# Anyone ever see an author confess he quit his day job and failed?



## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

DRMarvello just made a great point on another forum. We were discussing Robert Crane's blog post about the sacrifices he made and the risks he took in order to succed. DRMarvello pointed out that you probably won't see blog posts from the authors who take such risks and fail. I can't remember ever seeing one.

I doubt I'll ever quit the day job to write, but, if I ever do and I fail, I thick I'll blog about it. Put it out there as a cautionary tale. There have GOT to be stories like that. But, man, it would take a huge swallow of pride to make it public. Think of the ridicule from the smug.


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## Gertie Kindle (Nov 6, 2008)

Many people quit their day jobs to start their own businesses and many do fail. This is not unique to authors. Chefs, hairdressers, actors. Any time you go out on your own, it's a big risk and one which should be carefully considered and prepared for. Go in expecting to succeed, but prepared to fail.


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## dave_flora (Jan 26, 2014)

This ties into a pet peeve of mine.

I read an article lately on how to make a living as a writer.  According to this person, you just figured out what you needed to make a living, divided that up into a monthly/weekly amount and then set your goal to sell that number of books to make it.

Hahahahaaa!

I am really amazed at how seriously he said it, like getting people to buy, read, enjoy and talk about your book was sort of the same process as printing money.  You can make as many financial plans as you like, but until you have a product that people are actually willing to pay for, those plans are...
...well, not worth the money you printed them on.


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## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

I have seen one - and she had a lot of books, and they were awesome, and they just stopped selling for some reason. I think it wasn't a blog post though, more likely a lengthy cautionary forum post somewhere - I can't remember her name despite the fact I've read several of her books. I will track it down and throw up a link here.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

vrabinec said:


> DRMarvello just made a great point on another forum. We were discussing Robert Crane's blog post about the sacrifices he made and the risks he took in order to succed. DRMarvello pointed out that you probably won't see blog posts from the authors who take such risks and fail. I can't remember ever seeing one.
> 
> I doubt I'll ever quit the day job to write, but, if I ever do and I fail, I thick I'll blog about it. Put it out there as a cautionary tale. There have GOT to be stories like that. But, man, it would take a huge swallow of pride to make it public. Think of the ridicule from the smug.


I know of many trade authors who could never quit their day jobs, or even have to go back to work after they've had a NYT best seller. This isn't anything new to the industry, no matter which side of the fence you are on.


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## valeriec80 (Feb 24, 2011)

If I have to go back to work, I'm going to be very public about it.

But most people don't seem to like to advertise their failures to the world, for some reason. 

Anyway, I think what likely happens is that the sales stop, and then that's stressful, and confidence is shaken, and then writing stops cold, and then by the time the writer goes back to work, they've given up on writing anyway. So, they've already stopped blogging and hanging out here, etc.

The rare person who perseveres at writing after a big setback like that might be more open about it. 

But... man, I don't know if I could keep writing afterward. It would be really hard not to get very bitter, I think. I probably would keep going. Probably. I mean, nothing's stopped me from writing thus far, so maybe I could handle that too.


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## sarahdalton (Mar 15, 2011)

Steve W. said:


> I have seen one - and she had a lot of books, and they were awesome, and they just stopped selling for some reason. I think it wasn't a blog post though, more likely a lengthy cautionary forum post somewhere - I can't remember her name despite the fact I've read several of her books. I will track it down and throw up a link here.


I think I know who you mean. I was going to list the same example, but maybe it would be best to ask permission first.

I quit in October and my book sales are a teeny bit down since back then. I'd just released the last book in my trilogy and sales were amazing then. I'm seeing some of my other books perform better though. I've had a book accepted into Kindle Singles and that's doing great right now. Plus one of my books is in a multi-author boxed set that has just got off to a great start, so that might boost things.

The problem I have is getting readers to move to a new series. I think the books I write pretty much target the same audience, but for some reason they don't follow me to a new series, say from YA dystopia to YA fantasy. I struggle to get people to sign up to my mailing list as well. I'm not sure why, but I think I'll have to figure it out if I want to keep writing full time.


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## Issy (Aug 25, 2013)

Depends on "failed". Plenty of writers have changed - attitudes, aspirations, working patterns. To take the risk of leaving a day job is life-changing. You might go back to a day job again but I reckon that person has changed in some way. Hopefully, not into a bitter sort of person. That writer has learned things about what makes them tick and what gives them pleasure and achievement. And, if they can see *why* they are not making enough money to survive (which I guess is how we're all defining "failed") then it's not a true failure.

I left my day job last February; I made enough money from writing articles, copy-editing, and self-publishing under another name. But my productivity dipped without the pressure of having to cram in my words into a short period of time. I also prefer to be alone and so, now I could be alone, my social skills certainly declined. So I took a part time occasional job. I get to choose the days I work, and it's a short 4-hour day, and I do maybe 6 or 8 a month. Have I "failed"? No, I didn't need to take other employment. But I had learned what motivates me, and inspires me, and what works best for me.


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2014)

valeriec80 said:


> If I have to go back to work, I'm going to be very public about it.


Many people who quit their day jobs would rather *DIE* than go back. I'm one of them. I quit my day job over six years ago, and now I'm spoiled.

I'd rather die than return to my old life. So I wouldn't be around to go public about it.


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## sarahdalton (Mar 15, 2011)

I would find it very difficult to go back to work. Especially full time.

This thread is making me wonder if it might be a good idea to find a writing related side job - making covers, running writer workshops, _dun dun duuuuun_ - going hybrid with a trade contract.


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## Speaker-To-Animals (Feb 21, 2012)

The people I can think of who've gone back to day jobs were not so much about failure as about wanting the security of not working for themselves in a volatile market. More so because the people I'm thinking of were erotica writers who are at the whims of whatever clutched pearls article the British tabloids.

If there's any particular reason we don't hear more failure stories, I think it's not so much because people can and won't fail, but because the whole congruence of ebook and reader penetration and easy form based access to worldwide retailers is only four years old. The number of people who have quit their day jobs is relatively low and most that I've known have been extremely conservative about it, usually having sales that could easily take a hit and still support them or having a spousal income that could cushion any sales setbacks.

Wait a few years and you'll definitely see people just like you do in any form of business venture or self employment. It'll be a hell of a lot lower than the number of people who open a restaurant and go bust though!


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

Isabella Brooke said:


> Depends on "failed". Plenty of writers have changed - attitudes, aspirations, working patterns. To take the risk of leaving a day job is life-changing. You might go back to a day job again but I reckon that person has changed in some way. Hopefully, not into a bitter sort of person. That writer has learned things about what makes them tick and what gives them pleasure and achievement. And, if they can see *why* they are not making enough money to survive (which I guess is how we're all defining "failed") then it's not a true failure.
> 
> I left my day job last February; I made enough money from writing articles, copy-editing, and self-publishing under another name. But my productivity dipped without the pressure of having to cram in my words into a short period of time. I also prefer to be alone and so, now I could be alone, my social skills certainly declined. So I took a part time occasional job. I get to choose the days I work, and it's a short 4-hour day, and I do maybe 6 or 8 a month. Have I "failed"? No, I didn't need to take other employment. But I had learned what motivates me, and inspires me, and what works best for me.


Yeah, "failed" is subjective. I was kinda thinking along the lines of bringing financial ruin upon their family. For anyone who really just messes their own life up a little, I don't consider that failure. I see that person as a kind of William Wallace Braveheart type for trying. But if you plunge into finacial ruin and take a spouse and kids along for the ride...


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## rex kusler (Feb 12, 2010)

Quitting a job and then going back to it for the same pay isn't a failure. Quitting a desirable, good-paying job and ending up working for 15% of what you were making at your previous job--bad idea. Most quality jobs are not easy to get. I think there are a lot of authors who made good money the last two or three years and now find their sales greatly reduced.


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## valeriec80 (Feb 24, 2011)

Joliedupre said:


> Many people who quit their day jobs would rather *DIE* than go back. I'm one of them. I quit my day job over six years ago, and now I'm spoiled.
> 
> I'd rather die than return to my old life. So I wouldn't be around to go public about it.


Oh, man... you have no idea how much I don't want to go back to work. I don't know if I'd rather literally die, but I think that my soul would be severely damaged and possibly irreparable if I lost this. This is like my biggest dream, the only thing that I've ever wanted this much. If I lost it, I don't even know who I would _be_ anymore.

I guess most people don't like to share with the public when they're miserable and hurting. They have an instinct to hide and lick their wounds.

I seem to have been born without this instinct. I'm kind of an exhibitionist, and I'm very warts and all about it. _Look at me! I'm in pain!! _

This has cost me some friendships and relationships in the past. (I now have a strict rule that my life can be an open book, but to never share anything negative about anybody that I care about.) I imagine it also makes certain people who are watching the spectacle cringe a bit. The way I figure it, though, that's their problem, not mine.

But I also think it would be good to have something for other writers going through the same thing. Vrabinec is right. No one ever talks about it, but I'm sure it happens. And when it does happen, I bet those people feel like they're going through it alone.


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## minxmalone (Oct 28, 2012)

I'm sure there's examples of this but most of the writers I know who've quit their day jobs didn't do so until they had a significant cash cushion to tide them over. I waited until I had enough in the bank to carry me for two years straight even if my sales completely stopped. And that was after I paid off all my outstanding debt. 

So I think that's why you don't see that many cases of people going back. Because it's just not a decision that you make lightly and without adequate contingency plans.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Very interesting thread, and it had to be today. Really got me thinking.

So... I guess it's time.

I quit my day job to write full time on August 10th, 2012. I didn't have to look it up -- it's in my head, as sure as my birthday. I looked forward to that day, counting down the hours in a job I hated and that was slowly killing me, at a really dark period of my life. I remember feeling so happy on my last day of work and I remember feeling... genuine freedom and happiness on my first day of being self-employed.

I've never called it quitting my job. I've called it being self-employed. Because writing became my job. I got a real boost of genuine happiness, right when I needed it, and I decided to take advantage of that. I wasn't quitting my job. I was changing my job. My new job was writing.

I worked pretty hard. In 2013 I published three novels (_Rakshasa Book I_, _Lacuna: The Ashes of Humanity_, _Ren of Atikala_), I published four short stories (_The Nun's Lover_, _Rakshasa Book #2 Part I_, _Rakshasa Book #2 Part II_, _Sanguina_) and three novellas (_Magnet: Marauder_, _Insufficient_, _Insurrection_). That's a lot for me. I did almost all the artwork for those covers, the print formatting and covers, the internal formatting, publishing, distribution, everything. I managed my finances, I made spreadsheets that calculate my Amazon/Expanded Distribution/Google Play incomes, I managed the promos, I responded to fans (I _always _respond to negative reviews, occasionally to positive reviews when I need a boost, and my email address is in all my books). Reviews for _Lacuna_ went from about 25-ish to nearly 100. I'm proud of what I accomplished.

But pride won't pay the bills. It's the 25th of February, 2014, and I've been looking for part time or full time work for the last three months. Today I basically had an interesting discussion with my Mum -- I've been off work long enough to be eligible for the dole, something I've never had to do, and something I'm certain I won't be qualify for due to assets I own. But the fact that I had to have that conversation showed me that, well, the time has come.

I'm not self-employed anymore. I'm unemployed.

My financial situation is largely an open book, so I don't mind going over some of the vagaries in a public forum, but obviously this is a... somewhat touchy subject for me. I'm tough -- you have to be tough in this game or you're not going to get anywhere -- but obviously, discussing this kind of thing is a bit painful.

Nobody likes to fail.

Anyone who reads my author Facebook page is probably a bit surprised at this post, because my last post was how January was my best month in terms of income ever. The funny thing is, February is doing really well as well; excluding December 2012, which until last January was my best month, this month has been my second best month and sales are continuing to be strong. You can see for yourself right here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvxvaH4Nj7PndFJTT21kSVpFVUxJOXhITTZSU09PcEE#gid=3 I stuck in some conservative dummy data for stuff I don't have reports for yet.

But right now, it's not quite enough. Sure, the money's here now (and like I said, I have other sources of income that really help during the bad months; it essentially pays my rent), but take a look at September, October, November in the sheet that I linked. That's going to leave a dent, no matter how much you spin it, and that's the problem. The money comes in during the good times, but during the hard times it dries up pretty quickly. I'm expecting some nice cash from December/January/February this year, but it's going to be hard to save that because I have a lot of expenses that I've been putting off until that money arrives, so it's largely all accounted for.

So I guess I'm done. I learnt a lot though. In no particular order, here's what I got.

The bar is pretty high for success as an indie writer doing it full time. If you can snag a Bookbub you can do well for that month, but they're getting harder and harder to get, and they're only available once per six months per book now. I can get _Lacuna_ into Bookbub with regularity, but none of my other novels can get in, despite good covers, blurbs, well edited contents, etc. I think Bookbub heavily favours series; they even once took _Lacuna_ even though they shouldn't have, and had to email me and say they would take it in three months. That kind of sucked. I can't get a look in for _Ren of Atikala_, though, or the _Rakshasa_ novels.

_Lacuna_ sits in the top 5-15 of at least three categories, regularly, and its sequels get good reviews. The main book... not so much. I am slowly coming to terms with the fact that the first book I wrote, as was the case with many other authors (self-published or not), was pretty crap. The second one was a lot better and by the time I was hitting the third, forth ones I felt like I could do much better. Not sure what you can do about that -- you HAVE to get that first book out, but I suspect that tying your writing identity too much into it is a bad plan. The domain for my author's website and email accounts is www.lacunaverse.com. I should have picked something like www.davidadamsauthor.com, as it would give me a lot more freedom to build my brand, rather than focusing on a single series.

Still. If someone's sitting that high in the rankings and can't quite scrape by, that's a bit of a problem. There's only so much room on those charts. This is what I mean when I say the bar is quite high.

Sequels are king. Everything I have that sells well is part of a series. I have some books that are stand alone work that sell less than one copy a month. My longest novel, _Ren of Atikala_, has gotten some awesome reviews but sell 3-6 copies a month. I suspect that will change when Book 2 comes out and I set Ren free, but for the moment, it hasn't even come close to making back its costs.

Which is another thing. You need money to make money. It's an old adage, but it's true. It's possible for one to manage on a fairly low amount of money really, but publishing a book is a big expense. I generally pay $300 for a cover for Ren/Lacuna, and editing costs run between $600-$1,100. Again, if you refer back to the income spreadsheet earlier, you can see why that's a bit of a problem. At the moment Ren 2 is about 2/3 finished, but it's on hold because I simply can't get it edited properly. My editor has offered to make some kind of differed payment plan because I recommend her to others, but I think that's unfair on her, and I'd be too guilt-ridden to accept it.

You'd be surprised what sells though. If you take a closer look at that spreadsheet (although it's really a massive wall of numbers), the erotica I write under a pen name doesn't sell jack squat. Usually less than one copy per month, all put together. However, the Magnet spinoffs are doing quite well, especially for their length (15k-25k) and price point ($2.99). Having the first one free helps a lot.

Publish regularly. If you have a serial, like Rakshasa, burnout is a huge huge huge problem. You slip you schedule, a bit comes in late, sales drop. So you get discouraged. So the next bit is late(r). Sales drop more. You put it off for three months to recover, but sales fall into an abyss and never climb out. You put out a bit and it gets 3 sales. So you basically give up.

That's a waste of some of the best covers I've ever made, and frankly, some pretty good writing. It's a dead series. I'm going to get book #2 finished this year even if it murders me, but the lesson learnt here is... if you set a publishing schedule, _stick to it_. Even the most devoted fan will leave if you can't maintain the pace.

The _Wool_ fanfiction is doing surprisingly well. Those stories are bringing in about $50 a month and they're consistent, marketing-free income. They just keep giving. That's awesome. I should write more of them, the problem is, it's hard. Once again, I set myself an ambitious schedule and then couldn't meet the deadlines, and again, sales are falling off. I really need to get part #3 out and done for. It's critical. I know this, but sometimes the words won't come, right?

Budget. Save what you can when you can. There are going to be random costs, and those random costs tend to hit right when the money's the lowest. Remember, in December you're living off September's pay. September, for two years running now, has been right when sales plunge off the big cliff leading up to Christmas. December, however, is when the house insurance is due, when the car insurance is due, and when Christmas comes with all its expenses. Additionally, Christmas promos have to be paid for, and more importantly, the more you have out over Christmas, the better you'll do. So it's a time for finishing *everything*. I wrote so much over Oct-Nov-Dec that I barely remember some of it. It's a time of sowing the seeds for the future, but it's not a happy time, and it usually means facing down massive burnout in the Jan-Feb-Mar months, like I am now. You can only whip yourself for so long.

So what can we learn from this? Consistency is better. It's better to do 2k words a week for a year than 10k words every 5 days for three months. Just do a little bit every day and you'll do well. Don't cram before Christmas; it kills you for the next year. Work a little bit every day, even if it's just a few words.

If money is a problem, remember you have marketable skills. I can format books for print. I can do covers. People will pay for that, especially if you take a "cheap and cheerful" approach. I usually charge about $40-$50 for an ebook cover, and about the same for formatting a book. I don't make much per hour, but when you can't write and you're struggling to pay your bills, a cover+format deal for $90 can really help you out. Make it worth people's money and they'll come back, especially if you're friends. Which is my next point.

Have a good support network.

I've had an awesome support network which has helped a lot. Friends, family, other writers... everyone. My parents have really helped me out -- emotionally, with networking opportunities and offers, and of late, monetarily. That's awesome of them and I couldn't ask for better folks. I'd be screwed without them. My friends, too, have stood by me something chronic, and I really, really appreciate them. Readers too -- even when books were late, or series spluttered out for a while and put on hold, they stuck with me and I really appreciate that. I really, really am grateful for the time I've had. It's been a wild ride, and I couldn't do it without the readers. I love them all and they gave me the best year of my working adult life. No matter what happens from here-on out, nobody can take that away from me, and it's all due to them.

Help other authors. I know it's hard, especially when you're doing it all yourself and trying to make the bills get paid and there's this _other thing_ you said you'd do and it's taking up a lot of time and distracting you and people are asking you when it'll get done and you don't want to do it because it's unpaid work... but help people out. Helping people is an intangible currency that's more valuable than a few bucks here and there. The amount of times other authors I'm friends with have randomly bought my new releases -- driving them up the new release charts and prompting much more sales from that -- is staggering, and I'm super grateful to all of them. Elle Case got me a whole bunch of reviews for Ren by offering it to her fanbase, and I'm super grateful.

If nothing else... it's hard to do it alone. I don't know any authors IRL who've completed a book (I know at least one who's getting there though). Especially when money is tight, going out and seeing friends can be difficult. I'm single which makes it worse. Writing on your own can be a lonely, solitary existence and it's good to have (as I have) some friends who drag me away from work occasionally to go hang out with them.

Remember that nobody writes in isolation. I take inspiration from so many every-day events that, paradoxically, if I don't go outside and do something interesting once in a while my writing suffers. Gotta remember that breaks are work too.

So even when the inevitable part time job arrives now, the thing is, I couldn't stop writing if I tried. There'll be more books from me for all my series, even if they come out slower. Once again, I know this will quickly kill my sales -- my writing is just, plain and simple, not good enough to take off without regular releases -- but they'll sell for a while more yet.

But obviously I'm going to trim some things. _Rakshasa_, despite my secret love for it, is going to go on haitus after Book 2 is finished. I'm clearly terrible at erotica, so that's getting shelved next, except possibly a Kindle Worlds erotica piece. That might be my next thing because it's cheap, cheerful, and got appeal. The next _Lacuna_ sequel is going to get published this year regardless, as is Ren 2 when I can afford to get it released good and proper. I have some things that I know will move a few copies coming out soon (most notably _Eh, Zombie_ because Hugh will mention it to his fans and then they'll make the tragic mistake of buying it), and that's mostly finished too, but I know that some things are going to have to be cut. I don't really know yet. Which baby do you eat when winter comes? I don't know.

So now you know. This's what happens to authors who don't make it. It's not a bad outcome -- my books continue to sell, even after I go back to work, and for as long as I live I'll always have those books. They're a great conversation topic and, like I said, I can't stop myself writing even if I wanted to.

Doesn't make it hurt any less though.


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

Wow. Thanks, David. Good luck, man.


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## The 13th Doctor (May 31, 2012)

Thank you for such an honest post, David. I wish you the best of luck.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

Hi David, I'm glad you are having some good months, but I'm sorry it hasn't worked out (yet) as you had planned. Keep writing, and enjoy the journey.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

vrabinec said:


> Wow. Thanks, David. Good luck, man.


Thanks mate, and no worries (and the same to everyone else who's posted).

It is what it is. Job interview's this coming week -- I think I'm understating it when I say it's not going to be easy to smile and be professional when I'm talking to them, but I'll make sure I keep it together. Not many people could have taken a _year_ off work and not only had that time to spend as I did, but also have created assets that will continue to sell basically forever. It got me out of the darkest times I've ever had in my life and, like I said, nobody can take that away from me. 2013 was an awesome year, but I guess it's time to go back to work for a bit.

I'll be quitting again though. I'm like that. I'm just too damn stupid to even consider giving up. Even though this is crushing me just talking about it, "going back to work" is going to end eventually. I'll put aside my pennies, write more, and do it all again. I lasted a year and a half this time; maybe next time I'll make three. Maybe the second time's the charm.

Or maybe not. If I don't make it again, I'll do exactly what I'm doing now. Go back to work, save my pennies, and do it again. Rinse and repeat until I'm dead I suppose. That's just how I am.


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## Josh Hilden (Feb 22, 2014)

Every time I start thinking I could transition to full time writer I remember the kids and that my wife would go from making 50% of the household income to more than 75%. Si I stay at a job I loathe so I can afford to do the job I love.


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## Donna White Glaser (Jan 12, 2011)

David, that was a very courageous post and I thank you for it. I'll be sending good thoughts for your interview this week and for your on-going writing career.


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## rex kusler (Feb 12, 2010)

David Adams said:


> Thanks mate, and no worries (and the same to everyone else who's posted).
> 
> It is what it is. Job interview's this coming week -- I think I'm understating it when I say it's not going to be easy to smile and be professional when I'm talking to them, but I'll make sure I keep it together. Not many people could have taken a _year_ off work and not only had that time to spend as I did, but also have created assets that will continue to sell basically forever. It got me out of the darkest times I've ever had in my life and, like I said, nobody can take that away from me. 2013 was an awesome year, but I guess it's time to go back to work for a bit.
> 
> ...


At the interviews don't tell them that you quit in order to try a career change. Tell them it was a sabbatical to write a bunch of books in order to expand your horizons--sort of like getting an advanced degree. You don't want them to wonder if you'll be quitting again in the near future. They'll probably be impressed. Not many people have written a book; probably only a few million.


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## Al Dente (Sep 3, 2012)

Thank you for posting that, David. I have also been doing better these last few months, but it's just not enough. I may also need to find a part-time job that still gives me enough freedom and time to continue writing. Just remember, you're not alone in your journey. I know I can relate to everything you just wrote.


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## blakebooks (Mar 10, 2012)

I know several. It happens. Most entrepreneurs start businesses and fail. Part of the cycle. Hopefully you learn from your failure and use that knowledge on the next one. 

Frankly, we get an outlier effect here on KB, because the vast majority of authors will not make enough to quite their day job. 

The vast majority of musicians will not make enough to quite their day job. The vast majority of artists won't, either. Or dancers. Or singers. Or actors. Or aspiring models.

That's just the nature of the entertainment biz.


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## bmcox (Nov 21, 2012)

Thanks for sharing that, David.


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## 60865 (Jun 11, 2012)

Knock them out on your interview and then just think of it as training... you need to have the income so you can set some aside and then start over full time or maybe part time.


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## PatriceFitz (Jan 8, 2011)

David: I was just thinking of you, reading this thread, and here you are. That was a tremendous, honest, helpful post. Thank you for being so brave.

I don't have to work because my husband does (thank goddess) but my income went down last year even though I produced more work -- most of it was very short, selling for 99¢, and the cover costs added up. My income trend has gone something like this -- 2011 - $11,000, 2012 - $14,000, 2013 - $9,000. I think that's the reality of the indie book market maturing and the ups and downs of a writing career. If I didn't have a bread-winning spouse, I'd be back working as... gack... a lawyer! If they'd have me, which they no doubt would not. It's been too many years.

Certainly I make more from writing than from singing, so there's that.

I think your writing, David, is excellent, and when you DO break out--and you will, with your talent and work ethic--all your fans will discover that precious back catalog and you'll be surprised at how much you sell. Making a living from writing is in your future.

When you interview, tell them you are a successful writer but you find that you NEED a day job to feed the muse, and your writing is better when you are also traditionally employed... otherwise you are too isolated and not as productive. So your plan is to work for them _forever_ at their fabulous stupid job, while writing on the side. They'll think you are so cool. Besides, you've got those eyebrows, so how can they resist?

Can't wait for "Eh, Zombie"! 

P.S. I'd love to talk to you about print formatting and cover work. I'll email you.


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## wolfrom (May 26, 2012)

David: I really appreciate your openness on this.

And I'll add my own little tidbit: when my first novel went, like, sales-crazy, I honestly thought to myself "I've arrived". For a couple of weeks, I was making more per day than I was at my day job. For a couple of weeks... then...

My sales have been slowing down ever since. If anything, that experience and the experiences of other authors has shown me that sales are too fickle to simply replace a full-time job, that it's only if I ever felt that I was throwing money away by *wasting my time* at a day job that I'd ever consider becoming a self-employed writer.


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## PhoenixS (Apr 5, 2011)

David, "sabbatical" was the first word I thought for you as well. Thank you for a brave and honest assessment. And courage going forward. You have mad design skills; they'll stand you in good stead.


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## CDForness (Nov 25, 2013)

Great post, David.  Thank you for your honesty.  I do think though with another productive year or two under your belt like 2013 and you'll be on the road to walking away from formal employment again.  Good luck.


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## Lefty (Apr 7, 2011)

Good luck, David.


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## Monique (Jul 31, 2010)

Thank you for that post, David. The honesty and passion in at all is inspirational. Most of the entrepreneurs I know have failed several times. I have complete faith you'll find a way to forge your dream.


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2014)

Not something a lot like to think about.  I was gettin' pretty close this month.  By February 21 I'd only made about $250 for the month from my writing.  Thankfully the presidents smiled upon me last Monday and some big jobs came through and now I'll have a good month.  Sometimes the not-knowing is the worst.


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## David &#039;Half-Orc&#039; Dalglish (Feb 1, 2010)

David, your post is a very sobering, honest account that I think should be required reading for everyone who goes into self-publishing. And I really do hope you pull through. I have no idea if this'll help, but I thought this might cheer you up the tiniest bit. From a book of mine:










Not even in the same class, man! I think you still got yourself a shot, so long as you come back to this at some point. Other than that, again, I really hope things pick up for ya. And if you're my minion, I clearly am a terrible Overlord


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

We'll all be rooting for you, David. Hold a 9-to-5 job for a year or two to finance a year off for writing, then rinse and repeat until you steal the last of David Dalglish's readers ... this could work out really well in the long run.


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## MonkeyScribe (Jan 27, 2011)

David, thanks for putting it all out there. It's hard to admit where we've fallen short, and you've done a great service by showing your work like this.

Having said all of that, you clearly have passion and a great work ethic. There's no reason that if you find a job that doesn't exhaust you too much that you can't keep writing and building that audience. One bit of luck, one great book and you could be back on the path again.

Best wishes.


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## EC Sheedy (Feb 24, 2011)

Great post, David. Thank you. 

And good for you to have taken the risk you did, and as it looks like you produced a lot of work during that time, there's a d*mn good chance that risk will bring reward going forward. You're obviously young, energetic, talented and hard-working, and there are lots of possibilities ahead of you. Kudos to you for giving your dream a solid shot. Not any kind of failure in my book.  

Russell is right. Not everyone *makes it* in the entertainment business, but those who fail to get the gold are luckier than those who don't even have the dream/creativity to get in the race. 

Good on ya. And Good luck on the job hunt!


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## nico (Jan 17, 2013)

David,

You have been one of my inspirations around here ever since i joined in the conversation. You're attitude exemplifies the Writer's Cafe and what makes this community so special. Keep it up and good fortune will bend your way eventually. 

In the meantime, knock em dead at those interviews!


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## Terrence OBrien (Oct 21, 2010)

> I read an article lately on how to make a living as a writer. According to this person, you just figured out what you needed to make a living, divided that up into a monthly/weekly amount and then set your goal to sell that number of books to make it.


I used the same system when I was panning for gold in Alaska. The gold was using a different system.

David, I've done it several times, but not with books. Think of it as opportunity.

God Bless the unpredictable life, for they are much more fun.


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## ToniD (May 3, 2011)

David, your post really touched me. I salute your honesty and passion—and I hope you get the job you need so you can continue at least in some part with the job you love.

Wishing you the best. 

(always love your posts)


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## EC Sheedy (Feb 24, 2011)

Terrence OBrien said:


> I used the same system when I was panning for gold in Alaska. The gold was using a different system.


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## Bluebonnet (Dec 15, 2013)

David, I really appreciate your post, and I am going to bookmark it to read again. You are right -- however we feel about our writing, survival has to come first.

Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs model explains this in an academic way. 
http://www.learning-theories.com/maslows-hierarchy-of-needs.html

The five levels in Maslow's hierarchy are:
•Self-actualization - morality, creativity, problem solving, etc.
•Esteem - includes confidence, self-esteem, achievement, respect, etc.
•Belongingness - includes love, friendship, intimacy, family, etc.
•Safety - includes security of environment, employment, resources, health, property, etc.
•Physiological - includes air, food, water, sex, sleep, other factors towards homeostasis, etc.

When we write, we are trying to fulfill our needs for self-actualization and esteem. But when we're broke and trying to meet our basic survival needs, we are at the "safety" need level.


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## GearPress Steve (Feb 4, 2012)

Everyone who hasn't read the book by Tim Ferris needs to do so.


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## Justawriter (Jul 24, 2012)

David,

My day job is in hr and recruiting. Here's how I would advise you to spin this. Don't say it was a sabbatical, say you wanted to try writing full-time, that it was dream you'd always wished to pursue. Let them know it was a great experience, and that you'll continue writing on the side, as a hobby, but that you learned that you really missed being around other people and wish to return to a similar role, while keeping writing as a side interest. A lot of people do find that working from home isn't all they thought it would be, that it is isolating and they miss the people interaction. You really don't have to worry that they'll be concerned that you are going to do it again, because you have explained that it didn't work out and that your priorities have changed.

You might actually find that your writing will pick up once you get back to work as you'll have to be that much more focused with your time. I still work full-time and get very little done on the weekends when I have tons of free-time....but am much more productive during the week, either before or after work hours.

It could well be that you just were ahead of the curve, and the best is yet to come for you with your writing. I wish you all the best success with the new job and writing. 

I have a word doc of interview and job search tips that I usually give to my candidates to help them prep for job interviews...It's stuff I've seen work especially well over the past 20 years in this field and it's what we give out when we give presentations on interviewing and resumes.  Am happy to shoot you a copy if you email me (anyone else here as well who might want a copy).  pam at customsearchgroup dot com


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## RM Prioleau (Mar 18, 2011)

David's situation is why I'm so hesitant in quitting my day job right now.

I hope things get better for you, David.


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## cidneyswanson (Feb 1, 2011)

Invaluable share there, David Adams--like, required reading for everyone who asks me if they should quit their day job yet. Thanks for sharing.


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## burke_KB (Jan 28, 2013)

RM Prioleau said:


> David's situation is why I'm so hesitant in quitting my day job right now.
> 
> I hope things get better for you, David.


This. I'm so glad you posted this today. I have a violent coworker (long story too stupid to possibly be true) and I keep thinking about quitting the day job. Driving to work is stressful for the first time in my life because it feels like I'm heading for a fight. Right now my job funds all the business expenses that you talk about, and I know that without it I can't launch the series I have planned. To do it right, I have to stay in cubicle land a while longer.

The dose of cold water was much appreciated 

I hope things work out and you can regroup.


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## Mark Dawson (Mar 24, 2012)

Great post, David. I've also really enjoyed reading your thoughts and laying it out like that, with numbers, was a brave and cool thing to do.

I'm probably making enough money to think about quitting now but I'm more cautious than many and I would want to have maintained a level of sales for quite a while longer before taking the leap. Plus we're expecting our second child - and he is probably coming tonight - and so I've got to be responsible.

Best of luck for the interview. It'll be a short stay, I'm sure. A bump on the road. No more.


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## Howietzer (Apr 18, 2012)

Man, I can count my job failures on all four of my hands.


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## DRMarvello (Dec 3, 2011)

David, thanks for your honesty and for contributing your story. Reading through your post, I see a lot that can help both of us. I believe you will get a chance to put all of that wisdom to work again some day, and perhaps the timing will be right next time. 

I'm glad the experience didn't make you bitter or cause you to give up writing. The only way to lose is to quit trying. You never know when the next book is going to be THE book that makes all the difference.

Best of luck in both your careers.


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## Sam Rivers (May 22, 2011)

David, there has been some excellence advice written above so I won't repeat any of that.

I am an expert at giving advice since I had a son about your age and gave him tons of advice.  He never followed any of it, but it was great advice.  He is much older now and was telling me the other day that he should have followed my advice and would have gotten rich.

So here goes, not from a friend, but from a stranger.

I think you should find a woman with a nice personality and a good job and marry her.  The job is more important than the personality.  It is easy to write if your wife has a good job and supports you so you write and not worry about making money.

So how do you get this woman with personality?  When I was young and was interested in cute girls with slim waists and went out on a blind date, when I asked if she was pretty, I got the answer she has a nice personality.  What that means, you can guess.  God makes all women beautiful, but some he drops on their nose.

So why settle for a woman with personality?  These are usually more desperate to get married since they aren't slim and beautiful.  Also don't disregards those that are older and divorced as long as they have a good job and are rolling in dough.

You could even run a newspaper ad for a wife.  "Woman needed to support starving author.  Must be financially independent.  Looks are not important."

That is my advice and I hope it helps you get your writing career back on track.  Remember that Blake said you have to do whatever it takes to sell your books.  Personal tastes are not an option.  That is not exactly what he said, but I think you get the idea.

If this doesn't work out, you may have to go back to work.  Working might actually be the best option depending on how she looks.  But if she has a nice personality, who cares.


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## Adam Poe (Apr 2, 2012)

Has it really been that long already, David?   I was actually just wondering how your adventures in full-time were going. Thanks for that great post.


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2014)

Hey David,

Thanks for sharing your story.  Currently, I ghostwrite.  If my indie books don't take off, I'll continue to ghostwrite.  That keeps me from having to return to working in downtown Chicago.

I can't go back to that life.

Jolie


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

Wild Rivers said:


> When I was young and was interested in cute girls with slim waists and went out on a blind date, when I asked if she was pretty, I got the answer she has a nice personality. What that means, you can guess. God makes all women beautiful, but some he drops on their nose.


God is so unfair. He drops some men on their noses and then goes and drops them on their heads, too.


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## Sarah Wynde (Apr 7, 2013)

I quit my job in 1996 to write. I was a freelancer until 2001. I did pretty well--definitely enough to support myself and my son in reasonable comfort (helped quite a bit by the dot.com boom), but I took a full-time job in 2001, because I was exhausted. I wasn't anywhere close to running out of my savings--nor did I expect to be, because I was earning enough to keep up. But paid vacation time? Glorious! Health, dental & vision insurance, without spending a third of my income on it? So, so, so nice. And the lovely peace of not needing to be thinking about work constantly, to not always be looking for the next job, to not have to juggle deadlines and to not have my writing always be about money-money-money--ah, so relaxing. 

I wouldn't have said I failed. I would have said I reassessed my priorities. Being a casual writer with a day job was just a lot more fun than being a career writer for me.


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## Sam Rivers (May 22, 2011)

> God is so unfair. He drops some men on their noses and then goes and drops them on their heads, too. Roll Eyes


At least God doesn't discriminate.


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

Wild Rivers said:


> You could even run a newspaper ad for a wife. "Woman needed to support starving author. Must be financially independent. Looks are not important."


I think this is my favorite line on this message board EVER!


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## m.a. petterson (Sep 11, 2013)

David --

You have writing skills.  You don't have to limit yourself to writing books to make money.

Write resumes and cover letters for people.  When I first started I charged $35 and lived in such a rat hole I made house calls.  When I got good I charged $300 and up, and clients came to my (much nicer) house.

Market yourself to ad agencies, they like contracting out work.  I made up a brochure that basically said I could do any kind of writing quite well, wrote a great query letter saying the same thing differently, and mailed out a bunch.  

You can do the same with businesses.  Churches.  Non-profits begging for money.  And so on.

Even better, you've got huge credibility - you're a published author!

Man, if I'd been able to tell my previous clients that I could've charged a lot more.....


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## Mark E. Cooper (May 29, 2011)

Hey David,

You wrote a lot of heartfelt things there, but I will only pick one. You said that your book 1 wasn't your best work and that it was hurting your sell through sales. You said you didn't know what you could do about that, well I do. You can't help the readers who have already read it, but you can revise and re-edit the book for the future. I wouldn't take it down. I would revise the hell out of it, polish it with all the experience you have gained releasing the rest of the series. You DID say the other books are superior by far. Book 1 needs to be good to hook readers in. Make it great, then re-upload on permafree. You should see immediate benefit.

I agree with you regarding series. I have four series and no longer have any standalone titles. I did have two and two, but realised quite early that i needed to change the stand-alones into series as well. So now I have four series. It was awkward because I had to write a prequel for one of the books that was already out and change the old one to book 2, and also write a sequel for the other stand alone, but it worked. I didn't change the name of the books already out, I added series subtitles and numbers to them.

I was forced into writing full time when my day job went away, but I was ready and just procrastinating. I can feel that I have done okay, but the truth is that I wouldn't have had the courage without being pushed. The redundancy package gave me the money that others in the thread needed to save up. I was damn lucky to get it at just the right time.

I really feel for you mate. I could easily be in your situation if not for having those two series already done, and ideas how to change the other titles into series as well. Bookbub is hard to get into now. I have only gotten in twice--ever! I've stopped asking. I noticed in my own use of bookbub as a reader that I rarely if ever open it to click and buy now. I'm not sure if others are the same, but I feel their effectiveness will be reduced this year, though they are still king of the lists when compared to the other lists. This business is ever changing. That's why I took my best two month's (like you Dec and Jan) royalties and spent it all upon getting audio editions done. I need that extra revenue stream. I really hope it works or I might be in deep crap too.

So, the premise of this thread asks whether authors can fail. The answer is sort of. If I did have to get a part time job to fill in the troughs in the weaker month's royalties (I don't think I will but you never know), I wouldn't call it failure. The books will still be there selling their little hearts out for the rest of my life. I will just keep adding books to my catalogue. I started having enough money to write full time at 7 books out. I now have 10 and two box sets. I will keep writing and one day I can probably stop filling in those spreadsheets and working out budgets.

Keep writing in your off time if you do decide to get another job, David, and revise that book one to hook people on your series.

Mark


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## jackz4000 (May 15, 2011)

Courageous post David and I'm sure it was difficult to write. Your numbers make everything even more clear and it was very generous of you to share them in a public forum. I'm glad you are looking at it so clearly and know you will be back to fight another day.

Precious few have made a living writing books compared to those who want to. You have come near to the mark and I'm confident in time you will achieve your goal. This is just a little detour and you'll be back.


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## horse_girl (Apr 9, 2010)

rex kusler said:


> Quitting a job and then going back to it for the same pay isn't a failure. Quitting a desirable, good-paying job and ending up working for 15% of what you were making at your previous job--bad idea. Most quality jobs are not easy to get. I think there are a lot of authors who made good money the last two or three years and now find their sales greatly reduced.


The last line is where I find myself. I had a great 2012 and okay 2013 but even with more books out in 2014, I don't see myself being able to pay my expenses and taxes as I did then. Self-employment taxes suck! I had to get a new vehicle. Luckily, my husband's job covers everything except my hobbies--the big four-legged is a costly hobby and the reason I work.

I'm going back to doing home childcare (6 1/2 years then quit almost three years ago thanks to the ebook sales). It's not a failure to go back, just changing ebook market conditions and needing to make ends meet. Unless one of my books "breaks out" massively, I will continue working a second job, and there is a HUGE need for childcare here. I'm just not into diaper changing, potty training, and naps anymore...although the nap times were good for writing  (One learns how to get ALL ages down for naps at the same time!) At least with school-age kids, they can mostly entertain themselves, so if the mood hits, I could get a few words down.


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## LBrent (Jul 1, 2013)

jackz4000 said:


> Precious few have made a living writing books compared to those who want to. You have come near to the mark and I'm confident in time you will achieve your goal. This is just a little detour and you'll be back.


Exactly!

You haven't failed. You're simply adjusting to your circumstances right now.


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## Shayne Parkinson (Mar 19, 2010)

David, I really admire your courage, both in taking the leap in the first place and in sharing your experiences so openly. I'm going to echo so many others here, and say that your talent and work ethic makes me believe that you've still a *very* good chance of eventually supporting yourself financially by your writing. This is a setback, not the end of the road.

In the meantime, best of luck with the job interview. Fingers will be crossed for you on this side of the ditch.


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## SunHi Mistwalker (Feb 28, 2012)

I don't think I can add anything that others haven't already said, so I just want to say thank you, David, for your story. I have faith that you will do well and that you will eventually take off. I just feel it. Do what you have to do to pay the bills, but never, ever give up.


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## valeriec80 (Feb 24, 2011)

Oh, David. 

BIG HUGS. (You are one of my favorite people I've met in this self-publishing adventure, and we don't even really know each other. But you are aces in my book, just so you know.)

And, if it makes you feel better, I am not in a great place currently either. I have enough money to make through the next two months, and then... well, I'm just hoping next month is good. (My current way of dealing with this is not to think about it, since thinking about it changes exactly nothing. I'm trying to just be happy and think positive thoughts and shit, because Wayne Dyer says it works, and why not try, right? What's it going to hurt?) 

Anyway, I'm not sure that you even want advice (sometimes when people give me unasked for advice, I kind of get really annoyed), but I'm going to tell you some stuff that I've decided for myself, and if any of it resonates with you, cool. If not, also cool.

-If I ever go back to a job, I am never taking a career-type job. I was ready an article by Holly Lisle once and she said that if you're serious about this writing thing, then you have to live as if it's going to work. And one thing she recommended was to never take a job that you'd feel guilty about leaving. Work jobs that allow you to write as much as possible and that don't demand of you a commitment to excellence or whatever. Be a waiter, work retail, etc. Don't do something serious. That's what she said, anyway, and I fully intend to follow that idea. Writing is my priority. (Of course, I felt like such a damned failure at the end of 2013 that I toyed with the idea of quitting writing altogether for about a week. Worst week of my life, actually. Worse than when my cousin died or I got dumped. Don't know what that says about me. Probably that I'm selfish and awful, but... oh well.)

-I published some books that are pretty terrible too. Not all of them were written when I first started writing either. I'm never going to revise them except for spot-changing typos. I'm just going to write better books and throw those out, and then hope people see those first. I don't know about you, but the thought of revising something I wrote years ago, when I was a different writer and a different person, sounds about as fun to me as getting a root canal, and I'm sure I can put my time to better use. But, that's just me. 

I'm glad you're not giving up, and I'm closing my eyes and wishing for the book-selling fairy to make all your books take off. Or for you to be drowning in opportunities for Bookbub, or for you to be graced with one of those ideas that sells itself because it's so amazing that hearing the one-line premise makes people go, "I want that now."

I really wish you the best. Very, very much.


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## Steve W. (Feb 23, 2011)

David, just wanted to say good luck to you.


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## SunHi Mistwalker (Feb 28, 2012)

valeriec80 said:


> -*I published some books that are pretty terrible too. *Not all of them were written when I first started writing either. I'm never going to revise them except for spot-changing typos. I'm just going to write better books and throw those out, and then hope people see those first. I don't know about you, but the thought of revising something I wrote years ago, when I was a different writer and a different person, sounds about as fun to me as getting a root canal, and I'm sure I can put my time to better use. But, that's just me.


Not to derail the thread, but I just want to say that when I saw you say this I was surprised, so I took a look at your signature books. I read the description on "Breathless" and then went to read the reviews. Of course, I saw the first one star and read that. Well, after reading that review I was like "This is EXACTLY the type of book I would love," then I clicked download to kindle.  Just because someone (even a lot of people) is crapping on your books doesn't mean the books are bad. It just means that those readers who didn't like it are the most vocal and that you haven't found your audience yet.

Edited for clarity.


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## CJArcher (Jan 22, 2011)

David, I just wanted to add my well wishes to all the above. It's clear from your post that you love to write and I think this passion will stand you in good stead until you can go full-time again. Best of luck.



Becca Mills said:


> God is so unfair. He drops some men on their noses and then goes and drops them on their heads, too.


This made me LOL so hard.


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## rex kusler (Feb 12, 2010)

Wild Rivers said:


> I think you should find a woman with a nice personality and a good job and marry her. The job is more important than the personality. It is easy to write if your wife has a good job and supports you so you write and not worry about making money.
> 
> So how do you get this woman with personality? When I was young and was interested in cute girls with slim waists and went out on a blind date, when I asked if she was pretty, I got the answer she has a nice personality. What that means, you can guess. God makes all women beautiful, but some he drops on their nose.
> 
> ...


I knew a guy who thought he'd met a woman like that. She stole his car while he was asleep.


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## dianasg (Jan 8, 2010)

David, I just wanted to thank you for your very brave and honest post. I know you're an institution here at KB, and rightly so. There are few people who deserve success in writing as much as you, and I honestly believe you'll get there. "There" being wherever you want to be. 

FWIW, I don't see your venture and return to the day job as a failure at all. From where I'm standing, you took a leap of faith and were rewarded with a stretch of time where you were a working writer! You lived off your stories, your creations, the products of your imagination. And that's incredible. That's the dream. I mean, any of us could die tomorrow. The question will always be, what did you do with your life? How did you spend your time? And you've been able to live what most of us will only ever dream of doing before we die. You spent a year as a writer. That's no small feat. This is not to say that going back to the day job isn't painful -- rather, it's just a reminder to give yourself some major credit for this incredible thing you managed to accomplish -- and will continue to accomplish, even if it's a year or two at a time. So. *high fives*

I'm crossing my fingers for you and sending you the very best of wishes.


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## Usedtoposthere (Nov 19, 2013)

minxmalone said:


> I'm sure there's examples of this but most of the writers I know who've quit their day jobs didn't do so until they had a significant cash cushion to tide them over. I waited until I had enough in the bank to carry me for two years straight even if my sales completely stopped. And that was after I paid off all my outstanding debt.
> 
> So I think that's why you don't see that many cases of people going back. Because it's just not a decision that you make lightly and without adequate contingency plans.


Well, maybe YOU don't, Minx. I did. I quit two weeks into writing my first fiction. I did! (Well, I didn't actually leave the job for another month, by which time I'd finished the book. OK, six weeks.)

I was very scared. BUT my husband's health insurance was already covering me, and we knew we could manage, albeit on a much tighter budget, for a year. And I have credentials where I could have got another job if we'd really had to fill in the gap. It was still a huge leap. Very glad I did it, though I still can't believe I did. I'm not what you'd call a devil-may-care sort of person.

David, best of luck to you. That was my Plan B, too--to go back and get a "real job." No shame in that whatsoever, though I totally get that it feels bad. This business is full of ups and downs, very iffy place to be, which is why it's scary to have all your eggs in the "author" basket.

And I, too, went back and re-edited the heck out of my first book. And my second, and my third, and about to start in on #s four and five. Hopefully, I won't feel like I have to re-edit #s seven and eight a year from now.


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## nomesque (Apr 12, 2010)

David Adams said:


> It is what it is. Job interview's this coming week -- I think I'm understating it when I say it's not going to be easy to smile and be professional when I'm talking to them, but I'll make sure I keep it together. Not many people could have taken a _year_ off work and not only had that time to spend as I did, but also have created assets that will continue to sell basically forever. It got me out of the darkest times I've ever had in my life and, like I said, nobody can take that away from me. 2013 was an awesome year, but I guess it's time to go back to work for a bit.


Good luck with the interview. 

I can see this being the case with me too. Not that I did quit - I was made redundant in November - but I walked out beaming with a spring in my step. But whether I can make it pay, with the sort of writing I do and the lack of traction from having had to neglect my writing for a couple of years... I don't know. It's nice to have the opportunity, though.


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## SunshineOnMe (Jan 11, 2014)

Mark Dawson said:


> Great post, David. I've also really enjoyed reading your thoughts and laying it out like that, with numbers, was a brave and cool thing to do.
> 
> I'm probably making enough money to think about quitting now but I'm more cautious than many and I would want to have maintained a level of sales for quite a while longer before taking the leap. Plus we're expecting our second child - and he is probably coming tonight - and so I've got to be responsible.
> 
> Best of luck for the interview. It'll be a short stay, I'm sure. A bump on the road. No more.


Ahhhh congratulations on your babe!!!!


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## Writerly Writer (Jul 19, 2012)

Wild Rivers said:


> So why settle for a woman with personality? These are usually more desperate to get married since they aren't slim and beautiful. Also don't disregards those that are older and divorced as long as they have a good job and are rolling in dough.


 

Definitely don't try go for those women who might have both personality and good looks. They are as unattainable as ebook sales.


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## WHDean (Nov 2, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your troubles, David. It’s easy to get caught up in the "doors closing forever" thing when you’re young. Luckily, however, life doesn’t work like that. One day you’re lamenting working with a bunch of goofs in a goofy job, the next you’re writing about how bad it is just to purge yourself of it, and the day after you’re publishing a book about it that hits the bestseller list. Life’s funny like that. 

Good luck.


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## hardnutt (Nov 19, 2010)

David, you're a winner in my book.

What does a writer need?

Courage: It took courage to write that post.
Dedication: You've got it in spades, man.
The work ethic: Ditto.
A love of words: Got that as well.
Craft: Hell, if you're able and willing to do your own covers / formatting / interiors, you're WAY ahead of most authors.
Writing talent: I confess I haven't read any of your books (I'm into mysteries and historicals), but I might just pop off and buy one or two now. But, to judge from your various posts on kb, you can sure put words together. You can write about your feelings, too (how's that for a man?!).

You've got the full package, you lucky Aussie b*****d! Okay, so you weren't able to make it work this time. No shame in that. I've been published since 1991, but it's only in the last couple of years that I've made a full-time living (not a fortune, but enough to get by).

Try to regard the forthcoming day job as a rare opportunity to get close to and observe unfamiliar people (your new workmates). Consider it as a research project and you won't feel nearly so bad.

Good luck for the future. I have a feeling the world will be hearing a lot more about David Adams, author.


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## Maia Sepp Ross (May 10, 2013)

Becca Mills said:


> God is so unfair. He drops some men on their noses and then goes and drops them on their heads, too.


Ain't that the truth


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## valeriec80 (Feb 24, 2011)

SunHi Mistwalker said:


> Not to derail the thread, but I just want to say that when I saw you say this I was surprised, so I took a look at your signature books. I read the description on "Breathless" and then went to read the reviews. Of course, I saw the first one star and read that. Well, after reading that review I was like "This is EXACTLY the type of book I would love," then I clicked download to kindle.  Just because someone (even a lot of people) is crapping on your books doesn't mean the books are bad. It just means that those readers who didn't like it are the most vocal and that you haven't found your audience yet.
> 
> Edited for clarity.


Aww, thanks!! Rest assured, I have never let that particular one star bother me. It was actually posted on a blog and I went and asked the reviewer to put in on Amazon, because I knew it would draw the right kinds of people to the book and send the wrong kinds of people away.

Maybe I shouldn't say "terrible." Let's say that I have books that suffer from various storytelling issues instead, shall we?  There are little gems of awesomesauce in those books, of course, or I wouldn't have put them out for people to buy. (I do have two manuscripts that will never, ever be published, because they require far, far too much work to ever be salvageable.)

Oh, and anytime you want to derail a thread to say nice stuff to me, I think it's perfectly okay. And everyone else agrees with me.

Right?

Come on, guys. _Right?_


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## vrabinec (May 19, 2011)

rex kusler said:


> I knew a guy who thought he'd met a woman like that. She stole his car while he was asleep.


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## kathrynoh (Oct 17, 2012)

> So, the premise of this thread asks whether authors can fail. The answer is sort of. If I did have to get a part time job to fill in the troughs in the weaker month's royalties (I don't think I will but you never know), I wouldn't call it failure. The books will still be there selling their little hearts out for the rest of my life.


This is so true. It's not a black/white, success/fail situation. Years ago, I was doing a writing course and one of the guys in the course would work for a year then take a year off to write. He'd been doing that for quite a few years. I'd love to try it but I have enough gaps in my resume due to travel as it is  I'm a contractor so I can take longer periods between jobs as it is but ultimately, I'd love to be able to earn enough from writing so that I can write and travel.

Hope the interview goes well, David.


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## NoCat (Aug 5, 2010)

Well, if I can't turn everything around in the next six months, I'll be writing a post I guess much like David's. I've been writing for a living since 2009, but with medical bills and such piling up, I have about 6 months.


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## Riley Graham (Sep 1, 2013)

David, thank you so much for sharing your story. I know it can't have been easy, but I admire you for your courage and honesty. You should be proud of all you've accomplished, and I wish you all the best in your writing career.


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## Sapphire (Apr 24, 2012)

rex kusler said:


> At the interviews don't tell them that you quit in order to try a career change. Tell them it was a sabbatical to write a bunch of books in order to expand your horizons


This is excellent advice. Keep us posted on your future writing and the more traditional job success. Life has a way of hitting us with surprises, but those who persevere at their goals eventually meet with sweet success.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Huge thanks to everyone who's posted so far. I just got up and I didn't expect this to have anywhere near as many replies as it has. Wow. You are all awesome. 

It's funny. I got woken up by the recruiter telling me that they've not only found another possible position for me (it's part time too, which means I would be able to continue writing at a fairly good pace), but the interview is on for Friday. It's not the first job interview I've had so far in the search, but it's the first one that I felt I could get it, and that I'd *want* to get it. It's part time, but two shifts a week at 12 hours per shift, so it's pretty much ideal for me.

Going to be pretty nervous.



burke_KB said:


> This. I'm so glad you posted this today. I have a violent coworker (long story too stupid to possibly be true) and I keep thinking about quitting the day job.


I know how you feel, but I want to stress that this last year has been really really good. I don't regret it at all, from a personal perspective, or even from an economic one. At the moment my books are making about $1,000 a month. From an investment point of view, it's pretty hard to get something that good from only a year's work.

I do recommend it if you can manage it, but if you're going to do it, make sure it's sustainable -- or that you have a backup plan if all goes to poop. It helps that I'm single though because while I'm totally okay with going "So hey, this week's meals are... rice and random sauce packets!" That's a crappy thing to do to an S.O.


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## dalya (Jul 26, 2011)

First, much <3 to David.

Second, some of us have "failed" and given up on pen names, series, and genres. 

I've poured my heart into books that were such utter failures that when my KDP report shows a sale in one of them, it hurts my thump-thump.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Wild Rivers said:


> I think you should find a woman with a nice personality and a good job and marry her.


You forget that I'm hilariously unattractive.

Honestly, I'd rather not bring someone else into this unless they were certain they knew what they were doing, and they liked me for me. Part of the reason why I quit the day job in the first place was ex-related; I'd rather be single, go back to work, save pennies, and focus on writing when it's time again.

I have a cute cat. She is the most adorable cat ever. I'll just cuddle her and make everything okay.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

MarkP said:


> David --
> 
> You have writing skills. You don't have to limit yourself to writing books to make money.


It's actually not a bad idea. I've been doing a bit of freelance cover and formatting work but I might look into that, even if a job comes through. Every penny saved now is another few minutes before quitting again (oh, both the positions I mentioned are 6-month contracts, so that's even better!).


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## AshMP (Dec 30, 2009)

David, you know I've always been a big fan of your work and I while I know you'll continue to write, I think sharing your journey of being a full-time writer (thus far!) was very brave.

I believe that it's human nature to take chances. For me writing was a life long dream, and I'm proud of what I done. That's not to say that I haven't made mistakes or have my fair share of regrets...of course I've made mistakes along the way and erred (some of which are mortifying) but I don't consider them failures. I learn from them, sometimes the lessons just cost more emotionally or financially. I'm okay with that.

I left my job in the fall of 2012. Where I was working downsized and I was no longer needed. It coincided with the release of my second book, and I felt certain it was "sign" that it was time for me to move on. Unlike many of you, I didn't have the time to save up for years. I just jumped. Given the chance, I'd probably have done it differently. Still, my husband (God bless him) worked and for that, I was able to "stay home" and work my craft, write my books, and so on. My sales were steady and with the addition of a second novel I was making more than before but even that was *considerably* less than what I'd contributed in the past. We adjusted to the smaller income over time, but it wasn't easy and my "standard of living and expectations" changed dramatically.

In the winter of 2013, a few months after my job had shuttered, my book (for the blink of an eye) made Amazon's Best Seller list. We celebrated and I had the best month, in multiples, than ever had before. That's when I signed with my agent. That isn't the right course for everyone, please believe that I know that, but sitting there with a contract in hand and the afterglow of my potential still lingering, I was hopeful. Really, really hopeful.

It's been almost a year now. April will be the milestone of my decision. There have been good times...but there have also been bad. When I say bad, I mean months were my book didn't sell and I made nothing. Mark and I have discussed my going back into the work world, and someday it may come to that, although Mark tells me all the time that he "loves that we both work from home." It's terrible to be contributing nothing to a family that means everything to me...but I'm not "there" yet where I'll roll over and admit defeat.

Still, I don't feel shame, even when I consider the "un-pretty" parts of this choice I made. I'm big on taking chances, it's why I left college for cosmetology school and why I've had so many of the life-defining experiences I've had. I don't think, even if I end up failing, I'd be able to "regret" the choices I made...they aren't worth regretting and I hope, no matter what happens, all of you somehow feel much the same. See, I have a friend who wants to be an interior designer but every day she gets up before dawn and hoofs it to a job she hates. Work makes her frequently unhappy. She texts me periodically to "vent" and I don't believe any amount of money in the world is worth that sort of mental anguish. She occasionally takes pot-shots at me for doing what I do (example: "How's your paycheck?") and I just smile and shrug it off because at the end of the day, I'm doing what she isn't brave enough to do yet. I think, spending time in the WC is a bit of mind-warp. We're around so many authors all the time that moniker looses it shine...but in the real world, we're writers, and how many other people do you know that can they've written a book or multiple books, much less chased the dream of seeing them reach the level of success they deserve? How many people do you know that can they risked it all to live an authentic life? Probably not many.


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## Victoria Champion (Jun 6, 2012)

Tad of a sideline but ... David Adams, you said that you regret not having a different url? You can buy another domain name for around $11/year and have it redirect to a pre-existing site without paying extra hosting fees. It really doesn't matter what the url bar shows once the visitor is at your site. Just get them to the site. For instance, I have both luminouspoints.com and victoriachampion.com as my site url, which is actually hosted by blogger, which has its own url. And so I just use victoriachampion.com whenever referring to my site in email, social media, in conversation, in my ebooks, and everywhere else to point people to my site. I use Dreamhost for this service, but you can try just about any reputable domain provider.

As for the money and job thing, good luck. Wish you the best.


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## Cherise (May 13, 2012)

rex kusler said:


> I knew a guy who thought he'd met a woman like that. She stole his car while he was asleep.


LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!!!!!!


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## Sam Rivers (May 22, 2011)

> Honestly, I'd rather not bring someone else into this unless they were certain they knew what they were doing, and they liked me for me. Part of the reason why I quit the day job in the first place was ex-related; I'd rather be single, go back to work, save pennies, and focus on writing when it's time again.


Dave, I think there is someone out there for everyone. When I was a young man, I worried I would never find anyone. But I have been married for 46 years and they have been wonderful years that I wouldn't have wanted to spend alone.

So keep looking and you will find the right woman someday.


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## P.A. Woodburn (May 22, 2010)

That was a very courageous post, David. I don't see you as a failed writer at all. Going back to work for a while may give you some new experiences. I see this as just a temporary set back. I'm sure you'll be around. You have a whole lifetime of writing ahead of you. This will be forgotten.


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## Maia Sepp Ross (May 10, 2013)

Thank you, David, and everyone else for sharing your stories. I left my job in late 2012. I had just turned 40, and I simply could not continue to work 12 hour days in a very difficult environment, live with a chronic illness, and continue to write. I had a fair bit of money saved up, my husband has a good job, and we don't have any debt. We're living pretty frugally right now, compared to how we used to, and he's very supportive. I hope that I'm able to make even a tiny living this year, or I'm going to have to consider going back to a day job. I really want to be able to make a go of this (and I hope I can), but if I can't, then at least I know that I gave it a shot. And I never, ever thought I was going to get that chance.
--Maia


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

markecooper said:


> Hey David,
> 
> You wrote a lot of heartfelt things there, but I will only pick one. You said that your book 1 wasn't your best work and that it was hurting your sell through sales. You said you didn't know what you could do about that, well I do. You can't help the readers who have already read it, but you can revise and re-edit the book for the future. I wouldn't take it down. I would revise the hell out of it, polish it with all the experience you have gained releasing the rest of the series. You DID say the other books are superior by far. Book 1 needs to be good to hook readers in. Make it great, then re-upload on permafree. You should see immediate benefit.


I've revised it slightly already (a controversial scene was rewritten, and then later the whole book was reedited), but I'm very strongly considering a soft reboot. It would keep continuity with the other books with minor revisions to them, but the main difference would be that Liao would not be in command at the beginning and she would assume command about half-way through the book. It'd be a substantial change but one that could work.

Alternatively, I could just move on and write something else instead. Both are good options. I haven't decided yet.


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## 57280 (Feb 20, 2012)

Just remember David, you already have a career: you are a writer.

What you need is what we actors call a _survival job._

You'll be absolutely fine. Good luck to you!


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## Ben Mathew (Jan 27, 2013)

Beautiful post, David. Thanks for sharing. Best of luck going forward.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

hardnutt said:


> David, you're a winner in my book.


Thanks.  And thanks to everyone else who posted stuff. I kind of binged a bit today, helped a mate buy a new TV, ate bad food and felt sorry for myself. Feeling a LOT better now.



hardnutt said:


> Try to regard the forthcoming day job as a rare opportunity to get close to and observe unfamiliar people (your new workmates). Consider it as a research project and you won't feel nearly so bad.


That's basically my plan. Also, I'm going to use at least some of the money to go to the U.S. and have a long trip -- going to visit some "writing-inspiring" locations, as well as visit a really awesome ex-cheerleader friend of mine for reasons that I swear are purely platonic. c_c


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## A.A (Mar 30, 2012)

David Adams said:


> That's basically my plan. Also, I'm going to use at least some of the money to go to the U.S. and have a long trip -- going to visit some "writing-inspiring" locations, as well as visit a really awesome ex-cheerleader friend of mine for reasons that I swear are purely platonic. c_c


I didn't know Hugh had ever been a cheerleader 

Seconding what Victoria said about changing your website name. I changed mine from the stupidly-stupid dollhousetrilogy.com to my author name without a hitch. After reading your Imperfect short story, I knew you'd just have to hit the right note with a large enough audience and you'll have a major hit on your hands. That's all it's going to take - because the writing is there.


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## Becca Mills (Apr 27, 2012)

A.A said:


> I didn't know Hugh had ever been a cheerleader


Was *so* waiting for that.


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## Rin (Apr 25, 2011)

A.A said:


> I didn't know Hugh had ever been a cheerleader


Coming soon to Kindle Worlds...


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## Susanne O (Feb 8, 2010)

A lot of posts here reminded me of this poem by Rudyard Kipling, which someone on my forum just mentioned:

If you can dream---and not make dreams your master;
If you can think---and not make thoughts your aim,
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same:.
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
And stoop and build'em up with worn-out tools;

ETA: Thank you David for sharing your story. I don't see that as failure, just part of the ups and downs of a writing career. Everyone has them. That's what this writing business is all about. That's what life is about too. You have done extraordinary well since you started and you will keep going and rise again. Nobody can take away your great talent. You will write more books and keep increasing your readership. You're young and you have all the time in the world. Hang in there and keep writing.

Good luck!


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## books_mb (Oct 29, 2013)

This reminds me of the so-called "publication bias". Scientists and journals are more willing to publish studies with a positive result (great for furthering the career, get visibility) than a negative results (often seen as a waste of time and certainly not gonna win you a Nobel). This happened when the SSRI drugs were still young. Their effectiveness was greatly overestimated (and side-effects underestimated) simply because many studies with negative results lay dormant. I suppose in this case we have a similar situation. People are generally more willing to share a success story than a failure and hence you can expect the ratio to be skewed.

That said, thanks to KDP making a living with writing is not rocket-science. It's never been easier. You know how much an artist makes for a play on Spotify? Less than a hundredth of a cent. Same goes for plays on webradios. Compared to that, ebooks are cash cows. As a writer you still have a much better chance at quitting a day job than a musician.


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## UnicornEmily (Jul 2, 2011)

Thank you for your very honest sharing, David.  It was good to hear your story, and with such specific details.

I don't see it as a failure, either.  You will make it.  You have stumbled, but you'll make it.  I'm sure it's meant to be.


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## Zelah Meyer (Jun 15, 2011)

*Hugs* To David. Thank you for sharing your story with us.

To you, and to everyone facing a return to working for someone else - just remember that highs and lows are a natural part of an artistic career. Very few people, VERY few, just keep going up and up.

I read an old, public domain book by a professional writer: https://archive.org/details/fictionfactoryb00compgoog (I recommend the online scanned version if you want to read it) and he talks about times where he was struggling to make ends meet. Dean Wesley Smith talks about how many 'crashes' he's had as an author, and how when he was coming out of one, he spoke to a bunch of other long-term professionals at a conference and they'd all had at least two or three as well.

Having to adapt and take up other work from time to time isn't failure, it's part of the journey. The only writers who don't have to do that are the run away bestsellers who have made enough money that they never have to work again! Those lucky men and women are the outliers among outliers.

Good luck!


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Doomed Muse said:


> Well, if I can't turn everything around in the next six months, I'll be writing a post I guess much like David's. I've been writing for a living since 2009, but with medical bills and such piling up, I have about 6 months.


This is why I'm glad I'm Australian. Free health care seems like such a completely ordinary thing that I can't even imagine living without it. 



AshMP said:


> David, you know I've always been a big fan of your work and I while I know you'll continue to write, I think sharing your journey of being a full-time writer (thus far!) was very brave.


Oh hush, you wrote one of the best books I've ever read. I'm your fan. That's settled.

Thanks though.  I know you're going to be okay. You've got publishing contacts and all kinds of fancy stuff -- you've got a lot going for you, and a supportive S.O. is a really big part of that. High fives to both of you. 



A.A said:


> I didn't know Hugh had ever been a cheerleader


There will ALSO be more Hugh stalking. It's going to be awesome!


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## N. Gemini Sasson (Jul 5, 2010)

I see life as coming in stages. You never really fail. You learn lessons, move on, and apply those lessons to the next endeavor.

Only by taking risks in life do we test our limits. When we don't meet our expectations and have the courage to move on, we gain wisdom, appreciation and resiliency. 

I don't think it's always true that people who need to return to other jobs just don't want to talk about their 'failures'; I think it's that they have the sensibility to get on with life and not dwell on it.


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## Sapphire (Apr 24, 2012)

Casper Bogart said:


> Just remember David, you already have a career: you are a writer.
> 
> What you need is what we actors call a _survival job._
> 
> You'll be absolutely fine. Good luck to you!


THIS! (Yes, I know all caps are like shouting. It was intentional.)


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## hardnutt (Nov 19, 2010)

David Adams said:


> This is why I'm glad I'm Australian. Free health care seems like such a completely ordinary thing that I can't even imagine living without it.


One good thing you learned from us Brits...!

But please, can you teach us to play cricket?


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## Lisa Scott (Apr 4, 2011)

David Adams said:


> You forget that I'm hilariously unattractive.


Um...nope! You're super cute, you love cats, and you've got an accent (at least in the US you'll have one!) You'll find a girl. 

Good luck to you. This isn't the end of your story. Just one of the plot points along the way. Keep us updated and nail that interview.


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## Lisa Grace (Jul 3, 2011)

books_mb said:


> This reminds me of the so-called "publication bias". Scientists and journals are more willing to publish studies with a positive result (great for furthering the career, get visibility) than a negative results (often seen as a waste of time and certainly not gonna win you a Nobel). This happened when the SSRI drugs were still young. Their effectiveness was greatly overestimated (and side-effects underestimated) simply because many studies with negative results lay dormant. I suppose in this case we have a similar situation. People are generally more willing to share a success story than a failure and hence you can expect the ratio to be skewed.
> 
> That said, thanks to KDP making a living with writing is not rocket-science. It's never been easier. You know how much an artist makes for a play on Spotify? Less than a hundredth of a cent. Same goes for plays on webradios. Compared to that, ebooks are cash cows. As a writer you still have a much better chance at quitting a day job than a musician.


What if Edison had felt like a failure with the first 1,999 lightbulbs he designed that didn't work? He might of quit, and then where would us night owls be? 

You're doing well for what you have out.  Keep writing, enjoy the journey, hug your kitty, and know you have a whole forum of people rooting for you. And maybe Hugh is getting to the point where he wants to hire a ghost writer, and go all James Patterson on us.


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## Book Master (May 3, 2013)

Too many folks think that self publishing is an easy way to make tons of money. I wish that those that promote it as a way to go from "rags to riches" would stop the nonsense already.

Many work regular jobs but still find the time to spend writing. Write when you have the time and chances, aside from your regular means of financial support. Who knows, you just might find some luck with your writing that can lead to making some good money.  If it is meant for you to make a lot of money then that will happen but don't get into it thinking money first.

Write because you love to write and it comes from your heart and soul first.

BM


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## William Stacey (Jul 7, 2012)

Hey, David,
hang in there brother. Not a fail if you keep trying.

No advice, you're getting tons of it anyhow. Just a thought: Remember, "your place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory or defeat." (so says Teddy R, and I think he was exactly correct).


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## sarahdalton (Mar 15, 2011)

Wishing you the best, David. I'm right there with you discovering that it's so hard to maintain good sales. Luckily I'm still earning more than my old day job and saved a load when sales were great so I'm okay for the time being. 

But if I have to go back to work, I won't consider it a failure, and you shouldn't either. Good luck with the job hunt!


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## B.A. Spangler (Jan 25, 2012)

Hang in there David - and thank you for being so open. The timing of this thread is uncanny as I face some similar decisions.
As another author recently told me, change is just a plot twist, the story continues on.

Hope you land the part-time job. Sounds like a perfect survival job.


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## Jana DeLeon (Jan 20, 2011)

Thank you for sharing your story, David! I hope you find a great part-time position that eliminates your financial worries and still allows you time to write.


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## Kay Bratt (Dec 28, 2011)

David,

Funny how you wouldn't have predicted it, yet you turned into an inspiration for many! I applaud you for chasing your dreams in a big way and I feel the year you took to focus on writing will be huge later on when a book does take off for you, and then you'll have a backlist for readers to pounce on.

I've been very lucky that I've had a spouse to rely on, because it has taken me five years to be at the level of success I am now that if I had to (and I hope I never will), I could support myself on my writing alone. It's been a long, hard journey and sometimes reading the almost-instant success tales of other authors can be like a kick in the gut, but I try to focus on my own road, and knowing how hard it was to get here makes it that much more rewarding for me.

Remember this; you _are_ a writer. _And_ an inspiration.

Everything else is just backstory.


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Thanks once again to everyone. There's just so many that I can't reply to all of you, but I love everyone. <3

Job interview tomorrow. I'm good. Not freaking out at all. I can do it!

Related note: I discovered today that Amazon's totally stripped out all the formatting in Lacuna. I discovered via a bad review that mentioned it, and I'm like... what the heck are they talking abOHGODWHATISTHIS. This isn't my book!

Emergency republish, emergency chocolate injection, emergency cat cuddling. Must remember to eat chocolate and cuddle cat, not the other way around.


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## Guest (Feb 26, 2014)

Yes, you'd have to define the term fail. 

For instance, when there are no opportunities in a given field, people often take jobs just to earn a living. I met several accountants driving cabs Did they fail at accounting because they had to resort to driving people around the city? I also have ballet dancing friends working at Starbucks and other places offering flexible schedules so they pursue their real career. 

I don't see or define either of these as failures. You live, you learn, and sometimes you take a job just because.


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## nomesque (Apr 12, 2010)

David Adams said:


> Related note: I discovered today that Amazon's totally stripped out all the formatting in Lacuna. I discovered via a bad review that mentioned it, and I'm like... what the heck are they talking abOHGODWHATISTHIS. This isn't my book!


GAH! Talk about nightmare. *shudder*



David Adams said:


> Emergency republish, emergency chocolate injection, emergency cat cuddling. Must remember to eat chocolate and cuddle cat, not the other way around.


Cats are good like that. They'll point out (usually forcefully) that you're mistaken. My dog would probably just deal philosophically with it.


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## wolfrom (May 26, 2012)

David Adams said:


> Related note: I discovered today that Amazon's totally stripped out all the formatting in Lacuna. I discovered via a bad review that mentioned it, and I'm like... what the heck are they talking abOHGODWHATISTHIS. This isn't my book!


I've put Lacuna in the hopper for tomorrow's SF Signal Free Fiction post... not sure if that results in more than a few new readers, though...

It looks to me like the formatting is fixed now, but let me know if I should push that mention back a day.

_Assuming you're not already asleep, since it's very late where you are..._


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## FictionalWriter (Aug 4, 2010)

Oh yes. Someone who answered my survey said she quit her job and now has to look for another one. Her sales really went down in 2013. She blamed it on authors giving away their books for free. I respectively disagree with her, but that's just me.


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## Sam Rivers (May 22, 2011)

> Oh yes. Someone who answered my survey said she quit her job and now has to look for another one. Her sales really went down in 2013. She blamed it on authors giving away their books for free. I respectively disagree with her, but that's just me.


There have been a lot of discussions about free books causing a drop in sales. Nothing has ever been resolved though.

Personally I don't give away any books since I have strong sales so don't need to. If free books affect book sales, it hasn't seem to affect mine.


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## Usedtoposthere (Nov 19, 2013)

StevenCampbell said:


> Wow! As a science fiction author, I wish I had the capability of visiting parallel universes. Ones where you could track your book sales where there were no free books in the world, and contrast it with this universe. Because that's the only way you can be certain your sales haven't been affected (+ or -).
> 
> While you're universe-hopping can you do me a favor and tell me if I get more dates if I ink Maori tattoos all over my face? I don't want to go down that road only to find it was a mistake. Thx.
> 
> /btw, this isn't meant to be mean, I just thought it was a funny, and very definitive, statement to make.


Well, the three Maori heroes in my stories definitely get dates, and end up with hot girls. But then, their mokos are only on one arm/shoulder/pec. The face thing might be a bridge too far. Just sayin'.


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## Derek.Courson (Feb 27, 2014)

I was fired from my day job so that made the decision easy.


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

I'm doing it and I'm not succeeding. Yet. I don't consider it failing, though. I consider it working toward success, like with any start-up business or endeavor. If I fail, at least I tried. It would bother me on my death bed had I not tried.

And, yeah, the newest book is too big in my siggy. I've asked for help because I can't EVER get a book up in my sig here correctly.


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## daringnovelist (Apr 3, 2010)

I've been thinking about this thread, and I think the problem with the Subject question is that for most writers quitting a day job is a single and important event.  But what happens after that is a process.  It's... an evolution.

So, you quit your full time job as a stock broker to write thrillers, but it doesn't go so well, so you start writing erotic romance instead.... failure or just a change?  Even though you didn't end up doing what you intended.

What if, instead of writing erotic romance, you still kept writing the thrillers, but had a sideline of editing and formatting books for other authors... failure or adaptation?  What if you take on some part time consulting work?

What if you got an offer to live free on a beautiful island as long as you took care of some beautiful birds on the island while you were at it? (As was discussed in another thread.)  Failure or really cool opportunity?

Quitting your job is one, easily definable thing.  What happens after that, though, can be really hard to define.

I don't know that I've ever heard of someone quitting their day job write, and then giving up and simply going back to their day job. It's always an evolution forward.

Camille


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## jnfr (Mar 26, 2011)

Best wishes, David. You really are a bright light around here.


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## Perro Callejero (Dec 23, 2013)

Thank you for your post, David.


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## MrPLD (Sep 23, 2010)

I have started several businesses ( just myself ) and crashed & burned even though they were my passion.  Maybe it's easier to say it now, but all I know is that sometimes things simply don't work out, either because the market falls away, or you don't have enough capital to keep afloat long enough to gain the market traction you need... or you just decide you don't like it any more.

As for writing, I'm supporting the writer in the relationship as a "long term investment" so that we have something to work with after I find myself not capable of doing what I do now for a daily living.


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## Sam Rivers (May 22, 2011)

> And, yeah, the newest book is too big in my siggy. I've asked for help because I can't EVER get a book up in my sig here correctly.


Caddy, there are two boxes that determine size. One is for small and the other is for large. You probably checked small for your other books and large for you last book.

Just delete the last book and enter it Agna and check small.


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## 13893 (Apr 29, 2010)

wolfrom said:


> I've put Lacuna in the hopper for tomorrow's SF Signal Free Fiction post... not sure if that results in more than a few new readers, though...
> 
> It looks to me like the formatting is fixed now, but let me know if I should push that mention back a day.
> 
> _Assuming you're not already asleep, since it's very late where you are..._


Threadjacking for a minute:

O.M.G. ... _you're_ SF Signal? I want to thank you publicly. I am absolutely miserable at marketing. I sell so few books generally (unless it's a BookBub day) that when i sell any multiple of copies in a day, it's an event.

So I've noticed it when you've listed Give Me or Space Junque on your site. Your readers click links - they download freebies, and they buy the following books in series. I know this from the days when Amazon let us have bit.ly images on our pages.

Thank you, thank you. You've made my day so many times - both in the downloads and in the pleasure of knowing you deemed the books worthy.

And SF Signal is a fabulous site.

::back to our regularly scheduled program::


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## wolfrom (May 26, 2012)

LKRigel said:


> Threadjacking for a minute:


Thanks for letting me know that SF Signal readers are downloading. I never have as much data on that as I'd like.

And I'm just the lowly Free Fiction guy... sometimes they let me sneak onto a panel for something, but quickly regret the decision.


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## nomesque (Apr 12, 2010)

David! Interview, how'd it go, already? (or is it still coming?)


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## David Adams (Jan 2, 2012)

Heya Wolfrom, thanks for that! Really appreciate it! 

Sitting in the lobby now, all dressed up with a tie and all. Here goes nothing!


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## Caddy (Sep 13, 2011)

> Caddy, there are two boxes that determine size. One is for small and the other is for large. You probably checked small for your other books and large for you last book.
> 
> Just delete the last book and enter it Agna and check small.


I don't see those boxes and never have...but I think the size is marked wrong on my photo. I have am email in to the person that did them and I will hopefully get this solved soon.


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## Nathalie Aynie (Nov 24, 2013)

Caddy said:


> I don't see those boxes and never have...but I think the size is marked wrong on my photo. I have am email in to the person that did them and I will hopefully get this solved soon.


PM me the code of your sig Caddy and I'll help you.


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