-edition-books-what-cut-of-999-do-publishers-get/


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## Edward C. Patterson (Mar 28, 2009)

You can report such reviews to Amazon stating that there is a bias that has nothing to do with quality, but a seemingly engineered device to smear the product. Amazon will delete the reviews and chastise (even revoke the posting privileges of) the reviewers. In the interim, you should check the "Helpful NOT" button as you truly did not find the review helpful. Authors sometimes encounter such things. (I haven't, Thank God - but I treat readers as "my precious"). There are some cases when bad reviews are given for nonsense reasons. When the Kindle version of Steinbeck's The Grapes of Wrath came out, it had a 1-star review. I was astonished. After reading the review, it appears that the reviewer sampled it (didn't even buy it), read Steinbeck's rather long Drepression statistical prolog and declared that "this is boring and long and too much . . . I'm not bothering to download it," and gave it 1 star. I ran a campaign with readers and authors who have read The Grapes of Wrath to post their own reviews of the Steinbeck classic, which counter-acted that misguided reviewer. All is well now East of Eden. he he. BTW, I'm not opposed to a 1-sat review on a classic that is poorly formatted, but to label a book 1-star for reasons other than quality or as part of a smear campaign, is outrageous.

Edward C. Patterson


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

The Red Wolf Conspiracy (Kindle Edition)
by Robert V. S. Redick (Author) 
6 Reviews 
5 star: (4) 
4 star: (1) 
3 star: (1) 
2 star: (0) 
1 star: (0)

› See all 6 customer reviews... 
› See all discussions...

4.5 out of 5 stars See all reviews (6 customer reviews)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Digital List Price: $26.00 
Print List Price: $19.10 
Kindle Price: $14.30 & includes wireless delivery via Amazon Whispernet 
You Save: $4.80 (25%)

This is one I have been wanting....but the Digital Price is $7 higher than the print price and I just can't do it. I hate feeling like I'm being swindled!


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## DD (Nov 9, 2008)

Chad Winters (#102) said:


> The Red Wolf Conspiracy (Kindle Edition)
> by Robert V. S. Redick (Author)
> 6 Reviews
> 5 star: (4)
> ...


Obviously, the reviewers have not attacked this book because of the intro price as they did the Baldacci book I mention in my OP.


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

I think Amazon must be doing somthing about it now, I just looked at about two dozen books priced over 9.99 and none of them had 1 star reviews based on price. There were some who wanted their money back because it sucked...but at least they read the book! The 9.99 boycott tags are still there though.


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## Edward C. Patterson (Mar 28, 2009)

Chad Winters (#102) said:


> The Red Wolf Conspiracy (Kindle Edition)
> by Robert V. S. Redick (Author)
> 6 Reviews
> 5 star: (4)
> ...


I'm not sure whether it's a swindle. Looking at the editions and the pricing (the Hardcover is down to $17.00), this book is handstrung between DelRey and Ballantine, and there's an obvious disconnect which the author should try to resolve with their publisher(s), as he doesn't have the electronic rights - but he's the sufferer because of these issues. Shame. It sounds like a winner to me, but since I price all my 12 Kindle books at $3.99 and less so there's no barrier between me and my reader's pocketbook (I want the reader's heart and mind, a much more valuable asset than their pocketbook), I shudder when I see how Tradipublishers hamstring author's best chances to get into a reader's hand.

Edward C. Patterson


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## Kind (Jan 28, 2009)

Yeah, I also don't understand why people  would give it such a poor rating because of the price. The price does not make it a bad book. A Ferrari is a bit pricey, does that make it a bad car? Not really.


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## geoffthomas (Feb 27, 2009)

Chad Winters (#102) said:


> The Red Wolf Conspiracy (Kindle Edition)
> by Robert V. S. Redick (Author)
> 6 Reviews
> 5 star: (4)
> ...


I admit to being confused.
I understand where you are getting the $7 from.
But the Kindle price is $14, so you are not paying more than the hardcopy price. And I searched all over Amazon and could not find a HardCopy available for sale. The help says that the Digital Price is the price set by the author. Not sure what that means.
However, the book is reviewed and strongly recommended by Terry Brooks. So it should be a no-brainer, even for $14.
Just sayin......


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## Edward C. Patterson (Mar 28, 2009)

The Hardcover price is $17.14 reduced from the SRP (Suggested Retail Price of $26.00) see http://www.amazon.com/Red-Wolf-Conspiracy-Robert-Redick/dp/0345508831/ref=ed_oe_h

The Digital Price is set by the "Publisher." In some cases the "author" and the "publisher" are one and the same, but it is set at who owns the digital rights. In this case it's Ballantine books. By setting the Digital Price at the SRP is a bit hokey, especially since the hardcover price is discounted to $17.14. This gives the appearance of a deeper discount than the reader is actually getting. But this is what happens when the marketers (publishers) are running the show instead of the authors. None of this speaks to the quality of the book. If a reader wants a book, they'll buy it at any price - but . . . I mean I just bought a book for $180.00, but it's a 1,000 page book on Sung Dynasty history and part of my research collection. If it were $300.00 I would have bought it. BTW, I have no personal interest in the book under discussion, and Harv never read it, but as an Indie author, it's my business to know Amazon's pricing mechanism and how it is controlled. Here's the simple rule for anyone to note. The PRICE (SRP or Digital) is determined by the rights holder (publisher or author). The discount is determined by Amazon.com. Royalties are paid on the SP or Digital Price, not the discount. Most of my books are priced at $3.99 for the Kindle, but Amazon discounts them to $3.19. I get paid on the $3.99. When I discount a book to $ .99, usually Amazon doesn't discount it further (but they have in one instance), and I get paid $ .35 per sale. That doesn't sound like much, especially for a 700 page book, but again, I would rather have a reader than a diet coke (the price of the $3.00 royalty, which is $1.40 - I often joke with fellow authors that $1.40 buys my daily Diet Coke from the vending machine or 1 sold book means 1 new reader and a Diet coke to celebrate a new reader on board).

Hope that helps explain things.

Edward C. Patterson


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

geoffthomas said:


> I admit to being confused.
> I understand where you are getting the $7 from.
> But the Kindle price is $14, so you are not paying more than the hardcopy price. And I searched all over Amazon and could not find a HardCopy available for sale. The help says that the Digital Price is the price set by the author. Not sure what that means.
> However, the book is reviewed and strongly recommended by Terry Brooks. So it should be a no-brainer, even for $14.
> Just sayin......


As Ed said, 
Artificially raising the Digital Price means Amazon gives more royalties to the publisher and probably loses money on the book. Which hurts the Kindle as an Amazon product (and makes Amazon less likely to expand Kindle options and content)


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Geoff, who is Terry Brooks, and why does this person mean more than any other review?


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

He's a pretty well known fantasy writer.  A review by him means, to me, that the book is fantasy genre and his review was requested to get the attention of his fans.

Ann


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Any time something is on the 'honor system' you're going to find some folks who are not honorable.  Fortunately, in this case, it's pretty easy to tell who they are and respond appropriately to what they say.

Ann


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Ann, thanks for the answer.  I've not read much in this genre, actually, I can't think of a single title.  Maybe I should run over to the books we recommend, or the books read on Kindle thread and look for ideas


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## Chad Winters (Oct 28, 2008)

This is original trilogy, or at least the one that made him famous. It was pretty good.


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## geoffthomas (Feb 27, 2009)

Terry Brooks has a few reasons to be known.

Terry has written more than 20 New York Times bestselling novels.
In his Landover series (6 books so far): Magic Kingdom For Sale - Sold!, the first book, is currently in movie production by Universal Pictures.

He wrote The Sword of Shannara. It became the first work of fiction ever to appear on the New York Times trade paperback bestseller list, where it remained for over five months. He has written 15 Shannara novels. And 6 more Shannara "prequels".  The Word and the Void trilogy and the recent trilogy that bridges the W&V books with the Shannara books.

George Lucas personally asked Terry if he would write the novelization to Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace. 

So he has some credibility.
Just Sayin......


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## devilsrule2004 (May 5, 2009)

yea you need to report it, after enough reports amazon will get a flag to check it. then they will look into it and remove inaccurate reviewsa


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## MonaSW (Nov 16, 2008)

I also report those reviews when I find them. If you don't like the price, don't buy the book - and write the publisher!


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

LDB said:


> I have no problem telling how the cow ate the cabbage so here it is.
> 
> The people giving a low review based only on the price of the book are *SCUM*. At the very least they should be locked out of ever being allowed to post another review and in my opinion should be completely locked out of Amazon permanently. Hopefully that wasn't too unclear to be understood.


I don't often say this, but I have to agree with you 100% on this. . I might not have worded it as strongly though. Some time back over on the Amazon boards people were upset over the price of Mrs. Astor Regrets. Several people thought nothing wrong of the low stars to complain about the book. As you can imagine, it got pretty ugly. I just can't imagine why people think it's ok? If the price is too high, don't buy it.


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## LDB (Oct 28, 2008)

I think part of the problem is people don't want to word anything strongly anymore. In any event, it's totally wrong to post a bad review on a book one hasn't even read just because one is a petty, immature putz. I can't see any reason to let them off lightly with a diluted statement. That's part of what creates those types.


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