# Kindles on airplanes



## travelbug (Aug 9, 2010)

Does anyone know if you take your Kindle on a plane, can you just have it in your purse when you go through the x-rays or do you need to take it out and put it in one of those baskets like you do laptops?  I'm going on a cruise in three weeks and am so excited to take my new kindle!


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

Your Kindle can stay in your purse/backpack/briefcase/computer bag.

I did have my Kindle pulled out this last trip but that was because I had a K1 on top of a DXG in my bag and I confused the screener. What? I used the K1 in a waterproof bag when on the beach and boat and my DXG every where else.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

It can stay in.  Only laptops have to be removed.


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## thetonyclifton (Aug 26, 2010)

I assume they cant be used during takeoff or landing tho?


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

You can take it on planes.  However, most airlines now request that kindles be turned off for take-off/landing, so bring a magazine or something.

As to the x-rays, it depends on the airport and on the TSA employees working that day.  I'd leave it in the backpack, but be prepared to take it out if asked.


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## calypso (Aug 21, 2010)

yup. i read somewhere that kindle and ipad users were asked to turn their reading devices off as the plane was about to land


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## BTackitt (Dec 15, 2008)

If you are flying American Airlines, it is in print in the back of the magazine that e-readers, and iPads must be off during take-offs and landings.  I flew alot of AA this summer, and had plenty of time to look.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

thetonyclifton said:


> I assume they cant be used during takeoff or landing tho?


Yep. Anything with a power switch must be turned off during take off and landing. I've been asked to turn off my Kindle by flight attendants doing the landing check etc. Last flight I took they even mentioned Kindles specifically in the announcement.


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## Tam (Jan 7, 2010)

I have taken it out and put it in the bin with my cell phone every time, just because its easier than worrying that they will want to stop me and have me open up my purse. I did ask a security official the first time I flew after getting it and was told at that time that they prefer anything like that be out.

I just go ahead and turn it off for takeoff and landing - I can look at a magazine or something else for that short amount of time...


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

I turn mine off when asked but admit to turning it back on when the flight attendants are buckled in. 

(prepares for the lecture)


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

ProfCrash said:


> I turn mine off when asked but admit to turning it back on when the flight attendants are buckled in.
> 
> (prepares for the lecture)


Yup, if Wireless is off it's not like it's transmitting anything.


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

Tom Diego said:


> Yup, if Wireless is off it's not like it's transmitting anything.


and then there are the airlines that offer wifi on their plane flights.


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## The Hooded Claw (Oct 12, 2009)

Is that why you have the name of Professor Crash?


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## Thalia the Muse (Jan 20, 2010)

I'm a bad person -- I have the Moleskine Kindle cover and I just flip it closed when the flight attendant comes by, then open it again and keep reading -- if I don't have the 3G on, I can't imagine how it could affect the aircraft.


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

Nope. Car Crash when I was 16 lead to the Crash, teaching at University got me the Prof.

I have never been in an airplane crash and I am reasonably certain that on most of the flights in the last 15 years some type of electronic device has been left on, wheter it be a CD player, MP3 player, Noise Cancelling headsets, Kindles, or a cell phone. I don't buy for a second that electronic devices are dangerous for the airplane, I think they are about being able to pay attention to the flight attendants in case of an emergency.


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## jaylynn (Feb 2, 2009)

I also close the cover or put it away while the attendants are walking through but read once they're seated.  Wireless always off.  I put mine to sleep for security but it's not usually all the off even then.


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## MoyJoy (Aug 24, 2010)

I travelled throughout China for three weeks this summer and on all my flights it was totally dependent on the TSA workers.  Actually in China a few times they just wanted to look at it and my ipad for their own personal pleasure.  They held them up to the others and showed them off like show and tell.  That was awkward.  

Some people just don't know what to do with them so they just check them out just in case.  When I had jury duty the security guys kept saying "What is the device in your bag?!  What is the device in your bag?!"  I was so nervous I just started blabbering like a fool.  They thought that was really funny.  I did not.

As far as takeoff an landing it goes like this for me:

stewardess: please turn off all your devices
me in my head: keep reading, it's just a book.  it's a book!
stewardess: ma'am
me in my head: she's not talking to me.  this is a book, it's just a book.
stewardess: ma'am
me in my head: if I just keep reading... keep my eyes on the page....
stewardess: if you could please turn that off.
>i sadly turn it off<

I HATE flying.  I NEED my books. sigh.  One day... I pray they will allow them.


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## MoyJoy (Aug 24, 2010)

ProfCrash said:


> I have never been in an airplane crash and I am reasonably certain that on most of the flights in the last 15 years some type of electronic device has been left on, wheter it be a CD player, MP3 player, Noise Cancelling headsets, Kindles, or a cell phone. I don't buy for a second that electronic devices are dangerous for the airplane, I think they are about being able to pay attention to the flight attendants in case of an emergency.


OH yah, they tested this on Mythbusters. They mentioned if they were really worried about electronic devices bringing down planes they'd ban them from planes altogether and that they most likely do it for legal reasons just in case theres that ONE in a gazillion billion chance...


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## luvmy4brats (Nov 9, 2008)

ProfCrash said:


> I turn mine off when asked but admit to turning it back on when the flight attendants are buckled in.
> 
> (prepares for the lecture)


No lecture from me.

My last few flights, I've just closed the cover when asked to turn it off and just went back to reading when they buckle themselves in.


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## Muddypawz (Jan 13, 2009)

I've just left it in my purse for both domestic and foreign flights and have never had a problem.

Melissa


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## CoolMom1960 (Mar 16, 2009)

I make sure the wireless is off.  While they are doing their pre-flight stuff I put it in the pocket in front of me.


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

CoolMom1960 said:


> I make sure the wireless is off. While they are doing their pre-flight stuff I put it in the pocket in front of me.


be careful, people have forgotten their kindles in the seat pockets.


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## travelbug (Aug 9, 2010)

Thanks for all the great responses!  I guess I can handle having my Kindle turned off for take-off and landing.


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## r0b0d0c (Feb 16, 2009)

luvmy4brats said:


> No lecture from me.
> 
> My last few flights, I've just closed the cover when asked to turn it off and just went back to reading when they buckle themselves in.


Same here. I turn the wireless off, but mainly to conserve battery, rather than fear of interfering with the aircraft's electronics. Generally, if I hold it in the case open like a book, the flight attendants don't even say anything.


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## Steph H (Oct 28, 2008)

scarlet said:


> be careful, people have forgotten their kindles in the seat pockets.


A guy on a cleaning crew at DFW Airport got busted just recently for stealing all sorts of stuff that people left on planes as well as from luggage too...items reported included specifically Kindles....


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## telracs (Jul 12, 2009)

travelbug said:


> Thanks for all the great responses! I guess I can handle having my Kindle turned off for take-off and landing.


I plan on carrying 1 paperback for the takeoffs and landings....


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## TJoseph (Sep 1, 2010)

I fly just about every week.  I never take the Kindle out of my bag for TSA and they have never flagged it as a problem.  Usually, I just close the cover on the Kindle when they are checking seatbelts on the plane but keep it in my hands and then open it up again when they sit down.  Sometimes I take a newspaper with me to read during takeoff and landing if the hotel is giving them away free.

Tom


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## raynsally (Jan 27, 2010)

Back in May I took a flight out of Tampa to Pa, with a stop over in Md. Same Rt back. In Md. They stopped me and made me take it out of my bag. One fellow looked at the other two and said, it's one of those new things, it's ok. The reason I told you the RT, Is the Kindle didn't work either way.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

MoyJoy said:


> OH yah, they tested this on Mythbusters. They mentioned if they were really worried about electronic devices bringing down planes they'd ban them from planes altogether and that they most likely do it for legal reasons just in case theres that ONE in a gazillion billion chance...


It's more that they find the occasional device that can interfere with some of the equipment on the plane in certain circumstances, and it's just impossible to ban things on a case by case basis and have flight attendants trained to identify which gadgets could cause a problem etc.

Easier to just have everyone turn all devices off for take off and landing, so that's probably never going to change. As you say, just not worth the risk legally. And it's at most a minor inconvenience IMO.


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## jaimee83 (Sep 2, 2009)

I've gone through with it in my carry on a few times.  Once I was admonished for not removing it, I just take it out and put it in the basket.  They are becoming more and more popular so TSA can identify them.  I don't want to be the guy holding the line up.


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## jasonrw (Jan 2, 2010)

i've flown with a kindle several times. i always keep in in my carry-on and have never had a problem going through security. i have, however, had issues with not being able to use it during take-off/landing... on one flight they even specifically said to turn off cell phones and kindles over the P.A.... surprised me. 

i've tried reading it and being discreet (using a cover so you can't see) but the flight attendant still saw it and told me to turn it off!

seems silly... it is definitely frustrating not being able to use it during take-offs and landings.


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## TJoseph (Sep 1, 2010)

According to this TSA article, it is not necessary to take it out of your bag:

http://blog.tsa.gov/2010/04/traveling-with-e-readers-netbooks-and.html


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## ken.w (Jul 30, 2010)

Using your Kindle during take off and landing also puts you at risk of pissing off everyone around you, since they have to turn THEIR stuff off.


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

That is assuming that they did.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

Most people turn stuff off.  It's the polite thing to do.  Otherwise you look like a jerk ignoring flight attendant orders.  It's silly to have to turn off this kind of stuff, but even sillier as an adult to ignore such requests.


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## calypso (Aug 21, 2010)

ProfCrash said:


> I have never been in an airplane crash and I am reasonably certain that on most of the flights in the last 15 years some type of electronic device has been left on, wheter it be a CD player, MP3 player, Noise Cancelling headsets, Kindles, or a cell phone. I don't buy for a second that electronic devices are dangerous for the airplane, I think they are about being able to pay attention to the flight attendants in case of an emergency.


this is true. i fell asleep one time with my ipod on, i didnt even notice we were already landing til my seatmate (who happens to be my cousin) woke me up and told me that we were about to leave the plane.


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2010)

mooshie78 said:


> Most people turn stuff off. It's the polite thing to do. Otherwise you look like a jerk ignoring flight attendant orders. It's silly to have to turn off this kind of stuff, but even sillier as an adult to ignore such requests.


If someone thinks I am a jerk because I don't follow a stupid and baseless rule and don't get caught...well that's too bad. Someone on this forum has a quote from a book that talked about "rules"...I need to find it. It was by Heinlein if I recall. You have admitted the rule is silly....yet you say it's sillier to ignore that silly rule? That makes no sense to me. Following silly rules seems far more "silly" in my eyes.

If they catch me I will pretend to turn the item off and then go about my business when they sit down. An E-Reader poses ZERO risk to the aircraft's systems even with the wireless on. I don't want to crash just as much as they don't want to so if I actually believed it was about anything real and not just about control and ignorance I would oblige.


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## Karma Kindle (Jul 27, 2009)

dhiggins said:


> If someone thinks I am a jerk because I don't follow a stupid and baseless rule and don't get caught...well that's too bad.


Are you the person who sits in front of me on the plane and refuses to put their seat upright for takeoff and landing?


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## Trophywife007 (Aug 31, 2009)

Karma Kindle said:


> Are you the person who sits in front of me on the plane and refuses to put their seat upright for takeoff and landing?


Hee hee.  Actually, s/he is the parent of the child sitting behind you kicking your seat!


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## r0b0d0c (Feb 16, 2009)

Karma Kindle said:


> Are you the person who sits in front of me on the plane and refuses to put their seat upright for takeoff and landing?


Not the same - that requirement actually serves a legitimate safety purpose, during the most dangerous stages of flight, takeoff and landing. If seats and trays are left down, emergency exiting from aircraft, in already tight quarters, would be hindered.

I agree that the ENTIRE requirement of turning electronic gadgets off is silly and without scientific basis, but has simply become de facto "law." Modern aircraft have electronic shielding that makes this unnecessary, but no company will fund research to rescind this, since there's no financial reward. (And they have a reason for annoying cell phone conversations and ringtones to be silenced!)

IF there were ANY type of electronic danger, rather than risk even ACCIDENTAL use of electronic devices, the airlines (or, more likely, the FAA) would simply ban electronic devices from being brought on board.


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2010)

Karma Kindle said:


> Are you the person who sits in front of me on the plane and refuses to put their seat upright for takeoff and landing?


Nope. Because there is a legitimate reason for that as the poster above clearly explained. Not even comparable to reading a Kindle. They just want to use the ever illogical "zero tolerance" rule. Everything gets turned off regardless of if there is a good reason. I hate that kind of stupidity.

How someone can make a leap from minding my own business reading to things like not putting a seat upright for safety or kicking seats is beyond me.

Some people blindly follow rules. Others follow common sense.

Here is a Heinlein quote someone here has as a signature. I would mention them but don't recall the name. I live my life this way. In the instances I have to I play along as minimally as possible not to end up in prison or cause problems. Common sense should drive rules not "because I said so". I didn't buy that as a kid and still don't as an adult.

*"I will accept the rules that you feel necessary to your freedom. I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." Robert A. Heinlein, The Moon is a Harsh Mistress*


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## ak rain (Nov 15, 2008)

it does say off in top corner, that should be enough imo  though i am all talk i turn off at request. the stewards actually said Kindles off at start. that is how popular they are.
sylvia


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## Karma Kindle (Jul 27, 2009)

dhiggins said:


> Nope. Because there is a legitimate reason for that as the poster above clearly explained. Not even comparable to reading a Kindle. They just want to use the ever illogical "zero tolerance" rule. Everything gets turned off regardless of if there is a good reason. I hate that kind of stupidity.[/b]


The last person I asked to move their seat forward during take-off felt it was a "stupid rule" also. That's why I asked.

Meanwhile, stupid rule or not, it's certainly easier to turn off the Kindle for a few minutes than risk wasting time after being made the example for a violation of what the airline perceives to be a violation of a FAA regulation, see:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/04/30/rex-ryan-santonio-holmes-should-have-turned-off-his-ipod/

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-9796512-37.html

and for more information:

http://www.airspacemag.com/need-to-know/NEED-Celphones.html

and for a good laugh (and a bargain at $3.89), how about the Kindle Book "Betty in the Sky with a Suitcase"?

http://www.amazon.com/Betty-Sky-Suitcase-Hilarious-ebook/dp/B0035FZMRI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&m=AG56TWVU5XWC2&s=digital-text&qid=1283582738&sr=1-1


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2010)

It's "easier" to do a lot of things. I will continue to say "ok" and give them the impression I am complying and once they are out of the way I will do as I think reasonable.  I am not going to argue with them because clearly no good can come from it. But I will not comply with stupidity.

It's actually really easy to not be noticed anyway. They don't really pay that much attention. Put it inside a magazine, when you see them walking the aisle put it under your jacket or somewhere else hidden etc.

Also...not that I want to be a martyr but if they DID try to press it over certain devices which do not transmit or had wireless turned off you could have a field day with them in court as there would be no basis for the "danger" they claim you were causing. Even devices that ARE transmitting are not a danger, but those that are not cannot even be argued as a "potential" risk. The whole "if it has a power switch turn it off" rule is ridiculous.


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## Karma Kindle (Jul 27, 2009)

::waits for flight attendant to walk by::


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

So.... how do you even turn the Kindle off? May sound stupid but there's no mention of it in the user guide and when I slide the power control over, it just goes into sleep mode with the screensaver on. When I hold the slider longer, it just reboots. Is sleep mode considered "turning it off"?


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## KindleChickie (Oct 24, 2009)

MoyJoy said:


> OH yah, they tested this on Mythbusters. They mentioned if they were really worried about electronic devices bringing down planes they'd ban them from planes altogether and that they most likely do it for legal reasons just in case theres that ONE in a gazillion billion chance...


This isnt true. I am an aircraft inspector and see all the ACs and reports that come from the FAA. There has been verification that flight instruments will drift due to interference from portable devices. Just because the aircraft didnt crash doesnt mean there wasnt anything noticed in the cockpit. After all, how many times do you deplane and know what the pilot wrote in the logbook?


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2010)

I have heard just as many pilots, A&Ps and engineers claim its bunk and the worst reality is that GSM warble in the headset if someone is making a call with a GSM phone in some older planes....and even THAT is rare And THAT is with something that transmits. Something that does not transmit or has it's transmitter turned off doesn't even pose a "theoretical" risk. A Kindle or a laptop with wireless off or an ipod etc CANNOT interfere with systems because they are not putting out any signal yet the powers that be lump all things together and irritate us for no valid reason.

I would like to see proof that critical systems are affected by someone reading an ebook reader or playing a game on their laptop. I simply do not believe it.


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## KindleChickie (Oct 24, 2009)

I am an A&P, been working under my license for over 25 years.  A couple years back a AC came round that stated there was verification that a cell phone had affected an aircrafts navigation system during landing.  They even stated what type of AC and where the person was seated.  

My original statement stands.


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2010)

KindleChickie said:


> I am an A&P, been working under my license for over 25 years. A couple years back a AC came round that stated there was verification that a cell phone had affected an aircrafts navigation system during landing. They even stated what type of AC and where the person was seated.
> 
> My original statement stands.


Your "anecdote" stands. Your SINGLE anecdote. And it would be very difficult to prove causality but very easy to BLAME based on preconceived notions. It could have just as easily been an anomaly in the system or caused by something else and the phone was blamed. I truly believe short of occasional GSM headset noises the rest is urban legend.


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## Labnick (Jan 6, 2010)

I just flew this week and no problems.  Kept my kindle in my carryon with wireless off.  Took it out once in the air.


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## 4Katie (Jun 27, 2009)

mooshie78 said:


> It's more that they find the occasional device that can interfere with some of the equipment on the plane in certain circumstances, and it's just impossible to ban things on a case by case basis and have flight attendants trained to identify which gadgets could cause a problem etc.
> 
> Easier to just have everyone turn all devices off for take off and landing, so that's probably never going to change. As you say, just not worth the risk legally. And it's at most a minor inconvenience IMO.


I agree - better safe than sorry. You can't expect them to identify every electronic device out there. And besides, who knows how something innocent could be tampered with. I can live without reading for a few minutes.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

dhiggins said:


> If someone thinks I am a jerk because I don't follow a stupid and baseless rule and don't get caught...well that's too bad. Someone on this forum has a quote from a book that talked about "rules"...I need to find it. It was by Heinlein if I recall. You have admitted the rule is silly....yet you say it's sillier to ignore that silly rule? That makes no sense to me. Following silly rules seems far more "silly" in my eyes.
> 
> If they catch me I will pretend to turn the item off and then go about my business when they sit down. An E-Reader poses ZERO risk to the aircraft's systems even with the wireless on. I don't want to crash just as much as they don't want to so if I actually believed it was about anything real and not just about control and ignorance I would oblige.


Point is it is not a baseless rule. The problem is that someday some e-reader model could have some feature that causes interference. Same with any gadget. It's silly for the Kindle, but they just can't have rules on a device-by-device basis The only way to be 100% safe is just have everything turned off. There's no practical way for airlines to test every model of every gadget on every type of airplane to make sure nothing comes out that causes problems. And even if they could, it's not practical to train flight attendants to recognize such devices and make sure they're turned off while everything else can be left on.

So I have no problem turning my stuff off for a few minutes, not using my cell phone etc. etc. But hey, some are self centered and just care about doing what they want to do, when they want to do it and will come up with justifications for not obeying rules I guess. So go on being a jerk!


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## pidgeon92 (Oct 27, 2008)

history_lover said:


> So.... how do you even turn the Kindle off? May sound stupid but there's no mention of it in the user guide


It is in the user guide. Pg. 24 of the K3 User's Guide PDF:



> To turn off your Kindle, slide and hold the power switch for seven seconds until the screen goes blank, and then release.


For the K2, I believe it is 4 seconds.


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## TJoseph (Sep 1, 2010)

I fly a lot and I would be willing to bet that 30-50% of the cell phones on the plane do not get turned off.  I turn mine off completely (mostly to save the battery).  I almost never see people pulling them out and turning them off.  If you get irritated with your seatmate reading his Kindle at take off, do you also remind him to turn off his phone if you didn't see him do it?  Personally, I don't let it bother me.  The kid kicking the back of my seat bothers me and sometimes it gets to me when the guy in front me of reclines his seat duriing takeoff, but not too much.  My personal pet peeve is when people boarding the plane walk down the aisle knocking everyone with their carryons then they grab the back of your seat as they are sitting down and yank it back.  That is why I prefer a window seat.


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## MamaProfCrash (Dec 16, 2008)

I always turn off the cell phone and whispernet.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

I always turn off my phone.  Often I turn it off before I'm even on the plane--and I see others doing so to when they start boarding etc.  So that probably explains why you don't see everyone turning their's off.

My Whispernet is always off--only turn it on when downloading a book.  Otherwise I don't use it so no need to have it on running down the battery.


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## Guest (Sep 5, 2010)

mooshie78 said:


> So I have no problem turning my stuff off for a few minutes, not using my cell phone etc. etc. But hey, some are self centered and just care about doing what they want to do, when they want to do it and will come up with justifications for not obeying rules I guess. So go on being a jerk!


It is my understanding personal insults are against the rules here. Was I mistaken or are you exempt?

With regards to interference it has not been proven and is very anecdotal. Some people still insist putting butter on burns is a good thing but in reality this causes MORE damage...but those who believe it will go to the mat over it. So until there is more than random anecdotal reports it is fear mongering and nothing more.


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## Tom Diego (Jun 30, 2010)

My wife and I had a 5-1/2 hour flight today.  We made sure that wireless was off when we boarded.  We waited until told that we could turn on electronic devices before we pulled out our Kindles.  When it came time to land, I closed the cover on my Kindle and I thought that I had put it in sleep mode.  I have it on my lap and I'm getting ready to stow it and all of a sudden I start hearing music!  I still had my headphones around my neck and thought it was my iPod.  Imagine my surprise when I find out it's my Kindle!  It somehow had started playing music with the cover closed.  Not sure how that happened and then I had to figure out how to shut it off.  

I forgot to mention that before takeoff they specifically mentioned turning off e-reading devices.


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## history_lover (Aug 9, 2010)

pidgeon92 said:


> It is in the user guide. Pg. 24 of the K3 User's Guide PDF:


I don't have the PDF but I just did a search for "turn off" and found it, thanks. I had been looking at the table of contents over and over and I guess I just didn't check the "Learning More" section.



> For the K2, I believe it is 4 seconds.


Seems more like 7 seconds for K3. I tried 5 seconds and it just went to sleep mode. Thanks.


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## 4Katie (Jun 27, 2009)

> With regards to interference it has not been proven and is very anecdotal. Some people still insist putting butter on burns is a good thing but in reality this causes MORE damage...but those who believe it will go to the mat over it. So until there is more than random anecdotal reports it is fear mongering and nothing more.


Be that as it may, it just makes sence to follow the rules. They exist for everyone's safety. Personally I find such a cavalier attitude toward airline safety very irresponsible. Everyone's just doing their jobs. Why be difficult?


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Tom Diego said:


> My wife and I had a 5-1/2 hour flight today. We made sure that wireless was off when we boarded. We waited until told that we could turn on electronic devices before we pulled out our Kindles. When it came time to land, I closed the cover on my Kindle and I thought that I had put it in sleep mode. I have it on my lap and I'm getting ready to stow it and all of a sudden I start hearing music! I still had my headphones around my neck and thought it was my iPod. Imagine my surprise when I find out it's my Kindle! It somehow had started playing music with the cover closed. Not sure how that happened and then I had to figure out how to shut it off.
> 
> I forgot to mention that before takeoff they specifically mentioned turning off e-reading devices.


Oh yeah. . . .it will keep playing even when asleep. . . . .I guess you accidentally hit the 'play music' function as you were putting it to sleep. And/or you might have accidentally pushed the volume up.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

4Katie said:


> Be that as it may, it just makes sence to follow the rules. They exist for everyone's safety. Personally I find such a cavalier attitude toward airline safety very irresponsible. Everyone's just doing their jobs. Why be difficult?


Exactly. It all gets back to two things that make most people today just crappy people. People are self absorbed and just want to do whatever they want to do, whenever they want to do. And second, people have little intellect or interest in thinking etc. People can't even sit on a plane for 10 minutes during take off and landing and be content with their thoughts. People have to be doing something every waking second of their day. Drives me nuts.

Anyway, it's at most a minor inconvenience and again there's just no way to no when some new gadget will cause major problems so it's better to be safe than sorry when 100s of lives are at stake even if the risk is minuscule.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

Folks. . .based on the last page or so of posts. . .I think the issue has been beaten to death and I detect that some of the rhetoric is degenerating into. . .well, I'm not sure what. 

Here's what we know.

TSA may or may not require you to remove the Kindle for hand checking.

Flight attendants may or may not request you to turn it off for take off and landing.

Period.

Further discussion seems pointless.  Let's move on.


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## TJoseph (Sep 1, 2010)

One quick point and I will move on.  It is not impossible to know if a new gadget will cause major problems.  The FCC requires shielding and tests for all new electronic devices sold in the United States.  The manufacturer pays for those tests as part of the cost of bringing their product to market.  Maybe what is required is a certification process by the FCC or FAA that the manufacturer pays for.  A logo on the device would tell you if it is safe to use during take off and landing.


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## Miss Moneypenny (Aug 7, 2010)

Some clarifications...

The FCC (not the FAA) prohibits the use of cell phones in flight. The FAA requires all portable electronics to be turned off completely under 10 thousand feet. Their rulemaking may or may not rub you the right way, but it is still a federal regulation that air carriers are required to comply with. If a person refuses to comply he or she has violated another Federal Aviation Regulation entirely. Now, I've only been in a courtroom a few thousand times, but I can't seem to recall the 'but it's a stupid baseless rule' working out so well for the defense.


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## TJoseph (Sep 1, 2010)

Darn and I had promised to move on, but I have to disagree with you.  Civil disobedience is a very good way to get stupid baseless rules changed.  It has been used for protesting and changing such stupid baseless rules as slavery (underground railroad), segregation, and women not having the right to vote during the women's suffrage movement.  If people like Rosa Parks had just moved to the back of the bus when asked to it would be a very different America today.


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## mooshie78 (Jul 15, 2010)

TJoseph said:


> One quick point and I will move on. It is not impossible to know if a new gadget will cause major problems. The FCC requires shielding and tests for all new electronic devices sold in the United States. The manufacturer pays for those tests as part of the cost of bringing their product to market. Maybe what is required is a certification process by the FCC or FAA that the manufacturer pays for. A logo on the device would tell you if it is safe to use during take off and landing.


Still kind of unreasonable for flight attendants to have to go around and ask to see the logo on devices etc.

I just don't get why people can't sit and just think, or chat with the person next to them etc. for 10 minutes at take off and landing, and act like it's some huge inconvenience to have to turn things off. Like I said, most people just have to be doing something every waking minute for whatever reason. I love periods with nothing to do but sit and think etc. personally. Life is far to hectic, it's nice to have time with nothing to do!


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## VictoriaP (Mar 1, 2009)

mooshie78 said:


> I just don't get why people can't sit and just think, or chat with the person next to them etc. for 10 minutes at take off and landing, and act like it's some huge inconvenience to have to turn things off. Like I said, most people just have to be doing something every waking minute for whatever reason. I love periods with nothing to do but sit and think etc. personally. Life is far to hectic, it's nice to have time with nothing to do!


I'm guessing you're fortunate enough not to suffer from panic attacks while flying. The last thing on earth anyone around me wants is for me to have time to think while I'm on a plane. No one wants to have to talk to me during those periods either, trust me on that. 

I do take my devices out and send them through the conveyor separately. TSA seems to be perfectly happy with me doing so, since I get through the lines a lot faster since I started doing it. I do turn the Kindle completely off before doing so as there were sporadic reports of xray machine problems that might be totally baseless, but what the hey.

The last flight I was on, they didn't even bother to make the "turn off" comment for any devices at the end of the flight. The person next to me listened to music all the way down, as did three others in the row of six. There were several ereaders in use in my vicinity, and even the onboard video screens with full audio kept running through the landing. That sort of thing makes it hard to believe there's a real electronics issue at the heart of this rule.


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## ak rain (Nov 15, 2008)

all I had this last time was a guy showing me his dtb and smiling saying no off switch here ...


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## Miss Moneypenny (Aug 7, 2010)

Civil disobedience is fine if you're convinced an entire class of people have been denied their civil rights... but I wish you well in convincing even a single supreme court justice that the ban on portable eletronics in flight below 10k feet somehow violates yours... and anyone else so similarly situated... 



TJoseph said:


> Darn and I had promised to move on, but I have to disagree with you. Civil disobedience is a very good way to get stupid baseless rules changed. It has been used for protesting and changing such stupid baseless rules as slavery (underground railroad), segregation, and women not having the right to vote during the women's suffrage movement. If people like Rosa Parks had just moved to the back of the bus when asked to it would be a very different America today.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2010)

mooshie78 said:


> Still kind of unreasonable for flight attendants to have to go around and ask to see the logo on devices etc.
> 
> I just don't get why people can't sit and just think, or chat with the person next to them etc. for 10 minutes at take off and landing, and act like it's some huge inconvenience to have to turn things off. Like I said, most people just have to be doing something every waking minute for whatever reason. I love periods with nothing to do but sit and think etc. personally. Life is far to hectic, it's nice to have time with nothing to do!


Chatting is doing something...sitting and thinking is doing something. Just because the " something"I do doesn't fit into what you approve of doesn't make me wrong somehow.

Calling me "self absorbed" and "crappy" sideways like that is still an insult. It is not clever to hide it in a general statement.

You also have got the entire point wrong. It's not about it being inconvenient or me trying to change the world. It is about me not succumbing to fear mongering and nonsense. A lot of people do things simply because they are told to. Regardless of how ridiculous those things are. I have a good moral base and am a reasonable person. I would not do something that would harm fellow passengers. There is absolutely NO harm that can come from reading a Kindle with the wireless off so why in the world should I worry about not doing so unless it is simply to pacify someone's irrational thoughts? The entire point of the rule is to prevent danger to the aircraft and it's passengers. Reading an E-Book that does not transmit cannot. It cannot...it's not even up for debate. It cannot interfere anymore than a paper book can.

I happily abide by reasonable rules and ignore the unreasonable ones if I can do so without harm to myself or others. I don't drive like a maniac through residential areas, I don't break into people's homes and steal from them etc. Ignoring a stupid rule on a plane hardly makes me the "self absorbed crappy" person you keep trying to label me. I simply do not tolerate zero tolerance and sweeping policy because it is more convenient for some bureaucrat. That is not "wrong" you just don't like it.

I have already made it clear I will not start a fight on board the plane over it...I will simply do it as discretely as possible. But you seem insistent on labeling me a scourge to society.


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## MichelleR (Feb 21, 2009)

Tam said:


> I have taken it out and put it in the bin with my cell phone every time, just because its easier than worrying that they will want to stop me and have me open up my purse. I did ask a security official the first time I flew after getting it and was told at that time that they prefer anything like that be out.
> 
> I just go ahead and turn it off for takeoff and landing - I can look at a magazine or something else for that short amount of time...


Yep, anything even questionable or subject to debate I still in the bin. On the plane, I figure it's no big deal to shut it off since I'm probably in a window seat and still like to watch the plane take off.


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## Ann in Arlington (Oct 27, 2008)

What part of "let's move on" was unclear, folks?  

Seriously. . . . .nothing new is being said.  No minds are being changed.

This thread is closed.


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