# Russian Literature - War and Peace vs Doctor Zhivago



## jj2339 (Jan 18, 2010)

I've been wanting to read these two books for a long time, and am now ready to make the plunge into either War and Peace or Doctor Zhivago.  Both periods of history interest me greatly, and i'm not sure which one to dive into first.  Any recommendations?  I've started War and Peace once before and liked it (but then got distracted and never finished it), but I have to say that the revolutionary period interests me a bit more (although I've heard Zhivago has a tendency to be harder to follow).  Any comments?


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## Cuechick (Oct 28, 2008)

I was actually named for the main character in Dr. Zhivago, Lara. Though I have never read it, I did watch a very good mini series version with Kera Knightly and found the story very compelling. I'd download the sample and see if it grabs you... 

Or watch the mini series!


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## geoffthomas (Feb 27, 2009)

It takes special people to read Russian literature.

War and Peace is an older work and is more classically written.  Can be tedious and is super long.  But easier than reading Crime and Punishment.
Doctor Zhivago is more modern, but still plods compared to a modern romantic mystery.

If you are into real epic literature and/or want the real Russian experience then go for War and Peace. Nice book.
If you just want to read the book that Omar Sharif brought to the screen - read Zhivago.

Just sayin.....


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## Geemont (Nov 18, 2008)

FYI, Doctor Zhivago has a new and updated translation coming out in October from Richard Pevear and Larissa Volokhonsky. The link is for the Hardcover, but I'm guessing there will be a Kindle version when it's published.

Their War and Peace translation is supposed to be good.


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## jj2339 (Jan 18, 2010)

I dove back into War and Peace (Maude translation) and am loving it!

Any idea if the Pevear translation of Zhivago will retain the French like their War and Peace translation did?  I like their work, but I found the french being kept french to be a questionable decision, and especially on kindle, i don't want to be clicking on links to translate it.  I know some prefer to keep the french parts in french, but I just find it odd to do a translation into English, and not translate all of it into English (especially as in Tolstoy's time, most Russian readers spoke French fluently, so it wasn't a big deal).

Anyway, loving Tolstoy.  I'll save Zhivago for later.  I've always enjoyed Dostoyevsky, and glad i'm finally plunging into the Napoleonic Wars!


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## DYB (Aug 8, 2009)

geoffthomas said:


> But easier than reading Crime and Punishment.


That's interesting because I always thought "Crime and Punishment" was an easy read because the novel is essentially a mystery/thriller, which keeps you turning the pages to see if Roskolnikov will get busted or not. It's one big cat and mouse game. (Until the last 100 pages, which I do think are tedious.)


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## Anne (Oct 29, 2008)

jj2339 said:


> I dove back into War and Peace (Maude translation) and am loving it!
> 
> Any idea if the Pevear translation will retain the French like their War and Peace translation did? I like their work, but I found the french being kept french to be a questionable decision, and especially on kindle, i don't want to be clicking on links to translate it. I know some prefer to keep the french parts in french, but I just find it odd to do a translation into English, and not translate all of it into English (especially as in Tolstoy's time, most Russian readers spoke French fluently, so it wasn't a big deal).
> 
> Anyway, loving Tolstoy. I'll save Zhivago for later. I've always enjoyed Dostoyevsky, and glad i'm finally plunging into the Napoleonic Wars!


Are you reading it on Kindle? Can you do a link?


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## jj2339 (Jan 18, 2010)

Sure!

http://www.amazon.com/Classic-Russian-Literature-translated-ebook/dp/B0032Z74RW/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&m=AG56TWVU5XWC2&s=digital-text&qid=1278854679&sr=1-3

This is the version I'm reading, it's got more than War and Peace in this file, all by Tolstoy. And these should all be the Maude translations (although not 100% sure of that).

I did a sample of the Pevear translation, but the retained French just kept pulling me out of the story (plus, having to navigate to the links was beyond annoying). I find the Maude translation very readable, i've had no problems with it.


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## Anne (Oct 29, 2008)

jj2339 said:


> Sure!
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Classic-Russian-Literature-translated-ebook/dp/B0032Z74RW/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&m=AG56TWVU5XWC2&s=digital-text&qid=1278854679&sr=1-3
> 
> ...


Thanks I am looking for an easy or good translation to read.


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## DYB (Aug 8, 2009)

Anne said:


> Thanks I am looking for an easy or good translation to read.


Easy and good might be two very different things!


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## jj2339 (Jan 18, 2010)

DYB said:


> Easy and good might be two very different things!


Ha!


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## Anne (Oct 29, 2008)

DYB said:


> Easy and good might be two very different things!


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## mparish6 (Apr 14, 2010)

If you really want to read something by Tolstoy, I would recommend you read Anna Karenina rather than War and Peace. The plot and the characters are much more engaging than W & P and unlike W & P, it doesn't end with a long philosophical dissertation disguised as an anticlimax. Of the Tolstoy novels I've read, Anna Karenina was undoubtedly the best (IMHO anyway).


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## DYB (Aug 8, 2009)

mparish6 said:


> If you really want to read something by Tolstoy, I would recommend you read Anna Karenina rather than War and Peace. The plot and the characters are much more engaging than W & P and unlike W & P, it doesn't end with a long philosophical dissertation disguised as an anticlimax. Of the Tolstoy novels I've read, Anna Karenina was undoubtedly the best (IMHO anyway).


I concur!


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## Anne (Oct 29, 2008)

mparish6 said:


> If you really want to read something by Tolstoy, I would recommend you read Anna Karenina rather than War and Peace. The plot and the characters are much more engaging than W & P and unlike W & P, it doesn't end with a long philosophical dissertation disguised as an anticlimax. Of the Tolstoy novels I've read, Anna Karenina was undoubtedly the best (IMHO anyway).


Thanks that is a great idea. I think I will start with Anna Karenina


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## DYB (Aug 8, 2009)

Anne said:


> Thanks that is a great idea. I think I will start with Anna Karenina


For me "Anna Karenina" was a real page turner. There are two loosely connected stories Tolstoy is telling and he would end each section on a cliff-hanger and I couldn't wait to return to it every time. The Anna story is particularly emotional. The other one, about Levin, is more philosophical in nature. In most movie adaptations they tend to leave it out altogether!

The opening sentence of "Anna Karenina" is one of the great lines in all literature.

_All happy families are alike; each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way._


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## Anne (Oct 29, 2008)

DYB said:


> For me "Anna Karenina" was a real page turner. There are two loosely connected stories Tolstoy is telling and he would end each section on a cliff-hanger and I couldn't wait to return to it every time. The Anna story is particularly emotional. The other one, about Levin, is more philosophical in nature. In most movie adaptations they tend to leave it out altogether!
> 
> The opening sentence of "Anna Karenina" is one of the great lines in all literature.
> 
> _All happy families are alike; each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way._


WoW it sounds good I will have to read Anna Karenia


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## russianfiction (Feb 28, 2012)

Nowadays there are not much award-winning Russian writers!!!!! But Tolstoy and Dostoyevskiy were among the greatest!!!


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## Matthew Lee Adams (Feb 19, 2012)

Since this thread got resurrected, I'd say that some people might enjoy:

Mikhail Bulgakhov's "The Master and Margarita":



It's quite a romp in almost a Mark Twain sort of way at times. The Burgin/O'Connor translation is well-regarded. I've also read the Glenny translation and liked it, although many people have criticized it for not being as true a translation. Translations are tricky, especially between dissimilar languages like Russian and English. It's difficult enough simply to translate the actual sentences in a comparable manner from one language to the other, and even more difficult to attempt to recreate the spirit of the language while doing so.

Here's one review of the book that compares the same passage as done by two different translations of this wonderful book:

http://www.amazon.com/review/R22RL1A7V3LURE/ref=cm_cr_pr_perm?ie=UTF8&ASIN=0679760806&nodeID=&tag=&linkCode=


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## StephenLivingston (May 10, 2011)

War and Peace is an excellent book, I've not yet read Dr Zhivago but I thought the movie was very good.  I'd also recommend Crime and Punishment very highly.
Best wishes, Stephen Livingston.


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## Borislava Borissova (Sep 9, 2011)

Matthew Lee Adams said:


> Since this thread got resurrected, I'd say that some people might enjoy:
> 
> Mikhail Bulgakhov's "The Master and Margarita":
> 
> ...


I love Master and Margarita most, War and Peace is my second favourite Russian book and Pasternak's Doctor Zhivago, Turgenev, Dostoevsky are after them.


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## DYB (Aug 8, 2009)

I've never read "The Master and Margarita," but I have the Pevear/Volokhonsky translation on my Kindle for future reading.

The judgment the reviewer makes on Pevear/Volokhonsky is a bit off-putting.  It's silly to say that they can't write in idiomatic English.  Pevear is American.  The point is that they choose not to, but try to keep as close to the original Russian as possible.  It's a choice not everyone agrees on, but it's a choice and it's nice to have choices where every choice is not the same!

Incidentally, I find it interesting that Glenny calls the character "Bezdomny," a Russian word.  And Pevear/Volokhonsky translate to "Homeless."


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## John A. A. Logan (Jan 25, 2012)

The Michael Glenny unabridged translation of The Master and Margarita is one of the best novels I have ever read. (That's not me "taking sides" re translations though as I have only read Glenny's)

The Idiot by Dostoyevsky is another stunning novel. Fond of Notes from Underground too (or should that be From Under the Floorboards...depending, again, on translation)


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## Matthew Lee Adams (Feb 19, 2012)

DYB said:


> I've never read "The Master and Margarita," but I have the Pevear/Volokhonsky translation on my Kindle for future reading.
> 
> The judgment the reviewer makes on Pevear/Volokhonsky is a bit off-putting. It's silly to say that they can't write in idiomatic English. Pevear is American. The point is that they choose not to, but try to keep as close to the original Russian as possible. It's a choice not everyone agrees on, but it's a choice and it's nice to have choices where every choice is not the same!
> 
> Incidentally, I find it interesting that Glenny calls the character "Bezdomny," a Russian word. And Pevear/Volokhonsky translate to "Homeless."


You mentioning "Bezdomny" just made me think of Viktor Tsoi's song "Бездельник": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3AMDgTis34&feature=relmfu

Poor Tsoi. Some beautiful music he shared before we lost him...


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## Vukovina (Mar 30, 2012)

Chalk up another vote for _The Master and the Margarita_.

...and, speaking of Pevear and Volokhonsky, might I interest you in _The Collected Tales of Nikolai Gogol_?


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## Pavel Kravchenko (Mar 2, 2012)

Matthew Lee Adams said:


> You mentioning "Bezdomny" just made me think of Viktor Tsoi's song "Бездельник": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3AMDgTis34&feature=relmfu
> 
> Poor Tsoi. Some beautiful music he shared before we lost him...


Now what the heck is someone named Matthew Lee Adams doing "losing" Viktor Tsoi? Come on, is your real name Матвей Адамский or something?


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## Pavel Kravchenko (Mar 2, 2012)

Oh, and my top 5 Russian books:

1. Brothers Karamazov.
2. Idiot
3. Demons
4. Master and Margarita
5. The Dead Souls


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## Matthew Lee Adams (Feb 19, 2012)

Pavel Kravchenko said:


> Now what the heck is someone named Matthew Lee Adams doing "losing" Viktor Tsoi? Come on, is your real name Матвей Адамский or something?


Russian Studies degree.

I have all the Kino albums, plus Chizh & Co. (what an amazing musician!), some Akvarium, Alisa, Nautilus Pompilius, Piknik...

I love Zemfira's cover of "Kukushka" as well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pgc0ZYDzazY

And the stylized version (with changed lyrics) of Vosmiklassnitsa in "Stilyagi" was gorgeous: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTQ__XfMAL4


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## Pavel Kravchenko (Mar 2, 2012)

Matthew Lee Adams said:


> Russian Studies degree.
> 
> I have all the Kino albums, plus Chizh & Co. (what an amazing musician!), some Akvarium, Alisa, Nautilus Pompilius, Piknik...
> 
> ...


Going to go ahead and disagree with you about Zemfira's cover, but otherwise wow


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## Matthew Lee Adams (Feb 19, 2012)

Pavel Kravchenko said:


> Going to go ahead and disagree with you about Zemfira's cover, but otherwise wow


No problem with the disagreement - music is great because there are so many variations for any kinds of taste!

I think what I liked about her version was that it took a classic song but put a female voice behind it, and I like the novelty of hearing it performed differently for that reason. Kinoprobiy was pretty cool for that reason. I can't say I liked all the different variations of Kino's songs. Mumiy Troll's "Vosmiklassnitsa" is addictive for some reason, even though I really didn't like that version.

I think I remember hearing (maybe I'm wrong) that Viktor Tsoi worked with some members of Akvarium for "45" - I have always felt that album had a very different sound overall, as well as the backing musicians sounding a lot more polished than the later albums which have a more "raw" sound that goes more with the rock direction Kino ended up going. Favorite albums from Kino: 45, Eto ne Lyubov', Gruppa Krovi, and Tsoi's Akusticheskiy Kontsert.

Back to Russian literature again 

Besides "Master and Margarita" I always loved Ilf and Petrov's "Twelve Chairs" - to name one you had not mentioned among your own favorite recommendations.


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## Pavel Kravchenko (Mar 2, 2012)

If it was a top ten favorite, 12 chairs would have been in it, together with the Golden Calf. I actually translated 12 Chairs, and now that it's going public domain in July (I think Petrov died in July 1942), I'm thinking to maybe put some more work in it 

And you're not wrong about 45. BG was on guitar and backing vocals for that one, as far as I know.


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## Matthew Lee Adams (Feb 19, 2012)

Pavel Kravchenko said:


> If it was a top ten favorite, 12 chairs would have been in it, together with the Golden Calf. I actually translated 12 Chairs, and now that it's going public domain in July (I think Petrov died in July 1942), I'm thinking to maybe put some more work in it
> 
> *And you're not wrong about 45. BG was on guitar and backing vocals for that one, as far as I know.*


That definitely makes sense.

There was a polish to the album and music that felt like veteran musicians were behind it.

I confess I haven't kept as much up with Russian music the last decade, although there is some really good stuff out there.


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## Pavel Kravchenko (Mar 2, 2012)

Matthew Lee Adams said:


> That definitely makes sense.
> 
> There was a polish to the album and music that felt like veteran musicians were behind it.
> 
> I confess I haven't kept as much up with Russian music the last decade, although there is some really good stuff out there.


I haven't kept up with it either, aside from an odd Mummytroll album. None of what I heard is as good as Tsoi, though.


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