# K3 delivery date



## blefever (Jul 29, 2010)

Has anybody received a firm delivery date for their K3 from Amazon? All I'm getting is : "Not Yet Shipped:
Delivery estimate: We need a little more time to provide you with a good estimate. We'll notify you via e-mail as soon as we have an estimated delivery date. You can cancel at any time. " Thought I had read somewhere that certain people had received a date, but cannot verify that. I ordered on July 29th with 1-day Prime, so I'm hoping to get mine on the 27th (or sooner)


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

It says the same thing for everyone.

There was a brief kerfluffle where they were, apparently, updating things, and some people saw dates at the end of Sept or in October. . .but that's been resolved.  We probably won't see specific dates, now, until the things are ready to ship.

AND Amazon has said, that you will get your Kindle on the date shown when you ordered it. . . .anyone who ordered before the 1st of August or so, should see it on the 27th or 28th. . . . . .


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## blefever (Jul 29, 2010)

Thank you, Ann. I guess that the kerfluffle caused my confusion, but now I am "deconfused". Thanks again!


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## PraiseGod13 (Oct 27, 2008)

We're all so anxious.... it doesn't take much to get us kerfluffled (love that word!).  Plus, it's always fun to use "K" words in reference to our Kindles.  We'll just have to wait until we get closer to the 27th to start getting our shipping notices, unfortunately.  It's so fun once they ship and you can track them.  I think I checked the tracking site about every 15 minutes for two days just monitoring where my K1 was and I was standing at the bottom of our stairs when the UPS man pulled into our driveway.


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## CaroleC (Apr 19, 2010)

So far I have not had a specific date, either. 

I keep checking this forum every day, hoping that others who ordered early like I did might start receiving their k3's before the 27th. I suppose that is not likely, but still I check each day.

Seventeen days!


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

CaroleC said:


> Seventeen days!


Or is it sixteen days if you ordered one day shipping?!?!


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## Silver (Dec 30, 2008)

Noooo!  It can't still be over two weeks.  I ordered such a long time ago (seems like).


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## CaroleC (Apr 19, 2010)

Shetlander said:


> Or is it sixteen days if you ordered one day shipping?!?!


I was assuming that we would all receive them on the 27th, and today being the 10th, 27-10=17. But then maybe the one day shipping might mean a delivery on the 26th? I'm confused, I admit it. I ordered with two day free shipping so I might not get mine until the 30th. (groan)


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I think the first wave will arrive on the 27th for everyone eligible for that first wave. One day shipping will most likely mean that they ship on the 26th. I did the one day as insurance, because I live in the middle of nowhere, but I think it's not necessary when you talk about a preorder of a Kindle. They want to make a lot of people happy on release date. Delivering it the day before causes more problems than it solves because it leads to people arguing and bickering over who ordered when and feeling ill-used by Amazon.


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## Mandy (Dec 27, 2009)

Well I'm at least enjoying a temporary distraction as I wait for my replacement K2i arrive today, it's currently 'out for delivery!'


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

MichelleR said:


> I think the first wave will arrive on the 27th for everyone eligible for that first wave. One day shipping will most likely mean that they ship on the 26th.


Yeah, that makes sense. Except for Amazon's "order now for release date delivery" statement that was on the product page until they ran out of stock. They didn't say order now with XXX shipping for release date delivery. I wish I could remember how it worked with my K2 which had one day shipping.


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## Neo (Mar 30, 2009)

Shetlander said:


> I wish I could remember how it worked with my K2 which had one day shipping.


I did that too with my K2 US and remember quite specifically that all of us who ordered with one day shipping got them all one day early, i.e. 24 February, whereas they were supposed to get to us on 25. What a day that was, and I fully expect a repeat of that experience at the end of the month 

Although it will be even better this time around with the whole week-end to play with it, last time it was a Tuesday or Wednesday if I remember correctly


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## HappyGuy (Nov 3, 2008)

Maybe they'll ACTUALLY release them on the 25th, so that if you have 1 day shipping they'll arrive on the 26th and if you have 2 day shipping they'll arrive on the 27th?


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

When will these things hit Target? That's when I'll get one.


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

tubemonkey said:


> When will these things hit Target? That's when I'll get one.


Maybe check with Amazon CS if you're curious.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

tubemonkey said:


> When will these things hit Target? That's when I'll get one.


I'm happy to see Kindles in Target. . .'cause it gets 'em in front of eyeballs that might not otherwise see them. . . .but if someone asked, I'd recommend they BUY from Amazon direct. . . .I just trust their customer service better. . . . .


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Shetlander said:


> Maybe check with Amazon CS if you're curious.


I love your answer. Since it applies to most of the questions asked on this board, we could kill most threads with the first reply.


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

tubemonkey said:


> I love your answer. Since it applies to most of the questions asked on this board, we could kill most threads with the first reply.


Most questions on this board can be answered by the members, but there are some questions no-one here can possibly know the answer to, like that one. So it was a very sensible answer!


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Ann in Arlington said:


> I'm happy to see Kindles in Target. . .'cause it gets 'em in front of eyeballs that might not otherwise see them. . . .but if someone asked, I'd recommend they BUY from Amazon direct. . . .I just trust their customer service better. . . . .


I've never dealt with Amazon before and I have dealt with Target. So far, the only high tech gadgets I've purchased online have all been from companies with B&M stores.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Linjeakel said:


> Most questions on this board can be answered by the members, but there are some questions no-one here can possibly know the answer to, like that one. So it was a very sensible answer!


So this topic has never come up before? Someone can know the answer to this and it wouldn't be any more speculative that the numerous "when are they gonna ship" threads.


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

tubemonkey said:


> So this topic has never come up before? Someone can know the answer to this and it wouldn't be any more speculative that the numerous "when are they gonna ship" threads.


When it comes up, we usually tell the person to check with Customer Service or Target themselves. Nobody knows the answer.


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## Seamonkey (Dec 2, 2008)

I would consider buying a case if there was one I liked at Target.


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

tubemonkey said:


> So this topic has never come up before? Someone can know the answer to this and it wouldn't be any more speculative that the numerous "when are they gonna ship" threads.


Yeah, but the difference is we know they're going to start shipping by the 27th to those of us who have ordered. Plus, we _enjoy_ speculating about our Kindles to be.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

luvmy4brats said:


> When it comes up, we usually tell the person to check with Customer Service or Target themselves. Nobody knows the answer.


Thank you. I won't bring the topic up again.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

tubemonkey said:


> I've never dealt with Amazon before and I have dealt with Target. So far, the only high tech gadgets I've purchased online have all been from companies with B&M stores.


Fair enough. Though, I, personally, wouldn't put TARGET in the same category as most stores that sell 'high tech gadgets'.   You're, frankly, not likely to find a sales person who will be able to tell you any more than what's on the display.

As to when they'll be there. . . .only Amazon and Target could say, if they even know. . . and probably wouldn't tell you if you asked -- even if they DID know. . . . .I would be surprised to see them before October, though I would expect to see them before Thanksgiving, _*if*_ Amazon is going to go that route at all with the K3.


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

tubemonkey said:


> I've never dealt with Amazon before and I have dealt with Target. So far, the only high tech gadgets I've purchased online have all been from companies with B&M stores.


I purchased my current 60" Sony HDTV, my Onkyo SRX-707 A/V receiver, my Panasonic DMP-BD35K Blu-ray player, My iPod nano 3g and 5G, my Canon SLR camera and most of my camera equipment from Amazon. And that's only the "high tech gadgets" that I can quickly think of off the top of my head. I've been buying everything that I can from Amazon for years. Lowest cost, 2-day delivery for most items, and no state sales tax, 30 day return policy, can't beat Amazon!


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Fair enough. Though, I, personally, wouldn't put TARGET in the same category as most stores that sell 'high tech gadgets'.   You're, frankly, not likely to find a sales person who will be able to tell you any more than what's on the display.


I don't listen to sales reps in any store; even high tech stores like Best Buy. By the time I walk into a store to see an item first hand, I've already done my research and know far more than the sales rep does about the product in question.

I already know what the major eReaders have in the way of features and what they're capable of doing. I'm planning on getting a Nook for myself and a Kindle 3 for my son. I joined Nookboards in June and this board today for the purpose of getting information on user experiences with these devices. I wanna know what faults these devices have and how the companies react to the problems before I make a purchase.


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## blefever (Jul 29, 2010)

Why buy from Amazon as opposed to Target? 
1st and foremost......customer service
2nd........................customer service
3rd........................Customer service
4th........................free (or very reasonable) shipping cost
5th........................No sales tax!!!!!!
There is no mystery here.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

blefever said:


> Why buy from Amazon as opposed to Target?
> 1st and foremost......customer service
> 2nd........................customer service
> 3rd........................Customer service
> ...


My target has pretty good customer service, but then again I haven't really needed it. One plus target gets over Amazon is return period, Target's is 90 days.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Amazon collects sales taxes in at least 5 states.


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

I'm just in awe of someone who has never bought from Amazon!


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Shetlander said:


> I'm just in awe of someone who has never bought from Amazon!


Then be prepared to be totally enthralled, because I've never purchased from eBay either.


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## Steph H (Oct 28, 2008)

Ann in Arlington said:


> As to when they'll be there. . . .only Amazon and Target could say, if they even know. . . and probably wouldn't tell you if you asked -- even if they DID know. . . . .I would be surprised to see them before October, though I would expect to see them before Thanksgiving, _*if*_ Amazon is going to go that route at all with the K3.


Didn't someone in another thread say their Target store had a sign saying the new K3s would be there in September? doesn't mean it applies to _all_ Target stores, o'course...


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

tubemonkey said:


> Then be prepared to be totally enthralled, because I've never purchased from eBay either.


Nah, I can live without eBay. My 84 year old mom hasn't bought from either company either, though I've ordered a number of times for her. But then, she's living almost off the grid.


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## Kindle-lite (Apr 9, 2009)

My Target store (KS) has a sign up saying "third generation Kindle for sell in early September"......


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## mlewis78 (Apr 19, 2009)

blefever said:


> Why buy from Amazon as opposed to Target?
> 1st and foremost......customer service
> 2nd........................customer service
> 3rd........................Customer service
> ...


I would also recommend buying directly from Amazon, but we do pay sales tax in New York whether we purchase from Target or Amazon.


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

kindle2luvr said:


> My Target store (KS) has a sign up saying "third generation Kindle for sell in early September"......


Ooh! Tubemonkey has his answer!  Are Kindles only in Targets in certain states or in selected Targets in all states? The little Target by me (MI), which I love and shop at a couple times a month, hasn't ever carried them.


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

Shetlander said:


> Ooh! Tubemonkey has his answer!  Are Kindles only in Targets in certain states or in selected Targets in all states? The little Target by me (MI), which I love and shop at a couple times a month, hasn't ever carried them.


My _guess_ is that when K3s show up in Target will vary among stores.

I too am leery of on-line only (no B&Ms) stores. No worries with Amazon though. Long-time customer here.


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## Shetlander (Mar 10, 2009)

Sandpiper said:


> I too am leery of on-line only (no B&Ms) stores. No worries with Amazon though. Long-time customer here.


Overall, I've been very lucky with Internet shopping. Amazon gets the majority of my business, but I also use ebags and onlineshoes a good deal. Plus many smaller businesses. Good thing since I live in the sticks where B&M stores are limited, more so each year.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

blefever said:


> Why buy from Amazon as opposed to Target?
> 1st and foremost......customer service
> 2nd........................customer service
> 3rd........................Customer service
> ...


So if my son decides he doesn't like the Kindle and wants to return it:

1- will Amazon charge a restocking fee?
2- will Amazon pay for return shipping charges?


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

tubemonkey said:


> So if my son decides he doesn't like the Kindle and wants to return it:
> 
> 1- will Amazon charge a restocking fee?
> 2- will Amazon pay for return shipping charges?


They will not charge a restocking fee within 30 days.

Amazon will pay the return shipping charges if the unit is _defective_.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

pidgeon92 said:


> They will not charge a restocking fee within 30 days.
> 
> Amazon will pay the return shipping charges if the unit is _defective_.


1- Good

2- Bad - this is one of the reasons why I don't make online purchases from stores that don't have a B&M presence where I live.

I'll be getting it from Target.


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

The return shipping is like $3 IF they charge it. I returned a perfectly fine Kindle DXG last month and did not pay return shipping AND they reimbursed my original shipping charge. 

And most states don't pay sales tax... That alone is worth it.


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

tubemonkey said:


> I'll be getting it from Target.


I wouldn't count on your local Target allowing an open box return without a restocking fee.


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## mlewis78 (Apr 19, 2009)

I don't think that Target will have the K3 for a while, at least not until Amazon has fulfilled current orders.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

pidgeon92 said:


> I wouldn't count on your local Target allowing an open box return without a restocking fee.


I looked this up earlier and this is the Restocking Fee policy at Target.

*Restocking Fees: Some items are subject to a 15% restocking fee, including camcorders, digital cameras, portable DVD players and portable electronics.*

I guess the Kindle could be under the "portable electronics" category, but its rather vague. I really think it would depend on the person at the counter and from my experiences of returning stuff to Target, I think they would probably let restocking fee slide, or forget about it altogether.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

luvmy4brats said:


> The return shipping is like $3 IF they charge it. I returned a perfectly fine Kindle DXG last month and did not pay return shipping AND they reimbursed my original shipping charge.
> 
> And most states don't pay sales tax... That alone is worth it.


$3 is pretty good; but what about insurance? That's another fee to consider.

If you're lucky enough to live in those states; or maybe you live in a state that charges no sales tax at all.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

mlewis78 said:


> I don't think that Target will have the K3 for a while, at least not until Amazon has fulfilled current orders.


I'm in no hurry.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

jd78 said:


> I looked this up earlier and this is the Restocking Fee policy at Target.
> 
> *Restocking Fees: Some items are subject to a 15% restocking fee, including camcorders, digital cameras, portable DVD players and portable electronics.*
> 
> I guess the Kindle could be under the "portable electronics" category, but its rather vague. I really think it would depend on the person at the counter and from my experiences of returning stuff to Target, I think they would probably let restocking fee slide, or forget about it altogether.


Thanks for the info.

Well, that changes things. I figured Target would be like the others. Neither B&N or Best Buy charge a restocking fee for Nook returns, nor does Amazon for Kindle returns.

This adds another factor to consider.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

I love shopping at Target. It's one of my favorite places to go -- yes, I'm pathetic like that.  However, there's no way I'd buy a Kindle there when I can eliminate the middle man with one click.  Am Amazon product purchased directly from Amazon makes it clear who I'll deal with if there's an issue. It's 100% Amazon's rear on the line and that's the way (uh huh, uh huh) I like it.  

Target might sell it, but it's not their product, and therefore I have less room to demand they stand behind it.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

MichelleR said:


> Target might sell it, but it's not their product, and therefore I have less room to demand they stand behind it.


Does Target no longer exchange defective items within the return window?


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## 911jason (Aug 17, 2009)

Yes, they do... However, there have been several instances posted here on KB where Amazon has replaced customer-damaged Kindles free of charge. In the most recent case, the person left their Kindle on the roof of their car and forgot about it. When they realized their mistake, they went back and found the Kindle on the road, completely destroyed because it had been runover. Amazon is replacing it for free. I'm not saying they will do this in every case, but there have been enough similar stories to make me choose Amazon for my Kindle purchase. 

Try returning a runover Kindle at Target, and see what happens... (actually if you do this, please video it and post on Youtube, so I can see what happens too!


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

Cool. That's a big plus for Amazon. That now adds another factor in my decision as to where to buy it.


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

tubemonkey said:


> $3 is pretty good; but what about insurance? That's another fee to consider.
> 
> If you're lucky enough to live in those states; or maybe you live in a state that charges no sales tax at all.


It's a pre-printed shipping label that you'd get from Amazon. You don't need to worry about insurance. Just slap it on the box and drop it off at UPS.

I live in MD, there's no sales tax with Amazon. If I remember correctly, there are only a very few that need to pay tax on items from amazon, Washington and New York being the ones I can think of.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

luvmy4brats said:


> It's a pre-printed shipping label that you'd get from Amazon. You don't need to worry about insurance. Just slap it on the box and drop it off at UPS.
> 
> I live in MD, there's no sales tax with Amazon. If I remember correctly, there are only a very few that need to pay tax on items from amazon, Washington and New York being the ones I can think of.


Cool. You guys have me almost convinced to go the Amazon route.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

tubemonkey said:


> Does Target no longer exchange defective items within the return window?


Sure. However, I consider buying it from Amazon to be extra insurance and simpler. No Target employee telling me it's Amazon's problem, no Amazon employee telling me I have to deal with Target. More leeway when the situation might be in a gray area. I know that Amazon has always been good about returns, like when my Angel box set had duplicate discs, and for every story I've heard of Amazon blowing it customer service wise, I've heard 5 of them being extraordinarily helpful. When you consider people are more likely to complain when something goes wrong than they are to mention it going right, I think that ratio is telling.

I think any of the Kindle owners who pay attention to these stories know of one or two instances where Amazon would have been well in their rights to tell the purchaser they were irresponsible and to have a nice day, but instead replaced the thing. I don't think I'd be the type to try to take advantage of that lenience, but it does make me feel comfortable knowing it's the case.

Target gives me a hard time and I can complain publicly and loudly about it, but they didn't make the thing. They know that my rant is probably not going to amount to a hill of beans. Amazon is invested in making the Kindle successful, in going above and beyond to smooth out problems so that there is no reason for me to complain loudly and publicly -- because a rant reflects on them not just as the vendor but on their product.

Mostly it's just that the company has legitimately earned my trust and given me a warm fuzzy feeling. Not that a shopping spree at Target doesn't.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

MichelleR said:


> I love shopping at Target. It's one of my favorite places to go -- yes, I'm pathetic like that.  However, there's no way I'd buy a Kindle there when I can eliminate the middle man with one click. Am Amazon product purchased directly from Amazon makes it clear who I'll deal with if there's an issue. It's 100% Amazon's rear on the line and that's the way (uh huh, uh huh) I like it.
> 
> Target might sell it, but it's not their product, and therefore I have less room to demand they stand behind it.


I agree with this 100%. . . well except about the pathetic part.  What's pathetic about getting a good deal?


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> I agree with this 100%. . . well except about the pathetic part.  What's pathetic about getting a good deal?


They used to have the Isaac Mizrahi dog biscuits that my dogs loved so much. Well, my dogs like most biscuits, but I liked the ingredients and they were so cute. The cookies in this case, not my dogs. Anyhow, thanks for your defense of me from that meanie, also me.


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## JSRinUK (Aug 3, 2010)

I don't know anything about this "Target" place, but it strikes me that the product is different things to different sellers.

A third-party retailer (which I presume "Target" is), is trying to sell you a product - the Kindle.  That's all the interest they have in it.  If it goes wrong or gets broken, they couldn't care less if it takes six months to fix or if they don't fix it at all.  They want you to buy another one, because that's where their profit it.  It's not in their interest to ensure you get a quick (and free) replacement because they won't get any extra profit from a replacement.

Amazon, however, are selling a service - a means to read the books they sell.  They know that if you don't have a Kindle (whether it's been run over by a car, eaten by the dog, or left behind on a day trip to the moon) then you won't buy any more books.  They want you to buy books, because that's where their greatest profit is in the long-term.  If they don't replace your Kindle, they hurt their profits, so they'll undoubtedly do everything in their power to ensure you have a working Kindle as soon as possible - so you can buy more books.  If they don't replace your Kindle, you might buy a Nook and switch your loyalty to B&N instead.

In short, Amazon have a vested interest in making sure you have a Kindle at all times.  A third-party retailer does not.  I don't think it gets more simple than that.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

MichelleR said:


> I love shopping at Target. It's one of my favorite places to go -- yes, I'm pathetic like that.  However, there's no way I'd buy a Kindle there when I can eliminate the middle man with one click. Am Amazon product purchased directly from Amazon makes it clear who I'll deal with if there's an issue. It's 100% Amazon's rear on the line and that's the way (uh huh, uh huh) I like it.
> 
> Target might sell it, but it's not their product, and therefore I have less room to demand they stand behind it.


I also love Target. Target is just a more comfortable shopping experience to that of Walmart. Also, sometimes they clearance items really heavily. Obviously this won't apply to the Kindle, but I have grabbed some really nice deals at Target (Britax Marathon Convertible Car Seat - $35 regularly $280, HP Photosmart portable printer - $36 regularly $150). Of all the B&M stores Amazon could have partnered with, Target was a good choice. I am getting my K3 straight from Amazon, and am only pointing out the PROs of Target because it's not a bad option. Some people will only shop in B&M stores. My brother-in-law is this type of person, He goes to Best Buy a couple times a week and has bought his last two big screen TVs from them. Me on the other hand, my TVs have come from online stores that offered lower prices, free shipping, and no tax. When I am shopping for something specific, I usually check the internet for the best price. I usually only buy from B&M if it's something I need that day.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

JSRinUK said:


> A third-party retailer (which I presume "Target" is), is trying to sell you a product - the Kindle. That's all the interest they have in it. If it goes wrong or gets broken, they couldn't care less if it takes six months to fix or if they don't fix it at all. They want you to buy another one, because that's where their profit it. It's not in their interest to ensure you get a quick (and free) replacement because they won't get any extra profit from a replacement.


I see what you are saying, but I don't think that applies here. Target sells the Kindle, but they wouldn't support it and I don't think anyone should expect them to. If you have a broken, malfunctioning, or any problem with your Kindle you would contact Amazon, or at least you should. The only reason you would contact Target about your Kindle is if you want to return/exchange it.

Now if you drop it, run over it, or whatever... Then it's not unreasonable for Target to refuse it. I understand that "some" have had a positive experience with Amazon taking the broken Kindle back, but nowhere have I read that this is their policy and in this case YMMV. Pretty much every store is this way, especially with electronics.


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## tubemonkey (Aug 10, 2010)

It's actually in the interests of both companies to manage in-store Kindle sales properly. Poor service will reflect badly on both of them, since they have a special partnership with each other. That partnership is expected to end next year when Target will build and manage its own ecommerce platform.


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## JSRinUK (Aug 3, 2010)

jd78 said:


> If you have a broken, malfunctioning, or any problem with your Kindle you would contact Amazon, or at least you should. The only reason you would contact Target about your Kindle is if you want to return/exchange it.


That's a little different to how it works here in the UK. Here we're constantly being told that our contract is with the retailer, not the manufacturer. If you buy direct from the manufacturer, then they are the retailer.

The manufacturer has no obligation to help you if the item you buy goes wrong (unless they are the retailer in this instance). The retailer, however, has to abide by their obligations under the SoGA (Sale of Goods Act) and, if bought online, the DSRs (Distance Selling Regulations).

Normally, that gives us peace of mind when buying from a retailer. However, given that a broken Kindle affects Amazon's book sales and has no impact on the retailer, I would expect a more efficient response from Amazon than from anyone else. Buying direct from Amazon would, at least here in the UK, be the most sensible option because Amazon themselves would have to abide by the SoGA and DSRs.

Does anyone know if any retailer besides Amazon sells the Kindle in the UK? If not, then it's a moot point and I apologise for interrupting the discussion.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

jd78 said:


> I see what you are saying, but I don't think that applies here. Target sells the Kindle, but they wouldn't support it and I don't think anyone should expect them to. If you have a broken, malfunctioning, or any problem with your Kindle you would contact Amazon, or at least you should. The only reason you would contact Target about your Kindle is if you want to return/exchange it.
> 
> Now if you drop it, run over it, or whatever... Then it's not unreasonable for Target to refuse it. I understand that "some" have had a positive experience with Amazon taking the broken Kindle back, but nowhere have I read that this is their policy and in this case YMMV. Pretty much every store is this way, especially with electronics.


I think it does apply in you're actually making the point that I'm making and that JSRinUK is making. Target has less of an investment, less of an interest in the product. The point isn't that they're wrong in this, but that buying from Amazon might yield a better result should there be issues, because they're heavily invested in keeping a working Kindle in your hands. No one is saying that Target would be wrong in not going beyond the letter of their return policy, not at all, but that Amazon has more leeway.

JSRinUK, Target is a store that sells a wide variety of items, including a grocery section, but mostly clothes, appliances, electronics, movies and music, and household wares. They're akin to Walmart or KMart, not that you're expected to know those either, but I think they're a step up. They're often called Tar-zhay to jokingly imply they're more upscale than they are, but it's all too easy to fill up a shopping cart there.


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

MichelleR said:


> However, there's no way I'd buy a Kindle there when I can eliminate the middle man with one click. An Amazon product purchased directly from Amazon makes it clear who I'll deal with if there's an issue. It's 100% Amazon's rear on the line and that's the way (uh huh, uh huh) I like it.


Well, one small middleman, buy through the KB affiliate link so Harvey and KB get a small amount to help keep these wonderful boards going.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

BTackitt said:


> Well, one small middleman, buy through the KB affiliate link so Harvey and KB get a small amount to help keep these wonderful boards going.


Ha, excellent point, but I forgot to do that. I do chip in a few dollars here and there to do my part to keep the board going though. But, I agree, click that link!!


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## Gerund (Aug 8, 2010)

One thing I would like to add is that Amazon has a great history of doing good things for customers.

"Good things" has historically included everything from coupons to free books to early access to merchandise to free Kindles. Once you establish a relationship with them, there's a decent chance that they'll scratch your back eventually, too. You don't get that when you deal with a third party like Target.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

MichelleR said:


> I think it does apply in you're actually making the point that I'm making and that JSRinUK is making. Target has less of an investment, less of an interest in the product. The point isn't that they're wrong in this, but that buying from Amazon might yield a better result should there be issues, because they're heavily invested in keeping a working Kindle in your hands. No one is saying that Target would be wrong in not going beyond the letter of their return policy, not at all, but that Amazon has more leeway.


I still disagree. Amazon has a vested interest no matter where you buy it. You can buy one from e-bay and Amazon will support it, and if it's still under warranty they will treat as if you bought it from them. The only thing that changes when you by from a third party is the return/exchange policy. I am not saying it isn't better to buy it from Amazon, but they definitely won't support it any different if you get it from Target.


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## blefever (Jul 29, 2010)

Given all the time and effort spent by tubemonkey in deciding not what to buy, but where to buy it, I can only say that I am glad I have never been and never will be his/her Realtor. Phew!!!!!


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

JSRinUK said:


> I don't know anything about this "Target" place, but it strikes me that the product is different things to different sellers


Kinda like the US version of Marks and Spencer. . . .sell a little bit of everything. . .


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

jd78 said:


> I still disagree. Amazon has a vested interest no matter where you buy it. You can buy one from e-bay and Amazon will support it, and if it's still under warranty they will treat as if you bought it from them. The only thing that changes when you by from a third party is the return/exchange policy. I am not saying it isn't better to buy it from Amazon, but they definitely won't support it any different if you get it from Target.


I agree that Amazon will provide the same level of support. . .but it might be somewhat complicated in that you didn't purchase directly. For example, they'd surely replace a damaged unit under warranty. . .and if you asked for warranty coverage from Target, I'm sure they'd point you to Amazon.

I don't think Amazon would accept one for return within the first 30 days, as they do if you buy from them directly . . .they'd have no purchase info so you'd have to take it back to Target. This may be more or less trouble for you depending on, well, you.


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## mom133d (aka Liz) (Nov 25, 2008)

I can understand being wary of shopping online from a place w/o a B&M store. I still do it myself. But I have been a happy Amazon customer since its beginnings, back when all they sold were books. There are few online only merchants I will shop from.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> I agree that Amazon will provide the same level of support. . .but it might be somewhat complicated in that you didn't purchase directly. For example, they'd surely replace a damaged unit under warranty. . .and if you asked for warranty coverage from Target, I'm sure they'd point you to Amazon.
> 
> I don't think Amazon would accept one for return within the first 30 days, as they do if you buy from them directly . . .they'd have no purchase info so you'd have to take it back to Target. This may be more or less trouble for you depending on, well, you.


I think we are not on the same page. Just about every product you buy from Target, Walmart, Best Buy, etc would not be supported by the store. Most products offer manufacturer warranties and you would contact the manufacturer for support (i.e. Amazon). If you wanted to return the product, you would return it to the point of sale (i.e. Target). If we use another product as an example, a Samsung TV purchased at Walmart... You can return the TV to Walmart as long as you are within their return period (whatever that is), but if you wanted support for it you would not contact Walmart, you would contact Samsung, right?

Best Buy would be an exception here if you buy their extended warranty. This is pretty much how every electronic item is handled when purchased in a B&M with the exception of B&M branded items (i.e. Rocket Fish and Dynex = Best Buy, Nook = B&N).


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## Kathy (Nov 5, 2008)

MichelleR said:


> I love shopping at Target. It's one of my favorite places to go -- yes, I'm pathetic like that.  However, there's no way I'd buy a Kindle there when I can eliminate the middle man with one click. Am Amazon product purchased directly from Amazon makes it clear who I'll deal with if there's an issue. It's 100% Amazon's rear on the line and that's the way (uh huh, uh huh) I like it.
> 
> Target might sell it, but it's not their product, and therefore I have less room to demand they stand behind it.


Not pathetic. I love my Target store. I don't think I'd buy my Kindle there, but that is because I have had such wonderful customer service from Amazon. I was one of those that had 3 sun fade K2s, but they kept sending me new ones until they got it right.


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## JSRinUK (Aug 3, 2010)

MichelleR said:


> JSRinUK, Target is a store that sells a wide variety of items, including a grocery section, but mostly clothes, appliances, electronics, movies and music, and household wares. They're akin to Walmart or KMart, not that you're expected to know those either, but I think they're a step up. They're often called Tar-zhay to jokingly imply they're more upscale than they are, but it's all too easy to fill up a shopping cart there.


Thanks for the description, I know the type of shop you mean. I think I'd feel more confident buying from a dedicated electronics store, rather than a jack of all trades that tries to sell everything. 



jd78 said:


> Just about every product you buy from Target, Walmart, Best Buy, etc would not be supported by the store. Most products offer manufacturer warranties and you would contact the manufacturer for support (i.e. Amazon).


That's not how it works in the UK.


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## jd78 (Dec 8, 2009)

JSRinUK said:


> That's not how it works in the UK.


I understand that. Since we were referring to Target, I thought we had already clarified that we were discussing how it works in the U.S.


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## JSRinUK (Aug 3, 2010)

jd78 said:


> I understand that. Since we were referring to Target, I thought we had already clarified that we were discussing how it works in the U.S.


I just wanted to clarify the point because there may be people who skip into this thread part way through. I often read about people who automatically go direct to manufacturers - either because they believe they have to, or they misunderstand the purpose of the warranty, or the retailer tries to fob them off. After going to the manufacturer, they then find that their rights under the SoGA no longer apply because they didn't go to the retailer first.

Sorry for confusing the discussion.


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## Trophywife007 (Aug 31, 2009)

Ann in Arlington said:


> Kinda like the US version of Marks and Spencer. . . .sell a little bit of everything. . .


Lol! M&S seems just a bit classier... as many British things do.


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## Dan (Jul 30, 2010)

This is the latest info I received early this A.M. from Kindle CS regarding release dates for the K3:



> Hello Dan,
> 
> Due to strong customer demand, Kindle (Latest Generation) is temporarily sold out.
> 
> ...


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## Sandpiper (Oct 28, 2008)

Yay! Mine will ship on _or before_ September 4.


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

See, its that "will still _ship_ by the August 27th release date" that bothers me. When we ordered, it said on the product page "order now for _delivery_ on the release date".


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## Dan (Jul 30, 2010)

Sandpiper said:


> Yay! Mine will ship on _or before_ September 4.


It's the final countdown now. Won't be long.


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## Kathy (Nov 5, 2008)

Yeah, I'm on the first delivery date. I didn't do the one day shipping, so hopefully by Aug 30 or 31 I'll have it.


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## LauraB (Nov 23, 2008)

Linjeakel said:


> See, its that "will still _ship_ by the August 27th release date" that bothers me. When we ordered, it said on the product page "order now for _delivery_ on the release date".


I ordered on the 1st night, about 9 pm central time, and on one part of the page it said "order now for release date delivery" in orange right below the color choice but it also said "will ship on or before August 27th" in the fine black type under that. That is why I used Prime one day shipping, because of the discrepancy. I figured if the deliver by the 27th happens great. But if not I'll get it Saturday, because one of the benefits of One day Prime is Saturday deliveries! I decided it is worth the $3.99 to not have to fret over if I will have to wait until the 30th or 31st.


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

LauraB said:


> I ordered on the 1st night, about 9 pm central time, and on one part of the page it said "order now for release date delivery" in orange right below the color choice but it also said "will ship on or before August 27th" in the fine black type under that. That is why I used Prime one day shipping, because of the discrepancy. I figured if the deliver by the 27th happens great. But if not I'll get it Saturday, because one of the benefits of One day Prime is Saturday deliveries! I decided it is worth the $3.99 to not have to fret over if I will have to wait until the 30th or 31st.


Yes I also ordered with Prime - and in the UK that automatically means next day delivery, no extra charge and Saturdays are included. But I want it on the 27th d*mn it!  *whines like a baby*


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## 911jason (Aug 17, 2009)

Someone here suggested Prime for me as well, as I had posted that I upgraded to 1-day shipping for $18.98... I was able to go for the 30-Day Free Trial of Prime and get the shipping cost lowered by $15. Thanks to whomever suggested that! =)


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## Whidbeyislandgirl (Apr 19, 2009)

Does Amazon usually use UPS to ship overnight? I emailed to ask them and was told maybe yes, maybe no..... could be USPS, UPS, FEDEX or some other carries I didn't recognize. I order periodically from them and it comes USPS or UPS when it was shipping regular delivery, I don't know that I have ordered much with overnight shipping. 

The shipping method will affect where I have it delivered, I can't get USPS deliveries at work, but my local itty bitty post office is not consistant in delivering things with my work address to my home or PO box. About the point I think they have figured out that it's still me, and they are putting mail with my shop address in to my PO box, then they decide to not do it anymore and return it. If I have it sent to my house it will sit on my front porch all day and not be in my anxious hands! 

I can't say with my K2, my husband ordered it to be delivered at his work address with no expidited shipping and isn't sure how it came. 

I can't decide.... home means I have to wait all day until I get there, but work address is risky if it isn't coming UPS or FEDEX. 

Any experience with past Kindle releases? With overnight shipping specifically.....


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

My Prime 2-day shipments have been delivered by a carrier other than UPS or FedEx but not always.  I can't recall the carrier's name.  These shipments usually arrive in the morning and the vehicle is a van.  UPS usually arrives in the late afternoon in a big brown truck and FedEx could show up at any time, either on a regular FedEx truck or a FedEx van.  I've never received a 2-day Prime shipment from USPS.

Send it to a neighbor that you know will be home or a nearby relative?


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

Just thought you'd want to know....

*Orders placed today are expected to ship on or before September 10th.*


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## Pushka (Oct 30, 2009)

Amazon uses DHL couriers to get to Australia.  They are very efficient and their tracking is spot on.  Which is great when you get that email from Amazon.  Every little movement is documented.
I dont understand what the difference is between UPS and USPS though?


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## mlewis78 (Apr 19, 2009)

Pushka said:


> Amazon uses DHL couriers to get to Australia. They are very efficient and their tracking is spot on. Which is great when you get that email from Amazon. Every little movement is documented.
> I dont understand what the difference is between UPS and USPS though?


USPS is regular US Mail. They also have USPS Priority, which is great for points within the US. USPS and Priority are much faster than UPS Ground for California to NY (west coast to east coast) shipping. UPS Ground is a plod, unless it's between close points.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Pushka said:


> I dont understand what the difference is between UPS and USPS though?


USPS is the United States Postal Service. . . .quasi-governmental.

UPS is United Parcel Service. . .completely private. . . a competitor of DHL and Federal Express (FedEx).

USPS will deliver letters for the price of a stamp. . .like the Royal Mail. . . .and they have parcel delivery as well.

The private shippers only do 'large' letters or packages. I suppose you could send a letter. . .but they'd make you put it into one of their big flat cardboard envelopes and pay several dollars to do so.


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## Pushka (Oct 30, 2009)

Thanks for all the info about UPS and USPS.  Just wondering how the business registration people allowed UPS to call themselves that, as it does create confusion with USPS - deceptively similar and all that jazz.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Whidbeyislandgirl said:


> Does Amazon usually use UPS to ship overnight? I emailed to ask them and was told maybe yes, maybe no..... could be USPS, UPS, FEDEX or some other carries I didn't recognize. I order periodically from them and it comes USPS or UPS when it was shipping regular delivery, I don't know that I have ordered much with overnight shipping.
> 
> The shipping method will affect where I have it delivered, I can't get USPS deliveries at work, but my local itty bitty post office is not consistant in delivering things with my work address to my home or PO box. About the point I think they have figured out that it's still me, and they are putting mail with my shop address in to my PO box, then they decide to not do it anymore and return it. If I have it sent to my house it will sit on my front porch all day and not be in my anxious hands!
> 
> ...


I'm probably of limited help. I live in a remote place but for the K2 I happened to be, well, away from home and so it was sent to where I was -- a much bigger city. Then it arrived right on time even though according to tracking it was in the wrong state. I think maybe once in several years has the delivery been other than UPS or FedEx -- with it being UPS about 75/80% of the time.


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## MAGreen (Jan 5, 2009)

It's really frustrating being over seas with an FPO address. Everything gets sent by USPS Priority, but it always take a couple extra days to get to us, since it has to go through customs, and then make it's way through the military delivery system. I am not expecting to get mine until the Tuesday after release. Most of the time, it's pretty quick and it doesn't matter too much anyway if it takes an extra day or two, but I am already waiting for my Keurig to get here and I know I am going to be chomping at the bit when others start getting their K3's!


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Pushka said:


> Thanks for all the info about UPS and USPS. Just wondering how the business registration people allowed UPS to call themselves that, as it does create confusion with USPS - deceptively similar and all that jazz.


Not so much, really, 'cause people mostly call USPS "The Post Office" . . . . .and a lot of people 'pronounce' UPS. . .as in "upps". . . .they're latest ad campaign focuses on their logo color which is brown: "What can brown do for you?" It's only when looking at it written that you have to look carefully.


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## Steph H (Oct 28, 2008)

Whidbeyislandgirl said:


> Does Amazon usually use UPS to ship overnight? I emailed to ask them and was told maybe yes, maybe no..... could be USPS, UPS, FEDEX or some other carries I didn't recognize. I order periodically from them and it comes USPS or UPS when it was shipping regular delivery, I don't know that I have ordered much with overnight shipping.


All of my 2-day and 1-day Prime deliveries come either UPS or FedEx. UPS most of the time, but I think it sometimes depends on what service center it's coming from. My DXG last month was 2-day, not 1-day, but was sent FedEx.


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## CoolMom1960 (Mar 16, 2009)

Sometimes my next day stuff arrives via DHL.  I just upgraded to prime but it didn't change my order date.  The next two weeks are going to be a killer.  My son's counselor had a moment for me yesterday when I told him my Kindle died.  He then wanted to know why I didn't get a nook to replace it and I said I had too many books from Amazon that I haven't read yet for Kindle.


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## geko29 (Dec 23, 2008)

luvmy4brats said:


> Just thought you'd want to know....
> 
> *Orders placed today are expected to ship on or before September 10th.*


I just noticed that. Looks like the 3rd batch (August 27th, September 4th, September 8th) has sold out.


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## lindnet (Jan 25, 2009)

geko29 said:


> I just noticed that. Looks like the 3rd batch (August 27th, September 4th, September 8th) has sold out.


Do you think they might not actually be running out of K3's, but running out of shipping capacity for them? That would explain the 4 day difference.


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## Gerund (Aug 8, 2010)

Yes and no: at a certain point, you'd just start shipping directly from the factory rather than through Amazon. Air freight from Hong Kong to North America can be delivered within 48 hours, so a gap of 4 or 6 or 10 days suggests the problem is supply rather than capacity.


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## geko29 (Dec 23, 2008)

lindnet said:


> Do you think they might not actually be running out of K3's, but running out of shipping capacity for them? That would explain the 4 day difference.


No way. Apple/AT&T managed to deliver about 3 million iPhone 4s in a roughly 24 hour period. If you have the stock prestaged, even ten million extra packages is no sweat for a major carrier like UPS or FedEx. Amazon uses both, and nowhere near a million K3s will be sold before release. We're definitely seeing production constraints here.


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

geko29 said:


> No way. Apple/AT&T managed to deliver about 3 million iPhone 4s in a roughly 24 hour period. If you have the stock prestaged, even ten million extra packages is no sweat for a major carrier like UPS or FedEx. Amazon uses both, and nowhere near a million K3s will be sold before release. We're definitely seeing production constraints here.


Let's hope putting the manufacturers under pressure doesn't affect the quality of the product.


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

Linjeakel said:


> Let's hope putting the manufacturers under pressure doesn't affect the quality of the product.


There was a news article I saw that reported on an unusually high number of suicides at the Chinese Foxconn factory because of the pressure of meeting manufacturing demands. They are the main supplier of Apple iPhones.

Here it is: http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE64O2CK20100525

But I don't mean to be a buzz kill on this thread.


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## Pushka (Oct 30, 2009)

I agree that it is a logistic problem of shipping and not a supply problem of manufacturing. I reckon the first batch of kindles have been shipped by container well before the announcement and the second and third batch are on their way. People will need to check for quality when they get them, but because they are assembly items and not stitched or sewn, then if there are problems they will become apparent pretty quickly. 

Are we there yet?


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## akpak (Mar 5, 2009)

Tom Diego said:


> There was a news article I saw that reported on an unusually high number of suicides at the Chinese Foxconn factory because of the pressure of meeting manufacturing demands. They are the main supplier of Apple iPhones.


That "news" was pretty much all just posturing and angling to get a headline with "Apple iPhone" in it. Foxconn is a HUGE company. They had something like 10 suicides this year. Now, given the number of employees, that suicide "rate" is actually far below the average for a "population" of that size.

In fact, the suicide rate at Foxconn is *less* than the average suicide rate in Anchorage, Alaska (where I live), and I don't see huge media frenzies about how "stressful" it is to live here.

Context, people, context.

Here's an article for rebuttal: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/foremski/media-gets-its-facts-wrong-working-at-foxconn-significantly-cuts-suicide-risk/1356


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

Thanks, hadn't seen that.  It certainly gives a different perspective.  Now I feel much better about the mental health of the Chinese workers who will be manufacturing my Kindle!


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

Off-topic:  I noticed that you're going to Kauai in a couple of weeks.  We leave on 9/4 and will be there for a week then on to Waikiki Beach for 2 nights before heading home.  We're looking forward to taking our new K3s!


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## Pushka (Oct 30, 2009)

Gerund said:


> Yes and no: at a certain point, you'd just start shipping directly from the factory rather than through Amazon. Air freight from Hong Kong to North America can be delivered within 48 hours, so a gap of 4 or 6 or 10 days suggests the problem is supply rather than capacity.


No, surprisingly Amazon dont adopt the direct to customer logistics, as kindles sent to Australia always come from USA and not direct from the factory.


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## mattbiernat (Aug 5, 2010)

akpak said:


> In fact, the suicide rate at Foxconn is *less* than the average suicide rate in Anchorage, Alaska (where I live), and I don't see huge media frenzies about how "stressful" it is to live here.
> Context, people, context.
> Here's an article for rebuttal: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/foremski/media-gets-its-facts-wrong-working-at-foxconn-significantly-cuts-suicide-risk/1356


i agree that context is important.... where i live there is no suicides per year.... having said that to determine whether a suicide rate was within normal levels you would have to compare it to the area where each factory is located at. 
the best way to actually determine whether the suicide rate was abnormal for that factory would be to compare it to other factories at similar locations and compare it for the current year and previous years. you would also have to set a P-value to find out whether the change in suicides was due to random events or actual cause and effect. 
the article that you suggested compares the rate of suicides of an entire nation to the rate of suicides of few specific locations which as i point out above is incorrect.


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## Pushka (Oct 30, 2009)

Honestly, I dont think you will get completely factual information out of China anyway.  For many reasons.  Especially about suicides, illness, death, and industrial matters.


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## mattbiernat (Aug 5, 2010)

true on that...


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## Linjeakel (Mar 17, 2010)

My K3 is on order from the UK site and it says on there that it's dispatched directly from amazon.co.uk - not from the US. So presumably the UK site has it's own, separate, supply of Kindles. However, the UK site has matched the US exactly every time it has changed it's delivery date - to Sept 4th then 8th and now 10th at exactly the same time. Are we supposed to assume that sales in the UK, in terms of percentage of stock sold, have exactly matched the US on a daily basis? I don't think so. I can't fathom how either a logistical or supply problem would fit into that scenario. Could it be that Amazon, who are always coy about the number of Kindles sold, want to give the rest of the world, both competitors and customers, the impression it's selling a lot more than it actually is...... ?


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## JSRinUK (Aug 3, 2010)

Linjeakel said:


> So presumably the UK site has it's own, separate, supply of Kindles. However, the UK site has matched the US exactly every time it has changed it's delivery date - to Sept 4th then 8th and now 10th at exactly the same time. Are we supposed to assume that sales in the UK, in terms of percentage of stock sold, have exactly matched the US on a daily basis? I don't think so. I can't fathom how either a logistical or supply problem would fit into that scenario.


I suspect that Amazon know that they can build and ship a certain number of K3s before each of these dates. They're not bothered whether they go to the UK or the US, just that there is a finite number of Kindles available. Whether that means 1% are ordered in the UK and 99% in the US (counting that non-UK customers will be buying from the US site), or even if it's 50%/50%, it just doesn't matter to them.

This is different to the iPad scenario in which Apple effectively sacrificed international customers solely to give priority to US customers. I think Amazon have a handle on exactly how many Kindles are available, and when. Diverting a certain number to the UK, or getting them all to the US before shipping some to the UK, is something they will have factored into their calculations. That's why the date only shifts by a couple of days and not by a whole month.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

I agree . . . .and it's in their interest to be timely in the UK as it's, essentially, a new product launch there. . . . .


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